Don't Hard Cap CP points ZOS

TalonShina

nimander99 wrote: »

You know, a daily cap would have been the smartest thing but that ship has sailed.

O.P I agree with you argument but you are going up against a vast player base of gimme gimme I have ta be teh elitest NOW people, there just isnt any reasoning or logical arguments u can use and its why "old" content in mmo's is generally skipped by the dev's themselves after a few years.

@ZOS_RichLambert has already said that a campaign which disables Champion Points is in the works. Below is my question to him about that very issue cut and paste from my message log... hope this looks ok.

Edit: Uggg terrible

nimander99 September 26
Hey /lurk if you are reading this and it's the weekend, take a break buddy... but if it's Monday then I have a simple question.

Why won't you just create a campaign that disables CP's? Instead of capping or changing major functions/systems of the game?

This seems the more elegant solution, as opposed to the collateral damage from really getting invasive.
ZOS_RichLambert
ZOS_RichLambert September 26
We are. Wheeler already announced that awhile ago.

I agree with you on this and I was glad to learn it was in the works I think they need to take BWB and make it like the new campaign open to Vets and Non-Vets no CP

Some have argued on this thread about leaderboards for trials and I can see their point but also think that making the the current trials into a campaign system would work too

access to all trials leaderboards based off the groups abilities to complete all trials 0-100 CP
second campaign 101-300 CP and so on then you are not only getting better but competing on that even play field and moving up as well.

of course this means the higher CP campaigns reward tiers would get better as it should and then you have continual progression

evoga

Just remove CP and problem solved.

iliatha

First said, im not a fan of CP System right now. Thing is zenimax kept a lot of peaople playing while there was no new content at all. They encouraged people to grind by bringing exp-potions into the game & crown store. Suddenly they want to punish those who did it the best. Thats the only thing im having a problem with. And everybody else would, who invested a lot of time.

Jeckll wrote: »

Because otherwise, no competitve player will EVER start ESO again as they can't catch up to play with the big boys

Well, i do understand what you are saying, but its simply not true.

i have played DAoC for like 6 years. I know many other ESO players did it too. "DAoC's CP-System" was basically the reward for earning points in PvP. (much better than grinding for hours like it is in ESO). But still, active pvp players had the strongest characters in game. I would even say that DAoC PvP rewarded the players even more than "our" CP system.

Over the whole time i played this game new groups came up, many pvp groups switched servers and stuff to play versus other groups and for variety. They had NOTHING and started with ZERO boni. They still did very well when they where good enough. Skill was still enough to compete and it was even a bigger achivement to kill high-rank groups.

All i can read on this forum is"QQ i dont want to play against a guy that might have more cp than me because its so unfair".
DAoC daoes exist till today and PvP is the best any MMO ever brought up. Is it the ESO community or just a bunch of pants shitting guys who cant deal with loosing from time to time ? What game do you want ? Every character is completely even ? Same gear, same money, some everything, nobody can improve anything ? Each guy that plays 1 hour / week is as strong as someone who plays for 3 hours every day ? Dont know if i would call i "fair" but i would call it boring ;D This is still a "mmo" not chess or competitive tetris. MMOs ARE about character progress. Is it not this way ?

Jeckll wrote: »

I do have way above average CP but surely there are many ppl that even have more and I personally dont want to have all my achievements in Game reduced to "thats because you have a ton of CP".

dealing with envy and stupidity shouldnt be a reason for any change. Most of the players that have most CP right now are known for beeing good players before CP system, i dont care bout those "opinions" and you shouldnt either

mcurley

iliatha wrote: »

What game do you want? Every character is completely even? Same gear, same money, same everything? nobody can improve anything? Each guy that plays 1 hour/week is as strong as someone who plays for 3 hours every day? Dont know if i would call that "fair" but I would call it boring ;D. This is still a "mmo" not chess or competitive tetris. MMOs ARE about character progress. Is it not this way?

Obviously everyone wants different things from ESO, but I doubt anyone wants every character to be the same. That's why we have tons of gear options and many skills to choose from.

What us anti-CP people are saying is that we want our skill of theorycrafting builds and our skill of executing our theorycrafted builds to matter more than the amount of time we have spent killing computer scripts over and over again... judging from the bolded part of your quote above, I imagine that you do not feel the same way.

Believe it or not, there are very skilled gamers out there who love this game but do not have the time to play for "3 hours every day".

nimander99

coolermh wrote: »

People who lose will always find something to complain about or blame... once cp gets nerfed it will be some other thing to wine about until it gets nerfed. The good players will continue to find a way to win while the winners will find another reason to wine about why they lost or its unfair... Cycle of the game.

coolermh wrote: »

People who lose will always find something to complain about or blame... once cp gets nerfed it will be some other thing to wine about until it gets nerfed. The good players will continue to find a way to win while the winners will find another reason to wine about why they lost or its unfair... Cycle of the game.

phbell wrote: »

My understanding was that the CP system was a reward for "playtime". The more one plays, the more CP one gets. Accelerated CP is also a benefit of being a subscriber. In other words it is a "customer rewards program".

