Add faction locked 7-day campaign or put 48-72 hour acct cooldown on hops in same campaign

idk

Enkil wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Enkil wrote: »

The faction hopping is occurring en masse where players are going from low pop faction to high pop or Emp faction with daily frequency, on weekends, and during prime time. It's absolutely ridiculous on Kyne NA-PC.

Sure, some want to faction hop so they can play with friends or even play on underdog but those are by far the minority. This absence of any restrictions whatsoever has been continuously and totally abused by the majority of those that do so.

Will you all please do something? Put a 48 or 72 hour timer on accounts for hopping on same account alt from another faction on the same campaign. SIMPLE & VERY REASONABLE!!!!

(won't solve all but will help minimize)

What I see here is nothing. Someone that wants something without any justification just because they think might be causing problems yet they have no clue if anything significant is happening.

Sure, they say it is SIMPLE & VERY REASONBLE which makes sense because they want it but they do not even bother to provide any actual justification for it nor do they even provide any measurement of how much it will solve of whatever their make believe problem is.

When someone makes a post, and u reply to it it, u might want to actually reply in a coherent manner rather than conjure some nonsense made-up straw-man argument no one is thinking about.. DUH

These post about legit arguments aren't here to boost your troll post count.

You can disagree, that does not make my statement incoherent by any stretch. I just pointed out you did not provide anything as basis for your opinion presented in the OP.

To suggest that is not coherent without adding anything to support the opinion presented in the OP seems more like attacking me without substance.

Beardimus

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

The "winning" side. What exactly do players get for switching to the winning side? 100k AP and they are at tier 3. So switching to the winning side benefits them for all of 2 or 3 hours at worst. This argument has never and will never make sense. Winning the campaign is utterly meaningless unless you are pushing the leaderboard or you have all of your characters in that faction. The only reason people really want this is out of some absurd sense of faction loyalty. Just fight whoever is fighting against you and fight with whoever is fighting with you and get over it already.

..in your opinion.

In mine if i want that ill go play a FPS or street fighter 2.

This is an MMORPG and the tactical play around the map, and alliance gains is where its at for many.

If all you care for is instant gratification then remain in BattleGrounds, Cyrodiil is a place for more than that. And alliance matters, things that break that need to change.

By the same token, those players swapping for instant gratification, or T1-T3 rewards, are spending only a couple hours on the campaign, and are not capable of influencing the result as much as you claim.

They can spy, muck about with scrolls, boost, flip keeps and flip it back to pass emp about etc etc - plenty enough to make new players and old think what's the point.

Not the absolutle answer. But its an answer. And ill recap - a lock for 24-48 hours (min) has no real downside.

People in your own faction can spy and muck about with scrolls, boosting is hardly a thing these days, there's not enough of them to flip keeps back and forward and if there is enough to do this to pass Emp around it's clearly a dead campaign where Emp and the score has no meaning.

The amount of influence these players have is so diminished from what they are accused of.

That said, maybe a 1 hour lock would be okay.

The justifications crack me up

If you don't care about those campaigns then a full lock, let alone a 48hr should be cool then right? Won't impact you.

Keep Vivec as is for the boosters and zergs, and let the small scales enjoy some legit fights. Like your suggestion.

Beardimus

esotoon wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

And ill recap - a lock for 24-48 hours (min) has no real downside.

Except it stops you from being able to play with friends when you want.
It stops you being able to play with guilds when you want.
It stops you the freedom of playing the play style you want if your characters are on different factions.
It stops you from countering scroll trolls.
It stops you from switching to other factions when your current faction starts dominating or doing things you don't approve of (gate camping, etc.).
It makes setting up group v group fights more difficult.

Whilst you may not consider these downsides, to other players they are.

Honestly if you spending that much time logging in and out you must just love loading screens and campaign queues. It's great that you are a white night of faction hoping, shame they all arent.

Besides You would be able to play with friends, and guilds - just by organising it, 'this week we red on shor / but blue on Vivec etc) And that organization might just spread people out of Vivec which would be a good thing for all.

Honestly it can bat back and forth for ever, it's a difference of opinion so let's change the narrative. All I care about is reducing the cheating, and right now faction unlock aides it and to be it makes utter sense as I would prefer a game with faction loyalty over all else.

I'll all ears to other ways to stop boosting / flipping / switching to stack the winning team etc etc honestly if its not lock and it gets stopped huzzah

Any sport I know would be ruined if you could flip flop teams mid game, it's just odd.

Jeezye

Guys I really don't get the point and issue that faction hopping induces. Can you please be more clear what kind of "cheating" can be exploited by changing factions?

I for myself also played since beta, and I have toons spread over all alliances. I love pvping in Cyro and coulndnt care less about the actual score of a faction, since its literally meaningless which faction wins the campaign at all?! I go into Cyro to enjoy great fights, with friends or by myself, on whatever faction my desired character was created on. Since there's only one campaign that is playable anyways (vivec - all others are dead), a timer would force me to not play other toons for said time - so I'm strongly against that.

