The new pvp is disgusting.

Artem_gig

In fact, I was sure until the last that the new pvp is great, and partly it is, but it is still impossible to enjoy it. (I'm talking about the 8vs8 modes, which was named by the developers as not stressful). So, the biggest problem with the past battlefields, what with these personally for me, is that they take away your time, not giving you what you actually went into them for. Namely, the daily experience bonus. Sometimes I have to play 10-15 games for this bonus (and it's just disgusting). And all my hatred of this regime could be corrected with one simple new teaching. Namely, it is guaranteed to give a daily bonus after at least 2 losses in this disgusting (for me personally, because this is already some kind of grind) mode. This would finally allow you to play this mode and have fun without being afraid that it will become a routine again.

Pepegrillos

They made a great (in principle, in execution...) pvp patch for a population long gone. The kind of players that would've loved the BG changes are mostly gone. The last time they were still around was 2019-2021.

madmidwestmark

Artem_gig wrote: »

In fact, I was sure until the last that the new pvp is great, and partly it is, but it is still impossible to enjoy it. (I'm talking about the 8vs8 modes, which was named by the developers as not stressful). So, the biggest problem with the past battlefields, what with these personally for me, is that they take away your time, not giving you what you actually went into them for. Namely, the daily experience bonus. Sometimes I have to play 10-15 games for this bonus (and it's just disgusting). And all my hatred of this regime could be corrected with one simple new teaching. Namely, it is guaranteed to give a daily bonus after at least 2 losses in this disgusting (for me personally, because this is already some kind of grind) mode. This would finally allow you to play this mode and have fun without being afraid that it will become a routine again.

why not just do other things for the experience bonus? I'm not sure why anyone would do things in this game to "grind" unless you were very low cp

licenturion

You are not forced to play this mode you know.

If you have to waste an hour doing matches against your wishes you are better off doing other things that hour and probably have the same amount of XP by doing stuff that you actively enjoy.

SaffronCitrusflower

Pepegrillos wrote: »

They made a great (in principle, in execution...) pvp patch for a population long gone. The kind of players that would've loved the BG changes are mostly gone. The last time they were still around was 2019-2021.

I don't know any PvP mains that spend any notable time in BG's. They didn't in the past and are not likely to in the future. That's why the focus on BG's by the devs is so disappointing.

dcrush

The new BGs are absolutely terrible.

Doesn’t help that the most common game mode is “Looking For Player…” which involves waiting in a spawn point for several minutes until the game kicks you out.

xylena_lazarow

Counterpoint: I love the 8v8 solo (bugs aside) and am interested in BGs for the first time in years.

Nathanbreakfast

Artem_gig wrote: »

In fact, I was sure until the last that the new pvp is great, and partly it is, but it is still impossible to enjoy it. (I'm talking about the 8vs8 modes, which was named by the developers as not stressful). So, the biggest problem with the past battlefields, what with these personally for me, is that they take away your time, not giving you what you actually went into them for. Namely, the daily experience bonus. Sometimes I have to play 10-15 games for this bonus (and it's just disgusting). And all my hatred of this regime could be corrected with one simple new teaching. Namely, it is guaranteed to give a daily bonus after at least 2 losses in this disgusting (for me personally, because this is already some kind of grind) mode. This would finally allow you to play this mode and have fun without being afraid that it will become a routine again.

Why do believe yourself to be entitled to a PVP daily bonus? Sound like you don't like PVP at all. Imagine if a PVP player stated "I have tried AA+2 10-15 times and never beat the boss and its DISGUSTING" without having a PVE guild, build or whatever if takes to accomplish that goal. You would loose your mind. Do you have a PVP build/setup? What are you running? What class? How are you helping your team win?

Artem_gig

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

Counterpoint: I love the 8v8 solo (bugs aside) and am interested in BGs for the first time in years.

This is not a counter argument. I didn't say that they were bad in terms of gameplay, only in terms of rewards, before, when there were 3 teams, there was a better chance of getting a daily bonus. Now the chance of this has become even less, and sometimes you have to play too many games for this bonus. This was a problem before, it's just that it's gotten even longer now.

