MagBlade Theorycrafting Changes Thread

fred4

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

So... I have an idea and it's probably not gonna work but right. Moon Hunter / calu / kena.

Light attack twice, cloak, lotus

I would love to pull this combo off but I would need to grind calu rings or moon rings and weapons.

Here's what I think:

(1) Why use Moon Hunter when you're a single-target build and Spell Strategist RELIABLY gives you 500 spell damage (just 100 less) against a single target with basically no cooldown? I'm not 100% sure, but I think Spell Strategist IS buffed by Major Sorcery, unlike those sets that only buff a particular damage type.

(2) I've used Spell Strategist in PvP on my templar, but I think the extra Spell Damage is nothing to write home about. I'd rather use Spinner, because the pen buffs the Caluurion proc, or I'd use Overwhelming Surge to help against other nightblades, or Auroran's Thunder as a cross between the two. That said, Lotus Fan already gives you Minor Vulnerability, so Spinner might be your best bet. If you're using Dampen / Harness, I'd probably go with Alfiq / Necro / BTB. I know it's boring, but it's so hard to get away from those sets. Either those or Shackle / Amber, if you have no other stam sustain.

(3) Opening with two light attacks means that the Caluurion proc is no longer controlled. IMO you have to single-bar Caluurion and you have to open with either Lotus Fan or Concealed Weapon, without a preceding light attack. That is the only way Shadowy guarantees the crit of those abilities to satisfy the Caluu proc condition.

I am basically reverting back to that as well. Trying Elemental Weapon / Light Attack as part of my opener did not work out. Great when it works, but really cumbersome and hugely unreliable after further testing. If it put good players under severe pressure, it might have been worth it, but I have now concluded that's not really the case. I will probably keep Fear in my standard combo from now on, but Elemental Weapon is gone, replaced by Swallow Soul again.

GhostofDatthaw

fred4 wrote: »

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

So... I have an idea and it's probably not gonna work but right. Moon Hunter / calu / kena.

Light attack twice, cloak, lotus

I would love to pull this combo off but I would need to grind calu rings or moon rings and weapons.

Here's what I think:

(1) Why use Moon Hunter when you're a single-target build and Spell Strategist RELIABLY gives you 500 spell damage (just 100 less) against a single target with basically no cooldown? I'm not 100% sure, but I think Spell Strategist IS buffed by Major Sorcery, unlike those sets that only buff a particular damage type.

(2) I've used Spell Strategist in PvP on my templar, but I think the extra Spell Damage is nothing to write home about. I'd rather use Spinner, because the pen buffs the Caluurion proc, or I'd use Overwhelming Surge to help against other nightblades, or Auroran's Thunder as a cross between the two. That said, Lotus Fan already gives you Minor Vulnerability, so Spinner might be your best bet. If you're using Dampen / Harness, I'd probably go with Alfiq / Necro / BTB. I know it's boring, but it's so hard to get away from those sets. Either those or Shackle / Amber, if you have no other stam sustain.

(3) Opening with two light attacks means that the Caluurion proc is no longer controlled. IMO you have to single-bar Caluurion and you have to open with either Lotus Fan or Concealed Weapon, without a preceding light attack. That is the only way Shadowy guarantees the crit of those abilities to satisfy the Caluu proc condition.

I am basically reverting back to that as well. Trying Elemental Weapon / Light Attack as part of my opener did not work out. Great when it works, but really cumbersome and hugely unreliable after further testing. If it put good players under severe pressure, it might have been worth it, but I have now concluded that's not really the case. I will probably keep Fear in my standard combo from now on, but Elemental Weapon is gone, replaced by Swallow Soul again.

Yea this would be. Different type of style, and you proc Moon Hunter off your back bar easy proc and use a DD poison and close with the lotus. I I think this over spell strat for the our damage increase of molag and the moon, with a little DD poison pressure, then right into a cloak lotus

GhostofDatthaw

After playing more and after this dot meta I this I have my new build for next patch when I might be able to use dark cloak again. As of now shadow is just too op form of mit. Since server is down I'll make a link to it

Iskiab

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

After playing more and after this dot meta I this I have my new build for next patch when I might be able to use dark cloak again. As of now shadow is just too op form of mit. Since server is down I'll make a link to it

Is dark cloak broken right now? Someone mentioned that dark cloak doesn’t show up as a buff on the UI and I checked and it doesn’t.

