Motifs Sold Via Crown Store.

Circuitous

briandivisionb16_ESO wrote: »

#CosmeticOnlyOrBye

Motifs are technically cosmetic.

In seriousness... I'm fine with motifs being on the Crown Store, but I'd still rather they not be. But with the Justice System in place, making all the usual motif farming basically impossible, I really, really hope they introduce better ways to find motifs in-game, especially if they make them available for sale on their own.

rawne1980b16_ESO

Turelus wrote: »

So on ESO live tonight it seems ZOS announced that Motifs would indeed eventually come to the Crown Store.

Sadly this reminds me much of SWTOR and what killed that game for me, all the important items you wanted were moved to the store instead of taking meaningful gameplay to achieve.

And there is why some of us hate cash shops.

Not dislike, literally hate.

New stuff tends to go there and not in the game where it should be.

SWTOR gets a new DLC once in a blue moon but the cash shop sees regular updates.

It's sickening.

themizario

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

RDMyers65b14_ESO wrote: »

That isn't what they said.

They said there will be new motifs with the DLC. The DLC is on the Crown store. The Motifs are a PART of the DLC.

This is correct. We are currently discussing having some motifs available as part of future DLC. Whether or not we will offer them by themselves has not yet been decided.

This is a, we will eventually be offering them in the Crown Store just not right away. We will be easing everyone in to the store.

stefan.gustavsonb16_ESO

I feel like a frog in slowly heating water.
"So far, things don't look all that bad."

Drawberrry

briandivisionb16_ESO wrote: »

#CosmeticOnlyOrBye

Motifs are cosmetic only.

starkerealm

Circuitous wrote: »

briandivisionb16_ESO wrote: »

#CosmeticOnlyOrBye

Motifs are technically cosmetic.

In seriousness... I'm fine with motifs being on the Crown Store, but I'd still rather they not be. But with the Justice System in place, making all the usual motif farming basically impossible, I really, really hope they introduce better ways to find motifs in-game, especially if they make them available for sale on their own.

You can't motif farm like you used to. I checked on PTS the other day, though. You can still clear out the bank in Daggerfall, and Vulkel Guard just like you used to, even without medium armor and the stealth perks. You just need to go a little slower.

I didn't check anywhere in Pact, because I couldn't remember any good farming locations there. But, you can still clean out most buildings. If you can one shot people, you can even clear out houses without getting a bounty.

DDuke

Drawberrry wrote: »

briandivisionb16_ESO wrote: »

#CosmeticOnlyOrBye

Motifs are cosmetic only.

Sure they are, they just happen to take effort to find & cost anywhere between 500 & 100k gold.

MasterSpatula

DDuke wrote: »

Drawberrry wrote: »

briandivisionb16_ESO wrote: »

#CosmeticOnlyOrBye

Motifs are cosmetic only.

Sure they are, they just happen to take effort to find & cost anywhere between 500 & 100k gold.

For accuracy sake, I'm going to point out that your low-end is way too high. I can barely give away blue motifs these days.

wookiefriseur

I think there should not be any motifs in the crown store as crafters would be able to make ingame gold from it. Even if it wasn't shop exclusive or a hard to get motif, I wouldn't like to see it being sold there.

Motifs should stay something you have to farm and as the players progress, it becomes easier / cheaper to get the older motifs. No need to create an artificial shortcut that might gradually change things into a direction we don't want.

martinhpb16_ESO

store killed LOTRO - be warned

Devs wou want quick cash or a quality game that keeps you in a job as much as us interested?

Be careful.

Dave2836

I want some truly evil motifs... like a pair of gauntlets made from khajit hands or a helmut made from the scalp of an altmer or boots made from tanned argonian hides. You're telling me after years of war before the three alliances were formed these guys didn't wear each other's skins as trophies?

And just to throw a wrench in there... i wear a altmer scalp hat my interactions in AD should be very interesting to say the least. A necklace of dunmer ears would be cool too. Always wanted a pair of gators.

starkerealm

martinhpb16_ESO wrote: »

store killed LOTRO - be warned

Devs wou want quick cash or a quality game that keeps you in a job as much as us interested?

Be careful.

LotRO also sold items in the store, right? As in actual armor and other crap you actually needed to advance?

I'm still irked with Secret World's cash shop. "Yeah, grind the scenarios until your eyes bleed for the dream of a half way useful augment... or just buy these lock boxes."

c0rp

BIG DEAL. They put a motif in the store and its ACCOUNT BOUND when someone buys it. It gives NO gameplay advantage and is purely COSMETIC. That is the exact definition of their store..COSMETICS and convenience. Some people just have to complain about everything don't they?

starkerealm

c0rp wrote: »

BIG DEAL. They put a motif in the store and its ACCOUNT BOUND when someone buys it. It gives NO gameplay advantage and is purely COSMETIC. That is the exact definition of their store..COSMETICS and convenience.

Motifs are actually on the edge of cosmetic... if it's a transform to motif, like how the "Convert to imperial style" works now... where you can convert items on a character to another style, binding them in the process... that actually wouldn't be a bad thing to have access to.

