Can we just make summons illegal already? A rant about bears blocking stuff

Elsonso

Tipsy wrote: »

I used to play this game where you were able to shout at NPC "move it" ,and they got out of the way

Ahhhh, yes. Fus Ro Dah. Lydia listened well...

idk

VaranisArano wrote: »

I don't get it. During the Anniversary Event when everyone and their mother was turning in crafting writs for two weeks, I did my writs with 8 characters in Alinor and then Vivec City, two popular locations. I paid attention to pets, simply because I wanted to see if they were as annoying as people said.

The three times someone's pet blocked the turn in boxes, I only had to take a couple steps to the side to turn in my writs. Frankly, the NPC lounging in the middle of the crafting boxes in Vivec was more annoying than any pet.


Also, make it clearer how to desummon your pets. I was high level before I realized I could dismiss them by clicking the buff in the character menu. I'd been manually removing them from my skill bar

This. I have not found it to be as big of a deal as OP makes it out to be. I have been in this game for over 5 years.

Of course Zos could help with some information for newer players but when I have run pets I have not desummoned them because I choose to not access my ability bar for things that take such a short period of time.

katanagirl1

I’m on PS4/NA, and it is a constant problem everywhere, not just crafting like I said. When I started my sorc, I used to de-summon my familiar each time I went to the bank or crafting station. The problem from the perspective of the player who has the pet, is that player cannot see the pet because it is always so far behind them. You cannot see them most of the time and forget they are there. That habit didn’t last long because I always had other things on my mind.

Combat pets get in the way too when fighting bosses. Why do they block things and prevent me from interacting with them or fighting when the player does not? Perhaps the pets should work the same way as other players.

Dusk_Coven

VaranisArano wrote: »

I don't get it. During the Anniversary Event when everyone and their mother was turning in crafting writs for two weeks, I did my writs with 8 characters in Alinor and then Vivec City, two popular locations. I paid attention to pets, simply because I wanted to see if they were as annoying as people said.

Are you on PC or Console?
I'm thinking maybe the OP is on Console because a lot of players on PC use Dolgubon's Lazy Writ, which introduced an automatic pet/assistant dismissal. That helped a lot.

There was objection to the feature when Dolgubon introduced it so I wouldn't be surprised if people manually tweaked the code to retain their pets.

Tipsy wrote: »

I used to play this game where you were able to shout at NPC "move it" ,and they got out of the way then.Maybe this could solve the problem of pets blocking things. Just push a button to shout the pet out of the way

Or just bump into them?

redlink1979

I'd love that players could thought more about others and could see how their pets are absolutely unnecessary at crafting tables...
Am I the only one who unsummons the pets before entering a town?! lol

SoLooney

VaranisArano wrote: »

SoLooney wrote: »

All summons should either be desummoned in major cities or given the necro treatment, a bounty

Major cities are already laggy with all the people and pets blocking stations and writ turns in and taking my frames just adds to the problem

You do know that at least one major city, Daggerfall, has quests that require combat in it, right? Now that I think about it, so do Orsinium, Davon's Watch, Vulkhel Guard, Anvil, Vivec, etc.

Plus with the Justice System and dueling, there's always the potential for combat.


City Guard: "I'm sorry, I realize you just got ambushed by Bloodthorn assassins, but no, you can't summon your twilight matriarch to heal your stab wounds. Wardens, no bear maulings allowed within city limits!"

Warden: "My bear has been here for the last two years."

Sorc: "Two years? My Matriarch's been here since launch!"

Guard: "Its a new city ordinance."

Warden: "There's an effing werewolf mauling people in your city, and you are worried about my bear?!"

Sorc: "You know, I think maybe the Bloodthorn have the right idea about doing away with the King..."

You dont need pets to do damage, if you do, even more reason to nerf pets as they require no skill to use and reward the player immensely

And if you're doing a quest, necros summoning certain undead will still give them bounty. So idint see how your argument helps you out, it still rewards classes but necromancers

Streega

VaranisArano wrote: »

SoLooney wrote: »

All summons should either be desummoned in major cities or given the necro treatment, a bounty

Major cities are already laggy with all the people and pets blocking stations and writ turns in and taking my frames just adds to the problem

You do know that at least one major city, Daggerfall, has quests that require combat in it, right? Now that I think about it, so do Orsinium, Davon's Watch, Vulkhel Guard, Anvil, Vivec, etc.

