Let's make pvp players richer than God.

johnJrant

@ZOS_Kevin PVP players for some reason cannot fully enjoy wealth and indecent luxury inaccessible to ordinary mortal players. We don't have enough gold for AP. I'm talking about the top pvp players Cyrodiil and BG. Somehow we still don't have enough gold, even if 2-4kk AP is released per week. I want more luxury for pvp players. Our gameplay is much more complicated than that of pve players and crafters, it would be nice to make us already obscenely rich.
Here are my suggestions on how to achieve this. As for me, they will also improve the economy of the game.

- Hakeijo for 25k ap.
- Cyrodiil could have a herbalist who sold us alchemical ingredients for ap (the ingredients should be priced in proportion to their market value)
- A fisherman could appear in cyro from whom we would buy golden caviar.
- A food vendor may appear in Cyro for AP
- master-crafter can Potest apparere and sell for AP all what crafter bay for tikets
- change in win/loss payouts on BG: loss - 8000 win - 18,000 AP

I'm sure that all this will also give an incentive to play pvp properly, rather than running around in circles and being dumb.

Given the focus of next year, I think it's the active pvp players who should become obscenely rich. Disgustingly rich. The terrible envy of our untold wealth and luxury of the inaccessible pvp gods will be the best pvp teacher for beginners.

moo_2021

or drop IA leads and sets

valenwood_vegan

I totally disagree, I'm actually very special and all the things I enjoy doing in eso are better than the things other people enjoy, and I should be rich and have my own special vendors for everything I want. The game would be greatly improved in all possible ways if it revolved around me and around forcing other players to play exactly how I want them to.

Vaqual

johnJrant wrote: »

(...) Our gameplay is much more complicated than that of pve players and crafters, it would be nice to make us already obscenely rich. (...)

Sure. Why waste the time of the chosen ones by forcing them to play the entire game, when they are the only ones who can repair all those walls, kite through towers and lag around keeps. If these important changes are not made we may face a real shortage of proc-set-bombing and one-shot-gank youtube montages with hip hop backing tracks. Where are the second rate PvPers supposed leave their "Goated" comments then? Dreadful prospects.

peacenote

A few observations on this.

1-- Generally speaking, it's a core concept of an MMO that the competitive content you want to play is expensive, and that you must earn gold another way (like, with a profession). This is done so people will spend more time in the game. I'll (mostly) set aside my commentary on how being a crafter isn't as lucrative in ESO as I've seen it be in other MMOs, and how ZOS missed some opportunities with newer functionality to give crafters a benefit... but generally speaking no one plays an MMO solely "to craft" so, crafting "is supposed to" make gold. End-game PvE raiders are just as "poor" if they don't spend time in other activities. Thus, the whole premise that it's unfair that crafters and PvE players are richer, or that harder content should pay well, is flawed. PvP'ers want to PvP, PvE'ers want to progress, and in either case they need to do other content to generate wealth. Plus, PvE players are all over the map as to how they spend their time and if they have a lot of gold -- not all PvE players are rich! I think in this case you may more be referencing casual players, who quest and therefore build up gold, but that's only because there isn't a lot on which they need to spend their gold.

2-- Some of your ideas seem to be adapting things that exist in Imperial City (specifically, the first two ideas) where PvP'ers can earn Tel Var Stones to do exactly what you are suggesting. I happen to enjoy IC, the exciting risk of farming tel var, and personally I think it would be a shame to see the best rewards from that activity to become available another way. I wouldn't be against a completely unique idea that would allow AP to purchase a desired item that they could then trade for gold, but it shouldn't be the same items that can be obtained from tel var, in my opinion.

3-- When it comes to earning/farming gold, players tend to select the activity that is the most efficient for their time because mostly they want to just play the game and not farm. Therefore, I'm not sure if an AP -> gold path would help players learn and become more skilled unless the most efficient way to earn/farm AP is to become a skilled player. Often, people divide up their play time into "gold earning time" and then "real playing time," if that makes sense.

