Why is everything so expensive? (PC NA)

EozZoe1989

i put my stuff down ..

Pevey

Furniture mats have never returned to pre-New Life writs level.

M0ntie

Supply and demand. ZoS need to increase drop rates (increase supply) in the game so that people can get what they need for less time. This operates very obviously during motif drops during events. Initially the price on them will be high for the people who want them right now, then the price lowers and how much it lowers is proportional to how high the drop rate is.

Things ZoS could increase are for example to return more gold mats when refining raw materials and increase the drop rates of harvesting raw materials.

FlopsyPrince

Lumsdenml wrote: »

DagenHawk wrote: »

sinnereso wrote: »

We also have the issue of guild trader being rediculously expensive due to inflation and guild masters slave driving theyre members to sell / pimp themselves out to meet quota's. Players are no longer treated with any respect within these guilds, theyre just sheep for them and theres no discussion anymore. Its theyre way or the highway and the player left with nowhere to sell anything.

[snip]

THATS how the guild traders are run now!

[edited for naming-and-shaming]

You are right but take heart Auction houses are coming

Maybe not this year but soon.

And you can thank the abdominal way players are treated within guilds for making it happen

I find that very unlikely, and I hope the day never comes.

Why? So the system can keep protecting the profits of a few flippers, making it really hard for everyone else?

Lumsdenml wrote: »

Holycannoli wrote: »

trpajzla wrote: »

Holycannoli wrote: »

Djennku wrote: »

There's lots of groups who will manipulate the market and raise prices for the same amount and availability of goods to make more gold out of it. Eventually people going around buying all of an available item and flipping them for higher prices made things that used to be lower in cost extremely expensive.

So there's no reason anymore to not have a global auction house.

Flipping and reselling items has nothing to do with inflation.

Example (PC/EU real life scenario as it happened couple of minutes ago)

Some player dropped rare yellow Motif 72 Book which is rare, because it drops very little and it is higly valued collector item.

It costs around 8M market price as golds are very common and are generated by bots doing daily writs without any real effort in massive amount (as you can see, bots are not able to drop Motif 72 book so the ratio is 1Book =8M golds and it is absolutely fine

But the player who dropped the book was noob and didn't know exact market price so he sold it for 1,7M golds in his guildstore.

I (as I'm powerseller specialized on collector items and know the prices) found that book and bought it from the shop before anybody else/
So the player who dropped that book got his 1,7M golds and he will be poor forever as it was his life drop which happens once per life.

Then I put that book for proper price 8M to my guild shop and eventually it will be bought by collector for that price.
If not this week, it will be bought later because of the inflation lol.
As I'm running regularly through Tamriel and know the prices, I can buy 4-6 items like that per months.
It makes me nearly as effective as gold/writ abusers with the only difference I'm not generating anything and my actions are absolutely sterile.

The difference is, that the book will be always sold by the market price 8M as collectors have not enough time to run around the shops as powersellers are always faster so my action has not any impact on the server economy, it has just impact on distributing golds, but the ratio between book and golds will be always 1 book = 8M golds.

If you introduce auction house, the book/ gold ratio will be perfectly the same 1 book = 8M golds.

That's not the same thing.

OP was talking about people buying up items and re-listing them at higher prices. Basically scalping, like what was done with GPUs from 2020 to now.

The biggest argument against a global auction house was always that it would prevent scalpers from manipulating the market. The only other plausible argument against it was that guild traders were a gold sink.

So if people are scalping now what's the point of guild traders anymore? Because they're a gold sink? That's it? Because with an AH a lot of guilds would no longer need to exist?

What is the reason now for guild traders to remain in place of a global auction house? Who can give a reasonable argument in favor of them now?

The reason against an auction house was not to stop people from buying things low and reselling them. In fact, the guild trading system enables people to do that because people selling don't have an easy way to see what other people are selling the same item for (not counting addons).
The reason for the GT system over an AH is to REDUCE the number of people who control, or try to control, the market in a given item. The GT system will not eliminate this from happening, but it will reduce it because it puts a barrier up by forcing people to move around the map to buy items. There are a % of people who would go to an AH, buy up all items of something and relist them at a higher price who are unwilling to do so if they have to spend an hour going to every single physical location to do the same thing.
For this reason alone people should not want an AH. This is a reasonable argument.

That does not make sense. Making people hunt to find what they want is going to make the game better for players? Having people list things for below their value, because they don't know the "normal" price is going to help as well?

I have used systems with a Central AH and this one without. The ones with it are MUCH better to really buy and sell things.

deleted220614-000183

Pevey wrote: »

Furniture mats have never returned to pre-New Life writs level.

Because ZOS increased droprate and reduce respawn time of harvest nodes.
It is just temporary because as new chapter will be introduced 6th June 2022 and all people start to buy new furniture, prices of mats will go up again.
Take into your consideration that new chapter will attract inactive players with bank full of golds and these golds start new avalanche .of inflation, as they will be buying new crownstore stuff, new armors, new weapons, mats to increase their quality etc.

Now trading volumes are quite low as people are saving for upcoming DLC and inflation still bits a lot but wait couple of days and I guarantee you that all hell breaks loose.

If now gold/crown is around 3000:1 on PC/EU, it can be soon 4000:1

LalMirchi

As an ethnic viking I refer to my grandpas old proverb "Bra karl reder sig själv" === "A good man is self sufficient" (my translation) ie the reason why impoverished Nordic peasants conquered the known world at that time.

I do the regular dailies, crafting writs (everybody needs to do their chores, even the exalted overclass), quests, excavations and proceed to sweaty and sweatier content for added enjoyment as I really love this game

I get gold, motifs and other attractive objects by just playing casually, I'm in no rush as it all happens organically.

IMHO Rushing damages your perceived fun in any enterprise.

Take care but be brave!

Pevey

trpajzla wrote: »

Pevey wrote: »

Furniture mats have never returned to pre-New Life writs level.

Because ZOS increased droprate and reduce respawn time of harvest nodes.
It is just temporary because as new chapter will be introduced 6th June 2022 and all people start to buy new furniture, prices of mats will go up again.
Take into your consideration that new chapter will attract inactive players with bank full of golds and these golds start new avalanche .of inflation, as they will be buying new crownstore stuff, new armors, new weapons, mats to increase their quality etc.

Now trading volumes are quite low as people are saving for upcoming DLC and inflation still bits a lot but wait couple of days and I guarantee you that all hell breaks loose.

If now gold/crown is around 3000:1 on PC/EU, it can be soon 4000:1

You missed my point. The price of mats never came down to their pre-New Life writs level. Even with an increased drop rate.

JKorr

DagenHawk wrote: »

sinnereso wrote: »

We also have the issue of guild trader being rediculously expensive due to inflation and guild masters slave driving theyre members to sell / pimp themselves out to meet quota's. Players are no longer treated with any respect within these guilds, theyre just sheep for them and theres no discussion anymore. Its theyre way or the highway and the player left with nowhere to sell anything.

[snip]

THATS how the guild traders are run now!

[edited for naming-and-shaming]

You are right but take heart Auction houses are coming

Maybe not this year but soon.

And you can thank the abdominal way players are treated within guilds for making it happen

Question from curiosity; if that is how guilds [your guilds, none I've ever been involved with, around, or even barely acquainted with are like that] why on Tamriel are you and the other guild members stupid enough to put up with it? To the best of my knowledge, there are no legally/magically binding contracts signed in player blood that say YOU MAY NEVER EVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE LEAVE THE GUILD. Why would people who are being exploited, scammed and abused stay in those bad guilds? And please don't say "Because they are the only option", because they aren't. Nothing is stopping anyone from dropping a guild and finding another. If enough abused and mistreated players leave, they could even...:gasp: create their own guild. set up the way they want to run it. If they don't the choice of finding a different guild, one that has no dues, or sales requirements, and they do exist. My no dues no sales needed TRADING guild has a trader consistently. My no dues no sales needed SOCIAL guilds have traders. No one dictates what prices I put on anything I want to sell. I don't consider myself or my guildmates treatment to be abominable. Works quite nicely, actually. Even with my "only when I get ambitious and really want to" selling habits my bank balance is 14m. If I actually put some effort into it, belonging to 1 trading guild/4 social guilds with 30 slots to sell at each one, that total would be higher.