Plus with the Justice System and dueling, there's always the potential for combat.


City Guard: "I'm sorry, I realize you just got ambushed by Bloodthorn assassins, but no, you can't summon your twilight matriarch to heal your stab wounds. Wardens, no bear maulings allowed within city limits!"

Warden: "My bear has been here for the last two years."

Sorc: "Two years? My Matriarch's been here since launch!"

Guard: "Its a new city ordinance."

Warden: "There's an effing werewolf mauling people in your city, and you are worried about my bear?!"

Sorc: "You know, I think maybe the Bloodthorn have the right idea about doing away with the King..."

Oh please, those guys drop dead when you sneeze at them... You really don't need a pet to kill them, even if you are lvl 5 fresh off the boat newb without CP. Actually, when you are lvl 5 you probably don't even have the skill yet.

VaranisArano

SoLooney wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

SoLooney wrote: »

All summons should either be desummoned in major cities or given the necro treatment, a bounty

Major cities are already laggy with all the people and pets blocking stations and writ turns in and taking my frames just adds to the problem

You do know that at least one major city, Daggerfall, has quests that require combat in it, right? Now that I think about it, so do Orsinium, Davon's Watch, Vulkhel Guard, Anvil, Vivec, etc.

Plus with the Justice System and dueling, there's always the potential for combat.


City Guard: "I'm sorry, I realize you just got ambushed by Bloodthorn assassins, but no, you can't summon your twilight matriarch to heal your stab wounds. Wardens, no bear maulings allowed within city limits!"

Warden: "My bear has been here for the last two years."

Sorc: "Two years? My Matriarch's been here since launch!"

Guard: "Its a new city ordinance."

Warden: "There's an effing werewolf mauling people in your city, and you are worried about my bear?!"

Sorc: "You know, I think maybe the Bloodthorn have the right idea about doing away with the King..."

You dont need pets to do damage, if you do, even more reason to nerf pets as they require no skill to use and reward the player immensely

And if you're doing a quest, necros summoning certain undead will still give them bounty. So idint see how your argument helps you out, it still rewards classes but necromancers

I don't see how people can't see the difference between Necromancer, who were designed from the outset to have certain skills limited situationally vs retroactively removing access to Sorc and Warden skills after 2+ years because they annoy you.

I really doubt ZOS is going to retroactively remove access to skills from Sorc and Warden when they keep designing quests that involve combat within city limits. Its not just Daggerfall.

There are better solutions that don't involve retroactively nerfing two classes in city quests designed for combat just because you are annoyed.

VaranisArano

Streega wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

SoLooney wrote: »

All summons should either be desummoned in major cities or given the necro treatment, a bounty

Major cities are already laggy with all the people and pets blocking stations and writ turns in and taking my frames just adds to the problem

You do know that at least one major city, Daggerfall, has quests that require combat in it, right? Now that I think about it, so do Orsinium, Davon's Watch, Vulkhel Guard, Anvil, Vivec, etc.

Plus with the Justice System and dueling, there's always the potential for combat.


City Guard: "I'm sorry, I realize you just got ambushed by Bloodthorn assassins, but no, you can't summon your twilight matriarch to heal your stab wounds. Wardens, no bear maulings allowed within city limits!"

Warden: "My bear has been here for the last two years."

Sorc: "Two years? My Matriarch's been here since launch!"

Guard: "Its a new city ordinance."

Warden: "There's an effing werewolf mauling people in your city, and you are worried about my bear?!"

Sorc: "You know, I think maybe the Bloodthorn have the right idea about doing away with the King..."

Oh please, those guys drop dead when you sneeze at them... You really don't need a pet to kill them, even if you are lvl 5 fresh off the boat newb without CP. Actually, when you are lvl 5 you probably don't even have the skill yet.

You do realize One Tamriel is a thing, yes? And that Daggerfall is not the only city that has combat quests requiring combat? Or that justice players can get into combat at any time?

