IC Testing, needs 1 week with PVP turned on and 1 week with PVP Turned off.

Robbmrp

***Title changed***

In two days of playing on the PTS I've seen a part of a city district and killed three bosses. This in about 6 hours of time. So for the other 4 hours it has been nothing but trying to defend myself from the other two factions attacking me while mobs spawn on top of you.

I get that this is a PVP City but the ganking is limiting the actual TESTING that can be done. The gankers don't care about testing the actual update, only that they have new ganking spots.

@ZOS_GinaBruno, @ZOS_JessicaFolsom, @ZOS_BrianWheeler if you want accurate test results for IC, you really need to turn off PVP in it until launch. Otherwise, 75% of the issues people didn't see due to constant fights will go to the live server.

Why not do 1 week of PVP testing and then 1 week with PVP turned off. This will allow adequate testing for all changes being made to the game.

If there was 1 week of strictly PVE testing, this could give other people an opportunity to try out Imperial City that normally wouldn't since it's in a PVP zone. This could help increase sales, once people get in here and see what it looks like and how good it looks, they may decide to get it regardless of the PVP ability. They sure as [SNIP] won't though when it's a massive gank fest every minute and can't even explore the city.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity]

Kupoking

Turn off pvp in a pvp zone which main feature is that you fight enemies and players at the same time...

You must be joking.

ThatNeonZebraAgain

everything is data, especially including how players behave in the new environment.

Robbmrp

houimetub17_ESO wrote: »

Turn off pvp in a pvp zone which main feature is that you fight enemies and players at the same time...

You must be joking.

I said for testing only. We need to be able to test the new changes. Not get ganked every two minutes because someone wants to test out a new gank spot or roam in hordes to rack up Tel Var stones.

Robbmrp

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

everything is data, especially including how players behave in the new environment.

And I get that, but when that's the ONLY testing that's being done is attacking other people, it's not adequate testing for a DLC. Bosses, quests, mobs, crafting, everythings going to suffer from people not being able to test them due to constant fighting.

starlizard70ub17_ESO

OP missed the point, ganking IS the testing on PTS IC. Anyone can figure out how to kill npc mobs, it's figuring out how to kill npc mobs while avoiding being killed by other PvPer is the test.

ewhite106b16_ESO

There's no point whatsoever in testing the Imperial City without PVP, the entire point of PTS IMO is to see how systems work when you throw large numbers of real players at them actually .....playing, in the cast of Imperial City this means PVPing. Treating it like a PVE zone doesn't really reveal much of anything. From what I've read on the forums the last few days have already revealed quite a bit of information that players in a pvp-free IC wouldn't have.

Robbmrp

starlizard70ub17_ESO wrote: »

OP missed the point, ganking IS the testing on PTS IC. Anyone can figure out how to kill npc mobs, it's figuring out how to kill npc mobs while avoiding being killed by other PvPer is the test.

Sorry but no. Testing includes all aspects of a DLC, not just new gank spots....

Kupoking

Considering that pvp fights should happen in this zone mos the of time since its the theme, it should be tested with insane amount of ganking.

Robbmrp

Sorry all. I get where your coming from but just feel that there will be more game bugs that will end up on the live server due to not being able to adequately test the DLC changes.

ginoboehm

Robbmrp wrote: »

starlizard70ub17_ESO wrote: »

OP missed the point, ganking IS the testing on PTS IC. Anyone can figure out how to kill npc mobs, it's figuring out how to kill npc mobs while avoiding being killed by other PvPer is the test.

Sorry but no. Testing includes all aspects of a DLC, not just new gank spots....

we have to test every possible broken skill every broken ability how the new balance is where to kill people. Zenimax already planed ot make some changes from our tests. Ganking cc'ing and so on has to be the majority of tests this update will rise and fall with good and balanced pvp

alainjbrennanb16_ESO

they need this data to help combat, including stupid player behaver, like ganking from a keep on the way to the ic on the pts

starlizard70ub17_ESO

Robbmrp wrote: »

starlizard70ub17_ESO wrote: »

OP missed the point, ganking IS the testing on PTS IC. Anyone can figure out how to kill npc mobs, it's figuring out how to kill npc mobs while avoiding being killed by other PvPer is the test.

Sorry but no. Testing includes all aspects of a DLC, not just new gank spots....

I agree with your sentiment, but the sad truth is many player use the PTS to find new explots, gank spots, etc they can use to their advantage when the patch/dlc goes live.

