DK Scales! - Reversing My Position

Vis

I must officially reverse my position on "No More Nerfs."

DK scales spam have reached new epic proportions. We all knew the skill was OP, but I was alright with it because it was rare to run into a DK who spammed it continuously ....

However, the cat is now out of the bag.

Every DK worth anything now has Scales up 100% of the time in every fight. And why not? It costs almost the same as bolt (with no cd penalties) and effectively removes more than 80% of all dps skills.

Scales can reflect all single target spells, arrows, and even thrown daggers. It's AMAZING!

AND it's dirt cheap. If only the majority of us took a look at how little magicka scales costs, there would be a mob.

What are we supposed to do?

Use aoes at melee range (against a DK, good luck)?
Hope a DK is dumb enough to stand in a ground effect?
Pull out our stamina melee builds (hahahahahaha)?
Use any of the 3-4 skills that are very low in dps?

1.) You created a class that can effectively dps as high as any other (talons/whip)
2.) Tank like a god (green dragon blood)
3.) AND reflect the majority of all dps skills against ALL players in a fight

Yes, I could very slowly burn down a DK with my low dps aoe/melee skills IF he did not have the best self heal in game and ONLY IF he did not have the means to kill me in a 10th of the time.

If you are a DK who has lost a 1v1 ... you are way behind your fellow brothers.

I don't blame the many people now re-rolling DKs, it would be stupid not to.

Did I miss something here?

ZOS, DO YOU PLAY YOUR OWN GAME???

Brace yourselves, DKs who want to protect their ez-mode are coming ...

hk11

It sounds like you might have died.

Vis

hk11 wrote: »

It sounds like you might have died.

Yes, to many noob DKs who never deserved to live.

yodased

This game honestly needs global cooldowns in PvP.

Reflect is the only thing they HAVEN'T taken away from my epeen, please let me keep it.

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO

Oh so people are countering the current fotm dress/staves and you want to nerf the counter?
K

Vis

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

Oh so people are countering the current fotm dress/staves and you want to nerf the counter?
K

The fotm dress/staves DKs spam it too. Duh.

In fact, it is a favorite of the fotm dress/staves DKs.

It would be a fair counter if all classes had it.

Cody

lol. guess that explains why I would see one take hits from 5-7 different people, and their health barley nudge. Don't listen to the other ppl here, trying to defend it. They just want their easy god mode ability to stay

demonlkojipub19_ESO

i think the certain dks who can block forever are worse. They dont even need scales, you cant kill them in a 1 on 1.

And scales lasts 4 seconds and doesnt even reflect all magic.

yyiri

You forgot Syrabane

Aeratus

demonlkojipub19_ESO wrote: »

i think the certain dks who can block forever are worse. They dont even need scales, you cant kill them in a 1 on 1.

And scales lasts 4 seconds and doesnt even reflect all magic.

DKs who just block aren't a problem because is a tactic common to all classes. On the other hand, scales is not.

SienneYviete

Harness magicka + Dragon fire scale = Win

yodased

Harness magicka + Dragon fire scale + Green dragon blood + immovable = unkillable

+ Talons & standard and boom headshot

+ sea of flames + molten whip = aoe headshot

NobleX35

420 magicka is not cheap...that's almost as much as dragons blood. The cost issue is a light armor passive imbalance not a skill imbalance.

Your rant is also completely filled with incorrect information. Scales only reflects projectile RANGED abilities which like you said includes bow skills & dagger throw, and all ranged projectile single target spells. Also the skill consumes more magicka when you do actually reflect something, not sure the rate/percentage, but I think it's about 5% of your total pool? On top of all that, it has an incredibly short duration of 4 seconds...so if someone is spamming it and constantly deflectin then they will be out of magicka in a hurry.

The skill does absolutely nothing to melee based magicka skills and melee based stamina based skill...

yodased

Lol defense!!!

DRAGON FIRE SCALE I
Cast Time Instant
Target Self
Duration 4 seconds
Cost 49 Magicka
Reflects all projectiles for 4 seconds. Reflected attacks deal 20% additional damage.
New Effect:
Increases damage of reflected attacks.