No, necros don't count. Their skill restrictions were mandated by ZOS from the beginning. This woukd be a retroactive change of allowable skills from launch and from Morrowind, respectively.

No, it doesnt matter if Sorc's/Wardens "need" it or not in your infinite wisdom. That's not your call. What you suggest is that Sorcs and Wardens should have part of their combat toolkit taken away from them because you find it annoying.

There are better solutions.

ghastley

My one character who has a pet, my sorc healer, always dismisses her Matriarch in town, because she gets in my own way too much. The creature's AI seems to have it move into the player's line of sight whenever you're no in combat. It prevents me looting, it gets in the way of crafting, turning in writs etc. I don't play a warden, but does the bear annoy its owner as much?

albesca

ghastley wrote: »

My one character who has a pet, my sorc healer, always dismisses her Matriarch in town, because she gets in my own way too much. The creature's AI seems to have it move into the player's line of sight whenever you're no in combat. It prevents me looting, it gets in the way of crafting, turning in writs etc. I don't play a warden, but does the bear annoy its owner as much?

Yeah, I do the same as she always gets in the way while I'm trying to interact with containers, and in my experience the bear is a bit less annoying, cause standing on the ground it doesn't get that much between the camera and the world objects.

One that's as annoying as the matriarch is the daedroth of Maw of the Infernal, that always tries to hump my character every time he loots corpses after a battle.

Ryori729

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

I will repeat it again. The game (ESO) can solve this mostly with just a bit better pathing for the bear/pets. Make them be repelled by quest givers and workstations and the problem is solved without breaking the game for many.

My bear gets in my way often wherever my character is. When I go to loot a kill frequently he's standing on top of it. He's blocked my own access to the BS and got in the way half the time on the crafting writs turn in in Vivec City. Indoors especially it runs in right in front of me, then won't move till I'm a fair bit away from it. The netch buff sometimes moves into the middle of the screen too which blocks vision. I don't seem to have as much issue with the soc pets.

I try to remember to turn them off, but till a pet gets in my own way, sometimes I forget if they are there or not if I logged in just to do crafting or manage the bank.

So fixing the pathing would be good for everyone. I am enjoying my templar more now because I don't have a pet getting in the way so often.

Thorvik_Tyrson

Since I started playing back in April, I think of Alinor/Summerset as home. I play Pet Sorcs, and Wardens. I agree that they get in the way, and think it's just rude on the part of other players to not want an auto-dismiss of the Pets when entering town, or a crafting area.

The crafting area in Alinor is already a no mount area, I think they should also make it despawn your pets when you enter the area. That wont solve it for all crafting area's.

I would also agree to making it a bounty item. It's a matter of habit. If you get used to dismissing the pet before entering town, it soon becomes a non-issue. ZOS could help by having a hot key to dismiss all pets.

And to the Gentleman that argued about it being this way since beta and we cant change it now. I reply with "So what" just because they didn't implement it in Beta is not a valid reason to me that we cant make a change now.

Gundug

The simple solution to this issue would to make combat pets non-interactive outside of combat. You cannot expect pet build players to go out of their way to be considerate to others, but the game designers can take steps to minimize the annoyance they frequently cause.

FlopsyPrince

Gundug wrote: »

The simple solution to this issue would to make combat pets non-interactive outside of combat. You cannot expect pet build players to go out of their way to be considerate to others, but the game designers can take steps to minimize the annoyance they frequently cause.

No, the simple solution would be for them to make it so pets avoid crafting stations and NPC quest givers. Add a "repulsive pet field" to them and things would be relatively fixed without any user changes required.

Compare how pets and the banker work. The banker is NEVER in the way, even when you want to click on him (which can get very annoying). Things could be fixed, but have not been.

Ashryn

To me... the non-combat pets rarely (if ever) have presented a problem in getting in the way. Combat pets do because they are big. One of my early characters was a sorcerer and I discontinued her because of that damned Twilight. My main is a Warden, but I rarely slot the bear as an ultimate BECAUSE it gets in MY way. Wish they had made the bear a wolf or hawk, to be honest!

As to turn-in writ or quest situations... I think that people mounted on their various steeds are just as much of a problem as a pet.

