Question to any Dev :Why is Magicka Sorc damage so high when facing enemies with no nirn equipment?

pkb16_ESO2 · May 2015

Dont mess with Sorc Lobby... the only thing that is more OP than gaming sorcs.

Snit · May 2015

Sorcs are the easiest class for experienced players to counter:

- Sorc's big hitters (Frags, Overload) are slow moving projectiles, easy to dodge, block or reflect
- Magicka damage is mitigated by high levels of champion points far more than physical damage can be
- Magicka damage is mitigated by pricey gear far more than physical damage can be (though nirn will presumably be nerfed somewhat)

If you don't use active defenses, don't have many CP points and gear solely for damage, then, yes, Frags and Overload will destroy you. The most important is the first of those suggestions. Watch the battlefield and know when to dodge (or block, or reflect).

I find killing sorcs to be annoying, too, and I play one. Good ones are hard to pin down. But they're among the least dangerous opponents on the battlefield, when measured by what kills me most often. Sorcs often escape me, but the guys who kill me are almost always stamina builds.

rfennell_ESO · May 2015

Sorcs are so strong and so overpowered that most sorcs have already switched to nightblades.

Snit · May 2015

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Sorcs are so strong and so overpowered that most sorcs have already switched to nightblades.

Heh.. My Bosmer WW NB is currently 31. I already have all his VR14 stuff ready

Methariorn · May 2015

Zsymon wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Those large hits 1.) require a glass cannon setup and 2.) can not only be reduced with actives defenses and spell resistance, but reduced magic and critical damage.

Besides that, don't mess with the spell penetration system. Forming arguments without thoroughly testing in the same version of the game is rarely a good idea, sadly.

For a sorc, glass cannon and high survivability, are the same thing, they require the same resource. There is no such thing as glass cannon Sorcerers.

When I try to run with my glas cannon setup my survivability is a lot lower than with my standard gear: to have max spell power and good mana pool I give up mana regen, 8% reduction cost of the archmage, heavy nirhoed chest and medium nirhoed boot. So I lost the chance to perma blink due to low magica regen, spell cost more (and sometime I need to cast HW every 2-3 seconds when stamina NB and DK decide to send my sorc in oblivion). So max spell power is by no way max survivability for a sorc. And blink got counters: I lost count of time I blinked away and 2-3 stamina classes where sending focussed aim/flying blade (nerf that damm ability: the damage is insane) and got killed. If I blink I can't cast my shield and I found NB who can crush my shield even with capped bastion.

JDar · May 2015

Its not even just sorcs. My magicka nightblade regularly drops 15k magicka damage before i even cast mass hysteria on them. Get nirn

Etaniel · May 2015

danyels64eb17_ESO wrote: »

Hello to everyone ,

First of all this post isn't meant as a full rant .. maybe a bit Was just curious why such big numbers can be pulled from one class !? I think the forums will burst into tears when they finally nerf the nirn gear , as magicka damage will get a lot more obvious as broken - especially the sorcerer damage .
I have been trying to stay away from nirn gear , thinking the nerfbat will soon come . However each passing day , makes me regret not making a full set of nirn gear just to be able to get 1/3 or 1/2 of the damage i currently get .
Example (i am at work right now , though i did make some screenshots) Velicious curse 11k damage , Inevitable detonation 16k , crystal frags 15.5k - All these were thrown down in less than couple of seconds , the burst coming up all at once almost, with the crystal frags as the coupe de grace. This combo blew my harness magicka and buffed hp instantly .
Something worth to mention is, that some sorc was fighting the same morning outside a keep , solo killing 5-6 guys that just couldnt kill the sorc , and guess what, they were killed over and over by the same guy - hardened ward + insane burst and just kiting with bol - Doesn't take a genius to realize something is wrong .
I know this is sorc's cup of tea and that's what they're supposed to do (as in most mmos sorcs/mages got some teleport ability , some major nuke and fillers.. at least they are squishy in most) but this game is broken damage-wise to almost fubar level .

Dont know the context, but if you are skilled, killing 5-6 scrub players should be doable with any class. There's nothing wrong with that, so don't base your argument on it

cozmon3c_ESO · June 2015

After playing magicka and stamina sorc there is one class above all others that kill me the most. NB. Sorc damage is so avoidable it's not even funny. This dude on DC today said I was scripting because I dodged all his frags lol.