Anyway, based on some of the OP's word choices, I feel like this post is semi-serious but also a bit playful. I chose to address it with a serious response, but also wish acknowledge that "terrible envy of our untold wealth" made me smile.

moo_2021

I have accepted pvp costs a lot and the only way it's sustainable is to pay for it (i.e. buy crowns to exchange to gold). How else can a newbie afford all the gears, tripots and golden food? I looked at my overland sets which are the lowest kind, and the market price is hundreds of thousands if not a million.

MincMincMinc

moo_2021 wrote: »

I have accepted pvp costs a lot and the only way it's sustainable is to pay for it (i.e. buy crowns to exchange to gold). How else can a newbie afford all the gears, tripots and golden food? I looked at my overland sets which are the lowest kind, and the market price is hundreds of thousands if not a million.

For the most part a new player can use the alliance pots and make gold crafted gear. For generic pvp builds if you get bloodspawn+clever+order'sWrath you are basically at a meta build. All of this is affordable after a day of farming. You really only need gold weapons to cut down on costs. For food either run jewels of misrule or hissimir. If you really want triglyphs, just do them for the chest, head, legs. After a day or two you should be able to afford hard meta sets like rallyingcry or plaguebreak at vendors.

Itd be much easier for new players if they finished standardizing the game
- food/drink are ungodly unbalanced
- Glyphs across the board
- some Major/minor buffs
- CP is still heavily defensive
- Stats like spell and weapon crit could combine to be crit
- Effects being overcomplicated like offbalance or status effects in general (prime example of bad combat direction)

moo_2021

MincMincMinc wrote: »

For the most part a new player can use the alliance pots and make gold crafted gear. For generic pvp builds if you get bloodspawn+clever+order'sWrath you are basically at a meta build. All of this is affordable after a day of farming.

Has gold farming become easier?

A few years ago I was doing thieve guild heists all day just to make tens of thousands; can't even afford overland rings or weapons for collection (especially DW sets!).

Calastir

Any incentive for less PvP is a good one. Perhaps allowing them to spend some time doing community service in exchange for a reward. Such an experience might make them grow into better people.

XSTRONG

johnJrant wrote: »

@ZOS_Kevin PVP players for some reason cannot fully enjoy wealth and indecent luxury inaccessible to ordinary mortal players. We don't have enough gold for AP. I'm talking about the top pvp players Cyrodiil and BG. Somehow we still don't have enough gold, even if 2-4kk AP is released per week. I want more luxury for pvp players. Our gameplay is much more complicated than that of pve players and crafters, it would be nice to make us already obscenely rich.
Here are my suggestions on how to achieve this. As for me, they will also improve the economy of the game.

- Hakeijo for 25k ap.
- Cyrodiil could have a herbalist who sold us alchemical ingredients for ap (the ingredients should be priced in proportion to their market value)
- A fisherman could appear in cyro from whom we would buy golden caviar.
- A food vendor may appear in Cyro for AP
- master-crafter can Potest apparere and sell for AP all what crafter bay for tikets
- change in win/loss payouts on BG: loss - 8000 win - 18,000 AP

I'm sure that all this will also give an incentive to play pvp properly, rather than running around in circles and being dumb.

Given the focus of next year, I think it's the active pvp players who should become obscenely rich. Disgustingly rich. The terrible envy of our untold wealth and luxury of the inaccessible pvp gods will be the best pvp teacher for beginners.

I make millions of Gold on PvP currency telwar/AP.

Some people needs some patience, you not gonna make 10m in one day but a couple hundred k a week is a really good start. And having an steady income of Gold helps

johnJrant

XSTRONG wrote: »

I make millions of Gold on PvP currency telwar/AP.

