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Magicka Sorcerer DW PvP Build - Riddick
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Izaki✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
You killed me xDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD Its pretty much that to be honest lol@ Izaki #PCEU
#FrenchKiss #GoneFor2YearsAndMyGuildDoesn'tRaidAnymore
#MoreDPSthanYou
#Stamblade0 -
Malamar1229✭✭✭✭✭
✭[/quote]
I'm not claiming to be the best, I said the build works for me several times, but you can't accept that (I guess that's a typical woman thing to do) you'll just keep moaning and moaning 'don't even compare myself to you' like just be quiet your a
[/quote]
This is starting to get erotic. 50 Shades of Dracane?3 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »I don't understand why sustainability would be any different with destro rather than DW.
The regen stats would be the same, I don't know many players that heavy attack destro main for sustain. Resto heavy attacks do that, and both versions run it.
Destro offers one spammable ability (that's mediocre damage) it doesn't offer sustain.
Ward, Curse, Pet =3 abilities = very good chances of frag proc. No need for a spammable destro move to proc frag.
Resto can't be reflected or dodged meaning much better for resources than destro heavy attack, plus ticks higher than lightning staff.
My point is sustain and pressure can be maintained with a resto staff - which both versions run.
I really don't see why there would be such a supposed difference.
It's the inferno medium weave. It constantly gives you a neat chunk resources back without any drawbacks.
Resto is a channel, so it can be interrupted or you simply get damaged while doing it. It also lowers your dps, since it can't be weaved. That's not worth the extra magicka, unless you're really desperate.0 -
Izaki✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »I don't understand why sustainability would be any different with destro rather than DW.
The regen stats would be the same, I don't know many players that heavy attack destro main for sustain. Resto heavy attacks do that, and both versions run it.
Destro offers one spammable ability (that's mediocre damage) it doesn't offer sustain.
Ward, Curse, Pet =3 abilities = very good chances of frag proc. No need for a spammable destro move to proc frag.
Resto can't be reflected or dodged meaning much better for resources than destro heavy attack, plus ticks higher than lightning staff.
My point is sustain and pressure can be maintained with a resto staff - which both versions run.
I really don't see why there would be such a supposed difference.
It's the inferno medium weave. It constantly gives you a neat chunk resources back without any drawbacks.
Resto is a channel, so it can be interrupted or you simply get damaged while doing it. It also lowers your dps, since it can't be weaved. That's not worth the extra magicka, unless you're really desperate.
Medium attacks don't restore any resources. Resto staff heavy attacks (or lightning or any heavy attacks for that matter) can't be interrupted. So, I'm the one spreading misinformation here right? Sounds quite the opposite to me.Edited by Izaki on 15 December 2016 19:17@ Izaki #PCEU
#FrenchKiss #GoneFor2YearsAndMyGuildDoesn'tRaidAnymore
#MoreDPSthanYou
#Stamblade3 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »I don't understand why sustainability would be any different with destro rather than DW.
The regen stats would be the same, I don't know many players that heavy attack destro main for sustain. Resto heavy attacks do that, and both versions run it.
Destro offers one spammable ability (that's mediocre damage) it doesn't offer sustain.
Ward, Curse, Pet =3 abilities = very good chances of frag proc. No need for a spammable destro move to proc frag.
Resto can't be reflected or dodged meaning much better for resources than destro heavy attack, plus ticks higher than lightning staff.
My point is sustain and pressure can be maintained with a resto staff - which both versions run.
I really don't see why there would be such a supposed difference.
It's the inferno medium weave. It constantly gives you a neat chunk resources back without any drawbacks.
Resto is a channel, so it can be interrupted or you simply get damaged while doing it. It also lowers your dps, since it can't be weaved. That's not worth the extra magicka, unless you're really desperate.
Dual wield doesn't need as much much sustain to keep going. You arent spending 2-3K every second on FP just to proc frags. You rarely need resto heavies because your resources will be fine with a potion and a lich proc every minute.
What it's missing is sustain *pressure* you get from the woven light attacks, heavy attacks and force pulse on a staff build. And those FP attacks tend to proc more frags. It forces healers to heal more. It pressures people into going on defense (blocks, dodge rolls, shields, and vigor).
0 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »I don't understand why sustainability would be any different with destro rather than DW.
The regen stats would be the same, I don't know many players that heavy attack destro main for sustain. Resto heavy attacks do that, and both versions run it.
Destro offers one spammable ability (that's mediocre damage) it doesn't offer sustain.
Ward, Curse, Pet =3 abilities = very good chances of frag proc. No need for a spammable destro move to proc frag.
Resto can't be reflected or dodged meaning much better for resources than destro heavy attack, plus ticks higher than lightning staff.
My point is sustain and pressure can be maintained with a resto staff - which both versions run.
I really don't see why there would be such a supposed difference.
It's the inferno medium weave. It constantly gives you a neat chunk resources back without any drawbacks.
Resto is a channel, so it can be interrupted or you simply get damaged while doing it. It also lowers your dps, since it can't be weaved. That's not worth the extra magicka, unless you're really desperate.
Dual wield doesn't need as much much sustain to keep going. You arent spending 2-3K every second on FP just to proc frags. You rarely need resto heavies because your resources will be fine with a potion and a lich proc every minute.
What it's missing is sustain *pressure* you get from the woven light attacks, heavy attacks and force pulse on a staff build. And those FP attacks tend to proc more frags. It forces healers to heal more. It pressures people into going on defense (blocks, dodge rolls, shields, and vigor).
Here's what I do: ward, curse, pet, frag, ward, curse, frag, pet, ward, curse, frag etc etc... medium weaves are slower than AC instant abilities plus more damage0 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭4 necro 5bsw 2 slimecraw mage mundus outperformed anything a DW built could provide for my personal playstyle.<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 500 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭4 necro 5bsw 2 slimecraw mage mundus outperformed anything a DW built could provide for my personal playstyle.
Really? Can't be in duels right? You're down time on buffs seems pretty big0 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »
Why would you duel in anything else but a petbuild on a sorc. People can´t outmaneuver pets in the small dueling area (edit: but why would anyone duel on a sorc (or a magica toon in general).
And why downtime on buffs? BSW is proccing pretty reliably with just staff + crushing shock - way better than scathing mage for example.Edited by Derra on 15 December 2016 21:03<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 500 -
Kutsuu✭✭✭✭✭As stated, medium weaves do not give resources back, it needs to be a full heavy. It's like doing a lightning or resto heavy and stopping before the last tick. Only that last tick gives resouces back. I do like the idea of landing a full heavy attack along with a frag proc after a curse, but I'm not sure how viable that is for you guys. The full heavy windup is such an obvious animation that at least I personally would be preparing to dodge or block it (depending on build i'm playing) and you'd end up losing your frag in the process b/c of it.PC/NA
Envy Me - Sorc
Kutsus - NB
Kutsmuffin - Temp
Kutsuu the Destroyer - NB
Kutsuu - Temp
Natsu Dragoneel - DK
Kutsumo - NB1 -
Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »psychotic13 wrote: »psychotic13 wrote: »IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »Guys, the burst damage of DW is simply not enough. All that theoretical damage math goes down the drain when your opponent blocks or dodges for a second.
Even when DW sorcs were viable, around Orsinium, the general opinion was that destro was more competitive since it wasn't countered as hard. That was before Trapping Webs was made obsolete, when Streak dropped block, when we had a magical Dawnbreaker finisher, and when pure damage sets like Julianos were maintainable in PvP, before SOMEONE decided to swing a cost increase bat at us.
Speaking of, I feel a lot like Glen in regards to sorc nerfs in the past.
You can't just burst any correctly geared player down these days. You have to apply pressure and gain the upper hand, then time your burst and pray to Auri-El the stars may align. This forces sorcs into destro and is a big reason why they're struggling, EotS apart.
Also, Mina, you don't empower every frag with DW. You empower with Entropy or very rarely Meteor. You re-apply Entropy every 15 seconds for the DOT, everything else is a dps loss. The time it takes you to cast Entropy just for empower is better spent on Fury. Or a shield.
Curse can't be empowered. Neither Meteor. Thaumaturge also doesn't strengthen pseudo-dots like they used to. Speaking of Curse and Proxy det. You're also missing medium attacks for damage, enchants/poison, resource gain, ultimate gain and status effects. And that additional set bonus is meaningless with lich proc and set jewelry now.
Seriously, DW sorcs these days are not even at 33% percent of their former strength. They are laughable and not competitive at all.
Play a DW build if you want, but don't you dare spreading misinformation about it and then even go as far as calling out one of the very best sorc players we have.
You're the one spreading misinformation here mate. Saying that dual wield sorcs aren't competitive at all and in your words "laughable" is well... laughable because you clearly haven't even tried the build that is being discussed. That "theoretical damage math" is what the game is built on, its all math and formulas. If you theoretically have the damage potential to take down someone with 30k, then its only a matter of time before you pull of your burst correctly.
Fyi you actually gain an extra enchant on dual wield, don't know if you read previous posts but apparently not. You know you can swing those swords and you should swing your swords, just like templars do. Ultimate gain isn't an issue if you know what you're doing and actually swap bars often enough to apply your Curse with a light attack (because you probably haven't noticed, but it is on the back bar in this build, so you do proc the ultimate gain from resto light attacking every 4 seconds, which is more often than needed).
Oh and yeah, I too just called out one of the best sorc players you have, because well... although maybe "good" not exactly well informed.
Well... "mate"... I have played my fair share of DW sorc and I have toyed around with pets and had Curse on the back bar and everything else you're discussing here. It didn't work well when DW was at its peak, it works way less now.
If you wanna play that way, by all means, do so, but expect backlash.
