Resistance to taunting

karaiv

I have read in a couple of threads that even trash mobs can resist taunting even more often now than they used in the past (cannot remember the update that this happened). And from my experience so far as a tank, that seems to be accurate. The question is, do they resist taunting using their spell resistance no matter the taunt (stamina based or magicka based) or in case of a stamina based taunt, they use their armor rating? Moreover assuming they have resisted a taunt attempt, does this mean that they have successfully resist any other possible effects of the taunt skill used against them, for example the armor reduction of the puncture skill (and morphs) or do they resist each effect separately?

Thank you

Thymos

For the chance that you don't get a reply here, you should throw this in the Ask Us Anything thread to be answered Friday.

Nestor

In my experience the one who is giving out the most damage to a mob is the one who gets the focus of the mob, Taunt skills not withstanding.

AlnilamE

I see. Here I thought I was just not doing it right. :-(

deathmasterl_ESO

Most of the time I can keep a boss targeted on me with Puncture on my Tank that is until my friend usually nails them with a high burst dps attack, for the most part though I am very successful playing tanky tank. However trash mobs are another story.

traigusb14_ESO2

The taunts aren't numerical or additive in ESO, they are equivalent to "save taunts" from other games. They do not raise hate. They are reactive skills not a building number of hate (like WoW or EQ).

You grab aggro for XX secs. that's it.
The recast seems the same length to me.
You have to let it wear off before you can retaunt.
If you taunt while it is still under the debuff it extends the debuff but doesn't give you new aggro (because it is all or nothing aggro for XX secs, you aren't adding any hate) it will extend the immunity to future taunts though.


A lot of tanks from other games have a hard time adapting and spam taunts all over the place... which wastes resources and actually makes it harder to actually taunt stuff.

From the people that I have talked with since beta, we haven't been able to tell if the taunt skills' effect and taunt are the same thing or not. (Does resisting the armor decrease resist the taunt, or are they separate?)

If I remember right we thought all the saves were vs. spell resist, even for the S&SH STA taunt. It was very hard to tell, because monsters had almost no Spell Resist and Armor before... and taunts don't work on players as such. It may have changed in 1.6.

I can't say I have seen more resists since 1.6. I have seen more lag, so it is possible people are re-taunting a tiny bit too soon, while immunity is still up.

I agree, ask for the next show. I'm not sure if it is something they want us to know though.

karaiv

traigusb14_ESO2 wrote: »

The taunts aren't numerical or additive in ESO, they are equivalent to "save taunts" from other games. They do not raise hate. They are reactive skills not a building number of hate (like WoW or EQ).

You grab aggro for XX secs. that's it.
The recast seems the same length to me.
You have to let it wear off before you can retaunt.
If you taunt while it is still under the debuff it extends the debuff but doesn't give you new aggro (because it is all or nothing aggro for XX secs, you aren't adding any hate) it will extend the immunity to future taunts though.


A lot of tanks from other games have a hard time adapting and spam taunts all over the place... which wastes resources and actually makes it harder to actually taunt stuff.

From the people that I have talked with since beta, we haven't been able to tell if the taunt skills' effect and taunt are the same thing or not. (Does resisting the armor decrease resist the taunt, or are they separate?)

If I remember right we thought all the saves were vs. spell resist, even for the S&SH STA taunt. It was very hard to tell, because monsters had almost no Spell Resist and Armor before... and taunts don't work on players as such. It may have changed in 1.6.

I can't say I have seen more resists since 1.6. I have seen more lag, so it is possible people are re-taunting a tiny bit too soon, while immunity is still up.

I agree, ask for the next show. I'm not sure if it is something they want us to know though.

I thought immunity was caused by "overtaunting", that is 3 consecutive taunts in period of less than 10 secs. Are you suggesting this is not the case?
The increase of "taunting resistance" occurrences maybe it's my idea, but I have read that this is the impression of other people too, so something is there, a bug, a new mob mechanism or even a side-effect from lag, it's just too difficult to accurately know, what's the actual case, so this is the reason I asked.

I will do ask for the next show, let's hope we will get answers.

Ffastyl

This was stated in a previous Patch Notes, many months ago:

If a target is taunted three times within 10 seconds, the target becomes immune to taunting.

