How Should CP Be Calculated without Grinding?

Sentinel

First off, I am wondering why when the Champion point system was mentioned giving approx. 1 CP/hour when the actual value tends to be closer to .25 CP/hour, and more-so, why this value must be based off of XP, when all activities do not give the same rate of XP gain. Grinding tends to give the best XP/hour gain, and so with this system promising CP for XP gains, the grind will be seen as necessary by many. This, I assume, is not within the expectations of a system that's meant to replace another aspect of the game that is also a grind (Veteran ranks).

What it comes down to in my mind is why it must be based off of XP at all. Roleplaying, PvE, PvE endgame, and PvP all give varied amounts of XP/hour, most of which does not match up with 1 CP/hour (in the case of Roleplaying, 0 CP/hour). This makes for a wide difference of play styles to be discouraged with only the 'best' (most CP gain/hour) play style being accepted. Many I know will simply disregard the Champion system all together because of this, others will see it as another grind that they must go through. XP is at the heart of this.

Someone who is Roleplaying does not get any or much XP/hour (Depending on the activities of the Roleplay, which in most cases is often to be found without XP based activities). Therefore, these players get no CP/hour either. I am wondering for what reason this activity is neglected when looking at the implementation of the Champion system as a whole, and overall, why many activities that have low XP gain will now be discouraged.

I doubt this is what the system had in mind when the concept was first devised. What it is doing is promoting people to perform an even more monotonous grind (Lowering the xp gain values from a grind will not so much as discourage grinders as it will simply make them grind longer). Those who do not accept the grind play style will be overcome stat wise by those who did.

Therefore my suggestion is to alter the system to allow a timer to provide players 1 CP/ hour. This can work with Enlightenment to help the balance of players who are online often and those who are not. Enlightenment may allow someone who plays for less time to gain, say 3 CP/ hour or 4. Of course I realize the implementation of this type of a system would have to be tested extensively to allow the most equality of time played + enlightenment to have equal CP gain. In a single day, someone who plays for 12 hours for example, would earn no Enlightenment to help their CP rate, as they are already playing for longer. Someone who plays for 6 hours may have enlightenment for a short time, and those who play for less than 6 hours would have increasing rates of Enlightenment that scales off of the amount of time they play per day on average.

Currently I can see a few things especially needing care with such a system, a few listed below:

• May promote players to play for less time to have Enlightenment and therefore the best CP gains overall.
• Those who play often may feel like they aren't getting what they want for their time spent.
• If the rates of Enlightenment to a players average time are not set correctly, wide imbalances will occur that may make many distraught.

I would like to know the pros/cons to the current implementation of the Champion system, much of which was stated, as well as feedback on the ways that the above system can be implemented and its pros/cons.

If someone disagrees with my own suggestion, I would ask they provide one of their own so as to help give the largest basis for public opinion on the matter (as opposed to simply disagreeing and giving nothing in return).

Please keep all discussion constructive, and I would like to know what the official stance on this suggestion would be.

Thanks again.

EDIT: Additional suggestions below may outdate/ be more worthwhile than this one.

Nihil

The cp per hour was changed probably around the time they lowered the amount pf cp needed to max out a star (i think it was originally intended to take 700 instead of 100).

Time based rewards can have spme major side affects as well. If cp was gained by time played then players could easily find away to keep themselves logged on while they are afk (other games you could tape down an arrow key or jump butto to do so). This could cause extra stress on the server and in other games caused other players to be locked out of the game (primarily right after the launch).

Current exp system is prwtty imbalanced but no matter what they try there will always be ways to manipulate it. I think it best to work on the enlightenment system and exp balance (or alternative ways to gain cp).

Robbmrp

If they are going to change the way CP is calculated it should be the same across the board imo.

Why not base it off the game clock. Give x number of CP for each player per game day whether they are logged on or not for active accounts regardless of subscription status. This will allow everyone to gain CP at the same rate that's already playing the game. People can level their character from 1-V14 in how ever long they choose too. By allowing someone to gain more CP than others because they spend all their time online will only continue to unbalance the game imo.

When I log into the game I don't have any expectations on I should get this or I should get that because I've played all day long. My only expectation is I will be logged on as long as I am having fun, when that stops I log off for the day.

Sentinel

Nihil wrote: »

The cp per hour was changed probably around the time they lowered the amount pf cp needed to max out a star (i think it was originally intended to take 700 instead of 100).

