Why all the hate?

Xjcon

jpatek0501ub17_ESO wrote: »

When you order a Burger from a nice restaurant you expect something better than McDonalds. Especially when they tell you it is.
Then you get dog food on a bun, and a promise it will be better next time. You go back cause its still a cosmetically nice restaurant with potential.
Now they tell you dog food burgers are free, but you now can buy these awesome coloring books!

I don't think this game is like this, if I ever had an issue at a restaurant I just don't go back, there are enough out there I can go to I never need to return to a bad one, so if this game to you is that bad then I'm sorry but I wouldn't be here if I thought like that.

badmojo

JD2013 wrote: »

Sinthrax wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

Sinthrax wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

Sinthrax wrote: »

Well, honestly, if you had been here as a paying sub since launch you wouldn't ask any of this. You would fully understand.....

Been here since beta. Yes there are problems. Definitely are. But screaming and creating a toxic environment helps nothing.

In my opinion ZoS made the environment toxic. Maybe ask them the same questions?

Imagine you're in a room. A dark room. Now close your eyes.

Now imagine a thousand voices shouting out to you. "Fix this!" "Fix this!!" "You suck!" "Your game sucks!" "I hate this!" "Why isn't this how *I* want it??" And so on and so forth.

That's kind of like these forums.

I won't argue that fact. You are 100% correct but that doesn't excuse alot of what ZoS has done. Also, some of this hasn't been fixed in months. Do they not have proficient people working for them? I could give you all my reasons but most only want to counter and not discuss so I wont .

I will just leave it as I agree about the forums but....you lie and half-butt stuff then you suffer the consequences. So here we are.....

I am absolutely listening. I agree 100 percent that this game is far from perfect. The list of things that need doing and fixing are longer than the 1.6 patch notes. Lag. More content. LFG tool. Bugs. Balancing.

There's only so many staff at Zenimax and so many hours in the day. Prioritising would be good. Absolutely agreed. But raging gets us nowhere.

But there's a history of ZOS responding to rage from players. Bolt escape, stack size, provisioning, enchanting, the list goes on and on. Just about every patch notes I've seen has had at least 1 fix in response to customer "rage".

So I can't agree that raging gets us nowhere. They are listening.

StaticWax

I'm available to give hugs, be shoulder to cry on, or even if you just need someone willing to listen without prejudice.

I'll be right here waiting for you.

Sinthrax

StaticWax wrote: »

I'm available to give hugs, be shoulder to cry on, or even if you just need someone willing to listen without prejudice.

I'll be right here waiting for you.

You couldn't handle it. I eat the hugging type alive daily.

tplink3r1

Some people were expecting for a "skyrim online", not for an MMORPG based on TES, most of the hate comes from this.

Sinthrax

tplink3r1 wrote: »

Some people were expecting for a "skyrim online", not for an MMORPG based on TES, most of the hate comes from this.

Good point. I am actually the opposite. I expected more MMO and less single player Skyrim.

StaticWax

Sinthrax wrote: »

StaticWax wrote: »

I'm available to give hugs, be shoulder to cry on, or even if you just need someone willing to listen without prejudice.

I'll be right here waiting for you.

You couldn't handle it. I eat the hugging type alive daily.

You don't fool me. You're soft & gooey on the inside like a hot s'mores.

JD2013

Sinthrax wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

Sinthrax wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

Sinthrax wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

Sinthrax wrote: »

Well, honestly, if you had been here as a paying sub since launch you wouldn't ask any of this. You would fully understand.....

Been here since beta. Yes there are problems. Definitely are. But screaming and creating a toxic environment helps nothing.

In my opinion ZoS made the environment toxic. Maybe ask them the same questions?

Imagine you're in a room. A dark room. Now close your eyes.

Now imagine a thousand voices shouting out to you. "Fix this!" "Fix this!!" "You suck!" "Your game sucks!" "I hate this!" "Why isn't this how *I* want it??" And so on and so forth.

