What Is the NightBlade "Sap Tank" Build Set Up?

Vaerth

I was talking with some people on here and they mentioned the Sap tank build for NightBlades. Anyone care to share their Sap Tank build for a new comer?

Shunravi

Sap essence.
Siphoning Attacks
Whatever skills you find you need.
5 Heavy armor with a set of your choice (some are far better than others, but honestly go wild)
2 light armor.

Vaerth

Shunravi wrote: »

Sap essence.
Siphoning Attacks
Whatever skills you find you need.
5 Heavy armor with a set of your choice (some are far better than others, but honestly go wild)
2 light armor.

Lol seems easy enough

Sacadon

You get to choose how you get there, but the target/goal is using the drain power skill (name coined from using Sap Essence morph) to self-heal and therefore be difficult to kill.

There's tons of build advice out there with these forums having more misinformation than not. Tamriel Foundry has the largest community of players most educated on game mechanics, but best to try different approaches to find what works for your play style. There are a few on these forums that really have there styles mastered you may want to look into their posts. (just a few: @Araxleon, @Sypher)

BTW, If magicka approached, as of 1.6 means little damage compared to stamina NB.

Shunravi

Sacadon wrote: »

You get to choose how you get there, but the target/goal is using the drain power skill (name coined from using Sap Essence morph) to self-heal and therefore be difficult to kill.

There's tons of build advice out there with these forums having more misinformation than not. Tamriel Foundry has the largest community of players most educated on game mechanics, but best to try different approaches to find what works for your play style. There are a few on these forums that really have there styles mastered you may want to look into their posts. (just a few: @Araxleon, @Sypher)

BTW, If magicka approached, as of 1.6 means little damage compared to stamina NB.

^

=3

Vaerth

Sacadon wrote: »

You get to choose how you get there, but the target/goal is using the drain power skill (name coined from using Sap Essence morph) to self-heal and therefore be difficult to kill.

There's tons of build advice out there with these forums having more misinformation than not. Tamriel Foundry has the largest community of players most educated on game mechanics, but best to try different approaches to find what works for your play style. There are a few on these forums that really have there styles mastered you may want to look into their posts. (just a few: @Araxleon, @Sypher)

BTW, If magicka approached, as of 1.6 means little damage compared to stamina NB.

Well that sucks then lol, I was thinking maybe of trying a build 5 light 2 heavy and seeing if that would grant me good DPS with a magicka build for PvP.

Shunravi

I should also point out there are two contexts that builds will place in. PvE and PvP. What works in one might not necessarily work in the other. If you follow the builds of the two @Sacadon posted, you are more likely to find PvP builds.

Attorneyatlawl

Typically refers to a build using sap essence, although many use siphoning attacks full time too (I've always toggled it since beta when doing the kind of setup). It's not new, and it isn't tied to any gear type really. Raw heavy mitigation can be compensated for by avoidance if you go light armor or medium, for example, and it can be made into good damage even.

Shunravi

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Typically refers to a build using sap essence, although many use siphoning attacks full time too (I've always toggled it since beta when doing the kind of setup). It's not new, and it isn't tied to any gear type really. Raw heavy mitigation can be compensated for by avoidance if you go light armor or medium, for example, and it can be made into good damage even.

I was doing it in both PvE and PvP in light armor pre 1.6. Worked pretty well, did decent damage. if you do use siphoning attacks, it is always recommended to learn how and when to toggle it.

Vaerth

Shunravi wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Typically refers to a build using sap essence, although many use siphoning attacks full time too (I've always toggled it since beta when doing the kind of setup). It's not new, and it isn't tied to any gear type really. Raw heavy mitigation can be compensated for by avoidance if you go light armor or medium, for example, and it can be made into good damage even.

I was doing it in both PvE and PvP in light armor pre 1.6. Worked pretty well, did decent damage. if you do use siphoning attacks, it is always recommended to learn how and when to toggle it.

Did 1.6 spoil the build for you?

Shunravi

Vaerth wrote: »

Shunravi wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Typically refers to a build using sap essence, although many use siphoning attacks full time too (I've always toggled it since beta when doing the kind of setup). It's not new, and it isn't tied to any gear type really. Raw heavy mitigation can be compensated for by avoidance if you go light armor or medium, for example, and it can be made into good damage even.

I was doing it in both PvE and PvP in light armor pre 1.6. Worked pretty well, did decent damage. if you do use siphoning attacks, it is always recommended to learn how and when to toggle it.

