IC dungeons too difficult in VET mode for casual players !!!!

Nikkiy

Spearshard wrote: »

The biggest problems with the difficulty of ICP and WGT is that 1: there is necessary gear gated behind them, and 2:they are in the pledge rotation. For those who CAN complete them on vet, that's fantastic that you get 2 gold keys. But for the majority of players they are screwed out of a chance to get the gear to GET them to the level to complete these dungeons. The rng is abysmal enough on undaunted chests, but to forgo the chance at it is even worse. And the argument "well you still get a silver key" is not a valid argument. The chance at any given shoulder piece on gold is bad enoufh, let alone the one you actually want, but on silver it's next to useless.
It's a badly designed system. It's not the casual''s fsult, nor the hard core player''s fault. Each deserves the opportunity to obtain gear, and the hardcore deserve a challenge. The argument, we'll normal gets you v15 gear, that's ok....no offense we all know v15 is pointless. It has almost no added power, and the v16 is necessary to run these pledges.
I'm a casual, I have maybe 2 hours about every other day to play. However I am familiar with game mexhamocs, I have a v16 character that is 1 piece away from a full v16 geared character. I also can pull 14-19k single target damage on most mobs. So here''s the thing. ICP and WGT are dps checks, but not only that, champion point checks. I've run each several times and always after we leave ask, "what's your dps, and what's your cp number." I always get the same answer. The same situation that happens to me. My dps drops from that 14-19k to 4-8k in the new dungeons. Why? I simply don't have enough cp allocated to get extra passives and armor pen.
I've studied the vids as have many of the people I've run it with. We understand the mechanics. And as we don't have the punch to get bosses down, or adds down we end up wiping. And to those who say, it's not a dps race, EVERY encounter is. The longer a fight goes the greater the chance a mistake will happen. I'm not saying nerf the dungeons, I complete every pledge except these two, and after the catchup mechanoc, and I have more cp''s I'll go back and get these too. I just think that the hardcore players need to understand the situation and not ridicule casuals with the usual l2p mentality, especially since most of you probably have gotten so used to the power your cp''s give you, you don't have to worry. If someone can post a video, or point to one that shows a group who has done this with 80-100 cp''s I'll happily admit I'm wrong. But I really don't think it's just a l2p thing

If you´re getting 8k dps, you´re doing something wrong

Spearshard

If you read that entire post and that is your response. You read it wrong.

FENGRUSH

Spearshard wrote: »

The biggest problems with the difficulty of ICP and WGT is that 1: there is necessary gear gated behind them, and 2:they are in the pledge rotation. For those who CAN complete them on vet, that's fantastic that you get 2 gold keys. But for the majority of players they are screwed out of a chance to get the gear to GET them to the level to complete these dungeons. The rng is abysmal enough on undaunted chests, but to forgo the chance at it is even worse. And the argument "well you still get a silver key" is not a valid argument. The chance at any given shoulder piece on gold is bad enoufh, let alone the one you actually want, but on silver it's next to useless.
It's a badly designed system. It's not the casual''s fsult, nor the hard core player''s fault. Each deserves the opportunity to obtain gear, and the hardcore deserve a challenge. The argument, we'll normal gets you v15 gear, that's ok....no offense we all know v15 is pointless. It has almost no added power, and the v16 is necessary to run these pledges.
I'm a casual, I have maybe 2 hours about every other day to play. However I am familiar with game mexhamocs, I have a v16 character that is 1 piece away from a full v16 geared character. I also can pull 14-19k single target damage on most mobs. So here''s the thing. ICP and WGT are dps checks, but not only that, champion point checks. I've run each several times and always after we leave ask, "what's your dps, and what's your cp number." I always get the same answer. The same situation that happens to me. My dps drops from that 14-19k to 4-8k in the new dungeons. Why? I simply don't have enough cp allocated to get extra passives and armor pen.
I've studied the vids as have many of the people I've run it with. We understand the mechanics. And as we don't have the punch to get bosses down, or adds down we end up wiping. And to those who say, it's not a dps race, EVERY encounter is. The longer a fight goes the greater the chance a mistake will happen. I'm not saying nerf the dungeons, I complete every pledge except these two, and after the catchup mechanoc, and I have more cp''s I'll go back and get these too. I just think that the hardcore players need to understand the situation and not ridicule casuals with the usual l2p mentality, especially since most of you probably have gotten so used to the power your cp''s give you, you don't have to worry. If someone can post a video, or point to one that shows a group who has done this with 80-100 cp''s I'll happily admit I'm wrong. But I really don't think it's just a l2p thing

I could make a video doing this with 80 CP. Ive 3 manned this dungeon and Im wearing v14 gear still due to my disinterest in making new gear just yet.