I’ve been raid logging on my main and working on an alt so haven’t had a chance to test it. The heal definitely works, I’m just not sure if you get the minor protection.

GhostofDatthaw

Iskiab wrote: »

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

After playing more and after this dot meta I this I have my new build for next patch when I might be able to use dark cloak again. As of now shadow is just too op form of mit. Since server is down I'll make a link to it

Is dark cloak broken right now? Someone mentioned that dark cloak doesn’t show up as a buff on the UI and I checked and it doesn’t.

I’ve been raid logging on my main and working on an alt so haven’t had a chance to test it. The heal definitely works, I’m just not sure if you get the minor protection.

well hopefully they fix that next patch because with the demise of dots i would like to come out of the shadows

GhostofDatthaw

this is the build i would like to try once i dont have to rely on shadowy for dot mitigation, i also have a couple very unique ideas be and my buddy in discord have been discussing

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=181246

i might drop degen for sap is they making it buff by no cast right? I need more pressure though that's why I'm really doing alot more theory crafting now. These Regen builds are amazing and alot of fun to play, work well in a small group where you can time a burst but solo I just need something more to get the kill

GhostofDatthaw

Yeah the more time I spend in IC the Regen build does not cut it solo. In groups is pretty slick but it lacks the real pressure to get the quick kill. I've tried alot of things from going just glyphs to DD poisons to bar changing cloak to allow more fluid procs.

I used essentially the same setup and used calu which seemed to help with sustain pressure and burst but not being a ganker. That with moving bar spots with cloak have allowed more higher and unpredictable burst. Calu procs on a random swallow weave, I have bow up, I cloakcancel bow, times up nice for a good burdt. I think I want to explore this more

I do still love the swift and the speed on magnb big game changer

ThePhantomThorn

Just gunna say this:
Merciless give maj sorcery
Note: not my idea saw it on a nb identity thread
Also 1 morph of agony should be a self burst heal

The_Lex

I've been taking my mageblade into no cp Cyro lately (I only have 700 cps). I dunno but swallow soul seems really weak for damage. I'm wearing spinners/btb/skoria. I might try concealed weapon and go for a more melee playstyle.

HowlKimchi

The_Lex wrote: »

I've been taking my mageblade into no cp Cyro lately (I only have 700 cps). I dunno but swallow soul seems really weak for damage. I'm wearing spinners/btb/skoria. I might try concealed weapon and go for a more melee playstyle.

Yep it's not the best damage-wise. You could try elemental weapon if you wanna stay ranged. I'm mostly using swallow soul for the passives and the sustained pressure. On a ranged playstyle, the kills usually come from spectral bow and soul harvest combo.

Iskiab

The_Lex wrote: »

I've been taking my mageblade into no cp Cyro lately (I only have 700 cps). I dunno but swallow soul seems really weak for damage. I'm wearing spinners/btb/skoria. I might try concealed weapon and go for a more melee playstyle.

It is weak, if it can’t do damage then it can’t heal well too.

Melee works but only in certain settings. In a post-onslaught buff world heavy armour is inconsistent for protection so there’s no way to play a brawler magblade well, brawler types are using protection and maim for defense moreso than resistances. As melee you have to be surgical I guess you could say, and steer clear of BGs because it’s full of aoe spam.

Ranged can work, just try and only use magblade abilities for utility and passives. Destro passives are weak on non-destro abilities, but great on destro ones. Try clench and shock. Elemental weapon’s good for a bit of burst: elemental - LA - clench/shock will hit around the same time for a bit of burst.

fred4

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

I do still love the swift and the speed on magnb big game changer

Hurrah!

