Do you agree with the ZoS putting a Cap on Champion Points per DLC?

Valen_Byte

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

This would be P2W.

Tolmos

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

Tyr wrote: »

Elhanan wrote: »

This won't address the long term consequences of the champion point system. Slowly progression of CP now will only benefit casual players NOW. In the future, it will be a hindrance for any new potential customers/players.

I seriously don't understand how nobody either 1) realizes this problem or 2) understands that it will ultimately result in similar complaints as they are now facing.

They are also creating a curve for players with lower CP than the general population, so the later a player gets into the game the faster they will earn their first CP.

This is also really important to me. I've played several MMOs, that I absolutely loved, which slowly died out primarily due to the seniority based rewards that made those of us who had been there a while feel good, but alienated the new players. The main playerbase were the same ones who had always been there, and as those players slowly dropped off the game got smaller and smaller. It wasn't that there was some mass exodus that killed the game; instead, the game just kind of quit gaining new players, and the ones who did join would head to greener pastures when they realized how the system favored long term players so heavily.

This was great, but eventually the game started to become a ghost town. By the time the companies usually decided to do something, the graphics were on the edge of being completely outdated and the game had fallen to obscurity. People would speak of the games in the past tense, despite me still logging in regularly with our handful of other devoted members.

I don't want that for ESO. I know it feels good to have the ego stroked via in-game mechanics, but it comes at an extremely hefty penalty that can cut short your enjoyment of the game. I want this game to last decades, and I don't really see the current iteration of the CP system being conducive to that. Time gated caps + a catch up mechanic, however, could be the bandaid the system needs.

SkinnyDG

This game is too far gone.

Mastery404

I don't think that putting a cap would do any difference. Those who dislike the CPs (like myself) would still disliking it for the very same reasons and those who like it are going to dislike the fact that they can't keep progressing the way they think they should.

Laggus

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

They should have capped them from the beginning. I think that ship sailed now though and MMOs need new blood to sustain them. Its disheartening to remain so far behind others after reaching max level, particularly if you are a casual player.

Revenant_Spartan

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

Problem is, if you cap CP, you take away the point of what CP is supposed to do: Give you something to work towards when you hit end level and have all the gear.

By limiting the character development you put the game back into a state where people stop playing once they hit a certain point. Then they have to wait for a DLC to continue. Time not spent playing is time that you can lose interest and move onto other games.

If you limit it but you would never reach cap before the next DLC, then the cap point is moot as you would still be in perpetual catch-up as a new player.

How about a smarter idea like this:

Everyone that buys the game now will get a CP exp boost - so that X amount of CP will be gained super quick. X is then worked out by the amount of time lapsed since the inception of the CP point system. And implement a "rested bonus" for all players. So if you are away and unable to gain some CP for a while, you get a small bonus.

Add to that:

The gain of CP is calculated server wide based on a mathematical average based on the least CP through to the most CP gained for the week. Then based on your own rate of gain you are assigned a % boost that would bring you up to the average gain. The closer you personally get to the average gain the smaller the bonus becomes. The idea is to give those with less time and newcomers a much needed catch-up mechanic without screwing the people who can spend more time on the game.

Tonnopesce

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

MaximusDargus wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

I've proposed this a month ago and no one where listen to me... now who is the weird guy?

You still are, because this idea is bad and driven only by selfishness of people who are jelous that others could invest more time into game and got a reward for it that they deserved.

Well yes and no.

I personally don’t have problems with the CP gap and the CP farmers since my motto is " track me down on cyrodill".
As a PVP'er the possibilities to encounter a player with 700+ CP are very little and if i do the next time i simply avoid him.
You need to consider the possibilities to use the CP sistem as both, a progression and a itemization sistem:

Consider the fact that when VR will be removed Zos can tell us : ok for the next dlc we rise the CP limit from 700 to 1K , evryone under 700 will be enlighted to reach the new "minimum" and at 800 you can equip the new gear included with the dlc, same thing with the 900 and 1k, evry X CP you can equip the next (more powerful) season gear.

All the cp you gain over the 1K cap will be stored and you can use them when the next dlc will be released.

I think it can be a great idea to help remove the VR ranks

Rinmaethodain

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

MaximusDargus wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

I've proposed this a month ago and no one where listen to me... now who is the weird guy?