Some people needs some patience, you not gonna make 10m in one day but a couple hundred k a week is a really good start. And having an steady income of Gold helps

Someone who farms 250-1kk AP a day doesn't earn millions of gold? Not impressive. I don't pay taxes in the two largest merchant guilds when treiding only pvp stuff and only go for telvars when I need to spend 2kk+ at a time.
If you also do this on sorka, then twice is not impressive.
I don't understand your comment at all, if you're making so much gold on ap, then why don't you want more? Or are you worried about Hakeijo? There's still a lot of stuff left for the telvars. You'll find something.
And your advice to beginners is like advice to a drowning person not to be nervous.

johnJrant

peacenote wrote: »

A few observations on this.

.

Cors its semi-serious It's New Year's Eve. but that doesn't make it any less relevant.

1. Before TESO, I only played EVEOnline. And the choice of TES was not only because of the universe, but above all because you don't have to work here, you can leave it and come back, you can only do what you want here. So no, I disagree with you. 80% of the 4 years of the game I have been playing pvp. After the update, I stopped getting out of BG and Cyro because I get 600-700 transmutes per week. TESO is not about another job or something you don't want to do.

1.(a) There is no crafting in TESO) in the sense that with the ease of learning alchemy and cooking, the benefits of crafting are only in making complex crafting sets to order, the rest is only for the crafters themselves, there is no social aspect. There is no crafting in TESO.

2. The Imperial City is ideal for pvе guild raids for variety and familiarization with PVP. Give them the opportunity to effectively earn gold on AP and this place will become more pleasant for them.

3. I didn't write anything about selecting ways to earn money from other places. Only to improve it for AP. Anyone who wants to earn in other places will earn there.

johnJrant

I see few people understood what this post is about. I'll try it for the little ones and with pictures.

First of all, I will say about the Telvars. This is a PVE currency, if you don't kill a mob, you won't get a telvar. Their extraction is extremely simple and can bypass the PVP segment.

AP is the main pvp currency. But what can we buy with it.
1. Prisms. It is half the price of hakeijo and sells much worse.
2. The motives of the residents. They sell for a very long time if you do not reduce the price to profit from the prism.
3. Cyrodiil's sets. It's clear that this will sell worse than consumables.
4. New folios. It's not about them now, whoever knows knows.

It's all. To begin with, this is less than for any other currency. Just one consumable and it's not the best. The crafters only need motives from us, and they are not very popular.

Now the pictures.

https://eu.tamrieltradecentre.com/pc/Trade/SearchResult?IconName=crafting_heavy_armor_vendor_component_002.png&ItemID=6132&ItemNamePattern=Превосходная+икра&ItemQualityID=4&LevelMin=1&LevelMax=1&SortBy=LastSeen&Order=desc&page=1

Excellent caviar. Everything below 45k is immediately bought by traders. And we have a queue at BG, because of which you may not have time to buy caviar for cheap. For a normal student, this is already 135k per day just for food.

https://eu.tamrieltradecentre.com/pc/Trade/SearchResult?IconName=crafting_flower_columbine_r1.png&ItemID=3200&ItemNamePattern=Водосбор

All thoracic potions are already from 275 gold. That's another 55k per day. and we get about 190k per day of expenses. For such a busy day, we will earn about 1kk AP. 40 prisms of 9k is 360k, which means that only 170k will remain. Now imagine what kind of beginners who still need to collect sets.

But as it says in the post. It's not that pvp players earn little. No. The point is that it's time to make them richer than everyone else. This is the most socialized group, bringing a lot of movement to the game, and next year, as I understand it, they will have even more fun. So give us more gold. We also furnish houses between BG rounds, so we have a lot of gold to put.

johnJrant

Vaqual wrote: »

johnJrant wrote: »

(...) Our gameplay is much more complicated than that of pve players and crafters, it would be nice to make us already obscenely rich. (...)

Sure. Why waste the time of the chosen ones by forcing them to play the entire game, when they are the only ones who can repair all those walls, kite through towers and lag around keeps. If these important changes are not made we may face a real shortage of proc-set-bombing and one-shot-gank youtube montages with hip hop backing tracks. Where are the second rate PvPers supposed leave their "Goated" comments then? Dreadful prospects.