That's kind of like these forums.

I won't argue that fact. You are 100% correct but that doesn't excuse alot of what ZoS has done. Also, some of this hasn't been fixed in months. Do they not have proficient people working for them? I could give you all my reasons but most only want to counter and not discuss so I wont .

I will just leave it as I agree about the forums but....you lie and half-butt stuff then you suffer the consequences. So here we are.....

I am absolutely listening. I agree 100 percent that this game is far from perfect. The list of things that need doing and fixing are longer than the 1.6 patch notes. Lag. More content. LFG tool. Bugs. Balancing.

There's only so many staff at Zenimax and so many hours in the day. Prioritising would be good. Absolutely agreed. But raging gets us nowhere.

Ok, fine. But do you not think them being honest with paid customers the entire process wouldn't have cured a lot of this? I mean even an honest update instead of we working on it. Hell, they was working on it 5 years ago. Them holding back content until they can charge again for it...again..I could go on but people don't listen. Their best advice is shut up and dont complain about anything and take it. I would be more concerned if people weren't raging about the crap they have pulled.

I absolutely agree again. But I don't think that Zenimax were thinking that they would have to go the b2p route. (Not originally. Not defending them) The player numbers were a lot lower than they likely anticipated given how many truckloads Skyrim sold. I mean this is an Elder Scrolls MMO. That name alone should have sold way more.

I'm not saying that they haven't made bad decisions. They most certainly have. But a lot of stuff now comes from them listening too much to the community. For example the vet levels. People shouting for nerfs. Things like that. There seem to be an awful lot of armchair developers on these forums.

Now, on the flip side, there's Zenimax. They've been forced to go b2p route. They're currently busy trying to get it released for consoles (not a favourite choice of mine, but they were likely thrown money by Microsoft and Sony to do so) and some more transparency would have been lovely. Completely agree with you on that one. But at the end of the day, they are a business. The game is a business model. It has to make money or else bye bye ESO.

I'm not thrilled at having to wait for more content. I'm not thrilled at the crown store. I'm not thrilled by a lot of things. But at the end of the day, this is an MMO set in my favourite video game world. I'm yet to reach V14 and I genuinely like the game. Despite all the wrong turns and bad decisions. Raging won't get it fixed any faster. It won't bring new content faster either. I don't have any magical answer for this game. I wish I did.

Sinthrax

StaticWax wrote: »

Sinthrax wrote: »

StaticWax wrote: »

I'm available to give hugs, be shoulder to cry on, or even if you just need someone willing to listen without prejudice.

I'll be right here waiting for you.

You couldn't handle it. I eat the hugging type alive daily.

You don't fool me. You're soft & gooey on the inside like a hot s'mores.

LOL. I have to admit that you at least make me laugh. I wish I could meet you. I am not very soft at all and cant stand s'mores. I would offend you in about 2 seconds probably. I am not much into the politically correct world most live in. Maybe they should add s'mores into the game to satisfy you?

Inactive Account

for those of you wondering.... The decision to go B2P happened in the same meeting that it was decided that it would be offered on the console platform.

The PC market share would not last if there was still a paid sub fee for PCs and it was B2P for the console. Don't kid yourselves;, this decision was made a long time ago. it did not "Just happen one day". this was and still is the marketing plan.

This game is not run by the people who put the effort into creating and fixing this game, it is run by the Bean Counters who have no idea about MMOs.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

nobertpaulb16_ESO wrote: »

for those of you wondering.... The decision to go B2P happened in the same meeting that it was decided that it would be offered on the console platform.

The PC market share would not last if there was still a paid sub fee for PCs and it was B2P for the console. Don't kid yourselves;, this decision was made a long time ago. it did not "Just happen one day". this was and still is the marketing plan.

This game is not run by the people who put the effort into creating and fixing this game, it is run by the Bean Counters who have no idea about MMOs.

