Why is everyone getting so riled up about the upcoming B2P transition?

Neizir

Seriously I couldn't really care less about what mode ESO chooses to have. As long as there's no pay-to-win and I get to play a quality game, I'm fine with any model. I'm definitely sticking around when ESO goes B2P. But come on guys, why are you all so saddened? In fact you should be happy, this could bring in a HUGE wave of players as well as more positivity! If you're worried about the cash shop, remember that it WON'T be selling pay-to-win items! How can a silly costume or an XP booster give you any significant advantage over another player? Especially considering that everyone is boosted to the same level in PvP plus vet ranks are being removed, too.

Also don't forget that even the mighty WoW is approaching the F2P model (We all know it's coming some day, WoW has been hemorrhaging subs for years. There are signs of its coming in WoD with the F2P veteran's edition.).

Kilandros

Because we paid to be beta testers? Yup, that's why I'm pissed!

Lynnessa

My perspective is similar to yours, @Neizir. Cheers!

I do understand why people feel like they were used, paying for a beta test.

However... if this had all been a free beta all along, then ZoS wouldn't have gotten all of the feedback from players that has helped to shape the game, and I think we can all agree that the game has been steadily improving.

MissBizz

People are also riled up because we don't see the cash shop. It could become a pay to win.

Neizir

MissBizz wrote: »

People are also riled up because we don't see the cash shop. It could become a pay to win.

Except it won't? Vanity items and XP boosters are not P2W...

sirston

Neizir wrote: »

MissBizz wrote: »

People are also riled up because we don't see the cash shop. It could become a pay to win.

Except it won't? Vanity items and XP boosters are not P2W...

but every game that makes it this way goes the same path.

briandivisionb16_ESO

As long as there's no pay-to-win

* An allotment of crowns to spend in the new in-game Crown Store based on your membership period (more below)
* Access to all of ESO’s downloadable content (or DLC) game packs for the duration of your membership
* A 10% bonus to XP and gold gain, crafting research, and inspiration

"You can spend crowns in the in-game Crown Store to get unique mounts, special vanity pets, a variety of fun costumes for your character, and convenience items like health potions and soul gems."

XP bonus, soul gems, and items 'like health potions and soul gems' give you an advantage by using your credit card.

Their only saving grace to me is if they limit the store to vanity items only. No XP boosts. No in game items you can buy.
F*cking sellouts.

Asia_Skyly

Personally, the issue is that since the cash shop becomes the goose with the golden egg, all other development suffers. Take GW2 for example, their focus was that shop, content be damned. They did add content, but it would be done in 30 minutes if you followed the zerg. It was NOT substantial.

For me and many others, the cash shop is a symbol that development is going to be working for the new cash shop over lord.

Since the cash shop is all about cosmetic items (hopefully), there goes the substance of the game.

BBSooner

For myself, The negativity stems from the experiences I have received from games that make the transition to an in game store from a sub model. Since a game had not yielded a positive experience for me, I anticipate a repeat experience from ESO's store. It absolutely could be different, but the multitude of negative F2P/cash shop experiences (TOR, LotRO, Neverwinter, Rift, Archeage, Aion, etc.) has me questioning whether this will be different.

ben_ESO5

Kilandros wrote: »

Because we paid to be beta testers? Yup, that's why I'm pissed!

No, we didn't. We all paid for access to the game over the last nine months, plain and simple, just like any other service on the damn planet -- you pay for access. The fact that you continued to pay is your own fault, no one forced you to, and come March, you'll still not have to.

Am I dissapointed it's going B2P? Yup. But I've continued to pay because I got my money's worth. Crying about supposedly "beta testing" is juvenile, it means absolutely nothing.

Tandor

I couldn't agree more with the OP. I see this as a positive move.

Unfortunately, a lot of players don't appreciate the distinction between F2P (bad) and B2P (not so bad), and obsession with P2W is very much a PvP issue and therefore doesn't impact on me as I have no interest in PvP. I doubt very much, however, that ZOS intend to make a mess of that aspect and if the game is adopting the same model as TSW - which it looks like doing - then it can only be a good thing for its long-term survival and growth. Freeloaders won't like it because it isn't going pure F2P and they'll be caught by some restrictions in terms of the DLC, but so what?

