biggest miss in new patch 1.2.3

crislevin

with numerous changes to skills and morphs, and they offer no skill points refund or free respec?

surely a sneaky gold sink if you ask me.

tordr86b16_ESO

i guess their goal is to push people even further away from their game.

Phinix1

Because 10-20k is serious when I have over 200k from basically quest rewards and item vendoring at Veteran level 5.

Oh no, FTP in 10...

crislevin

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

Because 10-20k is serious when I have over 200k from basically quest rewards and item vendoring at Veteran level 5.

Oh no, FTP in 10...

how lucky you have 200K! now stop assuming everybody is filthy rich as you.

Maverick827

Yeah, really disappointed with the lack of a free respec/reduction of the cost of respecs.

What people often don't see is that gold = time and time = money. The time it takes to earn gold is time that you pay them to play the game. It's the entire point of gold sinks: artificially increasing the time it takes to complete objectives.

This patch is basically saying "We fixed a lot of the balance issues that you've been waiting 3+ months for, but you need to pay $2 to take advantage of them."

nerevarine1138

Find a VR racial motif. That will happen naturally if you just search containers while you quest. Sell that motif. Now you can respec.

fromtesonlineb16_ESO

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Find a VR racial motif. That will happen naturally if you just search containers while you quest. Sell that motif. Now you can respec.

If the nerfbat hadn't been taken to these things they'd not be so valuable, as they shouldn't be.

nerevarine1138

fromtesonlineb16_ESO wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Find a VR racial motif. That will happen naturally if you just search containers while you quest. Sell that motif. Now you can respec.

If the nerfbat hadn't been taken to these things they'd not be so valuable, as they shouldn't be.

They're actually very reasonably priced (with the potential exception of Imperial, but that's supposed to be insanely hard to find), and I've found 3 Daedric motifs while leveling from VR6-VR10. It's not that hard. It's also not that hard to earn gold through questing, delving, crafting, etc. I don't even concentrate on earning gold, and I find that a few hours of play nets me at least 10k in quest rewards and vendor money, never mind any bonus money I might get for crafting/auctioning other things.

AngryNord

If you ask me they should completely do away With racial motifs, and make you learn other races styles by deconstructing dropped armour/weapon (but you would only learn the style of the item you deconstructed)

Lodestar

crislevin wrote: »

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

Because 10-20k is serious when I have over 200k from basically quest rewards and item vendoring at Veteran level 5.

Oh no, FTP in 10...

how lucky you have 200K! now stop assuming everybody is filthy rich as you.

Yeah, what is with these people, jumping on forums to post things like that, at every opportunity? Is it an excuse for bragging, or just an insular BS comment, that assumes that it is norm for players to have that much money? I am nearly lvl 45, and never had more than 42k on me. Most of my money went on repairs or horse feeds, or bank and inventory space. No idea where people are getting this money, unless they are buying it from those farmers. Someone must be putting them in business.

MW2K

tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »

i guess their goal is to push people even further away from their game.

Yes, that has to be it. There can be no other logical explanation.

nerevarine1138

Lodestar wrote: »

crislevin wrote: »

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

Because 10-20k is serious when I have over 200k from basically quest rewards and item vendoring at Veteran level 5.

Oh no, FTP in 10...

how lucky you have 200K! now stop assuming everybody is filthy rich as you.

Yeah, what is with these people, jumping on forums to post things like that, at every opportunity? Is it an excuse for bragging, or just an insular BS comment, that assumes that it is norm for players to have that much money? I am nearly lvl 45, and never had more than 42k on me. Most of my money went on repairs or horse feeds, or bank and inventory space. No idea where people are getting this money, unless they are buying it from those farmers. Someone must be putting them in business.

The poster you are referring to is VR5. By the time you get to VR, you're mostly out of gold-sinks, and you get more gold for kills/quests/vendoring. And (as mentioned) if you find a single VR motif that you don't want to use, congratulations. That's a minimum of 10k gold in your wallet right there.