Did 1.6 spoil the build for you?

Not so much spoiled it as I decided to go back to my old stamina 2h build because I'd been runing magica for so long. There were a few other factors as well, but I still tank veteran dungeons and trials with my sap/heavy build. I could build for it again and see how it does....

Draxys

It's dead, that's what it is. Thanks to 1.6

Avenias

Vaerth wrote: »

I was talking with some people on here and they mentioned the Sap tank build for NightBlades. Anyone care to share their Sap Tank build for a new comer?

I use sap essence only when there are multiple enemies to siphon from. For individual fights, like those boss fights that has no trash, i just hold block and spam swallow soul (the morphed version of strife). With magicka reduction gears and siphoning strikes, its literally impossible to run out of magicka using swallow soul, note that all the while u have your block up, so you can block and fight simultaneously. The concept is to use magicka to sustain stamina and to use stamina to sustain magicka, so you can manage both pools of resources together. For instance, you run out of magicka but have plenty of stamina, then u can shield bash or use other stamina based atk skills to regen your magicka.

For play-style wise, what i do is i run into a pile of trash, spam sap essence till i loose aggro to the dps or healer of the party, then quickly taunt the few that runs for them before they attack them. Hope it helps, enjoy!

Vaerth

Shunravi wrote: »

Vaerth wrote: »

Shunravi wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Typically refers to a build using sap essence, although many use siphoning attacks full time too (I've always toggled it since beta when doing the kind of setup). It's not new, and it isn't tied to any gear type really. Raw heavy mitigation can be compensated for by avoidance if you go light armor or medium, for example, and it can be made into good damage even.

I was doing it in both PvE and PvP in light armor pre 1.6. Worked pretty well, did decent damage. if you do use siphoning attacks, it is always recommended to learn how and when to toggle it.

Did 1.6 spoil the build for you?

Not so much spoiled it as I decided to go back to my old stamina 2h build because I'd been runing magica for so long. There were a few other factors as well, but I still tank veteran dungeons and trials with my sap/heavy build. I could build for it again and see how it does....

How it it for PvP? Better to go 5 light 2 heavy or 2 heavy and 5 light?

Shunravi

Vaerth wrote: »

Shunravi wrote: »

Vaerth wrote: »

Shunravi wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Typically refers to a build using sap essence, although many use siphoning attacks full time too (I've always toggled it since beta when doing the kind of setup). It's not new, and it isn't tied to any gear type really. Raw heavy mitigation can be compensated for by avoidance if you go light armor or medium, for example, and it can be made into good damage even.

I was doing it in both PvE and PvP in light armor pre 1.6. Worked pretty well, did decent damage. if you do use siphoning attacks, it is always recommended to learn how and when to toggle it.

Did 1.6 spoil the build for you?

Not so much spoiled it as I decided to go back to my old stamina 2h build because I'd been runing magica for so long. There were a few other factors as well, but I still tank veteran dungeons and trials with my sap/heavy build. I could build for it again and see how it does....

How it it for PvP? Better to go 5 light 2 heavy or 2 heavy and 5 light?

I would have to ask a current sap tank, or theorycraft with the 1.6 changes. 2 heavy with nirnhoned and 5 light would work ok I think... But it would have potential survivability issues. I used a magica build for much the same reason you are citing in your threads. I wanted to use the class abilities. Now I'm changing it up a bit.

Attorneyatlawl

Draxys wrote: »

It's dead, that's what it is. Thanks to 1.6

Not at all, just gotta build it differently. It's worked well for me since late 2013 in the full-time closed beta, through the present on my NB . You just need to strike a balance based on your play for pvp with a sap build.

If you go 5 light, 2 heavy (large pieces), then you'll want to have an armor/spell res buff like Immovable on there and use less shadow skills as it's the same buff you'd get from the passive, & try to fit in a set with an armor bonus tier, possibly even slotting Absorb Magicka (the stronger shield version of Harness Magicka) to level out the spell damage, with 1-2 nirnhoned items.

For a 5 heavy, 2 light (small pieces) setup you would probably want to capitalize on some of the heavy drop sets, and use the shadow skill passive for your armor buff, with nirnhoned taking care of the spell resistance, rather than slotting immovable. You could take advantage of the lower block cost by using resto-destro, instead of destroy-swordboard as your weapon sets.

In both builds you'd want to use Shuffle or Double Take to get the dodge chance to level out the incoming damage spikes. Basically, just shore up the weak spots of any specific way you're thinking of doing it through skills if it's a gear issue, and gear if it's a skills issue .

