This week's polearm post

Lynx7386

We still need them, and the sooner the better.

I had another interesting idea about differentiating the polearm skill line from other weapon types, in that it would have two subweapon types: Polearms and Battlestaffs, similar to how 2handed has battleaxe / greatsword / maul.

However, this setup would make each ability in the polearm tree dual-purpose. If you've got a polearm equipped, the abilities in the tree cost stamina and have more physical-oriented effects. If you have a battlestaff equipped, the abilities in the tree cost magicka and have more spell-oriented effects.

Some ideas for abilities:

Low Sweep
Damage and knock down nearby enemies.
With a polearm equipped, enemies bleed for X damage over 10 seconds.
With a battlestaff equipped, enemies take X magic damage.

Spinning Strike
A radial attack that damages all enemies around you.
With a polearm equipped, enemies are knocked back 5 meters and disoriented for 2 seconds.
With a battlestaff equipped, you create a vortex that pulls enemies closer and then detonates for X magic damage.

Javelin
Throw your weapon at a distant enemy dealing heavy physical damage.
With a polearm equipped, activating the ability a second time causes you to charge towards the target, dealing damage to any enemies in your path.
With a battlestaff equipped, activating the ability a second time causes you to teleport to the target, gaining a damage bonus on your next attack.

Deflection
For 30 seconds, while you are blocking you gain increased armor, spell resistance, and all attacks have a chance to miss you.
With a polearm equipped, you will automatically counter-attack melee attackers, dealing X physical damage.
With a battlestaff equipped, you will reflect negative single-target spells back at their casters.

impale
A powerful stab against a single target. Deals 300% increased damage to targets below 25% health.
With a polearm equipped, reduce the target's armor by 50% for 10 seconds.
With a battlestaff equipped, regain magicka when hitting targets below 25% health.



This kind of dual-purpose weapon, with the same skill tree having different effects based on the type of subweapon used, would greatly encourage hybrid builds. Imagine using a polearm on one weapon bar and a battlestaff on the other - you essentially have completely different attacks with each weapon bar and they function off of different resources.

milesrodneymcneely2_ESO

We need polearms.

And Hand-to-Hand.

Please, ZOS. Got some Daedra that need to be speared in the gut and kicked in the FAAAAAAAAACE!!!

Nox_Aeterna

I dont wont even suggest how the skills should work , i just want the weapon option.

I picked templar pretty much only for the spear skill line.

david.haypreub18_ESO

Another vote for spears!

Zenimax, please fire Sheogorath from your development team and put an end to the madness.

Give us our spears!

Crisscross

As long as there's one handed spears too please.

smeeprocketnub19_ESO

two-handed spears/polearms aren't really meant for 1v1 melee though.

Amsel_McKay

Templars already have spears...

Mr.Turtlesworth

Yes pls.

david.haypreub18_ESO

Crisscross wrote: »

As long as there's one handed spears too please.

Let's be totally Oprah about this. "You get a spear! And you get a spear! EVERYBODY GETS A SPEAR!"

Artemiisia

I want trowing knifes

Istyar

Pretty good post! I would love to use it

Nox_Aeterna

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

two-handed spears/polearms aren't really meant for 1v1 melee though.

There are many kinds of spears.

Many of them are made for that and would give the user a huge advantage against something like a sword for example.

Lynx7386

two-handed spears/polearms aren't really meant for 1v1 melee though.

How often do you find yourself fighting one enemy at a time in this game?

Polearms are excellent weapons for fighting off multiple attackers. They're designed for sweeping area attacks.

Not to mention that a weapon with a polearm's reach would be so much more effective against large daedroth and gargoyles and trolls than a short sword would.

Templars already have spears...

No, they dont, they have cheap glowing stick knockoffs of spears, and they're not even close to a proper polearm weapon.

Heishi

As cool as it is that you made a whole skill line (that I won't get into). Even if said items were brought into game, which is reasonable, they would still fall under 1h/2h and subject to the same skill line not an entirely new one.

smeeprocketnub19_ESO

Lynx7386 wrote: »

show previous quotes

two-handed spears/polearms aren't really meant for 1v1 melee though.

