Official Discussion Thread for "Update 6 Guide: Provisioning"

HeroOfEvbof

In my opinion they can tell as much as they want, they can tell us nothing, they can tel us outright lies, they can tell us what is currently encoded...
Does Not Matter
Nothing matters until we all get on PTS and bang the hell out of this thing.

Champions Points anybody? Those flippity flopped so much it makes a persons head spin.
All that matters is the PTS. I guarantee some major features will be tweaked by end of PTS, maybe a feature added maybe a feature deleted - anything will happen.

If I were to ask a question to ZoS, the most important would be WHEN.
Its Jan 19 already and we havent even had toon copy. Hell there is some confusion on my part as to which server will get first copy privileges. In early posts they came out and said EU would get first dibs then a later community announcement said NA but the later announcement seemed more off hand and less procedural.

Some people were asking about "stale" and value of "stale". Check this post:
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/comment/1464207#Comment_1464207

Overall I'd say this post was more informative but since this particular moderator does not have ZoS in their forum handle I suspect many people missed it:

Divinius

I'm sorry, but I'm still not seeing anything in this "revamp" that really excites me into believing that the benefits of the new system will outweigh the horrible mess that trying to change the entire system at this stage is inevitably going to cause.

I spelled out my concerns very thoroughly in my comment from the developer thread (feel free to read it there), and I'm not seeing anything here that is alleviating any of my fears.

In short, I'm going to call it now: This revamp is going to hurt the craft as a whole more than help it.

Garwulf

Seems to me this is a shuffling of the deck chairs with nothing really new being offered.Reducing number of ingredients is equivalent to increasing bank space. Sure we get new recipes to find and new ingredients and some spoil but like all the other crafting in this game it is very shallow and presumably aimed at not very intelligent 12 year olds.

No experimentation for example leading to a Master chef, just grind the recipes and ingredients. Just like in the real world where anyone can be a Master Chef armed with a cook book and some ingredients ....

And do not get me going on crafting writs which like Undaunted are essentially authorised grinding.

Sorry ZOS but you have lost the plot. You need to expand the game so we want to continue playing it, not simplifying it for the idiots who like Grinding Undaunted to get passives and specialised equipment that even a Master Craftsman cannot make.

In one word BORING.

HeroOfEvbof

From a solo or small guild point of view there really is no real value in the revamp except that there will actually be a team that can fix bugs instead of making new ones.
For a big pvx guild the revamp has a lot of promise - mostly because of the huge simplification in ingredients and WYSIWYG. I can assign various guildies to be all magicka or all stamina and they only have to collect and store ingredients associated with their stat.
In the old system, any one specializing in Stews (Soups are for dryskins!!) had to have the 12 primaries and 9 secondaries and three flavorings. The Stew specialist could share primaries with the Pastry specialist via the guild bank. Thus each specialist had 12 slots of stuff on themselves and the guild bank had 12. The new system looks like it will cut this down at least a little. A guild bank will now need no more than 9 slots of shared additives and I think a Vegetable specialist may only have 9 slots of vegetable. More importantly, the vegetable specialist can make use of WYSIWYG to only pick up the things he needs to add to his own slots. The meat specialist will take care of himself. No more turning off autoloot, or clicking to destroy or swapping via guild bank or any thing cumbersome.
Super chefs like myself will have everything, sure. But a big pvx guild will only need one or two super chefs and anybody else can be specialized.

Sighotic

Looks like no one really liked this new provisioning system. As for my self - Im totally agree with Garwulf and Divinius. Instead of adding new contend zos trying to replace all that has been done in game. The result is that players with highest level simply spent the money in the shuffle.

Stonesthrow

dmitrygooseweb17_ESO wrote: »

Looks like no one really liked this new provisioning system. As for my self - Im totally agree with Garwulf and Divinius. Instead of adding new contend zos trying to replace all that has been done in game. The result is that players with highest level simply spent the money in the shuffle.

Speak for yourself, or at least preferably wait until you actually SEE WHAT IT DOES to form an opinion for the rest of us.

What is the option for ZOS? Wait another year to fix things that clearly need to be fixed? Two years? There are too many matts… too many recipes that do the same thing. This needed adjustment and it looks like they thought it through. I for one look forward to the inventory reduction… ANOTHER thing that needed some attention.

Your new content is coming as well… the Justice System, aka the prelude to Thieves Guild.

HippieTheGreat

I like the changes, this will definitely free up my inventory.

