Should Archers have to restock their arrow quivers?

Ffastyl · May 2015

Staves in Elder Scrolls games also have charges, requiring a Soul Gem(s) to refill periodically. I would like limited ammunition, but it is important not to show bias against a weapon type. If bows are to require arrows, all ranged weapons must have limited uses. It would also be fair to introduce durability to melee weapons, but there is inherently higher risk for engaging up close, so infinite durability could be a reward for the higher risk.

Fizzlewizzle · May 2015

Yes

All weapons, like armor, should have some drawback while using it.

Every type of equipment should degrade when using it.
Melee weapons should deal less damage when they degrade.
Staffs and bows should have "ammunition" (arrows for bows, Soul gems for staffs).

This would make it that people actually need to maintain their equipment, instead of making an epic weapon and just constantly replacing their other gear.

Arrows should become a (common) drop you get from archers, and Soul gems a common drop from mages (not only high level gems, also lower tier ones, even at endgame)

Arrows should become craftable, through woodworking (higher level arrows should be more powerful than lower level arrows). The basic arrows (+1 damage) should be sold at Woodworking stores for about 1G each.
Arrows could take up the "offhand" slot, or they could create a new Quiver slot among the Equipment tabs where you could store your arrows.

To maintain their weapon(s) people could make Polishing tools if their Smithing level is high enough (you could also buy them). This way they can repair their weapons even if they are away from town.

I think armor should also have an (Player made) option to repair it, as it would seem pretty simple to stitch up a piece of Clothing or leather if you had said materials with you. Metal Armor would be a bit harder, but with a bit of "fire magic" a good rock and a hammer that should also be plausible outside of town.
*The "fire" shouldn't be a requirement... its just to paint the picture.

It would create a more realistic touch to the game if you were to ask me.

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO · May 2015

No

@Fizzlewizzle The problem what that is how are the arrows counted and how high up do they stack? Whether it's 100 or 200 the question will be how many arrows do I need? Light and heavy attacks, Poison arrow, Snipe and Scatter Shot would clearly use one as they do now. The real question comes in with Volley and Arrow Spray under your system it wouldn't make sense to turn one arrows into the 10-20 needed for the attack. Also if they cost ten times more they should output more damage to reflect the increased cost.

On Staff weapons how would that charge be counted would they have to refresh the enhancement and basic weapon charge?
cause if it's only one gem for the whole staff then it would have to drain twice as fast to stay in line with the other weapons.
As with the bow will Crushing Shock take three charges as it hit three times with one attack.

Finally will blocking with your weapon and not a shield cost more damage or "decay" to your weapons and will this decay be the same for Metal and wood with Metal being clearly stronger.

Vizier · May 2015

No

Silly suggestion-

If you were serious rather than just expressing sour grapes you'd suggest something like needing spell books or scrolls for the more powerful spells. Maybe chances for swords and armor to break. Arrows being limited should then have significantly increased damage.

Funny when I'm seeing sorcs SPAM Hvy attack for 15-20k, with 20k hits from Overload Light attacks while standing behind a spammed shield and Snipe is touted as the problem. LMFAO at what appears to another troll thread.

Fizzlewizzle · May 2015

Yes

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

@Fizzlewizzle The problem what that is how are the arrows counted and how high up do they stack? Whether it's 100 or 200 the question will be how many arrows do I need? Light and heavy attacks, Poison arrow, Snipe and Scatter Shot would clearly use one as they do now. The real question comes in with Volley and Arrow Spray under your system it wouldn't make sense to turn one arrows into the 10-20 needed for the attack. Also if they cost ten times more they should output more damage to reflect the increased cost.

On Staff weapons how would that charge be counted would they have to refresh the enhancement and basic weapon charge?
cause if it's only one gem for the whole staff then it would have to drain twice as fast to stay in line with the other weapons.
As with the bow will Crushing Shock take three charges as it hit three times with one attack.

Finally will blocking with your weapon and not a shield cost more damage or "decay" to your weapons and will this decay be the same for Metal and wood with Metal being clearly stronger.

With current item stacking, i would say that around 200 arrows would fit inside your quiver (max).
If they ever intend to increase that number my vote would go to 750 max.

Personally i would guess that 200 arrows will get you pretty far on average, and it shouldn't be so expensive to maintain.
(Pickpocket someone for 2 Green items and you can already buy a stack of basic arrows.)
When Fletching (crafting) your own arrows i would say about 15-25 arrows for each piece of wood you use.

Multi Projectile skills like Volley and Arrow Spray should use up multiple arrows, but with the added bonus that the attack rating of each (used) arrow is added to the total damage of the skill.

Poison arrow: Base damage 1000, Arrow type: level 1, Arrow damage: 1, Arrows used:1
Total damage = 1001 damage.
Poison arrow: Base damage 1000, Arrow Type: VR14, Arrow damage: 64, Arrows used:1
Total damage = 1064 damage.

Volley: Base damage 1000, Arrow Type: level 1, Arrow damage: 1, Arrows used: 10.
Total damage = 1010 damage.
Volley: Base damage 1000, Arrow Type: VR14, Arrow damage: 64, Arrows used: 10.
Total damage = 1640 damage.

You could use all arrows up to the level of your bow.
A VR14 can use every type of arrow, while someone with a level 14 bow can only use arrows up till level 14.

