Is this game moving more and more into becoming soloable?

I_killed_Vivec

spartaxoxo wrote: »

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

SkaiFaith wrote: »

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

It ain't solo if you have a companion.

I have my companions out 100% of the time cause I feel lonely. In the hardest fights like, let's say, Tragan the wandering minotaur they die after 10 seconds. Stop this nonsense of "if you have a companion out is not solo" - it is.

Why is it nonsense? Tragan kills 'em, what does that prove?

But if there is any content that you couldn't complete without a companion, but you can with a companion then clearly there is a difference between solo and solo with a companion.

Stop this nonsense of "it's still solo if I have a companion". You want to say it's solo... go solo.

I mean I could say the same thing about any other skill. I can beat this boss with a damage shield and heal slotted but not without it would still be considered soloing it. Some of us view the companions the same. They aren't controlled by real people and their AI is bad. Their gear is a pale imitation of what's available to a real player. Since they are so disconnected from being like an actual player, I'd still consider it solo.

I don't play with companions, I choose to go solo.

However, for every "they aren't that good" comment, I see three saying "I can now solo X, and I couldn't without a companion".

AI is poor, gear is bad, they are "disconnected". So if there is no benefit why use them? Why bother? Why not actually go solo?

Oh, it's because they allow you to "solo" content that you can't solo without a companion.

And no, it's not the same as slotting a heal or a shield. By definition it is EXTRA, because you can still slot the same heal and shield... and get the benefit of the companion.

And if you say they are more trouble than they are worth then maybe you need to learn how to use them properly, because others are working miracles with them (OK, and HA pet oakensorc...).

spartaxoxo

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

SkaiFaith wrote: »

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

It ain't solo if you have a companion.

I have my companions out 100% of the time cause I feel lonely. In the hardest fights like, let's say, Tragan the wandering minotaur they die after 10 seconds. Stop this nonsense of "if you have a companion out is not solo" - it is.

Why is it nonsense? Tragan kills 'em, what does that prove?

But if there is any content that you couldn't complete without a companion, but you can with a companion then clearly there is a difference between solo and solo with a companion.

Stop this nonsense of "it's still solo if I have a companion". You want to say it's solo... go solo.

I mean I could say the same thing about any other skill. I can beat this boss with a damage shield and heal slotted but not without it would still be considered soloing it. Some of us view the companions the same. They aren't controlled by real people and their AI is bad. Their gear is a pale imitation of what's available to a real player. Since they are so disconnected from being like an actual player, I'd still consider it solo.

I don't play with companions, I choose to go solo.

However, for every "they aren't that good" comment, I see three saying "I can now solo X, and I couldn't without a companion".

AI is poor, gear is bad, they are "disconnected". So if there is no benefit why use them? Why bother? Why not actually go solo?

Oh, it's because they allow you to "solo" content that you can't solo without a companion.

And no, it's not the same as slotting a heal or a shield. By definition it is EXTRA, because you can still slot the same heal and shield... and get the benefit of the companion.

And if you say they are more trouble than they are worth then maybe you need to learn how to use them properly, because others are working miracles with them (OK, and HA pet oakensorc...).

I have long advocated that people should use companions for content they can't do on their own. I also used to upload videos where I use them to make soloing the dungeons for the story easier. Although, I can and have done those "true solo" as well for the most part. And I have given people information about my setup because their companion had died when my worked. So, it's not a skill issue that makes me see them as still soloing.

Rather, I compare them to having another actual human being. And to be fair, a person who isn't extremely skilled. Even with that caveat, a companion is objectively worse at all aspects of gameplay besides convenience (a companion is always available without wait).

Since a companion does NOT provide the benefits of a duo or group, and is much closer to a pet skill than a person, I still consider it solo.

SeaGtGruff

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

SkaiFaith wrote: »

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

It ain't solo if you have a companion.

I have my companions out 100% of the time cause I feel lonely. In the hardest fights like, let's say, Tragan the wandering minotaur they die after 10 seconds. Stop this nonsense of "if you have a companion out is not solo" - it is.

Why is it nonsense? Tragan kills 'em, what does that prove?

But if there is any content that you couldn't complete without a companion, but you can with a companion then clearly there is a difference between solo and solo with a companion.

Stop this nonsense of "it's still solo if I have a companion". You want to say it's solo... go solo.

What about combat pets? Is it no longer solo if someone uses combat pets? Because it seems to me that companions aren't much different than combat pets, other than being much more customizable as far as their armor, weapons, and slotted skills.

JemadarofCaerSalis

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

SkaiFaith wrote: »

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

It ain't solo if you have a companion.

