Why does ZOS hate Sorcs?

Leovolao

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXMhsaeMZ9I
Here is a video of playing near perfect as a sorc 1.5.7, yeah i do well, but i have to work way way harder to win fights compared to other classes. the average player will not have near perfect timing and positioning, not trying to boast. the current state of the class right now is really hurting them. go to cyrodiil and look around, how many sorcerers do you see, i can almost count them on my hand. i bet most quit or re-rolled to dk to be competitive. just my two cents.

I'm still here!!!!!!

Yolokin_Swagonborn

The current Bolt Escape Nerf has three issues:

1. It is inconsistent with the overall philosophy of an Elder Scrolls game.
2. It was implemented too early before the metagame could develop.
3. It pulls out the lynch pin of what sorcs were designed around: High Mobility, superior positioning, and an "escape" instead of a class heal.

1. Game Philosophy
The problem with the bolt escape nerf is that now Bolt Escape is the ONLY ABILITY IN THE GAME that punishes a player for using it rapidly i.e. spamming.

Every class has abilities that are considered OP when spammed. Some abilities are arguably more OP that BE ever was when spammed. That is why it seems like inconsistent and poor game design to only punish Sorcs for ability spamming while other classes spam their way to easy kills all the time.

Is it really more frusterating to not catch a fleeing Sorcerer than it is to see your entire kill log filled with one ability like snipe, flame lash or blazing shield?

So why not put cooldowns on every ability someone considers OP?

This goes against the spirit of an Elder Scrolls game where you are not supposed to be limited by cooldowns of any sort but only by your resource pool. This is the same reason we want the "hidden cooldowns" to be removed from templar abilites such as Toppling Charge and Solar Barrage. Cooldowns kill the fun.

Cooldowns, or magicka use penalties hurt the "play the way you want" style that makes this game so unique.

There are plenty of MMOs out there with cooldowns on abilities but this one was unique and different. This one was special.

But the bolt escape nerf sets a terrible precedent for micro-managed skill abilities. Do you really want the endgame playstyle to be all about counting out timings in your head like starcraft or LoL?

2. Bolt escape was nerfed too early i.e. Counters Not Nerfs

The second problem with the bolt escape nerf is that it was nerfed before the meta-game had time to develop counters. I have killed plenty of sorcs by using well timed gap closers that all outrange Bolt escape. When I play a sorc, I have been killed by gap closers or ranged abilities even though I had at least 3 bolts worth of magicka reserves left. Bolt escape was always counter-able. But those counters weren't as well known or as well practiced as they are now in PvP.

Nerf or L2P is a false dichotomy.

The middle road between nerfs and L2P is balancing powerful abilities by providing plenty of counters in the form of skills and tactics. I don't like the phrase "L2P" because (1) it assumes that the game is perfectly balanced and fine the way it is and (2) it is mainly a conversation derailer and does not promote helpful discussion.

Bolt Escape has plenty of existing well developed counters now. The current nerf is outdated and no longer necessary.

3. High mobility in exchange for no class heals

Everyone that plays PvP knows how important positioning is. This invisible "line of scrimmage" determines whether you live or get melted instantly. Tanky classes can cross that line and take forward positions due to either strong damage mitigation or strong healing abilities.

After the Harness Magicka nerf, sorcs lack both of those. Bolt escape ensured you could remain in the battle but constantly adjusting your position relative to the ever changing battle lines. It was what made sorcs competitive and extremely fun to play.

This nerf really killed the fun and reduced the available builds for sorcs. Where other classes can get away with two offensive weapons setups, a resto staff is a mandatory second weapon for a sorc.

TL:DR. The current bolt escape nerf is no longer needed and sets a bad precedent for future balance changes. It removes one of the few advantages of the sorc class (survivability in the form of mobility) in return for nothing. It lowers the fun of playing a sorc.

