Deconstruction Bug

MorHawk

GreyRanger wrote: »

Sorry, but I have to ask: Is there any idea on the priority timeline on the change (it is an important core game mechanic).

Can you tell us how the current mechanic works: the base percentage, degree of penalty, and whether the penalty applies to all materials e.g.: base materials versus tempers versus upgrade stones

Too late, he already threw the smoke pellet.

d.crosgrove_ESO

Siliconhobbit_ESO wrote: »

Deconstructing, and the items you recover from that process, is tied to your character level, not your crafting level.

Thus, deconstructing items that are higher level then you will result in less material returned, and often times none at all if the level of the item is much greater then your own character level. In essence, if you cannot personally USE that item, do not expect to get materials back from that items deconstruction.

It's always been this way.

Wrong. I played every beta weekend, and was in the game during the entire early access. My launcher still reads beta. And let me state this perfectly clear, the game, up until today, has NEVER cared about character level. I would usually get something out of deconstructing. (Aside from skill gains, which when you hit level 50, are zero.)

As of right now, the game makes no sense--my character can make a VR7 item using VR7 mats, but because she is only level 24, she cannot break down a VR7 item and get anything out of it?

My crafting character, which was created 20 minutes after the servers opened up an hour early, has just become worthless.

This needs to be fixed fast.

stefan.gustavsonb16_ESO

Saying your character is now worthless is an overstatement. Are you really completely dependent on deconstruction as your only source for base raw materials? It's not as if farming for materials is difficult. OK, the leather requires you to kill some critters, but you can find easy targets in every zone, and wood, cloth and ore are just sitting there for you to harvest them. If an alt is making armor and weapons for characters of much higher level, those other characters would have no problems finding the base materials.

Halke

d.crosgrove_ESO wrote: »

Siliconhobbit_ESO wrote: »

Deconstructing, and the items you recover from that process, is tied to your character level, not your crafting level.

Thus, deconstructing items that are higher level then you will result in less material returned, and often times none at all if the level of the item is much greater then your own character level. In essence, if you cannot personally USE that item, do not expect to get materials back from that items deconstruction.

It's always been this way.

Wrong. I played every beta weekend, and was in the game during the entire early access. My launcher still reads beta. And let me state this perfectly clear, the game, up until today, has NEVER cared about character level. I would usually get something out of deconstructing. (Aside from skill gains, which when you hit level 50, are zero.)

As of right now, the game makes no sense--my character can make a VR7 item using VR7 mats, but because she is only level 24, she cannot break down a VR7 item and get anything out of it?

My crafting character, which was created 20 minutes after the servers opened up an hour early, has just become worthless.

This needs to be fixed fast.

Your beta credit will not help you here. Been there too, ZOS has already confirmed multiple times that this has been around since the start. It only affects base materials and the effect is more sever the further you are from their level. This is being fixed to some degree soon though. All that the update did was add a notification.

Grileenor

d.crosgrove_ESO wrote: »

Siliconhobbit_ESO wrote: »

Deconstructing, and the items you recover from that process, is tied to your character level, not your crafting level.

Thus, deconstructing items that are higher level then you will result in less material returned, and often times none at all if the level of the item is much greater then your own character level. In essence, if you cannot personally USE that item, do not expect to get materials back from that items deconstruction.

It's always been this way.

Wrong. I played every beta weekend, and was in the game during the entire early access. My launcher still reads beta. And let me state this perfectly clear, the game, up until today, has NEVER cared about character level. I would usually get something out of deconstructing. (Aside from skill gains, which when you hit level 50, are zero.)

He is right, you are wrong here. It has always been this way, even during the last betas. But it is very nice to hear, it will finally be changed. So I will keep up to /feedback

sgraybillb14_ESO

ZOS_JasonLeavey wrote: »

... However, based on your feedback, our team is going to change this in a future update so that we’ll check your passive skill rank level in addition to your character level, using whichever is higher to help give you the full deconstruct credit easier..

Thank you but why should it have ANYthing to do with character level? Creating items doesn't why would deconstructing them? It should be based solely on extraction skill, nothing at all to do with character level.