Time based rewards can have spme major side affects as well. If cp was gained by time played then players could easily find away to keep themselves logged on while they are afk (other games you could tape down an arrow key or jump butto to do so). This could cause extra stress on the server and in other games caused other players to be locked out of the game (primarily right after the launch).

Current exp system is prwtty imbalanced but no matter what they try there will always be ways to manipulate it. I think it best to work on the enlightenment system and exp balance (or alternative ways to gain cp).

Yeah, this occurred to me, the best way I can think of how to balance that would be to make diminishing returns for CP gain/ hour after a long enough period of time. Alternatively, putting a cap on the amount of CP gained would also be a solution, however I can imagine people saying things such as, "Oh, I need to play for 12 hours today if I want to have the most CP. I'll just afk." Something similar to this may also occur with diminishing returns, so it really would need to be looked into well.

david.haypreub18_ESO

I'd be fine with that. As it is right now, PvP does not give near enough xp.

Nestor

So I could log in, set my toon to always walk, point him at a wall, come back in an hour and have a CP? While your idea has merit, how would they determine if a player is playing or is merely logged in to the game. (note I have not pointed my always running PC at a wall to see how long the game keeps me logged in, so I don't even know if that would work)

RP'ers do get the short end of the stick but one could argue that what they do does not require CPs like other game activities do (Trials, PvP, higher end VR content).

However I think everyone should get something towards CPs if they are logged into the server and are doing something in the game. Except spamming spells in trading hubs and banks.

Sentinel

Nestor wrote: »

So I could log in, set my toon to always walk, point him at a wall, come back in an hour and have a CP? While your idea has merit, how would they determine if a player is playing or is merely logged in to the game. (note I have not pointed my always running PC at a wall to see how long the game keeps me logged in, so I don't even know if that would work)

RP'ers do get the short end of the stick but one could argue that what they do does not require CPs like other game activities do (Trials, PvP, higher end VR content).

However I think everyone should get something towards CPs if they are logged into the server and are doing something in the game. Except spamming spells in trading hubs and banks.

That's the biggest downside to my suggestion. I've not found a way to bypass the fact that many will likely just afk for points.

Robbmrp

My post above would resolve this issue. Granted people will be ticked about it but what aren't they already ticked about!

olsborg

Agree with op, people will grind and grind, and the few that want to pvp will eventually be hanging behind...

Sentinel

Robbmrp wrote: »

If they are going to change the way CP is calculated it should be the same across the board imo.

Why not base it off the game clock. Give x number of CP for each player per game day whether they are logged on or not for active accounts regardless of subscription status. This will allow everyone to gain CP at the same rate that's already playing the game. People can level their character from 1-V14 in how ever long they choose too. By allowing someone to gain more CP than others because they spend all their time online will only continue to unbalance the game imo.

When I log into the game I don't have any expectations on I should get this or I should get that because I've played all day long. My only expectation is I will be logged on as long as I am having fun, when that stops I log off for the day.

This may also be worth considering (a single fixed value given per day regardless of time and xp).

Keron

Sentinel wrote: »

Robbmrp wrote: »

<snip>

This may also be worth considering (a single fixed value given per day regardless of time and xp).

Combine it. If a player logs in a given day, he can get a max of 5 (example, adjust as required) champion points. He gets 2 after 1h of doing anything varied (pvp, chatting a.k.a. rp, trial, pve, whatever). The other three can be obtained thereafter by earning either experience points or alliance points or any combination thereof.

This gives a small amount for free, these can also be achieved by the so-called casuals. More hardcore players can still distinguish themselves by earning more, but the limit makes sure that hardcore grinding is useless.

ThatNeonZebraAgain

Sentinel wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

So I could log in, set my toon to always walk, point him at a wall, come back in an hour and have a CP? While your idea has merit, how would they determine if a player is playing or is merely logged in to the game. (note I have not pointed my always running PC at a wall to see how long the game keeps me logged in, so I don't even know if that would work)

RP'ers do get the short end of the stick but one could argue that what they do does not require CPs like other game activities do (Trials, PvP, higher end VR content).

However I think everyone should get something towards CPs if they are logged into the server and are doing something in the game. Except spamming spells in trading hubs and banks.

That's the biggest downside to my suggestion. I've not found a way to bypass the fact that many will likely just afk for points.

Have interactions (e.g. advancing a quest, looting a corpse, purchasing something with gold, crafting an item, trading with a player, killing a mob/player, 'entering' city/dungeon/place, etc) create a kind of check that keeps the timer going. If you're idle for a while, the timer stops. Sure, people could figure out a way to mix/max interactions and afk time, but at that point you're still having to play the game pretty much.

derpsticks

How about a system not based on time or xp?