For what it's worth, I am now running Concealed, RAT, SA, Healing Ward, Shadowy, Temporal Guard on the resto bar, which is now truly my back bar. On the front bar it is Swallow, Fear, Inner Light, Lotus Fan, Dampen, SH. As you know, my previous build used Comcealed as the spammable. That is now banished to be a speed buff only. I cloak, then bar swap when going on the attack. This feels like a huge improvement! Sets and skills are virtually the same, but having Fear on the front bar and having a ranged spammable is much better, even though the gameplan still involves opening with Lotus Fan (Caluu) from Cloak.

GhostofDatthaw

fred4 wrote: »

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

I do still love the swift and the speed on magnb big game changer

Hurrah!

For what it's worth, I am now running Concealed, RAT, SA, Healing Ward, Shadowy, Temporal Guard on the resto bar, which is now truly my back bar. On the front bar it is Swallow, Fear, Inner Light, Lotus Fan, Dampen, SH. As you know, my previous build used Comcealed as the spammable. That is now banished to be a speed buff only. I cloak, then bar swap when going on the attack. This feels like a huge improvement! Sets and skills are virtually the same, but having Fear on the front bar and having a ranged spammable is much better, even though the gameplan still involves opening with Lotus Fan (Caluu) from Cloak.

Yeah it's very strange changing skill locations. I swapped places of fear and cloak. I find myself cleaning when I want to fear a d fearing when I want to cloak

GhostofDatthaw

Iskiab wrote: »

The_Lex wrote: »

I've been taking my mageblade into no cp Cyro lately (I only have 700 cps). I dunno but swallow soul seems really weak for damage. I'm wearing spinners/btb/skoria. I might try concealed weapon and go for a more melee playstyle.

It is weak, if it can’t do damage then it can’t heal well too.

Melee works but only in certain settings. In a post-onslaught buff world heavy armour is inconsistent for protection so there’s no way to play a brawler magblade well, brawler types are using protection and maim for defense moreso than resistances. As melee you have to be surgical I guess you could say, and steer clear of BGs because it’s full of aoe spam.

Ranged can work, just try and only use magblade abilities for utility and passives. Destro passives are weak on non-destro abilities, but great on destro ones. Try clench and shock. Elemental weapon’s good for a bit of burst: elemental - LA - clench/shock will hit around the same time for a bit of burst.

Yeah I think reactive is bis defensive set for bgs atm

GhostofDatthaw

I feel I'm blowing this thread up, but I'm having back surgery and have nothing to do but play eso and forum.

I think Regen works well this patch is just will not kill certain builds. I have some new recordings I will link up, some good, some bad, some I *** up, but everything is a learning experience.

ScruffyWhiskers

Good luck with the surgery. I hope you feel tip top soon afterwards. I don't know your circumstances but I've got some hereditary issues with low back pain myself.Not fun. Getting old really sucks too.

Iskiab

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

The_Lex wrote: »

I've been taking my mageblade into no cp Cyro lately (I only have 700 cps). I dunno but swallow soul seems really weak for damage. I'm wearing spinners/btb/skoria. I might try concealed weapon and go for a more melee playstyle.

It is weak, if it can’t do damage then it can’t heal well too.

Melee works but only in certain settings. In a post-onslaught buff world heavy armour is inconsistent for protection so there’s no way to play a brawler magblade well, brawler types are using protection and maim for defense moreso than resistances. As melee you have to be surgical I guess you could say, and steer clear of BGs because it’s full of aoe spam.

Ranged can work, just try and only use magblade abilities for utility and passives. Destro passives are weak on non-destro abilities, but great on destro ones. Try clench and shock. Elemental weapon’s good for a bit of burst: elemental - LA - clench/shock will hit around the same time for a bit of burst.

Yeah I think reactive is bis defensive set for bgs atm

Oh I’ve never tried that one, I’ll give it a look.

I more meant most stam go DW/2H. DW for the BRP set and on demand major protection and 2H for onslaught and dizzy spam. NBs lack stamina regen passives to pull quick cloak off, but I think I’m going to try it as a MagDK and maybe MagWarden could work. MagDK getting around 1k stamina back every time they cast an earthen ability with no cooldown is pretty OP.

