Exploiters selling their cheap mats and getting rich

Daraugh · May 2016

gw2only1b14_ESO · May 2016

lathbury wrote: »

cote-bmsb16_ESO wrote: »

I couldn't give to craps about the exploiters getting rich. They are only making personal gains, I'm not being affected. The only way it could possibly hurt me is if I buy tempers pff them, oh wait. They sell them cheaper than what regular farmers would sell them for.. Thanks for the deal!

see the post above yours. but aside from the economy damage the main problem here is the precedent it sets and the feeling of impunity exploiters will garner from this. not to mention the advantages having a lot of gold gives exploiters over people who play fair.

Ill throw in the fact the extra gold influx allows they to lock down guild Traders and inflate that all ready f*ed up part of the in game system as well

lathbury · May 2016

I'll add as well the only way to counter the inflation is to add more gold sink cause we all know how much we love bank upgrade prices. also the fact that EU server got pulled in prime time to sort this.

ForsakenSin · May 2016

Last night ive seen 200 gold tempers for sale for 975K

so .. yhea....

Purdomination33 · May 2016

Oh no! We get cheaper materials. The horror!!!

ForsakenSin · May 2016

Purdomination33 wrote: »

Oh no! We get cheaper materials. The horror!!!

I wish ...

975k / 200 is $4875 each which is cheaper by $125 considering one is $5k

i was just surprised by 200 gold tempers and the amount of gold asking which i will never have LOL

Korah_Eaglecry · May 2016

Shadowfx1970 wrote: »

daemonios wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

long and incoherent rant...

1. Nobody forces you to click on these threads. If you're tired of them, ignore them.
2. Part of the reason there is hostility is that exploiting culture is so rampant in ESO. I don't care about people having more gold or mats than me, what I do care is about fairness. When a multiplayer game, especially one with competitive aspects to it, stops feeling fair, people will rant. If it gets bad enough, people will leave. I know this first-hand, as I've quit PvP over the cheating there.

Yes it's unfair but more people are likely to leave or not play the game if they come to the forums and read thread after thread from angry holier than thou players who have never done anything wrong in their whole entire lives *cough* trying to persecute and stone a few people who took advantage of something and were punished.

YEAH! Keep quiet you honest players that play the game as intended! How dare you let newcomers know that there are exploiters in the game taking advantage of things and going unpunished! How dare you share that information with players that may not agree with such behavior and would feel ripped off buying into the game only to realize at how much of a disadvantage they are!

SHAME FOR SHAME!

/s

GrumpStump · May 2016

Would any of you fine ZOS people be willing to let us know why no materials were removed?

@ZOS_DaryaK
@ZOS_AlanG
@ZOS_AntonioP
@ZOS_Finn
@ZOS_RichLambert
@ZOS_Finn
@ZOS_GinaBruno

Thank You

GrumpStump

TX11 · May 2016

GrumpStump wrote: »

Would any of you fine ZOS people be willing to let us know why no materials were removed?

@ZOS_DaryaK
@ZOS_AlanG
@ZOS_AntonioP
@ZOS_Finn
@ZOS_RichLambert
@ZOS_Finn
@ZOS_GinaBruno

Thank You

GrumpStump

we can only hope they will. I for one am very upset people where allowed to keep there illicit gains.

Thornen · May 2016

GrumpStump wrote: »

Would any of you fine ZOS people be willing to let us know why no materials were removed?

@ZOS_DaryaK
@ZOS_AlanG
@ZOS_AntonioP
@ZOS_Finn
@ZOS_RichLambert
@ZOS_Finn
@ZOS_GinaBruno

Thank You

GrumpStump

I'll eat my own hat if this actually gets a response, usually Zos will bury their head in the sand and pretend that this never happened.

Edit: And I was actually hyped for the DB update now I can't give a *** about it due to how useless this company is.

Kildayen · May 2016

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

...? So you'd login to further dehumanize players for an exploit, that they were already punished for by the company of the given game? Regardless of the punishment distributed, you encourage the type of stuff...?