These fights are not DPS races. To say they are a DPS race because you have more of a chance to die the longer the fight goes is saying you dont know what a DPS check/race really is. These fights are focused on mechanics.

Tankqull

Artemis wrote: »

Justice31st wrote: »

The game difficulty gap between normal and veteran is too large, ZOS should lower veteran dungeons difficulty and there should be 3 difficulties for ESO dungeons. Normal, Veteran, and Hardcore.

Normal gives normal item drop %, veteran gives veteran items with normal drop %, and hardcore gives increased veteran item drop %.

Problem solved.

Then they will whine for ZOS to nerf hardcore mode because they can't complete it.

OP, do normal mode. It has the same fights and mechanics. It's not like, say, vet COA and normal COA. And if you didn't complete vet COA, then you didn't see a part of the story/content. Here you don't have this excuse. You just want a completion to be handed for you. It's not fair to people who spent hours trying to beat those dungeons and succeeded.

well i do not know anyone doing vet dungeons for the pleasure of compleating it but for the drops. add a way for casuals to gather their gear and no one is complaining anymore. have v16 normal mode provide the current droprate of vet dungeons in terms of v16 gear. vet dungeons a 10% increased drop chance for the monster helmet and new sets and hard mode affect the entire dungeon and not only the last mob with a 20% increased chance. problem solved - casuals will be able to gather the loot they need while the non casuals have a reason to do those dungeons at hihger difficulties.
hell you can even make hardmode drops bound on equip to intensify the desire to do that difficulty.

Spearshard

To an extant you are right and wrong, it's simple statistics, the longer a fight lasts the more times you have to perform a given mechanic, be that dodge roll at the right time, bash a boss, or any other boss related technique each time there is a chance you are either out of stam to perform it or you miss it, so while it may not be the strongest argument, or what you see as a dps chexk, it is still true, from a certain point of view. I'm always happy to learn something new, if you can 3 man it, great, I'd love to see ser it, and I don't type that to be taken as an angry comment. If I can learn something new awesome.

G0ku

FENGRUSH wrote: »

These fights are not DPS races. To say they are a DPS race because you have more of a chance to die the longer the fight goes is saying you dont know what a DPS check/race really is. These fights are focused on mechanics.

Trying again to quote you so that you explain: Prison Boss Flesh Sculptor, first atronarch is always spawning, you can´t stop that with grenades like the following atronarchs. How can you avoid the enrage of the atronarch if you ain´t got enough damage. imo at least this part is a dps race - care to explain what I got wrong here or am I right?

laksikus

Stop whining. My bad, you cant finish IC dungeons fpr gold keys cos you arent good enough? Asko those that didnt buy the DLC what they think about those dungeons beeing gold

Really that "i cant do it nerf it" is just stupid.

I dont think that i am one of those 2% players, but hey, how did i finish vWGT?

I couldnt make it to max level before the IC patch, it took me 2 days to get from v10 to v16, some xp pots and 1 lvl/hour.
I have now around 150 cp, so not that much, i still have my v14 martial knowledge armor, still dont have my yellow glyphs.

So my gear isnt maxxed or OP or smth, my CP are rather low, and i didnt even manage vCOA some weeks ago.
What did i do? i did nWGT alot when the rumer was around you get molag kena helmet in normal.

Then we started with vet and it was hard. we wiped alot to first boss, till we got a good tactics, second boss is easy.
Then Atronach: he is a real pain in the ass and we wiped even more often than to 1st boss. if you get too many adds -> wipe, bad healer -> wipe, one little mistake -> wipe.

But we kept doing it. It got easier once tank flipped to a DD instead. and finally we did it. and Molag Kena is a cake walk, even easier on Hardmode than on vet.


If you cant do it then keep trying.
if you cant do it then you do smth wrong. bad heal, bad tank or bad dd...

If you dont do enough dps, look at your skills.
if you are healer and you mates die, l2h.
tank the same.

its endgame content, its not meant to be finished at your 1st or 2nd run.

