Cyrodiil Population Cap Testing

Overamera

The first days were horrible with lag, unplayable. But I played yesterday during prime time pc eu and It was actually playable, still laggy (spells not firing off) but much better compared to the first days. I believe they must have reduced the pop cap for the weekend which made it less laggier.

Elsonso

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Overamera wrote: »

The first days were horrible with lag, unplayable. But I played yesterday during prime time pc eu and It was actually playable, still laggy (spells not firing off) but much better compared to the first days. I believe they must have reduced the pop cap for the weekend which made it less laggier.

Maybe they turned the knob to 11 to start with, then backed it off?

Crown

@ZOS_BrianWheeler here's some video from last night. System specs and relevant details in comments if it helps. You're welcome to reach out for more if you'd like 12-person raid footage from our Monday/Friday raids, or just more general video any time.

Solo hammer wielder has no guaranteed heals, so was playing very conservatively trying to get the faction to move together:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0dIFCmLNBY

Jaraal

Crown wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler here's some video from last night. System specs and relevant details in comments if it helps. You're welcome to reach out for more if you'd like 12-person raid footage from our Monday/Friday raids, or just more general video any time.

Solo hammer wielder has no guaranteed heals, so was playing very conservatively trying to get the faction to move together:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0dIFCmLNBY

The Queen approves!

Laddey

Crown wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler here's some video from last night. System specs and relevant details in comments if it helps. You're welcome to reach out for more if you'd like 12-person raid footage from our Monday/Friday raids, or just more general video any time.

Solo hammer wielder has no guaranteed heals, so was playing very conservatively trying to get the faction to move together:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0dIFCmLNBY

Dude your UI is quality.

Care to share?! I like the combat log and the buff timer.

aetherial_heavenn

dcrush wrote: »

PC/NA GH:

- my ping is about 150-200ms higher than before this test (normally 300, now 450-500)
- Skill delay seems worse than before the server upgrade and often skills are not firing at all. Ultimates become spammables because you have to keep hitting the button in the hopes it will go off
- Positional desync is back to where it was before server upgrade - with gap closers I will see my toon have the jumping animation, then nothing happens and 2 seconds later I’m suddenly in a different place. Either that or I jump to a target behind me. Dark Conzergence is pulling way outside of its supposed range again and showing up way too late as an aoe (I’m assuming also as a result of positional desync)
- Break free rarely works, and multiple times I got stuck in a break free loop where my toon did the animation but was still stuck
- CC immunity does not exist (not a new issue)
- No disconnects so far in about two hours of playing

Pretty much the same for me. Including increase in ping. Play from australia.

I played PCNA, on GH for a few hours in both Prime time US and Prime time Oceana from day one of NA test and again 2 days ago. The performance was mixed.
-Crashed as I rode up to a long fight at Chal on first log in. After that I had no crashes.
-Bad FPS and hitching and stuttering, which I haven't had for a long while in zergs: perf got down to 12 fps...normally it's stable 30 in faction stacks, 60 fps and above the rest of the time.
-Big keeps fights produced huge positional desync. But not worse than usual, (apart from that blissful month after the last performance improvement in Cyrodil patch. AAAAH, the memories of it just working.)
-When I was near a ball group, particularly the one tower humping, all of the the above quoted mess happened simultaneously and I got the dreaded all my skills are greyed out, I can't use a potion, break free, roll dodge or blockfeature.

Crown

Laddey wrote: »

Dude your UI is quality. Care to share?! I like the combat log and the buff timer.

https://darkelves.com/addons has most of the addons I use with short config example videos.