So what are the actual problems and how can they be addressed??

Beardimus

Jeezye wrote: »

Guys I really don't get the point and issue that faction hopping induces. Can you please be more clear what kind of "cheating" can be exploited by changing factions?

I for myself also played since beta, and I have toons spread over all alliances. I love pvping in Cyro and coulndnt care less about the actual score of a faction, since its literally meaningless which faction wins the campaign at all?! I go into Cyro to enjoy great fights, with friends or by myself, on whatever faction my desired character was created on. Since there's only one campaign that is playable anyways (vivec - all others are dead), a timer would force me to not play other toons for said time - so I'm strongly against that.

So what are the actual problems and how can they be addressed??

Campaign win might be meaningless to you. But it's not for many, personally I'm faction loyal. And fight to win the campaigns we commit to, otherwise it all feels like meaningless action. But this is besides the point each to their own.

Faction hopping get used for a few things, mucking about with scrolls. I.e. When on a run, death. Someone switches to your alliance, grabs it, runs it back.

On the quiet campaigns people play against themself. Flip the map one way then the other, both boosting ap and racking up wild acores on top of two or all three leaderboards which kill the campaign.

Folks switch to flip keeps for emp. Again devaluing it. Plus less nefarious but the players that switch near the end if a camo and pack the leading side.

Etc etc.

So the ask is to lock it, personally i think Shor, Sotha and Kyne could be fully locked. And vivec on a timer 24-48.

Playstyle is each to their own. However the nefarious behavior ruins others play types. Conversely if all you care for is action you won't be impacted, but left as is those that do care about the campaign, emp, and legit play Its undermined when people flip flop and manipulate stuff.

And coming from a guild that nurtures new players try Kyne and Sotha when faced against it it devalues PvP totally. As once new players cotton on how the winning is done they either say whats the point or can't beat em join em.

I'm all for promoting the campaign to mean more or faction loyalty to be worth more to counter it. Or disable AP earn on a y faction but the one you registered that camp etc etc.

But players literally playing against themselves is bonkers

Beardimus

@Jeezye here's another classic

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/462924/blatent-cheating-in-pvp-cmon-man#latest

Elong

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

The "winning" side. What exactly do players get for switching to the winning side? 100k AP and they are at tier 3. So switching to the winning side benefits them for all of 2 or 3 hours at worst. This argument has never and will never make sense. Winning the campaign is utterly meaningless unless you are pushing the leaderboard or you have all of your characters in that faction. The only reason people really want this is out of some absurd sense of faction loyalty. Just fight whoever is fighting against you and fight with whoever is fighting with you and get over it already.

..in your opinion.

In mine if i want that ill go play a FPS or street fighter 2.

This is an MMORPG and the tactical play around the map, and alliance gains is where its at for many.

If all you care for is instant gratification then remain in BattleGrounds, Cyrodiil is a place for more than that. And alliance matters, things that break that need to change.

By the same token, those players swapping for instant gratification, or T1-T3 rewards, are spending only a couple hours on the campaign, and are not capable of influencing the result as much as you claim.

They can spy, muck about with scrolls, boost, flip keeps and flip it back to pass emp about etc etc - plenty enough to make new players and old think what's the point.

Not the absolutle answer. But its an answer. And ill recap - a lock for 24-48 hours (min) has no real downside.

People in your own faction can spy and muck about with scrolls, boosting is hardly a thing these days, there's not enough of them to flip keeps back and forward and if there is enough to do this to pass Emp around it's clearly a dead campaign where Emp and the score has no meaning.

The amount of influence these players have is so diminished from what they are accused of.

That said, maybe a 1 hour lock would be okay.

The justifications crack me up

If you don't care about those campaigns then a full lock, let alone a 48hr should be cool then right? Won't impact you.

Keep Vivec as is for the boosters and zergs, and let the small scales enjoy some legit fights. Like your suggestion.

I don't think you addressed a single one of my points like I did to you original post, but I guess I'm not the one who has to accept this is how the game is and the silent majority are quite content.

Defilted

What if ZOS implemented something that made holding emp and winning the campaign mean something beyond just winning. I have to say for me just winning is good enough for me , but I know for others it is not.

In DAOC they implemented a PVE zone called Darkness falls. Now in order to gain entry to this zone you have to hold the majority of the relics and keeps on the map. This was a fantastic time! Factions would log in to the PVP zone and try to take wat was needed to unlock this zone and have to fight the defenders of the current faction that had it unlocked. It made you really fight for something.

Now the down side to this is becasue of the way ESO game works the above idea does not work in practice as anyone can have a character that is on any faction so people would just change to that faction and go on in to the zone and never care about the PVP side of things. It worked in DAOC becasue you joined a faction and your account was bound to that faction.

Faction lock would allow for a faction type reward like Darkness falls, but I don't think that would work well for this game. The game has been up to this point been a free for all.