Me and my group arent PVE pros, not at all. We used to do PVP most of the time before IC.
But now that im considered to be one of the 2% on top of you. thx for the complimetn xD

nimander99

Wait, are you saying Veteran should be Casual? Please put the lol button back in ZoS! Please please please please.

Daveheart

G0ku wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

These fights are not DPS races. To say they are a DPS race because you have more of a chance to die the longer the fight goes is saying you dont know what a DPS check/race really is. These fights are focused on mechanics.

Trying again to quote you so that you explain: Prison Boss Flesh Sculptor, first atronarch is always spawning, you can´t stop that with grenades like the following atronarchs. How can you avoid the enrage of the atronarch if you ain´t got enough damage. imo at least this part is a dps race - care to explain what I got wrong here or am I right?

You're technically correct, the atros do have an enrage mechanic that can wipe a party. However, if the mechanics are executed properly, the DPS required to kill them in time is pretty low. If you're trying to AoE everything to reduce the overall time of the fight, then yes, you're much more likely to encounter the enrage mechanic. However, that's not a feature of the fight but rather, it's a result of attempting to skip mechanics. With good execution of the mechanics, I'd hesitate to call the flesh atros a true DPS check.

Jamersonb16_ESO

I have to say I'm really for (enjoying isn't the right word) the new vet dungeons and even the changes to the old vet dungeons (bull netch springs to mind) that make them harder. Before 1.7 the vet pledges were just a walk in the park, and that was with pug groups. Now some of them are challenging again, and the two new IC ones are downright hard. Great, it finally gives you something to aim for and brings challenge back to the game.

The fact that you don't get your guaranteed gold key every day isn't an issue - now silver keys can drop V16 shoulders on average you'll have exactly the same chance as before of getting a drop and some days you've doubled your chances.

I still manage to get any 75% of gold key runs finished successfully, usually with pugs and I have about 155 CPs. I've never finished the two vet dungeons yet but I enjoy the challenge and when I do it'll be a sense of accomplishment that's been missing for months and months now.

Artis

@anitajoneb17_ESO

Because frankly, you truly believe that 75% of players achieving "Boethia's Scythe" (VDSA achievement) is because they've all practiced and progressed to reach it ? DSA, VDSA, CoH, CoA, Shada's tear, etc. , all these originally hard dungeons, all dungeons in fact, have been progressively nerfed, openly or behind the curtains, to give players a (artificial) sense of progression.

Don't remember any of them being nerfed. Maybe slightly? But hey, damage in vet icp and wgt was slightly nerfed too, I didn't feel any difference, though.
And yes, people completed vdsa because they practiced or someone (who practiced) carried them A group of 3 can carry 1 easy) Even 1 person can carry 3 if he knows all the tricks and strats.

Also you still didn't answer my questions, can anyone else do it please? Because I don't get it.

ClearArrow

I haven't even tried them yet, but have been warned that if I make one wrong move we will all wipe. Not sure I like that kind of pressure in a game I just want to enjoy...

Artis

What kind of pressure? It's a game! You wipe, you rez, you keep going and avoid doing whatever you did that lead to the wipe.

Figuring out how to do things is like solving a puzzle and is a part of fun!

Korah_Eaglecry

DenMoria wrote: »

BeardLumber wrote: »

Protip: Work at getting better, once you finally beat the dungeon you will feel like you've accomplished something.

Oh please. It's a video game. If you honestly feel like you've accomplished something, you really, really need to get out more. It's a video game.

Dude....Theres literally a section of the game devoted to ACCOMPLISHMENTS.

Dymence

Spearshard wrote: »