HARNESS MAGICKA I
Cast Time Instant
Target Self
Duration 20 seconds
Cost 60 Stamina
Creates 3 point damage shield for 20 seconds. Player takes -50% less damage from spells while shield holds. Restores Magicka each time player absorbs Spell Damage. This value is increased by 3% for each piece of Light Armor equipped. Current bonus: 3%.
New Effect:
Absorb magicka based on amount of light armor equipped

DEFENSIVE STANCE I
Cast Time Instant
Target Self
Duration 30 seconds
Cost 32 Stamina
Reflects next spell projectile back at attacker and stuns them for 2 seconds when activated. Increases Block mitigation by 8% and reduces Block cost by 8% when slotted.
New Effect:
Reflected attacks stun enemy caster.

IMMOVABLE I
Cast Time Instant
Target Self
Duration 8 seconds
Cost 56 Stamina
Increases Armor and Spell Resistance by 17 for 8 seconds. Grants immunity to knockback and disabling effects for the duration.

RING OF PRESERVATION I
Cast Time Instant
Target Area
Radius 5 meters
Duration 20 seconds
Cost 35 Stamina
Creates an area of protection for 20 seconds. Nearby allies have Armor and Spell Resistance increased by 10 and Health Recovery increased by 25%. Armor and Spell Resistance increased by an additional 10 against undead and Daedric enemies.

Xsorus

Wait till you guys figure out Blazing Shield is the exact same thing as Reflective Scales, only it works on Melee.

Falmer

I will say one thing. ESO is the perfect example of why PvP skills and abilities should be kept completely separate from PvE portion.

I think they should just simple disable ALL skills and abilities in PvP. You get your light and heavy attacks... That's it. Of course, there will probably still be crying.

ferzalrwb17_ESO

The skill is fine as intented but it should do what the tooltip says and reflect magic projectiles. Currently it reflects arrow skills and thrown daggers which is, of course, bonkers. Reflecting stuff like other DK chains is a bit of a grey area - they are magicka skills after all but stamina abilities should not be reflected.

It's not WAI (if you believe the tooltip and think slightly rationally) in that sense. Otherwise it's just a very good skill you have to be aware of. If the DK is spamming it AND hitting dragonblood they're going to have limited DPS options. So don't kill yourself on it.

At some point when I trust Zeni to make changes again I'd like to see it fixed to WAI but certainly not nerfed.

yodased

huh? No its not. Edit* I see you are saying its the same thing for Melee chars. but who cares, who is using melee in pvp?

BLAZING SHIELD I
Cast Time Instant
Target Self
Duration 6 seconds
Cost 42 Magicka
Creates damage shield for 30% Max Health that lasts 6 seconds. Each nearby target increases shield strength by 4%.Returns 50% of damage taken to nearby enemies when effect ends. You will not regenerate Magicka while the shield is active.
New Effect:
Deals damage when shield ends based on damage absorbed.

its aoe dmg on breaking of shield. This is ONLY for melee

dastone

I am a night blade I have Blurr 15 percent chance for hits to be missed.

Wait. What. 120 percent damage shield on all most all ranged attacks

Why do I feel like I am sitting at the little kids table during thanksgiving

danno8

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

Wait till you guys figure out Blazing Shield is the exact same thing as Reflective Scales, only it works on Melee.

Uhh not quite. Blazing Shield has a tonne of conditions attached to it. It stops you magicka regen (horrible for a Templar), It is 30% of max health (so even with 3000 health you would get a 900 damage shield), it only returns 50% of damage absorbed on expiry (so again 50% X 900 = 450 damage).

melodeath

not trying to defend this.. but the only reason dk's can spam/keep it up is because of "noobs" that keep casting at them while they have syrabane set...

the set gives you magica everytime you reflect a spell.. so, its not really the abilitty but more the ability with the set bonus on top of people that keep feeding the dk magica with it.

dastone

Wait you guys miss my post? I am a night blade my equivalent ability is Blurr. Perhaps you don't understand all I have to do is slott this bad boy and cast it and you will miss me doing no damage at all 15 percent of the time. Yeah no fooling
If you try to hit me you will miss 3 times out of 20

Afraid now I see you might want to think twice before you attack me with skills like that.