You still are, because this idea is bad and driven only by selfishness of people who are jelous that others could invest more time into game and got a reward for it that they deserved.

Well yes and no.

I personally don’t have problems with the CP gap and the CP farmers since my motto is " track me down on cyrodill".
As a PVP'er the possibilities to encounter a player with 700+ CP are very little and if i do the next time i simply avoid him.
You need to consider the possibilities to use the CP sistem as both, a progression and a itemization sistem:

Consider the fact that when VR will be removed Zos can tell us : ok for the next dlc we rise the CP limit from 700 to 1K , evryone under 700 will be enlighted to reach the new "minimum" and at 800 you can equip the new gear included with the dlc, same thing with the 900 and 1k, evry X CP you can equip the next (more powerful) season gear.

All the cp you gain over the 1K cap will be stored and you can use them when the next dlc will be released.

I think it can be a great idea to help remove the VR ranks

I dont like it either, having gear tied to CP instead of level.

Because i still believe that even if ZOS will remove VR they will keep sane mind and introduce more regular lvls making new lvl cap somewhere around lvl80-100. Because MMO with 50 lvls is a complete joke.

Tonnopesce

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

MaximusDargus wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

MaximusDargus wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

I've proposed this a month ago and no one where listen to me... now who is the weird guy?

You still are, because this idea is bad and driven only by selfishness of people who are jelous that others could invest more time into game and got a reward for it that they deserved.

Well yes and no.

I personally don’t have problems with the CP gap and the CP farmers since my motto is " track me down on cyrodill".
As a PVP'er the possibilities to encounter a player with 700+ CP are very little and if i do the next time i simply avoid him.
You need to consider the possibilities to use the CP sistem as both, a progression and a itemization sistem:

Consider the fact that when VR will be removed Zos can tell us : ok for the next dlc we rise the CP limit from 700 to 1K , evryone under 700 will be enlighted to reach the new "minimum" and at 800 you can equip the new gear included with the dlc, same thing with the 900 and 1k, evry X CP you can equip the next (more powerful) season gear.

All the cp you gain over the 1K cap will be stored and you can use them when the next dlc will be released.

I think it can be a great idea to help remove the VR ranks

I dont like it either, having gear tied to CP instead of level.

Because i still believe that even if ZOS will remove VR they will keep sane mind and introduce more regular lvls making new lvl cap somewhere around lvl80-100. Because MMO with 50 lvls is a complete joke.

FF14?

The problem with increasing the level cap to + 50 is that nothing will change from now that we have the vr's, in any case you have two separate progression systems together and as we have seen is suboptimal.

Using CP and allow people to store them over the cap is perfect, because every dlc the people who play a lot are able to store a lot of CP, and when the "next" dlc comes they will be upgraded automatically to the max level without the need to grind points or levels.

While the "casuals" or the people who don’t have a lot of time will be able to catch up with the others, avoiding the power gap that right now CP system alone is creating.

Hexyl

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

Up

This need to stay on top.

Champion system is totally broken.

Pallmor

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

Laggus wrote: »

They should have capped them from the beginning. I think that ship sailed now though and MMOs need new blood to sustain them. Its disheartening to remain so far behind others after reaching max level, particularly if you are a casual player.

Yep. All caps would do now is give the top CP guys a permanent edge over everyone else. It caps everyone looking to catch up, while the top guys get to keep their 1000CP lead forever.

DaveMoeDee

Kinda, If you can still earn CP even-though you wont be able to always to use all of them.

Jar_Ek wrote: »

In order for PvP to work and hence ic, they need to introduce a soft cap mechanism where you can keep earning CPs, but you can only spend them up to the current cap. So a spend cap, not an earning cap. On and remove all enlightenment when the cap is reached.

Agreed.

I would hate to see people lose their already earned CPs (even if they can't be spent). And if they get to keep theirs for future use, others should be able to accumulate past the cap too.

DaveMoeDee

Kinda, If you can still earn CP even-though you wont be able to always to use all of them.

Mastery404 wrote: »

I don't think that putting a cap would do any difference. Those who dislike the CPs (like myself) would still disliking it for the very same reasons and those who like it are going to dislike the fact that they can't keep progressing the way they think they should.