That's what I'm talking about. This is a real threat and a problem. By the way, I recently took a new bomb build and this was... Aweeeeeeeesome)

johnJrant

Calastir wrote: »

Any incentive for less PvP is a good one. Perhaps allowing them to spend some time doing community service in exchange for a reward. Such an experience might make them grow into better people.

And what are your criteria for the better people there?

Amottica

While I would not suggest that PvP play is more complicated since it is a challenge for most players to clear the most challenging content in the game during a given year, I would suggest that PvP should get a better reward system.

johnJrant

And here's another thing. I've been playing for 4 years with long breaks, so I still have all the AP in circulation. There are players who lick millions of AP. Whatever we put a price on Hakeijo or excellent caviar alone, we need to give a lot of seedlings that we can buy and sell, then we will improve the economy, and not bring down the price of any one product.

Well, for example, if a lot of antelopes inflate the price of excellent caviar, the crocodiles will have to come and eat half of the antelopes, then the water at the watering hole will not end.

Oh, I've come up with something that more people will understand. Like Thanos. Give us the infinity slipper and we will make the economy healthy and acceptable for everyone.

Jierdanit

Calastir wrote: »

Any incentive for less PvP is a good one. Perhaps allowing them to spend some time doing community service in exchange for a reward. Such an experience might make them grow into better people.

Did someone kill you a few too many times?

Djennku

......Should we tell him that things bought with AP like gear in desirable traits and certain other items make alot of gold on the market, and how you can 'sell' AP to other players for gold (they pay you, you buy them X AP worth of boxes)?

johnJrant

Djennku wrote: »

......Should we tell him that things bought with AP like gear in desirable traits and certain other items make alot of gold on the market, and how you can 'sell' AP to other players for gold (they pay you, you buy them X AP worth of boxes)?

Well, tell me) but if you're so smart, you can read the thread and see what has already been written about things from the boxes. A lot of gold, a lot of it is an abstract concept. A lot for you is not enough for me.

Djennku

johnJrant wrote: »

Djennku wrote: »

......Should we tell him that things bought with AP like gear in desirable traits and certain other items make alot of gold on the market, and how you can 'sell' AP to other players for gold (they pay you, you buy them X AP worth of boxes)?

Well, tell me) but if you're so smart, you can read the thread and see what has already been written about things from the boxes. A lot of gold, a lot of it is an abstract concept. A lot for you is not enough for me.

My point was that there's plenty of ways to make alot of gold (talking millions btw) from AP and PvP activities. Lots of people who play PvP have lots of gold.

With anything though, if you want to have money, you need to put in the effort to make the money yourself. You don't just get money by complaining about it.

There's a saying. If a person wants something, they'll find a way to do it no matter what. If they don't, they'll make every excuse not to.

johnJrant

Djennku wrote: »

My point was that there's plenty of ways to make alot of gold (talking millions btw) from AP and PvP activities. Lots of people who play PvP have lots of gold.

With anything though, if you want to have money, you need to put in the effort to make the money yourself. You don't just get money by complaining about it.

There's a saying. If a person wants something, they'll find a way to do it no matter what. If they don't, they'll make every excuse not to.

My friend, please read everything that is written in this thread more carefully. You don't understand what this is about at all. And which of us earns more gold on PVP is still to be seen. I ended this week with +2kk gold on AP alone. So there is no need to talk about the current methods and the fact that many earn millions. It's not about that at all. Did I write somewhere here that pvp players don't earn millions? That's not the point here. Come and write something about complaints when there's not even a whiff of them. And you obviously haven't read the entire thread.

blktauna

Calastir wrote: »

Any incentive for less PvP is a good one. Perhaps allowing them to spend some time doing community service in exchange for a reward. Such an experience might make them grow into better people.

rude. I pvp heavily and also play the rest of the game (except for the tot which I do not like) Maybe you should have to pvp as community service to be allowed to do dungeons...

See how silly that sounds.

Onto the gold. The little alchemist bags give good resources and the rune mats and dawn prisms are excellent to sell.
Have a look around and you can see loads of money making ways.