Come on let us hear Nerf Blurr chants only chance you noobs have

yodased

Nerf Blurr!

Erock25

melodeath wrote: »

not trying to defend this.. but the only reason dk's can spam/keep it up is because of "noobs" that keep casting at them while they have syrabane set...

the set gives you magica everytime you reflect a spell.. so, its not really the abilitty but more the ability with the set bonus on top of people that keep feeding the dk magica with it.

You would think that but watch this video ....

That guy isn't even wearing Syrabane.

This Reflective Scale spell is ridiculous and needs to go.

Bashev

This skill might be OP but currently it is not. If you do not know why please dig some info.

Vis

melodeath wrote: »

not trying to defend this.. but the only reason dk's can spam/keep it up is because of "noobs" that keep casting at them while they have syrabane set...

the set gives you magica everytime you reflect a spell.. so, its not really the abilitty but more the ability with the set bonus on top of people that keep feeding the dk magica with it.

You see, that is the point I am trying to make.

It costs between 250-350 magicka for LA DKs to use. That means it is easily spammable even without the set. The same people who accused sorcs of "spamming bolt forever" are now silent on DK scales despite the fact it has nearly the same cost.

Vis

Bashev wrote: »

This skill might be OP but currently it is not. If you do not know why please dig some info.

It is true there is a cost bug, but even then the ability to negate all inc damage while issuing it back at the caster makes is worthy of spam. Any DK with the syrbane set (and many do have it) already have countered the bug. So, it's OP still.

Vis

yodased wrote: »

huh? No its not. Edit* I see you are saying its the same thing for Melee chars. but who cares, who is using melee in pvp?

Another underlying reason why DK scales is so much more powerful than even the craziest dev intended.

Vis

ferzalrwb17_ESO wrote: »

The skill is fine as intented but it should do what the tooltip says and reflect magic projectiles. Currently it reflects arrow skills and thrown daggers which is, of course, bonkers. Reflecting stuff like other DK chains is a bit of a grey area - they are magicka skills after all but stamina abilities should not be reflected.

It's not WAI (if you believe the tooltip and think slightly rationally) in that sense. Otherwise it's just a very good skill you have to be aware of. If the DK is spamming it AND hitting dragonblood they're going to have limited DPS options. So don't kill yourself on it.

At some point when I trust Zeni to make changes again I'd like to see it fixed to WAI but certainly not nerfed.

That's the issue, they do not have limited dps options. Look at the cost of scales.

Perphection

Vis wrote: »

ZOS, DO YOU PLAY YOUR OWN GAME???

I often wonder that too. I don't see how they possibly could, if they had been playing maybe they would have pushed the PC release back 6 months too.

Snit

I would like to know if any sorcerers are able to kill well played DK's more than, say, 10% of the time in a one-on-one. To be clear, I mean at geared-up V12, and nobody started out on their horse And let's also assume nobody's a moron (e.g., the sorc isn't spamming a hardcast CF). Here are the issues, from the sorc's point of view:

- DK's heal, so you need to burst them down
- DK's reflect both of the nukes we might load, Crystal Fragments or Crushing Shock. They also reflect Destro Staff attacks (the heavy attack can do significant damage)
- Velocious Curse, Resto staff attacks and Endless Fury can not be reflected, but those two together won't burst enough to kill anyone at their keyboard

I'm all for Rock-Paper-Scissors (or Shotgun, or even Lizard-Spock). I can wreck badly played DK's. But a good one is darn near impossible, and I'm definining good solely as "Has Reflecting Scale on their bar and uses it frequently." DK's have a pretty amazing combination of defense and offense.

The best answer I have found is to just run.