But why no food/drink stacking? I thought that was going to be added in? Even if you make the drinks "competitive" I still don't see people using them over the food.

Murmeltier

The new Provisioning System looks more Logical and i like it.

But i thought both Buffs, Drinks & Bufffood, can be used together? Zenimax said this in the Past and i am curious, if they have changed their Minds.

To make the Drinks competive, sounds like that. So my Question to the Mods/Devs is, can we use Bufffood and Drinks together?

I think it isnt Top-Secret and i dont asked for the Patchnotes or Release Date of 1.6. Maybe we get an Answer here ?

Nightreaver

•There are far less ingredients, saving you inventory space and making it easier to craft useful products.

Very true. By not allowing drinks to stack with foods and going against what was originally proposed in the revamp and the one thing that everyone agreed they wanted, I will be able to reduce my Provisioning inventory in half by getting rid of all drink ingredients making it easier to craft useful products... like food.

brandon

What will happen to the tons of ingredients we have in our bank or inventory? I really would hate to have it just taken away without any type of replacement after all the hard work of finding them. The same goes for recipes, what about all the recipes we've found? Can we get a response on this because it would be much appreciated.
@ZOS_AmeliaR @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom

ZOS_MSchroeder

I’d like to take a moment and address some of the questions that have come up in this thread so far. We’re all excited to hear your feedback, and I wanted to allay a few fears. Some of this is information we’ve shared before, but I figured it would be helpful to address as much as possible here.

...

1. “What happens to all of my ingredients? How do I get new ingredients I might need?”

Some ingredients will be marked as “Old”. They will no longer be used in Provisioning. However, we’ve set their value to be the same as the price of buying a new ingredient. Grocers will be selling ALL non-rare ingredients, so visiting one is recommended as a one-stop shop for your Provisioning needs. Further, Chefs will be selling all non-rare Food ingredients, and Brewers will be selling all non-rare Drink ingredients. We'll be monitoring the price of player-sold Provisioning items, as well as feedback on this and other forums, to see if and when this pricing schema should change.

Those ingredients that aren’t becoming “Old” or “Stale” will remain useful in Provisioning. However, their names and icons might change. For instance, this is the case with Oats and Tomatoes, generally considered the rarest of all Provisioning ingredients today. After the revamp, they will still be required for purple recipes, but they will change icons and names. So don’t rush off and sell all your tomatoes and oats, thinking they will become commonplace!

Of course, there are many other ways to get ingredients, as well. Like we mentioned in the article, you can now skin fish for use in meat dishes. As ever, you can check in crates, barrels, boxes, and many other places to find spare ingredients just lying around – though now this may incur the wrath of justice. You’ll also find provisioning materials on critters in the wild, as well as receiving materials of all kinds from your Hirelings and any Writs you complete.

2. “What happens to all of my recipes?”

You will still know all of your recipes. No recipes will be ‘forgotten’. However, much like the ingredients that remain, their names and the ingredients they use will change. The rest of any recipe will generally remain the same:
• All recipes have retained their quality. If you knew a purple recipe before the revamp, you will still know a purple recipe afterwards.
• All recipes remain food or drink. If a recipe was a food recipe before the revamp, it will still be a food recipe afterwards (and the same for drink recipes).
• The vast majority of recipes have retained their level. The few recipes that have changed level, have only had their level increase, to ensure maximum value for your effort.

3. “What about VR 10 recipes?”

With the Provisioner Revamp, we are introducing new Veteran Rank 10 recipes. As brand-new recipes, you will have to go out into the world and find them, much like before – no matter how many recipes you might already know.

4. “What happens to all of the foods and drinks I’ve already made?”

They will all still be edible and useful. Many of the foods and drinks you’ve made before will remain as they are today; not even their names will change (they won’t become “old”) – you just won’t be able to make them anymore. Some foods will change their names and icons, but will still be as useful as before.

5. “What’s happening with Drinks?”

During the design phase of the Provisioner revamp, we discussed the possibility of allowing players to use both a food and a drink at the same time. However, we’ve decided at this time that we want there to be an interesting choice between food and drink – some situations call for food, while other situations call for drink. To this end, we’ve improved the regeneration(s) granted by drinks by a significant margin, but we’ve left food and drink unable to stack with one another.

...

We’ll be watching the usage of food and drink on PTS, and going forward on Live. If feedback and metrics show that drinks remain widely unused after the improvements, we will review our options (including but not limited to making them stack) and act accordingly.

EDIT: Forgot to bold question #4.

