Enduring Dragon [PvE Tank] by Luna Hlaalu

paulsimonps

Steel_Brightblade wrote: »

Thanks, I was leaning towards hist bark, just wanted to be sure. My set up is extent similar to yours and currently work well with rank 14 hist bark so I'll stick with the hist then as I can't see anything that greatly interests me in orsinium other than the maelstrom weapons.

I keep meaning to ask why you have no cp in blademastery, to get the riposte skill that does damage while blocking, thought that would be nice on this build.

The points I have in Precise Strikes, Piercing and Mighty helps me more during the planar inhibitor fight and just over all a bit more damage. The Blade expert is meh and best since its only light and heavy attacks while the other 3 works for all stamina based attack. As well Ripostf does so little damage anyway, not worth it.

JSilva88

Hi Paul!
Thanks for the great build! I really like the play style you've detailed here and think it would fit mine as well. I just hit lvl 25 as an imperial DK, and quite honestly this character started as a crafter for me but I'm really liking the DK and just being a meat machine tank so far. My set up is a little mish-mashed and just based on what I thought would work well for leveling given that I would be spending most of my points in crafting skills... so it probably needs an overhaul.

I'm wondering if I should just respec my skills and attributes before it gets too expensive or if this will work going forward...
Imperial (w/ all passives so far)
DragonKnight

Attributes:
+30 Health
... The imperial and heavy armor passives I thought really lend well to a high base health pool and I will probably start putting the rest of my points into stamina now for damage and blocking (and sprinting!). I originally thought this race/class combo would make a good health tank (w/ draconic power abilities), but 30k seems to be the magic number regardless of what you plan on doing... Up until now I've pretty much ignored stamina.

Skills:
For trash and just general questing/leveling solo I've been using Empowering Chains morph to pull myself to a group of enemies and then Fiery Breath (with +20% dmg buff from chains) and Cleave(2h)/Pierce Armor(1h+s) to dot them up. With warmth passive they are also slowed... gives great mobility and I can kite/jump to other groups or swap to 1h+s to block/cc while they burn/bleed... nobody seems to use this morph as a tank but I like it for soloing so far :P

1h+s
I'm just starting to tank in dungeons as I come across them... my next points will go into choking talons, deep slash, absorb magic, and shield assault (which I see can replace empowering chains' utility) as you've suggested, but leveling dungeons are just a *** show so far and I don't think I'll be able to do any real tanking until 50 anyways, but I want to practice going at a quick pace.

My general approach is to jump in, cripple and taunt the mobs with Pierce Armor, use hardened armor, and dragon blood if I start getting low. For taunting, do you pierce armor each mob separately? There is no aoe taunt? Dark talons/choking talons seems like it would help out with this by keeping the mobs in place while applying pierce armor. My ult for both bars is standard of might until I get aggressive horn (haven't been brave enough to jump into Cyrodill yet).

Wondering if I'm on the right track and if this will work as I start getting into more serious content down the road. I know you did not post a leveling build but I'd rather not respec multiple times. Let me know your thoughts! I'd appreciate the input.

paulsimonps

JSilva88 wrote: »

Hi Paul!
Thanks for the great build! I really like the play style you've detailed here and think it would fit mine as well. I just hit lvl 25 as an imperial DK, and quite honestly this character started as a crafter for me but I'm really liking the DK and just being a meat machine tank so far. My set up is a little mish-mashed and just based on what I thought would work well for leveling given that I would be spending most of my points in crafting skills... so it probably needs an overhaul.

I'm wondering if I should just respec my skills and attributes before it gets too expensive or if this will work going forward...
Imperial (w/ all passives so far)
DragonKnight

Attributes:
+30 Health
... The imperial and heavy armor passives I thought really lend well to a high base health pool and I will probably start putting the rest of my points into stamina now for damage and blocking (and sprinting!). I originally thought this race/class combo would make a good health tank (w/ draconic power abilities), but 30k seems to be the magic number regardless of what you plan on doing... Up until now I've pretty much ignored stamina.

Skills:
For trash and just general questing/leveling solo I've been using Empowering Chains morph to pull myself to a group of enemies and then Fiery Breath (with +20% dmg buff from chains) and Cleave(2h)/Pierce Armor(1h+s) to dot them up. With warmth passive they are also slowed... gives great mobility and I can kite/jump to other groups or swap to 1h+s to block/cc while they burn/bleed... nobody seems to use this morph as a tank but I like it for soloing so far :P

1h+s
I'm just starting to tank in dungeons as I come across them... my next points will go into choking talons, deep slash, absorb magic, and shield assault (which I see can replace empowering chains' utility) as you've suggested, but leveling dungeons are just a *** show so far and I don't think I'll be able to do any real tanking until 50 anyways, but I want to practice going at a quick pace.

