DK Nerfs will get their own Patch Notes right?

Wuuffyy · August 6

Nordstern wrote: »

The only thing these screenshots show once again that corrosive is a problem and needs to be nerfed strong or entirely removed. Also keep in mind that all these screenshots of 20k whips hardly ever did 20k damage. Most of the time it's a 20k hit on <5k hp due to execute damage.

Nah, 15-19k whips casually with multiple defensive sets- whips that are being proc'd by essentially spamming an infinite sustain move and keeping up basic buffs are a problem all the same.

Just a handful of years ago, if a NB was doing that much damage in defensive gear with an insta-cast, no travel time bow- people would have been screaming to hekk and back.

Besides, corrosive full-pen has been a thing since about as long as I can remember with DK. Only now it's a significant issue... no.

Radiate77 · August 6

This thread is so funny, “Subclassed Dragonknight is stronger than ‘pure’ DK” what a great argument.

Idk what Skill Line you’d trade off for a 10% increase in efficiency at everything you do, the one providing unlimited sustain and the strongest Spammable in the game? Or the one giving 50% ranged damage prevention baked into a snare removal AoE knockback that also provides Major Expedition to a class known for moving slow?

Even before Class Mastery, the skills and now passives of Dragonknight were too overloaded to justify switching Skill Lines and now it’s just overkill.

With Class Mastery though?

Nobody is using Subclassing, even the classes who used to benefit the most from it, like Necromancer. My favorite system and I can’t justify even touching it out of the insane power creep Masteries have brought to this game.

Removing Class Mastery from reworked Classes is not only logical, but necessary in a PvP environment.

ketsparrowhawk · August 6

Radiate77 wrote: »

This thread is so funny, “Subclassed Dragonknight is stronger than ‘pure’ DK” what a great argument.

Idk what Skill Line you’d trade off for a 10% increase in efficiency at everything you do, the one providing unlimited sustain and the strongest Spammable in the game? Or the one giving 50% ranged damage prevention baked into a snare removal AoE knockback that also provides Major Expedition to a class known for moving slow?

Even before Class Mastery, the skills and now passives of Dragonknight were too overloaded to justify switching Skill Lines and now it’s just overkill.

With Class Mastery though?

Nobody is using Subclassing, even the classes who used to benefit the most from it, like Necromancer. My favorite system and I can’t justify even touching it out of the insane power creep Masteries have brought to this game.

Removing Class Mastery from reworked Classes is not only logical, but necessary in a PvP environment.

Would make a lot more sense to just make adjustments to make the classes more comparable to one another, rather than deleting a system for one particular class.

Radiate77 · August 6

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

Radiate77 wrote: »

This thread is so funny, “Subclassed Dragonknight is stronger than ‘pure’ DK” what a great argument.

Idk what Skill Line you’d trade off for a 10% increase in efficiency at everything you do, the one providing unlimited sustain and the strongest Spammable in the game? Or the one giving 50% ranged damage prevention baked into a snare removal AoE knockback that also provides Major Expedition to a class known for moving slow?

Even before Class Mastery, the skills and now passives of Dragonknight were too overloaded to justify switching Skill Lines and now it’s just overkill.

With Class Mastery though?

Nobody is using Subclassing, even the classes who used to benefit the most from it, like Necromancer. My favorite system and I can’t justify even touching it out of the insane power creep Masteries have brought to this game.

Removing Class Mastery from reworked Classes is not only logical, but necessary in a PvP environment.

Would make a lot more sense to just make adjustments to make the classes more comparable to one another, rather than deleting a system for one particular class.

Not when the particular class in question is stomping everything so heavily there’s no contest… even without the Masteries.

When Warden comes up for Rework, it too can have its Class Masteries removed with Battle Spirit… and that is by far the easiest solution to balancing 1.0 Classes to 2.0s without causing irreparable damage to Reworked Classes as we await them all to finish.

ketsparrowhawk · August 6

Radiate77 wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

Radiate77 wrote: »

This thread is so funny, “Subclassed Dragonknight is stronger than ‘pure’ DK” what a great argument.

Idk what Skill Line you’d trade off for a 10% increase in efficiency at everything you do, the one providing unlimited sustain and the strongest Spammable in the game? Or the one giving 50% ranged damage prevention baked into a snare removal AoE knockback that also provides Major Expedition to a class known for moving slow?

Even before Class Mastery, the skills and now passives of Dragonknight were too overloaded to justify switching Skill Lines and now it’s just overkill.