Merlight

sgraybillb14_ESO wrote: »

Thank you but why should it have ANYthing to do with character level? Creating items doesn't why would deconstructing them? It should be based solely on extraction skill, nothing at all to do with character level.

Perhaps because they can see a bit further. I assure you that if they did what you suggest, the day that change would go live, people would flock forums with complaints why can't they learn a new crafting profession and get mats on their VR14 characters by deconstructing gear they're looting everywhere!

Zhoyzu

took long enough

Kusagari

Okay, i can understand the explanation of diminishing returns for deconstructing an item higher than your characters level. I can not understand the logic of basing it on character level since crafting an item is not based on characters level.
On the flip side of that coin, why are there no increasing returns for deconstruction an item below your level? It is only logical, using your explanation that being above the items level would give you a better chance of getting the highest percentage of base materials needed to make the item back from the item.

Elsonso

@ZOS_JasonLeavey If you could pass along a suggestion to the team. If a deconstruct will result in nothing, have some sort of UI indication in advance so we know not to try to deconstruct it. I am thinking something like the red used for items we cannot equip because of level.

Divinius

lordrichter wrote: »

@ZOS_JasonLeavey If you could pass along a suggestion to the team. If a deconstruct will result in nothing, have some sort of UI indication in advance so we know not to try to deconstruct it. I am thinking something like the red used for items we cannot equip because of level.

As long as you are still allowed to deconstruct it anyway, since many people use the IP gained from deconstructing to level the craft, and wouldn't necessarily care that they won't get any mats from it.

undctiatc

This is simple. If I can create an item of a certain level, I surely must know what materials are used to create that item. If I know what goes into it, I surely must know what I get out of it.

Heishi

d.crosgrove_ESO wrote: »

Siliconhobbit_ESO wrote: »

Deconstructing, and the items you recover from that process, is tied to your character level, not your crafting level.

Thus, deconstructing items that are higher level then you will result in less material returned, and often times none at all if the level of the item is much greater then your own character level. In essence, if you cannot personally USE that item, do not expect to get materials back from that items deconstruction.

It's always been this way.

Wrong. I played every beta weekend, and was in the game during the entire early access. My launcher still reads beta. And let me state this perfectly clear, the game, up until today, has NEVER cared about character level. I would usually get something out of deconstructing. (Aside from skill gains, which when you hit level 50, are zero.)

As of right now, the game makes no sense--my character can make a VR7 item using VR7 mats, but because she is only level 24, she cannot break down a VR7 item and get anything out of it?

My crafting character, which was created 20 minutes after the servers opened up an hour early, has just become worthless.

This needs to be fixed fast.

I have to agree with the mod, to a degree. I played every Beta weekend and all through early access as well (940hrs 36min according to Raptr). My crafter was lv 22 though (now up to 30 because I finally decided to start leveling.

What I experienced was that for my Lv22 crafter, anything I deconstructed over lv 35-40 I could get trait stones, resins, and style stones but I wouldn't get any actual materials.

I ended up getting around this by having my high lvl characters breakdown white items. This has always been based on character lvl. I'm not going to pull out articles and all that, but there has been studies figuring this out and has been a source of conversation since the beginning.

I do agree this never should have been the case. Using character level as the basis for deconstructing doesn't make sense. If you recall in the beginning they were also not so subtly pushing that they didn't want people to have one do it all crafter. This is why they made the research time so incredible long, as well as the char lv implementation.

People have railed against this pretty hard and slowly it's been whittled down a bit. News that they are finally changing this is great.

Goibot

ZOS_JasonLeavey wrote: »

Hey there, everyone. We wanted to provide some clarity on the deconstructing issue described in this thread. Previously, if your character’s level was not as high as the item you were deconstructing, you would receive an increasing penalty, which would potentially reduce the amount of material you’d get from deconstructing the item – this would depend on how far below your character level was compared to the item itself. However, there was no clear indication that this was the case.