Artem_gig

In terms of gameplay, the new pvp is really good.

fizzylu

Pepegrillos wrote: »

They made a great (in principle, in execution...) pvp patch for a population long gone. The kind of players that would've loved the BG changes are mostly gone. The last time they were still around was 2019-2021.

Everyone I know who quit and loved BGs would have hated these changes (and yes, I did tell some of them about it and they think it sounds terrible) and I'm jealous that they were smart enough to get out when they did.

Artem_gig

licenturion wrote: »

You are not forced to play this mode you know.

If you have to waste an hour doing matches against your wishes you are better off doing other things that hour and probably have the same amount of XP by doing stuff that you actively enjoy.

I like this mode, but I don't like that now it takes even more time than before. It doesn't give me the right emotions. I want to have fun in pvp, even if I lose, but get a bonus, even if I have to play 2-3 games, each of which will be lost. This is better than playing 8 losers, and only picking up the bonus with 9 win.

Shanee

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

Counterpoint: I love the 8v8 solo (bugs aside) and am interested in BGs for the first time in years.

Same. Battlegrounds in MMO's are what I always used to play for, especially when I played WoW.

While I had some fun in the old 4v4v4 battlegrounds, they never gave me that itch to want to actively play them. But these new 8v8's have made me save a PvP build in my armoury so I can queue up for these BG's a lot more often. I may even make a couple of my alts into PvP characters.

Artem_gig

Nathanbreakfast wrote: »

Artem_gig wrote: »

In fact, I was sure until the last that the new pvp is great, and partly it is, but it is still impossible to enjoy it. (I'm talking about the 8vs8 modes, which was named by the developers as not stressful). So, the biggest problem with the past battlefields, what with these personally for me, is that they take away your time, not giving you what you actually went into them for. Namely, the daily experience bonus. Sometimes I have to play 10-15 games for this bonus (and it's just disgusting). And all my hatred of this regime could be corrected with one simple new teaching. Namely, it is guaranteed to give a daily bonus after at least 2 losses in this disgusting (for me personally, because this is already some kind of grind) mode. This would finally allow you to play this mode and have fun without being afraid that it will become a routine again.

Why do believe yourself to be entitled to a PVP daily bonus? Sound like you don't like PVP at all. Imagine if a PVP player stated "I have tried AA+2 10-15 times and never beat the boss and its DISGUSTING" without having a PVE guild, build or whatever if takes to accomplish that goal. You would loose your mind. Do you have a PVP build/setup? What are you running? What class? How are you helping your team win?

Well, of course I have a build. I've been playing this game for 6 years. I am not focused only on pve, I am equally a pvp and pve player, and I belong to the respective guilds. An argument with the boss is not appropriate at all. That is, in your opinion, going to some kind of dungeon with a hard mode, even with random ones, is the same as going with 7 completely random players without mmr in pvp? I played 7 lost games yesterday, of course I was in first place in each one, it's no good. The 8vs8 mode is more spontaneous, and it has both not very good players and pros. I won't blame the bad players, they came for a bonus (like me) or fun. The problem is that I can't have fun knowing that another loss won't bring me what I came for. I'm not saying that a bonus would be given even for a defeat, I'm saying that a bonus would be given either from the first victory (as it is done now) or from 2-3 defeats. For me, this is more honest, for such a spontaneous regime. I am alone, and little depends on me in a mode where there are 16 people. Only by joint efforts can victory be achieved. But common efforts are not always possible with 7 random players. At hm, you are prepared in one way or another, and usually with a prepared group. Dungeons and trials are hardly fashionable to find a spontaneous event, which cannot be said about pvp 8vs8.

xylena_lazarow

Pepegrillos wrote: »

The kind of players that would've loved the BG changes are mostly gone. The last time they were still around was 2019-2021.

I'm one of these players (17-19 for me), some of us have been in Cyro, others have actually returned to the game after years gone just to check out the new BGs. Seeing plenty of old familiar names, it's pretty cool.