With Class Mastery though?

Nobody is using Subclassing, even the classes who used to benefit the most from it, like Necromancer. My favorite system and I can’t justify even touching it out of the insane power creep Masteries have brought to this game.

Removing Class Mastery from reworked Classes is not only logical, but necessary in a PvP environment.

Would make a lot more sense to just make adjustments to make the classes more comparable to one another, rather than deleting a system for one particular class.

Not when the particular class in question is stomping everything so heavily there’s no contest… even without the Masteries.

When Warden comes up for Rework, it too can have its Class Masteries removed… and that is by far the easiest solution to balancing 1.0 Classes to 2.0s without causing irreparable damage to Reworked Classes as we await them all to finish.

Yeah that can all be addressed without deleting class masteries for DK. No need to deprive a class of a new system that everyone else gets to enjoy when there are a myriad of ways balance can be addressed otherwise.

method__01 · August 6

dk and dk and dk and ww ,you see nothing else at Cyro now

i though new management was re-balncing classes ,not buff one and let others at bottom tier

how a quality control let this passed in live game ? this is so wrong

i have more to say but i respect the forum rules and im stopping here

Radiate77 · August 6

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

Radiate77 wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

Radiate77 wrote: »

This thread is so funny, “Subclassed Dragonknight is stronger than ‘pure’ DK” what a great argument.

Idk what Skill Line you’d trade off for a 10% increase in efficiency at everything you do, the one providing unlimited sustain and the strongest Spammable in the game? Or the one giving 50% ranged damage prevention baked into a snare removal AoE knockback that also provides Major Expedition to a class known for moving slow?

Even before Class Mastery, the skills and now passives of Dragonknight were too overloaded to justify switching Skill Lines and now it’s just overkill.

With Class Mastery though?

Nobody is using Subclassing, even the classes who used to benefit the most from it, like Necromancer. My favorite system and I can’t justify even touching it out of the insane power creep Masteries have brought to this game.

Removing Class Mastery from reworked Classes is not only logical, but necessary in a PvP environment.

Would make a lot more sense to just make adjustments to make the classes more comparable to one another, rather than deleting a system for one particular class.

Not when the particular class in question is stomping everything so heavily there’s no contest… even without the Masteries.

When Warden comes up for Rework, it too can have its Class Masteries removed… and that is by far the easiest solution to balancing 1.0 Classes to 2.0s without causing irreparable damage to Reworked Classes as we await them all to finish.

Yeah that can all be addressed without deleting class masteries for DK. No need to deprive a class of a new system that everyone else gets to enjoy when there are a myriad of ways balance can be addressed otherwise.

Let me ask you this, does DK need Class Mastery in PvP to be viable? If the answer is no, then that speaks for itself.

There is no argument to be had here.

BardokRedSnow · August 6

You’ll never talk sense to the people on these forums, they just wanna advocate for nerfs for the sake of yapping.

The state of the game before the rework of dk and ww speaks for itself, the subclassed builds prior were far more oppressive and toxic, it wasn’t even close.

This is why I posted that link, the developers understand subclassing is damaging the brand. I actually advocated for the signet ring staying for this very reason also, to give some cheap kills to less skilled players that can’t really play dk even after the rework they weren’t a threat to good players and made the rest feel relevant while we wait for the warden refresh

ketsparrowhawk · August 6

Radiate77 wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

Radiate77 wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

Radiate77 wrote: »

This thread is so funny, “Subclassed Dragonknight is stronger than ‘pure’ DK” what a great argument.

Idk what Skill Line you’d trade off for a 10% increase in efficiency at everything you do, the one providing unlimited sustain and the strongest Spammable in the game? Or the one giving 50% ranged damage prevention baked into a snare removal AoE knockback that also provides Major Expedition to a class known for moving slow?

Even before Class Mastery, the skills and now passives of Dragonknight were too overloaded to justify switching Skill Lines and now it’s just overkill.

With Class Mastery though?

Nobody is using Subclassing, even the classes who used to benefit the most from it, like Necromancer. My favorite system and I can’t justify even touching it out of the insane power creep Masteries have brought to this game.

Removing Class Mastery from reworked Classes is not only logical, but necessary in a PvP environment.

Would make a lot more sense to just make adjustments to make the classes more comparable to one another, rather than deleting a system for one particular class.

Not when the particular class in question is stomping everything so heavily there’s no contest… even without the Masteries.