Lodestar

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Find a VR racial motif. That will happen naturally if you just search containers while you quest. Sell that motif. Now you can respec.

Only how long do you think that will last? When most people have them, and the prices drop.

What about those of us who are not VR level? What about those who are but, don't care for it and play alts instead?

Ah just realised who I am responding to. Yes, figures.

crislevin

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Lodestar wrote: »

crislevin wrote: »

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

Because 10-20k is serious when I have over 200k from basically quest rewards and item vendoring at Veteran level 5.

Oh no, FTP in 10...

how lucky you have 200K! now stop assuming everybody is filthy rich as you.

Yeah, what is with these people, jumping on forums to post things like that, at every opportunity? Is it an excuse for bragging, or just an insular BS comment, that assumes that it is norm for players to have that much money? I am nearly lvl 45, and never had more than 42k on me. Most of my money went on repairs or horse feeds, or bank and inventory space. No idea where people are getting this money, unless they are buying it from those farmers. Someone must be putting them in business.

The poster you are referring to is VR5. By the time you get to VR, you're mostly out of gold-sinks, and you get more gold for kills/quests/vendoring. And (as mentioned) if you find a single VR motif that you don't want to use, congratulations. That's a minimum of 10k gold in your wallet right there.

right, I am V7, and I have 100k total.

Its gold and time sink however you "interpret" it. Farming motif isn't exactly an instant gratification.

nerevarine1138

Lodestar wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Find a VR racial motif. That will happen naturally if you just search containers while you quest. Sell that motif. Now you can respec.

Only how long do you think that will last? When most people have them, and the prices drop.

What about those of us who are not VR level? What about those who are but, don't care for it and play alts instead?

Ah just realised who I am responding to. Yes, figures.

If you aren't VR level, your respec can't cost 20k yet. There's absolutely no way for you to have 200 skill points before VR content. I performed my only respec at VR8, and it was only 24k (meaning 240 skill points).

Now, if you'd like to actually read my posts instead of making erroneous assumptions because you didn't like what I said in another thread, feel free. There are plenty of opportunities to earn gold if earning gold is an issue for you.

Lodestar

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Lodestar wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Find a VR racial motif. That will happen naturally if you just search containers while you quest. Sell that motif. Now you can respec.

Only how long do you think that will last? When most people have them, and the prices drop.

What about those of us who are not VR level? What about those who are but, don't care for it and play alts instead?

Ah just realised who I am responding to. Yes, figures.

If you aren't VR level, your respec can't cost 20k yet. There's absolutely no way for you to have 200 skill points before VR content. I performed my only respec at VR8, and it was only 24k (meaning 240 skill points).

Now, if you'd like to actually read my posts instead of making erroneous assumptions because you didn't like what I said in another thread, feel free. There are plenty of opportunities to earn gold if earning gold is an issue for you.

Never said my respec was requiring 200k. Who is the one who should be reading posts?

I have read your posts, and in almost all cases you do exactly what you accuse me of doing, while making some snide attempt at cut downs and passive aggressive insults. That is all you come here for.

That and also telling people what can and can't be done in game. But, never once actually backing it up with any context or provenance of any sort. Just this can be done, or that can be done. Well, your assurances mean absolutely squat.

Not that I myself have this problem, but has anyone ever told you it is not the size of it that counts, but what you do with it?

crislevin

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Lodestar wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Find a VR racial motif. That will happen naturally if you just search containers while you quest. Sell that motif. Now you can respec.

Only how long do you think that will last? When most people have them, and the prices drop.

What about those of us who are not VR level? What about those who are but, don't care for it and play alts instead?

Ah just realised who I am responding to. Yes, figures.

If you aren't VR level, your respec can't cost 20k yet. There's absolutely no way for you to have 200 skill points before VR content. I performed my only respec at VR8, and it was only 24k (meaning 240 skill points).

Now, if you'd like to actually read my posts instead of making erroneous assumptions because you didn't like what I said in another thread, feel free. There are plenty of opportunities to earn gold if earning gold is an issue for you.

lol, "ONLY" 24k.