Vizier

Vaerth wrote: »

Shunravi wrote: »

Vaerth wrote: »

Shunravi wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Typically refers to a build using sap essence, although many use siphoning attacks full time too (I've always toggled it since beta when doing the kind of setup). It's not new, and it isn't tied to any gear type really. Raw heavy mitigation can be compensated for by avoidance if you go light armor or medium, for example, and it can be made into good damage even.

I was doing it in both PvE and PvP in light armor pre 1.6. Worked pretty well, did decent damage. if you do use siphoning attacks, it is always recommended to learn how and when to toggle it.

Did 1.6 spoil the build for you?

Not so much spoiled it as I decided to go back to my old stamina 2h build because I'd been runing magica for so long. There were a few other factors as well, but I still tank veteran dungeons and trials with my sap/heavy build. I could build for it again and see how it does....

How it it for PvP? Better to go 5 light 2 heavy or 2 heavy and 5 light?

:-/ you care to rephrase that or are you just making a funny?

Shunravi

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Draxys wrote: »

It's dead, that's what it is. Thanks to 1.6

Not at all, just gotta build it differently. It's worked well for me since late 2013 in the full-time closed beta, through the present on my NB . You just need to strike a balance based on your play for pvp with a sap build.

If you go 5 light, 2 heavy (large pieces), then you'll want to have an armor/spell res buff like Immovable on there and use less shadow skills as it's the same buff you'd get from the passive, & try to fit in a set with an armor bonus tier, possibly even slotting Absorb Magicka (the stronger shield version of Harness Magicka) to level out the spell damage, with 1-2 nirnhoned items.

For a 5 heavy, 2 light (small pieces) setup you would probably want to capitalize on some of the heavy drop sets, and use the shadow skill passive for your armor buff, with nirnhoned taking care of the spell resistance, rather than slotting immovable. You could take advantage of the lower block cost by using resto-destro, instead of destroy-swordboard as your weapon sets.

In both builds you'd want to use Shuffle or Double Take to get the dodge chance to level out the incoming damage spikes. Basically, just shore up the weak spots of any specific way you're thinking of doing it through skills if it's a gear issue, and gear if it's a skills issue .

Yup. Pretty much. I comes down to tailoring it to what you are doing with it. I've gone against some sap tanks who are pretty beastly in PvP.(until I fear them of course. ) Have not done it since the update myself, but I do still see it. I might just pick it up again...

Vaerth

Vizier wrote: »

Vaerth wrote: »

Shunravi wrote: »

Vaerth wrote: »

Shunravi wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Typically refers to a build using sap essence, although many use siphoning attacks full time too (I've always toggled it since beta when doing the kind of setup). It's not new, and it isn't tied to any gear type really. Raw heavy mitigation can be compensated for by avoidance if you go light armor or medium, for example, and it can be made into good damage even.

I was doing it in both PvE and PvP in light armor pre 1.6. Worked pretty well, did decent damage. if you do use siphoning attacks, it is always recommended to learn how and when to toggle it.

Did 1.6 spoil the build for you?

Not so much spoiled it as I decided to go back to my old stamina 2h build because I'd been runing magica for so long. There were a few other factors as well, but I still tank veteran dungeons and trials with my sap/heavy build. I could build for it again and see how it does....

How it it for PvP? Better to go 5 light 2 heavy or 2 heavy and 5 light?

:-/ you care to rephrase that or are you just making a funny?

No, I did do that one in particular as a funny to see if anyone would catch it, hats off to ya buddy!

Vaerth

Does a Sap Build work well with a 2H?

Shunravi

Vaerth wrote: »

Does a Sap Build work well with a 2H?

Potentially.

If you use 5 heavy, you could take advantage of the reduced block as @Attorneyatlawl stated, and make use of the spell damage that 2h gives effectively. You could also supplement your healing with rally and maybe throw some brawler in the mix. Though from my experience brawler isn't really the best in PvP... That's as a dps though. (Keep in mind the buff from rally and sap don't stack.)And on a magica build they aren't to strong.

Vaerth

Shunravi wrote: »

Vaerth wrote: »

Does a Sap Build work well with a 2H?

Potentially.

If you use 5 heavy, you could take advantage of the reduced block as @Attorneyatlawl stated, and make use of the spell damage that 2h gives effectively. You could also supplement your healing with rally and maybe throw some brawler in the mix. Though from my experience brawler isn't really the best in PvP... That's as a dps though. (Keep in mind the buff from rally and sap don't stack.)And on a magica build they aren't to strong.