I will come back the reward in a min

I see in Shor (Xbox NA)almost everytime I play a group of Yellows standing there while a group of reds flips the keep just to wait their turn to flip it back. Happens all the time. I see players switch from one faction to the next all the time. Fighting them on a blue, five minutes later see them in AD zone chat. So I disagree based on the behavior that I see all the time that boosting does not happen. Happens constantly.

There is currently a faction of players that only care about a few things
- Ap and getting as much as possible no matter what faction they are playing and will hop to get more on another
- Getting that AP by any means allowed
- Stacking a faction to push EMP for their flavor of the week player
- Generally working together across factions to push the campaign in the direction they want. It does not take a ton of people to make this happen.

The above mentioned group is completely contradictory to the alliance team based group. These two groups seem to make up the majority

Now I am not saying that one group is correct and one group is not. We clearly have part of the player base that is one way and part of the player base that is another. There are other groups as well, but these would be the I don't really care either way people.

Currently the only real reward in PVP that is a team based award is Emp. So the only time people come together is when they want to Emp push for said guild/person/faction, there own reasons. Now pushin for emp takes a team, but only one person is really rewarded.

What we need are rewards that reward faction loyalty. Currently we have a tier 3 reward, but this is so easily reached it can be done within a hour or so per character. We also have the gold Jewelry reward that is tied to tier 3 and your faction winning the campaign, but this is so small of a reward not a large group of people seem to give it much thought and dont play in a way to get this reward.

We need to reward people for playing in the AvAvA environment. You want AD to "Win" and you spend your time there , then I think you should be rewarded for helping your faction each and every day you play.

- Tier 3
- Gold Jewelry
- Bonus AP for winning
- A bonus that the winning campaign gets for that faction only, outside of PVP until the next campaign is decided
- A bonus for the winning campaign that inside the PVP area until the next campaign is decided.

I am sure there are many ideas for rewards that would be fun to get for winning a campaign.

Faction lock would be great for me, but there are players that would not like this. I do not want to make these players feel punished becasue I prefer a different style of play when I PVP and in turn I don't want my style of play to be ruined because of players that boost and AP farm and choose who will be emp and who will not be emp.

Having two different campaigns does not seem like a bad idea on the surface. If this divides the player base and spreads players out on each server this could help in other areas as well, but I think we can come up with a better idea.

Katahdin

The way Vivec is now, no one is switching factions during prime time to sit in a 1-2 hour que to get in again.....Yea Vivec is so dead....

No one is flipping Emp in Vivec either

If it's happening in a "dead" campaign, so what? The campaign is dead

Defilted

I don't think population is a reason to not make the game better for all groups of players. There is a strong base of players as I described that play two different ways. Promoting a team atmosphere would be a good thing IMO.

Xvorg

Ok, I'm gonna say it again: Winning the campaign doesn't matter. It is not important!!

What's important is tha ZoS fix the bugs and chase the cheaters.

Beardimus

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

The "winning" side. What exactly do players get for switching to the winning side? 100k AP and they are at tier 3. So switching to the winning side benefits them for all of 2 or 3 hours at worst. This argument has never and will never make sense. Winning the campaign is utterly meaningless unless you are pushing the leaderboard or you have all of your characters in that faction. The only reason people really want this is out of some absurd sense of faction loyalty. Just fight whoever is fighting against you and fight with whoever is fighting with you and get over it already.

..in your opinion.

In mine if i want that ill go play a FPS or street fighter 2.

This is an MMORPG and the tactical play around the map, and alliance gains is where its at for many.

If all you care for is instant gratification then remain in BattleGrounds, Cyrodiil is a place for more than that. And alliance matters, things that break that need to change.

By the same token, those players swapping for instant gratification, or T1-T3 rewards, are spending only a couple hours on the campaign, and are not capable of influencing the result as much as you claim.

They can spy, muck about with scrolls, boost, flip keeps and flip it back to pass emp about etc etc - plenty enough to make new players and old think what's the point.

Not the absolutle answer. But its an answer. And ill recap - a lock for 24-48 hours (min) has no real downside.

People in your own faction can spy and muck about with scrolls, boosting is hardly a thing these days, there's not enough of them to flip keeps back and forward and if there is enough to do this to pass Emp around it's clearly a dead campaign where Emp and the score has no meaning.

The amount of influence these players have is so diminished from what they are accused of.

That said, maybe a 1 hour lock would be okay.

The justifications crack me up

If you don't care about those campaigns then a full lock, let alone a 48hr should be cool then right? Won't impact you.

Keep Vivec as is for the boosters and zergs, and let the small scales enjoy some legit fights. Like your suggestion.

I don't think you addressed a single one of my points like I did to you original post, but I guess I'm not the one who has to accept this is how the game is and the silent majority are quite content.

Agreed, those that wanna keep hoping for dodgy reasons keep quiet, agreed there. And those that actually want to vocalise their frustration with cheats, will continue to try.