OrangeTheCat

After seeing this, I have little sympathy for your complaining, at least for PvP:

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/143092/vid-umbra-and-the-raptor-crew-its-good-stuff#latest

cozmon3c_ESO

wasnt complaining, but i can see where the average player will have short comings with playing sorc, its not like dk where you can spam one button and live forever, it requires work, timing and positioning to play a sorc.

cozmon3c_ESO

Leovolao wrote: »

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXMhsaeMZ9I
Here is a video of playing near perfect as a sorc 1.5.7, yeah i do well, but i have to work way way harder to win fights compared to other classes. the average player will not have near perfect timing and positioning, not trying to boast. the current state of the class right now is really hurting them. go to cyrodiil and look around, how many sorcerers do you see, i can almost count them on my hand. i bet most quit or re-rolled to dk to be competitive. just my two cents.

I'm still here!!!!!!

your a great sorc though lol

Leovolao

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

Leovolao wrote: »

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXMhsaeMZ9I
Here is a video of playing near perfect as a sorc 1.5.7, yeah i do well, but i have to work way way harder to win fights compared to other classes. the average player will not have near perfect timing and positioning, not trying to boast. the current state of the class right now is really hurting them. go to cyrodiil and look around, how many sorcerers do you see, i can almost count them on my hand. i bet most quit or re-rolled to dk to be competitive. just my two cents.

I'm still here!!!!!!

your a great sorc though lol

awww thanks dude!

You too!

Milf_Hero

It actually might be bad to reroll DK. If you havn't been one in these first rough 6 or so months of rebalancing, fixing, tweaking, fine tuning, whatever terminology you wish to use, then you have pretty much missed out on the DK gravy train every one thinks we are on. (<-- that right there is sarcasm.) Since there is a movement against DKs, you might be better of staying whatever class you are currently or rerolling a NB oooor being a Templar and just heal in pvp and pve.

Lol just because I like seeing how active he is, thumbs up to @zos_ulyssesw

Oh and @cozmon3c_ESO , good fighting. a good show of sorcs being able to stand their own against other classes in an even fight.

*** Hero OUT!

TheLaw

You're on point with the BE nerf. Our mobility was our advantage and now it's a punishment. It's pretty obvious sorcs need some love, let's just hope the ability revamp in 1.6 is good enough.

Da Sandman

Leovolao wrote: »

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

Leovolao wrote: »

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXMhsaeMZ9I
Here is a video of playing near perfect as a sorc 1.5.7, yeah i do well, but i have to work way way harder to win fights compared to other classes. the average player will not have near perfect timing and positioning, not trying to boast. the current state of the class right now is really hurting them. go to cyrodiil and look around, how many sorcerers do you see, i can almost count them on my hand. i bet most quit or re-rolled to dk to be competitive. just my two cents.

I'm still here!!!!!!

your a great sorc though lol

awww thanks dude!

You too!

No!

NordJitsu

Totally agree with your analysis. BE wasn't just for running. It was for positioning and maneuvering in a fight. Ironically, the ability to run got hit least by the nerfs and the ability to use it in combat got hurt the most (magicka regen penalty is absurdly painful.)

It was also a source of damage if you picked Streak or defense if you picked BoL (why do melee DKs get to spam RS but melee sorcs can't spam BoL to stop range?)

Now I'm not pretending you can't be good with a sorc. It's just way harder than any other class. There is no margin for error like there is with the other 3.

#itoldyousoZoS

Poxheart

Derra wrote: »

Thx. I have been such an idiot not thinking of these . Any NB dying to a single person popping a stealth detect pot especially in the forementioned situation where the bowman waits till numbers are in his favor probably deserves to die.

^^Spoken like someone who has never played a Nightblade or has had to deal with unreliable stealth. Unlike Sorcerers with Bolt Escape, once an enemy uses a detect pot a Nightblade is pretty much dead in the water unless they are a vampire & use Mistform to elude the damage/charges/roots that are directed at them.

I need to test it, but I'm pretty sure that Crushing Shock will still target/hit a Nightblade that has activated Dark Cloak/Shadowy Disguise.

NordJitsu

Stop pretending like the NB only has invisibility. Refreshing path is by far faster than bolt escape over moderate to long distances.

NB also has better self healing like sap essence and other siphoning skills.

Milf_Hero

w8, you can out run a sorc with refreshing path? holy popsicles bat man!!

Teargrants

Poxheart wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Thx. I have been such an idiot not thinking of these . Any NB dying to a single person popping a stealth detect pot especially in the forementioned situation where the bowman waits till numbers are in his favor probably deserves to die.