The decision wouldnt have been made had the game been what was promised. A TON of people left because of broken quests and blocked character progression. The game went b2p because the game was sub par and not worthy of a sub.

Soulshine

There are far bigger issues with the game than it chaging the sub model.

I don't know how far you have progressed in the game, but I can tell you that the game from 1-50, while extremely buggy at launch, has indeed improved a great deal and is very smooth. The real problems start with vet leveles, the XP discrepancies, the class issues, etc. All of which put together by the time you get to VR14 like me and after having done everything you have a different view.

That this game is an MMO and therefore has issues like other MMOs is not really a correct way to look at facts being this MMO has a lot of problems which still reamain unresolved, by devs own words, when it comes to core systems and constantly changing them -- somthing they said they want to stop doing this year and get down to actual content realeases. Unfortunately, we will not see anything like that until maybe late summer at the very earliest, which will put this game (a brand new game) with a wait window of nearly a year for many players. We have a right to express this is not an acceptable way to handle the end game.

That people may say this in rude ways, I agree could be done better. But Just because you personally do not feel there are issues for your gameplay does not mean there are not any and that therefore we should not bring them to light where found.

Inactive Account

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

nobertpaulb16_ESO wrote: »

for those of you wondering.... The decision to go B2P happened in the same meeting that it was decided that it would be offered on the console platform.

The PC market share would not last if there was still a paid sub fee for PCs and it was B2P for the console. Don't kid yourselves;, this decision was made a long time ago. it did not "Just happen one day". this was and still is the marketing plan.

This game is not run by the people who put the effort into creating and fixing this game, it is run by the Bean Counters who have no idea about MMOs.

The decision wouldnt have been made had the game been what was promised. A TON of people left because of broken quests and blocked character progression. The game went b2p because the game was sub par and not worthy of a sub.

I am truly interested in the console version; not to play but it's fluidity it comparison to the PC version.
I wonder if the console version will be plagued with the lag and the quantity of crashes.
The "bug" part, I think should be reduced as many of them have been fixed over the last year on the PC version.
I wonder if the console servers will be better suited for the traffic, or is the main issue like many have stated... "It's not the hardware, it's the Software".

rager82b14_ESO

Most of the hate from us beta testers was being ignored. We knew going in this game was not looking good.

The game could have been amazing, if they would have thought outside of the box. Not make it like other mmos. Make it where you can pick to have a solo world, or group base would, or even massive. Have scaling options and random dungeons for your friends to go in and adventure. Have a breathing world, that could cater to all types of players.

What did we get? Sub par, testers are not the blame for it. We tried to give feedback for a better game.

Roechacca

No hate here


Other mmo's should look at this game as a role model

Genomic

Krycek89 wrote: »

BrassRazoo wrote: »

For one who has played since beta, I still get *** pings, massive lag spikes, eternal loads, patch manifest errors, unknown version errors, crashes, drop outs ... hjkhsdhchn ... I'm tired now.

i have the CE box set been here since beta too - i don't come on here to *** and moan and carry on like some seem to think is appropriate or deemed suitable to do.

And yet here you are doing exactly that...

drogon1

One of the prob with the negativity on these forums is...that they are electronic public forums. Many people have a crudeness lurking within them that they keep in check in social settings. On the Internet though, there is nothing to contain them. Out it spews when the lousy person can expect anonymity with little consequence.

It's a shame that so many of these types exist, but much of the negativity says more about the poster than ZoS or ESO.

nimander99

I can agree with your sentiment but when you hit vr14 and look at the distant horizon of content I guarantee you will feel some frustration.
I am a huge fan of the series AND this game! I'm getting tired of no REAL (new) content... not even events or holidays, anything to take my mind off of Craglorn, Final Gold Zone grind, Cyrodiil, Crafting Writs, Delves, Craglorn, Final Gold Zone grind, Cyrodiil, Crafting Writs, Delves, Craglorn, Final Gold Zone... Forums, Cyrodiil, Forums, Crafting Writs, Forums, Delves, Forums, Forums, Forums aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrrrggggggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh *dies*

Genomic

drogon1 wrote: »

One of the prob with the negativity on these forums is...that they are electronic public forums. Many people have a crudeness lurking within them that they keep in check in social settings. On the Internet though, there is nothing to contain them. Out it spews when the lousy person can expect anonymity with little consequence.