How about giving a preset number of champion points per day based on completed objectives. For instance, lets say an account can earn up to 8 champion points in a day maximum but each of those champion points is awarded upon the completion of an objective such as:

"Complete both undaunted dungeon dailies"
"Complete X crafting dailies"
"Complete X pvp dailies"
"Complete <insert trial name>"
"Complete DSA"
"Earn X alliance points"
"Catch the rare <insert fish name> fish from <insert zone>"
"Help capture X keeps, scrolls, or resources"
"Mine/Pick/Chop/Extract/Collect X resource nodes"
"Kill X <insert mob name> in <insert level appropriate zone>"
"Steal X items without being caught by a guard"
"Pickpocket X items without being caught by a guard"
"Literally anything that takes some amount of measurable effort that players like to do anyways"

Now here is the interesting part, the player is given the opportunity to choose which 8 of these objectives to complete to earn their daily champion points from a list of 12-16 possibilities. Furthermore, the list is randomly generated and may have multiple objectives to do the same thing or slight variances where applicable. The randomness could be based on how "easy" or how much time the objective practically takes so things like harvesting resources would be available less often because it is relatively easy, but often enough because it can be time consuming.

What this does:

Prevents players from having to grind for anything except if they choose the grindy objective.

Randomization prevents players from picking the same thing over and over and will effectively average that player's ability to complete the objectives (If players could pick what they were good at all the time they would have too easy a time). Forcing players to complete at least some of their least favorite / hardest to complete things mixes the game up for them and guarantees all players average about the same amount of time to gain all their points over time.

Allows Crafters, PVErs, PVPrs, Grinders, Farmers, Fishers, Thieves, etc. equal access to the champion system. (Sorry RPrs, I don't RP so I can't think of a measurable objective for you, maybe you can).

Allows all players an equal opportunity to advance in the champion system at the same rate. It would also be possible to implement 3 days worth of champion point "backlog" to a player, allowing them to earn up to 24 champion points if they missed a few days or didn't finish an objective from the day before, but no more than 24 after the 3rd day.

Gives PVP players a viable option to gain champion points without worrying about the xp rates in Cyrodiil. They will just do what they normally do to earn a point, but can't earn them all doing just PVP unless RNG works out for them.

Gives VR14 characters viable options to gain champion points and does not punish those having completed most quests/achievements/events/etc.

Does not require players to create alts just for additional sources of XP.

Prevents any player from gaining a significant advantage over any other player who plays an average amount of time per day. Players who join later or do not have the ability to play every 3 days may be awarded additional champion points per day if they are significantly far behind (say 6 - 8 months down the road when others have 2/3-3/4 the points).

Does not allow players to sit idle and gain champion points on a daily basis based on a timed release of points.

Does not make certain time frames of xp gain worth wildly larger amounts for no apparent reason (current enlightenment). Instead merely allows players to choose alternative objectives so they can actually play the way they want in order to earn their points.

Many other wonderful things can come of this system. Given a proper set of difficult/time consuming/measurable accomplishments and objectives every single player's play style could be accounted for and given equal weight.

This system would make the champion system 3600 times better than the current implementation (see what I did there).

Please feel free to comment on this, I would love to hear your feedback. Constructive criticism is welcome.

ZRage

Kinda surprising MMO players have problem with grind......... lol ?

I don''t think champion system was designed (at least it simply isn't) to remove grinding from the game (in fact what else endless* activities you can implement to the MMO game?). Champ system was added to simply add more deep to the end game character development.

I disagree with free rewards for everyone, I think that any progress in game should be aquired by players, not given away for free, it just ruins whole reward system, very bad idea.

What they could do instead is increasing the max pool to week or more so newer people would have better chances to catch up.

Sentinel

ZRage wrote: »

Kinda surprising MMO players have problem with grind......... lol ?

I don''t think champion system was designed (at least it simply isn't) to remove grinding from the game (in fact what else endless* activities you can implement to the MMO game?). Champ system was added to simply add more deep to the end game character development.

I disagree with free rewards for everyone, I think that any progress in game should be aquired by players, not given away for free, it just ruins whole reward system, very bad idea.

What they could do instead is increasing the max pool to week or more so newer people would have better chances to catch up.

