Justify bolt escape

semp3rfi

Seems to me that there was poor desiging when it comes to this skill.

How can you justify having a skill that does high mobility teleport, spamable, stun and damage on "HIGHLY LAGGED" PVP areas when no other class has anything as such.

If any other class other than a sorc gets dismounted in an ambush, they have few options, stay and fight or try and use their limited mobility moves. Mages just instantly teleport spam away.

Now in all honesty I would be fine for this move to stay. But it needs to come with some major penalties, OR the other classes need their mobility skills brought inline

For example:

Bolt escape Penalty options.
1: costs a large percentage of max mana say 33%
2: stops mana regeneration, recovery
3: Spells cost considerably more mana with each consecutive cast for 15 seconds.
4: reduces distance travelled by 50% for 5 seconds after taking damage. 5 seconds is reset each time bolt escape is used before the debuff wears off

Could you imagine if night blades recieved the 50% movement buff from path of darkness without actually being on the path?

The skill is a good one, but it needs some serious moderation

ZiRM

Bolt escape needs a buff to do healing to group mates and yourself as well as a magicka use reduction.

Glurin

semp3rfi wrote: »

Seems to me that there was poor desiging when it comes to this skill.

How can you justify having a skill that does high mobility teleport, spamable, stun and damage on "HIGHLY LAGGED" PVP areas when no other class has anything as such.

The damage isn't that great, the cost is high, the stun is blockable and short lived, and the other classes do in fact have mobility skills. NB in particular has a teleport. Plus, in order for BE to do damage, you have to pick the proper morph, which sacrifices the full stun for disorient.

Lag is irrelevant since it affects everybody, sorcerer or not.

semp3rfi wrote: »

If any other class other than a sorc gets dismounted in an ambush, they have few options, stay and fight or try and use their limited mobility moves. Mages just instantly teleport spam away.

Sorcerers have just as many options when dismounted. They suffer the same dismount stun every other class does and are just as vulnerable as anyone else during that time. Probably more so, given that they have fewer combat practical recovery options and are glass cannons if speced such that they actually can spam BE.

semp3rfi wrote: »

Now in all honesty I would be fine for this move to stay. But it needs to come with some major penalties, OR the other classes need their mobility skills brought inline

For example:

Bolt escape Penalty options.
1: costs a large percentage of max mana say 33%
2: stops mana regeneration, recovery
3: Spells cost considerably more mana with each consecutive cast for 15 seconds.

1: Making it horribly useless.
2: Already stops regeneration, or is supposed to as I understand it. Stopping recovery as well makes it worse than horribly useless.
3: Making taking the skill at all gimp your entire character into being utterly worthless in any situation.

semp3rfi wrote: »

Could you imagine if night blades recieved the 50% movement buff from path of darkness without actually being on the path?

Path of darkness already gives NBs greater mobility than BE over long distances.

semp3rfi wrote: »

The skill is a good one, but it needs some serious moderation

You clearly have a very different idea of what "moderation" means.

semp3rfi

Glurin wrote: »

semp3rfi wrote: »

Seems to me that there was poor desiging when it comes to this skill.

How can you justify having a skill that does high mobility teleport, spamable, stun and damage on "HIGHLY LAGGED" PVP areas when no other class has anything as such.

The damage isn't that great, the cost is high, the stun is blockable and short lived, and the other classes do in fact have mobility skills. NB in particular has a teleport. Plus, in order for BE to do damage, you have to pick the proper morph, which sacrifices the full stun for disorient.

Lag is irrelevant since it affects everybody, sorcerer or not.

semp3rfi wrote: »

If any other class other than a sorc gets dismounted in an ambush, they have few options, stay and fight or try and use their limited mobility moves. Mages just instantly teleport spam away.

Sorcerers have just as many options when dismounted. They suffer the same dismount stun every other class does and are just as vulnerable as anyone else during that time. Probably more so, given that they have fewer combat practical recovery options and are glass cannons if speced such that they actually can spam BE.

semp3rfi wrote: »

Now in all honesty I would be fine for this move to stay. But it needs to come with some major penalties, OR the other classes need their mobility skills brought inline

For example:

Bolt escape Penalty options.
1: costs a large percentage of max mana say 33%
2: stops mana regeneration, recovery
3: Spells cost considerably more mana with each consecutive cast for 15 seconds.