^^Spoken like someone who has never played a Nightblade or has had to deal with unreliable stealth. Unlike Sorcerers with Bolt Escape, once an enemy uses a detect pot a Nightblade is pretty much dead in the water unless they are a vampire & use Mistform to elude the damage/charges/roots that are directed at them.

I need to test it, but I'm pretty sure that Crushing Shock will still target/hit a Nightblade that has activated Dark Cloak/Shadowy Disguise.

NB cloak is more than just for running away. NBs that just crouch and spam cloak to run, just limit themselves. Cloak is an amazing tool for momentary dmg mitigation and repositioning. DK talon spam? Just cloak to purge the talons. Ect ect.

Poxheart

Teargrants wrote: »

Poxheart wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Thx. I have been such an idiot not thinking of these . Any NB dying to a single person popping a stealth detect pot especially in the forementioned situation where the bowman waits till numbers are in his favor probably deserves to die.

^^Spoken like someone who has never played a Nightblade or has had to deal with unreliable stealth. Unlike Sorcerers with Bolt Escape, once an enemy uses a detect pot a Nightblade is pretty much dead in the water unless they are a vampire & use Mistform to elude the damage/charges/roots that are directed at them.

I need to test it, but I'm pretty sure that Crushing Shock will still target/hit a Nightblade that has activated Dark Cloak/Shadowy Disguise.

NB cloak is more than just for running away. NBs that just crouch and spam cloak to run, just limit themselves. Cloak is an amazing tool for momentary dmg mitigation and repositioning. DK talon spam? Just cloak to purge the talons. Ect ect.

When Crushing Shock doesn't go right through it. When Crystal Fragments doesn't go right through it. When Bolt Escape doesn't go right through it. When Shield Charge doesn't go right through it. Etc., etc., etc.

Basically, when it works it can be awesome. And I do use it to mitigate damage & reposition myself during a fight. However, the problem is that it isn't very reliable and unlike Bolt Escape, it doesn't CC enemies and it can be made completely ineffective by somebody using a potion.

More often than not, when things get hot I have to pop a speed/stealth pot to get away because the stealth granted by Shadowy Disguise breaks before it should. But even the full duration on stealth pots doesn't work 100% of the time.

Leovolao

Da Sandman wrote: »

Leovolao wrote: »

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

Leovolao wrote: »

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXMhsaeMZ9I
Here is a video of playing near perfect as a sorc 1.5.7, yeah i do well, but i have to work way way harder to win fights compared to other classes. the average player will not have near perfect timing and positioning, not trying to boast. the current state of the class right now is really hurting them. go to cyrodiil and look around, how many sorcerers do you see, i can almost count them on my hand. i bet most quit or re-rolled to dk to be competitive. just my two cents.

I'm still here!!!!!!

your a great sorc though lol

awww thanks dude!

You too!

No!

Don't be jelly, Sandy!

Derra

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXMhsaeMZ9I
Here is a video of playing near perfect as a sorc 1.5.7, yeah i do well, but i have to work way way harder to win fights compared to other classes. the average player will not have near perfect timing and positioning, not trying to boast. the current state of the class right now is really hurting them. go to cyrodiil and look around, how many sorcerers do you see, i can almost count them on my hand. i bet most quit or re-rolled to dk to be competitive. just my two cents.

A vid with more (friendly) adds than not.
Though it shows the class problems pretty clear. You´d not be able to kill anything without adds or the enemy severely overextending.

I would still not be claiming to play near perfect in your position with a max defense build (not there would be alternatives as a sorc you still waste a slot for double streak and have no basedots addet for pressure on dks). Still room for optimisation.
Mechanically its good play though.

Poxheart wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Thx. I have been such an idiot not thinking of these . Any NB dying to a single person popping a stealth detect pot especially in the forementioned situation where the bowman waits till numbers are in his favor probably deserves to die.

^^Spoken like someone who has never played a Nightblade or has had to deal with unreliable stealth. Unlike Sorcerers with Bolt Escape, once an enemy uses a detect pot a Nightblade is pretty much dead in the water unless they are a vampire & use Mistform to elude the damage/charges/roots that are directed at them.