What's really going on with a lot of people in this thread. It's pretty sick. Yes. Exploiting is wrong. YES! But seriously, some of you really need to take a break. Pause. And look at what you all are typing. You have extremes ranging from completely terminating people's accounts, to reducing them to 100-something champion points, to clearing out their inventory and banks, to now implementing a gallows and throwing fruit at people...? Is this really what what some you all here on the forums are really about...? Is that really what you represent...? The humiliation of players and savage means of "getting even"...?

Why, yes! Yes indeed! I'm all about it! You aren't?

Slammer99uk · May 2016

Voice of reason time I guess.

Has it occurred to anyone that ZOS realises the screw ups they had made previously and are trying to avoid them again? I have no inside knowledge (just like everyone on this thread and others like it) but picture this. A lot of people got a 3 day ban for allegedly exploiting a bug, how many of those people do you think raised a case to have their ban reviewed?

The sensible thing to do would be to review all those cases first, determine who had exploited, get proof, then wipe the gold/mats

GrumpStump wrote: »

Would any of you fine ZOS people be willing to let us know why no materials were removed?

@ZOS_DaryaK
@ZOS_AlanG
@ZOS_AntonioP
@ZOS_Finn
@ZOS_RichLambert
@ZOS_Finn
@ZOS_GinaBruno

Thank You

GrumpStump

My thread got closed just for asking IF they were going to be removed or not. Everyone wants to know the answer, but ZOS are doing nothing to inform them.

The level of moderation on here is flaky to say the least.

Good luck, I hope you do get an answer.

Turelus · May 2016

At this point I would just like ZOS to actually explain their security/GM team to us.

I mean, who is actually in charge of game enforcement, or do they really not have anything in place in the way of senior GM's or people who are there to look after that aspect of the game.

As others have said I have always tried to avoid taking part in anything I would consider to be an exploit as well as telling others not to or running guilds with rules against doing so. What's the point though? Why should I bother playing by the rules if I gain nothing from it.

anitajoneb17_ESO · May 2016

Wow wow wow... human nature at its best all over this thread.

My guess is that most people here asking for "hard punishment" are in fact envious of the exploiters and frustrated to not have know of the exploit earlier. They'd have used it no limit if they had known.

andreasv · May 2016

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Wow wow wow... human nature at its best all over this thread.

My guess is that most people here asking for "hard punishment" are in fact envious of the exploiters and frustrated to not have know of the exploit earlier. They'd have used it no limit if they had known.

Absolutely correct. If you had read the whole conversation you could have saved the time to post your comment.

daemonios · May 2016

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Wow wow wow... human nature at its best all over this thread.

My guess is that most people here asking for "hard punishment" are in fact envious of the exploiters and frustrated to not have know of the exploit earlier. They'd have used it no limit if they had known.

One could just as easily say that you and others who support ZOS' half-baked response are the actual exploiters... But that doesn't really serve a purpose other than name-calling, does it?

If you want to discuss, please, go ahead. If you want to throw around baseless accusations, you might as well crawl back into your hole.

Genomic · May 2016

Really disgusts me how the cheaters here are trying to rationalise their behaviour - "cheaper mats", etc. Cheating does *not* make a better community or a better game. Far from it. Unbelievably selfish.

Turelus · May 2016

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Wow wow wow... human nature at its best all over this thread.

My guess is that most people here asking for "hard punishment" are in fact envious of the exploiters and frustrated to not have know of the exploit earlier. They'd have used it no limit if they had known.

I don't think this is people annoyed they didn't abuse it because they didn't know how. I think this is more people are annoyed they don't abuse because it's against the rules, yet in this case (and previous ones) there has been very little punishment for those that do.

Meaning those who don't cheat and abuse exploits are actually at a loss vs those who do, which doesn't create a fair gaming environment and has ZOS setting the precedent that it's better to cheat and reap the rewards than follow the rules.

Malmai · May 2016

Alcast wrote: »

ZENIMAX handled the issue really well.
rewarding exploiters is not a good thing ZOS.
And how do I know? It is quite obvious if people sell materials 2k lower than usual all of the sudden in all zone chats lol.