1: Making it horribly useless.
2: Already stops regeneration, or is supposed to as I understand it. Stopping recovery as well makes it worse than horribly useless.
3: Making taking the skill at all gimp your entire character into being utterly worthless in any situation.

semp3rfi wrote: »

Could you imagine if night blades recieved the 50% movement buff from path of darkness without actually being on the path?

Path of darkness already gives NBs greater mobility than BE over long distances.

semp3rfi wrote: »

The skill is a good one, but it needs some serious moderation

You clearly have a very different idea of what "moderation" means.

Latency is very relevant to displacement moves such as teleport. the effect is amplified.

If it can be spammed and replenished the entire distance between fortresses without support, its not high cost.

If a sorc survies the dismounting, they teleport spam
if another class survives the dismounting, they pretty much have to fight

NBs have a teleport "to target". not to whereever they please

NBs Higher mobility is only on the path, which is no further than 15 meters. snares reduce this mobility, charges still anchor the NB. charge a teleporting sorc and your charge fizzles

It wouldnt make it uselss even being able to cast this 4 times in a row before depleting would give you a hefty distance. anything more than that is just silly. Chasing sorcs from fortress to fortress is just dumb.

Halrloprillalar

Do you read skill tooltips?
Do you read PTS notes?
Do you realize this is the 902390239th thread on the subject?
Do you think lag somehow doesn't affect sorcs??

semp3rfi

Halrloprillalar wrote: »

Do you read skill tooltips?
Do you read PTS notes?
Do you realize this is the 902390239th thread on the subject?
Do you think lag somehow doesn't affect sorcs??

Read PTS notes? soo, how it could be but isnt?
so many threads? must be a valid concern
lag doesnt effect sorcs? Read "displacement/teleporting effects" throw lag even further out of proportion when it comes to hit detection, skill fizzing.

Im a jackass? sorry to hear that

Teargrants

Justify this thread.

Halrloprillalar

semp3rfi wrote: »

Halrloprillalar wrote: »

Do you read skill tooltips?
Do you read PTS notes?
Do you realize this is the 902390239th thread on the subject?
Do you think lag somehow doesn't affect sorcs??

Read PTS notes? soo, how it could be but isnt?
Not yet, but your loud crying has ZOS' attention, grats

so many threads? must be a valid concern
must be search function fail

lag doesnt effect sorcs? Read "displacement/teleporting effects" throw lag even further out of proportion when it comes to hit detection, skill fizzing.
Have you tried to BE with 10s skill delay? Good luck.

Im a jackass? sorry to hear that
I never said you were one, but you kind of proved it.

nukeyoo

NiRN wrote: »

Bolt escape needs a buff to do healing to group mates and yourself as well as a magicka use reduction.

You're forgetting CC immunity.. It should grant that also.

ishilb14_ESO

Bolt Escape costs me 258 magicka at v12.
When a templar or DK gets dismounted, they can spam heals, when a nightblade gets dismounted he can go invisible. What can a sorc do in this situation besides Bolt Escape out? They can't tank because they can't self heal without channeling for 4 seconds unless they run healing staff, which would be a dumb requirement of sorcs since other classes aren't obliged to always use healing staff.
And oh, lag you say? You know what happens when a sorc gets hit by lag the second they hit Bolt Escape? It eats the cost of the spell up but the character doesn't actually do the Bolt Escape.
So again, like I've said the 3209840238490th time, Bolt Escape is all sorcs have to give them an edge, nerfing it would be like nerfing green dragonblood, that templar self heal, or nightblade's in-combat stealth.

Rosanna_Foxfire

I ran into a VR12 DK tank while questing in Cyrodiil the other day. Nothing I did would dent him. So I had to run, it was the only smart thing to do, flee using Bolt Escape. And I succeeded, very nearly died, but I succeeded.