Boostings a thing, alliance switching for nefarious reason is a thing (revealing stealth players, turning round siege, scroll moving, flipping keeps) i don't need to address your points as you don't make any, you make sweeping judgements that mine were invalid, and where i play they aren't.

I'm not saying faction lock is a silver bullet, answer to all the cheating in PvP - it's an improvement however and an option. Your counter argument is based upon it being fine as it is - thus you condone the behavior or try to deny it happens.

Some solutions rather than denial would be a better counter, id happily hear your views. Or ignoring this thread, as those that want faction lock don't want it for any mythical made up legacy arbitrary reason. They want it as they are done with cheats.

[edit]

Beardimus

Katahdin wrote: »

The way Vivec is now, no one is switching factions during prime time to sit in a 1-2 hour que to get in again.....Yea Vivec is so dead....

No one is flipping Emp in Vivec either

If it's happening in a "dead" campaign, so what? The campaign is dead

Ok then, if other campaigns don't matter then we can lock those right? Glad you agree.
And if no one is switching in vivec as you say, well then a 24-48hr lock on vivec won't hurt?

Glad you support faction lock across the board. TY.

Elong

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

The "winning" side. What exactly do players get for switching to the winning side? 100k AP and they are at tier 3. So switching to the winning side benefits them for all of 2 or 3 hours at worst. This argument has never and will never make sense. Winning the campaign is utterly meaningless unless you are pushing the leaderboard or you have all of your characters in that faction. The only reason people really want this is out of some absurd sense of faction loyalty. Just fight whoever is fighting against you and fight with whoever is fighting with you and get over it already.

..in your opinion.

In mine if i want that ill go play a FPS or street fighter 2.

This is an MMORPG and the tactical play around the map, and alliance gains is where its at for many.

If all you care for is instant gratification then remain in BattleGrounds, Cyrodiil is a place for more than that. And alliance matters, things that break that need to change.

By the same token, those players swapping for instant gratification, or T1-T3 rewards, are spending only a couple hours on the campaign, and are not capable of influencing the result as much as you claim.

They can spy, muck about with scrolls, boost, flip keeps and flip it back to pass emp about etc etc - plenty enough to make new players and old think what's the point.

Not the absolutle answer. But its an answer. And ill recap - a lock for 24-48 hours (min) has no real downside.

People in your own faction can spy and muck about with scrolls, boosting is hardly a thing these days, there's not enough of them to flip keeps back and forward and if there is enough to do this to pass Emp around it's clearly a dead campaign where Emp and the score has no meaning.

The amount of influence these players have is so diminished from what they are accused of.

That said, maybe a 1 hour lock would be okay.

The justifications crack me up

If you don't care about those campaigns then a full lock, let alone a 48hr should be cool then right? Won't impact you.

Keep Vivec as is for the boosters and zergs, and let the small scales enjoy some legit fights. Like your suggestion.

I don't think you addressed a single one of my points like I did to you original post, but I guess I'm not the one who has to accept this is how the game is and the silent majority are quite content.

Agreed, those that wanna keep hoping for dodgy reasons keep quiet, agreed there. And those that actually want to vocalise their frustration with cheats, will continue to try.

Boostings a thing, alliance switching for nefarious reason is a thing (revealing stealth players, turning round siege, scroll moving, flipping keeps) i don't need to address your points as you don't make any, you make sweeping judgements that mine were invalid, and where i play they aren't.

I'm not saying faction lock is a silver bullet, answer to all the cheating in PvP - it's an improvement however and an option. Your counter argument is based upon it being fine as it is - thus you condone the behavior or try to deny it happens.

Some solutions rather than denial would be a better counter, id happily hear your views. Or ignoring this thread, as those that want faction lock don't want it for any mythical made up legacy arbitrary reason. They want it as they are done with cheats.

There's nothing to fix!!!!!!!

idk

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

The "winning" side. What exactly do players get for switching to the winning side? 100k AP and they are at tier 3. So switching to the winning side benefits them for all of 2 or 3 hours at worst. This argument has never and will never make sense. Winning the campaign is utterly meaningless unless you are pushing the leaderboard or you have all of your characters in that faction. The only reason people really want this is out of some absurd sense of faction loyalty. Just fight whoever is fighting against you and fight with whoever is fighting with you and get over it already.

..in your opinion.

In mine if i want that ill go play a FPS or street fighter 2.

This is an MMORPG and the tactical play around the map, and alliance gains is where its at for many.

If all you care for is instant gratification then remain in BattleGrounds, Cyrodiil is a place for more than that. And alliance matters, things that break that need to change.

By the same token, those players swapping for instant gratification, or T1-T3 rewards, are spending only a couple hours on the campaign, and are not capable of influencing the result as much as you claim.

They can spy, muck about with scrolls, boost, flip keeps and flip it back to pass emp about etc etc - plenty enough to make new players and old think what's the point.