I need to test it, but I'm pretty sure that Crushing Shock will still target/hit a Nightblade that has activated Dark Cloak/Shadowy Disguise.

Please read what i wrote. The archer should not even be pot detect range when he´s adding the fight. NB archers that actually put some thought into their play and combinate stealth, dodgeroll and sprint + the use of environment are near impossible to catch even 1v1 (indeed the detected ones that stand in pot range and spam cloak till their mana is gone ARE dead fish, but they are not playing good and die because of their own faulty play).
I have to admit its harder to pull off with a stam NB than with a Sorc (1 button mash yeah). You might find its also a lot easier to get quick kills with a bow than with a class skill based sorc build also.

Poxheart wrote: »

When Crushing Shock doesn't go right through it. When Crystal Fragments doesn't go right through it. When Bolt Escape doesn't go right through it. When Shield Charge doesn't go right through it. Etc., etc., etc.

Basically, when it works it can be awesome. And I do use it to mitigate damage & reposition myself during a fight. However, the problem is that it isn't very reliable and unlike Bolt Escape, it doesn't CC enemies and it can be made completely ineffective by somebody using a potion.

More often than not, when things get hot I have to pop a speed/stealth pot to get away because the stealth granted by Shadowy Disguise breaks before it should. But even the full duration on stealth pots doesn't work 100% of the time.

I play since release i have yet to see my fragments break nb stealth ONE SINGLE TIME. I hear nbs complaining a lot about it. I have never seen it myself.

cozmon3c_ESO

There probably thinking velocious curse is crystal frag. They get the time bomb on them and dont realize it, works through dodgeroll too.

Poxheart

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

There probably thinking velocious curse is crystal frag. They get the time bomb on them and dont realize it, works through dodgeroll too.

I know the animation difference between curse & frags.

Eglath

Dear NBs, make your own thread about NB, and stop complining about them in every thread about class/game mechanics. I'm not sayong NB is fine but let's keep it sorc only .

Coming to the crux of the matter, nobody would be using BE if we had a reliable alternative, due to it's broken cost, but we have NO alternative, let me repeat that, NO alternative! If a sorc wants to be alive while fighting he has few options:

• Hide inside the walls. Which most ppl don't like (including me), and walls aren't available everywhere.
• Hide behind DKs, which again is not what ppl think when rolling a sorc, and DKs are not always avaiable.
• Or spam BE to get away.

The last one is mostly used but it's not effecitve. Why? Because of gap closer spamming, many fights agains DKs look as following: at some point he uses Shield Charge, I break free and BE, he uses Shield Charge, I break free and BE, he uses Shield Charge... and I'm out of stam.

The whole point of melee vs range is to give range possiblity to effectively kite melee, by slowing/ccing him, and generally keeping distance. Melee classes, on the other hand should be able to, by using gap closers, to get to caster, rot him and deal dmg. This all should be balanced, but it's not. Due to gap closer spamming we can't effectively fight melee, and we (sorcs and archers) are forced to escape because we stand no chance, as they will always be on our back. There is no point in even slowing them (on a side sorc has no range slow), as gap closers are too op atm.

MiyaTheUnbroken

I'm not a sorc and I know very little about them, so I will not speak on that, but I have seen several of you mentioning NBs and archers, and I will speak on that.

It was said that sorcs only have 3 viable class skills in PvP. Sorcerers are not alone in this. I only run two class skills, because they are the only one that work with my build in PvP. While I've obviously not polled everyone in the game, most people I've seen only run 2-3 class skills. I'm not saying that I feel you shouldn't be given better skills or that the skills you have now are sufficient. I don't know that. I am saying that it doesn't seem to be exclusive to sorcs.

There was also some speculation as to whether or not frags can break cloak. It can. It has. ZoS has confirmed this. They have also confirmed that there is a myriad of abilities and combinations that break both stealth and cloak. We are not confusing frags and curses. They look very different, not to mention one knocks you on your ass and the other does not.