So now because a few newer customers are unhappy ZOS is going to cap CP? That may prove to be a Customer Reduction Program. Businesses that cater to the vocal few tend to find them as their only customer.

I am hoping that Zenimax puts the programing resources into fixing the game performance issues rather than nerving yet another feature.

I couldn't have said it better my self. This is the truth of the issue.

Zilch

TalonShina wrote: »

I know a lot of people have complained about both the CP and the Vet levels for as long as I have been playing (which is about 3 or 4 months)

I finally (I am indecisive and building takes me a while) have a character i am proud of. I tweaked her yesterday but I am still proud of how she is coming out. I am now really excited to hit the Vet levels and join my husband who hit V 16 last night on his Sorc.

I have three characters a level 31, a 43, and a 46(my main) I could have easily been V16 likely or at least in the Vet ranks

wat

Xeven

Let me just tell you what 600cp buys a typical magicka build.

16% reduced spell cost
25% magicka regeneration
12% max stamina

Thats just 200 cp, lets keep going...

24% increased shields
16% reduced elemental damage taken (including shields)
16% reduced magic damage taken (including shields)
12% max health

Thats 400 cp... Were not done yet.

25% increased magic damage
25% increased crit/elemental damage
12% max magicka

Thats 600. Imagine 1600. With 200 CP you cant even max out one single star.

sadownik

iliatha wrote: »

First said, im not a fan of CP System right now. Thing is zenimax kept a lot of peaople playing while there was no new content at all. They encouraged people to grind by bringing exp-potions into the game & crown store. Suddenly they want to punish those who did it the best. Thats the only thing im having a problem with. And everybody else would, who invested a lot of time.

Jeckll wrote: »

Because otherwise, no competitve player will EVER start ESO again as they can't catch up to play with the big boys

Well, i do understand what you are saying, but its simply not true.

i have played DAoC for like 6 years. I know many other ESO players did it too. "DAoC's CP-System" was basically the reward for earning points in PvP. (much better than grinding for hours like it is in ESO). But still, active pvp players had the strongest characters in game. I would even say that DAoC PvP rewarded the players even more than "our" CP system.

Over the whole time i played this game new groups came up, many pvp groups switched servers and stuff to play versus other groups and for variety. They had NOTHING and started with ZERO boni. They still did very well when they where good enough. Skill was still enough to compete and it was even a bigger achivement to kill high-rank groups.

All i can read on this forum is"QQ i dont want to play against a guy that might have more cp than me because its so unfair".
DAoC daoes exist till today and PvP is the best any MMO ever brought up. Is it the ESO community or just a bunch of pants shitting guys who cant deal with loosing from time to time ? What game do you want ? Every character is completely even ? Same gear, same money, some everything, nobody can improve anything ? Each guy that plays 1 hour / week is as strong as someone who plays for 3 hours every day ? Dont know if i would call i "fair" but i would call it boring ;D This is still a "mmo" not chess or competitive tetris. MMOs ARE about character progress. Is it not this way ?

Jeckll wrote: »

I do have way above average CP but surely there are many ppl that even have more and I personally dont want to have all my achievements in Game reduced to "thats because you have a ton of CP".

dealing with envy and stupidity shouldnt be a reason for any change. Most of the players that have most CP right now are known for beeing good players before CP system, i dont care bout those "opinions" and you shouldnt either

You have been playing DAOC and you compare it to CP system? Could you elaborate how it was more powerful? Could you also elaborate how could you grind it?

phairdon

Agree to a point. Hard caps or removal of cp could be beneficial to alliance vs alliance, trails too. Leave as is, for the rest of pve.

Shimmer

Gosh, I hope none of you play AOC, its even worse. They have a champion point type system, but it takes real time to train them (much like researching traits) I for one dont agree with the cap. (I only have 200 CP points) Im super sad that people complaining about not playing but being entitled to the same as others who can play more got their way. Whats next? Being able to buy a Max character in the crown store? People are max rank and you complain that you arent either, and you get your way? They already did that with the glass motif.

What they SHOULD have done, was open different PVP campaigns in different CP tiers to keep the complainers happy.

Mr_Nobody

Or make it a real game and scale CPs off PvP.

100 kills = 10 CPs
10 solo kills = 10 CPs
100k AP = 10CPs

Whatever the numbers, you get the idea.

