UrQuan wrote: »

lihentian wrote: »

Necrelios wrote: »

On the other hand, if you just want to max your legerdemain skill more efficiently, she comes in handy for that since you still get the full xp for fencing stolen items to her. So I guess she is kind of useful, in her own way .

mind i ask why bother leveling legerdemain skill? i mean you are still limited to the number of sale per day.. would you like to use this assistant and earn 2/3 of the money in 50 minute.. or you rather earn full amount in 52 minute? it only take a minute or two to get to the refuge...

am not sure about you.. but i level legerdemain to earn cash...they certainly don't help with pvp or pve...

It definitely helps with both PVE and PVP. The 4 ranks of Improved Hiding are useful for sneaking around in both PVE and especially PVP. The 4 ranks of Locksmith are useful for PVE - especially when you're running vWGT. If you don't have that maxed out and you're relying on picking the lock to get out in the middle of that fight, you stand a very good chance of not making it out in time.

Before TG, I was leveling legerdemain only for the sneaking buff.

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

lihentian wrote: »

Necrelios wrote: »

On the other hand, if you just want to max your legerdemain skill more efficiently, she comes in handy for that since you still get the full xp for fencing stolen items to her. So I guess she is kind of useful, in her own way .

mind i ask why bother leveling legerdemain skill? i mean you are still limited to the number of sale per day.. would you like to use this assistant and earn 2/3 of the money in 50 minute.. or you rather earn full amount in 52 minute? it only take a minute or two to get to the refuge...

am not sure about you.. but i level legerdemain to earn cash...they certainly don't help with pvp or pve...

It definitely helps with both PVE and PVP. The 4 ranks of Improved Hiding are useful for sneaking around in both PVE and especially PVP. The 4 ranks of Locksmith are useful for PVE - especially when you're running vWGT. If you don't have that maxed out and you're relying on picking the lock to get out in the middle of that fight, you stand a very good chance of not making it out in time.

Before TG, I was leveling legerdemain only for the sneaking buff.

i never really understand that buff, it says reduce the stamina cost of sneaking.. but i never notice there are any cost of sneaking?? am i missing something?

UrQuan wrote: »

lihentian wrote: »

so.. ill give up.. you were right, i was naive.. i was trying to make an statement. .but instead people are here to argue. am done with this topic

So you were trying to make a statement, you didn't expect people to disagree with you, and you don't know how to handle people having a different opinion on the matter than you so you're just dismissing their opinions as "instead people are here to argue". *rolleyes*

well, yea~~ thats right XD i thought the statement is clear enough.. i thought people want this.... i thought i was fighting for the good of all....... but instead it see good amount of people don't care~~ i guess at some point i knew this will happen~~ not the first time~~~~

like i said, if you are here to win an argument and prevent good things from happening.. i congratulate you on a job well done XD

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

lihentian wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

lihentian wrote: »

Necrelios wrote: »

On the other hand, if you just want to max your legerdemain skill more efficiently, she comes in handy for that since you still get the full xp for fencing stolen items to her. So I guess she is kind of useful, in her own way .

mind i ask why bother leveling legerdemain skill? i mean you are still limited to the number of sale per day.. would you like to use this assistant and earn 2/3 of the money in 50 minute.. or you rather earn full amount in 52 minute? it only take a minute or two to get to the refuge...

am not sure about you.. but i level legerdemain to earn cash...they certainly don't help with pvp or pve...

It definitely helps with both PVE and PVP. The 4 ranks of Improved Hiding are useful for sneaking around in both PVE and especially PVP. The 4 ranks of Locksmith are useful for PVE - especially when you're running vWGT. If you don't have that maxed out and you're relying on picking the lock to get out in the middle of that fight, you stand a very good chance of not making it out in time.

Before TG, I was leveling legerdemain only for the sneaking buff.

i never really understand that buff, it says reduce the stamina cost of sneaking.. but i never notice there are any cost of sneaking?? am i missing something?

You are missing something. Your stamina goes down while you sneak. It becomes obvious in Cyrodiil.

didn't know that.. it might be because am running stamina build.. but i never notice my stamina goes down while sneaking.. and am pretty much sneaking 24/7 XD running the night's silence set

lihentian wrote: »

like i said, if you are here to win an argument and prevent good things from happening.. i congratulate you on a job well done XD

And again, because you can't understand that someone could actually have a different opinion from yours, and see things from a different point of view, you dismiss people who don't agree with you as people who "are here to win an argument and prevent good things from happening." Nope, we just don't agree with you. There are benefits to using the assistant the way that it is. The fact that you can't see them even when they're pointed out to you is a failure on your part.

