To all the oldies, it will still work.

JackDaniell

Hey guys, kind of a different thread I'm putting out for my fellow community members, especially those who have been here a long time with me.

So I have been spending allot of time on the PTS, and have also been spending allot of time reading the forums quietly gathering information and listening to the concerns of my fellow players.

The biggest thing I see is that "my build (insert type) is ruined!". Now yes allot of changes have been made and allot of builds on 1.5 no longer work like they did in 1.6. But we don't have to give up on them.


I think the beauty of this game and what ZOS is working to achieve with every patch is diversity, and 1.6 further opens those doors. For so long since launch people have wanted to play a certain build or style and we have always tried and tried new things to make them work. Some of us gave up and played the strongest builds at the time, some decided that they didn't want to give up on a build of thier dreams. Then some just can't sit still for a week and have tried every skill in the game in every combination possible.

Now 1.6 comes, and from what I have seen and experianced in my 100+ hours on the PTS, your builds will now work. If you like playing sword and shield resto magicka spec like you may on live, your build still works. For any class. If you really want to delve into stamina but havent tried it yet, now is the time to try.

I have played and dueled many a great players testing our builds of our dreams and they all work. I guess what I have to say is, we have been here this long and havent given up on our builds, so don't give up now. Maybe you may even like the changes if you haven't really tried them yet. Things always look different on paper than they do in application.

1.6 is diversity in my eyes, the amount of builds in this game is about to exponentialy expand.

Thanks for reading guys, I hope this helps quell some fears people have, have a great day!

Snit

I suspect people may have to undertake greater adjustments to their playstyle than this post leads them to believe.

Dracane

If you are the founder of the 'Legend' guild, you must have some experience and I don't want to argue with someone like you.

However, I don't agree.

Ezareth

JackDaniell wrote: »

Hey guys, kind of a different thread I'm putting out for my fellow community members, especially those who have been here a long time with me.

So I have been spending allot of time on the PTS, and have also been spending allot of time reading the forums quietly gathering information and listening to the concerns of my fellow players.

The biggest thing I see is that "my build (insert type) is ruined!". Now yes allot of changes have been made and allot of builds on 1.5 no longer work like they did in 1.6. But we don't have to give up on them.


I think the beauty of this game and what ZOS is working to achieve with every patch is diversity, and 1.6 further opens those doors. For so long since launch people have wanted to play a certain build or style and we have always tried and tried new things to make them work. Some of us gave up and played the strongest builds at the time, some decided that they didn't want to give up on a build of thier dreams. Then some just can't sit still for a week and have tried every skill in the game in every combination possible.

Now 1.6 comes, and from what I have seen and experianced in my 100+ hours on the PTS, your builds will now work. If you like playing sword and shield resto magicka spec like you may on live, your build still works. For any class. If you really want to delve into stamina but havent tried it yet, now is the time to try.

I have played and dueled many a great players testing our builds of our dreams and they all work. I guess what I have to say is, we have been here this long and havent given up on our builds, so don't give up now. Maybe you may even like the changes if you haven't really tried them yet. Things always look different on paper than they do in application.

1.6 is diversity in my eyes, the amount of builds in this game is about to exponentialy expand.

Thanks for reading guys, I hope this helps quell some fears people have, have a great day!

I think you're just happy that you can barrel roll ad infinitum in 1.6 ( =

Vis

I don't believe anyone is arguing that 1.6 does not produce a degree of diversity. However, disbalanced mechanics that existed before 1.6 are being exasperated.

There is potential for any diversity gained in the short run to be lost if those underlying issues are not ironed out against the light of a new balance. For instance, I am happy to see stamina sorcs out and about. However, it concerns me almost nothing from the class specializes it for a role in stamina, all the while to see its magicka base being damaged because the devs cling to old assumptions that have not been true for a while.

There is no doubt they are trying. But it seems they need to revisit even more of their core assumptions.

JackDaniell

I remember the game at at lunch, and in comparison to where it is now and where it is going things have become much more diverse. But you are right, lots of changes yet again will be made for almost everyone, if not more so than any patch before. 1.6 is the end of vanilla, but from the time I have spent on the PTS more builds are viable now than were in 1.5.