My general approach is to jump in, cripple and taunt the mobs with Pierce Armor, use hardened armor, and dragon blood if I start getting low. For taunting, do you pierce armor each mob separately? There is no aoe taunt? Dark talons/choking talons seems like it would help out with this by keeping the mobs in place while applying pierce armor. My ult for both bars is standard of might until I get aggressive horn (haven't been brave enough to jump into Cyrodill yet).

Wondering if I'm on the right track and if this will work as I start getting into more serious content down the road. I know you did not post a leveling build but I'd rather not respec multiple times. Let me know your thoughts! I'd appreciate the input.

@JSilva88

Hey, you might want to check this out:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/287171/enduring-dragon-pve-tank-by-luna-hlaalu-v2-0

Updated version of my build. It is what I am currently running. Also if you want I can tell you how to allocate your points as an imperial. you would need less points into health. The idea is to increase whats called your global resources, aka the number you get when you add your Health, Stamina and Magicka together. For example my HP is 29958, Stam is 25303 and magicka 19244 which would then be 74505 global. Only criteria to keep is to be at roughly 30k HP the rest should be as high as you can get it. If you got more questions post them on my updated thread.

Personofsecrets

Orc

Tavas/Spawn/Dragon

I want
31500 HP
28500 Stam
14000 Mag

What do?

paulsimonps

Personofsecrets wrote: »

Orc

Tavas/Spawn/Dragon

I want
31500 HP
28500 Stam
14000 Mag

What do?

@Personofsecrets

As an orc with those sets if you use all tri glyphs and have infused on 3 large pieces, 5 points into HP and 59 into Stamina with CP 150 Blue Stamina HP food you would get:

HP 31631
STAM 28369
MAG 13386

Assuming you are also going 5-1-1 in heavy armor and that everything is legendary.

Personofsecrets

paulsimonps wrote: »

Personofsecrets wrote: »

Orc

Tavas/Spawn/Dragon

I want
31500 HP
28500 Stam
14000 Mag

What do?

@Personofsecrets

As an orc with those sets if you use all tri glyphs and have infused on 3 large pieces, 5 points into HP and 59 into Stamina with CP 150 Blue Stamina HP food you would get:

HP 31631
STAM 28369
MAG 13386

Assuming you are also going 5-1-1 in heavy armor and that everything is legendary.

That is really great!

What do you think about 5-1-1 vs 7-0.

I've been using 7-0, but am considering trying out 5-1-1

paulsimonps

Personofsecrets wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

Personofsecrets wrote: »

Orc

Tavas/Spawn/Dragon

I want
31500 HP
28500 Stam
14000 Mag

What do?

@Personofsecrets

As an orc with those sets if you use all tri glyphs and have infused on 3 large pieces, 5 points into HP and 59 into Stamina with CP 150 Blue Stamina HP food you would get:

HP 31631
STAM 28369
MAG 13386

Assuming you are also going 5-1-1 in heavy armor and that everything is legendary.

That is really great!

What do you think about 5-1-1 vs 7-0.

I've been using 7-0, but am considering trying out 5-1-1

@Personofsecrets

The extra resistance you get and the extra bit from constitution you get from going 7 heavy is not worth it for the loss of max resources. And sure you lose 4% hp from juggernaut but you gain that back in undaunted mettle so zero difference there. The max resources is more worth it in my opinion, by far.

Personofsecrets

1

5 HA Scenario

With 5 HA, Constitution gives 930 Magic and Stam/4 seconds
1 Light armor gives about 40 magic regen
1 light armor gives about 100 magic worth of reduced cost on igneous shield
1 medium armor gives about 100 magic worth of reduced cost on igneous shield
5-1-1 makes the stamina pool larger and helping hand returns about 50 extra stamina
5-1-1 makes battle roar negligibly better

Versus

7 HA Scenario

With 7 HA, Constitution gives 1300 Magic and Stam/4 seconds

The above scenarios reduce to the following.

2

5 HA Scenario

About 40 magic regen
about 40 stamina regen
100 magic when casting average magic skill
100 stamina when casting average stamina skill

Versus

7HA Scenario

370 Magic and Stam/4 seconds

The above scenarios reduce once more.