I just wish they'd stop doing bind on equip.

johnJrant

blktauna wrote: »

Onto the gold. The little alchemist bags give good resources and the rune mats and dawn prisms are excellent to sell.
Have a look around and you can see loads of money making ways.

I just wish they'd stop doing bind on equip.

It's already the third one... I am aware that there are many ways to earn gold, I do not need to look around, read more carefully what the topic is about.
And then you're the third one who writes the same dreary "many ways to get gold from pvp currency." Well, what's next? Why don't you want more? Why don't you want to be more comfortable?

johnJrant

Okay, I'll try to put it this way.
Pvp players are forced to feed the guys who, instead of BG and Cyro, prefer to stand with a fishing rod or run to collect resources. As a pvp player, it bothers me, considering that they inflate the price of the same caviar to the limit. I'm not satisfied that 50-60% of my earnings go to these guys every day. They basically do nothing and receive such a huge income from pvp. This is absolutely wrong, why do we need these parasites selling caviar for 50k? I am ready to accept this further only with the introduction of forced pvp in all mining zones of this term.
An absolutely idiotic system in which pvp players must pay for the time of players who are willing to play less actively and with less social interactions. Why the hell should I pay a tiny fisherman who is afraid to enter BG 50k? I don't want to feed these bunnies, I want to buy what I need for my daily game with the currency I earn.
Why the hell should my daily expenses depend on players who don't go to pvp at all and therefore don't fill pvp zones?
@ZOS_Kevin If pvp players' income should depend on non-pvp players, then give us the opportunity to kill them anywhere, regardless of their desires.We'll roast these caviar lovers in all the fishing spots, they'll forget about the fishing rods. Since there's such a debate about giving pvp players more ingredients.
I think if you ignore the desires of pvp players and their requests and continue to lick pveplayrs, then one week a year of pvp zones anywhere will be a good compensation. Like judgment night. For a whole week we will be able to have fun and mock caviar lovers. It's going to be fair. Am I forced to give part of the gold I earned to some pathetic fisherman, a lover of the game, and even once a year I can't arrange a hunt for them? That's not right, Kevin. Hircine wouldn't approve of that kind of ***. Either solve this issue, then what the hell are we feeding them for. Or give us the opportunity to hunt these bunnies once a year.

ZOS_Hadeostry

Greetings,

After removing some unnecessary back and forth from this thread, we would like everyone to keep posts on the subject at hand, civil, and constructive.

If there may be any questions in regards to the rules, please feel free to review them here

VinnyGambini

johnJrant wrote: »

Okay, I'll try to put it this way.
Pvp players are forced to feed the guys who, instead of BG and Cyro, prefer to stand with a fishing rod or run to collect resources. As a pvp player, it bothers me, considering that they inflate the price of the same caviar to the limit. I'm not satisfied that 50-60% of my earnings go to these guys every day. They basically do nothing and receive such a huge income from pvp. This is absolutely wrong, why do we need these parasites selling caviar for 50k? I am ready to accept this further only with the introduction of forced pvp in all mining zones of this term.
An absolutely idiotic system in which pvp players must pay for the time of players who are willing to play less actively and with less social interactions. Why the hell should I pay a tiny fisherman who is afraid to enter BG 50k? I don't want to feed these bunnies, I want to buy what I need for my daily game with the currency I earn.
Why the hell should my daily expenses depend on players who don't go to pvp at all and therefore don't fill pvp zones?
@ZOS_Kevin If pvp players' income should depend on non-pvp players, then give us the opportunity to kill them anywhere, regardless of their desires.We'll roast these caviar lovers in all the fishing spots, they'll forget about the fishing rods. Since there's such a debate about giving pvp players more ingredients.
I think if you ignore the desires of pvp players and their requests and continue to lick pveplayrs, then one week a year of pvp zones anywhere will be a good compensation. Like judgment night. For a whole week we will be able to have fun and mock caviar lovers. It's going to be fair. Am I forced to give part of the gold I earned to some pathetic fisherman, a lover of the game, and even once a year I can't arrange a hunt for them? That's not right, Kevin. Hircine wouldn't approve of that kind of ***. Either solve this issue, then what the hell are we feeding them for. Or give us the opportunity to hunt these bunnies once a year.