The small punishment of a 3 day ban just encourages people to exploit again once another opportunity arises

But if they ban these people there will be nobody left xD

Turelus · May 2016

Malmai wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

ZENIMAX handled the issue really well.
rewarding exploiters is not a good thing ZOS.
And how do I know? It is quite obvious if people sell materials 2k lower than usual all of the sudden in all zone chats lol.

The small punishment of a 3 day ban just encourages people to exploit again once another opportunity arises

But if they ban these people there will be nobody left xD

I don't think that's true. Other games with less subscribers than ESO have been harder on exploiters and handed out bans yet continue to be healthy.
There are more casual players who don't even know this has happened in the game than people who abused this and would be banned.

Again a strike system on bans (temp, then perma) is fine to help show people where they went wrong and retain players who may realise the error of their ways. The issue we face here is that by leaving the ill gotten gains on the accounts which suffered bans ZOS has set up the idea to those who exploited (and those who didn't) that the benefit of cheating greatly outweighs the negatives.

I don't think they can really do anything with the case that just happened, however I would really like to hear their thoughts going forward from here on what they plan to do in future cases specifically the following.

Why did the bug have to hit open forums before being patched in less than 24 hours, when it was reported weeks prior. Was this a communication issue or general laziness from them.
What system do they have in place to monitor accounts and catch exploiters.
What are the current warnings/bans systems in place, is it a strike system or case by case.
What have they learnt from this, what will they be changing in future to stop the same mess happening again (regarding how it was handled, not the exploit itself).

I want an official statement from the companies leadership or a senior GM or whoever is technically in charge of all of this area. That's very entitled of me to ask for (or demand) however it's what almost every other major MMO offers its player base.

This really just once again comes down to ZOS' weird structure and rules about communication with their player base that no one actually understands.

Runs · May 2016

*sigh*

I am not pleased with how ZOS handled the situation, and really wish Gina or another member of the ZOS team would give a statement to insure us the way it was handled won't happen again. Outside of that, at this point there is not much they can really do.

We have no idea how far spread this was, the man hours it would take to go through the logs to remove the items and gold received via selling. To top that off we don't know how long this went on for. I've heard several people say the banker wasn't needed, you just had to run back to a bank without using a wayshrine. Even if it was not wide spread, simply removing the items and gold wouldn't quite work to solve the problem. Anyone who gifted supplies, that ended up being used to upgrade or make new equipment would get off scott free still.

I really hope the reasoning for the 3-day bans was not because of the cost of having a banker. No one should be entitled to a "get out of jail free card" for any reason.

I'm not sure about anyone else who has the banker, but for me now I end up being ashamed/embarassed of mine. Not because I did anything bad with him, but just that feeling that the people who see me with mine out will think I did. Every time I see someone with a banker out at a survey spot now my brain automatically assumes they were part of it. I try to remember to put mine away now before I go collecting to avoid others seeing me and thinking the same. I don't think I would feel this way had ZOS issued stiffer bans.

To the people saying next time they will go ahead and use the exploits... To me that just means you would have this time too, if you had known about it in time. Anyone who knew about it, had the time to but did not use it, I highly doubt will do so in the future...

Also I see many mentions of people talking about gold mats this and gold mats that and stuff being sold cheap now... But that's just a fraction of the problem. I am far more concerned with potent nirn and fortified nirn from Craglorn surveys and the people holding on to large quantities...

lathbury · May 2016

Runs wrote: »

*sigh*

I am not pleased with how ZOS handled the situation, and really wish Gina or another member of the ZOS team would give a statement to insure us the way it was handled won't happen again. Outside of that, at this point there is not much they can really do.

We have no idea how far spread this was, the man hours it would take to go through the logs to remove the items and gold received via selling. To top that off we don't know how long this went on for. I've heard several people say the banker wasn't needed, you just had to run back to a bank without using a wayshrine. Even if it was not wide spread, simply removing the items and gold wouldn't quite work to solve the problem. Anyone who gifted supplies, that ended up being used to upgrade or make new equipment would get off scott free still.

I really hope the reasoning for the 3-day bans was not because of the cost of having a banker. No one should be entitled to a "get out of jail free card" for any reason.