Not the absolutle answer. But its an answer. And ill recap - a lock for 24-48 hours (min) has no real downside.

People in your own faction can spy and muck about with scrolls, boosting is hardly a thing these days, there's not enough of them to flip keeps back and forward and if there is enough to do this to pass Emp around it's clearly a dead campaign where Emp and the score has no meaning.

The amount of influence these players have is so diminished from what they are accused of.

That said, maybe a 1 hour lock would be okay.

The justifications crack me up

If you don't care about those campaigns then a full lock, let alone a 48hr should be cool then right? Won't impact you.

Keep Vivec as is for the boosters and zergs, and let the small scales enjoy some legit fights. Like your suggestion.

I don't think you addressed a single one of my points like I did to you original post, but I guess I'm not the one who has to accept this is how the game is and the silent majority are quite content.

Agreed, those that wanna keep hoping for dodgy reasons keep quiet, agreed there. And those that actually want to vocalise their frustration with cheats, will continue to try.

Boostings a thing, alliance switching for nefarious reason is a thing (revealing stealth players, turning round siege, scroll moving, flipping keeps) i don't need to address your points as you don't make any, you make sweeping judgements that mine were invalid, and where i play they aren't.

I'm not saying faction lock is a silver bullet, answer to all the cheating in PvP - it's an improvement however and an option. Your counter argument is based upon it being fine as it is - thus you condone the behavior or try to deny it happens.

Some solutions rather than denial would be a better counter, id happily hear your views. Or ignoring this thread, as those that want faction lock don't want it for any mythical made up legacy arbitrary reason. They want it as they are done with cheats.

But crack on, justify away. Fingers in ears, snipes ok too right? GG

There's nothing to fix!!!!!!!

Exactly. Why fix what is not broken. Even OP acknowledges above that they cannot support the statement made in the OP.

Elong

idk wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

The "winning" side. What exactly do players get for switching to the winning side? 100k AP and they are at tier 3. So switching to the winning side benefits them for all of 2 or 3 hours at worst. This argument has never and will never make sense. Winning the campaign is utterly meaningless unless you are pushing the leaderboard or you have all of your characters in that faction. The only reason people really want this is out of some absurd sense of faction loyalty. Just fight whoever is fighting against you and fight with whoever is fighting with you and get over it already.

..in your opinion.

In mine if i want that ill go play a FPS or street fighter 2.

This is an MMORPG and the tactical play around the map, and alliance gains is where its at for many.

If all you care for is instant gratification then remain in BattleGrounds, Cyrodiil is a place for more than that. And alliance matters, things that break that need to change.

By the same token, those players swapping for instant gratification, or T1-T3 rewards, are spending only a couple hours on the campaign, and are not capable of influencing the result as much as you claim.

They can spy, muck about with scrolls, boost, flip keeps and flip it back to pass emp about etc etc - plenty enough to make new players and old think what's the point.

Not the absolutle answer. But its an answer. And ill recap - a lock for 24-48 hours (min) has no real downside.

People in your own faction can spy and muck about with scrolls, boosting is hardly a thing these days, there's not enough of them to flip keeps back and forward and if there is enough to do this to pass Emp around it's clearly a dead campaign where Emp and the score has no meaning.

The amount of influence these players have is so diminished from what they are accused of.

That said, maybe a 1 hour lock would be okay.

The justifications crack me up

If you don't care about those campaigns then a full lock, let alone a 48hr should be cool then right? Won't impact you.

Keep Vivec as is for the boosters and zergs, and let the small scales enjoy some legit fights. Like your suggestion.

I don't think you addressed a single one of my points like I did to you original post, but I guess I'm not the one who has to accept this is how the game is and the silent majority are quite content.

Agreed, those that wanna keep hoping for dodgy reasons keep quiet, agreed there. And those that actually want to vocalise their frustration with cheats, will continue to try.

Boostings a thing, alliance switching for nefarious reason is a thing (revealing stealth players, turning round siege, scroll moving, flipping keeps) i don't need to address your points as you don't make any, you make sweeping judgements that mine were invalid, and where i play they aren't.

I'm not saying faction lock is a silver bullet, answer to all the cheating in PvP - it's an improvement however and an option. Your counter argument is based upon it being fine as it is - thus you condone the behavior or try to deny it happens.

Some solutions rather than denial would be a better counter, id happily hear your views. Or ignoring this thread, as those that want faction lock don't want it for any mythical made up legacy arbitrary reason. They want it as they are done with cheats.

But crack on, justify away. Fingers in ears, snipes ok too right? GG

There's nothing to fix!!!!!!!

Exactly. Why fix what is not broken. Even OP acknowledges above that they cannot support the statement made in the OP.

The main thing is that they keep saying it's cheating when it's firmly established and encouraged by ZOS to play different factions, otherwise it wouldn't be a promoted option. If you don't like it, play another game IMO.