Rinmaethodain

This is the whole point of test.

The fact you were forced to make this topic because ganking became a behaviour that greatly disturbed or even prevented you from enjoying game, means that the whole idea of IC being mixed PVP and PVE is wrong.

The reason for that can be also its wrong to have every faction unlimited access to IC at the same time.

There are planned tests that will put into action "must have homekeeps" to access IC. We will then see if situation changes.

If topics like this will keep appearing this means that PTS did what it was meant to do.

It proved how wrong it is to have PVP mixed with PVE + incentive to harass other players.

Enodoc

One positive thing has come from this though - we know that there is an issue over spawn/door ganking, and we have come up with ways to prevent that going through to Live.

For testing the content itself, I suggest waiting until the next Imperial City access option is tested, when it'll be possible to lock the other alliances out for a while.

Etaniel

Robbmrp wrote: »

Sorry all. I get where your coming from but just feel that there will be more game bugs that will end up on the live server due to not being able to adequately test the DLC changes.

Just because someone kills you doesn't mean he's a brainless ganker that has no interest in testing all the content.

Rinmaethodain

Robbmrp wrote: »

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

everything is data, especially including how players behave in the new environment.

And I get that, but when that's the ONLY testing that's being done is attacking other people, it's not adequate testing for a DLC. Bosses, quests, mobs, crafting, everythings going to suffer from people not being able to test them due to constant fighting.

Right now noone can test mobs quest and everything because of constant fighting.

When it goes live Noone will be able to enjoy new content they paid for because of possible constant fighting.

This is what tests are meant to show. Its going to be bad if they (ZOS) decide that just because in their imagination, IC is PVP content, they will ignore complaints of people like us, who try to enjoy PVE aspect of IC that was forced into it and thus is forcing us to expose ourselfs to PVP harassments.

Robbmrp

starlizard70ub17_ESO wrote: »

Robbmrp wrote: »

starlizard70ub17_ESO wrote: »

OP missed the point, ganking IS the testing on PTS IC. Anyone can figure out how to kill npc mobs, it's figuring out how to kill npc mobs while avoiding being killed by other PvPer is the test.

Sorry but no. Testing includes all aspects of a DLC, not just new gank spots....

I agree with your sentiment, but the sad truth is many player use the PTS to find new explots, gank spots, etc they can use to their advantage when the patch/dlc goes live.

That is very true. It just makes it almost impossible to test the DLC when it's constant fighting.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

What you expected people to act like civilized humans? That is hilarious. You think its bad now wait till it goes live. Idiotic decision to make it an open pvp area. One of many which is why this game has so few players.

Rinmaethodain

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

What you expected people to act like civilized humans? That is hilarious. You think its bad now wait till it goes live. Idiotic decision to make it an open pvp area. One of many which is why this game has so few players.

Exactly that. I have no idea what ZOS expected when they even added incentive for behaviour like that with TV stones looting system.

Robbmrp

MaximusDargus wrote: »

This is the whole point of test.

The fact you were forced to make this topic because ganking became a behaviour that greatly disturbed or even prevented you from enjoying game, means that the whole idea of IC being mixed PVP and PVE is wrong.

The reason for that can be also its wrong to have every faction unlimited access to IC at the same time.

There are planned tests that will put into action "must have homekeeps" to access IC. We will then see if situation changes.

If topics like this will keep appearing this means that PTS did what it was meant to do.

It proved how wrong it is to have PVP mixed with PVE + incentive to harass other players.

I hear what your saying but don't agree with it. I enjoy Cyrodil a lot and know it's hard to do quests while being attacked by other players. It's easier to do that out in Cyrodil though where your spread out and not in a closes in city. They do need to make the Crafting stations PVP Free though. You shouldn't be getting killed while crafting there. The only one I've come across was in a building so they could separate those. Right now it just seems like none of the DLC is being tested because of the constant gank fest going on and mob spawns on top of you. And I do understand that is testing, damage is being tested, shield strengths are being tested, but we could have done that testing out in normal Cyrodil.

Rinmaethodain

Robbmrp wrote: »

MaximusDargus wrote: »

This is the whole point of test.

The fact you were forced to make this topic because ganking became a behaviour that greatly disturbed or even prevented you from enjoying game, means that the whole idea of IC being mixed PVP and PVE is wrong.

The reason for that can be also its wrong to have every faction unlimited access to IC at the same time.