Despite this being an MMO, it is also an Elder scrolls game and I would hope that all endgame content wouldn't be dumbed down to a grind based system that is as simple as it is boring. While I do agree that they should find a way that doesn't give it away for free, neither should they give things away only if you play how they want (via grind).

Keron

ZRage wrote: »

I disagree with free rewards for everyone, I think that any progress in game should be aquired by players, not given away for free, it just ruins whole reward system, very bad idea.

Correct. You just described XP grinding. Boring, does not take that much 'skill' and is only a measure of time you spend.

Darlantan

Keron wrote: »

ZRage wrote: »

I disagree with free rewards for everyone, I think that any progress in game should be aquired by players, not given away for free, it just ruins whole reward system, very bad idea.

Correct. You just described XP grinding. Boring, does not take that much 'skill' and is only a measure of time you spend.

And how much skill does it take to stick your character in a corner, press a key (or random keys) while you sleep?

None...

That is why time based CP reward is worse.

Darlantan

derpsticks wrote: »

How about a system not based on time or xp?

How about giving a preset number of champion points per day based on completed objectives. For instance, lets say an account can earn up to 8 champion points in a day maximum but each of those champion points is awarded upon the completion of an objective such as:

"Complete both undaunted dungeon dailies"
"Complete X crafting dailies"
"Complete X pvp dailies"
"Complete <insert trial name>"
"Complete DSA"
"Earn X alliance points"
"Catch the rare <insert fish name> fish from <insert zone>"
"Help capture X keeps, scrolls, or resources"
"Mine/Pick/Chop/Extract/Collect X resource nodes"
"Kill X <insert mob name> in <insert level appropriate zone>"
"Steal X items without being caught by a guard"
"Pickpocket X items without being caught by a guard"
"Literally anything that takes some amount of measurable effort that players like to do anyways"

Now here is the interesting part, the player is given the opportunity to choose which 8 of these objectives to complete to earn their daily champion points from a list of 12-16 possibilities. Furthermore, the list is randomly generated and may have multiple objectives to do the same thing or slight variances where applicable. The randomness could be based on how "easy" or how much time the objective practically takes so things like harvesting resources would be available less often because it is relatively easy, but often enough because it can be time consuming.

What this does:

Prevents players from having to grind for anything except if they choose the grindy objective.

Randomization prevents players from picking the same thing over and over and will effectively average that player's ability to complete the objectives (If players could pick what they were good at all the time they would have too easy a time). Forcing players to complete at least some of their least favorite / hardest to complete things mixes the game up for them and guarantees all players average about the same amount of time to gain all their points over time.

Allows Crafters, PVErs, PVPrs, Grinders, Farmers, Fishers, Thieves, etc. equal access to the champion system. (Sorry RPrs, I don't RP so I can't think of a measurable objective for you, maybe you can).

Allows all players an equal opportunity to advance in the champion system at the same rate. It would also be possible to implement 3 days worth of champion point "backlog" to a player, allowing them to earn up to 24 champion points if they missed a few days or didn't finish an objective from the day before, but no more than 24 after the 3rd day.

Gives PVP players a viable option to gain champion points without worrying about the xp rates in Cyrodiil. They will just do what they normally do to earn a point, but can't earn them all doing just PVP unless RNG works out for them.

Gives VR14 characters viable options to gain champion points and does not punish those having completed most quests/achievements/events/etc.

Does not require players to create alts just for additional sources of XP.

Prevents any player from gaining a significant advantage over any other player who plays an average amount of time per day. Players who join later or do not have the ability to play every 3 days may be awarded additional champion points per day if they are significantly far behind (say 6 - 8 months down the road when others have 2/3-3/4 the points).

Does not allow players to sit idle and gain champion points on a daily basis based on a timed release of points.

Does not make certain time frames of xp gain worth wildly larger amounts for no apparent reason (current enlightenment). Instead merely allows players to choose alternative objectives so they can actually play the way they want in order to earn their points.

Many other wonderful things can come of this system. Given a proper set of difficult/time consuming/measurable accomplishments and objectives every single player's play style could be accounted for and given equal weight.

This system would make the champion system 3600 times better than the current implementation (see what I did there).

Please feel free to comment on this, I would love to hear your feedback. Constructive criticism is welcome.

Again... that only work for some. Not everyone. Some people want to see a progression and see that the time they invest in the game show up.

Sadly that also sound a lot like everybody is a winner and we have no loser that some people keep preaching about. It's not something i am to interested...

btw, if you say a player can't chose the task that mean you will force players that do not want to pvp too pvp or players that to not want to harvest, to harvest or in simply do something they do not care to get the CP. That is also not good.