Artem_gig wrote: »

only in terms of rewards

To each their own. I play the PvP because it's fun and don't care about rewards or rankings.

dinokstrunz

As a BG main (for the last 4 years) I like the idea of these current BGs when they were first unveiled and BGs itself did need overhauling. But what we got in Update 44 is just pure slop. There's just so much wrong in the execution. 4 queues terrible, barely any good rewards, games not starting, questionable map design and mechanics.

This is one of the cases where ZoS needed to listen and respond to the feedback given but it was quite clear that weren't going to do that hence why we have this mess of a system in which nobody is happy. Said it now many a time this game and its community has been on the most remarkable decline and its all because of ZoS. Truth hurts sometimes but needs to be said.

MarioMario

8v8 it's really fun.
100% action with no downtime.

They just need to fix the queue bug.

Varana

8v8 is not 100% action.

It's action for about a minute tops until it's become clear which team will be winning, and after that, it's either spawncamping or letting time tick down.

fizzylu

@Varana
Every match I had this morning for 8v8 was really one-sided.... it wasn't that bad when the update first went live though so I'm not quite sure what could be up with that, if there is anything. I know I heard there's something about MMR being at zero for everyone, but not sure if that was like that from the beginning or not nor do I know how accurate of a statement that is to begin with.

peacenote

Artem_gig wrote: »

Nathanbreakfast wrote: »

Artem_gig wrote: »

In fact, I was sure until the last that the new pvp is great, and partly it is, but it is still impossible to enjoy it. (I'm talking about the 8vs8 modes, which was named by the developers as not stressful). So, the biggest problem with the past battlefields, what with these personally for me, is that they take away your time, not giving you what you actually went into them for. Namely, the daily experience bonus. Sometimes I have to play 10-15 games for this bonus (and it's just disgusting). And all my hatred of this regime could be corrected with one simple new teaching. Namely, it is guaranteed to give a daily bonus after at least 2 losses in this disgusting (for me personally, because this is already some kind of grind) mode. This would finally allow you to play this mode and have fun without being afraid that it will become a routine again.

Why do believe yourself to be entitled to a PVP daily bonus? Sound like you don't like PVP at all. Imagine if a PVP player stated "I have tried AA+2 10-15 times and never beat the boss and its DISGUSTING" without having a PVE guild, build or whatever if takes to accomplish that goal. You would loose your mind. Do you have a PVP build/setup? What are you running? What class? How are you helping your team win?

Well, of course I have a build. I've been playing this game for 6 years. I am not focused only on pve, I am equally a pvp and pve player, and I belong to the respective guilds. An argument with the boss is not appropriate at all. That is, in your opinion, going to some kind of dungeon with a hard mode, even with random ones, is the same as going with 7 completely random players without mmr in pvp? I played 7 lost games yesterday, of course I was in first place in each one, it's no good. The 8vs8 mode is more spontaneous, and it has both not very good players and pros. I won't blame the bad players, they came for a bonus (like me) or fun. The problem is that I can't have fun knowing that another loss won't bring me what I came for. I'm not saying that a bonus would be given even for a defeat, I'm saying that a bonus would be given either from the first victory (as it is done now) or from 2-3 defeats. For me, this is more honest, for such a spontaneous regime. I am alone, and little depends on me in a mode where there are 16 people. Only by joint efforts can victory be achieved. But common efforts are not always possible with 7 random players. At hm, you are prepared in one way or another, and usually with a prepared group. Dungeons and trials are hardly fashionable to find a spontaneous event, which cannot be said about pvp 8vs8.

So I do both PvP and PvE. I think the reason it feels more unfair that you can't get the daily xp with losses as opposed to unsuccessful PvE scenarios is that, except for when someone chooses to leave a dungeon or trial early, everyone on the PvE team fails or succeeds together. There's no scenario I can think of where you run a random daily dungeon and only half of the group gets the XP.

ToT has the same "problem" where the dailies require winning, not just playing, but because it is 1v1 it doesn't feel as bad (to me) as running BG's over and over and just never getting on a winning team. Probably because you have no one to blame but yourself if you lose in ToT. :P Whereas there really is nothing you can do if you're up against a better team to change those odds in BG's. It makes the BG's feel like "wasted" time... moreso even than if you were playing and the daily xp didn't exist at all!