Why would Auction house happen because some mentally challenged masochists enjoy being exploited, abused, and treated abdominally? [which doesn't mean what you think it means....unless it was an honest mis-chosen word on your part]

FlopsyPrince

JKorr wrote: »

DagenHawk wrote: »

sinnereso wrote: »

We also have the issue of guild trader being rediculously expensive due to inflation and guild masters slave driving theyre members to sell / pimp themselves out to meet quota's. Players are no longer treated with any respect within these guilds, theyre just sheep for them and theres no discussion anymore. Its theyre way or the highway and the player left with nowhere to sell anything.

[snip]

THATS how the guild traders are run now!

[edited for naming-and-shaming]

You are right but take heart Auction houses are coming

Maybe not this year but soon.

And you can thank the abdominal way players are treated within guilds for making it happen

Question from curiosity; if that is how guilds [your guilds, none I've ever been involved with, around, or even barely acquainted with are like that] why on Tamriel are you and the other guild members stupid enough to put up with it? To the best of my knowledge, there are no legally/magically binding contracts signed in player blood that say YOU MAY NEVER EVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE LEAVE THE GUILD. Why would people who are being exploited, scammed and abused stay in those bad guilds? And please don't say "Because they are the only option", because they aren't. Nothing is stopping anyone from dropping a guild and finding another. If enough abused and mistreated players leave, they could even...:gasp: create their own guild. set up the way they want to run it. If they don't the choice of finding a different guild, one that has no dues, or sales requirements, and they do exist. My no dues no sales needed TRADING guild has a trader consistently. My no dues no sales needed SOCIAL guilds have traders. No one dictates what prices I put on anything I want to sell. I don't consider myself or my guildmates treatment to be abominable. Works quite nicely, actually. Even with my "only when I get ambitious and really want to" selling habits my bank balance is 14m. If I actually put some effort into it, belonging to 1 trading guild/4 social guilds with 30 slots to sell at each one, that total would be higher.

Why would Auction house happen because some mentally challenged masochists enjoy being exploited, abused, and treated abdominally? [which doesn't mean what you think it means....unless it was an honest mis-chosen word on your part]

You make that money because of the very imperfect guild trader system. Information is very effectively hidden, even with TTC.

That means that a few profit really well at the expense of most users.

pleximus

Someone in a guild I'm in sold a stack of Columbine for 260k gold. My jaw was on the floor when I saw that. The prices are [snip] crazy now. Something needs to be done about this but I'm not qualified to say just how. It just needs fixing. This is sheer insanity.

Edit: This was on PC NA-server.

[edited for profanity bypass]

xXSilverDragonXx

trpajzla wrote: »

I think enough is enough.

What can be observed (especially in VIvec as both writ boards and the bank are very close to every crafting station, drop-off point nearby, all outdoors)
is mixed armies of multiaccounts/bots and normal players crafting writs in massive numbers (by thousands) exploiting:
Automated login / logoff
Automated moving from writ boards to crafting stations and drop-off point
(miss)using crafting addons such as Dolgubon's Lazy Writ Crafter
Automated Banking
Automated buying mats right from the guildstores
etc

The original idea was to give beginers decent amount of golds (215-664 per writ scaling from lvl 6-50 char to be precise) to cover needs of beginers and give them tutorial to the crafting system

It was never mentioned to serve as the biggest (if not the single lol) source of golds in the game.

What really happened is that most of multiaccount/chars are permanently parked in Vivec, making just daily writs and nothing else and destroying ingame economy by generating bilions golds daily.
These surplus golds were not dropped proper way by killing monsters and completing quests but by running automated scripts / boting with minimum effort andit is not tolerable anymore.

My suggestion - limit normal writs rewards to experience, a consumable box of supplies, and inspiration for that profession - no golds at all.
As for as consumable box, it should be limited - one box per account/day

This is necessary to curb insane amount of new generated golds which are destroying the game economy,
making life of trading guilds difficult and encourage people play the game as it should be played.

IDK. I imagine I look fairly automated on my toons when running writs. Maybe there are some out there, but I really don't think it's that many doing automated stuff. I think especially in vivec city, things are so close that it's easy to have a path you run on all your toons. I do it most days. Login by consumables board, pull writs, stop at bank for to pull those items, round the corner to the gear board and pull them. Clothing. Blacksmithing. Wood. Enchanting. Jewelry, Boardwalk to drop off items and get loot. Bank stop again, logout. It may vary depending on my mood here and there. Not all toons might be at same area at login. Sometimes I use the mount to speed it up. Sometimes I ride off the peir because that path is uneven and I have to swim back to shore. But by far and large, it's pretty much the same on all my toons. Am I a bot?

You should also keep in mind that anything that gets people logging in regularly is a boon to ZOS especially if it means they might have plus for it which I suspect many who do writs might. That's why they reward it well, my guess anyway.

Also, one of the largest problems in the game is flipping. Not writs. Writs give people the gold to afford the flipping. What drives prices up is people who buy and sell higher. They gobble up all the good priced stuff and sell it sometimes double and triple.

kargen27

xXSilverDragonXx wrote: »

trpajzla wrote: »

I think enough is enough.

What can be observed (especially in VIvec as both writ boards and the bank are very close to every crafting station, drop-off point nearby, all outdoors)
is mixed armies of multiaccounts/bots and normal players crafting writs in massive numbers (by thousands) exploiting:
Automated login / logoff
Automated moving from writ boards to crafting stations and drop-off point
(miss)using crafting addons such as Dolgubon's Lazy Writ Crafter
Automated Banking
Automated buying mats right from the guildstores
etc

The original idea was to give beginers decent amount of golds (215-664 per writ scaling from lvl 6-50 char to be precise) to cover needs of beginers and give them tutorial to the crafting system

It was never mentioned to serve as the biggest (if not the single lol) source of golds in the game.

What really happened is that most of multiaccount/chars are permanently parked in Vivec, making just daily writs and nothing else and destroying ingame economy by generating bilions golds daily.
These surplus golds were not dropped proper way by killing monsters and completing quests but by running automated scripts / boting with minimum effort andit is not tolerable anymore.

My suggestion - limit normal writs rewards to experience, a consumable box of supplies, and inspiration for that profession - no golds at all.
As for as consumable box, it should be limited - one box per account/day

This is necessary to curb insane amount of new generated golds which are destroying the game economy,
making life of trading guilds difficult and encourage people play the game as it should be played.

IDK. I imagine I look fairly automated on my toons when running writs. Maybe there are some out there, but I really don't think it's that many doing automated stuff. I think especially in vivec city, things are so close that it's easy to have a path you run on all your toons. I do it most days. Login by consumables board, pull writs, stop at bank for to pull those items, round the corner to the gear board and pull them. Clothing. Blacksmithing. Wood. Enchanting. Jewelry, Boardwalk to drop off items and get loot. Bank stop again, logout. It may vary depending on my mood here and there. Not all toons might be at same area at login. Sometimes I use the mount to speed it up. Sometimes I ride off the peir because that path is uneven and I have to swim back to shore. But by far and large, it's pretty much the same on all my toons. Am I a bot?

You should also keep in mind that anything that gets people logging in regularly is a boon to ZOS especially if it means they might have plus for it which I suspect many who do writs might. That's why they reward it well, my guess anyway.