I do not see how it's better for everyone....

McDoogs

Leave grinding. I'm in my mid-30s, have a more than full time career (software engineer @ a startup) with a family, if I couldn't grind (aka maximize my in-game progression efficiency) I wouldn't be able to progress through the game at any sort of enjoyable rate and would quickly be far, far behind. I posit that 'grinding' actually helps more people like me than it hurts the game via the crazy few (relative to overall game pop) outliers who grind out 14 hour days that everyone seems terrified of.

Honestly though, anyone who understands the leveling mechanics will hit the 360+ CP level and be pretty close to maximizing their favored build's effective power fairly quickly anyways, it's not worth trying to destroy the game for others over how they choose to level their characters.

Birdovic

Nestor wrote: »

So I could log in, set my toon to always walk, point him at a wall, come back in an hour and have a CP? While your idea has merit, how would they determine if a player is playing or is merely logged in to the game. (note I have not pointed my always running PC at a wall to see how long the game keeps me logged in, so I don't even know if that would work)

This brings back old memories of TES III xD
Best way to lvlup athletics

Kragorn

Sentinel wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

So I could log in, set my toon to always walk, point him at a wall, come back in an hour and have a CP? While your idea has merit, how would they determine if a player is playing or is merely logged in to the game. (note I have not pointed my always running PC at a wall to see how long the game keeps me logged in, so I don't even know if that would work)

RP'ers do get the short end of the stick but one could argue that what they do does not require CPs like other game activities do (Trials, PvP, higher end VR content).

However I think everyone should get something towards CPs if they are logged into the server and are doing something in the game. Except spamming spells in trading hubs and banks.

That's the biggest downside to my suggestion. I've not found a way to bypass the fact that many will likely just afk for points.

And that's a problem ... why?

No, seriously, if developers and more importantly players spent less time worrying about 'abusers' and concentrated on implementing FUN content MMOS would be vastly more enjoyable than they are.

PVE isn't competitive, so 'gaining unfair advantages' doesn't apply. Clearly PVP isn't like that but I'm fed up already with the amount of the PVE game that's sacrificed on the altar of PVP QQ so I really couldn't care less about how 'fun; PVE content would impact PVP.

Sentinel

One way to 'compromise' a sort of solution that would help give a bit of a balance would be:

• Give a fixed total amount of CP to every eligible player each day, not based off of performance etc... (Gives something to RPers)
• Reward additional CP for either: Activities done, or XP (I prefer activities done, as PvP based activities would fulfil this for a PvPer, PvE based activities would fulfill this for a PvErs)
• Put a cap on the total CP earned each day.
• Have the CP gained from Activities done be able to reach the cap without forcing other players to do something they do not wish. (Ex. A PvPer needing to do PvE to get the max CP that day).

Benefits:

• Everyone knows they gain at least something per day.
• Others can feel their time played rewards them
• One can play whatever they want and reap CP in some way. (Even RPers, though they will gain less than the others due to the limited activity).
• While some may gain an advantage over others, no one is forced into playing a certain way, and all gain some progression.

Cons

• (I'll leave this to be decided by others in the comments, as I'm pressed on time atm)

Archer Bearclaw

Why not go the other way, and cap the number of cp one can acquire in a day, then there will be less pressure to grind your way to advantage (I'm looking at this from PVP perspective, because you know that there are psychotic people that will grind 200 straight hours to max out and then imbalance cyrodiil)

C0pp3rhead

So you can't RP in a dungeon or in Cyrodiil?

I'm sorry, but I fail to see how hanging out in a tavern and posing for screenshots should earn you XP.

DeLindsay

Be happy if you don't plan to spend much time playing with Legerdemain. At current it gives about 1 CP per day and a half, no joke. I reported this and mentioned it in 3 diff threads and it's fallen on deaf ears. I even gave ZoS valid feedback as to how to adjust it, as well as farming nodes should give a small amount of XP, like 22 each or something. All of my feedback went unanswered as did others that made such comments. At this point I have no faith left in ZoS to fix glaring problems and balance issues with the game.

derpsticks

Darlantan wrote: »

Again... that only work for some. Not everyone. Some people want to see a progression and see that the time they invest in the game show up.

Sadly that also sound a lot like everybody is a winner and we have no loser that some people keep preaching about. It's not something i am to interested...

btw, if you say a player can't chose the task that mean you will force players that do not want to pvp too pvp or players that to not want to harvest, to harvest or in simply do something they do not care to get the CP. That is also not good.