I have my companions out 100% of the time cause I feel lonely. In the hardest fights like, let's say, Tragan the wandering minotaur they die after 10 seconds. Stop this nonsense of "if you have a companion out is not solo" - it is.

Why is it nonsense? Tragan kills 'em, what does that prove?

But if there is any content that you couldn't complete without a companion, but you can with a companion then clearly there is a difference between solo and solo with a companion.

Stop this nonsense of "it's still solo if I have a companion". You want to say it's solo... go solo.

I mean I could say the same thing about any other skill. I can beat this boss with a damage shield and heal slotted but not without it would still be considered soloing it. Some of us view the companions the same. They aren't controlled by real people and their AI is bad. Their gear is a pale imitation of what's available to a real player. Since they are so disconnected from being like an actual player, I'd still consider it solo.

I don't play with companions, I choose to go solo.

However, for every "they aren't that good" comment, I see three saying "I can now solo X, and I couldn't without a companion".

AI is poor, gear is bad, they are "disconnected". So if there is no benefit why use them? Why bother? Why not actually go solo?

Oh, it's because they allow you to "solo" content that you can't solo without a companion.

And no, it's not the same as slotting a heal or a shield. By definition it is EXTRA, because you can still slot the same heal and shield... and get the benefit of the companion.

And if you say they are more trouble than they are worth then maybe you need to learn how to use them properly, because others are working miracles with them (OK, and HA pet oakensorc...).

I can say the same thing about oakensoul

I fairly recently got it, and managed to defeat some world bosses that I couldn't defeat before, even with companions. So, does the use of oakensoul mean I am no longer solo?

Companions are a mechanic just like every other mechanic. They just come in the shape of a character.

If the user knows how to use that mechanic well, the companions do well. If the user doesn't know how to use that mechanic well, the companion is not good. Just like every other mechanic out there. Someone who doesn't know how to use things like heals (to get the most efficient use out of them) is going to struggle when it comes to certain mechanics.

So, it comes down to mechanic knowledge. If a user knows how to use the mechanics, they can do well, no matter what that mechanic is. But, if users don't know how to use the mechanics well, they will struggle.

Pelanora

SilverBride wrote: »

No it's not. World Bosses, and Public Dungeon group event Bosses, and zone story Bossses, and Incursions have all gotten progressively more difficult since High Isle. This is having a negative effect on a lot of players and should not continue. I would go so far as to say all of these things should be looked at and adjusted to be more in line with the previous zones.

This increased difficulty is not in alignment with what One Tamriel introduced, which was the ability to play how we want. These more difficulty zones are excluding a lot of players from being able to complete all the content and in any order they choose.

There will never only be content for solo players in a mmo. Zos will never walk away from this being multi-player. That would negate years of sunk costs. There will be some content for both in new releases until they give up on the game altogether.

Amottica

Erickson9610 wrote: »

Most content in this game is meant to be picked up and played by players of any skill level, with or without the assistance of other players. Your stats and PvE enemies scale with your level, so you're free to tackle any content in any order without requiring another player. However, some content (such as 4-man dungeons/arenas, 12-man trials, and PvP) are best played with other players.

This is because The Elder Scrolls Online is both an Elder Scrolls game (and most of those have been single-player experiences) and a Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game (MMORPG) that allows players to play together. Players can treat ESO as an MMO, or they can treat it as a single-player TES game.

Major MMORPGs tend to have a lot of solo content with some group content mixed in, such as dungeons and raids. This is normal. The companion does not equal another human player, and many players would still find many DLC WBs to be too much to handle with a fully leveled and top-geared companion others of us have been able to solo most DLC WBs before companions were added to game.

zaria

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

It ain't solo if you have a companion.

If I'm doing a west weald wb with another player and I die, the boss doesn't get reset, unless the other player dies too. If I'm doing the same boss with just sharp, and I die, the boss gets reset. So that's one major difference.

This on many newer quest end bosses your npc friends keeps the boss from resetting.
An good design as this one sees it. Its not like delves then you kill the boss not knowing its the boss but not hard, you just dies a lot and it kind of sent an message in why you get kicked from pledge groups.

Unfadingsilence

Zombocalypse wrote: »

Is it? Considering how they added Companions in one of the recent DLCs.

I'm not complaining, but I want to know if it really is the case.

And aside from Companions, are there other things added in the game over the years that makes it more and more soloable?

Thanks.

?? I thought the game has been solo for 10+ years

Servadei

It's becoming more casual.

Elsonso

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

I don't play with companions, I choose to go solo.

However, for every "they aren't that good" comment, I see three saying "I can now solo X, and I couldn't without a companion".