Flaminir

Thanks... there was more useful info in your post here than in the main article!

brandon

MSchroeder wrote: »

I’d like to take a moment and address some of the questions that have come up in this thread so far. We’re all excited to hear your feedback, and I wanted to allay a few fears. Some of this is information we’ve shared before, but I figured it would be helpful to address as much as possible here.

...

1. “What happens to all of my ingredients? How do I get new ingredients I might need?”

Some ingredients will be marked as “Old”. They will no longer be used in Provisioning. However, we’ve set their value to be the same as the price of buying a new ingredient. Grocers will be selling ALL non-rare ingredients, so visiting one is recommended as a one-stop shop for your Provisioning needs. Further, Chefs will be selling all non-rare Food ingredients, and Brewers will be selling all non-rare Drink ingredients. We'll be monitoring the price of player-sold Provisioning items, as well as feedback on this and other forums, to see if and when this pricing schema should change.

Those ingredients that aren’t becoming “Old” or “Stale” will remain useful in Provisioning. However, their names and icons might change. For instance, this is the case with Oats and Tomatoes, generally considered the rarest of all Provisioning ingredients today. After the revamp, they will still be required for purple recipes, but they will change icons and names. So don’t rush off and sell all your tomatoes and oats, thinking they will become commonplace!

Of course, there are many other ways to get ingredients, as well. Like we mentioned in the article, you can now skin fish for use in meat dishes. As ever, you can check in crates, barrels, boxes, and many other places to find spare ingredients just lying around – though now this may incur the wrath of justice. You’ll also find provisioning materials on critters in the wild, as well as receiving materials of all kinds from your Hirelings and any Writs you complete.

2. “What happens to all of my recipes?”

You will still know all of your recipes. No recipes will be ‘forgotten’. However, much like the ingredients that remain, their names and the ingredients they use will change. The rest of any recipe will generally remain the same:
• All recipes have retained their quality. If you knew a purple recipe before the revamp, you will still know a purple recipe afterwards.
• All recipes remain food or drink. If a recipe was a food recipe before the revamp, it will still be a food recipe afterwards (and the same for drink recipes).
• The vast majority of recipes have retained their level. The few recipes that have changed level, have only had their level increase, to ensure maximum value for your effort.

3. “What about VR 10 recipes?”

With the Provisioner Revamp, we are introducing new Veteran Rank 10 recipes. As brand-new recipes, you will have to go out into the world and find them, much like before – no matter how many recipes you might already know.

4. “What happens to all of the foods and drinks I’ve already made?”

They will all still be edible and useful. Many of the foods and drinks you’ve made before will remain as they are today; not even their names will change (they won’t become “old”) – you just won’t be able to make them anymore. Some foods will change their names and icons, but will still be as useful as before.

5. “What’s happening with Drinks?”

During the design phase of the Provisioner revamp, we discussed the possibility of allowing players to use both a food and a drink at the same time. However, we’ve decided at this time that we want there to be an interesting choice between food and drink – some situations call for food, while other situations call for drink. To this end, we’ve improved the regeneration(s) granted by drinks by a significant margin, but we’ve left food and drink unable to stack with one another.

...

We’ll be watching the usage of food and drink on PTS, and going forward on Live. If feedback and metrics show that drinks remain widely unused after the improvements, we will review our options (including but not limited to making them stack) and act accordingly.

EDIT: Forgot to bold question #4.

Thank you! That is very much appreciated!

ReCreare

We need to be able to get food and drink buffs simultaneously. Until this day, no excitement for provisioning from this one.

ebunts14_ESO

davedwildebeast wrote: »

Thanks... there was more useful info in your post here than in the main article!

And if people would have read the information that had been posted since the mention of the revamp, people would have seen everything MSchroeder just said.

Everything mentioned so far I have already heard from other posts, interviews, statements, ect.

Obsidian3

Thank you MSchroeder for the post.

As a master chef I am excited about the change, been making notes of dungeons on every map that are littered with barrels and crates, so I can farm w/o dealing with the damned Po-Po. Also got the Nights Silence farming armor ready to go, for a little light five fingered discount shopping. (although isn't there going to be an opt for Justice system, so we can continue to raid cities w/o incurring the wrath of the guards?)

It sounds to me the biggest problem that will be fixed is that main ingredients won't be level specific which is nice, because my VR chef cannot go to starting areas and farm low level meat, since the meat drops are all level specific, that I believe will make it a lot easier for Master Chefs to gather ingredients for low level recipes.

phreatophile

That answers most of my questions. Thanks very much.