Just because it didn't work well for you, doesn't mean it doesn't work. Takes a while to get used to as it's a completely different playstyle from your normal destro sorc, and 'toying around' isn't going to give you success you need to put the time in to get good with it.
But as for saying it's laughable? Not competitive? And don't I dare spread misinformation lol who are you? I've never said this build is to 1vX it's better at duels/small scale as it's primarily single target damage. I've shown it can work in both of those scenarios against good players, why you can't accept that I don't know. I would love to duel some of you who say the burst isn't enough, how did you come to that conclusion? Cause I can get around 20k Frags in PvP, that with curse, the damage from the familiar, an endless fury and Dawnbreaker will wipe out pretty much anything.
So you're the one spreading 'misinformation' so just wind your neck in
Honey, you have killed some unexperienced players with it and think, that it's good. You can use anything vs bad or medium players and succeed.
But dual wield Sorc is not viable vs good enemies.
Well 'honey', all of the people in the video were decent players with most being at the cap and having a good rank, the video you shared half of them are under cap, and you have to Destro ULT them with imperial physique. Can you just not comment in this thread now thanks.
Unlike you, I was against many enemies at the same time.
Don't even compare myself to you. You have killed some noobs that don't know what they are doing, I have killed 10 of them at the same time, many times.
Rank and Cp means nothing. I was against a max level player earlier. He was constantly fighting my pets, without realizing that he was fighting a players pets (mine) He just came again and again and let me swallow his stones.
@Dracane Didn't he say that the build was intended for small scale and duels?
And didn't you yourself remind everyone here that 1vX is not possible against good players? So dual wield is perfectly viable in 1vX situations.
Also what's the point of taking credit for killing a couple of noobs with the destro ult? Like seriously? Anyone can do that who knows what he's doing. 1vX is nothing special, I mean any Flawless Conqueror can do it, after all its the same as taking on a few mobs. Its hell of a lot of fun for sure, but bragging about it is unnecessary. It does demand concentration and quick reactions. But here you're telling someone who has been doing the exact same thing as you (meaning wiping solo 10 people) to not compare himself to you. I've been there and seen it, @psychotic13 has taken on groups by himself (cause I would end up dead) and wiped them without the destro ultimate using this exact build that he posted here. Just because he didn't catch the clips doesn't make him a worse player than you. The opposite has also happened, he'd end up dead and I'd have a bunch of idiots on me, and I'd take them out with my good old Shooting Star and no pets for the noobs to beat on to buy me time.
Wiping whole zergs of 50 people with a small group of 6 players, that's already more impressive, because that actually demands organization and team work as well as demanding everything you need in solo play.
Also don't take yourself too seriously. I mean if you think that magicka nightblades are really the best for vMA, just means you don't know much outside of PvP. Saying that magicka sorcerers don't do good DPS, is also nonsense as they are just as good as a magicka DK in terms of numbers (most of the time, even higher) and they are able to pull those numbers (50k+) from full range. Saying that heavy armor does more damage on a magicka sorc is pretty stupid too, as the Wrath passive doesn't actually work when you have a shield up. So you're a good player, but not very well informed. So stop being so up yourself and be a little open minded, will you? You don't know everything about the sorcerer class and stop acting like you do. None one does.
Here is the thing: go on and adapt your build for dual wield. Go out 1vXing and record the clips. I'm sure you'll get the same results. Then we'll argue about dual wield being viable or not. Don't tell me that you've already done it and what-not, just please do it, I'd like to see the results.
If you were talking about duels, well when you have a pet build, it doesn't really matter if you dual wild or not because the sustained pressure and the line of sight is there to help you place your burst. A non pet dual wield build, which is what I run? It relies on your opponent to make a mistake, so against a good player, a fight can take ages. But mistakes are human and they will happen at some point.
You should shorten your posts. It's so annoying to answer all of it.
-Mag Nightblade has higher scores in vMA, so they perform better.
-Heavy armor deals more damage in certain situations. Vs damage shields and low resistance targets.
-I'm not taking any advise from a scrub like you. I know everything about this class and don't need your liddle theories to make me insecure. I'm just laughing about your lack of knowledge about pvp. You and any other Sorc would have turned into a pile of ash during some fights that I had. No matter if it is the destro ult or not, not even that would help you.
Auri-El is my lord,
Trinimac is my shield,
Magnus is my mind.
My debut album on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Gleandra/videos0 -
Kutsuu✭✭✭✭✭Both staff and DW setups are perfectly viable and have different pros/cons. Any "pro" sorc player should understand this.
I really don't see how a video of using a gimmicky imperial physique build in IC has any bearing on the argument, though. The only thing I see worthy of discussion from that video is that the destro ult is very strong and it's hard to run DW/destro in order to get it.PC/NA
Envy Me - Sorc
Kutsus - NB
Kutsmuffin - Temp
Kutsuu the Destroyer - NB
Kutsuu - Temp
Natsu Dragoneel - DK
Kutsumo - NB1 -
psychotic13✭✭✭✭✭
✭IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »psychotic13 wrote: »psychotic13 wrote: »IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »Guys, the burst damage of DW is simply not enough. All that theoretical damage math goes down the drain when your opponent blocks or dodges for a second.
Even when DW sorcs were viable, around Orsinium, the general opinion was that destro was more competitive since it wasn't countered as hard. That was before Trapping Webs was made obsolete, when Streak dropped block, when we had a magical Dawnbreaker finisher, and when pure damage sets like Julianos were maintainable in PvP, before SOMEONE decided to swing a cost increase bat at us.
Speaking of, I feel a lot like Glen in regards to sorc nerfs in the past.
You can't just burst any correctly geared player down these days. You have to apply pressure and gain the upper hand, then time your burst and pray to Auri-El the stars may align. This forces sorcs into destro and is a big reason why they're struggling, EotS apart.
Also, Mina, you don't empower every frag with DW. You empower with Entropy or very rarely Meteor. You re-apply Entropy every 15 seconds for the DOT, everything else is a dps loss. The time it takes you to cast Entropy just for empower is better spent on Fury. Or a shield.
Curse can't be empowered. Neither Meteor. Thaumaturge also doesn't strengthen pseudo-dots like they used to. Speaking of Curse and Proxy det. You're also missing medium attacks for damage, enchants/poison, resource gain, ultimate gain and status effects. And that additional set bonus is meaningless with lich proc and set jewelry now.
Seriously, DW sorcs these days are not even at 33% percent of their former strength. They are laughable and not competitive at all.
Play a DW build if you want, but don't you dare spreading misinformation about it and then even go as far as calling out one of the very best sorc players we have.
You're the one spreading misinformation here mate. Saying that dual wield sorcs aren't competitive at all and in your words "laughable" is well... laughable because you clearly haven't even tried the build that is being discussed. That "theoretical damage math" is what the game is built on, its all math and formulas. If you theoretically have the damage potential to take down someone with 30k, then its only a matter of time before you pull of your burst correctly.
Fyi you actually gain an extra enchant on dual wield, don't know if you read previous posts but apparently not. You know you can swing those swords and you should swing your swords, just like templars do. Ultimate gain isn't an issue if you know what you're doing and actually swap bars often enough to apply your Curse with a light attack (because you probably haven't noticed, but it is on the back bar in this build, so you do proc the ultimate gain from resto light attacking every 4 seconds, which is more often than needed).
Oh and yeah, I too just called out one of the best sorc players you have, because well... although maybe "good" not exactly well informed.
Well... "mate"... I have played my fair share of DW sorc and I have toyed around with pets and had Curse on the back bar and everything else you're discussing here. It didn't work well when DW was at its peak, it works way less now.
If you wanna play that way, by all means, do so, but expect backlash.
Just because it didn't work well for you, doesn't mean it doesn't work. Takes a while to get used to as it's a completely different playstyle from your normal destro sorc, and 'toying around' isn't going to give you success you need to put the time in to get good with it.
But as for saying it's laughable? Not competitive? And don't I dare spread misinformation lol who are you? I've never said this build is to 1vX it's better at duels/small scale as it's primarily single target damage. I've shown it can work in both of those scenarios against good players, why you can't accept that I don't know. I would love to duel some of you who say the burst isn't enough, how did you come to that conclusion? Cause I can get around 20k Frags in PvP, that with curse, the damage from the familiar, an endless fury and Dawnbreaker will wipe out pretty much anything.
So you're the one spreading 'misinformation' so just wind your neck in
Honey, you have killed some unexperienced players with it and think, that it's good. You can use anything vs bad or medium players and succeed.
But dual wield Sorc is not viable vs good enemies.
Well 'honey', all of the people in the video were decent players with most being at the cap and having a good rank, the video you shared half of them are under cap, and you have to Destro ULT them with imperial physique. Can you just not comment in this thread now thanks.
Unlike you, I was against many enemies at the same time.
Don't even compare myself to you. You have killed some noobs that don't know what they are doing, I have killed 10 of them at the same time, many times.
Rank and Cp means nothing. I was against a max level player earlier. He was constantly fighting my pets, without realizing that he was fighting a players pets (mine) He just came again and again and let me swallow his stones.
@Dracane Didn't he say that the build was intended for small scale and duels?
And didn't you yourself remind everyone here that 1vX is not possible against good players? So dual wield is perfectly viable in 1vX situations.
Also what's the point of taking credit for killing a couple of noobs with the destro ult? Like seriously? Anyone can do that who knows what he's doing. 1vX is nothing special, I mean any Flawless Conqueror can do it, after all its the same as taking on a few mobs. Its hell of a lot of fun for sure, but bragging about it is unnecessary. It does demand concentration and quick reactions. But here you're telling someone who has been doing the exact same thing as you (meaning wiping solo 10 people) to not compare himself to you. I've been there and seen it, @psychotic13 has taken on groups by himself (cause I would end up dead) and wiped them without the destro ultimate using this exact build that he posted here. Just because he didn't catch the clips doesn't make him a worse player than you. The opposite has also happened, he'd end up dead and I'd have a bunch of idiots on me, and I'd take them out with my good old Shooting Star and no pets for the noobs to beat on to buy me time.