But, when it's an actual motif book? Then you're talking about having something you can use and then sell to other players. So it becomes an economic factor. "CRAFTING ARMOR HAVE NEW VVARDENFELL DWEMER MOTIF! 10k" Then, it's not cosmetic... even if it is technically a cosmetic item.

Dave2836

Crown shop items are currently set to be bound on purchase. It was mentioned in that infamous like where paul sage wore a jackson pollock as a shirt.

Elsonso

Circuitous wrote: »

In seriousness... I'm fine with motifs being on the Crown Store, but I'd still rather they not be.

I marked up your statement with how it looks to a manager (aka Producer) when they read it.

c0rp

starkerealm wrote: »

c0rp wrote: »

BIG DEAL. They put a motif in the store and its ACCOUNT BOUND when someone buys it. It gives NO gameplay advantage and is purely COSMETIC. That is the exact definition of their store..COSMETICS and convenience.

Motifs are actually on the edge of cosmetic... if it's a transform to motif, like how the "Convert to imperial style" works now... where you can convert items on a character to another style, binding them in the process... that actually wouldn't be a bad thing to have access to.

But, when it's an actual motif book? Then you're talking about having something you can use and then sell to other players. So it becomes an economic factor. "CRAFTING ARMOR HAVE NEW VVARDENFELL DWEMER MOTIF! 10k" Then, it's not cosmetic... even if it is technically a cosmetic item.

Yeah, I understand your point. But crafting items to sell to players in this game, is more based on the individual MATS of making the armor/weapon, than what STYLE it is. With the exception being....maybe when an armor style is just introduced into the game and the price could possibly be inflated for a short while. That situation is easily avoided by just not selling the motif immediately after it is introduced via DLC.

Regardless, either way, its just not a big of deal as what people are trying to make it. There are far WORSE things that could be sold in the store...

SteveCampsOut

Yet another premature panic thread... does the hysteria never stop with gamers?

ebunts14_ESO

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

RDMyers65b14_ESO wrote: »

That isn't what they said.

They said there will be new motifs with the DLC. The DLC is on the Crown store. The Motifs are a PART of the DLC.

This is correct. We are currently discussing having some motifs available as part of future DLC. Whether or not we will offer them by themselves has not yet been decided.

Knowing the way ZOS been wording things , this confirm that motifs is separate from the dlc. So you have to spend even more crowns (money grab).

nerevarine1138

ebuntsb14_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

RDMyers65b14_ESO wrote: »

That isn't what they said.

They said there will be new motifs with the DLC. The DLC is on the Crown store. The Motifs are a PART of the DLC.

This is correct. We are currently discussing having some motifs available as part of future DLC. Whether or not we will offer them by themselves has not yet been decided.

Knowing the way ZOS been wording things , this confirm that motifs is separate from the dlc. So you have to spend even more crowns (money grab).

Knowing how the English language works, this confirms that new motifs will be part and parcel of new DLC packages. The only question is whether those same motifs will be offered by themselves (without having to purchase the whole DLC) is what has not yet been decided.

Gyudan

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

RDMyers65b14_ESO wrote: »

That isn't what they said.

They said there will be new motifs with the DLC. The DLC is on the Crown store. The Motifs are a PART of the DLC.

This is correct. We are currently discussing having some motifs available as part of future DLC. Whether or not we will offer them by themselves has not yet been decided.

If some motifs are found in the game in content accessible only in the DLC, that is fine.
If some motifs are found in the cash shop only, that is P2W.
If some motifs are found in both the cash shop and the game, that is P2W. We'll never know how low the droprates will be to keep the incentive to buy them with "real money".

Don't go down this road @ZOS.

nerevarine1138

Gyudan wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

RDMyers65b14_ESO wrote: »

That isn't what they said.

They said there will be new motifs with the DLC. The DLC is on the Crown store. The Motifs are a PART of the DLC.

This is correct. We are currently discussing having some motifs available as part of future DLC. Whether or not we will offer them by themselves has not yet been decided.

If some motifs are found in the game in content accessible only in the DLC, that is fine.
If some motifs are found in the cash shop only, that is P2W.
If some motifs are found in both the cash shop and the game, that is P2W. We'll never know how low the droprates will be to keep the incentive to buy them with "real money".

Don't go down this road @ZOS.

1. Agreed.
2. Wrong. Motifs aren't needed to "win" anything, and offering a purely cosmetic item through the Crown Store only would not alter any game mechanics.
3. Also wrong, but only because you're calling it "pay-to-win". There's still no winning with motifs, but having motifs that one can buy in the cash shop instead of finding in the game will have a negative effect on the in-game economy.

Akiija

For whatever this feedback is worth, ZOS, I implore you: Do not put any motifs directly into the Crown Store. Part of what makes the crafting economy worthwhile is this notion of manufactured scarcity. Items are rare and become gradually less rare through the market in-game exerting itself. Motifs become more commonplace, traits become learned, etc.

To me, putting a motif in the store for use, creation, and sale of items is akin to locking a research trait behind the Crown Store. Not because of function (because, being honest, a trait would have combat/gameplay implications where a motif doesn't) but in principle.