Hey @Shunravi I am making a thread with my build, can you please comment on it for a DPS / PvP build? SHould be up in a couple minutes

You have been quite nice and helpful!

Zhoyzu

For tanking i tried 7/7 heavy ( didnt have light readily avail at the time).

what works really well is sap essence (obv) siphoning attacks (the one that works with skills) and caltrops. basically you have infinite resources for tanking as long as caltrops are down. the problem with this is caltrop are expensive so if the boss moves alot you gonna be in pain you also wont have the stamina sustain for tanking.

thats something i learned the hard way

crippledtank

So I literally just started building a sap tank for pve group dungeons should I bother?

aco5712

crippledtank wrote: »

So I literally just started building a sap tank for pve group dungeons should I bother?

its a valid playstyle so go for it

crippledtank

aco5712 wrote: »

crippledtank wrote: »

So I literally just started building a sap tank for pve group dungeons should I bother?

its a valid playstyle so go for it

Do you know any builds I could look at (just one to base off I never follow every detail)
Every build I find says it outdated since the 1,6 patch

UltimaJoe777

Shunravi wrote: »

I should also point out there are two contexts that builds will place in. PvE and PvP. What works in one might not necessarily work in the other. If you follow the builds of the two @Sacadon posted, you are more likely to find PvP builds.

Or like me you can make a build that works for you regardless of what you're doing. Then again I do sort of theme-based builds but they still work in both regardless.

Also just want to add Siphoning Strikes and Attacks both lost their toggle setting with IC patch and are now normal duration buffs which means they no longer reduce your damage when active. The other morph is still a toggle though.

hrothbern

Vaerth wrote: »

I was talking with some people on here and they mentioned the Sap tank build for NightBlades. Anyone care to share their Sap Tank build for a new comer?

There are many ways to do the siphoning tank. Many are valid builds. The principle is that Siphoning Attacks returns Magicka & Stamina per attack. Almost like a battery, although this was nerfed substantially in the IC update, it still works.
What they have in common is that they are very self sustainable (attacks do both damage as self heal !) and can handle 1vs 1-few with Strife (morphed to Funnel Health or Swallow Soul) and can handle extremely well mobs 1vs many, needed at higher level dungeons, with Sap Essence.

If you are however still a low level character, it takes a while before you have access to Siphoning Attacks and Sap Essence. It is therefore important that you level the Siphoning skill line fast.
I would start witth a Magicka build and at Vet 1 level you can always go for Stamina and more Damage. Atlow level, before all the Armor passives are gained, you can best go for 5 Heavy, 1 Light, 1 Medium, to get the Armor Resistance benefits of HA straight away at low level.
So put 1, 2, 3,4 Siphoning abilities fast in your bar slots. You only need the lowest shadow skill line ability slotted fast to develop the shadow ultimate Veil of Blades and one ability of Assassin, the teleport strike (the second ability) as gap closer, huge damage and fun.

Armor sets: 5 pcs Seducer HA is a trouble free source of Magicka. The rest is personal taste. If you like to do more damage as Magicka build, go 5 LA and 2 HA. But dead characters do little damage, so I would start with heavy.

Very easy to play and have fun

I have with a Vet 16 Mag NB Siphoning Tank no issues with any PVE content and do most solo, with HA Seducer + Healer/Warlock/Footman and in my defensive AOE bar with Sword & Shield: Funnel Health, Sap Essence, Siphoning Atrtacks, Refreshing Path (or a taunt) and Defensive Posture. In my offensive bar: Whatever I feel like.

chongguang

Hi guys
Is sap tank (magic) still working in DB game version?

code65536

chongguang wrote: »

Hi guys
Is sap tank (magic) still working in DB game version?

Don't necro a thread from over a year ago. Start a new one. Or search for one of the many recent saptank threads.

AzuraKin

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Typically refers to a build using sap essence, although many use siphoning attacks full time too (I've always toggled it since beta when doing the kind of setup). It's not new, and it isn't tied to any gear type really. Raw heavy mitigation can be compensated for by avoidance if you go light armor or medium, for example, and it can be made into good damage even.

problem since ic update is that siphoning attacks no longer is toggled thus it takes away from dps to proc it as well as it chance at proc is so low that it will not keep a 5 1 1 build with 3 cost reduction enchants from running out of magicka in less then 60s unless the caster relies heavily (90% of the time) on casting strife.