But if you place a seasonal cap, you now have horizontal progression as people vary their builds using the same number of CP as everyone else. Admittedly, there might not be much variation in how many spend, but I like the concept.

DaveMoeDee

Kinda, If you can still earn CP even-though you wont be able to always to use all of them.

Pallmor wrote: »

Laggus wrote: »

They should have capped them from the beginning. I think that ship sailed now though and MMOs need new blood to sustain them. Its disheartening to remain so far behind others after reaching max level, particularly if you are a casual player.

Yep. All caps would do now is give the top CP guys a permanent edge over everyone else. It caps everyone looking to catch up, while the top guys get to keep their 1000CP lead forever.

CPs earned doesn't matter past what you can spend. I would assume they are capping what you can spend, not what is earned.

SeptimusDova

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

If implemented properly it would be a check and balance.

Tolmos

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

Pallmor wrote: »

Laggus wrote: »

They should have capped them from the beginning. I think that ship sailed now though and MMOs need new blood to sustain them. Its disheartening to remain so far behind others after reaching max level, particularly if you are a casual player.

Yep. All caps would do now is give the top CP guys a permanent edge over everyone else. It caps everyone looking to catch up, while the top guys get to keep their 1000CP lead forever.

I don't think this is the case. I think the cap is actually on what you can SPEND, not have. So people could hit 3600 and it wouldn't matter- they can only spend 300. What it will give them is the ability to instantly reach the next cap when it is introduced, since they already have the CP grinded for it. The rest of the players will catch up.

My only concern is the future players. This helps us, now, but that's not the bigger picture. Our selfishness in wanting CPs today, and wanting to be the big dogs on the block later when new players start, could cost us new players down the road who don't feel like dealing with our bloated egos and sense of self-entitlement. They will join the game to be competitive, be 1,200 CP behind us on top of gears and levels... and go play a game with a more sensible system.

And while it's easy to say "Good, let them go play another game!", you will find it harder and harder to stomach the empty PvP campaigns, empty queues, etc, because the only people left are those of us who are here now, wallowing in our seniority and how powerful our "hard work" makes us feel.

There's no use having an uber character in a dead game.

Waffennacht

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

First you people act as if the CP makes some huge difference.

In my experience I can kill a V12 while im lvl 33. He has Cp I have none, still the build matters. I see very little difference from the various levels of Vx i fight.

Also can you not level via PvE? Catch up on PvE then try PvP? (Imo its very very silly to play ESO for PvP only)

Second your fear of losing new players will happen the longer the game exists, right now a new player on Neverwinter will not be able to catch up in gear by the time the next thing comes out, the longer the game exist the more new games will draw their attention.

The game does state "unlimited adventure " if you limit it, its no longer unlimited...

Third the number of Uber players will always pale compared to casual players.

As im consule only I also realize how fresh this game is for us and only expect the player base to grow in the coming months.
PC gamers will have a more shallow pool of players to choose from, with so much competition on PC games I could see why so many uber players. This will not be true for consule imo

Hexyl

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

Waffennacht wrote: »

The game does state "unlimited adventure " if you limit it, its no longer unlimited...

The Grind for CP is the "unlimited adventure" you want ? u_u. Amazing..

Also, yes, cp make an HUGE difference... go read some post about it..

If not, why you thing pvp people are grinding cp ??

washlov

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

sorry have to say it again can't believe what people write in this thread

washlov wrote: »

poor CP farmers there have to be a cap, or something else, or the game will slowly die

THINK!!!!!

Rinmaethodain

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

Hexyl wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

The game does state "unlimited adventure " if you limit it, its no longer unlimited...

The Grind for CP is the "unlimited adventure" you want ? u_u. Amazing..

Also, yes, cp make an HUGE difference... go read some post about it..

If not, why you thing pvp people are grinding cp ??

And its not like people gain that HUGE difference in one day.
Gaining CP TAKES DAYS, WEEKS, MONTHS

And guess what

EVERYONE is allowed to gain CP.
If they CHOOSE not to, the only one at FAULT is the PLAYER.

What i see in this topic is what i keep repeating in every "Plx norf CP plax plax so OP" topic.