The biggest problems with the difficulty of ICP and WGT is that 1: there is necessary gear gated behind them, and 2:they are in the pledge rotation. For those who CAN complete them on vet, that's fantastic that you get 2 gold keys. But for the majority of players they are screwed out of a chance to get the gear to GET them to the level to complete these dungeons. The rng is abysmal enough on undaunted chests, but to forgo the chance at it is even worse. And the argument "well you still get a silver key" is not a valid argument. The chance at any given shoulder piece on gold is bad enoufh, let alone the one you actually want, but on silver it's next to useless.
It's a badly designed system. It's not the casual''s fsult, nor the hard core player''s fault. Each deserves the opportunity to obtain gear, and the hardcore deserve a challenge. The argument, we'll normal gets you v15 gear, that's ok....no offense we all know v15 is pointless. It has almost no added power, and the v16 is necessary to run these pledges.
I'm a casual, I have maybe 2 hours about every other day to play. However I am familiar with game mexhamocs, I have a v16 character that is 1 piece away from a full v16 geared character. I also can pull 14-19k single target damage on most mobs. So here''s the thing. ICP and WGT are dps checks, but not only that, champion point checks. I've run each several times and always after we leave ask, "what's your dps, and what's your cp number." I always get the same answer. The same situation that happens to me. My dps drops from that 14-19k to 4-8k in the new dungeons. Why? I simply don't have enough cp allocated to get extra passives and armor pen.
I've studied the vids as have many of the people I've run it with. We understand the mechanics. And as we don't have the punch to get bosses down, or adds down we end up wiping. And to those who say, it's not a dps race, EVERY encounter is. The longer a fight goes the greater the chance a mistake will happen. I'm not saying nerf the dungeons, I complete every pledge except these two, and after the catchup mechanoc, and I have more cp''s I'll go back and get these too. I just think that the hardcore players need to understand the situation and not ridicule casuals with the usual l2p mentality, especially since most of you probably have gotten so used to the power your cp''s give you, you don't have to worry. If someone can post a video, or point to one that shows a group who has done this with 80-100 cp''s I'll happily admit I'm wrong. But I really don't think it's just a l2p thing

The power gap between vr15 gear and vr16 gear is extremely minor at best, except on weapons which you craft yourself. You don't have any reason to complain.

Also, the notion that you need a ton of CP to finish these dungeons is a joke and a poor attempt at shifting blame away from your own skill level.

Prabooo

Prabhujee, it takes a lotta skill and top gear to wipe those dungeons. Patience, study, and an elite group of assassins... is fun to discover all your potentials in a game

lathbury

Spearshard wrote: »

The biggest problems with the difficulty of ICP and WGT is that 1: there is necessary gear gated behind them, and 2:they are in the pledge rotation. For those who CAN complete them on vet, that's fantastic that you get 2 gold keys. But for the majority of players they are screwed out of a chance to get the gear to GET them to the level to complete these dungeons. The rng is abysmal enough on undaunted chests, but to forgo the chance at it is even worse. And the argument "well you still get a silver key" is not a valid argument. The chance at any given shoulder piece on gold is bad enoufh, let alone the one you actually want, but on silver it's next to useless.
It's a badly designed system. It's not the casual''s fsult, nor the hard core player''s fault. Each deserves the opportunity to obtain gear, and the hardcore deserve a challenge. The argument, we'll normal gets you v15 gear, that's ok....no offense we all know v15 is pointless. It has almost no added power, and the v16 is necessary to run these pledges.
I'm a casual, I have maybe 2 hours about every other day to play. However I am familiar with game mexhamocs, I have a v16 character that is 1 piece away from a full v16 geared character. I also can pull 14-19k single target damage on most mobs. So here''s the thing. ICP and WGT are dps checks, but not only that, champion point checks. I've run each several times and always after we leave ask, "what's your dps, and what's your cp number." I always get the same answer. The same situation that happens to me. My dps drops from that 14-19k to 4-8k in the new dungeons. Why? I simply don't have enough cp allocated to get extra passives and armor pen.
I've studied the vids as have many of the people I've run it with. We understand the mechanics. And as we don't have the punch to get bosses down, or adds down we end up wiping. And to those who say, it's not a dps race, EVERY encounter is. The longer a fight goes the greater the chance a mistake will happen. I'm not saying nerf the dungeons, I complete every pledge except these two, and after the catchup mechanoc, and I have more cp''s I'll go back and get these too. I just think that the hardcore players need to understand the situation and not ridicule casuals with the usual l2p mentality, especially since most of you probably have gotten so used to the power your cp''s give you, you don't have to worry. If someone can post a video, or point to one that shows a group who has done this with 80-100 cp''s I'll happily admit I'm wrong. But I really don't think it's just a l2p thing

There is so much wrong with this statement I don't know where to begin.

anitajoneb17_ESO

Artemis wrote: »

Also you still didn't answer my questions, can anyone else do it please? Because I don't get it.

... I haven't and I won't. Given how strongly I disagree with you on essential matters (like "tone doesn't matter"), the condescending vocabulary you like to use ("entitled", "handed over", "now listen to me carefully",etc.), the wrong statements you make (too many to list) and the fact that you don't read/listen to what I say (advising us to use teamspeak when I've stated several times that we always have), and a lot of other things, I don't think it would make sense to confront our opinions and points of view directly. Happens sometimes.

