Have an idea to improve PVP experience? Post it here! Improve the lag not allowed!

Urzigurumash

DrNukenstein wrote: »

I love spamming my instant heal just as much as the next pvp enthusiast. I also dislike the stalemates that are created by spammable burst heals as much as any pvp enthusiast. We would all die more, but it would be because we couldn't create the conditions to get a burst heal off. Having to create the space to heal up would be a fun and rewarding mechanic to add to eso pvp.

Other games with strong healing have cooldowns, limited charges, and/or cast times to limit how easy it is to heal up. Since ESO doesn't use cooldowns and sustain is so generous, I believe cast times are the best way to balance how potent burst heals are.

Strong kiter bias on this idea, but you're right, it would be best perhaps if -

Once you reach a certain Armor or HP, all your heals confer an uncleansable root.

Once you reach a certain Speed, all your heals gain a cast time.

Once you reach both, you get both.

Anyhow really great ideas otherwise doc, a Tanklet by nature and I think I agree with nearly all of them, especially the Jumping Heavy Attack bonus - by the same logic there should also be a melee damage done bonus on gapclosers like Orc had at launch - and you are very right to put at the top of your list:

"nerf passive sustain"

By far, I think this is the best single change. It's hard to guess how it would pan out, it might balance nearly everything out. I suggested the subjection of Mag and Stam Regen to HP Regen's Battlespirit Penalty as an indirect way to reduce DK's damage in this lovely poll: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/628489/dk-needs-a-13-damage-nerf

LunaFlora

the ability to turn off PvP whenever you select a campaign to enter so people can complete delves, fishing, and dark anchors calmly.

a quickslot wheel for siege weapons would be very useful and the ability to place siege weapons from your inventory.

ixthUA

Dead players should be fully lootable, including their currencies.

MLRPZ

ixthUA wrote: »

Dead players should be fully lootable, including their currencies.

You meant tears 😆

DrNukenstein

Urzigurumash wrote: »

Strong kiter bias on this idea, but you're right, it would be best perhaps if -

Once you reach a certain Armor or HP, all your heals confer an uncleansable root.

Once you reach a certain Speed, all your heals gain a cast time.

Once you reach both, you get both.

Anyhow really great ideas otherwise doc, a Tanklet by nature and I think I agree with nearly all of them, especially the Jumping Heavy Attack bonus - by the same logic there should also be a melee damage done bonus on gapclosers like Orc had at launch - and you are very right to put at the top of your list:

"nerf passive sustain"

By far, I think this is the best single change. It's hard to guess how it would pan out, it might balance nearly everything out. I suggested the subjection of Mag and Stam Regen to HP Regen's Battlespirit Penalty as an indirect way to reduce DK's damage in this lovely poll: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/628489/dk-needs-a-13-damage-nerf

Huge dark souls fan bias, but my favorite part of that combat is how deliberate every action is. When you want to heal, you need to create space to do the animation. When you do that heal, which is about as potent as an ESO burst heal, you are vulnerable to ranged punish or a sprinting attack if you didn't peel well enough. Sometimes you and an opponent both decide it's time to heal, then whoever finishes their chug first goes on offense first. It's cut throat.

Caribou77

After update 37, seriously, just focus on fixing all the new bugs. The quality of basic functionality for PVP is the very worst I’ve seen it in the 2.5 years I’ve been playing the game.

I honestly wonder if it will actually be fixed, or if this even further compromised state will just become the new norm. I don’t know what is going on.

wazzz56

Nerf healing....remove cross healing....buff bombers.....revert to patch 1.6.....make ani cancel what it once was......make master angler title give you a 100% damage and mitigation buff in pvp

Veinblood1965

ixthUA wrote: »

Dead players should be fully lootable, including their currencies.

I like this.

edward_frigidhands

Server performance needs to be addressed seriously before anything else.

Urzigurumash

DrNukenstein wrote: »

Urzigurumash wrote: »

Strong kiter bias on this idea, but you're right, it would be best perhaps if -

Once you reach a certain Armor or HP, all your heals confer an uncleansable root.

Once you reach a certain Speed, all your heals gain a cast time.

Once you reach both, you get both.

Anyhow really great ideas otherwise doc, a Tanklet by nature and I think I agree with nearly all of them, especially the Jumping Heavy Attack bonus - by the same logic there should also be a melee damage done bonus on gapclosers like Orc had at launch - and you are very right to put at the top of your list:

"nerf passive sustain"

By far, I think this is the best single change. It's hard to guess how it would pan out, it might balance nearly everything out. I suggested the subjection of Mag and Stam Regen to HP Regen's Battlespirit Penalty as an indirect way to reduce DK's damage in this lovely poll: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/628489/dk-needs-a-13-damage-nerf

Huge dark souls fan bias, but my favorite part of that combat is how deliberate every action is. When you want to heal, you need to create space to do the animation. When you do that heal, which is about as potent as an ESO burst heal, you are vulnerable to ranged punish or a sprinting attack if you didn't peel well enough. Sometimes you and an opponent both decide it's time to heal, then whoever finishes their chug first goes on offense first. It's cut throat.