The short version:
Addon Slector (helps enable / disable libraries correctly)
AP meter (because we are AP hoors and need to see those sweet, sweet numbers)
PChat (makes chat window much better)
RDK (needed for ult/resource/potion/proxy and shalk/rapids tracking)
Minimap (this one is better, disable the bandit one)
BuffTimers2 (see timers and get alerts to re-cast / maintain)
Bandit UI (best UI IMO)
FTC (only used for combat log module, all others off except for classes that don't need Srendarr, in which case debuff tracker is used)
Srendarr (mostly used for proc / enchant tracking in one display, all other features turned off, cast bar is nice on channeled abilities)
Bandit gear manager (same as dressing room or whatever you like)
Inventory Insights (know which toon has what gear for when you forget to bank an item)
Superstar (see current build making sure you didn't mess up)
Unknown Tracker / Potion Maker / CraftStore / Unboxer / Roomba are quality of life addons
Wykkyd toolbar (needs a patch, can share my version if anyone wants)

Necrotech_Master

i had some experiences running in cyro with the pop caps, i was running in blackreach and generally did not experience any issues even with pops locked

the only time i ran into issues was when ball groups showed up, especially when there were 3 of them in 1 keep fight

other than that it definitely felt like how cyro used to be and felt a lot busier

Crown

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

ihe only time i ran into issues was when ball groups showed up, especially when there were 3 of them in 1 keep fight. other than that it definitely felt like how cyro used to be and felt a lot busier

The ball group conundrum has been discussed for years. Ball groups optimize builds and synergy so they're much less likely to die to stupid things, so they engage in combat a lot longer and keep more server calculations going with more opponents to fight. 12 people themselves won't cause any issues if they're only fighting 20-30 others, but when their damage is hitting 50+ and those 50+ have heals all over each other (as they should), sometimes the servers can't handle it and/or the game client borks out as it can't handle that much incoming data.

In an effort to figure out (on my side) if hardware makes a difference to crashing, I've tested on a 4770k with a 1080 (in 1440p), a 9900k with a 3080 (in 4k), a 13900K with a 4080 (in 4k), and a 7940 laptop with a 4050 (in 1440p) during the past weekend in prime time. They all performed similarly well in small/medium fights.

• The 4770k crashed in range of large keep fights all the time.
• The 9900k crashed twice in range of large keep fights.
• The 13900k crashed once (WHILE I HELD A SCROLL DAEDRA DAMN IT)
• The laptop crashed about 10 times Saturday night (see video above)

RoseTheSnowElf

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

IndyMike26 wrote: »

Is this live for consoles yet? I saw “later this week,” but the week ends in two days…

@IndyMike26, we made an error in the original post. We have since edited that post. The population test will only be for PC at this time. However, double AP is still active on console.

Ok, well good to know that pop caps for Consoles haven't been increased at this time. I would like to point out that much of the old lag and performance experience we had become used to has been seeping back into Cyro. (I occasionally experience it on a more subtle level in pve land too)

When the hardware was first upgraded, the combat bug seemed to end quickly, now it's staying on longer. Got to use Cheese Mongers (if no q)

Animations are invisible. Me and others rubber banding. Abilities not going off. Getting desynced almost regularly like before the hardware upgrade.
Definitely all worse when the Ham is out.

Albeit, not as extreme as it once was, but at the rate it seems to be coming back and my grp/guild mates and fellow alliance members seem to be getting more frustrated, I don't think it'll be much longer before we are back to Cyro feeling like it used to.

And I don't know if this is related to hardware, but the voice chat bug is back, too. In the middle of grp, vc just drops and we're completely locked out of the feature. Need to re-log to hopefully get it working again.

@ZOS_Kevin

I'm PS5 NA

Necrotech_Master

Crown wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

ihe only time i ran into issues was when ball groups showed up, especially when there were 3 of them in 1 keep fight. other than that it definitely felt like how cyro used to be and felt a lot busier

The ball group conundrum has been discussed for years. Ball groups optimize builds and synergy so they're much less likely to die to stupid things, so they engage in combat a lot longer and keep more server calculations going with more opponents to fight. 12 people themselves won't cause any issues if they're only fighting 20-30 others, but when their damage is hitting 50+ and those 50+ have heals all over each other (as they should), sometimes the servers can't handle it and/or the game client borks out as it can't handle that much incoming data. I've tested on a 4770k with a 1080 (in 1440p), a 9900k with a 3080 (in 4k), a 13900K with a 4080 (in 4k), and a 7940 laptop with a 4050 (in 1440p) during the past weekend in prime time. They all performed similarly well in small/medium fights.