I can get where it would be frustrating for that tank that he didn't get to kill me, but I'm not there to provide free AP for him, and neither is he. Nerfing bolt-escape is punishing to those like me who don't have minmaxed amazing builds that do a few things really well.

Halrloprillalar

semp3rfi wrote: »

Chasing sorcs from fortress to fortress is just dumb.

Maybe you shouldn't chase sorcs fortress to fortress?

Kiljaz

BE is so easy to counter.... Justify no cooldown 33% heal and perma magical projectile reflect. Still able to overcome that, but way worse than BE.

Sidereal

Obviously, they need to nerf Kassadin.

shanersimms_ESO

Sidereal wrote: »

Obviously, they need to nerf Kassadin.

This. Being able to move all over the place while doing no significant dmg to anyone or anything and then being able to escape a fight with an ability called: "Bolt Escape" is complete nonsense peoples! Buff Malzahar.

dennis.schmelzleb16_ESO

Yesterday I was running around picking flowers, when a sorc attacked me.
He couldnt kill me as my dragonblood was healing his 5 attacks in no time, so after that 5 attacks I still had 85% hp.
When I was attacking him, getting him to 10% with 3 hits he BEd away!
NERF SORCS!!!!1111111


Yesterday I was lurking in the shadows, seeing a sorc riding through. So I ambushed him, getting him to 10% hp with 3 attacks, when he BEd away
NERF SORCS!!!!!11111

OniMalkav

dennis.schmelzleb16_ESO wrote: »

He couldnt kill me as my dragonblood was healing his 5 attacks in no time, so after that 5 attacks I still had 85% hp.

NERF BE !! Dragon Blood is ok though.. (nothing personal you just provided the perfect example)

Nox_Aeterna

Yeap , it is broken , with the nerf , i hope it will become atleast a bit more a balanced.

Still , i think the 4 secs mana regen lock is not needed , they should have made a much worse penatly for using in a row instead in my opinion , so they would not be able to spam it , but could use to move away from melee with 0 penalty.

Akinos

If ZOS continues to allow BE to be a stupidly strong skill I demand that templars get this as a personal instant GTFO button that also brings you out of combat in order to mount up and ride off into the sunset: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_BXkuh9JJg
Zenimax pls!

Juraigr

ishilpatelb14_ESO wrote: »

Bolt Escape costs me 258 magicka at v12.
When a templar or DK gets dismounted, they can spam heals, when a nightblade gets dismounted he can go invisible. What can a sorc do in this situation besides Bolt Escape out? They can't tank because they can't self heal without channeling for 4 seconds unless they run healing staff, which would be a dumb requirement of sorcs since other classes aren't obliged to always use healing staff.
And oh, lag you say? You know what happens when a sorc gets hit by lag the second they hit Bolt Escape? It eats the cost of the spell up but the character doesn't actually do the Bolt Escape.
So again, like I've said the 3209840238490th time, Bolt Escape is all sorcs have to give them an edge, nerfing it would be like nerfing green dragonblood, that templar self heal, or nightblade's in-combat stealth.

this is the *** right here sorcs have no way to heal or survive, as the guys above said nightblades dissapear they are gone, dks heal up with dragonblood, what dk doesnt have it on their bar if u dont your doing it wrong, templars....really
BE should be kept as it is if sorcs wanna run let em i know i won anyway
'written by a vet12DK suck it'

Juraigr

Rosanna_Foxfire wrote: »

I ran into a VR12 DK tank while questing in Cyrodiil the other day. Nothing I did would dent him. So I had to run, it was the only smart thing to do, flee using Bolt Escape. And I succeeded, very nearly died, but I succeeded.

I can get where it would be frustrating for that tank that he didn't get to kill me, but I'm not there to provide free AP for him, and neither is he. Nerfing bolt-escape is punishing to those like me who don't have minmaxed amazing builds that do a few things really well.

and this

Akinos

Juraigr wrote: »

Rosanna_Foxfire wrote: »

I ran into a VR12 DK tank while questing in Cyrodiil the other day. Nothing I did would dent him. So I had to run, it was the only smart thing to do, flee using Bolt Escape. And I succeeded, very nearly died, but I succeeded.