The duration of this immunity seems to be 10 seconds as well. This rule and latency/lag are the causes for taunts not working. There are some bosses with mechanics that ignore aggro and select a random target, taunt or no. Bosses that use almost exclusively these taunt-ignoring mechanics (almost because of light/heavy attacks) are referred to as taunt immune by the player-base. It is a misleading name, as you can still taunt such enemies. However, as the majority of their attacks ignore the taunt, it is better to just not use resources on trying to taunt such enemies.

To clarify on the rule above, the three taunts can come from any source, not the same player. This is why Inner Fire and Puncture are not used in DPS rotations as it would apply the rule. If another player (not the tank) throws a taunt at the boss, and the tank re-taunts the boss to redirect aggro, the boss will be immune to further taunts, choosing targets based on hate hence forth.

karaiv

Ffastyl wrote: »

This was stated in a previous Patch Notes, many months ago:

If a target is taunted three times within 10 seconds, the target becomes immune to taunting.

The duration of this immunity seems to be 10 seconds as well. This rule and latency/lag are the causes for taunts not working. There are some bosses with mechanics that ignore aggro and select a random target, taunt or no. Bosses that use almost exclusively these taunt-ignoring mechanics (almost because of light/heavy attacks) are referred to as taunt immune by the player-base. It is a misleading name, as you can still taunt such enemies. However, as the majority of their attacks ignore the taunt, it is better to just not use resources on trying to taunt such enemies.

To clarify on the rule above, the three taunts can come from any source, not the same player. This is why Inner Fire and Puncture are not used in DPS rotations as it would apply the rule. If another player (not the tank) throws a taunt at the boss, and the tank re-taunts the boss to redirect aggro, the boss will be immune to further taunts, choosing targets based on hate hence forth.

So there's no resistance to taunting? It's just a lag issue?

traigusb14_ESO2

karaiv wrote: »

traigusb14_ESO2 wrote: »

The taunts aren't numerical or additive in ESO, they are equivalent to "save taunts" from other games. They do not raise hate. They are reactive skills not a building number of hate (like WoW or EQ).

You grab aggro for XX secs. that's it.
The recast seems the same length to me.
You have to let it wear off before you can retaunt.
If you taunt while it is still under the debuff it extends the debuff but doesn't give you new aggro (because it is all or nothing aggro for XX secs, you aren't adding any hate) it will extend the immunity to future taunts though.


A lot of tanks from other games have a hard time adapting and spam taunts all over the place... which wastes resources and actually makes it harder to actually taunt stuff.

From the people that I have talked with since beta, we haven't been able to tell if the taunt skills' effect and taunt are the same thing or not. (Does resisting the armor decrease resist the taunt, or are they separate?)

If I remember right we thought all the saves were vs. spell resist, even for the S&SH STA taunt. It was very hard to tell, because monsters had almost no Spell Resist and Armor before... and taunts don't work on players as such. It may have changed in 1.6.

I can't say I have seen more resists since 1.6. I have seen more lag, so it is possible people are re-taunting a tiny bit too soon, while immunity is still up.

I agree, ask for the next show. I'm not sure if it is something they want us to know though.

I thought immunity was caused by "overtaunting", that is 3 consecutive taunts in period of less than 10 secs. Are you suggesting this is not the case?
The increase of "taunting resistance" occurrences maybe it's my idea, but I have read that this is the impression of other people too, so something is there, a bug, a new mob mechanism or even a side-effect from lag, it's just too difficult to accurately know, what's the actual case, so this is the reason I asked.

I will do ask for the next show, let's hope we will get answers.

Sorry, I was unclear .

Yeah over-taunting is 3x, I'm saying if you re-taunt an immune mob (taunt 4) it will extend the immunity.

From my experience, if you get the debuff glow you get the mob aggro, so I tend to think they are 1 thing and 1 resist check. I rarely have any issues with immunity.

It is all very hard to measure.

You can't 100% taunt a lot of dungeon bosses anyway. They have attacks based on rules a lot of the time like a Local AOE attack, 1 for guy at longest range, silence someone who cast a heal etc...they'll hit whomever as long as those people exist. One of the reasons it could be hard to solo instance before they scaled to your level (you could eat 4 people worth of specials all by yourself by being the only person there.)