Also, one of the largest problems in the game is flipping. Not writs. Writs give people the gold to afford the flipping. What drives prices up is people who buy and sell higher. They gobble up all the good priced stuff and sell it sometimes double and triple.

Nah flipping isn't a problem. That players can flip items shows that items can be found below market value. The "good priced stuff" is priced below market value. Often done on purpose by sellers that want to move items fast. I had close to 150 motifs that vary in worth between 5k and 20k. I sold most of them well below what I knew I could get for them because I wanted them gone quick. I'm guessing some were flipped because I saw the same buyer grab several. That just means they will more than likely be offered near market value. If they are relisted above market value they will sit there unsold.

FlopsyPrince

pleximus wrote: »

Someone in a guild I'm in sold a stack of Columbine for 260k gold. My jaw was on the floor when I saw that. The prices are [snip] crazy now. Something needs to be done about this but I'm not qualified to say just how. It just needs fixing. This is sheer insanity.

Edit: This was on PC NA-server.

[edited for profanity bypass]

I have found very few alchemy mats on guild traders, so this price does not surprise me. Higher than I would want to play, but not surprising given how rarely they are listed.

kargen27 wrote: »

xXSilverDragonXx wrote: »

trpajzla wrote: »

I think enough is enough.

What can be observed (especially in VIvec as both writ boards and the bank are very close to every crafting station, drop-off point nearby, all outdoors)
is mixed armies of multiaccounts/bots and normal players crafting writs in massive numbers (by thousands) exploiting:
Automated login / logoff
Automated moving from writ boards to crafting stations and drop-off point
(miss)using crafting addons such as Dolgubon's Lazy Writ Crafter
Automated Banking
Automated buying mats right from the guildstores
etc

The original idea was to give beginers decent amount of golds (215-664 per writ scaling from lvl 6-50 char to be precise) to cover needs of beginers and give them tutorial to the crafting system

It was never mentioned to serve as the biggest (if not the single lol) source of golds in the game.

What really happened is that most of multiaccount/chars are permanently parked in Vivec, making just daily writs and nothing else and destroying ingame economy by generating bilions golds daily.
These surplus golds were not dropped proper way by killing monsters and completing quests but by running automated scripts / boting with minimum effort andit is not tolerable anymore.

My suggestion - limit normal writs rewards to experience, a consumable box of supplies, and inspiration for that profession - no golds at all.
As for as consumable box, it should be limited - one box per account/day

This is necessary to curb insane amount of new generated golds which are destroying the game economy,
making life of trading guilds difficult and encourage people play the game as it should be played.

IDK. I imagine I look fairly automated on my toons when running writs. Maybe there are some out there, but I really don't think it's that many doing automated stuff. I think especially in vivec city, things are so close that it's easy to have a path you run on all your toons. I do it most days. Login by consumables board, pull writs, stop at bank for to pull those items, round the corner to the gear board and pull them. Clothing. Blacksmithing. Wood. Enchanting. Jewelry, Boardwalk to drop off items and get loot. Bank stop again, logout. It may vary depending on my mood here and there. Not all toons might be at same area at login. Sometimes I use the mount to speed it up. Sometimes I ride off the peir because that path is uneven and I have to swim back to shore. But by far and large, it's pretty much the same on all my toons. Am I a bot?

You should also keep in mind that anything that gets people logging in regularly is a boon to ZOS especially if it means they might have plus for it which I suspect many who do writs might. That's why they reward it well, my guess anyway.

Also, one of the largest problems in the game is flipping. Not writs. Writs give people the gold to afford the flipping. What drives prices up is people who buy and sell higher. They gobble up all the good priced stuff and sell it sometimes double and triple.

Nah flipping isn't a problem. That players can flip items shows that items can be found below market value. The "good priced stuff" is priced below market value. Often done on purpose by sellers that want to move items fast. I had close to 150 motifs that vary in worth between 5k and 20k. I sold most of them well below what I knew I could get for them because I wanted them gone quick. I'm guessing some were flipped because I saw the same buyer grab several. That just means they will more than likely be offered near market value. If they are relisted above market value they will sit there unsold.

I would argue that it is more likely to be a case of not having any idea what something should sell for, something that is the norm on the PS4. I would buy several BTW to use as research for leveling characters, if I could find a really good source.

JKorr

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

DagenHawk wrote: »

sinnereso wrote: »

We also have the issue of guild trader being rediculously expensive due to inflation and guild masters slave driving theyre members to sell / pimp themselves out to meet quota's. Players are no longer treated with any respect within these guilds, theyre just sheep for them and theres no discussion anymore. Its theyre way or the highway and the player left with nowhere to sell anything.

[snip]

THATS how the guild traders are run now!

[edited for naming-and-shaming]

You are right but take heart Auction houses are coming

Maybe not this year but soon.

And you can thank the abdominal way players are treated within guilds for making it happen

Question from curiosity; if that is how guilds [your guilds, none I've ever been involved with, around, or even barely acquainted with are like that] why on Tamriel are you and the other guild members stupid enough to put up with it? To the best of my knowledge, there are no legally/magically binding contracts signed in player blood that say YOU MAY NEVER EVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE LEAVE THE GUILD. Why would people who are being exploited, scammed and abused stay in those bad guilds? And please don't say "Because they are the only option", because they aren't. Nothing is stopping anyone from dropping a guild and finding another. If enough abused and mistreated players leave, they could even...:gasp: create their own guild. set up the way they want to run it. If they don't the choice of finding a different guild, one that has no dues, or sales requirements, and they do exist. My no dues no sales needed TRADING guild has a trader consistently. My no dues no sales needed SOCIAL guilds have traders. No one dictates what prices I put on anything I want to sell. I don't consider myself or my guildmates treatment to be abominable. Works quite nicely, actually. Even with my "only when I get ambitious and really want to" selling habits my bank balance is 14m. If I actually put some effort into it, belonging to 1 trading guild/4 social guilds with 30 slots to sell at each one, that total would be higher.

Why would Auction house happen because some mentally challenged masochists enjoy being exploited, abused, and treated abdominally? [which doesn't mean what you think it means....unless it was an honest mis-chosen word on your part]

You make that money because of the very imperfect guild trader system. Information is very effectively hidden, even with TTC.

That means that a few profit really well at the expense of most users.

A "few" profit... You don't have to be in a TRADING guild to trade. My social guilds that are not focused on trading get traders, so the pool of a "few" expands again. Even if no one is ambitious enough to try for a trader the option of the guild store is still there. It isn't that hard to make gold in this game. Before the traders existed, getting gold was a LOT harder.

The thing I can't get past is simply this; no one is being forced to pay exorbitant prices. Everything that you can buy at the guild trader you can farm yourself in-game IF you are willing to spend the time to do it. TTC is, in my opinion, personal opinion only, worthless for pricing anything. TTC shows the price someone listed an item for; it does NOT show what the item actually sold for. Someone could list a blue beginner motif for 250k, and its uploaded to TTC, that is the price that will show. When you check MM prices in the guilds you belong to it shows it sold for 50 gold. Again, people are free to list items at whatever price they want to ask for, and the players are equally free to "Nope, not paying *that* much" and leaving the buying screen.

Jpk0012

IMO, its 1 of 2 things. Either ZOS has started to take a serious stance on bots, which is why tannins have been so cheap for years, or its manipulation by the bot owners, as they are, by far, the richest people in game.

If you don't think tannins have been seriously undervalued for years go ahead and farm the material. Its far easier to farm something else and buy the tannins.

FlopsyPrince

JKorr wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

DagenHawk wrote: »

sinnereso wrote: »

We also have the issue of guild trader being rediculously expensive due to inflation and guild masters slave driving theyre members to sell / pimp themselves out to meet quota's. Players are no longer treated with any respect within these guilds, theyre just sheep for them and theres no discussion anymore. Its theyre way or the highway and the player left with nowhere to sell anything.