Sorc has no reliable way to kill someone permanent blocking. Sorc has the most trouble with killing dodge rollers compared to every other class.

I think some sorcs have beefed up there hardened ward plus healing ward to ridiculous levels that you can't ever seem to damage there health unless you are a NB. And because NB hits so hard you cannot Nerf one without Nerf in the other. I have not been hit by frags as hard as I have been by lethal arrows, and basically anything a NB dishes out behind stealth or cloak.

Stikato · June 2015

Edit: Its just not worth it anymore

Ezareth · June 2015

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Sorcs are so strong and so overpowered that most sorcs have already switched to nightblades.

*whistles innocently*

I will admit when you step into Cyrodiil as a VR1 and VR2 player you're now playing in hardmode as you pretty much get 1-shot by any high damage ability.

That said during the even numbered matchups I'm doing pretty well I just can't fight zergs yet until I get some decent gear/stats. I absolutely love trashing VR14 players with a VR1 (although most of thoseare nightblades haha)

Mauz · June 2015

Snit wrote: »

- Sorc's big hitters (Frags, Overload) are slow moving projectiles, easy to dodge, block or reflect

Blocking eats up your stamina before he's out of resources. Thats not an option. You can only dodge roll but you dont get a 100% avoidance window by spaming dodgerolls if you dont cheat. As nb thats your only defense. Cloak never worked against sorcs, at least not for me. You cant reflect if you dont use snb, if you do so you either lose your selfheal or your range option. Without one of them pvp in this game sucks.

Snit wrote: »

- Magicka damage is mitigated by high levels of champion points far more than physical damage can be

If you dont use nirn you'll still get casts between 15-20k dmg. For new players this will become extremly frustrating anyway in future. They dont have cps and progress is very slow.

Snit wrote: »

- Magicka damage is mitigated by pricey gear far more than physical damage can be (though nirn will presumably be nerfed somewhat)

O common ur final recommendation is a bugged mechanic. The nirn mitigation is 5x to high. If you are using non nirn gear right now sorcs have insane burst over and over again combined with great survivability and mobility. You ve to spend a major part of your resources just to survive a couple of seconds.

I think that was what the TE wanted to point out. It will go completely off balance after nirn will be fixed or call it nerfed somewhat.

Tankqull · June 2015

Mauz wrote: »

Snit wrote: »

- Sorc's big hitters (Frags, Overload) are slow moving projectiles, easy to dodge, block or reflect

Blocking eats up your stamina before he's out of resources. Thats not an option. You can only dodge roll but you dont get a 100% avoidance window by spaming dodgerolls if you dont cheat. As nb thats your only defense. Cloak never worked against sorcs, at least not for me. You cant reflect if you dont use snb, if you do so you either lose your selfheal or your range option. Without one of them pvp in this game sucks.

Snit wrote: »

- Magicka damage is mitigated by high levels of champion points far more than physical damage can be

If you dont use nirn you'll still get casts between 15-20k dmg. For new players this will become extremly frustrating anyway in future. They dont have cps and progress is very slow.

Snit wrote: »

- Magicka damage is mitigated by pricey gear far more than physical damage can be (though nirn will presumably be nerfed somewhat)

O common ur final recommendation is a bugged mechanic. The nirn mitigation is 5x to high. If you are using non nirn gear right now sorcs have insane burst over and over again combined with great survivability and mobility. You ve to spend a major part of your resources just to survive a couple of seconds.

I think that was what the TE wanted to point out. It will go completely off balance after nirn will be fixed or call it nerfed somewhat.

start making some true experience blocking sorc attacks and then come back.

Mauz · June 2015

Tankqull wrote: »

start making some true experience blocking sorc attacks and than come back.

oh yes I forgot everybody MUST use snb in this game. tank your sorc with 2h. your stamina is at 0 after 3 secs. but dont test it in your non vet campaign.