GhostofDatthaw

ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »

Good luck with the surgery. I hope you feel tip top soon afterwards. I don't know your circumstances but I've got some hereditary issues with low back pain myself.Not fun. Getting old really sucks too.

Thanks! All I can hear in my head is the rolling stones

ScruffyWhiskers

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

Thanks! All I can hear in my head is the rolling stones

After every failed gank I seem to hear "I can't get no satisfaction."

And after every PTS update something like "You can’t always get what you want / But if you try sometime you find / You get what you need"

Iskiab

ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

Thanks! All I can hear in my head is the rolling stones

After every failed gank I seem to hear "I can't get no satisfaction."

And after every PTS update something like "You can’t always get what you want / But if you try sometime you find / You get what you need"

Well IDK about this PTS. I just don’t see NBs being good outside solo play, and even then why bother. You have to really like cloak or the NB theme to stick with it.

fred4

Iskiab wrote: »

ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

Thanks! All I can hear in my head is the rolling stones

After every failed gank I seem to hear "I can't get no satisfaction."

And after every PTS update something like "You can’t always get what you want / But if you try sometime you find / You get what you need"

Well IDK about this PTS. I just don’t see NBs being good outside solo play, and even then why bother. You have to really like cloak or the NB theme to stick with it.

As someone who plays solo and who does like cloak, I'm down with that. Melee magblade was my main before Caluurion, Zaan, RAT, Swift and Minor Vulnerability from Lotus Fan. Power-wise it's still not really competitive, but it's geting there. I would be very afraid of (melee) magblade becoming popular or considered a better ganker than stamblade. The nerf hammer knows no subtlety. Quite happy to stay under the radar.

GhostofDatthaw

I've noticed going back and watching alot of fights I get into. I really do not take advantage of mercy like I should, proc wise. I like to think I weave well, but video evidence shows that I will often.. somehow... Not have the crosshairs on the target. Like I watched a fight where the guys half hp o have mercy on 3stack with 10s left and I don't get the proc off to keep pressure.

I've enjoyed going back and looking at videos again

ScruffyWhiskers

I just want to complain about the cast time on soul harvest. It is the most annoying change that they have made since I started playing this game in the beta right before launch. It is jarring. It is so disruptive. I get the sound a bunch of times and look down and still have my full ultimate charge or it just doesn't go off and I don't get the sound. They really should remove this. It's causing more harm than whatever good they thought it was doing.

GhostofDatthaw

ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »

I just want to complain about the cast time on soul harvest. It is the most annoying change that they have made since I started playing this game in the beta right before launch. It is jarring. It is so disruptive. I get the sound a bunch of times and look down and still have my full ultimate charge or it just doesn't go off and I don't get the sound. They really should remove this. It's causing more harm than whatever good they thought it was doing.

Yeah and you NEVER land it after a cc is anyone is not asleep. I've had to get more dynamic is when I weave it in. For a ganker though... Rip

GhostofDatthaw

I've been doing bgs more and nbs either seem to be cloak away and hit and run, actually effective in flag games and chaos ball, in death match it's rip unless the other group pugs out.

I've been running my dk more in bgs because my magnb is setup for cp but I kind of want to try and find a setup. With my few days playing the precious statement is what is have found.

I want to theory craft a brawler again. But if IC stays fun I might stay cp

Iskiab

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

I've been doing bgs more and nbs either seem to be cloak away and hit and run, actually effective in flag games and chaos ball, in death match it's rip unless the other group pugs out.

I've been running my dk more in bgs because my magnb is setup for cp but I kind of want to try and find a setup. With my few days playing the precious statement is what is have found.

I want to theory craft a brawler again. But if IC stays fun I might stay cp

I’d stick to IC and CP. I’ve done a ton of BGs and don’t think I’ve ever seen an effective magblade spec that wasn’t healing, and even then from changes to the game magblades won’t make good healers.

Brandon plays a ranged magblade cloakblade on PC-EU and does BGs. That might work best.