You are removing scarcity from the game for the sake of an immediate cash influx at the cost of removing items from the game that could shake up the in-game economy, motivate crafters to spend more time in-game, and let crafters feel as if they're working towards the ability to create new and unique armor styles.

Locking that behind a $5 payment robs it of any intrinsic importance to the crafting meta and works against the very system that you want working smoothly to encourage long-term sustainability. It is, by its nature, a slippery slope you do not want to tread on if you're hoping to engender confidence in your ability to keep ESO free of many of the pitfalls plaguing other F2P/B2P titles.

Gemseed

They're not putting them directly in the crown store.

They're talking about new motif's being inside DLC that you would still have to find within the zone. Which frankly, makes a lot of sense. We do want new motif's, do we not?

What's the point of buying DLC/keeping a sub, if all players, free or not, can access all the same items.

Hortator Mopa

Turelus wrote: »

So on ESO live tonight it seems ZOS announced that Motifs would indeed eventually come to the Crown Store.

Sadly this reminds me much of SWTOR and what killed that game for me, all the important items you wanted were moved to the store instead of taking meaningful gameplay to achieve.

People didnt see this coming as soon as f2p was announced.? Sorry b2p... and lets be honest its the same thing with a initial cost..

If this makes you upset just wait 6-12 months when real ridiculous p2w items come in because they are not making enough sales in the store.. (not saying motifs is p2w..)

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

RDMyers65b14_ESO wrote: »

That isn't what they said.

They said there will be new motifs with the DLC. The DLC is on the Crown store. The Motifs are a PART of the DLC.

This is correct. We are currently discussing having some motifs available as part of future DLC. Whether or not we will offer them by themselves has not yet been decided.

Taking that with a grain of salt.

rawne1980b16_ESO

Gyudan wrote: »

If some motifs are found in the game in content accessible only in the DLC, that is fine.
If some motifs are found in the cash shop only, that is P2W.
If some motifs are found in both the cash shop and the game, that is P2W. We'll never know how low the droprates will be to keep the incentive to buy them with "real money".

Don't go down this road @ZOS.

Nothing about buying motifs is pay to win.

If they took all motifs out of the game and just sold them in cash shop it still wouldn't be pay to win.

Motifs are purely cosmetic and offer to advantage whatsoever.

I really wish people who have no idea what pay to win is wouldn't mention it.
Pay to win is having items in a cash shop that offer an in game advantage and can't be acquired through normal game play.

XP boosts aren't pay to win - they are pay to get there faster. You don't "win" you have a temporary level advantage. Temporary.

Motifs aren't pay to win - they are purely cosmetic and offer no advantage whatsoever.

Mounts aren't pay to win - you can still get mounts in the game so have no advantage whatsoever.

The only thing that would be pay to win would be ZOS adding full VR14 legendary gear with superior stats than anything in the game.

Hortator Mopa

lol.

Gyudan

rawne1980b16_ESO wrote: »

Gyudan wrote: »

If some motifs are found in the game in content accessible only in the DLC, that is fine.
If some motifs are found in the cash shop only, that is P2W.
If some motifs are found in both the cash shop and the game, that is P2W. We'll never know how low the droprates will be to keep the incentive to buy them with "real money".

Don't go down this road @ZOS.

Nothing about buying motifs is pay to win.

If they took all motifs out of the game and just sold them in cash shop it still wouldn't be pay to win.

Motifs are purely cosmetic and offer to advantage whatsoever.

I really wish people who have no idea what pay to win is wouldn't mention it.
Pay to win is having items in a cash shop that offer an in game advantage and can't be acquired through normal game play.

XP boosts aren't pay to win - they are pay to get there faster. You don't "win" you have a temporary level advantage. Temporary.

Motifs aren't pay to win - they are purely cosmetic and offer no advantage whatsoever.

Mounts aren't pay to win - you can still get mounts in the game so have no advantage whatsoever.

The only thing that would be pay to win would be ZOS adding full VR14 legendary gear with superior stats than anything in the game.

The knowledge of rare motifs is one of the only things that differenciates two crafters and it direcly impacts how their crafts are valued by the community.
Do you prefer P2CMVS? (Pay 2 Craft More Valuable Stuff) ?

Fi'yra

I personally don't see an issue with Motifs being on the store if they're exclusive to a specific DLC?
Seperately too, maybe in bundles or something.
I don't see this being B2P, considering it's cosmetic and only makes you look better or worse..
Gosh, you guys do worry about everything.
If you're not complaining about costumes, don't complain about motifs ^^

Turelus

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

RDMyers65b14_ESO wrote: »

That isn't what they said.

They said there will be new motifs with the DLC. The DLC is on the Crown store. The Motifs are a PART of the DLC.

This is correct. We are currently discussing having some motifs available as part of future DLC. Whether or not we will offer them by themselves has not yet been decided.

Excellent, sorry for my misunderstanding then.
I hope when you're trying to decide if they should be sold alone you take some of the feedback from this thread into account.