Just an FYI, I only play DC and have done so exclusively for 6 months now, bar the odd hour or two at the end of an already decided campaign to get some Transmute gems.

idk

Elong wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

The "winning" side. What exactly do players get for switching to the winning side? 100k AP and they are at tier 3. So switching to the winning side benefits them for all of 2 or 3 hours at worst. This argument has never and will never make sense. Winning the campaign is utterly meaningless unless you are pushing the leaderboard or you have all of your characters in that faction. The only reason people really want this is out of some absurd sense of faction loyalty. Just fight whoever is fighting against you and fight with whoever is fighting with you and get over it already.

..in your opinion.

In mine if i want that ill go play a FPS or street fighter 2.

This is an MMORPG and the tactical play around the map, and alliance gains is where its at for many.

If all you care for is instant gratification then remain in BattleGrounds, Cyrodiil is a place for more than that. And alliance matters, things that break that need to change.

By the same token, those players swapping for instant gratification, or T1-T3 rewards, are spending only a couple hours on the campaign, and are not capable of influencing the result as much as you claim.

They can spy, muck about with scrolls, boost, flip keeps and flip it back to pass emp about etc etc - plenty enough to make new players and old think what's the point.

Not the absolutle answer. But its an answer. And ill recap - a lock for 24-48 hours (min) has no real downside.

People in your own faction can spy and muck about with scrolls, boosting is hardly a thing these days, there's not enough of them to flip keeps back and forward and if there is enough to do this to pass Emp around it's clearly a dead campaign where Emp and the score has no meaning.

The amount of influence these players have is so diminished from what they are accused of.

That said, maybe a 1 hour lock would be okay.

The justifications crack me up

If you don't care about those campaigns then a full lock, let alone a 48hr should be cool then right? Won't impact you.

Keep Vivec as is for the boosters and zergs, and let the small scales enjoy some legit fights. Like your suggestion.

I don't think you addressed a single one of my points like I did to you original post, but I guess I'm not the one who has to accept this is how the game is and the silent majority are quite content.

Agreed, those that wanna keep hoping for dodgy reasons keep quiet, agreed there. And those that actually want to vocalise their frustration with cheats, will continue to try.

Boostings a thing, alliance switching for nefarious reason is a thing (revealing stealth players, turning round siege, scroll moving, flipping keeps) i don't need to address your points as you don't make any, you make sweeping judgements that mine were invalid, and where i play they aren't.

I'm not saying faction lock is a silver bullet, answer to all the cheating in PvP - it's an improvement however and an option. Your counter argument is based upon it being fine as it is - thus you condone the behavior or try to deny it happens.

Some solutions rather than denial would be a better counter, id happily hear your views. Or ignoring this thread, as those that want faction lock don't want it for any mythical made up legacy arbitrary reason. They want it as they are done with cheats.

But crack on, justify away. Fingers in ears, snipes ok too right? GG

There's nothing to fix!!!!!!!

Exactly. Why fix what is not broken. Even OP acknowledges above that they cannot support the statement made in the OP.

The main thing is that they keep saying it's cheating when it's firmly established and encouraged by ZOS to play different factions, otherwise it wouldn't be a promoted option. If you don't like it, play another game IMO.

Just an FYI, I only play DC and have done so exclusively for 6 months now, bar the odd hour or two at the end of an already decided campaign to get some Transmute gems.

I do not faction hop either. I merely point out that statements like what is made in the OP are baseless and empty.

I think it speaks volumes with how few agree with their opinion.

Elong

idk wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

The "winning" side. What exactly do players get for switching to the winning side? 100k AP and they are at tier 3. So switching to the winning side benefits them for all of 2 or 3 hours at worst. This argument has never and will never make sense. Winning the campaign is utterly meaningless unless you are pushing the leaderboard or you have all of your characters in that faction. The only reason people really want this is out of some absurd sense of faction loyalty. Just fight whoever is fighting against you and fight with whoever is fighting with you and get over it already.

..in your opinion.

In mine if i want that ill go play a FPS or street fighter 2.

This is an MMORPG and the tactical play around the map, and alliance gains is where its at for many.

If all you care for is instant gratification then remain in BattleGrounds, Cyrodiil is a place for more than that. And alliance matters, things that break that need to change.

By the same token, those players swapping for instant gratification, or T1-T3 rewards, are spending only a couple hours on the campaign, and are not capable of influencing the result as much as you claim.

They can spy, muck about with scrolls, boost, flip keeps and flip it back to pass emp about etc etc - plenty enough to make new players and old think what's the point.

Not the absolutle answer. But its an answer. And ill recap - a lock for 24-48 hours (min) has no real downside.

People in your own faction can spy and muck about with scrolls, boosting is hardly a thing these days, there's not enough of them to flip keeps back and forward and if there is enough to do this to pass Emp around it's clearly a dead campaign where Emp and the score has no meaning.

The amount of influence these players have is so diminished from what they are accused of.