Agree that PvP rewards should be more valuable, so more players will join. Buying perfect roe for AP is great idea.

Avran_Sylt

I don't want PvP to devolve into figuring out how to farm AP to the max to get gold.

Maybe if they create independent servers where you can keep-farm the 3rd floor against bots indefinitely to gain infinite gold though, that could service a certain audience? (/s)

Although I'm pretty sure this post is sarcasm.

Just recall though that PvP fundamentally is about players playing with players. And can serve as a great way of retention, if not a total trash-fire. (*hacking cough, swears it's not pneumonia, but the coughs don't stop, they want to help, but it just gets worse, and worse, till there's blood, dear god the blood. It just won't stop*)

SuperXPEH

As PvP player, I'm fully agree with your idea, about making PvP more profitable, not only for tryhards and gigafarmers, but for people also, BUT some of your ideas will make situation worst.

To make PvP players reacher - here is needed only two movements:
1st - add new sets, useful in PvE, to PvP crates, but for much of AP/Tel Var
2nd - add new type of consumables, that will add unfeelable stat density, but needed for PvE (and PvP) tryhards, like "alliance war blessing" from the Elder Scroll, as item, that will empower spell, weapon damage, max hp and max resources, for 1%, for 4 hours, that you can buy for 10k ap each. That thing will cost at market ~5k of gold, and will be always needed, while you will have an option to use your 1kk ap, to get 500k gold fast

peacenote

johnJrant wrote: »

First of all, I will say about the Telvars. This is a PVE currency, if you don't kill a mob, you won't get a telvar. Their extraction is extremely simple and can bypass the PVP segment.

Do we not get tel var from killing other players? Depending on your point of view, IC and earning tel var is literally the only risky activity in the game, because you can not only gain tel var from killing players, but lose your tel var when being killed by players. Doesn't get more PvP than that, if you ask me. Sure, people can choose to farm tel var from the PvE mobs, but you can also choose to get AP from Cryo quests. I can die a million times in Cryo but I risk no AP by doing this.

johnJrant wrote: »

Okay, I'll try to put it this way.
Pvp players are forced to feed the guys who, instead of BG and Cyro, prefer to stand with a fishing rod or run to collect resources. As a pvp player, it bothers me, considering that they inflate the price of the same caviar to the limit. I'm not satisfied that 50-60% of my earnings go to these guys every day. They basically do nothing and receive such a huge income from pvp. This is absolutely wrong, why do we need these parasites selling caviar for 50k?

You seem to be making some assumptions about fishers and farmers that may not be true. :P Some people might do some fishing and PvP, you know! Certainly I can't see fishing or farming alone being a full time activity in this game... but that's just me. I wouldn't assume that your gold is definitely going to a non-PvP-er. I know for me, a lot of my perfect roe comes from the Anniversary Event.

Anyway, I'm all about the devs showing PvP some love, but I'm not a big fan of labeling and segmenting players or activities. Not everyone JUST PvP's or JUST PvE's and as a result I don't agree with the conclusion that those who fish or farm are less valuable members of our community. Those players may be doing lots of other things in the game and, even if they aren't, we need everyone to have a vibrant MMO.

Jierdanit

peacenote wrote: »

Do we not get tel var from killing other players? Depending on your point of view, IC and earning tel var is literally the only risky activity in the game, because you can not only gain tel var from killing players, but lose your tel var when being killed by players. Doesn't get more PvP than that, if you ask me. Sure, people can choose to farm tel var from the PvE mobs, but you can also choose to get AP from Cryo quests. I can die a million times in Cryo but I risk no AP by doing this.

Actually no.

Exactly zero telvar comes from players.
Players only get telvar if they do PvE or kill another player that did PvE first.

Killing players doesn't always grant telvar.
It does always grant ap (unless you already killed that same player multiple times before).