AI is poor, gear is bad, they are "disconnected". So if there is no benefit why use them? Why bother? Why not actually go solo?

Oh, it's because they allow you to "solo" content that you can't solo without a companion.

And no, it's not the same as slotting a heal or a shield. By definition it is EXTRA, because you can still slot the same heal and shield... and get the benefit of the companion.

And if you say they are more trouble than they are worth then maybe you need to learn how to use them properly, because others are working miracles with them (OK, and HA pet oakensorc...).

Yes, it is solo. I mean, it has to be since there is only one player and the game. Companions are part of the game and can be used to assist the player, just like the scaling, leveling, and buffs they apply to characters in other parts of the game.

The silly part is where ZOS calls companions two players in Infinite Arena. Their companions are not equivalent to another player.

zaria wrote: »

This on many newer quest end bosses your npc friends keeps the boss from resetting.
An good design as this one sees it. Its not like delves then you kill the boss not knowing its the boss but not hard, you just dies a lot and it kind of sent an message in why you get kicked from pledge groups.

Ranged Companions used to run away and take the boss with them, causing the boss to hit the kiting limit and reset.

Zodiarkslayer

Is it really? I think not.
Yes, most mechanics in this game do not require 2 or more players. But honestly, thats not the point...
That would be the entire gameplay-engagement-reward cycle. Which is not geared towards a typical single player focus in ESO.

notyuu

In all fairness outside of a few baked in anti-solo mechanics in certain dungeons and trials everything in the game can be soloed with enough effort

SkaiFaith

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

SkaiFaith wrote: »

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

It ain't solo if you have a companion.

I have my companions out 100% of the time cause I feel lonely. In the hardest fights like, let's say, Tragan the wandering minotaur they die after 10 seconds. Stop this nonsense of "if you have a companion out is not solo" - it is.

Why is it nonsense? Tragan kills 'em, what does that prove?

But if there is any content that you couldn't complete without a companion, but you can with a companion then clearly there is a difference between solo and solo with a companion.

Stop this nonsense of "it's still solo if I have a companion". You want to say it's solo... go solo.

Wao, eye opening: I didn't know I was NOT REALLY playing Skyrim solo for all these years, a literal single player game, in which I was instead never truly alone... Do you know if I can even marry Lydia or Isobel? I mean, IRL...? That would solve so many issues!
I guess I also have a pet, since my Warden bear is always around XD - I'm joking, sorry, but as others said, Oakensoul, pets, and what about the new Infinite Archive "tool" which is totally optional and is an NPC pet that helps you overcome fights you otherwise couldn't?

Also: if you record a video of you soloing an 18mil Dragon, and while you are doing so a single random player comes in, gives 2 hits and then realizes you are soloing and leave... So what? You didn't solo it after all? You honestly wouldn't count it solo? In which case I have good news for you: I bet the majority of people would call you a pro considering your victory a solo one anyway.

Sure a good companion can help overcome a fight previously impossible aaand what's the point? Different gear does the same.
Can a companion be better than a second player? Yes. Take 2 level 20 DDs and they will die. Take 1 level 20 DD with a good Tank companion and they could win.

What defines solo is the fact you didn't have a form of help from ANOTHER PLAYER that you would have not lived/won without.

I think Infinite Archive companions runs should count as single player but I can see it would not be fair since no companion is given out for free to base game players until now, so someone could consider it "pay to win".

(I hope I didn't sound disrespectful; if so it was not my intention)

Necrotech_Master

Elsonso wrote: »

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

I don't play with companions, I choose to go solo.

However, for every "they aren't that good" comment, I see three saying "I can now solo X, and I couldn't without a companion".

AI is poor, gear is bad, they are "disconnected". So if there is no benefit why use them? Why bother? Why not actually go solo?

Oh, it's because they allow you to "solo" content that you can't solo without a companion.

And no, it's not the same as slotting a heal or a shield. By definition it is EXTRA, because you can still slot the same heal and shield... and get the benefit of the companion.

And if you say they are more trouble than they are worth then maybe you need to learn how to use them properly, because others are working miracles with them (OK, and HA pet oakensorc...).

Yes, it is solo. I mean, it has to be since there is only one player and the game. Companions are part of the game and can be used to assist the player, just like the scaling, leveling, and buffs they apply to characters in other parts of the game.

The silly part is where ZOS calls companions two players in Infinite Arena. Their companions are not equivalent to another player.

zaria wrote: »

This on many newer quest end bosses your npc friends keeps the boss from resetting.
An good design as this one sees it. Its not like delves then you kill the boss not knowing its the boss but not hard, you just dies a lot and it kind of sent an message in why you get kicked from pledge groups.