How often do you find yourself fighting one enemy at a time in this game?

Polearms are excellent weapons for fighting off multiple attackers. They're designed for sweeping area attacks.

Not to mention that a weapon with a polearm's reach would be so much more effective against large daedroth and gargoyles and trolls than a short sword would.

show previous quotes

Templars already have spears...

No, they dont, they have cheap glowing stick knockoffs of spears, and they're not even close to a proper polearm weapon.

What I mean is that many of them, mostly polearms, less spears, were used in units. Multiple people in battle formation wielding poleaxes and what not. Or against Calvary, and what have you.

Lynx7386

You could say the same thing about sword and shield formations.

Two handed axes and swords and mauls were rarely used in real-world combat, and only by unconventional combatants.

Turelus

This was asked in a recent podcast interview and they said they have no plans at this time to add any more weapon systems.

Looks like you're going to be in for a much longer wait for them.

dsalter

Lynx7386 wrote: »

stuff

nice idea's but battlestaffs would be the new dress and stick build with those abilities

Tabbycat

I am not sure why but the title of this thread made me think of this:

Seamus

semp3rfi

I picked templar soley for the spear aswell.

I would like to see 1h spear with shield, 2 handed polearm and a ranged weapon javelin which could essential use the bow skills with different animations

NorthernFury

I'd rather see them fix the balance for stamina-based skills, first

Flexar

Artemiisia wrote: »

I want trowing knifes

Dual Wielding gives you a throwing knife skill.

I'd like to see spears and other polearms implemented, but I'd rather they were just classified as two-handed weapons as opposed to seeing an entirely new skill line for polearms.

NorthernFury

Lynx7386 wrote: »

You could say the same thing about sword and shield formations.

Two handed axes and swords and mauls were rarely used in real-world combat, and only by unconventional combatants.

There were some awesomely skilled individuals that did, though.....I think back to the account of the Viking at Stamford Bridge in 1066.....he was said to have held the Saxon army to a standstill by himself, and killed over 40 enemy soldiers using a Dane axe.

If they worked like they work in combat re-enactment, they are great for certain applications, like breaking the edge of a shield wall, or stopping a breach in your own. The power of a 2 handed weapon definetly had it's uses

Lynx7386

There were some awesomely skilled individuals that did, though.....I think back to the account of the Viking at Stamford Bridge in 1066.....he was said to have held the Saxon army to a standstill by himself, and killed over 40 enemy soldiers using a Dane axe.

Probably exagerrated, but you can find the same stories regarding polearms, sword and shield, or any other weapon.

"Legendary" polearms used in history are more relegated to pre-medieval civilizations such as ancient greece, sparta, persia, sumeria, so on and so forth.

Probably some of the most notable in mythology were Zeus' lightning spear/javelin and Poseidon's trident. Lugh, the irish sun god, had a blazing spear as his weapon. Even the norse god Odin used Gungnir, a magic spear.



The mistake everyone makes here is that they think polearms and spears have to be 15 foot pikes that would be useless in close combat, and that's about as far from the truth as you can get. Common polearms are no more than 8 feet long, and many were shorter at 5 or 6 feet. The chinese po-dao had a stave section roughly 4 feet long with a 2 foot broadsword blade affixed to it. A similar weapon was the Japanese Nagamaki, which was essentially a sword with an extra long handle (about equal to the length of the blade, 2-3 feet). Both weapons allowed infantry to fight well enough in close quarters, fend off attacks with the haft of the weapon, have the advantage of reach when thrusting or slicing at someone using a standard sword or other short weapon, and they were effective at cutting down mounted cavalry in a charge.

Polearms of any type give the advantage of reach and leverage when attacking, the advantage of a larger deflecting surface when parrying, and overall greater balance than a sword, axe, hammer, or similar weapon. The one and only disadvantage of a polearm is at extreme close quarters combat, where a smaller weapon can out-maneuver you - however, that disadvantage can be lessened, especially in one on one combat, through techniques to keep an opponent at a distance.