Wiping whole zergs of 50 people with a small group of 6 players, that's already more impressive, because that actually demands organization and team work as well as demanding everything you need in solo play.
Also don't take yourself too seriously. I mean if you think that magicka nightblades are really the best for vMA, just means you don't know much outside of PvP. Saying that magicka sorcerers don't do good DPS, is also nonsense as they are just as good as a magicka DK in terms of numbers (most of the time, even higher) and they are able to pull those numbers (50k+) from full range. Saying that heavy armor does more damage on a magicka sorc is pretty stupid too, as the Wrath passive doesn't actually work when you have a shield up. So you're a good player, but not very well informed. So stop being so up yourself and be a little open minded, will you? You don't know everything about the sorcerer class and stop acting like you do. None one does.
Here is the thing: go on and adapt your build for dual wield. Go out 1vXing and record the clips. I'm sure you'll get the same results. Then we'll argue about dual wield being viable or not. Don't tell me that you've already done it and what-not, just please do it, I'd like to see the results.
If you were talking about duels, well when you have a pet build, it doesn't really matter if you dual wild or not because the sustained pressure and the line of sight is there to help you place your burst. A non pet dual wield build, which is what I run? It relies on your opponent to make a mistake, so against a good player, a fight can take ages. But mistakes are human and they will happen at some point.
You should shorten your posts. It's so annoying to answer all of it.
-Mag Nightblade has higher scores in vMA, so they perform better.
-Heavy armor deals more damage in certain situations. Vs damage shields and low resistance targets.
-I'm not taking any advise from a scrub like you. I know everything about this class and don't need your liddle theories to make me insecure. I'm just laughing about your lack of knowledge about pvp. You and any other Sorc would have turned into a pile of ash during some fights that I had. No matter if it is the destro ult or not, not even that would help you.
Wow you need to get out more0 -
psychotic13✭✭✭✭✭
✭Both staff and DW setups are perfectly viable and have different pros/cons. Any "pro" sorc player should understand this.
I really don't see how a video of using a gimmicky imperial physique build in IC has any bearing on the argument, though. The only thing I see worthy of discussion from that video is that the destro ult is very strong and it's hard to run DW/destro in order to get it.
This basically0 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »psychotic13 wrote: »psychotic13 wrote: »IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »Guys, the burst damage of DW is simply not enough. All that theoretical damage math goes down the drain when your opponent blocks or dodges for a second.
Even when DW sorcs were viable, around Orsinium, the general opinion was that destro was more competitive since it wasn't countered as hard. That was before Trapping Webs was made obsolete, when Streak dropped block, when we had a magical Dawnbreaker finisher, and when pure damage sets like Julianos were maintainable in PvP, before SOMEONE decided to swing a cost increase bat at us.
Speaking of, I feel a lot like Glen in regards to sorc nerfs in the past.
You can't just burst any correctly geared player down these days. You have to apply pressure and gain the upper hand, then time your burst and pray to Auri-El the stars may align. This forces sorcs into destro and is a big reason why they're struggling, EotS apart.
Also, Mina, you don't empower every frag with DW. You empower with Entropy or very rarely Meteor. You re-apply Entropy every 15 seconds for the DOT, everything else is a dps loss. The time it takes you to cast Entropy just for empower is better spent on Fury. Or a shield.
Curse can't be empowered. Neither Meteor. Thaumaturge also doesn't strengthen pseudo-dots like they used to. Speaking of Curse and Proxy det. You're also missing medium attacks for damage, enchants/poison, resource gain, ultimate gain and status effects. And that additional set bonus is meaningless with lich proc and set jewelry now.
Seriously, DW sorcs these days are not even at 33% percent of their former strength. They are laughable and not competitive at all.
Play a DW build if you want, but don't you dare spreading misinformation about it and then even go as far as calling out one of the very best sorc players we have.
You're the one spreading misinformation here mate. Saying that dual wield sorcs aren't competitive at all and in your words "laughable" is well... laughable because you clearly haven't even tried the build that is being discussed. That "theoretical damage math" is what the game is built on, its all math and formulas. If you theoretically have the damage potential to take down someone with 30k, then its only a matter of time before you pull of your burst correctly.
Fyi you actually gain an extra enchant on dual wield, don't know if you read previous posts but apparently not. You know you can swing those swords and you should swing your swords, just like templars do. Ultimate gain isn't an issue if you know what you're doing and actually swap bars often enough to apply your Curse with a light attack (because you probably haven't noticed, but it is on the back bar in this build, so you do proc the ultimate gain from resto light attacking every 4 seconds, which is more often than needed).
Oh and yeah, I too just called out one of the best sorc players you have, because well... although maybe "good" not exactly well informed.
Well... "mate"... I have played my fair share of DW sorc and I have toyed around with pets and had Curse on the back bar and everything else you're discussing here. It didn't work well when DW was at its peak, it works way less now.
If you wanna play that way, by all means, do so, but expect backlash.
Just because it didn't work well for you, doesn't mean it doesn't work. Takes a while to get used to as it's a completely different playstyle from your normal destro sorc, and 'toying around' isn't going to give you success you need to put the time in to get good with it.
But as for saying it's laughable? Not competitive? And don't I dare spread misinformation lol who are you? I've never said this build is to 1vX it's better at duels/small scale as it's primarily single target damage. I've shown it can work in both of those scenarios against good players, why you can't accept that I don't know. I would love to duel some of you who say the burst isn't enough, how did you come to that conclusion? Cause I can get around 20k Frags in PvP, that with curse, the damage from the familiar, an endless fury and Dawnbreaker will wipe out pretty much anything.
So you're the one spreading 'misinformation' so just wind your neck in
Honey, you have killed some unexperienced players with it and think, that it's good. You can use anything vs bad or medium players and succeed.
But dual wield Sorc is not viable vs good enemies.
Well 'honey', all of the people in the video were decent players with most being at the cap and having a good rank, the video you shared half of them are under cap, and you have to Destro ULT them with imperial physique. Can you just not comment in this thread now thanks.
Unlike you, I was against many enemies at the same time.
Don't even compare myself to you. You have killed some noobs that don't know what they are doing, I have killed 10 of them at the same time, many times.
Rank and Cp means nothing. I was against a max level player earlier. He was constantly fighting my pets, without realizing that he was fighting a players pets (mine) He just came again and again and let me swallow his stones.
@Dracane Didn't he say that the build was intended for small scale and duels?
And didn't you yourself remind everyone here that 1vX is not possible against good players? So dual wield is perfectly viable in 1vX situations.
Also what's the point of taking credit for killing a couple of noobs with the destro ult? Like seriously? Anyone can do that who knows what he's doing. 1vX is nothing special, I mean any Flawless Conqueror can do it, after all its the same as taking on a few mobs. Its hell of a lot of fun for sure, but bragging about it is unnecessary. It does demand concentration and quick reactions. But here you're telling someone who has been doing the exact same thing as you (meaning wiping solo 10 people) to not compare himself to you. I've been there and seen it, @psychotic13 has taken on groups by himself (cause I would end up dead) and wiped them without the destro ultimate using this exact build that he posted here. Just because he didn't catch the clips doesn't make him a worse player than you. The opposite has also happened, he'd end up dead and I'd have a bunch of idiots on me, and I'd take them out with my good old Shooting Star and no pets for the noobs to beat on to buy me time.
Wiping whole zergs of 50 people with a small group of 6 players, that's already more impressive, because that actually demands organization and team work as well as demanding everything you need in solo play.
Also don't take yourself too seriously. I mean if you think that magicka nightblades are really the best for vMA, just means you don't know much outside of PvP. Saying that magicka sorcerers don't do good DPS, is also nonsense as they are just as good as a magicka DK in terms of numbers (most of the time, even higher) and they are able to pull those numbers (50k+) from full range. Saying that heavy armor does more damage on a magicka sorc is pretty stupid too, as the Wrath passive doesn't actually work when you have a shield up. So you're a good player, but not very well informed. So stop being so up yourself and be a little open minded, will you? You don't know everything about the sorcerer class and stop acting like you do. None one does.
Here is the thing: go on and adapt your build for dual wield. Go out 1vXing and record the clips. I'm sure you'll get the same results. Then we'll argue about dual wield being viable or not. Don't tell me that you've already done it and what-not, just please do it, I'd like to see the results.
If you were talking about duels, well when you have a pet build, it doesn't really matter if you dual wild or not because the sustained pressure and the line of sight is there to help you place your burst. A non pet dual wield build, which is what I run? It relies on your opponent to make a mistake, so against a good player, a fight can take ages. But mistakes are human and they will happen at some point.
You should shorten your posts. It's so annoying to answer all of it.
-Mag Nightblade has higher scores in vMA, so they perform better.
-Heavy armor deals more damage in certain situations. Vs damage shields and low resistance targets.
-I'm not taking any advise from a scrub like you. I know everything about this class and don't need your liddle theories to make me insecure. I'm just laughing about your lack of knowledge about pvp. You and any other Sorc would have turned into a pile of ash during some fights that I had. No matter if it is the destro ult or not, not even that would help you.
You're just a little too proud of crutching that hard on the destro ultimate in that video, which most likely has a massive nerf incoming. Do you really think you'd pull a 50v1 like that off without it? If so, lets see it. I'll even give you meteor to use.
Monday night I pulled 30+ kills on the Nickel back flag with one fire destro ult. Wiping a raid doesn't make me a great or even a good player. Was it hilarious though? Hell yes. There were maybe a dozen of us defending, no way I could do that without Eye of the Overpowered.