That said, maybe a 1 hour lock would be okay.

The justifications crack me up

If you don't care about those campaigns then a full lock, let alone a 48hr should be cool then right? Won't impact you.

Keep Vivec as is for the boosters and zergs, and let the small scales enjoy some legit fights. Like your suggestion.

I don't think you addressed a single one of my points like I did to you original post, but I guess I'm not the one who has to accept this is how the game is and the silent majority are quite content.

Agreed, those that wanna keep hoping for dodgy reasons keep quiet, agreed there. And those that actually want to vocalise their frustration with cheats, will continue to try.

Boostings a thing, alliance switching for nefarious reason is a thing (revealing stealth players, turning round siege, scroll moving, flipping keeps) i don't need to address your points as you don't make any, you make sweeping judgements that mine were invalid, and where i play they aren't.

I'm not saying faction lock is a silver bullet, answer to all the cheating in PvP - it's an improvement however and an option. Your counter argument is based upon it being fine as it is - thus you condone the behavior or try to deny it happens.

Some solutions rather than denial would be a better counter, id happily hear your views. Or ignoring this thread, as those that want faction lock don't want it for any mythical made up legacy arbitrary reason. They want it as they are done with cheats.

But crack on, justify away. Fingers in ears, snipes ok too right? GG

There's nothing to fix!!!!!!!

Exactly. Why fix what is not broken. Even OP acknowledges above that they cannot support the statement made in the OP.

The main thing is that they keep saying it's cheating when it's firmly established and encouraged by ZOS to play different factions, otherwise it wouldn't be a promoted option. If you don't like it, play another game IMO.

Just an FYI, I only play DC and have done so exclusively for 6 months now, bar the odd hour or two at the end of an already decided campaign to get some Transmute gems.

I do not faction hop either. I merely point out that statements like what is made in the OP are baseless and empty.

I think it speaks volumes with how few agree with their opinion.

Yep I'm in agreement with you mate : )

Minno

If everyone ran solo and hit random targets, you wouldn't need to worry about zone spies

poietin

I am sure this has been said before but I'll say it again. There are people who do not care about alliance wins or map control. Cyrodiil is a place that attracts both faction loyalists and people who just want to PVP regardless of factions. I understand there is BG but that doesn't mean Cyrodiil is an exclusive zone for faction campaign. I am a causal pvpers. If I see my EP queue into Vivec NA is at 50+, I am switching to my AD. I don't have the time or patience to wait 48-72 hours. I want to pvp now and my experience of Cyrodiil is just as valid as people who want to fight for their factions.
Simply put, a faction lock would exclude a lot of people from enjoying Cyrodiil and it's a terrible idea when the pvp population is dying and you spend half your time in Cyrodiil playing horse simulator looking for fights.

Enkil

All I would really want is one 7-day campaign with locks... if it’s lower pop that’s fine. Keep the rest of them as FFA.

Haashhtaag

Enkil wrote: »

All I would really want is one 7-day campaign with locks... if it’s lower pop that’s fine. Keep the rest of them as FFA.

You want a more dead campaign than Shor, that’s how you get it.

Beardimus

Haashhtaag wrote: »

Enkil wrote: »

All I would really want is one 7-day campaign with locks... if it’s lower pop that’s fine. Keep the rest of them as FFA.

You want a more dead campaign than Shor, that’s how you get it.

Honestly though why does that bother you?

The lengths a handful of posters go to to flame the idea of a lock, how it wont change anything and sky will fall - BUT there's no counter argument at all to a timed lock. 24-48 hours. Or a lock to the campaigns that some people don't seem to care about.

If it doesn't affect you why get so defensive over it, as switching for nefarious reasons DOES impact those that want to play legit.

Beardimus

idk wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

The "winning" side. What exactly do players get for switching to the winning side? 100k AP and they are at tier 3. So switching to the winning side benefits them for all of 2 or 3 hours at worst. This argument has never and will never make sense. Winning the campaign is utterly meaningless unless you are pushing the leaderboard or you have all of your characters in that faction. The only reason people really want this is out of some absurd sense of faction loyalty. Just fight whoever is fighting against you and fight with whoever is fighting with you and get over it already.

..in your opinion.

In mine if i want that ill go play a FPS or street fighter 2.

This is an MMORPG and the tactical play around the map, and alliance gains is where its at for many.

If all you care for is instant gratification then remain in BattleGrounds, Cyrodiil is a place for more than that. And alliance matters, things that break that need to change.

By the same token, those players swapping for instant gratification, or T1-T3 rewards, are spending only a couple hours on the campaign, and are not capable of influencing the result as much as you claim.

They can spy, muck about with scrolls, boost, flip keeps and flip it back to pass emp about etc etc - plenty enough to make new players and old think what's the point.

Not the absolutle answer. But its an answer. And ill recap - a lock for 24-48 hours (min) has no real downside.