• The 4770k crashed in range of large keep fights all the time.
• The 9900k crashed twice in range of large keep fights.
• The 13900k crashed once (WHILE I HELD A SCROLL DAEDRA DAMN IT)
• The laptop crashed about 10 times Saturday night (see video above)

i didnt have problems crashing or disconnecting, but there was a very noticeable lag for sure

a case i remember was in blackreach and AD was attacking ash, there were 2 blue ball groups in the keep (and an unknown amount of random blues) + a red ball group (and some amount of random reds) that came up behind AD outside of the keep

my ping during then shot up from the avg 100 to almost 180, and any skills with cast times were just failing to go off

when there were other fights with just giant zergs, there was minimal lag

when it comes to cyro i usually assume its the servers that are lagging due to the huge amount of processing, especially when ball groups are involved lol, pretty much never have any lag issues in the game client side

Jaraal

RoseTheSnowElf wrote: »

And I don't know if this is related to hardware, but the voice chat bug is back, too. In the middle of grp, vc just drops and we're completely locked out of the feature. Need to re-log to hopefully get it working again.

@ZOS_Kevin

I'm PS5 NA

I've noticed that the audio stuttering is back at some large keep fights that have ball groups and/or the hammer. And it's rather annoying to ride at full speed into an open enemy keep just to realize that you rode through 50 invisible enemies who were casting Empowered heavies at you, and you don't find out until your corpse starts flying through the air at full speed and you splat against the wall.

Laddey

Crown wrote: »

Laddey wrote: »

Dude your UI is quality. Care to share?! I like the combat log and the buff timer.

https://darkelves.com/addons has most of the addons I use with short config example videos.

The short version:
Addon Slector (helps enable / disable libraries correctly)
AP meter (because we are AP hoors and need to see those sweet, sweet numbers)
PChat (makes chat window much better)
RDK (needed for ult/resource/potion/proxy and shalk/rapids tracking)
Minimap (this one is better, disable the bandit one)
BuffTimers2 (see timers and get alerts to re-cast / maintain)
Bandit UI (best UI IMO)
FTC (only used for combat log module, all others off except for classes that don't need Srendarr, in which case debuff tracker is used)
Srendarr (mostly used for proc / enchant tracking in one display, all other features turned off, cast bar is nice on channeled abilities)
Bandit gear manager (same as dressing room or whatever you like)
Inventory Insights (know which toon has what gear for when you forget to bank an item)
Superstar (see current build making sure you didn't mess up)
Unknown Tracker / Potion Maker / CraftStore / Unboxer / Roomba are quality of life addons
Wykkyd toolbar (needs a patch, can share my version if anyone wants)

Thanks man - You're da king.

@Crown

I've struggling with an addon - All the icons seem to have disappeared - Do you have any suggestions bud?

P.S - Apologies this is off-topic. I'm not sure if i can send PM's - I'll be moving this to the dedicated UI / Addon section.

https://ibb.co/86S3zzQ

Reverb

Jaraal wrote: »

RoseTheSnowElf wrote: »

And I don't know if this is related to hardware, but the voice chat bug is back, too. In the middle of grp, vc just drops and we're completely locked out of the feature. Need to re-log to hopefully get it working again.

@ZOS_Kevin

I'm PS5 NA

I've noticed that the audio stuttering is back at some large keep fights

PC NA and I’ve also experience audio issues this weekend in large fights. Sometimes audio stuttering and sometimes the siege and combat sounds are reduced to crackles and static. I’ve seen that happen before after an update but hadn’t been a problem in a long time before this weekend.

RoseTheSnowElf

Jaraal wrote: »

I've noticed that the audio stuttering is back at some large keep fights that have ball groups and/or the hammer. And it's rather annoying to ride at full speed into an open enemy keep just to realize that you rode through 50 invisible enemies who were casting Empowered heavies at you, and you don't find out until your corpse starts flying through the air at full speed and you splat against the wall.

Reverb wrote: »

PC NA and I’ve also experience audio issues this weekend in large fights. Sometimes audio stuttering and sometimes the siege and combat sounds are reduced to crackles and static. I’ve seen that happen before after an update but hadn’t been a problem in a long time before this weekend.