[snip]

THATS how the guild traders are run now!

[edited for naming-and-shaming]

You are right but take heart Auction houses are coming

Maybe not this year but soon.

And you can thank the abdominal way players are treated within guilds for making it happen

Question from curiosity; if that is how guilds [your guilds, none I've ever been involved with, around, or even barely acquainted with are like that] why on Tamriel are you and the other guild members stupid enough to put up with it? To the best of my knowledge, there are no legally/magically binding contracts signed in player blood that say YOU MAY NEVER EVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE LEAVE THE GUILD. Why would people who are being exploited, scammed and abused stay in those bad guilds? And please don't say "Because they are the only option", because they aren't. Nothing is stopping anyone from dropping a guild and finding another. If enough abused and mistreated players leave, they could even...:gasp: create their own guild. set up the way they want to run it. If they don't the choice of finding a different guild, one that has no dues, or sales requirements, and they do exist. My no dues no sales needed TRADING guild has a trader consistently. My no dues no sales needed SOCIAL guilds have traders. No one dictates what prices I put on anything I want to sell. I don't consider myself or my guildmates treatment to be abominable. Works quite nicely, actually. Even with my "only when I get ambitious and really want to" selling habits my bank balance is 14m. If I actually put some effort into it, belonging to 1 trading guild/4 social guilds with 30 slots to sell at each one, that total would be higher.

Why would Auction house happen because some mentally challenged masochists enjoy being exploited, abused, and treated abdominally? [which doesn't mean what you think it means....unless it was an honest mis-chosen word on your part]

You make that money because of the very imperfect guild trader system. Information is very effectively hidden, even with TTC.

That means that a few profit really well at the expense of most users.

A "few" profit... You don't have to be in a TRADING guild to trade. My social guilds that are not focused on trading get traders, so the pool of a "few" expands again. Even if no one is ambitious enough to try for a trader the option of the guild store is still there. It isn't that hard to make gold in this game. Before the traders existed, getting gold was a LOT harder.

The thing I can't get past is simply this; no one is being forced to pay exorbitant prices. Everything that you can buy at the guild trader you can farm yourself in-game IF you are willing to spend the time to do it. TTC is, in my opinion, personal opinion only, worthless for pricing anything. TTC shows the price someone listed an item for; it does NOT show what the item actually sold for. Someone could list a blue beginner motif for 250k, and its uploaded to TTC, that is the price that will show. When you check MM prices in the guilds you belong to it shows it sold for 50 gold. Again, people are free to list items at whatever price they want to ask for, and the players are equally free to "Nope, not paying *that* much" and leaving the buying screen.

You completely missed my point. I have no way to easily find what is really a fair price, especially on the PS4. Yes, I don't have to buy anything, but finding things for comparative prices or gear to purchase is a very difficult process. You benefit because of this, but it is a very poorly designed system for most players.

JKorr

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

DagenHawk wrote: »

sinnereso wrote: »

We also have the issue of guild trader being rediculously expensive due to inflation and guild masters slave driving theyre members to sell / pimp themselves out to meet quota's. Players are no longer treated with any respect within these guilds, theyre just sheep for them and theres no discussion anymore. Its theyre way or the highway and the player left with nowhere to sell anything.

[snip]

THATS how the guild traders are run now!

[edited for naming-and-shaming]

You are right but take heart Auction houses are coming

Maybe not this year but soon.

And you can thank the abdominal way players are treated within guilds for making it happen

Question from curiosity; if that is how guilds [your guilds, none I've ever been involved with, around, or even barely acquainted with are like that] why on Tamriel are you and the other guild members stupid enough to put up with it? To the best of my knowledge, there are no legally/magically binding contracts signed in player blood that say YOU MAY NEVER EVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE LEAVE THE GUILD. Why would people who are being exploited, scammed and abused stay in those bad guilds? And please don't say "Because they are the only option", because they aren't. Nothing is stopping anyone from dropping a guild and finding another. If enough abused and mistreated players leave, they could even...:gasp: create their own guild. set up the way they want to run it. If they don't the choice of finding a different guild, one that has no dues, or sales requirements, and they do exist. My no dues no sales needed TRADING guild has a trader consistently. My no dues no sales needed SOCIAL guilds have traders. No one dictates what prices I put on anything I want to sell. I don't consider myself or my guildmates treatment to be abominable. Works quite nicely, actually. Even with my "only when I get ambitious and really want to" selling habits my bank balance is 14m. If I actually put some effort into it, belonging to 1 trading guild/4 social guilds with 30 slots to sell at each one, that total would be higher.

Why would Auction house happen because some mentally challenged masochists enjoy being exploited, abused, and treated abdominally? [which doesn't mean what you think it means....unless it was an honest mis-chosen word on your part]

You make that money because of the very imperfect guild trader system. Information is very effectively hidden, even with TTC.

That means that a few profit really well at the expense of most users.

A "few" profit... You don't have to be in a TRADING guild to trade. My social guilds that are not focused on trading get traders, so the pool of a "few" expands again. Even if no one is ambitious enough to try for a trader the option of the guild store is still there. It isn't that hard to make gold in this game. Before the traders existed, getting gold was a LOT harder.

The thing I can't get past is simply this; no one is being forced to pay exorbitant prices. Everything that you can buy at the guild trader you can farm yourself in-game IF you are willing to spend the time to do it. TTC is, in my opinion, personal opinion only, worthless for pricing anything. TTC shows the price someone listed an item for; it does NOT show what the item actually sold for. Someone could list a blue beginner motif for 250k, and its uploaded to TTC, that is the price that will show. When you check MM prices in the guilds you belong to it shows it sold for 50 gold. Again, people are free to list items at whatever price they want to ask for, and the players are equally free to "Nope, not paying *that* much" and leaving the buying screen.

You completely missed my point. I have no way to easily find what is really a fair price, especially on the PS4. Yes, I don't have to buy anything, but finding things for comparative prices or gear to purchase is a very difficult process. You benefit because of this, but it is a very poorly designed system for most players.

My point was "post your own prices". Common sense and a look at even one trader will show you a ballpark amount.

If you go too high, your items won't sell. If you go too low you'll know because your items will instantly sell, so you can go a little higher next time until you find the balance point. Asking guildmates for a price check might work; people even ask in zone chat. It doesn't have to be as difficult as some people [who may have personal agendas] make it out to be.

kargen27

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

DagenHawk wrote: »

sinnereso wrote: »

We also have the issue of guild trader being rediculously expensive due to inflation and guild masters slave driving theyre members to sell / pimp themselves out to meet quota's. Players are no longer treated with any respect within these guilds, theyre just sheep for them and theres no discussion anymore. Its theyre way or the highway and the player left with nowhere to sell anything.

[snip]

THATS how the guild traders are run now!

[edited for naming-and-shaming]

You are right but take heart Auction houses are coming

Maybe not this year but soon.

And you can thank the abdominal way players are treated within guilds for making it happen

Question from curiosity; if that is how guilds [your guilds, none I've ever been involved with, around, or even barely acquainted with are like that] why on Tamriel are you and the other guild members stupid enough to put up with it? To the best of my knowledge, there are no legally/magically binding contracts signed in player blood that say YOU MAY NEVER EVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE LEAVE THE GUILD. Why would people who are being exploited, scammed and abused stay in those bad guilds? And please don't say "Because they are the only option", because they aren't. Nothing is stopping anyone from dropping a guild and finding another. If enough abused and mistreated players leave, they could even...:gasp: create their own guild. set up the way they want to run it. If they don't the choice of finding a different guild, one that has no dues, or sales requirements, and they do exist. My no dues no sales needed TRADING guild has a trader consistently. My no dues no sales needed SOCIAL guilds have traders. No one dictates what prices I put on anything I want to sell. I don't consider myself or my guildmates treatment to be abominable. Works quite nicely, actually. Even with my "only when I get ambitious and really want to" selling habits my bank balance is 14m. If I actually put some effort into it, belonging to 1 trading guild/4 social guilds with 30 slots to sell at each one, that total would be higher.