That said I agree on all of your other points.2 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »psychotic13 wrote: »psychotic13 wrote: »IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »Guys, the burst damage of DW is simply not enough. All that theoretical damage math goes down the drain when your opponent blocks or dodges for a second.
Even when DW sorcs were viable, around Orsinium, the general opinion was that destro was more competitive since it wasn't countered as hard. That was before Trapping Webs was made obsolete, when Streak dropped block, when we had a magical Dawnbreaker finisher, and when pure damage sets like Julianos were maintainable in PvP, before SOMEONE decided to swing a cost increase bat at us.
Speaking of, I feel a lot like Glen in regards to sorc nerfs in the past.
You can't just burst any correctly geared player down these days. You have to apply pressure and gain the upper hand, then time your burst and pray to Auri-El the stars may align. This forces sorcs into destro and is a big reason why they're struggling, EotS apart.
Also, Mina, you don't empower every frag with DW. You empower with Entropy or very rarely Meteor. You re-apply Entropy every 15 seconds for the DOT, everything else is a dps loss. The time it takes you to cast Entropy just for empower is better spent on Fury. Or a shield.
Curse can't be empowered. Neither Meteor. Thaumaturge also doesn't strengthen pseudo-dots like they used to. Speaking of Curse and Proxy det. You're also missing medium attacks for damage, enchants/poison, resource gain, ultimate gain and status effects. And that additional set bonus is meaningless with lich proc and set jewelry now.
Seriously, DW sorcs these days are not even at 33% percent of their former strength. They are laughable and not competitive at all.
Play a DW build if you want, but don't you dare spreading misinformation about it and then even go as far as calling out one of the very best sorc players we have.
You're the one spreading misinformation here mate. Saying that dual wield sorcs aren't competitive at all and in your words "laughable" is well... laughable because you clearly haven't even tried the build that is being discussed. That "theoretical damage math" is what the game is built on, its all math and formulas. If you theoretically have the damage potential to take down someone with 30k, then its only a matter of time before you pull of your burst correctly.
Fyi you actually gain an extra enchant on dual wield, don't know if you read previous posts but apparently not. You know you can swing those swords and you should swing your swords, just like templars do. Ultimate gain isn't an issue if you know what you're doing and actually swap bars often enough to apply your Curse with a light attack (because you probably haven't noticed, but it is on the back bar in this build, so you do proc the ultimate gain from resto light attacking every 4 seconds, which is more often than needed).
Oh and yeah, I too just called out one of the best sorc players you have, because well... although maybe "good" not exactly well informed.
Well... "mate"... I have played my fair share of DW sorc and I have toyed around with pets and had Curse on the back bar and everything else you're discussing here. It didn't work well when DW was at its peak, it works way less now.
If you wanna play that way, by all means, do so, but expect backlash.
Just because it didn't work well for you, doesn't mean it doesn't work. Takes a while to get used to as it's a completely different playstyle from your normal destro sorc, and 'toying around' isn't going to give you success you need to put the time in to get good with it.
But as for saying it's laughable? Not competitive? And don't I dare spread misinformation lol who are you? I've never said this build is to 1vX it's better at duels/small scale as it's primarily single target damage. I've shown it can work in both of those scenarios against good players, why you can't accept that I don't know. I would love to duel some of you who say the burst isn't enough, how did you come to that conclusion? Cause I can get around 20k Frags in PvP, that with curse, the damage from the familiar, an endless fury and Dawnbreaker will wipe out pretty much anything.
So you're the one spreading 'misinformation' so just wind your neck in
Honey, you have killed some unexperienced players with it and think, that it's good. You can use anything vs bad or medium players and succeed.
But dual wield Sorc is not viable vs good enemies.
Well 'honey', all of the people in the video were decent players with most being at the cap and having a good rank, the video you shared half of them are under cap, and you have to Destro ULT them with imperial physique. Can you just not comment in this thread now thanks.
Unlike you, I was against many enemies at the same time.
Don't even compare myself to you. You have killed some noobs that don't know what they are doing, I have killed 10 of them at the same time, many times.
Rank and Cp means nothing. I was against a max level player earlier. He was constantly fighting my pets, without realizing that he was fighting a players pets (mine) He just came again and again and let me swallow his stones.
@Dracane Didn't he say that the build was intended for small scale and duels?
And didn't you yourself remind everyone here that 1vX is not possible against good players? So dual wield is perfectly viable in 1vX situations.
Also what's the point of taking credit for killing a couple of noobs with the destro ult? Like seriously? Anyone can do that who knows what he's doing. 1vX is nothing special, I mean any Flawless Conqueror can do it, after all its the same as taking on a few mobs. Its hell of a lot of fun for sure, but bragging about it is unnecessary. It does demand concentration and quick reactions. But here you're telling someone who has been doing the exact same thing as you (meaning wiping solo 10 people) to not compare himself to you. I've been there and seen it, @psychotic13 has taken on groups by himself (cause I would end up dead) and wiped them without the destro ultimate using this exact build that he posted here. Just because he didn't catch the clips doesn't make him a worse player than you. The opposite has also happened, he'd end up dead and I'd have a bunch of idiots on me, and I'd take them out with my good old Shooting Star and no pets for the noobs to beat on to buy me time.
Wiping whole zergs of 50 people with a small group of 6 players, that's already more impressive, because that actually demands organization and team work as well as demanding everything you need in solo play.
Also don't take yourself too seriously. I mean if you think that magicka nightblades are really the best for vMA, just means you don't know much outside of PvP. Saying that magicka sorcerers don't do good DPS, is also nonsense as they are just as good as a magicka DK in terms of numbers (most of the time, even higher) and they are able to pull those numbers (50k+) from full range. Saying that heavy armor does more damage on a magicka sorc is pretty stupid too, as the Wrath passive doesn't actually work when you have a shield up. So you're a good player, but not very well informed. So stop being so up yourself and be a little open minded, will you? You don't know everything about the sorcerer class and stop acting like you do. None one does.
Here is the thing: go on and adapt your build for dual wield. Go out 1vXing and record the clips. I'm sure you'll get the same results. Then we'll argue about dual wield being viable or not. Don't tell me that you've already done it and what-not, just please do it, I'd like to see the results.
If you were talking about duels, well when you have a pet build, it doesn't really matter if you dual wild or not because the sustained pressure and the line of sight is there to help you place your burst. A non pet dual wield build, which is what I run? It relies on your opponent to make a mistake, so against a good player, a fight can take ages. But mistakes are human and they will happen at some point.
You should shorten your posts. It's so annoying to answer all of it.
-Mag Nightblade has higher scores in vMA, so they perform better.
-Heavy armor deals more damage in certain situations. Vs damage shields and low resistance targets.
-I'm not taking any advise from a scrub like you. I know everything about this class and don't need your liddle theories to make me insecure. I'm just laughing about your lack of knowledge about pvp. You and any other Sorc would have turned into a pile of ash during some fights that I had. No matter if it is the destro ult or not, not even that would help you.
You're just a little too proud of crutching that hard on the destro ultimate in that video, which most likely has a massive nerf incoming. Do you really think you'd pull a 50v1 like that off without it? If so, lets see it. I'll even give you meteor to use.
Monday night I pulled 30+ kills on the Nickel back flag with one fire destro ult. Wiping a raid doesn't make me a great or even a good player. Was it hilarious though? Hell yes. There were maybe a dozen of us defending, no way I could do that without Eye of the Overpowered.
That said I agree on all of your other points.
See no one said there weren't differences or advantages/disadvantages for both. Where things went wrong was telling players what they can or cannot do. Saying a player cannot possibly win is a gross overstatement - there are simply too many variables (especially in open world) to make such a statement so conclusively. And of course you're gonna make someone mad saying that the only way they can win is by beating inexperienced players.
I know for a fact @psychotic13 is an experienced player and is more than capable of making informed decisions regarding the game and mechanics there within - to say any of the players in this discussion (or really forum goers in general) are poor (especially based simply on weapon choice) is really incorrect.2 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »Waffennacht wrote: »I don't understand why sustainability would be any different with destro rather than DW.
The regen stats would be the same, I don't know many players that heavy attack destro main for sustain. Resto heavy attacks do that, and both versions run it.
Destro offers one spammable ability (that's mediocre damage) it doesn't offer sustain.
Ward, Curse, Pet =3 abilities = very good chances of frag proc. No need for a spammable destro move to proc frag.
Resto can't be reflected or dodged meaning much better for resources than destro heavy attack, plus ticks higher than lightning staff.
My point is sustain and pressure can be maintained with a resto staff - which both versions run.
I really don't see why there would be such a supposed difference.
It's the inferno medium weave. It constantly gives you a neat chunk resources back without any drawbacks.
Resto is a channel, so it can be interrupted or you simply get damaged while doing it. It also lowers your dps, since it can't be weaved. That's not worth the extra magicka, unless you're really desperate.
Medium attacks don't restore any resources. Resto staff heavy attacks (or lightning or any heavy attacks for that matter) can't be interrupted. So, I'm the one spreading misinformation here right? Sounds quite the opposite to me.
Last time I checked, I saw a blue hue and my ult charged. Also, I'm pretty sure a frag to your face might feel pretty interruptive.
Go ahead, heavy resto your way to victory!
x'DDD0 -
Kutsuu✭✭✭✭✭IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »Waffennacht wrote: »I don't understand why sustainability would be any different with destro rather than DW.
The regen stats would be the same, I don't know many players that heavy attack destro main for sustain. Resto heavy attacks do that, and both versions run it.
Destro offers one spammable ability (that's mediocre damage) it doesn't offer sustain.
Ward, Curse, Pet =3 abilities = very good chances of frag proc. No need for a spammable destro move to proc frag.