Yes, I have been noticing this too.

Definitely the deaths where I'm running past keeps and never saw anything hit me til I die and my recap is full of stuff I would swear never happened. Kinda hard to defend yourself when you can't see any of it.

It definitely picked up after this recent patch maintenance. So even if consoles weren't intended for the test (despite the error in the original announcement) I'm convinced something was adjusted on the console servers to prep them for potential pop cap changes in the future and we're feeling the consequences now.

Crown

Laddey wrote: »

I've struggling with an addon - All the icons seem to have disappeared - Do you have any suggestions bud? P.S - Apologies this is off-topic. I'm not sure if i can send PM's - I'll be moving this to the dedicated UI / Addon section.

Likely easiest if you hit me up on Discord. You can join Just Chill with the link on the site with addon videos, or hit me up direct @ naitachal

EF321

Update on today's situation in Cyrodiil:
Dropped from server in the middle of the fight
Banned for trying to log back in
(nothing changed)

Zama666

Warning - My Experience, not a complaining

Mixed experience so far.

Assuming that is because we are testing.

The last 3 nights for me were great! I was on for about an hour at time, no real issues. Caveat - I was using a Steam Deck.

It's not going well tonight at all.

My connection is great. Got in the queue for Gray Host 7th in line, not too bad.

Get in to Cyrodiil....off to a keep. See an single enemy, make them dead. Keep moving - big battle ahead, connection gone, I am kicked.

Quit the game, wait, start over. Tosses me back into Cyrodiil. See a fight on the map, head towards it - as soon as I see people - kicked.

Try to login - lost connection to lobby.

This went on for about 7 times.

The 8th time, in, solid performance. No getting kicked. Got into some epic fights ( ie. died a lot), got some AP. A good time.
My lag ranged between 100ms-400ms. But it was not consistent in fights - sometimes awesome, sometimes not

My system remained the same (PC), obviously the time I played changed, but population seemed high.

Just My $0.02 so far.

Z

YandereGirlfriend

Laddey wrote: »

https://streamable.com/ikzkl4

I've no idea if the above link will work. However, the video shows that ALL my boys abilities are unusable.

He could:
Roll dodge
Block
Bar swap

He could not:
Light or heavy attack
Use any abilities
Mount

He tried:
Reload ui
Porting to another keep

It fixed after relogging.

@ZOS_Kevin I hope this helps.

If the link it on its rear end, I will re-upload.

Please note - My boys ping is always extremely high. Therefore, he has considered his ping normal at the point in this video.

BIG YEP to this happening to me as well. Was in the middle of the huge tri-faction brawl at Brindle on Friday night. It was like the Negate Bug but on steroids. I had to port out to IC to fix it. Infinitely annoying.

ZOS_Kevin

Thanks everyone for your feedback so far and for taking the time to participate. We know the Population Cap test is coming to an end, tomorrow, but we are sharing this information with the combat team for them to review along with the data gained from this test. We'll follow up a little after the test ends and after the team has looked over your feedback and data gained.

YandereGirlfriend

That said, the increase in population feels good when the performance is there to support it.

Friday night was the low point by far for me during the test but Saturday and Sunday nights both had good performance (though I do agree that the population cap subjectively seemed to be lowered over the weekend vs. Friday). There is probably a sweet spot somewhere in there where we can get bigger fights without performance significantly degrading.

Perhaps down the line, if ZOS continues refactoring their code, we can get those really large populations again without their attendant issues.

Reverb

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

Friday night was the low point by far for me during the test but Saturday and Sunday nights both had good performance.

This echos my experience (PC NA). Friday night was brutal. Saturday and Sunday performance was better even in big faction-stack battles.

Bar swapping and skill firing was unreliable but honestly that’s been a problem since U40.

I had a period last night (Sunday) of extremely high ping and dc’d twice near Nikel but it wasn’t a widespread problem so think it’s likely it was a network hiccup on my side.