When Warden comes up for Rework, it too can have its Class Masteries removed… and that is by far the easiest solution to balancing 1.0 Classes to 2.0s without causing irreparable damage to Reworked Classes as we await them all to finish.

Yeah that can all be addressed without deleting class masteries for DK. No need to deprive a class of a new system that everyone else gets to enjoy when there are a myriad of ways balance can be addressed otherwise.

Let me ask you this, does DK need Class Mastery in PvP to be viable? If the answer is no, then that speaks for itself.

There is no argument to be had here.

DK could be adjusted in a great number of ways that doesn't include deleting a system that everyone else gets to have fun with. Other classes can be adjusted too to bring them up to par. I'd be pretty irritated if an entire system was deleted from my class just because it's a bit too strong (not a DK main btw), rather than just making some sensible number adjustments.

Radiate77 · August 6

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

Radiate77 wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

Radiate77 wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

Radiate77 wrote: »

This thread is so funny, “Subclassed Dragonknight is stronger than ‘pure’ DK” what a great argument.

Idk what Skill Line you’d trade off for a 10% increase in efficiency at everything you do, the one providing unlimited sustain and the strongest Spammable in the game? Or the one giving 50% ranged damage prevention baked into a snare removal AoE knockback that also provides Major Expedition to a class known for moving slow?

Even before Class Mastery, the skills and now passives of Dragonknight were too overloaded to justify switching Skill Lines and now it’s just overkill.

With Class Mastery though?

Nobody is using Subclassing, even the classes who used to benefit the most from it, like Necromancer. My favorite system and I can’t justify even touching it out of the insane power creep Masteries have brought to this game.

Removing Class Mastery from reworked Classes is not only logical, but necessary in a PvP environment.

Would make a lot more sense to just make adjustments to make the classes more comparable to one another, rather than deleting a system for one particular class.

Not when the particular class in question is stomping everything so heavily there’s no contest… even without the Masteries.

When Warden comes up for Rework, it too can have its Class Masteries removed… and that is by far the easiest solution to balancing 1.0 Classes to 2.0s without causing irreparable damage to Reworked Classes as we await them all to finish.

Yeah that can all be addressed without deleting class masteries for DK. No need to deprive a class of a new system that everyone else gets to enjoy when there are a myriad of ways balance can be addressed otherwise.

Let me ask you this, does DK need Class Mastery in PvP to be viable? If the answer is no, then that speaks for itself.

There is no argument to be had here.

DK could be adjusted in a great number of ways that doesn't include deleting a system that everyone else gets to have fun with. Other classes can be adjusted too to bring them up to par. I'd be pretty irritated if an entire system was deleted from my class just because it's a bit too strong (not a DK main btw), rather than just making some sensible number adjustments.

Class Mastery was designed as a lever to help classes that have not been Reworked both compete with Subclassing and Reworked Classes.

Dragonknight is not competing with Subclassing or Reworked Classes in PvP. It is Reworked.

Like I said, there is no argument.

ketsparrowhawk · August 6

Radiate77 wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

Radiate77 wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

Radiate77 wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

Radiate77 wrote: »

This thread is so funny, “Subclassed Dragonknight is stronger than ‘pure’ DK” what a great argument.

Idk what Skill Line you’d trade off for a 10% increase in efficiency at everything you do, the one providing unlimited sustain and the strongest Spammable in the game? Or the one giving 50% ranged damage prevention baked into a snare removal AoE knockback that also provides Major Expedition to a class known for moving slow?

Even before Class Mastery, the skills and now passives of Dragonknight were too overloaded to justify switching Skill Lines and now it’s just overkill.

With Class Mastery though?

Nobody is using Subclassing, even the classes who used to benefit the most from it, like Necromancer. My favorite system and I can’t justify even touching it out of the insane power creep Masteries have brought to this game.

Removing Class Mastery from reworked Classes is not only logical, but necessary in a PvP environment.

Would make a lot more sense to just make adjustments to make the classes more comparable to one another, rather than deleting a system for one particular class.

Not when the particular class in question is stomping everything so heavily there’s no contest… even without the Masteries.

When Warden comes up for Rework, it too can have its Class Masteries removed… and that is by far the easiest solution to balancing 1.0 Classes to 2.0s without causing irreparable damage to Reworked Classes as we await them all to finish.

Yeah that can all be addressed without deleting class masteries for DK. No need to deprive a class of a new system that everyone else gets to enjoy when there are a myriad of ways balance can be addressed otherwise.