Da Sandman

Leovolao wrote: »

Da Sandman wrote: »

Leovolao wrote: »

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

Leovolao wrote: »

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXMhsaeMZ9I
Here is a video of playing near perfect as a sorc 1.5.7, yeah i do well, but i have to work way way harder to win fights compared to other classes. the average player will not have near perfect timing and positioning, not trying to boast. the current state of the class right now is really hurting them. go to cyrodiil and look around, how many sorcerers do you see, i can almost count them on my hand. i bet most quit or re-rolled to dk to be competitive. just my two cents.

I'm still here!!!!!!

your a great sorc though lol

awww thanks dude!

You too!

No!

Don't be jelly, Sandy!

You make a better nightblade.

morvegil

Sorcs underpowered? Ok....

OrangeTheCat

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

wasnt complaining, but i can see where the average player will have short comings with playing sorc, its not like dk where you can spam one button and live forever, it requires work, timing and positioning to play a sorc.

Same can be said about NBs. And ZOS does hate NBs. Therefore, ZOS must hate sorcs too.

Merlight

I learned Bolt Escape by the end of July, before the Great Campaign Culling. Not 100% sure it was before or after the last nerf, but anyway even before morphing it I thought it was pretty awesome. At first I picked Streak, a month later I switched to Ball of Lightning and I've been using that since then.

In my opinion, the increased cost for successive casts is absolutely required. BE spam that can be seen in early post-launch videos is just ridiculous. If they replaced the penalty with increased base cost, they'd make the skill much worse for people who use it scarcely.

What I have a little problem with is magicka regeneration. Basically whenever someone forces me to cast BE multiple times in a row, I can't go back even if I wanted to. I have no resources left to keep figting. So I just try to bolt away or die stupidly. I know it's annoying for the people chasing me, but for me as well.

Fruitdog

Aren't the top 4 or 5 players on NA Thornblade Sorcs? IJS...

Gorthax

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

woodsro wrote: »

The Sorc Class Short comings

We have no Direct Damage Instant Cast Class Skills. Were the only class gimped this way. This is why you see so many Sorcs using staffs. We also have the Summoned Pets that are completely useless in PVP. Crystal Shards is a roll of the RNG by using other skills(staff skills) to get an instant cast.

Mages Wrath is an execute and is useless unless the target is at 20% health or below. Rune Prison like nearly every sorc skill, has a cast time and can be interrupted, Encase costs way too much for what it does in comparison Talons. Surge is not useless, but it doesn't fot all builds either and don't make sense unless your using weapon based skills in liue of class skills, and in trials and dungeons you are using staff skills because Shards is a DPS loss and the rest of our class skills don't exactly kill very fast.

Negate is our only real game changing Ultimate but it isn't cheap and is situational...if it wasn't for Negate, Sorcs wouldn't even be asked to do any trials or dungeons.

Now we get to the Crux of the Argument

Why the Bolt Escape Nerf was over the top and has literally made Sorcs the worst class in the game, especially PVP

Since Sorcs have no instant cast time direct damage class abilities, Sorcs are designed to be dependent on "buying time" until their Curses go off, getting a lucky roll with the RNG for a Shard proc, and being able to out maneuver their opponent since Sorcs are obviously not a melee class in the traditional sense. Instead they are kiting class that relies on tickling their opponent with Mage's Wrath, while finding synergy with Curse and Shards while being able to use Bolt Escape to buy the time needed to do this.

However the current Bolt Escape nerf doesn't make this viable unless your willing to suck tri-potions like Skooma. Even then, its very hard to do.

Lets look at this Realistically and the Real cost of Bolt Escape:

Bolt Escape costs around 392 mana to cast(give or take) Now if you cast it again within 4 seconds it costs an INSANE 588 mana(give or take) and it reduces Mana Regen by 50% for 4 seconds...if your mana regen is 137 then cut that in half = 68.5. The mana you don't get in that regen penalty MUST be included in the total cost of the skill as that is mana you don't get regened which is a flat cost in itself.

So the TRUE cost of Bolt Escape's second cast is 588 mana + 68 x4 =(272) Total Cost of the Second Bolt Escape Cast(including regen penalty) is 860 Mana (give or take)

Please tell me how it is fair that a skill i need to cast to reposition myself has a TCOC(Total Cost of Cast) at 860 mana is possibly fair or balance?