Resto can't be reflected or dodged meaning much better for resources than destro heavy attack, plus ticks higher than lightning staff.
My point is sustain and pressure can be maintained with a resto staff - which both versions run.
I really don't see why there would be such a supposed difference.
It's the inferno medium weave. It constantly gives you a neat chunk resources back without any drawbacks.
Resto is a channel, so it can be interrupted or you simply get damaged while doing it. It also lowers your dps, since it can't be weaved. That's not worth the extra magicka, unless you're really desperate.
Medium attacks don't restore any resources. Resto staff heavy attacks (or lightning or any heavy attacks for that matter) can't be interrupted. So, I'm the one spreading misinformation here right? Sounds quite the opposite to me.
Last time I checked, I saw a blue hue and my ult charged. Also, I'm pretty sure a frag to your face might feel pretty interruptive.
Go ahead, heavy resto your way to victory!
x'DDD
You get ult for medium attacking, or even light attacking. You only get a magicka return for a fully charged one. Resto channel is more effective for pure resource sustain purposes since the passive makes it return extra magicka. It also can't be dodged or reflected, so it has valuable uses outside of just resource sustain. You'll never be channeling resto for pure DPS...Edited by Kutsuu on 16 December 2016 03:59PC/NA
Envy Me - Sorc
Kutsus - NB
Kutsmuffin - Temp
Kutsuu the Destroyer - NB
Kutsuu - Temp
Natsu Dragoneel - DK
Kutsumo - NB0 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »Waffennacht wrote: »I don't understand why sustainability would be any different with destro rather than DW.
The regen stats would be the same, I don't know many players that heavy attack destro main for sustain. Resto heavy attacks do that, and both versions run it.
Destro offers one spammable ability (that's mediocre damage) it doesn't offer sustain.
Ward, Curse, Pet =3 abilities = very good chances of frag proc. No need for a spammable destro move to proc frag.
Resto can't be reflected or dodged meaning much better for resources than destro heavy attack, plus ticks higher than lightning staff.
My point is sustain and pressure can be maintained with a resto staff - which both versions run.
I really don't see why there would be such a supposed difference.
It's the inferno medium weave. It constantly gives you a neat chunk resources back without any drawbacks.
Resto is a channel, so it can be interrupted or you simply get damaged while doing it. It also lowers your dps, since it can't be weaved. That's not worth the extra magicka, unless you're really desperate.
Medium attacks don't restore any resources. Resto staff heavy attacks (or lightning or any heavy attacks for that matter) can't be interrupted. So, I'm the one spreading misinformation here right? Sounds quite the opposite to me.
Last time I checked, I saw a blue hue and my ult charged. Also, I'm pretty sure a frag to your face might feel pretty interruptive.
Go ahead, heavy resto your way to victory!
x'DDD
You get ult for medium attacking, or even light attacking. You only get a magicka return for a fully charged one. Resto channel is more effective for pure resource sustain purposes since the passive makes it return extra magicka. It also can't be dodged or reflected, so it has valuable uses outside of just resource sustain. You'll never be channeling resto for pure DPS...
I dunno, man. Maybe it was a fully charged heavy that gave me magicka. With all the broken animations at the moment, it seems likely.
Still, heavy resto costs time and stuff and this was my main point, DW is lacking pressure. This breaks it. I don't wanna trash talk Psycho's build here. If it's fun and works moderately well, fine! People just shouldn't act like DW and pets are in the same tier as desto/resto, because they really are not. That's all I wanted.0 -
Gothren✭✭✭✭✭IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »psychotic13 wrote: »psychotic13 wrote: »IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »Guys, the burst damage of DW is simply not enough. All that theoretical damage math goes down the drain when your opponent blocks or dodges for a second.
Even when DW sorcs were viable, around Orsinium, the general opinion was that destro was more competitive since it wasn't countered as hard. That was before Trapping Webs was made obsolete, when Streak dropped block, when we had a magical Dawnbreaker finisher, and when pure damage sets like Julianos were maintainable in PvP, before SOMEONE decided to swing a cost increase bat at us.
Speaking of, I feel a lot like Glen in regards to sorc nerfs in the past.
You can't just burst any correctly geared player down these days. You have to apply pressure and gain the upper hand, then time your burst and pray to Auri-El the stars may align. This forces sorcs into destro and is a big reason why they're struggling, EotS apart.
Also, Mina, you don't empower every frag with DW. You empower with Entropy or very rarely Meteor. You re-apply Entropy every 15 seconds for the DOT, everything else is a dps loss. The time it takes you to cast Entropy just for empower is better spent on Fury. Or a shield.
Curse can't be empowered. Neither Meteor. Thaumaturge also doesn't strengthen pseudo-dots like they used to. Speaking of Curse and Proxy det. You're also missing medium attacks for damage, enchants/poison, resource gain, ultimate gain and status effects. And that additional set bonus is meaningless with lich proc and set jewelry now.
Seriously, DW sorcs these days are not even at 33% percent of their former strength. They are laughable and not competitive at all.
Play a DW build if you want, but don't you dare spreading misinformation about it and then even go as far as calling out one of the very best sorc players we have.
You're the one spreading misinformation here mate. Saying that dual wield sorcs aren't competitive at all and in your words "laughable" is well... laughable because you clearly haven't even tried the build that is being discussed. That "theoretical damage math" is what the game is built on, its all math and formulas. If you theoretically have the damage potential to take down someone with 30k, then its only a matter of time before you pull of your burst correctly.
Fyi you actually gain an extra enchant on dual wield, don't know if you read previous posts but apparently not. You know you can swing those swords and you should swing your swords, just like templars do. Ultimate gain isn't an issue if you know what you're doing and actually swap bars often enough to apply your Curse with a light attack (because you probably haven't noticed, but it is on the back bar in this build, so you do proc the ultimate gain from resto light attacking every 4 seconds, which is more often than needed).
Oh and yeah, I too just called out one of the best sorc players you have, because well... although maybe "good" not exactly well informed.
Well... "mate"... I have played my fair share of DW sorc and I have toyed around with pets and had Curse on the back bar and everything else you're discussing here. It didn't work well when DW was at its peak, it works way less now.
If you wanna play that way, by all means, do so, but expect backlash.
Just because it didn't work well for you, doesn't mean it doesn't work. Takes a while to get used to as it's a completely different playstyle from your normal destro sorc, and 'toying around' isn't going to give you success you need to put the time in to get good with it.
But as for saying it's laughable? Not competitive? And don't I dare spread misinformation lol who are you? I've never said this build is to 1vX it's better at duels/small scale as it's primarily single target damage. I've shown it can work in both of those scenarios against good players, why you can't accept that I don't know. I would love to duel some of you who say the burst isn't enough, how did you come to that conclusion? Cause I can get around 20k Frags in PvP, that with curse, the damage from the familiar, an endless fury and Dawnbreaker will wipe out pretty much anything.
So you're the one spreading 'misinformation' so just wind your neck in
Honey, you have killed some unexperienced players with it and think, that it's good. You can use anything vs bad or medium players and succeed.
But dual wield Sorc is not viable vs good enemies.
Well 'honey', all of the people in the video were decent players with most being at the cap and having a good rank, the video you shared half of them are under cap, and you have to Destro ULT them with imperial physique. Can you just not comment in this thread now thanks.
Unlike you, I was against many enemies at the same time.
Don't even compare myself to you. You have killed some noobs that don't know what they are doing, I have killed 10 of them at the same time, many times.
Rank and Cp means nothing. I was against a max level player earlier. He was constantly fighting my pets, without realizing that he was fighting a players pets (mine) He just came again and again and let me swallow his stones.
@Dracane Didn't he say that the build was intended for small scale and duels?
And didn't you yourself remind everyone here that 1vX is not possible against good players? So dual wield is perfectly viable in 1vX situations.
Also what's the point of taking credit for killing a couple of noobs with the destro ult? Like seriously? Anyone can do that who knows what he's doing. 1vX is nothing special, I mean any Flawless Conqueror can do it, after all its the same as taking on a few mobs. Its hell of a lot of fun for sure, but bragging about it is unnecessary. It does demand concentration and quick reactions. But here you're telling someone who has been doing the exact same thing as you (meaning wiping solo 10 people) to not compare himself to you. I've been there and seen it, @psychotic13 has taken on groups by himself (cause I would end up dead) and wiped them without the destro ultimate using this exact build that he posted here. Just because he didn't catch the clips doesn't make him a worse player than you. The opposite has also happened, he'd end up dead and I'd have a bunch of idiots on me, and I'd take them out with my good old Shooting Star and no pets for the noobs to beat on to buy me time.
Wiping whole zergs of 50 people with a small group of 6 players, that's already more impressive, because that actually demands organization and team work as well as demanding everything you need in solo play.
Also don't take yourself too seriously. I mean if you think that magicka nightblades are really the best for vMA, just means you don't know much outside of PvP. Saying that magicka sorcerers don't do good DPS, is also nonsense as they are just as good as a magicka DK in terms of numbers (most of the time, even higher) and they are able to pull those numbers (50k+) from full range. Saying that heavy armor does more damage on a magicka sorc is pretty stupid too, as the Wrath passive doesn't actually work when you have a shield up. So you're a good player, but not very well informed. So stop being so up yourself and be a little open minded, will you? You don't know everything about the sorcerer class and stop acting like you do. None one does.
Here is the thing: go on and adapt your build for dual wield. Go out 1vXing and record the clips. I'm sure you'll get the same results. Then we'll argue about dual wield being viable or not. Don't tell me that you've already done it and what-not, just please do it, I'd like to see the results.