Tankqull · June 2015

Mauz wrote: »

Tankqull wrote: »

start making some true experience blocking sorc attacks and than come back.

oh yes I forgot everybody MUST use snb in this game. tank your sorc with 2h. your stamina is at 0 after 3 secs. but dont test it in your non vet campaign.

so you are saying magica attacks need a nerf because they do as much dmg as stamina attacks wich you accept to avoid while you have no intention to do the same when beeing attacked by magica attacks. great solution...

ToRelax · June 2015

Mauz wrote: »

Tankqull wrote: »

start making some true experience blocking sorc attacks and than come back.

oh yes I forgot everybody MUST use snb in this game. tank your sorc with 2h. your stamina is at 0 after 3 secs. but dont test it in your non vet campaign.

YES, if blocking is your main defense mechanism, of course you have to build for it and that includes using S/B.
If not, use it only in emergency and rely on other defense mechanisms (as a stamina user that would be dodgeroll probably).
And of course you can dodge each and every Overload attack, that's really not that hard if you are aware of the Sorc. If you are not... well guess what happens if you're not aware of a stamina NB.

rfennell_ESO · June 2015

Ezareth wrote: »

*whistles innocently*

I whistle happily playing my nightblade.

I laugh heartily when I see another "nerf sorcs" thread.

cozmon3c_ESO · June 2015

Dodge roll and block the frag, or you can block the curse. use a defense against it, if your magicka cast a shield to eat the damage.

this whole post comes down to you not using your defensive mechanics and whining that a class hits too hard. what about NB, they have a crap ton of crazy instant cast burst damage that cannot be dodged more then half the time.

jelliedsoup · June 2015

i find the sorc backlash against nbs intereating.

As an nb i very rarely get killed bu other nbs. When I am they will kill me in a second. It appears sorcs believe everyone is an nb despite sorcs and dks still being everywhere in cyrodiil. All i see at the moment are hordes of wings coming.

Mayrael · June 2015

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

Dodge roll and block the frag, or you can block the curse. use a defense against it, if your magicka cast a shield to eat the damage.

this whole post comes down to you not using your defensive mechanics and whining that a class hits too hard. what about NB, they have a crap ton of crazy instant cast burst damage that cannot be dodged more then half the time.

+ they can burn your stamina and disable all of your active defense with just one button.

kaithuzar · June 2015

Zeni listened to almost millions of players crying "buff sorc's" for months! Now sorc's are upset that they're the strongest class & people want a nerf? lawl

I'm not suggesting nerf sorc damage by any means I'm just suggesting the combo of hardened ward + nirn + other shield stacking; it's just too much.
But my main complain is over STREAK.

Don't nerf the damage, you can even keep the "I'm unkillable buffs", but NERF STREAK.
Aside from it being used to solo glitch(nb's & dk's both have to be fighting an opponent, sorc's don't) in to an outpost, BUT pretending that everyone does around the same damage & has the same resist, STAND & FIGHT. Giving sorc's the ability to stun + get outta dodge, the minute the fight isn't going their way is just OP.
As a NB I can be PULLED out of stealth, I can have STEALTH POTS used against me, WHERE IS MY NO STREAK POT?
Nothing can be done to stop them from running if they use streak to stun you first!

ToRelax · June 2015

kaithuzar wrote: »

Zeni listened to almost millions of players crying "buff sorc's" for months! Now sorc's are upset that they're the strongest class & people want a nerf? lawl

I'm not suggesting nerf sorc damage by any means I'm just suggesting the combo of hardened ward + nirn + other shield stacking; it's just too much.
But my main complain is over STREAK.

Don't nerf the damage, you can even keep the "I'm unkillable buffs", but NERF STREAK.
Aside from it being used to solo glitch(nb's & dk's both have to be fighting an opponent, sorc's don't) in to an outpost, BUT pretending that everyone does around the same damage & has the same resist, STAND & FIGHT. Giving sorc's the ability to stun + get outta dodge, the minute the fight isn't going their way is just OP.
As a NB I can be PULLED out of stealth, I can have STEALTH POTS used against me, WHERE IS MY NO STREAK POT?
Nothing can be done to stop them from running if they use streak to stun you first!

lmao, so you can do nothing against cc and you can not chase a Sorc. They should stand and fight because... they are too strong. Yeeep.
I'd say at least try to comprehend what makes Sorcs appear stronger than in 1.5, but so far you didn't do a very good job with easier tasks...