FlopsyPrince

Ashryn wrote: »

To me... the non-combat pets rarely (if ever) have presented a problem in getting in the way. Combat pets do because they are big. One of my early characters was a sorcerer and I discontinued her because of that damned Twilight. My main is a Warden, but I rarely slot the bear as an ultimate BECAUSE it gets in MY way. Wish they had made the bear a wolf or hawk, to be honest!

As to turn-in writ or quest situations... I think that people mounted on their various steeds are just as much of a problem as a pet.

Mounting blocks are even worse when people are stuck waiting for the quest giver NPC to become selectable. I know I intentionally dismounted a lot for the Jester Festival since loading took so long many times.

(I am hating the "I am there and can block you, but you can't interact with me yet" status.

Feric51

Ashryn wrote: »

To me... the non-combat pets rarely (if ever) have presented a problem in getting in the way. Combat pets do because they are big. One of my early characters was a sorcerer and I discontinued her because of that damned Twilight. My main is a Warden, but I rarely slot the bear as an ultimate BECAUSE it gets in MY way. Wish they had made the bear a wolf or hawk, to be honest!

As to turn-in writ or quest situations... I think that people mounted on their various steeds are just as much of a problem as a pet.

I'll agree with you for the majority of time on this. However... back when I would cycle all my alts through the Dreloth Family Tomb to try and farm recipes and plans, there was always this same warden who had not only his bear standing on top of the urns, but also that big armored mastiff non-combat pet standing there too... pretty sure it was a deliberate troll because it was always on the same bank of urns and I could cycle through 7-8 alts and he wouldn't have moved.

I solved the problem, for the most part, by going into 1st-person PoV and working around them.

Slimebrow

Daedric Magic = Demon magic: you know the same one Molag Bal is using to take over Tamriel?
Daedric Pets = Demonic Beasts summoned from hell: you know...the ones Molag Bal is invading Tamriel with.

I guess the local NPCS and guards really must love demons and potentially man eating bears running around their cities all the meanwhile Molag Bal is just casually invading Tamriel and terrorising towns and cities with demons but I guess its OK to have demonic pets out in public tho because its sorcs "bread and butter".

How much lore inconsistencies do you want this game to have?

The_Lex

Flubbles wrote: »

Daedric Magic = Demon magic: you know the same one Molag Bal is using to take over Tamriel?
Daedric Pets = Demonic Beasts summoned from hell: you know...the ones Molag Bal is invading Tamriel with.

I guess the local NPCS and guards really must love demons and potentially man eating bears running around their cities all the meanwhile Molag Bal is just casually invading Tamriel and terrorising towns and cities with demons but I guess its OK to have demonic pets out in public tho because its sorcs "bread and butter".

How much lore inconsistencies do you want this game to have?

Lore inconsistencies?? Summoners are my favorite TES class. I never remember being accosted by guards for summoning in a town. Even in Skyrim, I'd summon a dremora lord in town without consequences.

That said, unless you were a master conjurer, your summons were temporary. Further, ESO doesn't have a true summoner class. Although I am not a big RPer, I do unsummon (through keybinds) my pets until I actually need them. Makes me feel like a classic TES conjurer.

Slimebrow

The_Lex wrote: »

Flubbles wrote: »

Daedric Magic = Demon magic: you know the same one Molag Bal is using to take over Tamriel?
Daedric Pets = Demonic Beasts summoned from hell: you know...the ones Molag Bal is invading Tamriel with.

I guess the local NPCS and guards really must love demons and potentially man eating bears running around their cities all the meanwhile Molag Bal is just casually invading Tamriel and terrorising towns and cities with demons but I guess its OK to have demonic pets out in public tho because its sorcs "bread and butter".

How much lore inconsistencies do you want this game to have?

Lore inconsistencies?? Summoners are my favorite TES class. I never remember being accosted by guards for summoning in a town. Even in Skyrim, I'd summon a dremora lord in town without consequences.

That said, unless you were a master conjurer, your summons were temporary. Further, ESO doesn't have a true summoner class. Although I am not a big RPer, I do unsummon (through keybinds) my pets until I actually need them. Makes me feel like a classic TES conjurer.