If you were talking about duels, well when you have a pet build, it doesn't really matter if you dual wild or not because the sustained pressure and the line of sight is there to help you place your burst. A non pet dual wield build, which is what I run? It relies on your opponent to make a mistake, so against a good player, a fight can take ages. But mistakes are human and they will happen at some point.
You should shorten your posts. It's so annoying to answer all of it.
-Mag Nightblade has higher scores in vMA, so they perform better.
-Heavy armor deals more damage in certain situations. Vs damage shields and low resistance targets.
-I'm not taking any advise from a scrub like you. I know everything about this class and don't need your liddle theories to make me insecure. I'm just laughing about your lack of knowledge about pvp. You and any other Sorc would have turned into a pile of ash during some fights that I had. No matter if it is the destro ult or not, not even that would help you.
You're just a little too proud of crutching that hard on the destro ultimate in that video, which most likely has a massive nerf incoming. Do you really think you'd pull a 50v1 like that off without it? If so, lets see it. I'll even give you meteor to use.
Monday night I pulled 30+ kills on the Nickel back flag with one fire destro ult. Wiping a raid doesn't make me a great or even a good player. Was it hilarious though? Hell yes. There were maybe a dozen of us defending, no way I could do that without Eye of the Overpowered.
That said I agree on all of your other points.
doesn't look like there was any crutching going on. the rotations were solid and on point. if potatoes want to die to that ultimate its their fault. im amazed all you saw was destroy ultimate.Edited by Gothren on 16 December 2016 05:111 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »psychotic13 wrote: »psychotic13 wrote: »IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »Guys, the burst damage of DW is simply not enough. All that theoretical damage math goes down the drain when your opponent blocks or dodges for a second.
Even when DW sorcs were viable, around Orsinium, the general opinion was that destro was more competitive since it wasn't countered as hard. That was before Trapping Webs was made obsolete, when Streak dropped block, when we had a magical Dawnbreaker finisher, and when pure damage sets like Julianos were maintainable in PvP, before SOMEONE decided to swing a cost increase bat at us.
Speaking of, I feel a lot like Glen in regards to sorc nerfs in the past.
You can't just burst any correctly geared player down these days. You have to apply pressure and gain the upper hand, then time your burst and pray to Auri-El the stars may align. This forces sorcs into destro and is a big reason why they're struggling, EotS apart.
Also, Mina, you don't empower every frag with DW. You empower with Entropy or very rarely Meteor. You re-apply Entropy every 15 seconds for the DOT, everything else is a dps loss. The time it takes you to cast Entropy just for empower is better spent on Fury. Or a shield.
Curse can't be empowered. Neither Meteor. Thaumaturge also doesn't strengthen pseudo-dots like they used to. Speaking of Curse and Proxy det. You're also missing medium attacks for damage, enchants/poison, resource gain, ultimate gain and status effects. And that additional set bonus is meaningless with lich proc and set jewelry now.
Seriously, DW sorcs these days are not even at 33% percent of their former strength. They are laughable and not competitive at all.
Play a DW build if you want, but don't you dare spreading misinformation about it and then even go as far as calling out one of the very best sorc players we have.
You're the one spreading misinformation here mate. Saying that dual wield sorcs aren't competitive at all and in your words "laughable" is well... laughable because you clearly haven't even tried the build that is being discussed. That "theoretical damage math" is what the game is built on, its all math and formulas. If you theoretically have the damage potential to take down someone with 30k, then its only a matter of time before you pull of your burst correctly.
Fyi you actually gain an extra enchant on dual wield, don't know if you read previous posts but apparently not. You know you can swing those swords and you should swing your swords, just like templars do. Ultimate gain isn't an issue if you know what you're doing and actually swap bars often enough to apply your Curse with a light attack (because you probably haven't noticed, but it is on the back bar in this build, so you do proc the ultimate gain from resto light attacking every 4 seconds, which is more often than needed).
Oh and yeah, I too just called out one of the best sorc players you have, because well... although maybe "good" not exactly well informed.
Well... "mate"... I have played my fair share of DW sorc and I have toyed around with pets and had Curse on the back bar and everything else you're discussing here. It didn't work well when DW was at its peak, it works way less now.
If you wanna play that way, by all means, do so, but expect backlash.
Just because it didn't work well for you, doesn't mean it doesn't work. Takes a while to get used to as it's a completely different playstyle from your normal destro sorc, and 'toying around' isn't going to give you success you need to put the time in to get good with it.
But as for saying it's laughable? Not competitive? And don't I dare spread misinformation lol who are you? I've never said this build is to 1vX it's better at duels/small scale as it's primarily single target damage. I've shown it can work in both of those scenarios against good players, why you can't accept that I don't know. I would love to duel some of you who say the burst isn't enough, how did you come to that conclusion? Cause I can get around 20k Frags in PvP, that with curse, the damage from the familiar, an endless fury and Dawnbreaker will wipe out pretty much anything.
So you're the one spreading 'misinformation' so just wind your neck in
Honey, you have killed some unexperienced players with it and think, that it's good. You can use anything vs bad or medium players and succeed.
But dual wield Sorc is not viable vs good enemies.
Well 'honey', all of the people in the video were decent players with most being at the cap and having a good rank, the video you shared half of them are under cap, and you have to Destro ULT them with imperial physique. Can you just not comment in this thread now thanks.
Unlike you, I was against many enemies at the same time.
Don't even compare myself to you. You have killed some noobs that don't know what they are doing, I have killed 10 of them at the same time, many times.
Rank and Cp means nothing. I was against a max level player earlier. He was constantly fighting my pets, without realizing that he was fighting a players pets (mine) He just came again and again and let me swallow his stones.
@Dracane Didn't he say that the build was intended for small scale and duels?
And didn't you yourself remind everyone here that 1vX is not possible against good players? So dual wield is perfectly viable in 1vX situations.
Also what's the point of taking credit for killing a couple of noobs with the destro ult? Like seriously? Anyone can do that who knows what he's doing. 1vX is nothing special, I mean any Flawless Conqueror can do it, after all its the same as taking on a few mobs. Its hell of a lot of fun for sure, but bragging about it is unnecessary. It does demand concentration and quick reactions. But here you're telling someone who has been doing the exact same thing as you (meaning wiping solo 10 people) to not compare himself to you. I've been there and seen it, @psychotic13 has taken on groups by himself (cause I would end up dead) and wiped them without the destro ultimate using this exact build that he posted here. Just because he didn't catch the clips doesn't make him a worse player than you. The opposite has also happened, he'd end up dead and I'd have a bunch of idiots on me, and I'd take them out with my good old Shooting Star and no pets for the noobs to beat on to buy me time.
Wiping whole zergs of 50 people with a small group of 6 players, that's already more impressive, because that actually demands organization and team work as well as demanding everything you need in solo play.
Also don't take yourself too seriously. I mean if you think that magicka nightblades are really the best for vMA, just means you don't know much outside of PvP. Saying that magicka sorcerers don't do good DPS, is also nonsense as they are just as good as a magicka DK in terms of numbers (most of the time, even higher) and they are able to pull those numbers (50k+) from full range. Saying that heavy armor does more damage on a magicka sorc is pretty stupid too, as the Wrath passive doesn't actually work when you have a shield up. So you're a good player, but not very well informed. So stop being so up yourself and be a little open minded, will you? You don't know everything about the sorcerer class and stop acting like you do. None one does.
Here is the thing: go on and adapt your build for dual wield. Go out 1vXing and record the clips. I'm sure you'll get the same results. Then we'll argue about dual wield being viable or not. Don't tell me that you've already done it and what-not, just please do it, I'd like to see the results.
If you were talking about duels, well when you have a pet build, it doesn't really matter if you dual wild or not because the sustained pressure and the line of sight is there to help you place your burst. A non pet dual wield build, which is what I run? It relies on your opponent to make a mistake, so against a good player, a fight can take ages. But mistakes are human and they will happen at some point.
You should shorten your posts. It's so annoying to answer all of it.
-Mag Nightblade has higher scores in vMA, so they perform better.
-Heavy armor deals more damage in certain situations. Vs damage shields and low resistance targets.
-I'm not taking any advise from a scrub like you. I know everything about this class and don't need your liddle theories to make me insecure. I'm just laughing about your lack of knowledge about pvp. You and any other Sorc would have turned into a pile of ash during some fights that I had. No matter if it is the destro ult or not, not even that would help you.
You're just a little too proud of crutching that hard on the destro ultimate in that video, which most likely has a massive nerf incoming. Do you really think you'd pull a 50v1 like that off without it? If so, lets see it. I'll even give you meteor to use.
Monday night I pulled 30+ kills on the Nickel back flag with one fire destro ult. Wiping a raid doesn't make me a great or even a good player. Was it hilarious though? Hell yes. There were maybe a dozen of us defending, no way I could do that without Eye of the Overpowered.
That said I agree on all of your other points.
doesn't look like there was any crutching going on. the rotations were solid and on point. if potatoes want to die to that ultimate its their fault. im amazed all you saw was destroy ultimate.
Oh please. 90% of those kills were the destro ult. You don't 1v50 with f****** crystal frags and force pulse.
I'm not saying it wasn't awesome to watch and really funny, but destro ult kills aren't something you come to the forums to validate your amazing skills.2 -
Izaki✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »psychotic13 wrote: »psychotic13 wrote: »IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »Guys, the burst damage of DW is simply not enough. All that theoretical damage math goes down the drain when your opponent blocks or dodges for a second.
Even when DW sorcs were viable, around Orsinium, the general opinion was that destro was more competitive since it wasn't countered as hard. That was before Trapping Webs was made obsolete, when Streak dropped block, when we had a magical Dawnbreaker finisher, and when pure damage sets like Julianos were maintainable in PvP, before SOMEONE decided to swing a cost increase bat at us.