Players who decide to invest their OWN PERSONAL TIME into game, are being targeted by LAZY PLAYERS who for some reason decide that they are ENTITLED to have in game character as strong as someone who is dedicated player who spends his OWN TIME in game.

People who advocate for removing/changing/limiting CP are ALLOWED to gain CP JUST AS ANY OTHER PLAYER. They CHOOSE NOT TO and instead of blaming for it the only person responsible (themselves) they demand to take away work of those who EARNED it.

Hexyl

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

MaximusDargus wrote: »

Hexyl wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

The game does state "unlimited adventure " if you limit it, its no longer unlimited...

The Grind for CP is the "unlimited adventure" you want ? u_u. Amazing..

Also, yes, cp make an HUGE difference... go read some post about it..

If not, why you thing pvp people are grinding cp ??

And its not like people gain that HUGE difference in one day.
Gaining CP TAKES DAYS, WEEKS, MONTHS

And guess what

EVERYONE is allowed to gain CP.
If they CHOOSE not to, the only one at FAULT is the PLAYER.

What i see in this topic is what i keep repeating in every "Plx norf CP plax plax so OP" topic.

Players who decide to invest their OWN PERSONAL TIME into game, are being targeted by LAZY PLAYERS who for some reason decide that they are ENTITLED to have in game character as strong as someone who is dedicated player who spends his OWN TIME in game.

People who advocate for removing/changing/limiting CP are ALLOWED to gain CP JUST AS ANY OTHER PLAYER. They CHOOSE NOT TO and instead of blaming for it the only person responsible (themselves) they demand to take away work of those who EARNED it.

Again,

You say that because maybe you are playing the game from the start. But what if you will start the game in the next year hmm ?
I would like to see what will be your speech..

And no, its not from LAZY player. Take 6 months or 1 year to up a char will be ok.
But now, we are talking about 4/5 years ! for a normal player..

Waffennacht

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

Start in the middle like every other multiplayer game I have owned? No problem.

Endless grinding? Yes please! Grinding is fine by me, never had a problem never will. Better than, "looks like im going to witcher"

Yes I like the idea Ill be rewarded for my training (again grinding is no different to me than lifting weights)

V14 supposedly should wreck a lvl 33 according to you, however that hasn't been MY experience.

Again I can see how some builds can't survive that gap, but that shouldn't mean change the game cause some builds are worse than others.

New players, one wont face V anything until they have committed to the game, if the gap is so large they toss a60 buck game at that point, i doubt they will even pick up a year old title to begin with.

Losing old players kills a game more than not having a new influx of players a year down the road

Tolmos

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

I'm glad posters like the above are using the arguments they are to champion CP points remaining the same. ZOS needs to see the type of mentality involved with the current system, and have that data when they discuss what it will mean for the future of the game.

It is toxic, and this page (9) of this thread has been the single best example of that. The pro-CP arguments on this page have been the single best arguments AGAINST the system, and it's impact on the longevity of the game and ability to attract new players down the road, that I have seen so far.

k2blader

Hexyl wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

The game does state "unlimited adventure " if you limit it, its no longer unlimited...

The Grind for CP is the "unlimited adventure" you want ? u_u. Amazing..

Also, yes, cp make an HUGE difference... go read some post about it..

If not, why you thing pvp people are grinding cp ??

PvPers who grind CPs are the same ones who say, "CPs don't make a difference in PvP." And likely the same ones who think smooshing low levels and pugs is skill. lol

Waffennacht

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

Do you seriously think there will be a large influx (or even a minor one) of new players to this title in one year?

On this point alone has nothing to do with CP. People do not buy old games, especially as variety increases.

Right now Xbox One only has two MMOrpgs. ESO and Neverwinter, in a year there will be more, newer, never been done before games.

The amount of new players will only decrease over time no matter what happens in the game.

PC gamers concern me not, as consule sales carry the TES name, without us no TES.

Very little can be done to attract new players down the road

Hexyl

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

This is a mmo.. it will constantly involving.

Do you realy think no one join WoW after the vanilla version ?

New peoples come constantly.