I predict that drinks will only be useful for long fights if at all. Unless the fight is going to last more than a minute or so, higher max resource will be king for the higher starting pool and higher damage. I'm not sure how high the regen rate would have to be to counteract the problem, but I think stacking will prove to be the only way beverages become useful.

dodgehopper_ESO

What happens to all the recipes we've been collecting since the game has released?
(Nevermind, I saw MSchroeder answered it).

redspecter23

Any chance this update to provisioning will reintroduce the 3 recipes (updated of course to their new versions)?

Green Saltrice Slurry
Blue Grilled Frog Legs
Purple Breton Stew

Both the frog legs and breton stew have dropped in the past but are currently not on the loot tables. The Saltrice Slurry has never dropped.

If you are simply replacing the names of old recipes with new ones then these 3 recipes may still be missing from the loot tables. I'm hoping to get an official word stating that ZoS at least knows about this and collectors won't be left hanging when when everything swaps over to the new system.

Amdirial

So when it was previously stated that drinks and food could stack now they can't and unless they change drastically drinks will be useless. This was the one "change" that a number of people were looking forward to.

Darkonflare15

It is amazing how someone can put clear info down and how one person can mis interpret it which raises plenty of confusion for anybody who did not pay attention to the source.

Murmeltier

First, thank you for answering and this Information. The Bufffood should stack with the Drinks, i think many People was waiting for it.

You say that Drinks are competive now but for sure, no one will use them if they cancel the Bufffood. Dont forget that many People use the Bufffood to create their Builds. No One will use Drinks, if they lose Attributes for that.

To be competive with the Bufffood, the Drinks should have heavy Regeneration Buffs. I dont mean only Bonuspoints on Regeneration, maybe more an additional Bonus all 5 Seconds or a Bonus on Hit. Only some Examples, insert other Bonus here .

But the best Option is, make them stackable with Bufffood.

CodexMMO

Looks like a good update. I like the consolidation of ingredient varieties so save inventory space

MisterBigglesworth

Murmeltier wrote: »

To be competive with the Bufffood, the Drinks should have heavy Regeneration Buffs. I dont mean only Bonuspoints on Regeneration, maybe more an additional Bonus all 5 Seconds or a Bonus on Hit. Only some Examples, insert other Bonus here .

I agree, and can already think of something I'd like to see:

Consummate Brew of the Red Bull
Reduces falling speed by 50% for 1 hour.

Arato

Food and Drink not stacking is a mistake, 9/10 you will want food, not drink. Only very long fights will make regen viable, and even then you might opt for food because food can increase your damage, where regen from drink does not.

DPS will probably never go for drink, tanks and healers may opt for it for very long boss fights.

Eldarth

MSchroeder wrote: »

5. “What’s happening with Drinks?”

During the design phase of the Provisioner revamp, we discussed the possibility of allowing players to use both a food and a drink at the same time. However, we’ve decided at this time that we want there to be an interesting choice between food and drink – some situations call for food, while other situations call for drink. To this end, we’ve improved the regeneration(s) granted by drinks by a significant margin, but we’ve left food and drink unable to stack with one another.

Sad.
I predict almost noone will pursue Drink Provisioning.
Oh well, at least that'll cut my provisioning inventory/recipes in half anyway.
After 6 months of noone doing drinks they'll figure it out and re-re-adjust it.

Royalty27

Sounds good to me. Just wish you could eat and drink but I do see how that could be a little overpowered.

Xsorus

I'm planning on trying a new build out in pvp when 1.6 comes out... I will consider using a drink in pvp... Since it plays heavily into my build... Drinks though would have to give a massiven buff right now to be comparable

timidobserver

Lets take the main part of the provisioning revamp that people are looking forward to(being able to use food and drinks) and cut it out.

Psychobunni

MSchroeder wrote: »

5. “What’s happening with Drinks?”

During the design phase of the Provisioner revamp, we discussed the possibility of allowing players to use both a food and a drink at the same time. However, we’ve decided at this time that we want there to be an interesting choice between food and drink – some situations call for food, while other situations call for drink. To this end, we’ve improved the regeneration(s) granted by drinks by a significant margin, but we’ve left food and drink unable to stack with one another.

...

We’ll be watching the usage of food and drink on PTS, and going forward on Live. If feedback and metrics show that drinks remain widely unused after the improvements, we will review our options (including but not limited to making them stack) and act accordingly.

Sooooo all provisioners on PTS need to send "please let them stack" feedback