Ranged Companions used to run away and take the boss with them, causing the boss to hit the kiting limit and reset.

i would actually say with the survivability buffs they gave to companions in the archive, its the only spot in the game where a tank companion is better than a human tank, because they are almost unkillable in most stages and can tank marauders and tho'at significantly easier than a player can

ranged companions can still draw aggro if you arent drawing the aggro yourself, ive never really had problems with ranged companions drawing more aggro than me because none of them are set up with taunts, in my experience ive generally never seen this because i mostly use my dps companions with my tank, who is already holding aggro, and i mostly use tank companions with my dps (which are melee and wont dodge unless they are almost dead)

KromedeTheCorrupt

Zombocalypse wrote: »

Is it? Considering how they added Companions in one of the recent DLCs.

I'm not complaining, but I want to know if it really is the case.

And aside from Companions, are there other things added in the game over the years that makes it more and more soloable?

Thanks.

MMO are made to be played with groups of players. Ofc older content is a lot easier and the newer DLC adds things that aren’t really solo able per say which doesn’t mean they can’t be soloed but for example,

dragons from elsewhere,

Harrow storms from Skyrim

Overland bosses from black wood, necrom, west Weald,

Are just a few examples.

My only problem is when the playerbase dwindles or people no longer care to do X activity. It becomes a slog and puts players off from even playing at times. I wanted to farm harrow storms so I can get a lead to craft a specific furniture item. But guilds who always so they offer help every time you ask in guild chat nobody answers or just say no. World chat tells you to shut up or quit spamming chat. Group finder doesn’t even work half the time and most people don’t care to help you with your stuff because they’re doing their own thing they need help with.

I’m not saying everything should be solo able but the longer the game goes on and the less and less previous chapters get played the harder it is to do that harder content because nobody else wants or is doing it. That’s with every MMO so I’m not against a difficulty decrease or increase depending on the number of players at an event. But I mean it wouldn’t really hurt either.

These types of games have loads of content that isn’t solo able or at least not easily but creating a solution to it would make casual people happier not to be locked out of content. I always thought adding a solo able option to MMOS would be such a great quality of life improvement. Especially games that have titles, skins and whatever else attached to that particular content.

Im not saying VHM trial speedrun, no deaths and time limit content should be solo able. Please don’t think I want the game to be any easier than it already is. Keep the proper hard content just the way it is.

I’m just talking about old content that nobody does anymore like overland stuff that can be a pain and more than anything honestly just annoying because you can’t get anybody to help you. Nobody wants to spend 3 hours either spamming chat for help either just let me kill this world boss for my achievement or lead so I can go on about my day.

SilverBride

KromedeTheCorrupt wrote: »

MMO are made to be played with groups of players.

No, they aren't. Playing with a group for the more difficult content is an option but it is not a requirement.

KromedeTheCorrupt

SilverBride wrote: »

KromedeTheCorrupt wrote: »

MMO are made to be played with groups of players.

No, they aren't. Playing with a group for the more difficult content is an option but it is not a requirement.

Your opinion does not negate the fact that mmos are made for multiple players. But okay

SilverBride

KromedeTheCorrupt wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

KromedeTheCorrupt wrote: »

MMO are made to be played with groups of players.

No, they aren't. Playing with a group for the more difficult content is an option but it is not a requirement.

Your opinion does not negate the fact that mmos are made for multiple players. But okay

MMO only means that there are multiple players in the game world at the same time. They are not obligated to group with others to play.

KromedeTheCorrupt

SilverBride wrote: »

KromedeTheCorrupt wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

KromedeTheCorrupt wrote: »

MMO are made to be played with groups of players.

No, they aren't. Playing with a group for the more difficult content is an option but it is not a requirement.

Your opinion does not negate the fact that mmos are made for multiple players. But okay

MMO only means that there are multiple players in the game world at the same time. They are not obligated to group with others to play.

You’re going out of your way to say this is a single player game from start to finish but grouping is optional. So go solo a trial and then post it but I don’t see why you even felt the need to take what I said and make an argument out of it. What are you seeking to gain ?

SilverBride

KromedeTheCorrupt wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

KromedeTheCorrupt wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

KromedeTheCorrupt wrote: »

MMO are made to be played with groups of players.

No, they aren't. Playing with a group for the more difficult content is an option but it is not a requirement.

Your opinion does not negate the fact that mmos are made for multiple players. But okay

MMO only means that there are multiple players in the game world at the same time. They are not obligated to group with others to play.