I can get where it would be frustrating for that tank that he didn't get to kill me, but I'm not there to provide free AP for him, and neither is he. Nerfing bolt-escape is punishing to those like me who don't have minmaxed amazing builds that do a few things really well.

and this

I agree with this in a 1v1 situation, but fights like that don't happen as often as massive zerg fights do, where a sorc can BE through a crowd of 25 players, stun all of them and get full ultimate in an instant. Bolt Escaping from a 1v1 is no different then dying to me, except you were to scared to let your pixels die. The big issue that I believe alot of people have with BE is it's ability to effectively cc really large groups of people, melee and non melee. Large scale PvP has basically turned into whoever has the most sorcs now will win..lol

Neferath

Well iam playing a meele pvp sorc wielding dual weapons and wearing heavy armor using BE to post "into" the action and maybe reposition 1-2 times.

Having that stated i can assure you that iam not able to spam that ability in any way.

Actually if i cast crit. surge, port into the action and root my enemies i have something like slightly more than 50 % of my magica left. rooting them once again, will leave me with the opportunity to cast BE 1-2 times again in order to relocate / stun and get myself into a better combat position.

While i of course understand that not everyone is using BE or a sorc the way i do, i can assure you that this makes me in now way op and with the changes of 1.2 (PTS) in mind, i also have to admit that this style of playing won't be a valid option anymore since iam often forced to relocate after my first stun and therefore will hit the 4 sec timer.

Honestly, actually, iam kind of pissed atm, just like every single pve player out there will be pissed about these changes since they destroy valid play-styles only because of some pvp ranters that cant deal with their ego about some sorc players - who dont want to fight - and therefore used BE in order to escape, leaving them without a chance to gank these ppl.

Iselin

Justification for Bolt Escape: it's something your neighbor has that you don't have and that's a good thing,

Halrloprillalar

majestic862_ESO wrote: »

Juraigr wrote: »

Rosanna_Foxfire wrote: »

I ran into a VR12 DK tank while questing in Cyrodiil the other day. Nothing I did would dent him. So I had to run, it was the only smart thing to do, flee using Bolt Escape. And I succeeded, very nearly died, but I succeeded.

I can get where it would be frustrating for that tank that he didn't get to kill me, but I'm not there to provide free AP for him, and neither is he. Nerfing bolt-escape is punishing to those like me who don't have minmaxed amazing builds that do a few things really well.

and this

I agree with this in a 1v1 situation, but fights like that don't happen as often as massive zerg fights do, where a sorc can BE through a crowd of 25 players, stun all of them and get full ultimate in an instant. Bolt Escaping from a 1v1 is no different then dying to me, except you were to scared to let your pixels die. The big issue that I believe alot of people have with BE is it's ability to effectively cc really large groups of people, melee and non melee. Large scale PvP has basically turned into whoever has the most sorcs now will win..lol

Hence the issue isn't BE but the ult gain on it due to not having the 6-max cap. I'm fine if they fix that. The actual 'cc' BE provides is pathetic and laughable. That is no reason to nerf it. It is the sole survival skill sorcs have that's worth a ***.

And if it's just one-two sorcs zipping through a crowd, nothing is stopping you from tabbing and wtfpwning them.

Lorkhan

if everyone had access to this skill, i still want the nerf.
anyone should escape a fight so easily

Lorkhan

nice video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnrqZzKPbQw

Halrloprillalar

fredthementenrb18_ESO wrote: »

nice video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnrqZzKPbQw

Bash NB not killing a sorc, color me shocked.
I feel bad for whoever wasted time making this video.

Braidas

It's getting nerfed, so the devs aren't justifying it.

Kiljaz

Its amazing how dumb people are... why would you ever cast a 15m bolt once... so you can set your enemy up for their next invasion or crit charge right? I know I'm all about giving my enemies free hits on me... that's why I play a dragonknight... so i can stand still in combat.

Bayezid

I just want Bolt escape to not work when i use a CC like Dark talons or when they are disorientated.