Why would Auction house happen because some mentally challenged masochists enjoy being exploited, abused, and treated abdominally? [which doesn't mean what you think it means....unless it was an honest mis-chosen word on your part]

You make that money because of the very imperfect guild trader system. Information is very effectively hidden, even with TTC.

That means that a few profit really well at the expense of most users.

A "few" profit... You don't have to be in a TRADING guild to trade. My social guilds that are not focused on trading get traders, so the pool of a "few" expands again. Even if no one is ambitious enough to try for a trader the option of the guild store is still there. It isn't that hard to make gold in this game. Before the traders existed, getting gold was a LOT harder.

The thing I can't get past is simply this; no one is being forced to pay exorbitant prices. Everything that you can buy at the guild trader you can farm yourself in-game IF you are willing to spend the time to do it. TTC is, in my opinion, personal opinion only, worthless for pricing anything. TTC shows the price someone listed an item for; it does NOT show what the item actually sold for. Someone could list a blue beginner motif for 250k, and its uploaded to TTC, that is the price that will show. When you check MM prices in the guilds you belong to it shows it sold for 50 gold. Again, people are free to list items at whatever price they want to ask for, and the players are equally free to "Nope, not paying *that* much" and leaving the buying screen.

You completely missed my point. I have no way to easily find what is really a fair price, especially on the PS4. Yes, I don't have to buy anything, but finding things for comparative prices or gear to purchase is a very difficult process. You benefit because of this, but it is a very poorly designed system for most players.

I look at it from a different point I guess. When purchasing I consider one thing. Is it at a price I am willing to pay. If not then I will go look for a lower price elsewhere. If yes then I purchase it. If I then see it cheaper somewhere else it doesn't really bother me. I got it at a price I was willing to pay. Some high priced items I will visit several traders to get an idea of price. Moderate priced items I don't shop around as much figuring my time is worth more than any potential savings.

When selling rare items I visit several traders to get an idea of price range. I don't trust TTC to give accurate prices for anything but common items.

FlopsyPrince

JKorr wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

DagenHawk wrote: »

sinnereso wrote: »

We also have the issue of guild trader being rediculously expensive due to inflation and guild masters slave driving theyre members to sell / pimp themselves out to meet quota's. Players are no longer treated with any respect within these guilds, theyre just sheep for them and theres no discussion anymore. Its theyre way or the highway and the player left with nowhere to sell anything.

[snip]

THATS how the guild traders are run now!

[edited for naming-and-shaming]

You are right but take heart Auction houses are coming

Maybe not this year but soon.

And you can thank the abdominal way players are treated within guilds for making it happen

Question from curiosity; if that is how guilds [your guilds, none I've ever been involved with, around, or even barely acquainted with are like that] why on Tamriel are you and the other guild members stupid enough to put up with it? To the best of my knowledge, there are no legally/magically binding contracts signed in player blood that say YOU MAY NEVER EVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE LEAVE THE GUILD. Why would people who are being exploited, scammed and abused stay in those bad guilds? And please don't say "Because they are the only option", because they aren't. Nothing is stopping anyone from dropping a guild and finding another. If enough abused and mistreated players leave, they could even...:gasp: create their own guild. set up the way they want to run it. If they don't the choice of finding a different guild, one that has no dues, or sales requirements, and they do exist. My no dues no sales needed TRADING guild has a trader consistently. My no dues no sales needed SOCIAL guilds have traders. No one dictates what prices I put on anything I want to sell. I don't consider myself or my guildmates treatment to be abominable. Works quite nicely, actually. Even with my "only when I get ambitious and really want to" selling habits my bank balance is 14m. If I actually put some effort into it, belonging to 1 trading guild/4 social guilds with 30 slots to sell at each one, that total would be higher.

Why would Auction house happen because some mentally challenged masochists enjoy being exploited, abused, and treated abdominally? [which doesn't mean what you think it means....unless it was an honest mis-chosen word on your part]

You make that money because of the very imperfect guild trader system. Information is very effectively hidden, even with TTC.

That means that a few profit really well at the expense of most users.

A "few" profit... You don't have to be in a TRADING guild to trade. My social guilds that are not focused on trading get traders, so the pool of a "few" expands again. Even if no one is ambitious enough to try for a trader the option of the guild store is still there. It isn't that hard to make gold in this game. Before the traders existed, getting gold was a LOT harder.

The thing I can't get past is simply this; no one is being forced to pay exorbitant prices. Everything that you can buy at the guild trader you can farm yourself in-game IF you are willing to spend the time to do it. TTC is, in my opinion, personal opinion only, worthless for pricing anything. TTC shows the price someone listed an item for; it does NOT show what the item actually sold for. Someone could list a blue beginner motif for 250k, and its uploaded to TTC, that is the price that will show. When you check MM prices in the guilds you belong to it shows it sold for 50 gold. Again, people are free to list items at whatever price they want to ask for, and the players are equally free to "Nope, not paying *that* much" and leaving the buying screen.

You completely missed my point. I have no way to easily find what is really a fair price, especially on the PS4. Yes, I don't have to buy anything, but finding things for comparative prices or gear to purchase is a very difficult process. You benefit because of this, but it is a very poorly designed system for most players.

My point was "post your own prices". Common sense and a look at even one trader will show you a ballpark amount.

If you go too high, your items won't sell. If you go too low you'll know because your items will instantly sell, so you can go a little higher next time until you find the balance point. Asking guildmates for a price check might work; people even ask in zone chat. It doesn't have to be as difficult as some people [who may have personal agendas] make it out to be.

That point does not work well.

How much is a specific purple ring worth? I may not be able to find many on the market. If I list it for 5K gold maybe it would be bought to get flipped. If I try 100K gold maybe I way overpriced.

A good market would let me find out prices no (at the least) so I could price accordingly.

Ermiq

Snamyap wrote: »

ShawnLaRock wrote: »

The problem is that people actually PAY the exorbitant prices, plus there is far too much gold.

S.

If you have millions and nothing worthwhile to spend it on then paying a few k extra for upgrade materials is irrelevant.

That's my case I guess. Have returned recently after another long break. And yeah, I notice the prices went up higher. But I still have my 8+ millions gold that I already had long before and didn't really have much reasons to spend.

tmbrinks

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

DagenHawk wrote: »

sinnereso wrote: »

We also have the issue of guild trader being rediculously expensive due to inflation and guild masters slave driving theyre members to sell / pimp themselves out to meet quota's. Players are no longer treated with any respect within these guilds, theyre just sheep for them and theres no discussion anymore. Its theyre way or the highway and the player left with nowhere to sell anything.

[snip]

THATS how the guild traders are run now!

[edited for naming-and-shaming]

You are right but take heart Auction houses are coming

Maybe not this year but soon.

And you can thank the abdominal way players are treated within guilds for making it happen

Question from curiosity; if that is how guilds [your guilds, none I've ever been involved with, around, or even barely acquainted with are like that] why on Tamriel are you and the other guild members stupid enough to put up with it? To the best of my knowledge, there are no legally/magically binding contracts signed in player blood that say YOU MAY NEVER EVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE LEAVE THE GUILD. Why would people who are being exploited, scammed and abused stay in those bad guilds? And please don't say "Because they are the only option", because they aren't. Nothing is stopping anyone from dropping a guild and finding another. If enough abused and mistreated players leave, they could even...:gasp: create their own guild. set up the way they want to run it. If they don't the choice of finding a different guild, one that has no dues, or sales requirements, and they do exist. My no dues no sales needed TRADING guild has a trader consistently. My no dues no sales needed SOCIAL guilds have traders. No one dictates what prices I put on anything I want to sell. I don't consider myself or my guildmates treatment to be abominable. Works quite nicely, actually. Even with my "only when I get ambitious and really want to" selling habits my bank balance is 14m. If I actually put some effort into it, belonging to 1 trading guild/4 social guilds with 30 slots to sell at each one, that total would be higher.