There are planned tests that will put into action "must have homekeeps" to access IC. We will then see if situation changes.

If topics like this will keep appearing this means that PTS did what it was meant to do.

It proved how wrong it is to have PVP mixed with PVE + incentive to harass other players.

I hear what your saying but don't agree with it. I enjoy Cyrodil a lot and know it's hard to do quests while being attacked by other players. It's easier to do that out in Cyrodil though where your spread out and not in a closes in city. They do need to make the Crafting stations PVP Free though. You shouldn't be getting killed while crafting there. The only one I've come across was in a building so they could separate those. Right now it just seems like none of the DLC is being tested because of the constant gank fest going on and mob spawns on top of you. And I do understand that is testing, damage is being tested, shield strengths are being tested, but we could have done that testing out in normal Cyrodil.

The whole point is the reason why would they turn off PVP in IC (or tune it down with any means possible).

Its going to be WRONG, if they turn it off or tune it down just to let us test properly all content without constant ganking, and after that they will push things into live server without any tuning to PVP aspect.

Its going to be RIGHT, if they turn it off or tune it down BECAUSE they realise it was wrong idea to mix PVP and PVE in such open manner and that they did wrong giving such large encouragement to harassing behaviour and ganking. They will adjust things before pushing IC to live server and they will adjust PTS to let us continue testing.

I also made a topic about similar thing, if they are planning to do any changes on PTS using players feedback before they push IC to live server, so far no answer. Such change could be a tuning PVP aspect or just like you said, turning it off to allow precise test of all non pvp content in IC

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/201888/is-there-going-to-be-something-like-half-point-pts-tweaks-re-evaluation?new=1

Robbmrp

MaximusDargus wrote: »

Robbmrp wrote: »

MaximusDargus wrote: »

This is the whole point of test.

The fact you were forced to make this topic because ganking became a behaviour that greatly disturbed or even prevented you from enjoying game, means that the whole idea of IC being mixed PVP and PVE is wrong.

The reason for that can be also its wrong to have every faction unlimited access to IC at the same time.

There are planned tests that will put into action "must have homekeeps" to access IC. We will then see if situation changes.

If topics like this will keep appearing this means that PTS did what it was meant to do.

It proved how wrong it is to have PVP mixed with PVE + incentive to harass other players.

I hear what your saying but don't agree with it. I enjoy Cyrodil a lot and know it's hard to do quests while being attacked by other players. It's easier to do that out in Cyrodil though where your spread out and not in a closes in city. They do need to make the Crafting stations PVP Free though. You shouldn't be getting killed while crafting there. The only one I've come across was in a building so they could separate those. Right now it just seems like none of the DLC is being tested because of the constant gank fest going on and mob spawns on top of you. And I do understand that is testing, damage is being tested, shield strengths are being tested, but we could have done that testing out in normal Cyrodil.

The whole point is the reason why would they turn off PVP in IC (or tune it down with any means possible).

Its going to be WRONG, if they turn it off or tune it down just to let us test properly all content without constant ganking, and after that they will push things into live server without any tuning to PVP aspect.

Its going to be RIGHT, if they turn it off or tune it down BECAUSE they realise it was wrong idea to mix PVP and PVE in such open manner and that they did wrong giving such large encouragement to harassing behaviour and ganking. They will adjust things before pushing IC to live server and they will adjust PTS to let us continue testing.

I also made a topic about similar thing, if they are planning to do any changes on PTS using players feedback before they push IC to live server, so far no answer. Such change could be a tuning PVP aspect or just like you said, turning it off to allow precise test of all non pvp content in IC

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/201888/is-there-going-to-be-something-like-half-point-pts-tweaks-re-evaluation?new=1

What they could do is have two testing phases to cover all aspects of a DLC that includes both PVP and PVE changes. The first week could be an all out PVP Gank fest and the second week could be all PVE testing with PVP turned off. A weeks worth of PVP ganking is more than plenty for a DLC. I will adjust the OP to include this.

ewhite106b16_ESO

MaximusDargus wrote: »

Right now noone can test mobs quest and everything because of constant fighting.

When it goes live Noone will be able to enjoy new content they paid for because of possible constant fighting.

This is what tests are meant to show. Its going to be bad if they (ZOS) decide that just because in their imagination, IC is PVP content, they will ignore complaints of people like us, who try to enjoy PVE aspect of IC that was forced into it and thus is forcing us to expose ourselfs to PVP harassments.