Speaking of, I feel a lot like Glen in regards to sorc nerfs in the past.
You can't just burst any correctly geared player down these days. You have to apply pressure and gain the upper hand, then time your burst and pray to Auri-El the stars may align. This forces sorcs into destro and is a big reason why they're struggling, EotS apart.
Also, Mina, you don't empower every frag with DW. You empower with Entropy or very rarely Meteor. You re-apply Entropy every 15 seconds for the DOT, everything else is a dps loss. The time it takes you to cast Entropy just for empower is better spent on Fury. Or a shield.
Curse can't be empowered. Neither Meteor. Thaumaturge also doesn't strengthen pseudo-dots like they used to. Speaking of Curse and Proxy det. You're also missing medium attacks for damage, enchants/poison, resource gain, ultimate gain and status effects. And that additional set bonus is meaningless with lich proc and set jewelry now.
Seriously, DW sorcs these days are not even at 33% percent of their former strength. They are laughable and not competitive at all.
Play a DW build if you want, but don't you dare spreading misinformation about it and then even go as far as calling out one of the very best sorc players we have.
You're the one spreading misinformation here mate. Saying that dual wield sorcs aren't competitive at all and in your words "laughable" is well... laughable because you clearly haven't even tried the build that is being discussed. That "theoretical damage math" is what the game is built on, its all math and formulas. If you theoretically have the damage potential to take down someone with 30k, then its only a matter of time before you pull of your burst correctly.
Fyi you actually gain an extra enchant on dual wield, don't know if you read previous posts but apparently not. You know you can swing those swords and you should swing your swords, just like templars do. Ultimate gain isn't an issue if you know what you're doing and actually swap bars often enough to apply your Curse with a light attack (because you probably haven't noticed, but it is on the back bar in this build, so you do proc the ultimate gain from resto light attacking every 4 seconds, which is more often than needed).
Oh and yeah, I too just called out one of the best sorc players you have, because well... although maybe "good" not exactly well informed.
Well... "mate"... I have played my fair share of DW sorc and I have toyed around with pets and had Curse on the back bar and everything else you're discussing here. It didn't work well when DW was at its peak, it works way less now.
If you wanna play that way, by all means, do so, but expect backlash.
Just because it didn't work well for you, doesn't mean it doesn't work. Takes a while to get used to as it's a completely different playstyle from your normal destro sorc, and 'toying around' isn't going to give you success you need to put the time in to get good with it.
But as for saying it's laughable? Not competitive? And don't I dare spread misinformation lol who are you? I've never said this build is to 1vX it's better at duels/small scale as it's primarily single target damage. I've shown it can work in both of those scenarios against good players, why you can't accept that I don't know. I would love to duel some of you who say the burst isn't enough, how did you come to that conclusion? Cause I can get around 20k Frags in PvP, that with curse, the damage from the familiar, an endless fury and Dawnbreaker will wipe out pretty much anything.
So you're the one spreading 'misinformation' so just wind your neck in
Honey, you have killed some unexperienced players with it and think, that it's good. You can use anything vs bad or medium players and succeed.
But dual wield Sorc is not viable vs good enemies.
Well 'honey', all of the people in the video were decent players with most being at the cap and having a good rank, the video you shared half of them are under cap, and you have to Destro ULT them with imperial physique. Can you just not comment in this thread now thanks.
Unlike you, I was against many enemies at the same time.
Don't even compare myself to you. You have killed some noobs that don't know what they are doing, I have killed 10 of them at the same time, many times.
Rank and Cp means nothing. I was against a max level player earlier. He was constantly fighting my pets, without realizing that he was fighting a players pets (mine) He just came again and again and let me swallow his stones.
@Dracane Didn't he say that the build was intended for small scale and duels?
And didn't you yourself remind everyone here that 1vX is not possible against good players? So dual wield is perfectly viable in 1vX situations.
Also what's the point of taking credit for killing a couple of noobs with the destro ult? Like seriously? Anyone can do that who knows what he's doing. 1vX is nothing special, I mean any Flawless Conqueror can do it, after all its the same as taking on a few mobs. Its hell of a lot of fun for sure, but bragging about it is unnecessary. It does demand concentration and quick reactions. But here you're telling someone who has been doing the exact same thing as you (meaning wiping solo 10 people) to not compare himself to you. I've been there and seen it, @psychotic13 has taken on groups by himself (cause I would end up dead) and wiped them without the destro ultimate using this exact build that he posted here. Just because he didn't catch the clips doesn't make him a worse player than you. The opposite has also happened, he'd end up dead and I'd have a bunch of idiots on me, and I'd take them out with my good old Shooting Star and no pets for the noobs to beat on to buy me time.
Wiping whole zergs of 50 people with a small group of 6 players, that's already more impressive, because that actually demands organization and team work as well as demanding everything you need in solo play.
Also don't take yourself too seriously. I mean if you think that magicka nightblades are really the best for vMA, just means you don't know much outside of PvP. Saying that magicka sorcerers don't do good DPS, is also nonsense as they are just as good as a magicka DK in terms of numbers (most of the time, even higher) and they are able to pull those numbers (50k+) from full range. Saying that heavy armor does more damage on a magicka sorc is pretty stupid too, as the Wrath passive doesn't actually work when you have a shield up. So you're a good player, but not very well informed. So stop being so up yourself and be a little open minded, will you? You don't know everything about the sorcerer class and stop acting like you do. None one does.
Here is the thing: go on and adapt your build for dual wield. Go out 1vXing and record the clips. I'm sure you'll get the same results. Then we'll argue about dual wield being viable or not. Don't tell me that you've already done it and what-not, just please do it, I'd like to see the results.
If you were talking about duels, well when you have a pet build, it doesn't really matter if you dual wild or not because the sustained pressure and the line of sight is there to help you place your burst. A non pet dual wield build, which is what I run? It relies on your opponent to make a mistake, so against a good player, a fight can take ages. But mistakes are human and they will happen at some point.
You should shorten your posts. It's so annoying to answer all of it.
-Mag Nightblade has higher scores in vMA, so they perform better.
-Heavy armor deals more damage in certain situations. Vs damage shields and low resistance targets.
-I'm not taking any advise from a scrub like you. I know everything about this class and don't need your liddle theories to make me insecure. I'm just laughing about your lack of knowledge about pvp. You and any other Sorc would have turned into a pile of ash during some fights that I had. No matter if it is the destro ult or not, not even that would help you.
You sure made me laugh withyour post.
- its been since Dark Brotherhood that Stam Sorcs were the best class with highest scores for vMa. 601k score. No other class has broken the 600k.
- It doesnt if the attacker has a damage shield cause wrath doesnt proc.
- if you say so. You really do need to get out more. Nonetheless my point stands, you don't have any arguments so the only thing you do is call every one a scrub and claim you're the best, etc. etc. Grow up a little will you.@ Izaki #PCEU
#FrenchKiss #GoneFor2YearsAndMyGuildDoesn'tRaidAnymore
#MoreDPSthanYou
#Stamblade2 -
Izaki✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »Waffennacht wrote: »I don't understand why sustainability would be any different with destro rather than DW.
The regen stats would be the same, I don't know many players that heavy attack destro main for sustain. Resto heavy attacks do that, and both versions run it.
Destro offers one spammable ability (that's mediocre damage) it doesn't offer sustain.
Ward, Curse, Pet =3 abilities = very good chances of frag proc. No need for a spammable destro move to proc frag.
Resto can't be reflected or dodged meaning much better for resources than destro heavy attack, plus ticks higher than lightning staff.
My point is sustain and pressure can be maintained with a resto staff - which both versions run.
I really don't see why there would be such a supposed difference.
It's the inferno medium weave. It constantly gives you a neat chunk resources back without any drawbacks.
Resto is a channel, so it can be interrupted or you simply get damaged while doing it. It also lowers your dps, since it can't be weaved. That's not worth the extra magicka, unless you're really desperate.
Medium attacks don't restore any resources. Resto staff heavy attacks (or lightning or any heavy attacks for that matter) can't be interrupted. So, I'm the one spreading misinformation here right? Sounds quite the opposite to me.
Last time I checked, I saw a blue hue and my ult charged. Also, I'm pretty sure a frag to your face might feel pretty interruptive.
Go ahead, heavy resto your way to victory!
x'DDD
You get ult for medium attacking, or even light attacking. You only get a magicka return for a fully charged one. Resto channel is more effective for pure resource sustain purposes since the passive makes it return extra magicka. It also can't be dodged or reflected, so it has valuable uses outside of just resource sustain. You'll never be channeling resto for pure DPS...
I dunno, man. Maybe it was a fully charged heavy that gave me magicka. With all the broken animations at the moment, it seems likely.
Still, heavy resto costs time and stuff and this was my main point, DW is lacking pressure. This breaks it. I don't wanna trash talk Psycho's build here. If it's fun and works moderately well, fine! People just shouldn't act like DW and pets are in the same tier as desto/resto, because they really are not. That's all I wanted.
Yeah all fully charged heavy attacks with any weapon restore resources. What you must have been experiencing with medium destro weaves wasn't lag, it's probably just the regen kicking in at the same time as you were doing your medium attacks.
Except when you run DW you don't need the fully charged heavy resto attack, because you don't run out of resources in the first place, which essentially means being on the offensive more and placing your burst more often.
Here the thing as @Kutsuu said, in the hands of a good player both are perfectly viable. No point in saying it isn't in the same "league" as destro, because it is. You don't need sustained pressure in your standard PvP, because 70% of the players you'll come across aren't that good. Both with DW and destro you get your kills quickly. The only legit advantage that destro has is the destro ultimate, which is beyond OP and can wipe out half a zerg in 7 seconds.@ Izaki #PCEU
#FrenchKiss #GoneFor2YearsAndMyGuildDoesn'tRaidAnymore
#MoreDPSthanYou
#Stamblade0 -
RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Hey guys take it easy on @Dracane She is entitled to her opinion just like everyone else.