Let me ask you this, does DK need Class Mastery in PvP to be viable? If the answer is no, then that speaks for itself.

There is no argument to be had here.

DK could be adjusted in a great number of ways that doesn't include deleting a system that everyone else gets to have fun with. Other classes can be adjusted too to bring them up to par. I'd be pretty irritated if an entire system was deleted from my class just because it's a bit too strong (not a DK main btw), rather than just making some sensible number adjustments.

Class Mastery was designed as a lever to help classes that have not been Reworked both compete with Subclassing and Reworked Classes.

Dragonknight is not competing with Subclassing or Reworked Classes in PvP. It is in it’s own lane.

Like I said, there is no argument.

All the issues you've mentioned can be address without deleting class masteries for DK. I imagine class masteries are now a permanent system.. doubtful they'll all be removed once class reworks are complete. So it really doesn't make sense to delete them for one class when there are other ways to address the issue (i.e. nerf the sustain on Core of Flame). You're right I don't see much of an argument here.

NovelliESO · August 6

BardokRedSnow wrote: »

NovelliESO wrote: »

Try reading what people actually type before responding to them.

Why would I do that when I already know I'm right?

Everyone else is only sharing their feelings, I'm the only one that pulled direct quote from the devs themselves.

NovelliESO wrote: »

DK deserves to be nerfed

Nah.

In fact Im starting to agree we need a buff, because really sublassed dk is still stronger tbh, fr fr ong.

Since we're posting our strong opinions as fact now n all, Buffing DK is just as valid. Considering subclassing. Yea buff dk 2026 feels good.

"I know I'm right" is a hilariously bad position from someone who can't compete at a high level and also quoted an 8 month old post from before class mastery existed in order to try and reinforce their point. You still haven't pointed out a single thing I didn't understand even though you were so vehemently adamant I did. Funny isn't it? DK needs to be nerfed because it is objectively the strongest PvP class. Also, you trying to downplay how much someone got hit by whip for by saying "you could use some more reinforced heavy" is as laughable as the rest of your "facts." You can get hit while being buffed in a ballgroup for 40k whips when people aren't even running corrosive. You don't know the game.

SneaK · August 6

It’s only a real issue now cause the refresh delay. Nerfing DK will throw us back into the subclass meta which was way worse tbh. I’m tired of the DK meta, don’t get me wrong, but I’d rather live in this than the mutt meta we endured for a solid year.

Here’s a thought! Adjust some of the other class masteries like NB/Temp/Necro/Arc (NOW). That’s what they originally said they’d do, adjust them… it’s obvious which classes are suffering.

Urzigurumash · August 6

Wuuffyy wrote: »

Besides, corrosive full-pen has been a thing since about as long as I can remember with DK. Only now it's a significant issue... no.

Only since 2021. Before then it didn't work with Whip, really only worked with D Swing after Heroic Slash's big nerf in 2019, and before 2021 Titanic Cleave could only stack up to like 5 times. Nobody played StamDK after Warden came out. In 2019 I was like one of two people in Xbox NA BGs who had Corrosive slotted.

But prior to Hybridization I supported the idea of giving Magic Pen to Corrosive, at the time MagDKs were suffering badly and near extinction.

Urzigurumash · August 6

Anyhow

How about a global Flame Damage Taken modifier in Battlespirit?

Or take it off Vamp, but I was bambroiled for suggesting this before, I guess it's really important for theme.

NovelliESO · August 6

SneaK wrote: »

It’s only a real issue now cause the refresh delay. Nerfing DK will throw us back into the subclass meta which was way worse tbh. I’m tired of the DK meta, don’t get me wrong, but I’d rather live in this than the mutt meta we endured for a solid year.

Here’s a thought! Adjust some of the other class masteries like NB/Temp/Necro/Arc (NOW). That’s what they originally said they’d do, adjust them… it’s obvious which classes are suffering.

It's only a real issue because of the refresh delay if they also make the other refreshed classes this strong, but something tells me they won't, and even if they do the period between DK and the 2nd refresh will be over a year.

AllenaNightWood · 12:34AM

im a stamblade at base and still sub classed

SerafinaWaterstar · 10:35AM

Four_Fingers wrote: »

It is because they can't accept that dying is a part of PvP and everything should be nerfed so they can win every time.

There’s difference between accepting you die in pvp, and having to face bgs of dks that take little damage & are able to constantly renew health plus do decent damage.