Volkodav

prabhu.abhimanyurwb17_ESO wrote: »

Wow, i somehow saw all this bitching coming forth.
1) I am able to complete other vet dungeons, why should these new dungeons be on another difficulty spectrum ???
2) Sorry, I thought the grouping tool changes were already in effect. I thought these change had come along with the DLC. My reading comprehension skills are just fine, i got this info from the quakecon video and Matt mentioned this detail then and since i skipped some parts of the video i thought this was part of the DLC changes

@RinOkumara: Define Advanced stupid please !. I guess u are one of them

Please,ignore these ignorant people who are disrespecting you here.It is they who havent the comprehension skills needed to be able to respond to a post positively.They seem unable to reply in anything other than insults.Their imagined 'elite status' (meaning they think that because they are L10 or above) gives them the right to talk down to others.
As I said,ignore them as they are unable to do anything to help,or give good info.
Personally,I wish it was a bit easier to just get past the first bunch of baddies so I could even see what it's all about.Myself,at V1,I have no chance at all. Even with a V4,its tough.I have no problems anywhere else in the game,even killing bosses who are sometimes 5 or 6 levels above me.Maybe someday I can get to see what the city is like. :]

G0ku

Daveheart wrote: »

G0ku wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

These fights are not DPS races. To say they are a DPS race because you have more of a chance to die the longer the fight goes is saying you dont know what a DPS check/race really is. These fights are focused on mechanics.

Trying again to quote you so that you explain: Prison Boss Flesh Sculptor, first atronarch is always spawning, you can´t stop that with grenades like the following atronarchs. How can you avoid the enrage of the atronarch if you ain´t got enough damage. imo at least this part is a dps race - care to explain what I got wrong here or am I right?

You're technically correct, the atros do have an enrage mechanic that can wipe a party. However, if the mechanics are executed properly, the DPS required to kill them in time is pretty low. If you're trying to AoE everything to reduce the overall time of the fight, then yes, you're much more likely to encounter the enrage mechanic. However, that's not a feature of the fight but rather, it's a result of attempting to skip mechanics. With good execution of the mechanics, I'd hesitate to call the flesh atros a true DPS check.

The sacrifices for the middle come from 3 different locations. I was dps´ing the flesh atronarch(s) while the tank tanked, the healer healed and killed the sacrifices from one direction and our 2nd DD covered the 2 other locations where the sacrifices come from. The activation of the grenades via synergy-button is quite a drag, so I got hardly any assisstance in dps´ing the boss and the atronarchs. I discovered that I have to reach about 15,k dps to prevent the atronarchs from enraging.

So either sth is blatantly wrong with our tactic or dps is the deciding factor there. Further advice appreaciated.

In any case I can see why most people struggle here. I informed many people in my (most casual guild) about my build and my rotation and even with the same setup they can´t raise their dps above 11k. For them prison is impossible because the flesh atronarchs. As soon as I join in to help with this stage and clean out the atronarchs they can finsih the rest of prison by themselves ( we tried switching me in group just for this stage).

For all those who are bitching at each other in this thread: there are two possible ways to get a solution. Either people cry and cry and cry on and eventually these will get nerfed like it always happened. Or we compromise and make the suggestion to zos to make the normal mode slightly harder and give people a share of the trophies for the V16 vault too.

Imo this way both sides would be happy and there would finally not be a reason to nerf any challenge that exists in this game to a status where a chimp could do it.

Regarding WGT I am really of the oppinion it´s doable for any organised group right now. It just depends on the time you invest. Other thing for unorganised without teamspeak though...

Titansteele

No More Nerf`s!!!!!!

If you can not do it then accept it and go back to single player games so you can tgm on and win that way where you wont spoil the experience for anyone else.

G0ku

Titansteele wrote: »

No More Nerf`s!!!!!!

If you can not do it then accept it and go back to single player games so you can tgm on and win that way where you wont spoil the experience for anyone else.

That´s exactly the kind of attitude which won´t help. Don´t know how long you´ve been ingame but they nerf stuff over and over again. Unless we make an alternative proposal that works it will happen again. Always keep in mind they need the whole playerbase to keep the game going. Only those who can do it all won´t bring ZOS enough $$$.

Titansteele

I have been in the game since the BETA, I remember when some of the solo bosses were properly tough but I do not feel that is relevant.