The other thing that I don't think has been mentioned in this thread is that all assistants have to be more limited than their counterparts in towns & refuges. Otherwise nobody would ever go to the towns and refuges, and they'd become ghost towns.

UrQuan wrote: »

lihentian wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

lihentian wrote: »

like i said, if you are here to win an argument and prevent good things from happening.. i congratulate you on a job well done XD

And again, because you can't understand that someone could actually have a different opinion from yours, and see things from a different point of view, you dismiss people who don't agree with you as people who "are here to win an argument and prevent good things from happening." Nope, we just don't agree with you. There are benefits to using the assistant the way that it is. The fact that you can't see them even when they're pointed out to you is a failure on your part.

The other thing that I don't think has been mentioned in this thread is that all assistants have to be more limited than their counterparts in towns & refuges. Otherwise nobody would ever go to the towns and refuges, and they'd become ghost towns.

i understand that people may have different opinion. but this is not something that can be changed with many opinion. and i thought people prefer result over meaningless argument. after all why deny something that is good for everyone? but clearly i was wrong. some people don't care, and some care more of meaningless argument then to actually get things done. either case, this will not likely to happen and i rest my effort

*sigh* and you still can't see that removing the tax isn't good for everyone. You're still too closed-minded to admit that your vision of what is best for everyone isn't universal. And because of that you simply dismiss everyone who disagrees with you as being someone who just wants to have a meaningless argument. It's really sad that you can't admit that other people have valid opinions and valid reasons for holding those opinions.

You could make an argument that the tax is too high (and maybe it is), but there has to be some disadvantage to using the assistant vs. actually going to a fence in an outlaw refuge. Otherwise the refuges become ghost towns. If the refuges become ghost towns nobody ever buys from any of the guild traders in the refuges. If nobody ever buys from those guild traders then the people in those guilds can't sell their stuff through them, and that just means that the big trade guilds get even more of a share of the market, because fewer people are going to the smaller less-desirable guild traders, and only the big trade guilds can afford to get the traders that everyone goes to.

But no, clearly it would be good for everyone if we just allowed that to happen. Do you really think it's just totally arbitrary that there are disadvantages to the assistants? Are you really naive enough to think that no thought was put into balancing the convenience vs. the danger that nobody would go to the towns and refuges? This is an MMO - you're looking at it as if it were a single player game. What would be good for you in a single player game isn't necessarily going to translate to "good for everyone" in an MMO.

i don't really understand why you are here. if you are trying to get me to stop, you have already succeed, if you are trying to win an argument, i already told you that you have win. if you think brag about tax been too high will actually do something, then do it. stalking this will done no good.

also there are other assistant coming, very soon. bank and merchant assistant in crown store with absolutely no drawback.

as of your statement of this will make refuge a ghost town...hmm by your standard if a quest can only be complete once, it will be uninvited for the rest of eternity.. you make it sound like everyone have dlc and complete entire thieves guild mission on every character. beside that there are other reason to go there. first launder can only be done with a real fence. second, your thieves guild passive can teleport you directly to the refuge.. should you wish it. there are also other reason such as achievement. hang out to lose the bounty.. a quick escape route outside the city....

as of the last part, am not sure where you are getting at. am not sure how you come up with those strange statement~~ am doing this in this way, because and only because i knew that this can only be done when there are only one once. no matter how i bought up the statement there are very likely always be someone like you to ruin the effort... either way you have get me to stop.. and maybe we should all stop to just let this post sink for good.

p.s. am not sure what are you trying to achieve, for sometime you almost sound like you have some better idea of how to get things done. but yet you spend all your effort on stopping it from happening.. am really confused.. i doubt anyone will be that naive to waste so much time just to "win" on the forum.

lihentian wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

lihentian wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

lihentian wrote: »

like i said, if you are here to win an argument and prevent good things from happening.. i congratulate you on a job well done XD

And again, because you can't understand that someone could actually have a different opinion from yours, and see things from a different point of view, you dismiss people who don't agree with you as people who "are here to win an argument and prevent good things from happening." Nope, we just don't agree with you. There are benefits to using the assistant the way that it is. The fact that you can't see them even when they're pointed out to you is a failure on your part.