I don’t think NBs have the tools to brawl.

brandonv516

Iskiab wrote: »

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

I've been doing bgs more and nbs either seem to be cloak away and hit and run, actually effective in flag games and chaos ball, in death match it's rip unless the other group pugs out.

I've been running my dk more in bgs because my magnb is setup for cp but I kind of want to try and find a setup. With my few days playing the precious statement is what is have found.

I want to theory craft a brawler again. But if IC stays fun I might stay cp

I’d stick to IC and CP. I’ve done a ton of BGs and don’t think I’ve ever seen an effective magblade spec that wasn’t healing, and even then from changes to the game magblades won’t make good healers.

Brandon plays a ranged magblade cloakblade on PC-EU and does BGs. That might work best.

I don’t think NBs have the tools to brawl.

Thanks for the shout-out. Just to clarify it's Xbox NA!

And yes it's still very effective.

Some of my struggles:

-Magplars that pressure hard with a gap closer, Sweeps, Overwhelming Surge or Aurorans, etc. -- Next patch this will be less lethal with the changes to Living Dark and the snare on Sweeps.

-Knockback effects -- I'm psyched about the changes with these on the PTS.

-NBs using Snipe -- I've been on the receiving end of some serious desyncs involving Snipe with a few players.

-Premades -- just shoot for second place and play very carefully.

Iskiab

As a healer I use cleanse so in BGs it’s a little different. You mop the floor with dot teams and any ranged builds. Where I struggle is dizzy spammers running a bit of speed. I can’t shake them and eventually run out of stam, with onslaught I just can’t stay up. You can build for tankiness so you won’t get globaled with a dizzy - LA - executioner with onslaught up but eventually fall to dizzy.

Cleanse is a great counter to dots. I’ve been doing less BGs but went against teams of good players trying to play dot specs even in a premade, they don’t get over 200 points and even then it’s from the two other teams killing each other. One button press being a full heal for your team against them makes them trivial.

WacArnold

brandonv516 wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

I've been doing bgs more and nbs either seem to be cloak away and hit and run, actually effective in flag games and chaos ball, in death match it's rip unless the other group pugs out.

I've been running my dk more in bgs because my magnb is setup for cp but I kind of want to try and find a setup. With my few days playing the precious statement is what is have found.

I want to theory craft a brawler again. But if IC stays fun I might stay cp

I’d stick to IC and CP. I’ve done a ton of BGs and don’t think I’ve ever seen an effective magblade spec that wasn’t healing, and even then from changes to the game magblades won’t make good healers.

Brandon plays a ranged magblade cloakblade on PC-EU and does BGs. That might work best.

I don’t think NBs have the tools to brawl.

Thanks for the shout-out. Just to clarify it's Xbox NA!

And yes it's still very effective.

Some of my struggles:

-Magplars that pressure hard with a gap closer, Sweeps, Overwhelming Surge or Aurorans, etc. -- Next patch this will be less lethal with the changes to Living Dark and the snare on Sweeps.

-Knockback effects -- I'm psyched about the changes with these on the PTS.

-NBs using Snipe -- I've been on the receiving end of some serious desyncs involving Snipe with a few players.

-Premades -- just shoot for second place and play very carefully.

Whats your build? There for a while i was using trans and spinner thats what i was using for cp trying to keep a brawler alive. Dont really think it was doing good in bgs. Started using btb and spinner with slime and uped my resource alot through jewels. Idk if im on the right track or not havent been doing as good in higher bgs. What kind of style do you play?

Btw whats your characters name? I saw a blue magblade wearing the budi-shirt is that you?

Iskiab

He’s not in a brawler spec. Think he uses a destro front bar and Ele weapon - LA - Clench for a burst/stun combo and dropped merciless.

All brawler builds will have onslaught and jabs to deal with. Stam use BRP DW on their back bar a lot for major protection so can brawl with good burst using dizzy. I’ve been struggling to figure something out for mag but gave up, the pirate smelly nerf hit hard. Templars will outdamage you and outheal you in melee, plus you have to deal with all your resistances being negated and constant aoes and stuns. A warden or DK could make it work because of stamina off-stat sustain but for NB I’d stick to cloak or ranged.