It's a shame that so many of these types exist, but much of the negativity says more about the poster than ZoS or ESO.

Is it the moaners who moan more or do the moaners who moan about the moaners moan more?

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

nobertpaulb16_ESO wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

nobertpaulb16_ESO wrote: »

for those of you wondering.... The decision to go B2P happened in the same meeting that it was decided that it would be offered on the console platform.

The PC market share would not last if there was still a paid sub fee for PCs and it was B2P for the console. Don't kid yourselves;, this decision was made a long time ago. it did not "Just happen one day". this was and still is the marketing plan.

This game is not run by the people who put the effort into creating and fixing this game, it is run by the Bean Counters who have no idea about MMOs.

The decision wouldnt have been made had the game been what was promised. A TON of people left because of broken quests and blocked character progression. The game went b2p because the game was sub par and not worthy of a sub.

I am truly interested in the console version; not to play but it's fluidity it comparison to the PC version.
I wonder if the console version will be plagued with the lag and the quantity of crashes.
The "bug" part, I think should be reduced as many of them have been fixed over the last year on the PC version.
I wonder if the console servers will be better suited for the traffic, or is the main issue like many have stated... "It's not the hardware, it's the Software".

Well one nice thing its all the same server and like you said all the same hardware. So it should in theory be alot easier to track down what is causing bugs.

Obscure

@Trevize2888

If the toxicity doesn't kill you, it makes you stronger. ESO itself faces this test.

The venom you see on these forums predates these forums, issues some of the longest standing members of this community brought up with civility, and were not heeded. Ignored when expressly invited to be heard. These things were left to fester in the game and in the community, and all that's left is venom. Anger, rage, and direct disrespect thrown at ZOS is a testament to both the position and passion ESO's fans take; we love the game, but not it's handlers.

ESO deserves better than what ZOS has done, and I frankly don't give a damn if it's offensive that I say so.

Endurance

Trevize2888 wrote: »

There are some posts on this forum that make me question the kind of people that call themselves gamers.

there is just too many crybabies on this forums.. the 1.6 to 2.0.x patch pretty much made veteran levels a hell of a grind.. everything is fine for me, but people are demanding it get removed so that they can rush their new characters to pvp without any restrictions.. people on here are just lazy they want to max out within a week to test builds but they dont realize theres a big storyline to ESO they wanna rush through the content and skip cadwell silver and gold

SirAndy

Trevize2888 wrote: »

... I know that Gamers expect a high standard ...

No seriously, that was funny ...

Soulshine

Endurance wrote: »

Trevize2888 wrote: »

There are some posts on this forum that make me question the kind of people that call themselves gamers.

there is just too many crybabies on this forums.. the 1.6 to 2.0.x patch pretty much made veteran levels a hell of a grind.. everything is fine for me, but people are demanding it get removed so that they can rush their new characters to pvp without any restrictions.. people on here are just lazy they want to max out within a week to test builds but they dont realize theres a big storyline to ESO they wanna rush through the content and skip cadwell silver and gold

Look I don't know what your story is, but there are plenty of us at vr14 who did not skip a single quest in the game, from starter islands right up to Craglorn. We did not grind mindlessly for hours, exploit the game, or skip any content. What we have seen and experienced during that entire time is not something that gets brushed under the carpet. I am also not sure what exactly you equate with "too many crybabies," but I can assure you the information given on the forums and the PTS over the many and repeated gameplay issues are specifically what is needed to improve the game. Attempting to discredit everyone who reports problems is not the solution.