Spells could work the same way, but instead of paying for each spell you would pay for every 20 spells.
The cheapest soul gem (unfilled) costs 21 gold, meant for level 1-9. You would pay 5% more for basic soul gem (20 spells) then you would pay for 20 basic arrows. The trade-off you would get is that a Soul gem would scale to the maximum level if would scale on, for the damage boost.

Using a level 1-9 Soul gem on a level 3 staff would give the same damage bonus as a level 3 arrow would give to a bow user.
Using a level 1-9 Soul gem on any staff higher than level 9 it would give it the same damage bonus as a level 9 arrow would give to a bow user.

Grand soul gems would work from level 50 onwards, and would give the user 50-64 extra damage, based on the level of staff they were used on.

A 3 hit spell (like Crushing shock) would drain 3 charges, but like the bow it would gain the damage boost of 3 gems of the used level.
Swapping out soul gems would also be possible, any (partially) used gems will be lost, but all unused gems will be returned.
Partially used Soul gems could also be returned as lower level soul gems, but if that were the case then they should also make a system where combining soul gems to create higher level ones a feature.

Vizier wrote: »

Silly suggestion-

If you were serious rather than just expressing sour grapes you'd suggest something like needing spell books or scrolls for the more powerful spells. Maybe chances for swords and armor to break. Arrows being limited should then have significantly increased damage.

Funny when I'm seeing sorcs SPAM Hvy attack for 15-20k, with 20k hits from Overload Light attacks while standing behind a spammed shield and Snipe is touted as the problem. LMFAO at what appears to another troll thread.

The guy who came up with the idea is a Templar, so starting about Sorcs is a bit useless.

I personally don't have a problem with either Sorcs or Snipe, as both of those attacks can be negated pretty easily (by any class).

Besides that, this suggestion is for bows (and what i added is also for staffs and melee Weapons). Class shouldn't need any items/ scrolls/ books or whatever to use their own skill. Weapons however are a completely different case, since you use tools to begin with.

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO · May 2015

No

@Fizzlewizzle I don't think you understand how Archers Fight for me normally this would be nothing as I just just waste time and gank while working from home so 200 arrow would be easy to manage but when I raid it would kill my PvP Archer as Arrow Spray with it's range and cone size would be 15-20 arrows easy hit that ten times at any point in a siege or defense and thats 150-200 arrows and just to be real here Archers use Arrow Spray and Volley a lot more then that in a small scale fight

The damage increase needed to compensate for the extreme draw back of have a power at more you could use ten times would be crazy and far more then +1 per arrow and with that being said as an Archer in real life since I was a 5 Arrows make up more of the bows damage then that

Fizzlewizzle · May 2015

Yes

I understand it pretty well.
You don't want this to be introduced since you like going around aimlessly spamming an AOE skill hoping you might hit something for a little bit of exp.

This suggestion (as well as adding staffs to this) will greatly reduce the people aimlessly spamming such skill (things like Rapid Regeneration spam, Grand healing spam, Impulse spam, or those AOE stuff people aimlessly like to spam, especially while being in a zerg). It would force those brainless zergs to learn to fight like a normal human being, as they would otherwise just throw their money away without gaining a single kill.

The +1 damage you pointed out is the thing people might find in coldharbor... during the tutorial.
Once you leave Coldharbor you are level 3, meaning you can use level 3 arrows, which would give you a +3 bonus.

I don't really get the drawback you mentioned. You could still use your class skills if you're out of arrows. You're bow still has an attack rating on its own, on which your skills will scale.
Also... you talk about "in real life"... unless you possess something like Ikaros' bow, you will be shooting arrows, not pull a string back and become able to produce an arrow out of thin air.

fancyleggs · May 2015

Yes

cost is not an issue, just make available 1 standard type arrow

- have a stack limit of something around 1000 at a time which would cost like 200 gold to buy
- add a quiver slot on the character equipment so that you arent missing a bag space
- then add an actual quiver viewable on the character
- after that sell other cosmetic arrows or quivers in game or in the crown store
- No additional damage or perks from cosmetic arrows
- all arrows are just for looks, skills and attributes still determine damage

done simple no complaining and cooler looking chars
BUT bow mechanics would need to be improved MASSIVELY because right now they are pretty poor

SirAndy · May 2015

No

MissBizz wrote: »

This add extra cost and issues with only one weapon, so I do not think so. It makes it unfair - for lack of a better word.

Exactly that ^^^

There are better ways for ZOS to deal with some of these issues.
Unfortunately, that won't happen either.

aisriyth_ESO · May 2015

Yes

Yes, but ONLY if they increase the damage and let you use different types of arrows, maybe a bleed arrow, a blunt arrow for armor pen, or a straight bonus damage arrow.

Otherwise, if not, then absolutely not.

seanvwolf · May 2015

No

Johngo0036 wrote: »

Oh i forgot that they should also be slottable on the quick slot so i can change them mid battle.

Armour piercing for DK's
Magicka Stealing for Sorcs

Think you get the picture.

Yup go for magicka stealing for sorcs. Cause there are no stamina sorcs out there... None. *sarc*

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO · May 2015

No

Using a power ten times in an siege is nothing if that power kills your ability to fight then what's the point and most class powers are magic so stamina builds would be out in the cold.

Plain and simple this would kill stamina AoEs only as most casters will just spam class AoEs