Lets take Snipe and give it a 50% cost increase and 50% stamina regen penalty every time you use it twice in a 4 second period.

Lets take Reflective Scales and do the same thing.

Lets do the same thing to Green Dragon Blood

Lets take Templar's Blazing Sheild and give it the same nerf.

The point is Bolt Escape DOES NOT EVEN KILL ANYONE! all the other skills i listed above do, yet its perfectly ok for them...yet the Sorc is crippled for using BE to reposition themselves.

Folks complained BE allowed people to run....didn't you win the fight when the person ran away? Why bother to chase...as a Sorc who sees a another Sorc BE, i don't bother chasing them, I will kill them later, no one has any patience anymore to force someone to fight on your terms. Instead, folks want to instant kill all fight up in your face with no strategy whatsoever.

I thought ESO AvA pvp was called an "Alliance War" retreat/running is a valid tactic. No one forces anyone to chase after a Sorc....and contrary to popular belief pre-nerf BE sorcs were not impossible to kill. You can string gap closers between their casts very easily to lock them down and kill them.

Ezarth commented about this in length that Critical Rush and Sheild Charge users were able to repeatedly spam those skills to lock him down and kill him and he is a former Emp....BE was counterable before this nerf.


Right now, the Sorc is the only class that is actively punished and crippled for using a class skill the entire class concept was designed around. Were the only class that has to deal with such a crippling skill....860 mana to cast a skill a 2nd time within 4 secs is not fair in any world this game takes place in.

DK get the easy nerf to Scales, it won't even effect them 99% of the time...stay stealth sometime and watch a DK...tell me how many times he reflects more then 4 projectiles before he has to recast....those instances are very rare...he usually recasts before he has reflected 4 projectiles, so that nerf changes nothing for them.

Yet Sorcs were hit with a critical blow that made us leaps and bounds weaker then other classes, and the nerfs just kept coming...Harness Magicka Nerf, etc....Sorcs do the worst damage out of all classes in PVP, and BE costs is insane and doesn't allow the skill to be used how it was intended(repositioning and offensively) because doing so costs way to much to be viable...

860 mana cost for 2nd cast...its not feasible...even with Tri-pots...so BE is used primarily to run now and must suck tri-pots most times to do it...i miss the days of being able to use Streak offensively to fight/reposition and kick someones teeth in...can't do that now...the insane costs make it impossible to do this against any other player with half a brain that knows what the block key is as most fights come down to resource management and BE in its current form makes winning a battle of resource mangement next to impossible against anyone who knows what they are doing.

Come on Zeni, you buff bows, been buffing all the stamina stuff...give us Sorcs some love...take this insane cost away from casting BE and set a 6 limit target cap on how many it can hit, reduce the Ultimate gained by targets with with BE, and us Sorcs won't hear another peep from us...we need this badly, the class is too weak otherwise...

if any other class had a skill with this kind of crippling penalty, the entire forum would be up in arms. Need proof? look no further then the Reflective Scales nerf thread, People are crying about a 4 projectile limit before recast when DK right now in 9 out of 10 cases never reflect more then 4 projectiles in a 4 sec period anyways, so this literally changes nothing for them, while Bolt Escape was beat into the dirt with a sledgehammer and buried under 2 tons of rubble.

Please Fix the class Zeni, if your not going to give us our BE back then fix our other class skills, make us viable in some other way, right now, most of our class skills suck for PVP, and in our current state, were only on par with other classes with a BE without this insane penalty, right now, Sorcs are clearly the weakest PVP class by far because of it.

To answer the question, No...you didn't win the fight when the Sorc ran away...Because what would happen is 9/10, they'd come right back when you were fighting someone else to unload on you.

And this is different from any other class doing the same thing, how?

themizario wrote: »

Useless thread... title implies ZOS decided that Sorcs would be singled out and hated on versus all other classes.

OP probably feels entitled in life. The world owes OP something.

Just zip it and L2P or reroll

You are the most ignorant person ever. L2P? Reroll? So you are saying screw what you wanna do go roll a class you have no interest in. Or follow everyone else and roll a lmfaofacemeetkeyboard sword and board vamp DK right?

Your post was useless and you should feel ashamed.