Aneima

LOUD NOISES!!

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

I guess you forgot the whole "Go ahead and play we will track your xp even after VR14 and award points based on your xp." promise. You also failed to mention 30 points would be equal to a fresh VR1. So basically they were going to take VR14 characters nerf them to VR1 status. So ya people didnt like that. I dont call that being a crybaby I call that being a normal person.

Divad Zarn

Trevize2888 wrote: »

I've only recently started reading forum threads and joining in with discussions, despite having bought ESO just after launch. And there is one thing bothering me.

I know that Gamers expect a high standard, the same as someone would want their favourite sports team to perform well, and it is human nature to complain but seriously...

There are some posts on this forum that make me question the kind of people that call themselves gamers.
Let me clarify, there are two points here.

One, I don't think it's necessary to air a grievance in an offensive or rude way, when manners and a quick message could fix the problem.

Two, What is the big problem here anyway? I am personally really enjoying ESO. I mean I'm biased because I love the franchise but really what is there that is such a big issue? And yes, some people will suffer errors and bugs that I won't, but that doesn't automatically fail the final product...does it?

Any issues that I have seen are simply the same issues that every single MMO goes through at one stage or another. Nothing more, nothing less. This game is a huge undertaking and to expect absolute perfection all the time is just unreasonable.
I mean, have you honestly cooked every single meal you've ever eaten perfectly every time?

The biggest issue at the moment seems to be the switch to free to play. This is a much bigger debate than I can even begin to write here but essentially, I couldn't afford to continue playing ESO after my trial month due to a change of job, but now I can. And I am grateful for that. And every time I hit a bug or my PC has a moment I let out a sigh and restart the launcher. But I don't lose sight of the hours of gameplay in between these moments, that I am enjoying thoroughly!

On a final note to try and lessen any offence this post may cause, this is not specific to just ESO players and really only encompasses a small cross-section of the forum users here.
Gamers seem to be the most critical of customers and I have to wonder, if everyone had the attitude of some of the people on this forum then why would games companies make anything for us to play?

Just remember, no matter what job you work in, that customer or co-worker or manager that comes to you and is rude, impatient and ill-informed (and maybe makes you want to punch them in their stupid complaining face) that's you. Every time you succumb to "Nerd-rage" about what is probably not such a big deal.

So that's that. I'm sure this will stimulate some discussion, please just remember to reply politely otherwise you're kind of proving my point.

Happy adventuring!

The thing isnt only about those rages and crashing, probably u'r new player + didnt experienced much other MMOs, anyway the thing is that game is great when u starting it, i understand your feeling about it cuz when i started playing while pre-order i was saying myself "hey this game is best MMO, nothing can be so amaizing", but after some time, when u reaching max lvls/money/equipment, u start realizing that there is nothing really to do, PvP (which cant be called PvP) totally boring for 90% players, most DONT like AvA style 200vs200 madness with all those lags and crashes which wasnt fixed for a whole year, PvE content? you will get bored after dungeon in few months as well, so what else to do in such great game without any interesting staff added there? thats why people raging about it

nimander99

Aneima wrote: »

LOUD NOISES!!

PEOPLE YELLING!! I'm Ron Burgundy?

Gilvoth

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pdWAcK6Eh8

Aneima wrote: »

LOUD NOISES!!

awesome post, i saw it necessary to quote you for truth and add the video you are ( i think) referring to.

Nightscar

I don't get how some of you always crash.. It seams to me it may be your computers and not the game in all honesty...
I have played the game over a month and have not crashed a single time.. And I have been all over PvP pve .

Of course my
I7 4790k
Gtx 780 ti
16GB ram
And SSD hard drive
Might help haha

But still to me I think many people are trying to run ESO on a pos laptop or a underpowered PC..
Consoles might be the better way to go for you folks in all honesty..