I'm not sure about anyone else who has the banker, but for me now I end up being ashamed/embarassed of mine. Not because I did anything bad with him, but just that feeling that the people who see me with mine out will think I did. Every time I see someone with a banker out at a survey spot now my brain automatically assumes they were part of it. I try to remember to put mine away now before I go collecting to avoid others seeing me and thinking the same. I don't think I would feel this way had ZOS issued stiffer bans.

To the people saying next time they will go ahead and use the exploits... To me that just means you would have this time too, if you had known about it in time. Anyone who knew about it, had the time to but did not use it, I highly doubt will do so in the future...

Also I see many mentions of people talking about gold mats this and gold mats that and stuff being sold cheap now... But that's just a fraction of the problem. I am far more concerned with potent nirn and fortified nirn from Craglorn surveys and the people holding on to large quantities...

yeah this has put me off getting a banker I was going to get one when I re new my sub agian. I'm seriously considering now whether to let my sub lapse.
ROCKSTAR Handled an exploit really well with people having a car they shouldnt they secretly coded it to explode lol the next time exploiters used it.

Magdalina · May 2016

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Wow wow wow... human nature at its best all over this thread.

My guess is that most people here asking for "hard punishment" are in fact envious of the exploiters and frustrated to not have know of the exploit earlier. They'd have used it no limit if they had known.

Yes actually.
This is a game. When we play a game, we usually abide certain rules. Why do we abide the rules in an activity that's done purely for fun? Simple, to keep it somewhat balanced, (relatively) fair and more or less equal for everyone.
For instance you don't play football with your hands. Even if it seems easier sometimes. Because it's FOOTball. If you do, you'll probably get kicked from the team.

Thing is rules only keep it fair and balanced if they're followed by everyone(well to be realistic they'll never be followed by EVERYONE, but at least the majority) and breaking them gets a punishment(like excluding the cheater from the game). Because otherwise the cheaters are at a direct advantage. It's like someone uses their hands in a football match and wins because of that. And he doesn't get kicked, and his score doesn't get discredited.

He used his hands in the game where you're not allowed to do so and won over the people who only used feet as they're supposed to. And the...um I don't know English terms for that well, sorry...couch? Judge? Sport commitee? Whoever's in charge, they recognized this as a legit victory.

So what should other players do NOW that they know if they keep playing by the rules here they'll likely simply be at a disadvantage? Two logical solutions:
1)Leave the place and play in a different team where players do get kicked for breaking rules/their score wouldn't count(buh bye ESO).
2)Start using hands as well because then everyone will be on more or less equal footing again. Basically pretending the "never touch the ball with your hands" doesn't rule doesn't exist for anyone.

It's not about evil nature of the humans(it would be if the goods in question had been removed but there'd been no punishment otherwise and people would be complaining about lack of punishment), it's about wanting fair play.

Now how ZOS can possibly not see this or think either of those 2 outcomes good is beyond me.

andreasv · May 2016

Magdalina wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Wow wow wow... human nature at its best all over this thread.

My guess is that most people here asking for "hard punishment" are in fact envious of the exploiters and frustrated to not have know of the exploit earlier. They'd have used it no limit if they had known.

Yes actually.
This is a game. When we play a game, we usually abide certain rules. Why do we abide the rules in an activity that's done purely for fun? Simple, to keep it somewhat balanced, (relatively) fair and more or less equal for everyone.
For instance you don't play football with your hands. Even if it seems easier sometimes. Because it's FOOTball. If you do, you'll probably get kicked from the team.

Thing is rules only keep it fair and balanced if they're followed by everyone(well to be realistic they'll never be followed by EVERYONE, but at least the majority) and breaking them gets a punishment(like excluding the cheater from the game). Because otherwise the cheaters are at a direct advantage. It's like someone uses their hands in a football match and wins because of that. And he doesn't get kicked, and his score doesn't get discredited.

He used his hands in the game where you're not allowed to do so and won over the people who only used feet as they're supposed to. And the...um I don't know English terms for that well, sorry...couch? Judge? Sport commitee? Whoever's in charge, they recognized this as a legit victory.