As someone who does both, I would support the idea that the BG daily would be tweaked to address this scenario, and I don't feel that such a change would then "require" ZOS to have to give daily XP rewards to failed dungeon runs. It's just a whole different dynamic and problem.

silky_soft

BG daily should be points based. Score 1500 or something.

Artem_gig

peacenote wrote: »

Artem_gig wrote: »

Nathanbreakfast wrote: »

Artem_gig wrote: »

In fact, I was sure until the last that the new pvp is great, and partly it is, but it is still impossible to enjoy it. (I'm talking about the 8vs8 modes, which was named by the developers as not stressful). So, the biggest problem with the past battlefields, what with these personally for me, is that they take away your time, not giving you what you actually went into them for. Namely, the daily experience bonus. Sometimes I have to play 10-15 games for this bonus (and it's just disgusting). And all my hatred of this regime could be corrected with one simple new teaching. Namely, it is guaranteed to give a daily bonus after at least 2 losses in this disgusting (for me personally, because this is already some kind of grind) mode. This would finally allow you to play this mode and have fun without being afraid that it will become a routine again.

Why do believe yourself to be entitled to a PVP daily bonus? Sound like you don't like PVP at all. Imagine if a PVP player stated "I have tried AA+2 10-15 times and never beat the boss and its DISGUSTING" without having a PVE guild, build or whatever if takes to accomplish that goal. You would loose your mind. Do you have a PVP build/setup? What are you running? What class? How are you helping your team win?

Well, of course I have a build. I've been playing this game for 6 years. I am not focused only on pve, I am equally a pvp and pve player, and I belong to the respective guilds. An argument with the boss is not appropriate at all. That is, in your opinion, going to some kind of dungeon with a hard mode, even with random ones, is the same as going with 7 completely random players without mmr in pvp? I played 7 lost games yesterday, of course I was in first place in each one, it's no good. The 8vs8 mode is more spontaneous, and it has both not very good players and pros. I won't blame the bad players, they came for a bonus (like me) or fun. The problem is that I can't have fun knowing that another loss won't bring me what I came for. I'm not saying that a bonus would be given even for a defeat, I'm saying that a bonus would be given either from the first victory (as it is done now) or from 2-3 defeats. For me, this is more honest, for such a spontaneous regime. I am alone, and little depends on me in a mode where there are 16 people. Only by joint efforts can victory be achieved. But common efforts are not always possible with 7 random players. At hm, you are prepared in one way or another, and usually with a prepared group. Dungeons and trials are hardly fashionable to find a spontaneous event, which cannot be said about pvp 8vs8.

So I do both PvP and PvE. I think the reason it feels more unfair that you can't get the daily xp with losses as opposed to unsuccessful PvE scenarios is that, except for when someone chooses to leave a dungeon or trial early, everyone on the PvE team fails or succeeds together. There's no scenario I can think of where you run a random daily dungeon and only half of the group gets the XP.

ToT has the same "problem" where the dailies require winning, not just playing, but because it is 1v1 it doesn't feel as bad (to me) as running BG's over and over and just never getting on a winning team. Probably because you have no one to blame but yourself if you lose in ToT. :P Whereas there really is nothing you can do if you're up against a better team to change those odds in BG's. It makes the BG's feel like "wasted" time... moreso even than if you were playing and the daily xp didn't exist at all!

As someone who does both, I would support the idea that the BG daily would be tweaked to address this scenario, and I don't feel that such a change would then "require" ZOS to have to give daily XP rewards to failed dungeon runs. It's just a whole different dynamic and problem.

Exactly! That's what I'm talking about. In the dungeons, it's fair not to give daily experience if you haven't passed the dungeon. While in bg, as for me, it was quite fair to give it for the second or third defeat, if it did not work out to win the first time. After all, who hasn't been able to complete a random daily dungeon at all? This is an almost 100% guaranteed daily bonus. While in bg, the chances can range from 100 (in rare cases) to 10%.