Birfreben_Kinghelred

They shouldn't make a new skill line for this, just add them to two handed and make them give crit chance through heavy weapons passive. Like daggers do for dual wield.

Lynx7386

Birfreben_Kinghelred wrote: »

They shouldn't make a new skill line for this, just add them to two handed and make them give crit chance through heavy weapons passive. Like daggers do for dual wield.

That's an option, but not a very good one. Right now, all 2handed weapons use the same grip points and the same animations. That goes for all 1handed weapons when using shield or dual wield as well. With the 1handed weapons in particular you get animation issues where you're "stabbing' with blunt weapons.

Polearms require a different stance, different grip points, and different attack animations than 2handed weapons use.

Dayel

Pole arms are unwieldy, difficult to handle in melee and range sensitive. Unless you are going the WoW route with bows of allowing you to shoot a person one inch in front of you, it would be better to skip them. Also they are aesthetically weird looking when you are trying to be pretty.

Lynx7386

I love how ZOS decides to close my thread that has the really detailed explanation and leaves this one open.

Unless you are going the WoW route with bows of allowing you to shoot a person one inch in front of you, it would be better to skip them.

Uh, in case you hadnt noticed, you CAN shoot people at point blank range with bows in this game. Staffs too.

Tremulous

milesrodneymcneely2_ESO wrote: »

We need polearms.

And Hand-to-Hand.

Please, ZOS. Got some Daedra that need to be speared in the gut and kicked in the FAAAAAAAAACE!!!

milesrodneymcneely2_ESO wrote: »

We need polearms.

And Hand-to-Hand.

Please, ZOS. Got some Daedra that need to be speared in the gut and kicked in the FAAAAAAAAACE!!!

I was running a dungeon yesterday and my weapons glitch (Dual Wielding) and I was just punching stuff.

AngryWolf

How about a nunchuck tree?!?

NorthernFury

Lynx7386 wrote: »

show previous quotes

There were some awesomely skilled individuals that did, though.....I think back to the account of the Viking at Stamford Bridge in 1066.....he was said to have held the Saxon army to a standstill by himself, and killed over 40 enemy soldiers using a Dane axe.

Probably exagerrated, but you can find the same stories regarding polearms, sword and shield, or any other weapon.

"Legendary" polearms used in history are more relegated to pre-medieval civilizations such as ancient greece, sparta, persia, sumeria, so on and so forth.

Probably some of the most notable in mythology were Zeus' lightning spear/javelin and Poseidon's trident. Lugh, the irish sun god, had a blazing spear as his weapon. Even the norse god Odin used Gungnir, a magic spear.



The mistake everyone makes here is that they think polearms and spears have to be 15 foot pikes that would be useless in close combat, and that's about as far from the truth as you can get. Common polearms are no more than 8 feet long, and many were shorter at 5 or 6 feet. The chinese po-dao had a stave section roughly 4 feet long with a 2 foot broadsword blade affixed to it. A similar weapon was the Japanese Nagamaki, which was essentially a sword with an extra long handle (about equal to the length of the blade, 2-3 feet). Both weapons allowed infantry to fight well enough in close quarters, fend off attacks with the haft of the weapon, have the advantage of reach when thrusting or slicing at someone using a standard sword or other short weapon, and they were effective at cutting down mounted cavalry in a charge.

Polearms of any type give the advantage of reach and leverage when attacking, the advantage of a larger deflecting surface when parrying, and overall greater balance than a sword, axe, hammer, or similar weapon. The one and only disadvantage of a polearm is at extreme close quarters combat, where a smaller weapon can out-maneuver you - however, that disadvantage can be lessened, especially in one on one combat, through techniques to keep an opponent at a distance.

Definetly love using a 7'-7.5' glaive as a personal preference. Good all-around length and weight, you can blast people over the top of the shield wall with it, yank shields out of people's hands, and overall brutalize people breaking through your wall. And still small enough to avoid getting tangled up most of the time