In Update 4, we added an error message that now appears providing that information -- no change was actually made to the mechanic itself. However, based on your feedback, our team is going to change this in a future update so that we’ll check your passive skill rank level in addition to your character level, using whichever is higher to help give you the full deconstruct credit easier. As always, thanks so much for your feedback on this issue, and for helping us to improve the game.

@ZOS_JasonLeavey How will this work? I don't even see this as a doable fix?
If I am a level 10 adventurer and a level50 crafter deconstructing a VR14 item Will there be any penalty for the 14 level difference? What happens in the future when they raise the cap to V16? V18? V20? etc....

Taleof2Cities

Goibot wrote: »

@ZOS_JasonLeavey How will this work? I don't even see this as a doable fix?
If I am a level 10 adventurer and a level50 crafter deconstructing a VR14 item Will there be any penalty for the 14 level difference? What happens in the future when they raise the cap to V16? V18? V20? etc....

ZOSJason said the devs are working on it ... so by acknowledging it, and saying action steps will be taken, that's a pretty good response already. Having the forum community micro-manage the fix into VR20 is probably asking a bit much right now ... especially with the VR levels soon to be replaced with the Champion system.

However, a key post in this thread appears to have been missed (or read and not responded to).

stefan.gustavsonb16_ESO wrote: »

Saying your character is now worthless is an overstatement. Are you really completely dependent on deconstruction as your only source for base raw materials? It's not as if farming for materials is difficult.

There are so many outlets for materials (guilds, guild stores, using an alt, trading with other players, or just simply farming) that I'm not sure why there is still an urgency to have this fixed yesterday.

Divinius

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

There are so many outlets for materials (guilds, guild stores, using an alt, trading with other players, or just simply farming) that I'm not sure why there is still an urgency to have this fixed yesterday.

Especially since it's been "broken" forever, and most people didn't even realize it until ZOS added the message letting us know.

zhevon

Divinius wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

There are so many outlets for materials (guilds, guild stores, using an alt, trading with other players, or just simply farming) that I'm not sure why there is still an urgency to have this fixed yesterday.

Especially since it's been "broken" forever, and most people didn't even realize it until ZOS added the message letting us know.

I am not convinced it was totally broken forever, at one point I had gotten some high level materials while deconstructing on a lower level character.

silverbow25

Am I the only person that thinks something that limits your ability to get materials and stuff is not necessarily a bad thing? I agree that there is a problem but I think the main problem is that the notification says "your skill level is not high enough" when actually it's your player level. This causes people to waste a lot of stuff trying to level their skill level high enough when it will never be high enough.

I do not necessarily think that it's a good idea for us to keep making it easier and easier to get all these mats. Aren't we going to be the same people complaining that none of our hard-earned materials are worth anything to anyone because the market is flooded with them? Oh wait, it's already like that. I'm all for limiting the acquisition of crafting materials in general any way that seems logical. I think we need to stop complaining about things that are going to impart changes that will cause us more problems down the road. The rarer this stuff is the more valuable it is, and it will help out the in-game economy a lot in my opinion.

Currently raw materials are the only materials with value. The refined materials have barely any more value than their vendor value. Why are we complaining about not getting more of the items that are currently flooding the market to the point of extreme devaluation?

Geralt_of_Aalst

ZOS_JasonLeavey wrote: »

(...) based on your feedback, our team is going to change this in a future update so that we’ll check your passive skill rank level in addition to your character level, using whichever is higher to help give you the full deconstruct credit easier. As always, thanks so much for your feedback on this issue, and for helping us to improve the game.

Almost a year later this has not changed yet, even though it was announced by ZOS in this thread
PS yes necro but precisely to make a point that it has been a year since the promise to change it for us...

Divinius

Geralt_of_Aalst wrote: »

ZOS_JasonLeavey wrote: »

(...) based on your feedback, our team is going to change this in a future update so that we’ll check your passive skill rank level in addition to your character level, using whichever is higher to help give you the full deconstruct credit easier. As always, thanks so much for your feedback on this issue, and for helping us to improve the game.

Almost a year later this has not changed yet, even though it was announced by ZOS in this thread
PS yes necro but precisely to make a point that it has been a year since the promise to change it for us...