So what should other players do NOW that they know if they keep playing by the rules here they'll likely simply be at a disadvantage? Two logical solutions:
1)Leave the place and play in a different team where players do get kicked for breaking rules/their score wouldn't count(buh bye ESO).
2)Start using hands as well because then everyone will be on more or less equal footing again. Basically pretending the "never touch the ball with your hands" doesn't rule doesn't exist for anyone.

It's not about evil nature of the humans(it would be if the goods in question had been removed but there'd been no punishment otherwise and people would be complaining about lack of punishment), it's about wanting fair play.

Now how ZOS can possibly not see this or think either of those 2 outcomes good is beyond me.

You've heard it here first folks. Football confirmed for next DLC after Dark Brotherhood. Spread the word!

sickboy2808 · May 2016

This whole dealing with the cheaters and their pathetic 72 hour ban has put me right off this game and company. I will not put another penny into this company, which is about all i can do to show ZOS that i have lost faith in them. I probs go back to an old game which PERM bans all cheaters but of course they can appeal but if still found Guilty their out of there... Pathetic ZOS

DaveMoeDee · May 2016

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Wow wow wow... human nature at its best all over this thread.

My guess is that most people here asking for "hard punishment" are in fact envious of the exploiters and frustrated to not have know of the exploit earlier. They'd have used it no limit if they had known.

You can't assume that. Many people who resist the temptation to cheat get very annoyed when people are allowed to get away with cheating. Nothing unreasonable about that response.

anitajoneb17_ESO · May 2016

Magdalina wrote: »

He used his hands in the game where you're not allowed to do so and won over the people who only used feet as they're supposed to. And the...um I don't know English terms for that well, sorry...couch? Judge? Sport commitee? Whoever's in charge, they recognized this as a legit victory.

... and that happens pretty often, in soccer at all levels from amateurs to competition. Sometimes people get away with it and keep their victory, sometimes they don't, there's a whole discussion going on about referrees using cameras, but there are a lot of valid arguments against it, so yes, things are never as easy and simple as they seem.

I don't consider this entire survey issue to be that big and I definitely don't want ZOS to waste X manhours on investigating each case. It's just not worth it, and it wouldn't even prevent exploiters to exploit next time, because next time / next issue will be entirely different with totally different outcomes and related issues.

Frankly all these cries for fairness and justice in a videogame are beyond ridiculous and out of proportion.

sickboy2808 · May 2016

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Wow wow wow... human nature at its best all over this thread.

My guess is that most people here asking for "hard punishment" are in fact envious of the exploiters and frustrated to not have know of the exploit earlier. They'd have used it no limit if they had known.

Yeah exactly YOUR Guess so i will tell you that I would never had used the bug to gain advantage. Firstly i dont get much game time per day anyway, lucky if its 30 mins and i would not have used that time to cheat. Secondly being a truthful and honest person in RL i would have been firmly against it. So dont just GUESS as if you know all of us.

anitajoneb17_ESO · May 2016

sickboy2808 wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Wow wow wow... human nature at its best all over this thread.

My guess is that most people here asking for "hard punishment" are in fact envious of the exploiters and frustrated to not have know of the exploit earlier. They'd have used it no limit if they had known.

Yeah exactly YOUR Guess so i will tell you that I would never had used the bug to gain advantage. Firstly i dont get much game time per day anyway, lucky if its 30 mins and i would not have used that time to cheat. Secondly being a truthful and honest person in RL i would have been firmly against it. So dont just GUESS as if you know all of us.

I said MOST, not ALL. Learn to Read. Thank you.

VampiricByNature · May 2016

I think everyone shoukd agree it's silly to propose some kind of heavy punishment on people who used the exploit. I think the "fair" course of action is the most anyone truly wanted. Ex: Mats or gold removed.
Zenimax is the judge and executioner. They might miss some and we have to accept that. The best we can try to do is buy from legit sources, enjoy our game and live with the knowledge that our gear is not gold because of an exploit.
I met some new players during the 3day ban. I was surprised by some people who got caught and got the 3 day vacay. I don't have to keep exploiters around me- and I think that's the best I can do to make my gaming experience enjoyable.
Let's not argue over the logistics. Next dlc is in testing, Hail Sithis, right?