You’re going out of your way to say this is a single player game from start to finish but grouping is optional. So go solo a trial and then post it but I don’t see why you even felt the need to take what I said and make an argument out of it. What are you seeking to gain ?

I said "Playing with a group for the more difficult content is an option" but players aren't required to do the more difficult content unless they choose to.

Ph1p

SilverBride wrote: »

KromedeTheCorrupt wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

KromedeTheCorrupt wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

KromedeTheCorrupt wrote: »

MMO are made to be played with groups of players.

No, they aren't. Playing with a group for the more difficult content is an option but it is not a requirement.

Your opinion does not negate the fact that mmos are made for multiple players. But okay

MMO only means that there are multiple players in the game world at the same time. They are not obligated to group with others to play.

You’re going out of your way to say this is a single player game from start to finish but grouping is optional. So go solo a trial and then post it but I don’t see why you even felt the need to take what I said and make an argument out of it. What are you seeking to gain ?

I said "Playing with a group for the more difficult content is an option" but players aren't required to do the more difficult content unless they choose to.

Yes, it absolutely is an option, just like playing solo is technically an option, too. But there is also content specifically designed for groups and it's pointless to complain that those are too difficult for solo players. ZOS clearly intended for ESO to have both lots of single player content as well as more challenging activities that require a team. It's literally how they describe their "play how you want" slogan:

SilverBride

Ph1p wrote: »

But there is also content specifically designed for groups and it's pointless to complain that those are too difficult for solo players.

I never once complained that content designed specifically for groups is too difficult to solo. I said that players do not have to participate in group content just because they are playing an MMO.

KromedeTheCorrupt

Ph1p wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

KromedeTheCorrupt wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

KromedeTheCorrupt wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

KromedeTheCorrupt wrote: »

MMO are made to be played with groups of players.

No, they aren't. Playing with a group for the more difficult content is an option but it is not a requirement.

Your opinion does not negate the fact that mmos are made for multiple players. But okay

MMO only means that there are multiple players in the game world at the same time. They are not obligated to group with others to play.

You’re going out of your way to say this is a single player game from start to finish but grouping is optional. So go solo a trial and then post it but I don’t see why you even felt the need to take what I said and make an argument out of it. What are you seeking to gain ?

I said "Playing with a group for the more difficult content is an option" but players aren't required to do the more difficult content unless they choose to.

Yes, it absolutely is an option, just like playing solo is technically an option, too. But there is also content specifically designed for groups and it's pointless to complain that those are too difficult for solo players. ZOS clearly intended for ESO to have both lots of single player content as well as more challenging activities that require a team. It's literally how they describe their "play how you want" slogan:

It’s literally that simple, black and white, and cut and dry. No idea how people don’t understand that.

Every single MMO that has existed has solo content for DUH reasons. No clue what people are on about arguing over an mmo saying it’s a single player game with optional group content. Like well no sh Sherlock Holmes. No MMO is going to force you to be grouped for the entire length of the game. You group for harder content. I want whatever buddy has in that pipe.

spartaxoxo

Personally, I view MMOs as mostly multiplayer games with some optional solo content. The name's on the tin. ESO is one of the most solo friendly MMO I have ever played. It could be better but it's already very solo friendly.

spartaxoxo

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

It ain't solo if you have a companion.

If I'm doing a west weald wb with another player and I die, the boss doesn't get reset, unless the other player dies too. If I'm doing the same boss with just sharp, and I die, the boss gets reset. So that's one major difference.

Honestly, it feels like one of the reasons that world bosses have gotten significantly tougher is just to kill companions. It's a lot of AOEs and other mechs that they can't avoid. And it started the dlc right after their introduction. I doubt they were necessarily trying to undermine the feature they had just introduced, but it does feel that way a bit.

Pelanora

SilverBride wrote: »

Ph1p wrote: »

But there is also content specifically designed for groups and it's pointless to complain that those are too difficult for solo players.

I never once complained that content designed specifically for groups is too difficult to solo. I said that players do not have to participate in group content just because they are playing an MMO.

You have regularly complained content designed for two or more players is too difficult for you.

You've had whole threads on that point.

SilverBride

Pelanora wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Ph1p wrote: »

But there is also content specifically designed for groups and it's pointless to complain that those are too difficult for solo players.

I never once complained that content designed specifically for groups is too difficult to solo. I said that players do not have to participate in group content just because they are playing an MMO.

You have regularly complained content designed for two or more players is too difficult for you.

You've had whole threads on that point.

I have never. And I have participated in dungeons, vet dungeons, and every normal trial so far. So how is this too difficult for me?

ZOS_Hadeostry

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