Gorthax

woodsro wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJu1KLm-VR0

I also notice the LOL's on my post and my video post of how to counter BE.

Here is a video of Ezareth(whom greatly influenced my fighting style) the infamous AD Emperor of Haderus using BE, well Ball of Lighting to be exact, to tactically elude, reposition, and kill his opponents.

What he is doing in this video is exactly what folks whined about that lead to BE being nerfed, when in reality Ezarth flat out tactically outplayed his opponents an lulled them into fighting him on his terms where he melted their faces. Outside of tons of tri-pots at 10-12k a stack, doing this now is extremely hard if not impossible.

How Ezareth is playing the Sorc is how the class is supposed to be played, tactically eluding your opponent and keeping fights at a distance where you can kill them because Sorcs in the traditional sense are not meant for melee combat.

A traditional Sorc in melee combat with a DK is a Sorc that won't live very long. The Sorc needs a resource management viable version of BE. I would even go as far as removing the mana regen penalty and just slighting increasing the base cost.

BE costs too much now to maintain an offensive on your opponent while trying to reposition(which is what the skill was intended to do) so now Sorcs only use BE to run because its almost impossible to maintain an offensive while using it because of the prohibitive cost, and not everyone has 10-12k to spend per day on tri-pots in order to make it semi-viable.

I can not stress how important it is to notice he is a BATTLE MAGE that block cast using sword and shield. That is not a caster class. Casters use only staffs. If that is how you want to look at it. I dont use melee and I try my hardest not to block cast (cheapest thing ever).

However, watching him play S&B as a sorc makes me understand why eso went from elder staves online to elder shield and bows online :P He is still a really good sorc though. Please keep in mind not everyone wants to pick up a sword and board

Lava_Croft

Please stop comparing Nightblades to Sorcerers. Apart from some (still) broken skills, Nightblades are overall in a much better place than Sorcerers. The fact that two nerfs (Cycle of Life and Harness Magicka) and one fix, (Sharpened) have hurt Sorcerers so much says a whole lot about the state of their class skills.

Sorcerers are currently in the place where Nightblades were just after release.
Only a few people can play them effectively and the effort you have to spend to be effective is a lot higher than with other classes.

Xsorus

Gorthax wrote: »

woodsro wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJu1KLm-VR0

I also notice the LOL's on my post and my video post of how to counter BE.

Here is a video of Ezareth(whom greatly influenced my fighting style) the infamous AD Emperor of Haderus using BE, well Ball of Lighting to be exact, to tactically elude, reposition, and kill his opponents.

What he is doing in this video is exactly what folks whined about that lead to BE being nerfed, when in reality Ezarth flat out tactically outplayed his opponents an lulled them into fighting him on his terms where he melted their faces. Outside of tons of tri-pots at 10-12k a stack, doing this now is extremely hard if not impossible.

How Ezareth is playing the Sorc is how the class is supposed to be played, tactically eluding your opponent and keeping fights at a distance where you can kill them because Sorcs in the traditional sense are not meant for melee combat.

A traditional Sorc in melee combat with a DK is a Sorc that won't live very long. The Sorc needs a resource management viable version of BE. I would even go as far as removing the mana regen penalty and just slighting increasing the base cost.

BE costs too much now to maintain an offensive on your opponent while trying to reposition(which is what the skill was intended to do) so now Sorcs only use BE to run because its almost impossible to maintain an offensive while using it because of the prohibitive cost, and not everyone has 10-12k to spend per day on tri-pots in order to make it semi-viable.

I can not stress how important it is to notice he is a BATTLE MAGE that block cast using sword and shield. That is not a caster class. Casters use only staffs. If that is how you want to look at it. I dont use melee and I try my hardest not to block cast (cheapest thing ever).

However, watching him play S&B as a sorc makes me understand why eso went from elder staves online to elder shield and bows online :P He is still a really good sorc though. Please keep in mind not everyone wants to pick up a sword and board

Oh god...please tell me you Sorcs aren't going to start using that bullcrap excuse like nightblades did when they were trying to get their class overbuffed... "It's a NightBLADE, not a NightSTAFF!!!"

And this game is still Elder staves online, don't bloody kid yourself.