Why would Auction house happen because some mentally challenged masochists enjoy being exploited, abused, and treated abdominally? [which doesn't mean what you think it means....unless it was an honest mis-chosen word on your part]

You make that money because of the very imperfect guild trader system. Information is very effectively hidden, even with TTC.

That means that a few profit really well at the expense of most users.

A "few" profit... You don't have to be in a TRADING guild to trade. My social guilds that are not focused on trading get traders, so the pool of a "few" expands again. Even if no one is ambitious enough to try for a trader the option of the guild store is still there. It isn't that hard to make gold in this game. Before the traders existed, getting gold was a LOT harder.

The thing I can't get past is simply this; no one is being forced to pay exorbitant prices. Everything that you can buy at the guild trader you can farm yourself in-game IF you are willing to spend the time to do it. TTC is, in my opinion, personal opinion only, worthless for pricing anything. TTC shows the price someone listed an item for; it does NOT show what the item actually sold for. Someone could list a blue beginner motif for 250k, and its uploaded to TTC, that is the price that will show. When you check MM prices in the guilds you belong to it shows it sold for 50 gold. Again, people are free to list items at whatever price they want to ask for, and the players are equally free to "Nope, not paying *that* much" and leaving the buying screen.

You completely missed my point. I have no way to easily find what is really a fair price, especially on the PS4. Yes, I don't have to buy anything, but finding things for comparative prices or gear to purchase is a very difficult process. You benefit because of this, but it is a very poorly designed system for most players.

My point was "post your own prices". Common sense and a look at even one trader will show you a ballpark amount.

If you go too high, your items won't sell. If you go too low you'll know because your items will instantly sell, so you can go a little higher next time until you find the balance point. Asking guildmates for a price check might work; people even ask in zone chat. It doesn't have to be as difficult as some people [who may have personal agendas] make it out to be.

That point does not work well.

How much is a specific purple ring worth? I may not be able to find many on the market. If I list it for 5K gold maybe it would be bought to get flipped. If I try 100K gold maybe I way overpriced.

A good market would let me find out prices no (at the least) so I could price accordingly.

Things are worth what you're willing to sell them for. Things are worth what people will pay for them. Sometimes there's a difference in "value". If you're going to have buyers/sellers remorse when buying/selling, then you'll do some research first.

It's like when my parents sold our working Atari 2600 with about 30 games and all the controllers at their garage sale while I was off at college (and they were moving) for like $30 (it was easily worth 10x at the time).

They got money for what they considered junk that was taking up space. The buyer got a great deal (and likely "flipped" the item). Both parties were happy. Sure, my technology illiterate parents could have looked up prices on the internet (I'd call TTC ESO's "internet") to get an idea of its worth. They could have also asked me for a suggestion (and I knew it was worth more than the $30, but wouldn't have thought it was worth the $300 or so it actually was).

JKorr

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

DagenHawk wrote: »

sinnereso wrote: »

We also have the issue of guild trader being rediculously expensive due to inflation and guild masters slave driving theyre members to sell / pimp themselves out to meet quota's. Players are no longer treated with any respect within these guilds, theyre just sheep for them and theres no discussion anymore. Its theyre way or the highway and the player left with nowhere to sell anything.

[snip]

THATS how the guild traders are run now!

[edited for naming-and-shaming]

You are right but take heart Auction houses are coming

Maybe not this year but soon.

And you can thank the abdominal way players are treated within guilds for making it happen

Question from curiosity; if that is how guilds [your guilds, none I've ever been involved with, around, or even barely acquainted with are like that] why on Tamriel are you and the other guild members stupid enough to put up with it? To the best of my knowledge, there are no legally/magically binding contracts signed in player blood that say YOU MAY NEVER EVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE LEAVE THE GUILD. Why would people who are being exploited, scammed and abused stay in those bad guilds? And please don't say "Because they are the only option", because they aren't. Nothing is stopping anyone from dropping a guild and finding another. If enough abused and mistreated players leave, they could even...:gasp: create their own guild. set up the way they want to run it. If they don't the choice of finding a different guild, one that has no dues, or sales requirements, and they do exist. My no dues no sales needed TRADING guild has a trader consistently. My no dues no sales needed SOCIAL guilds have traders. No one dictates what prices I put on anything I want to sell. I don't consider myself or my guildmates treatment to be abominable. Works quite nicely, actually. Even with my "only when I get ambitious and really want to" selling habits my bank balance is 14m. If I actually put some effort into it, belonging to 1 trading guild/4 social guilds with 30 slots to sell at each one, that total would be higher.

Why would Auction house happen because some mentally challenged masochists enjoy being exploited, abused, and treated abdominally? [which doesn't mean what you think it means....unless it was an honest mis-chosen word on your part]

You make that money because of the very imperfect guild trader system. Information is very effectively hidden, even with TTC.

That means that a few profit really well at the expense of most users.

A "few" profit... You don't have to be in a TRADING guild to trade. My social guilds that are not focused on trading get traders, so the pool of a "few" expands again. Even if no one is ambitious enough to try for a trader the option of the guild store is still there. It isn't that hard to make gold in this game. Before the traders existed, getting gold was a LOT harder.

The thing I can't get past is simply this; no one is being forced to pay exorbitant prices. Everything that you can buy at the guild trader you can farm yourself in-game IF you are willing to spend the time to do it. TTC is, in my opinion, personal opinion only, worthless for pricing anything. TTC shows the price someone listed an item for; it does NOT show what the item actually sold for. Someone could list a blue beginner motif for 250k, and its uploaded to TTC, that is the price that will show. When you check MM prices in the guilds you belong to it shows it sold for 50 gold. Again, people are free to list items at whatever price they want to ask for, and the players are equally free to "Nope, not paying *that* much" and leaving the buying screen.

You completely missed my point. I have no way to easily find what is really a fair price, especially on the PS4. Yes, I don't have to buy anything, but finding things for comparative prices or gear to purchase is a very difficult process. You benefit because of this, but it is a very poorly designed system for most players.

My point was "post your own prices". Common sense and a look at even one trader will show you a ballpark amount.

If you go too high, your items won't sell. If you go too low you'll know because your items will instantly sell, so you can go a little higher next time until you find the balance point. Asking guildmates for a price check might work; people even ask in zone chat. It doesn't have to be as difficult as some people [who may have personal agendas] make it out to be.

That point does not work well.

How much is a specific purple ring worth? I may not be able to find many on the market. If I list it for 5K gold maybe it would be bought to get flipped. If I try 100K gold maybe I way overpriced.

A good market would let me find out prices no (at the least) so I could price accordingly.

Is there a reason you absolutely positively have to know an exact price to sell an item? Are the selling opportunities so limited for you that you have to make the max amount of gold on every single sale? Is some great cosmic balance threatened if you list an item for a reasonable not exorbitant price and its bought and flipped? Even if it happens you would then have an example of the price you could have asked, and know it for the future.

Looking at how you see trading makes it look like a full time real world job, scrambling to get the best prices and beat out any competition. My personal opinion only, I couldn't play that way. My casual "when I feel like getting ambitious" trading, with whatever prices I think will let stuff sell quickly has worked, and allowed me to keep playing the game for fun/enjoyment, instead of working another job finding prices and worrying someone will buy my stuff and sell it higher. I'm satisfied with what I have in my bank at this point; there is nothing in the game I need gold for anyway, beside picking up lower level mats once in a while to craft low level gear for my guildmates/random new players.