Uh, I'm pretty sure that they did, in fact, change this.

EDIT:
Just found it. From the 1.5.2 Patch Notes...

You will no longer receive deconstruction penalties when your skill rank in a corresponding tradeskill is high enough to craft with the material in question.

chevalierknight

DBHAShadow wrote: »

Siliconhobbit_ESO wrote: »

Deconstructing, and the items you recover from that process, is tied to your character level, not your crafting level.

Thus, deconstructing items that are higher level then you will result in less material returned, and often times none at all if the level of the item is much greater then your own character level. In essence, if you cannot personally USE that item, do not expect to get materials back from that items deconstruction.

It's always been this way.

Not true, up until this patch, I've been deconstructing perfectly fine, I have never received that message, I use my alt to make my light pieces for my VR main, I leveled to that level of woodworking and tailoring by deconstruction. I wouldn't have as huge of a surplus of clothing and woodworking mats if this was true. It's based on crafting level and number of skill points placed.

I do the same

chevalierknight

Divinius wrote: »

Geralt_of_Aalst wrote: »

ZOS_JasonLeavey wrote: »

(...) based on your feedback, our team is going to change this in a future update so that we’ll check your passive skill rank level in addition to your character level, using whichever is higher to help give you the full deconstruct credit easier. As always, thanks so much for your feedback on this issue, and for helping us to improve the game.

Almost a year later this has not changed yet, even though it was announced by ZOS in this thread
PS yes necro but precisely to make a point that it has been a year since the promise to change it for us...

Uh, I'm pretty sure that they did, in fact, change this.

EDIT:
Just found it. From the 1.5.2 Patch Notes...

You will no longer receive deconstruction penalties when your skill rank in a corresponding tradeskill is high enough to craft with the material in question.

Wow didnt see narco they really need to start punishing them

NordJitsu

ZOS_JasonLeavey wrote: »

Hey there, everyone. We wanted to provide some clarity on the deconstructing issue described in this thread. Previously, if your character’s level was not as high as the item you were deconstructing, you would receive an increasing penalty, which would potentially reduce the amount of material you’d get from deconstructing the item – this would depend on how far below your character level was compared to the item itself. However, there was no clear indication that this was the case.

In Update 4, we added an error message that now appears providing that information -- no change was actually made to the mechanic itself. However, based on your feedback, our team is going to change this in a future update so that we’ll check your passive skill rank level in addition to your character level, using whichever is higher to help give you the full deconstruct credit easier. As always, thanks so much for your feedback on this issue, and for helping us to improve the game.

@ZOS_JasonLeavey

Any timetable on a fix?

This issue is preventing me from putting time into leveling my alt while I wait for a solution. His inventory is full of gear to decon and until he's able to decon I don't want to quest with him and add more loot.


EDIT:

Saw the above patch note. Can someone explain HOW it works? I still get this message despite being nearly max level in Woodworking and Blacksmithing.

Divinius

NordJitsu wrote: »

Saw the above patch note. Can someone explain HOW it works? I still get this message despite being nearly max level in Woodworking and Blacksmithing.

Do you have points in the Woodworking and Metalworking passives?

I don't think it's tied to the skill's level, but instead tied to the passive that you put points into that determines what level of material you can craft. So if you are Blacksmithing 50, but don't have any points into Metalworking (so you can only craft using Iron) they you won't get mats from anything other than Iron.

Basically, if you have put enough points into the passive so that you can craft items from a given materiel level, then you can get mats when deconstructing items made from that material. This is now true regardless of your characters level.

But just as before, you can also get mats if your character's level is high enough to use items made from that material, regardless of what your skill level (or the points in the passive) in the craft is.

Bottom Line:
If you are high enough character level to use the item you are deconstructing OR you have enough points in the craft's passive skill to allow you to make the item you are deconstructing, then you should be able to get mats from it, and not get the message.

NordJitsu

Gotcha, it's based on the first crafting passive then. I thought it might be based on the decon passive so that's where I put the points.