Maybe because demons were not trying to invade Skyrim and meld Tamriel with hell pretty much.Just because you were able to summon Daedra in towns in Skyrim doesn't make it something that should be overlooked for the sake of previous games.

So by that logic then necro abilities shouldn't be made a criminal act either because I am quite sure daedric summoning is a greater form of conjuring compared to summoning skeletons or just as equally bad from lore side of things.

Lauranae

msalvia wrote: »

So anyone who crafts knows about this...that warden with a bear blocking craft stations, writ boxes, etc. Just make it illegal. The precedent is set with necros, but it makes perfect sense of all kinds of summoning to be illegal in game, causing a guard to cap that afk warden whose bear is griefing a whole zone of crafters.

In Skyrim it was pretty clear that conjuration magic is frowned upon, so there's a perfect lore reason to make sorc pets illegal. I mean, wouldn't citizens be a little concerned about daedra all over the place? And for Wardens, this may not be dark magic, but it's still a bear in a town. That has to violate some kind of public ordinance.

It's such an easy fix to a stupid problem, and the Necro pets being illegal paves the way.

Or just force an auto-unsummon in craft areas. Or allow players to kill pets, pvp style. Or just do something technical to stop bears from acting like a wall between you and the thing you need to use. This can't be that hard. And we clearly can't leave it up to the decency of the player base.

You forget the Sorcerer pet, as well. And sometimes even the sorcerer with all that flashy lighting just front of the crates or the station.

Actually i use the new addon Petkennel that dismiss automatically my combat pets at differents places (bank, vendor, station and more) and even allow to disable pet company if you wish so at the same places. (there is also a keybinding options)

VaranisArano

Flubbles wrote: »

The_Lex wrote: »

Flubbles wrote: »

Daedric Magic = Demon magic: you know the same one Molag Bal is using to take over Tamriel?
Daedric Pets = Demonic Beasts summoned from hell: you know...the ones Molag Bal is invading Tamriel with.

I guess the local NPCS and guards really must love demons and potentially man eating bears running around their cities all the meanwhile Molag Bal is just casually invading Tamriel and terrorising towns and cities with demons but I guess its OK to have demonic pets out in public tho because its sorcs "bread and butter".

How much lore inconsistencies do you want this game to have?

Lore inconsistencies?? Summoners are my favorite TES class. I never remember being accosted by guards for summoning in a town. Even in Skyrim, I'd summon a dremora lord in town without consequences.

That said, unless you were a master conjurer, your summons were temporary. Further, ESO doesn't have a true summoner class. Although I am not a big RPer, I do unsummon (through keybinds) my pets until I actually need them. Makes me feel like a classic TES conjurer.

Maybe because demons were not trying to invade Skyrim and meld Tamriel with hell pretty much.Just because you were able to summon Daedra in towns in Skyrim doesn't make it something that should be overlooked for the sake of previous games.

So by that logic then necro abilities shouldn't be made a criminal act either because I am quite sure daedric summoning is a greater form of conjuring compared to summoning skeletons or just as equally bad from lore side of things.

You do realize that TES IV Oblivion was basically the first game where daedra from Oblivion were invading Tamriel to turn it into the Deadlands, yeah?

Yet Mages could happily summon whatever daedra they wanted.


Then again, you keep caling Daedra, demons, and Oblivion, Hell, so I guess I shouldn't assume.

FlopsyPrince

I wish whoever has that bear would quit following me around when I am crafting.

Oh yeah, that is my bear....

Marginis

It's also terrible when view of your character is blocked at an outfit station by someone's pet, summon, mount, or when they activate some ability that changes your appearance. Maybe we should just make things that aren't players invisible when in town, yes ZOS?

FlopsyPrince

Anyone who doesn't play like I do should be invisible and not be able to impact me in any way!

The_Lex

VaranisArano wrote: »

Flubbles wrote: »

The_Lex wrote: »

Flubbles wrote: »

Daedric Magic = Demon magic: you know the same one Molag Bal is using to take over Tamriel?
Daedric Pets = Demonic Beasts summoned from hell: you know...the ones Molag Bal is invading Tamriel with.