Don't get me wrong tho, their will be broken skills in need of fixing and some specs that perform to well (roll for days). But I find these things crop up towards the end of the champions trees and thankfully maxing your tree takes quite some time. I hope it is enough time for the appropriate changes for those things to be made.

And to those who disagree thank you for your input, I can only give my perspective on something which will always be skewed by my own biases. I could not have an opinion of everyone agreed . Just please give 1.6 a shot, I really think it can take this game to the next level.

Lionxoft

I think the saying is "LOLOLOL". Is that about right?

xMovingTarget

1.6 feels wierd. It pushes Stamina builds too far. But that just might be because we are not yet thinking outside of the box we been in for the last 10 month.

Some changes arnt great, some are. People will adapt or wait for other players to figure it out.

Teargrants

Thinking outside the box? You're right, we will all have to switch to builds that have no hard CC when fighting stam builds.

Unchained: Reduce the stamina cost of abilities by 80% for 8 seconds after breaking free from a stun, knockdown, fear, disorient or stagger.

Well, unless you like giving them infinite stam...

Dracane

Teargrants wrote: »

Thinking outside the box? You're right, we will all have to switch to builds that have no hard CC when fighting stam builds.

Unchained: Reduce the stamina cost of abilities by 80% for 8 seconds after breaking free from a stun, knockdown, fear, disorient or stagger.

Well, unless you like giving them infinite stam...

Holy Auri-El ! O.O this passive is in the actual game ?
Overpowered! There is nothing else I could say.

Asgari

Dracane wrote: »

Teargrants wrote: »

Thinking outside the box? You're right, we will all have to switch to builds that have no hard CC when fighting stam builds.

Unchained: Reduce the stamina cost of abilities by 80% for 8 seconds after breaking free from a stun, knockdown, fear, disorient or stagger.

Well, unless you like giving them infinite stam...

Holy Auri-El ! O.O this passive is in the actual game ?
Overpowered! There is nothing else I could say.

Welcome to 1.6 .. Stam is king.

Dracane

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Teargrants wrote: »

Thinking outside the box? You're right, we will all have to switch to builds that have no hard CC when fighting stam builds.

Unchained: Reduce the stamina cost of abilities by 80% for 8 seconds after breaking free from a stun, knockdown, fear, disorient or stagger.

Well, unless you like giving them infinite stam...

Holy Auri-El ! O.O this passive is in the actual game ?
Overpowered! There is nothing else I could say.

Welcome to 1.6 .. Stam is king.

Indeed O.O Still, my eyes decline to accept, this is in the actual game ^^

JackDaniell

xMovingTarget wrote: »

1.6 feels wierd. It pushes Stamina builds too far. But that just might be because we are not yet thinking outside of the box we been in for the last 10 month.

Some changes arnt great, some are. People will adapt or wait for other players to figure it out.

Agreed, I feel many people are thinking inside this box.

Teargrants wrote: »

Thinking outside the box? You're right, we will all have to switch to builds that have no hard CC when fighting stam builds.

Unchained: Reduce the stamina cost of abilities by 80% for 8 seconds after breaking free from a stun, knockdown, fear, disorient or stagger.

Well, unless you like giving them infinite stam...

This passive needs to be changed, quite frankly its dumb.

Cody

I just want agony replaced with something useful:/

Dracane

If it is true, that crits against damage shields are possible in 1.6.3, mage's are dead. Damage shields are our only defense. We can only CC break a few times and we should never block.

Stamina users can CC break, block and dodge forever and also have more armor and spell resistance than light armor users. Tell me: Where is the balance here ?

Teargrants

Dracane wrote: »

Indeed O.O Still, my eyes decline to accept, this is in the actual game ^^

Just for you

Lionxoft

JackDaniell wrote: »

Teargrants wrote: »

Thinking outside the box? You're right, we will all have to switch to builds that have no hard CC when fighting stam builds.

Unchained: Reduce the stamina cost of abilities by 80% for 8 seconds after breaking free from a stun, knockdown, fear, disorient or stagger.

Well, unless you like giving them infinite stam...

This passive needs to be changed, quite frankly its dumb.

Or just balance the base magnitude of cost reduction and modify it by pieces of heavy armor equipped.

Teargrants

Gimme one for decrease magicka costs by 80% and we'll call it even.