For sure something has to give, my view of things isn't so much that Tanklets have too strong of healing but far too much mobility, far too much sustain while kiting, which they shouldn't be doing at all. A cast time on all burst heals would be end of proper 1vX facetanking - easy in these Serpent's Coil and Mara DK laden days to not have much sympathy for the playstyle but it wasn't always as popular or effective as it is today.

I guess I'm getting at some "duality" to strike a balance between Kiting and Turtling, I've always been loudly opposed to the "trinity"-born idea that "Tank specs should only be for defense" because a purely defensive spec has extremely limited use in PvP and very few are interested in it anyhow. It never made much sense to me that a "Warrior" should be playing in the same armor weights as a "Thief", but these days the lines between the two are awfully hard to discern, really a "Thief" spec is terribly underperforming for the most part lately (at least in Xbox NA BGs).

StamDK was balanced when the only burst heal it had was GDB rather than Coag, but many on this forum maintained HP-scaled heals were inherently imbalanced and shouldn't exist. Well now DK only uses Damage-scaled heals and the class has never been more imbalanced (on Xbox).

Some new mechanics, like a cast time or root on burst heals, would be interesting and could help solve things, but I'll refer back to something I haven't let go of:

Revert the Direct Damage - DoT - HoT ratios to their Elsweyr levels. The balancing effect of all DoT ticks being unblockable could go a long way as it did in the past. (Facetanking was essentially impossible at Scalebreaker, aka the Entropy Meta, as I recall).

Urzigurumash

To go on about Cast Times and Roots on Heals -

Sorcs are right to say now "We need a better instant burst heal", just as DKs were right to say not long ago "We need more delayed direct damage" - to excel within the meta of the time, yes both are true, but with DK and the power Whip and Flames of Oblivion have gained we can see how a class built to excel in a different avenue than what's meta - in the case of DK it was melee pressure where the class always did well - can become overpowered when it gains the means necessary to rival the meta classes of the time - Necro, Warden, MagSorc - mostly on account of their ranged delayed direct damage. I.e. Flames of Oblivion.

From that view Sorcs don't need a better instant burst heal - Coag needs a cast time like Dark Deal if DK can play evasively and with such strong delayed direct damage.

The Devs clarified recently something like, "all classes should be able to fulfill all roles / specs", sure, that's what the people want, it's in line with past TES games, it makes sense.

But things get a little out of hand when DK and NB can both facetank and kite equally well and also do both at the same time. Something somewhere needs a little more "dynamicity".

Ramzdonb16_ESO

Best fix for PVP would be to completely remove sets.

You can choose between a light armour, medium armour and heavy armour set.

You can choose your weapons.

You can choose your class and skills.

Fully balanced.

All skill based

This would add a competitive aspect to the game and could create tournaments and make BGs one of the funnest experiences.

Another mode like BGS where you directly siege one keep and then have to break through and capture it would be fun as well.

godchucknzilla

1. Remove heal stacking, echoing vigor should not stack 12 times in a group. Major Courage can't stack so why should Vigor?
2. Slow down the movement speed of the characters
3. Buff Major and Minor Defile to 20 for Major and 10 for Minor
4. Fix the Cyrodiil Keeps that don't Upgrade, Glademist is stuck at 0
5. Fix getting out of combat so you aren't tied to someone you fought until you or they die
6. Increase the slots on the quick wheel or have separate wheel for Siege

Jman100582

1. Nerf undeath. It gives everybody way to much free tankiness
2. Nerf sustain. Builds can sustain with 20k or less max stat. Which means you can throw all your points into health, hence why there are so many builds running around with 35k+ hp and still doing damage
3. To further help with the max health tank meta, make battle spirit reduce health by a flat 3k
4. Remove cross healing
5. Nerf tanky sets or sets that greatly boost survivability (maras, pariah, rallying cry in particular)

My main issue with pvp (outside of class balance and lag) is that the general meta is “build barely enough damage to kill someone, and then dump everything else into being tanky.” I think this is because sustain and tankiness are so much easier to acquire than damage. Nerf sustain and tankiness, make people actually need to run recovery and max resources. Incentivize killing people. Modern day builds are way too well rounded, good sustain good tank good damage. It’s too easy to be “everything” and it leads to stalemates way too often

Caribou77

yep

get rid of undeath
get rid of corrosive (cmon DK, you’ll still overpower everyone else)
get rid of cloak 😁

Turtle_Bot

Caribou77 wrote: »

yep

get rid of undeath
get rid of corrosive (cmon DK, you’ll still overpower everyone else)
get rid of cloak 😁

Shhhh, you'll upset the forumblades and cause another riot for daring to suggest balancing their class

edward_frigidhands

Ramzdonb16_ESO wrote: »

Best fix for PVP would be to completely remove sets.

You can choose between a light armour, medium armour and heavy armour set.

You can choose your weapons.

You can choose your class and skills.

Fully balanced.

All skill based

This would add a competitive aspect to the game and could create tournaments and make BGs one of the funnest experiences.