3

5 HA Scenario

100 magic when casting average magic skill
100 stamina when casting average stamina skill

Versus

7HA Scenario

290 Magic and Stam/4 seconds

In conclusion, with all of the assumptions that I make, it looks like 7 HA is slightly better for resource management. The reason for that conclusion is because 7 HA, with my assumptions in place, ought to give about 580 total resources over 4 seconds and in order for 5-1-1 to reach that level of resource generation, a player would have to cast 6 average cost skills over a 4 second time window. I don't think that such fast skill use is possible.

What do you think about my thought process?

DHale

You guys make me laugh I have tanked everything in this game with 25 k health. Never needed more. Never will need more. Stam is all you need.

paulsimonps

DHale wrote: »

You guys make me laugh I have tanked everything in this game with 25 k health. Never needed more. Never will need more. Stam is all you need.

\_/ This is my bucket of care! OH LOOK! ITS EMPTY!

Go boast your empty words somewhere else.

Personofsecrets

DHale wrote: »

You guys make me laugh I have tanked everything in this game with 25 k health. Never needed more. Never will need more. Stam is all you need.

Why would we need stam when we don't need more stam?

Personofsecrets

@paulsimonps , I made a mistake and had to update my conclusion, but what do you think about post #39?

DHale

Personofsecrets wrote: »

DHale wrote: »

You guys make me laugh I have tanked everything in this game with 25 k health. Never needed more. Never will need more. Stam is all you need.

Why would we need stam when we don't need more stam?

i

Pretty sure you know this but more stam the harder you hit and the more you can hit. Because when my pug team goes down and occasionally does I can dps the boss my self as I have done dozens of times over 2.5 years. Depending on the healer to keep me up or just reapplying a taunt every 15 or a main every 7 is not enough. I am light and heavy attacking, ransack, bash throughout every fight and 40 k stam lets me do this with 100 in stam cost reduction. I make sure my magic regen is high and talons mobs every four seconds. I still molten and igneous by using a lot of magic regen in cp tree and use the atronach mundus.

I just don't think there is any plausible reason to sacrifice stam for health unless you are running a blazing shield tank build. When I had less stam I would depend on shards and pots to get me through fights and I required a lot more making sure there were Templar healers rather than all the sorc healers running around. Now I don't care who heals or will even run 3/4 of the dungeons without a healer. Igneous plus vigor heals are very powerful. Lastly, when you have very high stam your heavy attacks are 14 to 19 thousand when you are fully buffed and that is a very good tool when the dd's are not optimal.

paulsimonps

DHale wrote: »

Personofsecrets wrote: »

DHale wrote: »

You guys make me laugh I have tanked everything in this game with 25 k health. Never needed more. Never will need more. Stam is all you need.

Why would we need stam when we don't need more stam?

i

Pretty sure you know this but more stam the harder you hit and the more you can hit. Because when my pug team goes down and occasionally does I can dps the boss my self as I have done dozens of times over 2.5 years. Depending on the healer to keep me up or just reapplying a taunt every 15 or a main every 7 is not enough. I am light and heavy attacking, ransack, bash throughout every fight and 40 k stam lets me do this with 100 in stam cost reduction. I make sure my magic regen is high and talons mobs every four seconds. I still molten and igneous by using a lot of magic regen in cp tree and use the atronach mundus.

I just don't think there is any plausible reason to sacrifice stam for health unless you are running a blazing shield tank build. When I had less stam I would depend on shards and pots to get me through fights and I required a lot more making sure there were Templar healers rather than all the sorc healers running around. Now I don't care who heals or will even run 3/4 of the dungeons without a healer. Igneous plus vigor heals are very powerful. Lastly, when you have very high stam your heavy attacks are 14 to 19 thousand when you are fully buffed and that is a very good tool when the dd's are not optimal.

I never go into a fight assuming that my other group members suck, I never pug, and I make my builds for trials, they work in dungeons too but I am a trial leader, its what I do. My updated build that I linked earlier is what I used when I tanked for my guild and got 2nd highest score on Veteran Maw of Lorkhaj on NA PC.

Tanks should not go in to a fight spec'ed to DPS, you will not add a lot to the group, while on the other hand if you are more supportive and more tanky then the healer can help DPS and that will add a lot more DPS than a tank ever could. I build to optimize for end game content, dungeons as they are, are not end game in the same sense as the veteran trials. And I am not gonna go tank the Veteran Warrior with just 25k health, that is a recipe of disaster.