I guess the local NPCS and guards really must love demons and potentially man eating bears running around their cities all the meanwhile Molag Bal is just casually invading Tamriel and terrorising towns and cities with demons but I guess its OK to have demonic pets out in public tho because its sorcs "bread and butter".

How much lore inconsistencies do you want this game to have?

Lore inconsistencies?? Summoners are my favorite TES class. I never remember being accosted by guards for summoning in a town. Even in Skyrim, I'd summon a dremora lord in town without consequences.

That said, unless you were a master conjurer, your summons were temporary. Further, ESO doesn't have a true summoner class. Although I am not a big RPer, I do unsummon (through keybinds) my pets until I actually need them. Makes me feel like a classic TES conjurer.

Maybe because demons were not trying to invade Skyrim and meld Tamriel with hell pretty much.Just because you were able to summon Daedra in towns in Skyrim doesn't make it something that should be overlooked for the sake of previous games.

So by that logic then necro abilities shouldn't be made a criminal act either because I am quite sure daedric summoning is a greater form of conjuring compared to summoning skeletons or just as equally bad from lore side of things.

You do realize that TES IV Oblivion was basically the first game where daedra from Oblivion were invading Tamriel to turn it into the Deadlands, yeah?

Yet Mages could happily summon whatever daedra they wanted.


Then again, you keep caling Daedra, demons, and Oblivion, Hell, so I guess I shouldn't assume.

Yeah, I let that one go. Glad someone brought it up.

Feric51

The_Lex wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Flubbles wrote: »

The_Lex wrote: »

Flubbles wrote: »

Daedric Magic = Demon magic: you know the same one Molag Bal is using to take over Tamriel?
Daedric Pets = Demonic Beasts summoned from hell: you know...the ones Molag Bal is invading Tamriel with.

I guess the local NPCS and guards really must love demons and potentially man eating bears running around their cities all the meanwhile Molag Bal is just casually invading Tamriel and terrorising towns and cities with demons but I guess its OK to have demonic pets out in public tho because its sorcs "bread and butter".

How much lore inconsistencies do you want this game to have?

Lore inconsistencies?? Summoners are my favorite TES class. I never remember being accosted by guards for summoning in a town. Even in Skyrim, I'd summon a dremora lord in town without consequences.

That said, unless you were a master conjurer, your summons were temporary. Further, ESO doesn't have a true summoner class. Although I am not a big RPer, I do unsummon (through keybinds) my pets until I actually need them. Makes me feel like a classic TES conjurer.

Maybe because demons were not trying to invade Skyrim and meld Tamriel with hell pretty much.Just because you were able to summon Daedra in towns in Skyrim doesn't make it something that should be overlooked for the sake of previous games.

So by that logic then necro abilities shouldn't be made a criminal act either because I am quite sure daedric summoning is a greater form of conjuring compared to summoning skeletons or just as equally bad from lore side of things.

You do realize that TES IV Oblivion was basically the first game where daedra from Oblivion were invading Tamriel to turn it into the Deadlands, yeah?

Yet Mages could happily summon whatever daedra they wanted.


Then again, you keep caling Daedra, demons, and Oblivion, Hell, so I guess I shouldn't assume.

Yeah, I let that one go. Glad someone brought it up.

Someone's been playing Doom... no harm done, lol.

Dusk_Coven

The_Lex wrote: »

Lore inconsistencies?? Summoners are my favorite TES class. I never remember being accosted by guards for summoning in a town. Even in Skyrim, I'd summon a dremora lord in town without consequences.

There's a difference between
(1) should have been implemented
versus
(2) we didn't have development time to do it

Now that we have the mechanic of certain powers being Criminal Acts, we might as well use it.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/485809/criminal-acts-getting-tough-on-crime

FlopsyPrince

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

The_Lex wrote: »

Lore inconsistencies?? Summoners are my favorite TES class. I never remember being accosted by guards for summoning in a town. Even in Skyrim, I'd summon a dremora lord in town without consequences.

There's a difference between
(1) should have been implemented
versus
(2) we didn't have development time to do it

Now that we have the mechanic of certain powers being Criminal Acts, we might as well use it.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/485809/criminal-acts-getting-tough-on-crime

And

(3) We didn't want to spend time on it so we didn't do it at all.