Destai

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Thanks everyone for your feedback so far and for taking the time to participate. We know the Population Cap test is coming to an end, tomorrow, but we are sharing this information with the combat team for them to review along with the data gained from this test. We'll follow up a little after the test ends and after the team has looked over your feedback and data gained.

Can you please share what the goal of the test was and why it's different than the baseline experience?

ArchangelIsraphel

I play on PC/NA, and was in Cyrodiil all day Friday, Saturday, Sunday, and Monday including primetime. I hopped between various campaigns to see how each one felt during the course of the test.

I had very few issues, and surprisingly no disconnects at all even during large fights. Large fights caused the usual delays (especially around ball groups) but overall I found performance to be better than usual in big fights. I was in a huge 3 way skirmish this morning with AD pinned between EP and DC (I was on EP). That kind of lag would usually be an issue, but I was on my feet and fighting throughout the whole thing. It felt great being able to participate in huge fights.

I would have expected quite a few disconnects but had no disconnects at all. I'm seeing here that others had quite a few disconnects and I hope that the discrepancy between those who had issues and those who did not is being looked into.

I do realize other people were having a considerable amount of trouble, and I hope those concerns will be addressed.

As for me, my most major issue was with bar swap delay and skills/shields not firing off in time in larger fights. But that has been an issue since U40 (Which I hope is being looked into, because the problem isn't just in Cyrodiil, its in IC too. I don't have the issue in normal zones, only PVP zones)

Also as a side note- I had a lot of fun during this event in spite of the issues. I always enjoy double AP events in Cyrodiil, but it felt great fighting with other PVPers who actually wanted to be there and fight, rather than having the usual issues that come with whitestrakes and people who just want to get tickets. Please consider hosting more double AP events for Cyrodiil throughout the year that aren't connected to getting tickets.

Jaraal

ArchangelIsraphel wrote: »

Also as a side note- I had a lot of fun during this event in spite of the issues. I always enjoy double AP events in Cyrodiil, but it felt great fighting with other PVPers who actually wanted to be there and fight, rather than having the usual issues that come with whitestrakes and people who just want to get tickets. Please consider hosting more double AP events for Cyrodiil throughout the year that aren't connected to getting tickets.

Yes! The fun factor is greatly increased with the large scale battles, and without the ticket farmers' dead weight slowing things down.

MedicInTheWild

@ZOS_Kevin Asking for a friend..... Could we have double XP when the server returns to normal for a few days. You know for participating in this crazy thing of data collection.

As a note it was great seeing that amount of PVPers, I hope the data that was collected helps bring the PVP realm back once actions are taken to restore PVP servers to greatness.

ValarMorghulis1896

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

We know the Population Cap test is coming to an end, tomorrow

Can you say when it will end exactly? 15.00 UTC probably?

Jaraal

So the test is over and the AP is back to normal. Any updates on the cap, @ZOS_Kevin ? People are saying that it went back down to pre-test levels.

Xzysts

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

Heyo All!

Next week, we will be running some tests in Cyrodiil where we’ll be periodically adjusting the population caps. The first realm being tested is PC EU on Wednesday, December 6. During this time, we will increase population caps and monitor throughout the day through prime-time hours; if all goes well, we will do the same on PC NA later in the week. Edit: PC NA is also online today for the Population Cap Test.

We encourage everyone willing to fight for their Alliance to hop into their respective Campaigns because throughout the testing period until December 12, everyone in Cyrodiil will earn Double AP (On PC, Xbox, and PlayStation)!

Thanks in advance for joining this population test for Cyrodiil and enjoy the double AP while the test is active. See you on the field!

Edit: We made a correction to this post on December 8. The Cyrodiil population cap testing is happening only on the PC servers. The double AP, on the other hand, is turned on for all servers (PC, Xbox, PlayStation) through December 12.

Hey Kevin,

Just curious... What are the population tests being used for? Are we condensing the other campaigns into only 1-2 campaigns? Or are we just trying to see if the servers can handle more people?

Zama666

Today.

Kicked twice within 20 minutes of game play. Each time, encountering combat.
Running around picking my nose, nothing.

Last 45 minutes - golden!!!!!