Actually.....there's plenty of players who are enjoying the IC content, the expansion was never focused on players who want to PVE in peace - there's a reason IC is a PVP zone and has risk/reward TV stone mechanics. You aren't "forced" to go there at all and there's two entire group dungeons for PVE players to enjoy in peace with a ton of new gear sets.

There's more logical conclusions to be drawn from the amount of fighting and where/how it happens like fixes to players being ganked while loading, or removing the ability for fast respawns in the same district which would allow players to clear enemies out for a while and have more space to kill monsters.

Robbmrp

ewhite106b16_ESO wrote: »

MaximusDargus wrote: »

Right now noone can test mobs quest and everything because of constant fighting.

When it goes live Noone will be able to enjoy new content they paid for because of possible constant fighting.

This is what tests are meant to show. Its going to be bad if they (ZOS) decide that just because in their imagination, IC is PVP content, they will ignore complaints of people like us, who try to enjoy PVE aspect of IC that was forced into it and thus is forcing us to expose ourselfs to PVP harassments.

Actually.....there's plenty of players who are enjoying the IC content, the expansion was never focused on players who want to PVE in peace - there's a reason IC is a PVP zone and has risk/reward TV stone mechanics. You aren't "forced" to go there at all and there's two entire group dungeons for PVE players to enjoy in peace with a ton of new gear sets.

There's more logical conclusions to be drawn from the amount of fighting and where/how it happens like fixes to players being ganked while loading, or removing the ability for fast respawns in the same district which would allow players to clear enemies out for a while and have more space to kill monsters.

The spawn locations are really wayyy to close to each other. To die and be back within a fight in 10 seconds says it all there.

Joy_Division

ZoS, please don't turn of PvP in a PvP zone to test how said PvP zone will work.

OGLezard

you are worried about ganking and here I am worried people are finding new exploits that they wont report so they can abuse them on live.........

Robbmrp

OGLezard wrote: »

you are worried about ganking and here I am worried people are finding new exploits that they wont report so they can abuse them on live.........

Right, so that will be reduced if they drop the PVP testing to 1 week and then turn it off. They can't find new exploits if it's been turned off. They would have already found plenty within a week anyway.

Pangnirtung

starlizard70ub17_ESO wrote: »

OP missed the point, ganking IS the testing on PTS IC.

Has anyone considered that ganking is a part of PVP?

Gankers love it. Gankees hate it.

Are gankers any less worthy in a PVP zone than those who want to go toe to toe and duel it out?

It seems to me that it is all about play styles. If PVP really is player against player why hate on the ganker who is using PVP mechanics to their advantage?

Must be the carebear PVPers that complain about them? LOL

Saucy_Jack

This new content is PVP mixed with PVE. I think the main problem being addressed is that both aspects need to be tested. The PVP needs to be tested. The PVE needs to be tested. Both need to be tested at the same time.

The issue is that, due to the behaviour of certain people (that rhymes with blankers), little of the PVE aspect of the common areas is being tested.

Are PVE dungeons being tested? Yes. But it's hard to test PVE in the common areas due to deaths.

"BUT IT'S A PVP AREA, DEAL WITH IT!!!1111"

Yes, but just because it's a PVP area doesn't mean things don't need to be TESTED. If you can't get/do that content because you're being ganked, it can't be tested. If it's not tested, possible bugs/glitches/exploits won't be discovered, and will therefore go live.

And then people will complain "GG ZOS, TEH GAME IS BROKEN!!!111"...well maybe it wouldn't be broken if the gankers would let us THOROUGHLY TEST ALL THE DANG CONTENT BEFORE IT GOES LIVE.

I mean, so you found new gank spots. Congrats! I'll shake your hand. Now quit it so that enough people can get enough TV stones to get the new gear, in order to TEST IT. I don't understand why the gankers are continuing to us cheap tactics; it's not like the TV stones you get on the PTS transfer over to your live account. Once you've found a good ganking spot/technique, great! Save it for live. There are other things to test than just ganking efficiency.

Robbmrp

The OP has been changed with the discussions that have taken place. I'm not saying turn off PVP completely for IC, just limit it to 1 week of our 2 weeks worth of testing. This gives everyone adequate time to test PVP within the city and also gives plenty of testing time for everything else that was added.

With constant battles in the city, it limits the ability to test the other things that are changed in the DLC. We should be testing everything, not just PVP related things.