I didnt PvE at all in 1.6 and once 1.7 i had around 250. Played casually but still, invested quite some time in Cyrodiil. So thats whatever was gained from the initial ones given once 1.6 hit ~ If i spent the same amount of time PvE;ing, i would sit at around 850.

Shimmer

Mr_Nobody wrote: »

Or make it a real game and scale CPs off PvP.

100 kills = 10 CPs
10 solo kills = 10 CPs
100k AP = 10CPs

Whatever the numbers, you get the idea.

I didnt PvE at all in 1.6 and once 1.7 i had around 250. Played casually but still, invested quite some time in Cyrodiil. So thats whatever was gained from the initial ones given once 1.6 hit ~ If i spent the same amount of time PvE;ing, i would sit at around 850.

THEN the pve'ers would complain that the pvpers were getting something they werent....

Its a no win situation i think.

Mr_Nobody

Sylance9 wrote: »

Mr_Nobody wrote: »

Or make it a real game and scale CPs off PvP.

100 kills = 10 CPs
10 solo kills = 10 CPs
100k AP = 10CPs

Whatever the numbers, you get the idea.

I didnt PvE at all in 1.6 and once 1.7 i had around 250. Played casually but still, invested quite some time in Cyrodiil. So thats whatever was gained from the initial ones given once 1.6 hit ~ If i spent the same amount of time PvE;ing, i would sit at around 850.

THEN the pve'ers would complain that the pvpers were getting something they werent....

Its a no win situation i think.

Since when making it equal for the time-input, considering PvErs dont play PvP (unless forced) and vice versa, is a no win situation?

Korah_Eaglecry

OP has no idea why people are upset with the CP System.

Caligamy_ESO

Whats the difference between CP and levels, or vet levels? Nothing much except a time investment on that players part.

I mean really, if these are the arguments being made why don't we all just start new characters at V16 and do away with leveling completely so we can just endlessly pug grind for gear?

Korah_Eaglecry

Sylance9 wrote: »

Gosh, I hope none of you play AOC, its even worse. They have a champion point type system, but it takes real time to train them (much like researching traits) I for one dont agree with the cap. (I only have 200 CP points) Im super sad that people complaining about not playing but being entitled to the same as others who can play more got their way. Whats next? Being able to buy a Max character in the crown store? People are max rank and you complain that you arent either, and you get your way? They already did that with the glass motif.

What they SHOULD have done, was open different PVP campaigns in different CP tiers to keep the complainers happy.

Or turned CP off in PvP all together. Good luck filling up a PvP Campaign with people with XXX CP and Above. In my experience these players are not common. You run into maybe one or two of them once and a while in PvP. It be much simpler to cut CP out of PvP.

Funkopotamus

JD2013 wrote: »

Why should everyone be equal is my question? Why are people so angry about being beaten in PVP?

I have been PvPing in MMO's from the very first MMO's. Even some like AC where we could actually loot another players gear they spent weeks/months farming. I do NOT have a problem with "Being Beaten" if the player I lost to was actually skilled enough to do it... I do have a problem however with being beaten by some nolyfer just because he can sit around and grind all day and then run up on me and force feed me his "FreeTime"!

Xeven

Funkopotamus wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

Why should everyone be equal is my question? Why are people so angry about being beaten in PVP?

I have been PvPing in MMO's from the very first MMO's. Even some like AC where we could actually loot another players gear they spent weeks/months farming. I do NOT have a problem with "Being Beaten" if the player I lost to was actually skilled enough to do it... I do have a problem however with being beaten by some nolyfer just because he can sit around and grind all day and then run up on me and force feed me his "FreeTime"!

This is an awesome post.

Vslatimoreb14_ESO

Funkopotamus wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

Why should everyone be equal is my question? Why are people so angry about being beaten in PVP?

I have been PvPing in MMO's from the very first MMO's. Even some like AC where we could actually loot another players gear they spent weeks/months farming. I do NOT have a problem with "Being Beaten" if the player I lost to was actually skilled enough to do it... I do have a problem however with being beaten by some nolyfer just because he can sit around and grind all day and then run up on me and force feed me his "FreeTime"!

You sir have won the forums. Well done.

Peel_Ya_Cap_517

I personally have no problem with people being overpowered in PvP.. They have earned it and I think it makes the game more dynamic when you run into a guy that requires 2 or 3 people to take him out..

Looking at you, Hulk!, Xbone NA lol

Sausage

I agree but Zen has made it's choice, we will just have to see what the plan is then they reveal it. I personally think CP and catch-up system is gonna be something totally new what we have not discussed yet here.

nimander99 wrote: »

@ZOS_RichLambert has already said that a campaign which disables Champion Points is in the works. Below is my question to him about that very issue cut and paste from my message log... hope this looks ok.