Kilandros

Neizir wrote: »

MissBizz wrote: »

People are also riled up because we don't see the cash shop. It could become a pay to win.

Except it won't? Vanity items and XP boosters are not P2W...

Oh yeah I'm sure it will never expand to include more stuff than that hurr durr!!111

*blank stare*

Lord_Draevan

My concern is that the game will eventually become Pay to Win.

I don't mind it being Free to Play, I don't mind the influx of new players we're surely going to get, hell, I welcome more people to kill to fill up the dead campaigns.

I dread that it eventually comes to the point where the only way to be competitive in PvP is going to be via a credit card, not skill. If it does become Pay to Win, then I'll live. For now, I'm staying.

Sallington

I hate you to your core OP.

New waves of players using B2P or F2P are normally awful, and they already have an XP for real life money mechanic on day 1. Have fun supporting that ***.

Not to mention that consoles once again screw over PC gamers who are willing to pay a sub for something they enjoy and want to support. I 100% guarantee that if consoles weren't a thing, we'd still have a sub model with no question of anything else.

staticstorm

Neizir wrote: »

Seriously I couldn't really care less about what mode ESO chooses to have. As long as there's no pay-to-win and I get to play a quality game, I'm fine with any model. I'm definitely sticking around when ESO goes B2P. But come on guys, why are you all so saddened? In fact you should be happy, this could bring in a HUGE wave of players as well as more positivity! If you're worried about the cash shop, remember that it WON'T be selling pay-to-win items! How can a silly costume or an XP booster give you any significant advantage over another player? Especially considering that everyone is boosted to the same level in PvP plus vet ranks are being removed, too.

Also don't forget that even the mighty WoW is approaching the F2P model (We all know it's coming some day, WoW has been hemorrhaging subs for years. There are signs of its coming in WoD with the F2P veteran's edition.).

10mil -6mill subs would take 20 years for it to die, blizzard is doing its best tho to help that along.


ppl fear change, all those who complain will be playing it again.

Kevingway

My immersion is broken. Here's what's going to happen:

Type in my username and password, choose my character, load the map--bam, crown shop popup advertising this week's new cosmetic garbage. While playing, I come across an unusual wall built in the middle of nowhere. "What's this?" I ask, traversing along its forbidding boundary. Finally, I find a little door. I press E. "Sorry, you have not purchased access to this content."

Content will be churned out faster than any of you imagine, all of it separating players by a thick paywall such as the one described above.

That, and the players on the opposite side of the paywall, the side that didn't pay, will be garbage. Absolute garbage. Every name will contain the prefix "BR," and these players will be running around destroying the community that has been steadily developed from those loyal players who have maintained their subscriptions up until this point.

I'll continue to play ESO if the cash shop proves that it won't pop up on my screen every login, and the material that can be purchased won't be anything more than "cosmetic and convenient," but "convenience" I guarantee will not only destroy the legitimacy of crafted potions (these store-bought potions being stronger than those crafted, as has happened in many games), but also reveal that the game isn't worth anymore of our time if it can't escape the mistakes of those who came before it, GW2 included.

AlexDougherty

sirston wrote: »

Neizir wrote: »

MissBizz wrote: »

People are also riled up because we don't see the cash shop. It could become a pay to win.

Except it won't? Vanity items and XP boosters are not P2W...

but every game that makes it this way goes the same path.

With Swtor the cash shop destroyed crafting, it was easier to save your monthly allowance and buy the outfits and weapons (which were unlocked account wide), crafted gear died on the GTM Kiosks almost immediately.

I fear this will happen again, I just hope I can get the remaining motifs before people stop selling them.

Sallington

B2P is another cash grab. Once B2P purchases die down, they'll go F2P and have a ridiculous Pay2Win cash shop. Its obvious all about the money now. I feel like a turd for ever supporting them. This is just one giant slippery slope and I'm not falling for it any more.

knightblaster

Neizir wrote: »

MissBizz wrote: »

People are also riled up because we don't see the cash shop. It could become a pay to win.

Except it won't? Vanity items and XP boosters are not P2W...

How do you know that's all that's in there? No details released that I've seen.

And people disagree about the advantages of boosters as well, by the way.

MissBizz

sirston wrote: »

Neizir wrote: »

MissBizz wrote: »

People are also riled up because we don't see the cash shop. It could become a pay to win.