Cody

Dracane wrote: »

If it is true, that crits against damage shields are possible in 1.6.3, mage's are dead. Damage shields are our only defense. We can only CC break a few times and we should never block.

Stamina users can CC break, block and dodge forever and also have more armor and spell resistance than light armor users. Tell me: Where is the balance here ?

People in Light armor should be able to have maximum resistance and have high DPS? tell me, where is the balance there?

you will figure something out. Its what we stamina build/hybrid build users have had to do for the past 9 months:)

JackDaniell

Dracane wrote: »

If it is true, that crits against damage shields are possible in 1.6.3, mage's are dead. Damage shields are our only defense. We can only CC break a few times and we should never block.

Stamina users can CC break, block and dodge forever and also have more armor and spell resistance than light armor users. Tell me: Where is the balance here ?

Regarding damage shields I was playing a glass cannon stam NB, which in my opinion has the highest burst damage spec availible to them as well as one of the highest sustained damage specs. I have been doing many 3600 duels with this build and came to the conclusion that when you have a full champ tree you do not ever run out of recources, regardless of stamina or magicka spec.

So when dueling sorcs with 45k+ magicka I found them the most difficult build to fight. However the fight was almost entirely me smashing on them as they franticly sta k shields to survive. I felt as if they dis not have the damage to kill me as I could just roll and reset to easily. One sor. However utilized bolt very well against me making distance to reset himself and then trying to go offensive when I caught up to re engadge. He was able to give a better fight but I still felt as if he was constantly on the defense against me.

Now this could be builds foiling eachother, but with the incomming shield Nerf I am doubtful sorcs will be able to survive glass stamina setups like this.

All the sorcs I caught however failed to hard counter me except one. That was was running a stam spec, but his counter was critical surge (or the morph that aoe splashes people around you) to pull me out of stealth as well as the use of bolt to cc me inbetween my combos. In short he kicked my ass and forced me to play defensive against him. Now he used a stam build to kill me, but the skills that countered me are magicka based skills that any sorc could utilize, perhaps even using a stamina based gap closer to keep rotational pressure on me.

As for Templars, divine cross has a mean magicka based destro/resto build that I could not bring down. He is wearing light as well and uses his pre emotive blazing shield to prevent me from applying enough burst to kill him, also coupled with careful stamina management so I could not land an effective cc to killing blow. His damage was lower than mine, but defiantly comparable as I am much more squishy than he is. His build utilized powerful Templar heals as well to stay alive.

JackDaniell

I think movment is something 1.6 has emphesised very much, and magicka builds are also capable of utilizing this movment regardless of class.

I believe the modern day sword and shield rresto light build will be allot quicker to move across the map in 1.6 and that will be its saving grace.

Dracane

JackDaniell wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

If it is true, that crits against damage shields are possible in 1.6.3, mage's are dead. Damage shields are our only defense. We can only CC break a few times and we should never block.

Stamina users can CC break, block and dodge forever and also have more armor and spell resistance than light armor users. Tell me: Where is the balance here ?

Regarding damage shields I was playing a glass cannon stam NB, which in my opinion has the highest burst damage spec availible to them as well as one of the highest sustained damage specs. I have been doing many 3600 duels with this build and came to the conclusion that when you have a full champ tree you do not ever run out of recources, regardless of stamina or magicka spec.

So when dueling sorcs with 45k+ magicka I found them the most difficult build to fight. However the fight was almost entirely me smashing on them as they franticly sta k shields to survive. I felt as if they dis not have the damage to kill me as I could just roll and reset to easily. One sor. However utilized bolt very well against me making distance to reset himself and then trying to go offensive when I caught up to re engadge. He was able to give a better fight but I still felt as if he was constantly on the defense against me.

Now this could be builds foiling eachother, but with the incomming shield Nerf I am doubtful sorcs will be able to survive glass stamina setups like this.

All the sorcs I caught however failed to hard counter me except one. That was was running a stam spec, but his counter was critical surge (or the morph that aoe splashes people around you) to pull me out of stealth as well as the use of bolt to cc me inbetween my combos. In short he kicked my ass and forced me to play defensive against him. Now he used a stam build to kill me, but the skills that countered me are magicka based skills that any sorc could utilize, perhaps even using a stamina based gap closer to keep rotational pressure on me.