And without talking about new players. What about players who take a break for 2/3 months and will be totally outdated by the CP system ?

idk

I thought there was already a cap at 3600? Did they raise it again already. Seems to the the way Zos does things. Lol

Caspur

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Caspur wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

Caspur wrote: »

Celas_Dranacea wrote: »

We don't need an elite class off grinders 2x as powerful. Folks can get more powerful with gear and skill already

Yes but, you can only get to a certain point before you get cut off and can no longer get any better. And at that point every other player can catch up to you and then you're just another ordinary player and there's nothing special about you.

What should be special about you should be you're a better player.

It's not possible to be a better player when someone else has:

1. You're exact same gear
2. Are at your exact same level
3. Same Glyphs
4. Same abilities

And this is exactly what happens with CAPS. Most top players have cookie cutter builds that they copied from Youtube videos and in these videos they tell you exactly what gear to use with what glyphs to use and what abilities to use. So you and 99% of other max level players are running around and the only difference is the class that you're using.

How are you supposed to stand out or be a better player when you're a DK and the 10 other DKs running next to you are all exact duplicates. More often than not it comes down to luck with CAPS.

If you think the top players are the ones copying and pasting builds. Then its you that is completely out of touch.

The Top Players in this game are the ones making these builds. Theyre the ones pioneering what works and what doesnt. To pretend as if they simply took the easy way to the top while you somehow struggle is disengenious. Everyone Ive ever ran into rushing to the top, exploiting bugs and copying builds are those casuals who cant spend 8 hours a day in the game. Not the other way around.

Not everyone is exploiting. Not everyone is abusing the game. Youre just green with envy.

If a player puts in the time he should be rewarded for it. This cap is nothing but an attempt to punish anyone that isnt playing in short bursts. Its their time and you should have absolutely ZERO influence on how they are affected by that time in game.

I'm pretty sure you misunderstood what I'm saying.

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

If you think the top players are the ones copying and pasting builds. Then its you that is completely out of touch.

The Top Players in this game are the ones making these builds. Theyre the ones pioneering what works and what doesnt. To pretend as if they simply took the easy way to the top while you somehow struggle is disengenious. Everyone Ive ever ran into rushing to the top, exploiting bugs and copying builds are those casuals who cant spend 8 hours a day in the game. Not the other way around.

This was supposed to say "top level players" I forgot to put the word "level" in there. Sorry.

What I was saying here is that there are only so many viable builds per class and CP helps put a distinguishing touch on everyone's build whether that build was an original build(by that player) or if that build was copied from YouTube.

When I said top players, I am not being specific to any single player, I simply mean that players at the highest level (eg. VR14).

I am fully aware of who is making and sharing these builds with the community and was not talking about these players and I have the utmost respect for most of them.

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Not everyone is exploiting. Not everyone is abusing the game. Youre just green with envy.

I'm not really sure where I gave the idea that I thought everyone, or in fact anyone, is exploiting and/or abusing this game.

And I assure you I am not green with envy. Again, I'm not really sure where this came from or what I said to make you think I was envious of anything in my post.

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

If a player puts in the time he should be rewarded for it. This cap is nothing but an attempt to punish anyone that isnt playing in short bursts. Its their time and you should have absolutely ZERO influence on how they are affected by that time in game.

I 100% agree with this, that's why my vote is, has been, and will stay against putting a cap on CP. And I also agree that anyone who puts the time in SHOULD BE REWARDED regardless if they play thirty minutes a day or 22 hours a day and no one should have the ability or say so to take away the rewards they have earned or the rewards that anyone will earn in the future.



So, to sum this up, I am 100% against putting a cap on Champion Points, I was not belittling any of the top build-making players, I do not think everyone is exploiting and abusing the game, I am not green with envy and I believe that players should be rewarded for their time regardless of how much or little time they have played.


@Korah_Eaglecry

k2blader

Hexyl wrote: »

This is a mmo.. it will constantly involving.

Do you realy think no one join WoW after the vanilla version ?

New peoples come constantly.

And without talking about new players. What about players who take a break for 2/3 months and will be totally outdated by the CP system ?

Yep, it's why WoW is still successful. They understand their product is a form of entertainment even people who play only an hour or a few a day should be able to fully enjoy.

Aerius_Sygale

I'd vote yes, but I need a different reasoning option; Yes, so others can stop pulling away from me further and further. <_<