Heartrage

Prices are high but it also mean that you can sell higher. Personally, I don’t have a problem affording the stuff I want because I also sell for a lot.

Tommy_The_Gun

M0ntie wrote: »

Supply and demand. ZoS need to increase drop rates (increase supply) in the game so that people can get what they need for less time. This operates very obviously during motif drops during events. Initially the price on them will be high for the people who want them right now, then the price lowers and how much it lowers is proportional to how high the drop rate is.

Things ZoS could increase are for example to return more gold mats when refining raw materials and increase the drop rates of harvesting raw materials.

Tbh. All they need to do (if ZOS cares about in-game economy) is to add an option for guild traders to also buy stuff (just like you have cod system & post items you are selling you could also post an items you want to buy & for how much).

Imagine how it would boost item supply on the market. Guilds would be able to buy stuff relatively cheap from all eso players & all players with surplus items (solo or with guild) would be able to contribute to in-game economy in some way.

Even if traders would flip items & sell for more gold - even then the final prices would be lower, but the income from "flipping" would be the same.

I always thought that trading in ESO should be based on competition between guilds - who will offer lowest price - "wins", as players will buy from them rather than from someone who offers higher price. Meanwhile it seems like nowadays we have a different situation and trading guilds actually don't care about offering lower price than competition. Almost like a "Price fixing" (yeah, I know it is probably not that, but this is the impression I am getting) lol.

FlopsyPrince

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

M0ntie wrote: »

Supply and demand. ZoS need to increase drop rates (increase supply) in the game so that people can get what they need for less time. This operates very obviously during motif drops during events. Initially the price on them will be high for the people who want them right now, then the price lowers and how much it lowers is proportional to how high the drop rate is.

Things ZoS could increase are for example to return more gold mats when refining raw materials and increase the drop rates of harvesting raw materials.

Tbh. All they need to do (if ZOS cares about in-game economy) is to add an option for guild traders to also buy stuff (just like you have cod system & post items you are selling you could also post an items you want to buy & for how much).

Imagine how it would boost item supply on the market. Guilds would be able to buy stuff relatively cheap from all eso players & all players with surplus items (solo or with guild) would be able to contribute to in-game economy in some way.

Even if traders would flip items & sell for more gold - even then the final prices would be lower, but the income from "flipping" would be the same.

I always thought that trading in ESO should be based on competition between guilds - who will offer lowest price - "wins", as players will buy from them rather than from someone who offers higher price. Meanwhile it seems like nowadays we have a different situation and trading guilds actually don't care about offering lower price than competition. Almost like a "Price fixing" (yeah, I know it is probably not that, but this is the impression I am getting) lol.

The modern system has nothing to encourage that. A noble idea, but not practical in an MMO.

JKorr wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

DagenHawk wrote: »

sinnereso wrote: »

We also have the issue of guild trader being rediculously expensive due to inflation and guild masters slave driving theyre members to sell / pimp themselves out to meet quota's. Players are no longer treated with any respect within these guilds, theyre just sheep for them and theres no discussion anymore. Its theyre way or the highway and the player left with nowhere to sell anything.

[snip]

THATS how the guild traders are run now!

[edited for naming-and-shaming]

You are right but take heart Auction houses are coming

Maybe not this year but soon.

And you can thank the abdominal way players are treated within guilds for making it happen

Question from curiosity; if that is how guilds [your guilds, none I've ever been involved with, around, or even barely acquainted with are like that] why on Tamriel are you and the other guild members stupid enough to put up with it? To the best of my knowledge, there are no legally/magically binding contracts signed in player blood that say YOU MAY NEVER EVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE LEAVE THE GUILD. Why would people who are being exploited, scammed and abused stay in those bad guilds? And please don't say "Because they are the only option", because they aren't. Nothing is stopping anyone from dropping a guild and finding another. If enough abused and mistreated players leave, they could even...:gasp: create their own guild. set up the way they want to run it. If they don't the choice of finding a different guild, one that has no dues, or sales requirements, and they do exist. My no dues no sales needed TRADING guild has a trader consistently. My no dues no sales needed SOCIAL guilds have traders. No one dictates what prices I put on anything I want to sell. I don't consider myself or my guildmates treatment to be abominable. Works quite nicely, actually. Even with my "only when I get ambitious and really want to" selling habits my bank balance is 14m. If I actually put some effort into it, belonging to 1 trading guild/4 social guilds with 30 slots to sell at each one, that total would be higher.

Why would Auction house happen because some mentally challenged masochists enjoy being exploited, abused, and treated abdominally? [which doesn't mean what you think it means....unless it was an honest mis-chosen word on your part]

You make that money because of the very imperfect guild trader system. Information is very effectively hidden, even with TTC.

That means that a few profit really well at the expense of most users.

A "few" profit... You don't have to be in a TRADING guild to trade. My social guilds that are not focused on trading get traders, so the pool of a "few" expands again. Even if no one is ambitious enough to try for a trader the option of the guild store is still there. It isn't that hard to make gold in this game. Before the traders existed, getting gold was a LOT harder.

The thing I can't get past is simply this; no one is being forced to pay exorbitant prices. Everything that you can buy at the guild trader you can farm yourself in-game IF you are willing to spend the time to do it. TTC is, in my opinion, personal opinion only, worthless for pricing anything. TTC shows the price someone listed an item for; it does NOT show what the item actually sold for. Someone could list a blue beginner motif for 250k, and its uploaded to TTC, that is the price that will show. When you check MM prices in the guilds you belong to it shows it sold for 50 gold. Again, people are free to list items at whatever price they want to ask for, and the players are equally free to "Nope, not paying *that* much" and leaving the buying screen.

You completely missed my point. I have no way to easily find what is really a fair price, especially on the PS4. Yes, I don't have to buy anything, but finding things for comparative prices or gear to purchase is a very difficult process. You benefit because of this, but it is a very poorly designed system for most players.

My point was "post your own prices". Common sense and a look at even one trader will show you a ballpark amount.

If you go too high, your items won't sell. If you go too low you'll know because your items will instantly sell, so you can go a little higher next time until you find the balance point. Asking guildmates for a price check might work; people even ask in zone chat. It doesn't have to be as difficult as some people [who may have personal agendas] make it out to be.

That point does not work well.

How much is a specific purple ring worth? I may not be able to find many on the market. If I list it for 5K gold maybe it would be bought to get flipped. If I try 100K gold maybe I way overpriced.

A good market would let me find out prices no (at the least) so I could price accordingly.

Is there a reason you absolutely positively have to know an exact price to sell an item? Are the selling opportunities so limited for you that you have to make the max amount of gold on every single sale? Is some great cosmic balance threatened if you list an item for a reasonable not exorbitant price and its bought and flipped? Even if it happens you would then have an example of the price you could have asked, and know it for the future.

Looking at how you see trading makes it look like a full time real world job, scrambling to get the best prices and beat out any competition. My personal opinion only, I couldn't play that way. My casual "when I feel like getting ambitious" trading, with whatever prices I think will let stuff sell quickly has worked, and allowed me to keep playing the game for fun/enjoyment, instead of working another job finding prices and worrying someone will buy my stuff and sell it higher. I'm satisfied with what I have in my bank at this point; there is nothing in the game I need gold for anyway, beside picking up lower level mats once in a while to craft low level gear for my guildmates/random new players.

How would I have any idea what it was relisted (and possibly sold) for, especially on console? Why must I have no information about how much it is valued at? Why would so many areas of life have "price guides" and such if knowing good prices is not important?

The current system is horrid for that. The game should at least have TTC-type information built-in if you want a system without a Central AH. That would allow all players to find things out, not just those who make trading their job.