Except it won't? Vanity items and XP boosters are not P2W...

but every game that makes it this way goes the same path.

Yes. Personally I am trying to stay optimistic. They have said that there will not be gear or weapons in the shop, but they also said this is a subscription game. Its not that they are lieing, there will not be any weapons or armor in the crown shop now.. But even they don't know what could happen a year from now.

Yasha

I'm not, I think its a fabulous move.

I resubbed for three months recently and I don't feel any of this "rage" about being a beta tester or something or any regret for having paid a sub for the game. Just totally happy that I won't have to pay a game tax to play this amazing game anymore!

daswahnsinn

I'm not saying I won't be playing, I'm just pissed that I paid to play a beta. I don't see the point of B2P? It pretty much just lets players buy XP and the best gear w/o playing the d@mn game. This might not be a bad thing but I would think that the content will suffer horribly. But it's not like we got great new content before, Craglorn you had to grind to level, then the Pledges you got the worst loot since the PVP rewards. I've been playing since closed beta and it still feels the same, minus the crashes, oh wait I still get about 30 crashes a week, so submitting a crash report doesn't do much.

Xsorus

Cash shop doesn't mean pay to win...SWTOR has a cash shop, It is not pay to win in terms of if I spent a 1000 in the shop i'll just be a 1000 times more powerful then you.

Now there are games that are Pay to Win, ArcheAge for example..and that *** Russian MMO (can't think of it off the top of my head.)

But Cash Shops doesn't automatically mean P2W

Rammi

People are stupid if they did not think this was going to happen. Its happened to every game that has come out with a sub since WOW.

I think the bigger problem here is that the MMO sub model simply does not work anymore. What is sad for me is this also means the decline in updates to the game as they focus on cash shop items (This happens in every game so don't even try defending ZOS on this, as its all BS, it always happens).

I think this will be the last MMO I play for some time, other games genres offer me more pleasure as MMOs simply do not offer enough anymore. they lack the development cycles and do not focus on expansions that really change the game like they did in the past moving to a ore agile model that focus on small incremental change, which does not create the wow factor a big expansion creates in a game.

Either way I will continue to play as i enjoy the game but I'm very casual and will wait to see how they handle people who drop the sub but have been playing since Beta.

pronkg

knightblaster wrote: »

Neizir wrote: »

MissBizz wrote: »

People are also riled up because we don't see the cash shop. It could become a pay to win.

Except it won't? Vanity items and XP boosters are not P2W...

How do you know that's all that's in there? No details released that I've seen.

And people disagree about the advantages of boosters as well, by the way.

Premium members will get xp bonus of 10%
Crafting xp bonus pf 10%
Etc etc.

Acces to all DLC content if you keep paying a month.


Oh yeh btw 10% xp bonus is constant boost in champion points. That is pay to win.

Kilandros

Yasha wrote: »

I'm not, I think its a fabulous move.

I resubbed for three months recently and I don't feel any of this "rage" about being a beta tester or something or any regret for having paid a sub for the game. Just totally happy that I won't have to pay a game tax to play this amazing game anymore!

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pronkg

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McDoogs

Whats the difference between paying with your time, and paying with your credit card? This isn't exactly a competitive open pvp full loot sandbox game. I dont care if someone else is getting 10% more xp than me by paying money...

Justan

1) Because we've been lied to, used as paid beta testers for consoles, and repeatedly told ESO wouldn't go f2p/b2p.

2) and most importantly, because there has never and will never be a b2p/f2p MMO that even comes close to rivaling the quality of p2p MMO's.

Tavore1138

1. Because ZOS lied.
2. Because we've been paying to beta test for a year.
3. Because if they sneak in Crowns for XP boosters it will be P2W with the new CP for XP system being implemented.
4. All the promised 'delayed' content like Wrothgar, Imperial City, new Guilds and housing will be ticked behind a paywall - and you all know that 1,500 crowns per month from a Plus sub will not get you all the content they deem to be optional.
5. And because ZOS lied.

Gorthax

Neizir wrote: »

MissBizz wrote: »

People are also riled up because we don't see the cash shop. It could become a pay to win.

Except it won't? Vanity items and XP boosters are not P2W...

Just like they said that buy to play and free to play were NEVER going to happen?? riiiiiiiiight. What about xp boosters making champion points fly by faster? That seems pretty pay to win right there lol