Im pretty sure its non-vet campaign.

Xeven

Sausage wrote: »

I agree but Zen has made it's choice, we will just have to see what the plan is then they reveal it. I personally think CP and catch-up system is gonna be something totally new what we have not discussed yet here.

nimander99 wrote: »

@ZOS_RichLambert has already said that a campaign which disables Champion Points is in the works. Below is my question to him about that very issue cut and paste from my message log... hope this looks ok.

Im pretty sure its non-vet campaign.

Haderus is my home. I shouldn't be forced to leave to find a fair fight, or be banned from using any CP at all.

Make a campaign for 1k+ CP. You can call it NeckBeard.

AlphaCrucis

Alucardo wrote: »

AlphaCrucis wrote: »

Yep totally agree, but that's the risk i have to take when entering Cyrodil. When i come in with my 13 CP & come across someone like yourself with 500 CP & you smash me I'll just respwn & get over it. Next time i see someone that is v4 or higher I'll try to avoid them.

I just think if people are concerned about having low CP then spend some time to build them up

So you're basically saying that CPs matter to the point where you'd avoid someone with a lot of them? That in itself says there is a problem with the Champion Point system. If you have skill you should be able to go into a fight confidently, not avoid someone because they have more champion points than you.
Thank you for taking the time to demonstrate why this system is completely stupid.

Not at all, for some one to have so many CP means that they are a lot higher level then my V2, why should i be able to compete with some one that is a V14/16 in terms of CP

Etaniel

CP is not a problem. I don't mind loosing to someone with more CP than me. Someone with blue gear isn't going to complain about loosing to someone with gold trial gear, it just makes sense, if you spend more time on your character than me, you should have an advantage over me.

Although, there should be a hard cap on CP simply because the whole point of this system is to specialize your character and get him passives that fit him. What's the point of specializing when you can have access to all points. And that cap should be around 700, as it's stupid if you're able to get more than one 120 passive from a constellation. That's the only problem I have with CP

Jar_Ek

The problem I have is that not all gameplay gives cp (or do for that matter) at an equal rate. I really wouldn't mind too much if I could PvP as normal and still earn cp at a rate commensurate with grinding Npc, but I can't. I also can't level an alt and gain cps... In fact only a few activities do give rapid cp gain... mostly grinding ones.

And campaigns with cp caps are a bandaid for the bigger power differential creep.. which will only get worse with time.

Alucardo

AlphaCrucis wrote: »

Not at all, for some one to have so many CP means that they are a lot higher level then my V2, why should i be able to compete with some one that is a V14/16 in terms of CP

So please explain why my level 11 character has 671 CPs, which is most likely more than a lot of level 48+ on BWB?

TalonShina

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

OP has no idea why people are upset with the CP System.

Oh I can understand but as this thread pointed out there are many that share my view and many that don't. There is nothing wrong with varying opinions but someone in the thread pointed out this reaction from ZOS is based on A. One player who soloed something they don't believe he should have and they didn't even present all the facts there because it wasn't just CP but his emperor buff as well and B. most people that complain "claim" they asked the person that beat them how many CP they had and that person told them "1K+" I am sorry but if i beat someone of equal or close to equal level then me in PVP and was then whispered "that's no fair how many CP do you have?" I might lie to them just to mess with them. I think the person that suggested showing the CP amount along with one's level is a good idea because I do think the disparity is rarer then people would have you believe. Now that is not saying that there are going to be times where there is disparity and that is the reason person A wins over person B. But it is not as widespread of a problem.

and since I have now hit V1 I can interject with "more experience" as I start to gain CP maybe my opinion will change but I doubt it.

AlphaCrucis

Alucardo wrote: »

AlphaCrucis wrote: »

Not at all, for some one to have so many CP means that they are a lot higher level then my V2, why should i be able to compete with some one that is a V14/16 in terms of CP

So please explain why my level 11 character has 671 CPs, which is most likely more than a lot of level 48+ on BWB?

So the problem isn't to hard cap CPs, rather not let alt characters receive already acquired points

TalonShina

AlphaCrucis wrote: »

Alucardo wrote: »

AlphaCrucis wrote: »

Not at all, for some one to have so many CP means that they are a lot higher level then my V2, why should i be able to compete with some one that is a V14/16 in terms of CP

So please explain why my level 11 character has 671 CPs, which is most likely more than a lot of level 48+ on BWB?

So the problem isn't to hard cap CPs, rather not let alt characters receive already acquired points

or at least disable them from the non-vet campaign but yes I agree

Fissh

A post from a person who has not done any vet, any endgame, and earned one single cp.....
The rest of you use it to argue the same old tired arguments.