Why don't you go check the game population and see how many people are in normal vs VR zones?

When I went through 1-50, I never have more than 15k, respeccing at level 30-50 easily costs 4-7k.

Yeah, its not 24k, but hey, they don't have a massive bank acc, or a place to farm daedri motif neither.

nerevarine1138

crislevin wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Lodestar wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Find a VR racial motif. That will happen naturally if you just search containers while you quest. Sell that motif. Now you can respec.

Only how long do you think that will last? When most people have them, and the prices drop.

What about those of us who are not VR level? What about those who are but, don't care for it and play alts instead?

Ah just realised who I am responding to. Yes, figures.

If you aren't VR level, your respec can't cost 20k yet. There's absolutely no way for you to have 200 skill points before VR content. I performed my only respec at VR8, and it was only 24k (meaning 240 skill points).

Now, if you'd like to actually read my posts instead of making erroneous assumptions because you didn't like what I said in another thread, feel free. There are plenty of opportunities to earn gold if earning gold is an issue for you.

lol, "ONLY" 24k.

Why don't you go check the game population and see how many people are in normal vs VR zones?

When I went through 1-50, I never have more than 15k, respeccing at level 30-50 easily costs 4-7k.

Yeah, its not 24k, but hey, they don't have a massive bank acc, or a place to farm daedri motif neither.

And respeccing should cost that much. It should be a significant investment if you're going to make that big a change to your character.

This isn't WoW's skill system. You shouldn't need to respec unless you're totally changing your morph choices on multiple abilities or switching crafting specializations.

The point is that there are more than enough ways to earn enough money for a respec at any level you're at. Obviously, lower-level characters can't farm VR motifs, but they don't need to, because their respecs don't cost as much.

crislevin

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

crislevin wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Lodestar wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Find a VR racial motif. That will happen naturally if you just search containers while you quest. Sell that motif. Now you can respec.

Only how long do you think that will last? When most people have them, and the prices drop.

What about those of us who are not VR level? What about those who are but, don't care for it and play alts instead?

Ah just realised who I am responding to. Yes, figures.

If you aren't VR level, your respec can't cost 20k yet. There's absolutely no way for you to have 200 skill points before VR content. I performed my only respec at VR8, and it was only 24k (meaning 240 skill points).

Now, if you'd like to actually read my posts instead of making erroneous assumptions because you didn't like what I said in another thread, feel free. There are plenty of opportunities to earn gold if earning gold is an issue for you.

lol, "ONLY" 24k.

Why don't you go check the game population and see how many people are in normal vs VR zones?

When I went through 1-50, I never have more than 15k, respeccing at level 30-50 easily costs 4-7k.

Yeah, its not 24k, but hey, they don't have a massive bank acc, or a place to farm daedri motif neither.

And respeccing should cost that much. It should be a significant investment if you're going to make that big a change to your character.

BULL

I did NOT change my MIND, DEV changed the SKILL!

which part of that logic don't you understand. Your blind defense of whatever devs do is saddening to say the least.

nerevarine1138

crislevin wrote: »

BULL

I did NOT change my MIND, DEV changed the SKILL!

which part of that logic don't you understand. Your blind defense of whatever devs do is saddening to say the least.

You may notice that I didn't comment on the developers offering or not offering skill point refunds for specific skills that had changes. People turned this into a thread to complain about overall respec prices, which are not unfair.

I happen to think that they should offer refunds (only for the skills that have changed), but that's not what my posts up to this point have been responding to. But you know where I did put that feedback? In the game. There's a /feedback feature that the developers actually read. When the initial 1.2 notes came out, I submitted a feedback form mentioning that skill point refunds didn't appear to be mentioned. I assume people on the PTS did the same (if they agree with me).

Posting another "demand" thread on the forums doesn't generally get anyone's attention except other players. Do you really want to affect change in the game? Write a coherent, measured response to something in the feedback form.