Castagere

The guild trader idea was good at launch. But now it's a joke. So many people have more gold than they know what to do with. I am so glad I got my 3 characters geared out for my play style. It's very rare that I need to buy something. I remember in those early days having to put aside a whole day running from trader to trader in all the zones to find something. The TCC addon Zos should be looking at adding something like it to the game. But you can never even get them talking about the guild trader system.

DMuehlhausen

It's life man.

The better question is why will have to pay 1000$/month in new child support. While their mom is allowed to stay on public assistance when she is fully capable of working and doesn't have to report "donations" to her "ministry" she gets for praying over people.

Talk about expensive.

phairdon

Today a person was asking 1.8 million for companion epaulettes, 1.4 million for a motif, in zone chat. Insanity.

4 million for a blue print......

Mr_Stach

kargen27

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

M0ntie wrote: »

Supply and demand. ZoS need to increase drop rates (increase supply) in the game so that people can get what they need for less time. This operates very obviously during motif drops during events. Initially the price on them will be high for the people who want them right now, then the price lowers and how much it lowers is proportional to how high the drop rate is.

Things ZoS could increase are for example to return more gold mats when refining raw materials and increase the drop rates of harvesting raw materials.

Tbh. All they need to do (if ZOS cares about in-game economy) is to add an option for guild traders to also buy stuff (just like you have cod system & post items you are selling you could also post an items you want to buy & for how much).

Imagine how it would boost item supply on the market. Guilds would be able to buy stuff relatively cheap from all eso players & all players with surplus items (solo or with guild) would be able to contribute to in-game economy in some way.

Even if traders would flip items & sell for more gold - even then the final prices would be lower, but the income from "flipping" would be the same.

I always thought that trading in ESO should be based on competition between guilds - who will offer lowest price - "wins", as players will buy from them rather than from someone who offers higher price. Meanwhile it seems like nowadays we have a different situation and trading guilds actually don't care about offering lower price than competition. Almost like a "Price fixing" (yeah, I know it is probably not that, but this is the impression I am getting) lol.

The modern system has nothing to encourage that. A noble idea, but not practical in an MMO.

JKorr wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

DagenHawk wrote: »

sinnereso wrote: »

We also have the issue of guild trader being rediculously expensive due to inflation and guild masters slave driving theyre members to sell / pimp themselves out to meet quota's. Players are no longer treated with any respect within these guilds, theyre just sheep for them and theres no discussion anymore. Its theyre way or the highway and the player left with nowhere to sell anything.

[snip]

THATS how the guild traders are run now!

[edited for naming-and-shaming]

You are right but take heart Auction houses are coming

Maybe not this year but soon.

And you can thank the abdominal way players are treated within guilds for making it happen

Question from curiosity; if that is how guilds [your guilds, none I've ever been involved with, around, or even barely acquainted with are like that] why on Tamriel are you and the other guild members stupid enough to put up with it? To the best of my knowledge, there are no legally/magically binding contracts signed in player blood that say YOU MAY NEVER EVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE LEAVE THE GUILD. Why would people who are being exploited, scammed and abused stay in those bad guilds? And please don't say "Because they are the only option", because they aren't. Nothing is stopping anyone from dropping a guild and finding another. If enough abused and mistreated players leave, they could even...:gasp: create their own guild. set up the way they want to run it. If they don't the choice of finding a different guild, one that has no dues, or sales requirements, and they do exist. My no dues no sales needed TRADING guild has a trader consistently. My no dues no sales needed SOCIAL guilds have traders. No one dictates what prices I put on anything I want to sell. I don't consider myself or my guildmates treatment to be abominable. Works quite nicely, actually. Even with my "only when I get ambitious and really want to" selling habits my bank balance is 14m. If I actually put some effort into it, belonging to 1 trading guild/4 social guilds with 30 slots to sell at each one, that total would be higher.

Why would Auction house happen because some mentally challenged masochists enjoy being exploited, abused, and treated abdominally? [which doesn't mean what you think it means....unless it was an honest mis-chosen word on your part]

You make that money because of the very imperfect guild trader system. Information is very effectively hidden, even with TTC.

That means that a few profit really well at the expense of most users.

A "few" profit... You don't have to be in a TRADING guild to trade. My social guilds that are not focused on trading get traders, so the pool of a "few" expands again. Even if no one is ambitious enough to try for a trader the option of the guild store is still there. It isn't that hard to make gold in this game. Before the traders existed, getting gold was a LOT harder.

The thing I can't get past is simply this; no one is being forced to pay exorbitant prices. Everything that you can buy at the guild trader you can farm yourself in-game IF you are willing to spend the time to do it. TTC is, in my opinion, personal opinion only, worthless for pricing anything. TTC shows the price someone listed an item for; it does NOT show what the item actually sold for. Someone could list a blue beginner motif for 250k, and its uploaded to TTC, that is the price that will show. When you check MM prices in the guilds you belong to it shows it sold for 50 gold. Again, people are free to list items at whatever price they want to ask for, and the players are equally free to "Nope, not paying *that* much" and leaving the buying screen.

You completely missed my point. I have no way to easily find what is really a fair price, especially on the PS4. Yes, I don't have to buy anything, but finding things for comparative prices or gear to purchase is a very difficult process. You benefit because of this, but it is a very poorly designed system for most players.

My point was "post your own prices". Common sense and a look at even one trader will show you a ballpark amount.

If you go too high, your items won't sell. If you go too low you'll know because your items will instantly sell, so you can go a little higher next time until you find the balance point. Asking guildmates for a price check might work; people even ask in zone chat. It doesn't have to be as difficult as some people [who may have personal agendas] make it out to be.

That point does not work well.

How much is a specific purple ring worth? I may not be able to find many on the market. If I list it for 5K gold maybe it would be bought to get flipped. If I try 100K gold maybe I way overpriced.

A good market would let me find out prices no (at the least) so I could price accordingly.

Is there a reason you absolutely positively have to know an exact price to sell an item? Are the selling opportunities so limited for you that you have to make the max amount of gold on every single sale? Is some great cosmic balance threatened if you list an item for a reasonable not exorbitant price and its bought and flipped? Even if it happens you would then have an example of the price you could have asked, and know it for the future.

Looking at how you see trading makes it look like a full time real world job, scrambling to get the best prices and beat out any competition. My personal opinion only, I couldn't play that way. My casual "when I feel like getting ambitious" trading, with whatever prices I think will let stuff sell quickly has worked, and allowed me to keep playing the game for fun/enjoyment, instead of working another job finding prices and worrying someone will buy my stuff and sell it higher. I'm satisfied with what I have in my bank at this point; there is nothing in the game I need gold for anyway, beside picking up lower level mats once in a while to craft low level gear for my guildmates/random new players.

How would I have any idea what it was relisted (and possibly sold) for, especially on console? Why must I have no information about how much it is valued at? Why would so many areas of life have "price guides" and such if knowing good prices is not important?

The current system is horrid for that. The game should at least have TTC-type information built-in if you want a system without a Central AH. That would allow all players to find things out, not just those who make trading their job.

Why do you need to know at what price an item might have been resold? You got your asking price. If you aren't happy with the price list it higher. Sometimes I post something and it is gone a few minutes later. That tells me I list the next one a good step higher in price. Something sits for more than five days I might decide to yank it and post at a lower price. For rare items I visit several vendors to see if I can find some prices to consider.
During an event the Ancient Orc style motif. I had no idea what I should price it at. I held onto it for a while and looked for one in the traders. Didn't see one anywhere. Asked friends and guild mates and none of them had seen one. I looked at individual pages and kind of guessed a price. Eventually I listed it at 5.7 million. It was gone in around an hour. If I get lucky enough to ever find another I would probably list it between 7.5 and eight million gold.
Tracking your own sales will give a good indication if you are pricing high or low. That works for most items. The other stuff just look around some first.
I wouldn't mind a price history being available in game if it didn't negatively impact performance but I don't see it as anything that is absolutely needed.