The other thing that I don't think has been mentioned in this thread is that all assistants have to be more limited than their counterparts in towns & refuges. Otherwise nobody would ever go to the towns and refuges, and they'd become ghost towns.

i understand that people may have different opinion. but this is not something that can be changed with many opinion. and i thought people prefer result over meaningless argument. after all why deny something that is good for everyone? but clearly i was wrong. some people don't care, and some care more of meaningless argument then to actually get things done. either case, this will not likely to happen and i rest my effort

*sigh* and you still can't see that removing the tax isn't good for everyone. You're still too closed-minded to admit that your vision of what is best for everyone isn't universal. And because of that you simply dismiss everyone who disagrees with you as being someone who just wants to have a meaningless argument. It's really sad that you can't admit that other people have valid opinions and valid reasons for holding those opinions.

You could make an argument that the tax is too high (and maybe it is), but there has to be some disadvantage to using the assistant vs. actually going to a fence in an outlaw refuge. Otherwise the refuges become ghost towns. If the refuges become ghost towns nobody ever buys from any of the guild traders in the refuges. If nobody ever buys from those guild traders then the people in those guilds can't sell their stuff through them, and that just means that the big trade guilds get even more of a share of the market, because fewer people are going to the smaller less-desirable guild traders, and only the big trade guilds can afford to get the traders that everyone goes to.

But no, clearly it would be good for everyone if we just allowed that to happen. Do you really think it's just totally arbitrary that there are disadvantages to the assistants? Are you really naive enough to think that no thought was put into balancing the convenience vs. the danger that nobody would go to the towns and refuges? This is an MMO - you're looking at it as if it were a single player game. What would be good for you in a single player game isn't necessarily going to translate to "good for everyone" in an MMO.

i don't really understand why you are here. if you are trying to get me to stop, you have already succeed, if you are trying to win an argument, i already told you that you have win. if you think brag about tax been too high will actually do something, then do it. stalking this will done no good.

also there are other assistant coming, very soon. bank and merchant assistant in crown store with absolutely no drawback.

Not true. They both have drawbacks. The bank assistant only lets you access your personal bank, and not any guild banks or guild stores from any guild you're in. The merchant assistant only lets you sell items, and doesn't let you repair. Again, there's a very good reason why these assistants all need to have drawbacks: because this is an MMO and in an MMO it's a bad idea to introduce things that will depopulate population centres. It's fine to disagree on what the specific drawback for an assistant should be, but suggesting that there shouldn't be any drawback is single-player game thinking, and would be detrimental to an MMO.

lihentian wrote: »

as of your statement of this will make refuge a ghost town...hmm by your standard if a quest can only be complete once, it will be uninvited for the rest of eternity.. you make it sound like everyone have dlc and complete entire thieves guild mission on every character. beside that there are other reason to go there. first launder can only be done with a real fence. second, your thieves guild passive can teleport you directly to the refuge.. should you wish it. there are also other reason such as achievement. hang out to lose the bounty.. a quick escape route outside the city....

And maybe the lack of an ability to launder goods is enough of a drawback to the smuggler assistant. I think it's probably not enough on its own (although of course I could be wrong about that), but that would definitely be a solid argument for at least reducing the tax on goods that you sell to the assistant.

lihentian wrote: »

as of the last part, am not sure where you are getting at. am not sure how you come up with those strange statement~~ am doing this in this way, because and only because i knew that this can only be done when there are only one once. no matter how i bought up the statement there are very likely always be someone like you to ruin the effort... either way you have get me to stop.. and maybe we should all stop to just let this post sink for good.

And this is why I'm posting here. Because of your terrible attitude that anyone who doesn't agree with you is just trying to ruin things. It's ridiculous, and if you ever want to try to succeed in making anything better you need to realize that and change the way you think. You need to stop looking at everything as being a fight or an argument between you and the people who don't see things your way. You need to actually listen to what the other people are saying, and understand where they're coming from.

If you're only thinking about things from your own point of view (which is what you're doing) and seeing anyone who doesn't share that point of view as an enemy (which is also what you're doing), then you'll never get anywhere, and you'll never improve anything. The only way to actually make things better for everyone is to listen to the opinions of people who disagree with you and not dismiss them as just wanting to argue. You need to try to see their point of view and work with them to modify your ideas and come up with something that actually is better, rather than just stubbornly sticking to your own idea.

It's not about "winning" an argument. It never should be, and that's where you're going wrong: by thinking that it's about winning. It's not. It's about understanding that there are different points of view on things because people come at things from different frames of reference. It's about trying to see things from the points of view of others, and through that process coming up with better ideas that actually take into account as many of the potential consequences as possible.