Choice of weapon, skills, staff vs dual wield really comes down to preference. Guys like Tamerlin and Qaevir are able to make Dual wield work for them just fine because it fits their style of play. I tried Dual Wield, but it just doesn't fit my playstyle.
Certain sets ups have advantages and disadvantages in different situations. The style you use really comes down to your preference and how you wish to play.
Rinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
Juste Gandolphi Dark Elf Templar Daggerfall Covenant
Richter Gandolphi - Dark Elf Dragonknight Daggerfall Covenant
Mathias Gandolphi - Breton Nightblade Daggerfall Covenant
RinaldoGandolphi - High Elf Sorcerer Aldmeri Dominion
Officer Fire and Ice
Co-GM - MVP
Sorcerer's - The ONLY class in the game that is punished for using its class defining skill (Bolt Escape)
"Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak0 -
Kutsuu✭✭✭✭✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Hey guys take it easy on @Dracane She is entitled to her opinion just like everyone else.
Choice of weapon, skills, staff vs dual wield really comes down to preference. Guys like Tamerlin and Qaevir are able to make Dual wield work for them just fine because it fits their style of play. I tried Dual Wield, but it just doesn't fit my playstyle.
Certain sets ups have advantages and disadvantages in different situations. The style you use really comes down to your preference and how you wish to play.
I guess she's also entitled to shitting on everyone else's opinion? Because that's the only reason people aren't taking it easy.PC/NA
Envy Me - Sorc
Kutsus - NB
Kutsmuffin - Temp
Kutsuu the Destroyer - NB
Kutsuu - Temp
Natsu Dragoneel - DK
Kutsumo - NB1 -
RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Hey guys take it easy on @Dracane She is entitled to her opinion just like everyone else.
Choice of weapon, skills, staff vs dual wield really comes down to preference. Guys like Tamerlin and Qaevir are able to make Dual wield work for them just fine because it fits their style of play. I tried Dual Wield, but it just doesn't fit my playstyle.
Certain sets ups have advantages and disadvantages in different situations. The style you use really comes down to your preference and how you wish to play.
I guess she's also entitled to shitting on everyone else's opinion? Because that's the only reason people aren't taking it easy.
I didn't see anything in @Dracane original post with her video that in anyway warranted some sort of argument that has gone as it has. She stated her opinion why she didn't think Duel wield was good this patch for Sorc, made some valid points why she felt that was the case, and then showed a video of some tanky players she had to kill with sustained DPS pressure she feels would not be possible with dual wield.
Then folks started piling on her about how "she only won because she used OP broke Desto Ultimate" and blah blah....which was totally uncalled for, of course she is going to get defensive when being outright attacked on here for her playstyle, ....she isn't using any broken proc sets or anything else, she was vastly outnumbered, and yet she found a way to win...Destro Ultimate or not she found a way to win when most people probably would not have been able to.
Did she really deserve such criticism for merely posting her opinion? I don't think she did. I also don't think its fair for piling one someone using a Destro Ultimate as a solo player facing 5 times their number, considering the rest of the Desto Skill line sucks compared to other weapons.
The attacking and fighting in this thread wasn't started by her, and its unfair people started piling on her for merely stating her opinion.
Dracane and I go way back on these forums, its rare for me to take anyone side in any of these squabbles, but this time i feel the piling on she is taking here is unwarranted. The statements ridiculing or somehow trying to put down her video was just in poor taste, and not called for.
Rinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
Juste Gandolphi Dark Elf Templar Daggerfall Covenant
Richter Gandolphi - Dark Elf Dragonknight Daggerfall Covenant
Mathias Gandolphi - Breton Nightblade Daggerfall Covenant
RinaldoGandolphi - High Elf Sorcerer Aldmeri Dominion
Officer Fire and Ice
Co-GM - MVP
Sorcerer's - The ONLY class in the game that is punished for using its class defining skill (Bolt Escape)
"Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak1 -
Kutsuu✭✭✭✭✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Hey guys take it easy on @Dracane She is entitled to her opinion just like everyone else.
Choice of weapon, skills, staff vs dual wield really comes down to preference. Guys like Tamerlin and Qaevir are able to make Dual wield work for them just fine because it fits their style of play. I tried Dual Wield, but it just doesn't fit my playstyle.
Certain sets ups have advantages and disadvantages in different situations. The style you use really comes down to your preference and how you wish to play.
I guess she's also entitled to shitting on everyone else's opinion? Because that's the only reason people aren't taking it easy.
I didn't see anything in @Dracane original post with her video that in anyway warranted some sort of argument that has gone as it has. She stated her opinion why she didn't think Duel wield was good this patch for Sorc, made some valid points why she felt that was the case, and then showed a video of some tanky players she had to kill with sustained DPS pressure she feels would not be possible with dual wield.
Then folks started piling on her about how "she only won because she used OP broke Desto Ultimate" and blah blah....which was totally uncalled for, of course she is going to get defensive when being outright attacked on here for her playstyle, ....she isn't using any broken proc sets or anything else, she was vastly outnumbered, and yet she found a way to win...Destro Ultimate or not she found a way to win when most people probably would not have been able to.
Did she really deserve such criticism for merely posting her opinion? I don't think she did. I also don't think its fair for piling one someone using a Destro Ultimate as a solo player facing 5 times their number, considering the rest of the Desto Skill line sucks compared to other weapons.
The attacking and fighting in this thread wasn't started by her, and its unfair people started piling on her for merely stating her opinion.
Dracane and I go way back on these forums, its rare for me to take anyone side in any of these squabbles, but this time i feel the piling on she is taking here is unwarranted. The statements ridiculing or somehow trying to put down her video was just in poor taste, and not called for.
Ooooh you go way back. I was thinking you were going for the white knight pickup. Mystery solved about the origin of your bias! In any case, I don't think you've objectively paid attention to her combative behavior in here. The discussion was pretty reasonable early on, but she was throwing in "no good sorc would..." and "scrubs" etc to insult anyone who didn't share her opinion.
And come on, that video is of a sorc with a gimmicky imperial physique build in imperial city which already makes it unsuited to prove points with, and most of the kills include a destro ultimate bomb rather than sustained damage.PC/NA
Envy Me - Sorc
Kutsus - NB
Kutsmuffin - Temp
Kutsuu the Destroyer - NB
Kutsuu - Temp
Natsu Dragoneel - DK
Kutsumo - NB2 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »
Why would you duel in anything else but a petbuild on a sorc. People can´t outmaneuver pets in the small dueling area (edit: but why would anyone duel on a sorc (or a magica toon in general).
And why downtime on buffs? BSW is proccing pretty reliably with just staff + crushing shock - way better than scathing mage for example.
I have a whole set of BSW, and I don't run it because it wasn't reliable. At best it has a 2/3 uptime because it's live only 8 out of 12 seconds.
On top of that, it has a 20% proc rate. So you have to spam fire light attacks weaved with force pulse and your good friend ESO RNG always leaves you in a ditch, sometimes as long as half a minute.
I don't get why people rave about that set, I'd rather run Julianos and slimecraw or something. Maybe I just have all the bad luck, but think of it this way. You have an 80% chance of something bad happening (no proc) on every fire attack.Edited by Minalan on 16 December 2016 14:400 -
psychotic13✭✭✭✭✭
✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Hey guys take it easy on @Dracane She is entitled to her opinion just like everyone else.
Choice of weapon, skills, staff vs dual wield really comes down to preference. Guys like Tamerlin and Qaevir are able to make Dual wield work for them just fine because it fits their style of play. I tried Dual Wield, but it just doesn't fit my playstyle.
Certain sets ups have advantages and disadvantages in different situations. The style you use really comes down to your preference and how you wish to play.
I guess she's also entitled to shitting on everyone else's opinion? Because that's the only reason people aren't taking it easy.
I didn't see anything in @Dracane original post with her video that in anyway warranted some sort of argument that has gone as it has. She stated her opinion why she didn't think Duel wield was good this patch for Sorc, made some valid points why she felt that was the case, and then showed a video of some tanky players she had to kill with sustained DPS pressure she feels would not be possible with dual wield.
Then folks started piling on her about how "she only won because she used OP broke Desto Ultimate" and blah blah....which was totally uncalled for, of course she is going to get defensive when being outright attacked on here for her playstyle, ....she isn't using any broken proc sets or anything else, she was vastly outnumbered, and yet she found a way to win...Destro Ultimate or not she found a way to win when most people probably would not have been able to.
Did she really deserve such criticism for merely posting her opinion? I don't think she did. I also don't think its fair for piling one someone using a Destro Ultimate as a solo player facing 5 times their number, considering the rest of the Desto Skill line sucks compared to other weapons.
The attacking and fighting in this thread wasn't started by her, and its unfair people started piling on her for merely stating her opinion.
Dracane and I go way back on these forums, its rare for me to take anyone side in any of these squabbles, but this time i feel the piling on she is taking here is unwarranted. The statements ridiculing or somehow trying to put down her video was just in poor taste, and not called for.
Ok so when someone spends the time to create a build thread to share with others, the right thing to do is to say it's not viable, I couldn't wish to have killed the targets she was fighting and post videos of herself, hijack much, shut up.
And then to carry on saying it's not viable and it doesn't work several times, call people scrubs and that no one has the knowledge of the class like she does lol take your tongue out of her ass you idiot. If I was to post on someone's build thread telling them it won't work and start posting videos of myself using imperial physique and using the Destro ult I'd get roasted, and deservingly so.Edited by psychotic13 on 16 December 2016 14:410
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7I2-14y6-jM