If all players expect to be able to do absolutely everything in a multiplayer game then that is daft, I want to have a proper challenge in the game.

There are many casual players in our guild and they enjoy the challenge as well, in my experience many casual players in our guild are hardcore gamers who fell into the kid trap and no longer have the same time to put into a game. That doesn't mean they don't have any skill and are not good players that want a challenge.

Artis

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Artemis wrote: »

Also you still didn't answer my questions, can anyone else do it please? Because I don't get it.

... I haven't and I won't. Given how strongly I disagree with you on essential matters (like "tone doesn't matter"), the condescending vocabulary you like to use ("entitled", "handed over", "now listen to me carefully",etc.), the wrong statements you make (too many to list) and the fact that you don't read/listen to what I say (advising us to use teamspeak when I've stated several times that we always have), and a lot of other things, I don't think it would make sense to confront our opinions and points of view directly. Happens sometimes.

Lol you can rationalize it however you want, the true reason is that you have nothing to say.
And about ts.. Make sure everyone in a group is in the same channel, because if they are not - then it's pointless. But who do I teach, right? You're good, organized and efficient group that can't complete a dungeon that other groups can complete.


@G0ku

What you're doing is correct. Ask your 2nd dps/healer/tank to help you with dps - drop dps ultis and such. Also, make sure to throw grenades at atros. It helps a lot. Practice with grenades more and it won't be such a drag
Ignore fast sacrifices, consider them as a CD for atros to spawn. Prioritize big groups.
That's how we killed it.

ragespell

As I stated before in other discussions about the CP system, ZOS won't be able to deliver engaging content for all its playerbase.
If they make content too easy, people with 500+ CP will be bored to death.
Too hard and only 500+ CP players will be able to do it.

Now, I know by myself CP aren't all, but PVE is pretty hard to balance.
So if you have 2 equal skilled parties but one of the parties have a tank with 20% more mitigation, an healer with 20% more HPS and 2 DD with 20% more dps and regen because of the CP system, given an hard enough content, only this party will be able to beat it, no matter how hard the other party will try.

Artis

When I completed I had 220CP. Just so you see how many is definitely enough.
The other day we replaced 1 dps with a guy with like 700+ CP who deals some crazy dps. We couldn't complete because he wanted to just burn things and ignore mechanics, which wouldn't work.

Completion is about teamwork more than skill/CP. But sure, when there's an experienced group with a lot of CP and huge dps, all the fights might become trivial.
So... Why nerf dungeons if you are nerfing them yourself(so to say) when you gain more and more CP.

ragespell

Artemis wrote: »

When I completed I had 220CP. Just so you see how many is definitely enough.
The other day we replaced 1 dps with a guy with like 700+ CP who deals some crazy dps. We couldn't complete because he wanted to just burn things and ignore mechanics, which wouldn't work.

Completion is about teamwork more than skill/CP. But sure, when there's an experienced group with a lot of CP and huge dps, all the fights might become trivial.
So... Why nerf dungeons if you are nerfing them yourself(so to say) when you gain more and more CP.

Well, how many CPs have other party members? What role did you play in?

As I said, given 2 equal skilled parties and an hard enough dungeon, you can have a party that beat it and the other don't, if their averages CP differ too much.

And I know skill is important, but if a content is designed around mechanics as enrage timers or unavoidable damage or the simple lenght of the boss fight, you can't say CP don't matter.

Artis

ragespell wrote: »

Artemis wrote: »

When I completed I had 220CP. Just so you see how many is definitely enough.
The other day we replaced 1 dps with a guy with like 700+ CP who deals some crazy dps. We couldn't complete because he wanted to just burn things and ignore mechanics, which wouldn't work.

Completion is about teamwork more than skill/CP. But sure, when there's an experienced group with a lot of CP and huge dps, all the fights might become trivial.
So... Why nerf dungeons if you are nerfing them yourself(so to say) when you gain more and more CP.

Well, how many CPs have other party members? What role did you play in?

As I said, given 2 equal skilled parties and an hard enough dungeon, you can have a party that beat it and the other don't, if their averages CP differ too much.

And I know skill is important, but if a content is designed around mechanics as enrage timers or unavoidable damage or the simple lenght of the boss fight, you can't say CP don't matter.

I'd assume everyone was around 200-300, but I don't know for sure. I guess I can ask if you think it's a big deal?
I completed both as a tank and vet wgt as a dps. Didn't try vet icp as a dps much yet.