I do not see how it's better for everyone....

First, I don't understand how what I've proposed is not a progression that is directly based on time and effort invested. Each of the objectives would take time to complete, for some it would take longer and others they might be quicker. If you mean a progression system built purely on the amount of time a player can play the game, then that system will work for way fewer people than what I have proposed. At the very least doing eight or so of these objectives would most likely take between 4-8 hours depending on the player and their choices.

To you this might sound like everybody is a winner, but I disagree. Everyone is free to earn up to eight champion points in a day, but I never said people wouldn't have to put the effort in to get them. Everyone would surely get the eight champion points each day if they had the time to spend getting them. There are players who can only play 1-2 hours or 30-45mins a day who would not be able to be a winner by your standards even with the ability to get unearned points from three days prior. At the very least this system allows them to spend that hour earning a champion point by playing the game how they want to play it, which to them might be "winning" even if to you it is "losing". So clearly, everyone is not a winner by your standards but at least they can be by theirs.

Finally, this system does not force players to do anything, it allows them to play the game how they want with the ability to earn champion points from things they want to do. Think of the available objectives as menu items in a cafeteria. Not everyone wants to eat meatloaf when it is meatloaf day so they might get the pizza instead. No one will force them to eat the meatloaf and the pizza if they don't want to. Obviously people would want to get all eight of their side dishes for the day, but no one is forcing anyone to eat their carrots even though they are good for you. In reality this system is designed for players who want a well balanced meal or a quick snack while it tolerates the picky eaters and the fat kids. Just look at the hireling system currently in place. Does that force players to have hirelings on all eight of their characters? Does it force players to login every 12 hours to get their mail? No. It enables people to do that if they want to but not everyone will, nor does everyone have the time to do so.

Sentinel

C0pp3rhead wrote: »

So you can't RP in a dungeon or in Cyrodiil?

I'm sorry, but I fail to see how hanging out in a tavern and posing for screenshots should earn you XP.

Well the main point of this is that it shouldnt be based off of XP at all. We were promised that we would be given CP with any playstyle, and RP is only one, however it receives none with this system. The point of this thread is to discuss better ways to improve the system to live up to this promise of "gaining CP with any playstyle" and not allowing grinding to be the singular solution. (An additional note: RP can be done anywhere, be it a tavern or a cave, its just that RP is not centered around receiving XP in any form, and if it were it'd be quite a bit slower than anything else.)

Dazin93

1.6 and the champion system wasn't designed with the veteran players in mind; it was targeted specifically at the console market. ZO$ has the view that the champion system isn't something you grind or actively pursue, but rather an additional underlying progression system that occurs naturally while completing content.

This view will be accurate for most console players as they will appreciate the added character progression while they complete VR content. I believe they will find VR levels to be more rewarding and meaningful with the added power gains from CPs.

Veteran players obviously don't have the luxury of progressing in the champion system within new content, but again we are not the target market. Even last fall, the console release was a top priority for ZO$ and they emphasized it repeatedly when they met with guilds.

ZO$ is all in on whatever appeals to the widest range of console players because the console market is the only way they have a chance of hitting the numbers that was promised to their investors. I'm sure in some sense they appreciate forum feedback, but you had better believe that any decisions made are based on the greater good for console players.

Legit92

In my opinion, the champion system is end game content, therefore should be rewarded for doing end game content. Grinding is not end game content and never should it be. They should first make achievements global. Then give players 1 cp for every 50 achievement points gained. There should also be never ending achievements after reaching the current achievement max for things such as dolmens. So after you do the 250 dolmens and get the title reward, you should be able to get 1 cp for every 25 or so dolmens you do afterwards. And of course there's dungeons, trials, and pvp. Again, you should get a cp for every 50 cp you get for the achievements related to these and then be able to repeat for some additional cp. So every time you slay 100 named bosses you gain an additional champion point. Then also give the player an achievement point for completing every pledge. Pvp would be a bit more complex since players can abuse basically any system relying on objectives or exp.

Anyways, you get the idea, it should be objective based and not xp based. One of the worst and most idiotic decisions I've seen an mmo make. Alas, I suppose we are just about to go from alpha to beta testing.

Lionxoft

Attaching champion points to achievements or some type of feats would have been a better system. Using xp as a determining factor is uncreative and lazy. It will just be a grindfest now and I'm really not interested in that. I'd rather just PvP however you can't even level at a decent rate in PvP and the same will go for champion point accrual rate.