As for Templars, divine cross has a mean magicka based destro/resto build that I could not bring down. He is wearing light as well and uses his pre emotive blazing shield to prevent me from applying enough burst to kill him, also coupled with careful stamina management so I could not land an effective cc to killing blow. His damage was lower than mine, but defiantly comparable as I am much more squishy than he is. His build utilized powerful Templar heals as well to stay alive.

I don't get it actually. NB and DK should have it so easy against Sorcerers. Sorcerers are the worst stamina class. a Magicka Sorc can only CC break a few times. You only have to CC every 5 seconds, after 2 or 3 times, he will use a potion and might be able to break 2 more times.

And after that, you should easily be able to end the fight. So maybe 25-30 seconds and the fight should be over. I fail to see the problem. I am really realy scared of Nightblades and Melee's in the upcoming patch.

Gyudan

I'm not worried about PVP balance. Each class seems to have enough mechanisms to be effective in duels and large fights.
Endgame PVE however will be very sad in 1.6 if nothing changes before the update goes live. Mobility and burst don't really matter in that kind of content and some classes definitely outperform others. I'm glad I have a stamina templar ready in replacement of my sorcerer but not everybody will be able to switch.

Dracane

Gyudan wrote: »

I'm glad I have a stamina templar ready in replacement of my sorcerer but not everybody will be able to switch.

Me for example

JackDaniell

Dracane wrote: »

JackDaniell wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

If it is true, that crits against damage shields are possible in 1.6.3, mage's are dead. Damage shields are our only defense. We can only CC break a few times and we should never block.

Stamina users can CC break, block and dodge forever and also have more armor and spell resistance than light armor users. Tell me: Where is the balance here ?

Regarding damage shields I was playing a glass cannon stam NB, which in my opinion has the highest burst damage spec availible to them as well as one of the highest sustained damage specs. I have been doing many 3600 duels with this build and came to the conclusion that when you have a full champ tree you do not ever run out of recources, regardless of stamina or magicka spec.

So when dueling sorcs with 45k+ magicka I found them the most difficult build to fight. However the fight was almost entirely me smashing on them as they franticly sta k shields to survive. I felt as if they dis not have the damage to kill me as I could just roll and reset to easily. One sor. However utilized bolt very well against me making distance to reset himself and then trying to go offensive when I caught up to re engadge. He was able to give a better fight but I still felt as if he was constantly on the defense against me.

Now this could be builds foiling eachother, but with the incomming shield Nerf I am doubtful sorcs will be able to survive glass stamina setups like this.

All the sorcs I caught however failed to hard counter me except one. That was was running a stam spec, but his counter was critical surge (or the morph that aoe splashes people around you) to pull me out of stealth as well as the use of bolt to cc me inbetween my combos. In short he kicked my ass and forced me to play defensive against him. Now he used a stam build to kill me, but the skills that countered me are magicka based skills that any sorc could utilize, perhaps even using a stamina based gap closer to keep rotational pressure on me.

As for Templars, divine cross has a mean magicka based destro/resto build that I could not bring down. He is wearing light as well and uses his pre emotive blazing shield to prevent me from applying enough burst to kill him, also coupled with careful stamina management so I could not land an effective cc to killing blow. His damage was lower than mine, but defiantly comparable as I am much more squishy than he is. His build utilized powerful Templar heals as well to stay alive.

I don't get it actually. NB and DK should have it so easy against Sorcerers. Sorcerers are the worst stamina class. a Magicka Sorc can only CC break a few times. You only have to CC every 5 seconds, after 2 or 3 times, he will use a potion and might be able to break 2 more times.

And after that, you should easily be able to end the fight. So maybe 25-30 seconds and the fight should be over. I fail to see the problem. I am really realy scared of Nightblades and Melee's in the upcoming patch.

For pvp, every build be it stamina or magicka will need to be able to cc break once every 5 secconds. Not runningng a build that can do this makes you give up sustain. Unless however you get past the need to cc break with 'stall' skills like stealth and mobility. Any build worth its salt in live and in 1.6 is capable of fighting an opponent without running out of stamina. That is a PvP build.

glak

Can't help it, title reads in my head: "To the old ladies, it will still work"

Holycannoli

Diversity

Sorcerers must use pets for optimal DPS