Lodestar

crislevin wrote: »

BULL

I did NOT change my MIND, DEV changed the SKILL!

which part of that logic don't you understand. Your blind defense of whatever devs do is saddening to say the least.

That is actually where I am coming from. Even if I agreed with the respec skill cost (which I don't), the devs are as (per usual), refusing to accept responsibility. This is the stuff that warrants a free respec. Even SWTOR devs agreed on that,. and I sometimes questioned why I was being given a free respec.

crislevin

Lodestar wrote: »

crislevin wrote: »

BULL

I did NOT change my MIND, DEV changed the SKILL!

which part of that logic don't you understand. Your blind defense of whatever devs do is saddening to say the least.

That is actually where I am coming from. Even if I agreed with the respec skill cost (which I don't), the devs are as (per usual), refusing to accept responsibility. This is the stuff that warrants a free respec. Even SWTOR devs agreed on that,. and I sometimes questioned why I was being given a free respec.

now I completely agree. Sadly I don't see a choice here...... this will eventually be detrimental to the community.

yenkin2001b14_ESO

Most games give respec's when they change skill trees. But I think there are enough skill points in the game even if you make small mistake a few skyshards and you are good to go.

crislevin

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

crislevin wrote: »

BULL

I did NOT change my MIND, DEV changed the SKILL!

which part of that logic don't you understand. Your blind defense of whatever devs do is saddening to say the least.

You may notice that I didn't comment on the developers offering or not offering skill point refunds for specific skills that had changes. People turned this into a thread to complain about overall respec prices, which are not unfair.

I happen to think that they should offer refunds (only for the skills that have changed), but that's not what my posts up to this point have been responding to. But you know where I did put that feedback? In the game. There's a /feedback feature that the developers actually read. When the initial 1.2 notes came out, I submitted a feedback form mentioning that skill point refunds didn't appear to be mentioned. I assume people on the PTS did the same (if they agree with me).

Posting another "demand" thread on the forums doesn't generally get anyone's attention except other players. Do you really want to affect change in the game? Write a coherent, measured response to something in the feedback form.

if you want me to believe nobody has done so, for a thousand times, I would suggest you: get real.

crislevin

yenkin2001b14_ESO wrote: »

Most games give respec's when they change skill trees. But I think there are enough skill points in the game even if you make small mistake a few skyshards and you are good to go.

no, skyshard won't help if you need to change a morph.

nerevarine1138

crislevin wrote: »

if you want me to believe nobody has done so, for a thousand times, I would suggest you: get real.

With the number of people who seem to think that posting in all-caps on this forum is the correct way to reach the developers, I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't know how to use the in-game form. And I definitely wouldn't be surprised if they were incapable of writing a coherent sentence in English, much less one that adopts a measured, respectful tone.

The point remains: if you actually want to get your message to the developers, that's the way. The forums are for discussion of the game; public demands only get you validation (or lack thereof) from other players, which has no impact on the game itself.

Rylana

Oh noes the morffffffffff is now 1 percent less deeps

PANIC

onlinegamer1

Respecs should be free, permanently. With a 3 day cooldown.

Aeradon

I'm curious, sure, skill specific resets for the tweaked skills is indeed necessary when they change it.

But to mention it as a gold sink. What can gold do in this game? Bag spaces, mounts, skill resets, soul gems and bam! PVP players no longer need gold for anything. PVE, well, you may need to repair gears, but you do get more gold than PVP.

crislevin

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

crislevin wrote: »

if you want me to believe nobody has done so, for a thousand times, I would suggest you: get real.

The point remains: .

you never had any point, all you have is blindly defend anything dev does, and you have a long posting record of that. Anybody believe otherwise is naive.

Your action may sounds nice to devs, but it only encourages the bad aspect of the game and eventually contribute to the downfall of it. i.e., you are hurting the games in the long run.

ArRashid

I'm VR4 and I have 32k gold. That's enough for one respec (if I wanted it). As for my NB, I'm rather exping a replacement already than paying her for her 4th respec..