Another mode like BGS where you directly siege one keep and then have to break through and capture it would be fun as well.

So the best way to play the game is by removing a very large chunk of it?

What's next? We remove guild and class abilities and just whack each other with swords and arrows?

edward_frigidhands

LunaFlora wrote: »

the ability to turn off PvP whenever you select a campaign to enter so people can complete delves, fishing, and dark anchors calmly.

a quickslot wheel for siege weapons would be very useful and the ability to place siege weapons from your inventory.

You should not be entering a pvp campaign if you do not intend to pvp.

pedrogonzalez

I have an idea how to resurrect my favorite content in this game, Imperial city.
1. Delete noCP IC. Nobody plays that.
2. Make IC pve location, delete flags. Make rewards x10 less.
3. Open revamped ic. Make bosses spawn every 5 min, but make them twice weaker with twice less stones drop. No flags for districts, you always earn like you have 6 flags. Add some 5 min cd random located sigils with 20/30 sec duration (make it auto usable when you touch it, without synergy key). Maximum group members locked to 2. No alliance. Everyone who is not in your group - your enemy. Also here you may revamp sewers, way to base must be short, but hard.

That revamped IC that I described - it’s what would be interesting to play for ME, because it’s my point of view on what ic must to be.

nublife01

1) remove or nerf heavily sets that encourage heavy hard if not impossible to kill one ones own tank sets such as mara's balm rallying cry pariah etc. Nerf them so that in pvp they are much much weaker. there used to be set variety and less rallying cry ice staffs going for 1-2m on guild trader because nothing else in pvp other than maras balm remotely compares to them. get rid of the vomit tank meta inspiring meta sets.

2) tune hybrid builds so that they are more reliant upon stamina and magicka regen as non hybrid builds so that they have to equip a regen set instead of doublstacking damage sets or tank sets. Or bring non hybrid builds especially stamina (with maybe armor skill line passives) up to par and not heavily reliant upon a magica or stamina regen set unlike their hybrid counterparts.

3) buff non healing defensive/cc/healing reduction/movement abilities to classes that have them and give classes that don't have them abilites that behave this way. Cloak, fossilize, teleport, healing debuffs, etc buff these abilities in a way that encourages higher skill non mindless gameplay.

4) all around nerfs to healing abilities and stacking tank sets in pvp. no player should be immortal in a 1v1. this has been an issue since the game has been released. fix the issue its very cringe.

5) In other words get rid of the tank/zerg ball meta. bring back the high damage high skill meta where a single very good player could kill 5 or so bad players chasing them in the same gear. I don't care if it is done with proc sets or non proc sets it does not matter the tank meta has absolutely destroyed this game and pushed away many high end players and completely flattened any skillcurve with this game making it boring and stale and unrewarding of time investment. This game is almost 10 years old but in its high damage meta prime it was the funnest pvp game i have ever played. a very good player honed in his pvp craft could duel 5 average players at once and win and i havnet seen anything like it since diablo 2 lod. the current tank/zerg ball meta is the utter opposite of that.

6) as a nightblade who understands non nightblade players. easy forever fix to cloak/shadowydisguise: nerf the vampire ability that gives you extra damage based on how low your hp pool is. give shadowy disguise major expedition when it is used but also a cooldown when a non cloak ability is used within idk 3-5 seconds after it depending on the max range of the ability used. this way cloak is still a viable option and a get out tool but is no longer effective for those grief players that i am sure 90% of the community hate that either gank you with a desynced 10-15k hitting vampire spammable or snipe spam and if they dont kill you immediately cloak and run away where as cool ganking such as bomblade is still viable. make it punishing to leave stealth to attack as it should be. also buff dark cloak ffs give it major expedition too and snare removal and make it trigger concealed blades buff. give dark path a different purpose than major expedition. just make dark path a pve aoe or something.

nublife01

pedrogonzalez wrote: »

I have an idea how to resurrect my favorite content in this game, Imperial city.
1. Delete noCP IC. Nobody plays that.
2. Make IC pve location, delete flags. Make rewards x10 less.
3. Open revamped ic. Make bosses spawn every 5 min, but make them twice weaker with twice less stones drop. No flags for districts, you always earn like you have 6 flags. Add some 5 min cd random located sigils with 20/30 sec duration (make it auto usable when you touch it, without synergy key). Maximum group members locked to 2. No alliance. Everyone who is not in your group - your enemy. Also here you may revamp sewers, way to base must be short, but hard.

That revamped IC that I described - it’s what would be interesting to play for ME, because it’s my point of view on what ic must to be.

this would be awesome other than people running with pocket healers. how about only self heals allowed so that there is no youtube or ttv chump running with a pocket healer griefing people. include these types of bosses in the central sewers area. that area used to have so much more attension when the boss in the middle of it was farmable. unless imp city is revamped like this then definitely should not delete noCP IC as it is a nice refuge when a DC zergs the entire cp city ruining small scale pvp/boss farming. the original condensing of imp city to two servers was way bad enough. i just got off because both cp and nocp ic are flooded with dc zergs right now.