People in your own faction can spy and muck about with scrolls, boosting is hardly a thing these days, there's not enough of them to flip keeps back and forward and if there is enough to do this to pass Emp around it's clearly a dead campaign where Emp and the score has no meaning.

The amount of influence these players have is so diminished from what they are accused of.

That said, maybe a 1 hour lock would be okay.

The justifications crack me up

If you don't care about those campaigns then a full lock, let alone a 48hr should be cool then right? Won't impact you.

Keep Vivec as is for the boosters and zergs, and let the small scales enjoy some legit fights. Like your suggestion.

I don't think you addressed a single one of my points like I did to you original post, but I guess I'm not the one who has to accept this is how the game is and the silent majority are quite content.

Agreed, those that wanna keep hoping for dodgy reasons keep quiet, agreed there. And those that actually want to vocalise their frustration with cheats, will continue to try.

Boostings a thing, alliance switching for nefarious reason is a thing (revealing stealth players, turning round siege, scroll moving, flipping keeps) i don't need to address your points as you don't make any, you make sweeping judgements that mine were invalid, and where i play they aren't.

I'm not saying faction lock is a silver bullet, answer to all the cheating in PvP - it's an improvement however and an option. Your counter argument is based upon it being fine as it is - thus you condone the behavior or try to deny it happens.

Some solutions rather than denial would be a better counter, id happily hear your views. Or ignoring this thread, as those that want faction lock don't want it for any mythical made up legacy arbitrary reason. They want it as they are done with cheats.

But crack on, justify away. Fingers in ears, snipes ok too right? GG

There's nothing to fix!!!!!!!

Exactly. Why fix what is not broken. Even OP acknowledges above that they cannot support the statement made in the OP.

The main thing is that they keep saying it's cheating when it's firmly established and encouraged by ZOS to play different factions, otherwise it wouldn't be a promoted option. If you don't like it, play another game IMO.

Just an FYI, I only play DC and have done so exclusively for 6 months now, bar the odd hour or two at the end of an already decided campaign to get some Transmute gems.

I do not faction hop either. I merely point out that statements like what is made in the OP are baseless and empty.

I think it speaks volumes with how few agree with their opinion.

I disagree, faction lock threads appear pretty regularly and the counter arguements are all the same with no real substance.

There's no valid counter in this thread to why a temp lock couldn't happen 24-48hrs. To literally stop players switching tactically or playing against themselves.

Likewise enough of the faction hopping supporters on this very thread talk about the other campaigns being meaningless - so again if they have no value to you guys, let then have a lock. Win / Win

@idk @Elong Here is my point. I want a complete lock, across all. I'd be happy with that. BUT i hear the views of others and consider them. Hence regressing back to ANY means to drive faction loyalty in others ways would be great as a first step, failing that helping a timed lock on all 24-48 or a lock on Shor / Kyne / Sotha - however your arguments are based on denial that cheating even happens (three threads have been on the front page in the last 24hrs) or any degree of yield that allows for how others would like to play, which we consider a more legit way - fighting for one alliance with no nefarious / counter alliance behavior easily facilitated.

Utter denial and defense sadly is normally seen by those that want to boost or do weird stuff with faction hopping! I won't tar you tar that brush outright. But rather than flat out deny or try to shut down people that want to atop cheats / exploits (a good thing surely) why don't you bring suggestions to the table rather than a reluctance to change something that suits you.

When i see a trial is glitched and people exploit farming skins i don't flood the thread shouting NO ITS NOT. Or SKINS DONT MATTER. Which actually my view, i recognize that there is cheating going on and folks want it stopped (even tho in that example thencheating impacts no one else, and PvP boosting / cheating does)

If you don't think faction lock isnt the answer then help us, what is - give us something constructive. @ZOS_BrianWheeler is listening.

Beardimus

Whilst Im being constructive Ill throw another idea out, disable campaign impact for players that do switch. AP gain, and Alliance score.

Wouldn't stop the cheating, but would stop boosting which is a big part of the issue.

I'm sure the boosters gonna flame this one haha

Enkil

idk wrote: »

You can disagree all you want but you and the small band of people who are of the same opinion of the OP make similar bold claims like the OP in this thread with little but empty words to support the claims. It is really sad.'

Their threads also end up with a small number of supporters as well. Most people understand it is just crying wolf and that there is no real issue so most have no reason to bother with such threads.

So in the end, here is my point. Zos sees actual numbers and if there is an actual issue and it seems pretty clear they see no reason for a change. So unless you have something more than the empty words most of these threads are based on then there is no justification for change. It is that simple.

Really? What’s up with this obsession about threads and such? I don’t want to come here to post and would rather be in game. You speak in 3rd person arguing against a ghost as if removes you somehow. If you have one single valid counter-arguement, I have not yet heard it.

It’s not change, but offering a locked option... can we open our eyes and broaden our horizons a little more. Perhaps Stop being confrontational? I said at the outset I respect that most people like playing FFA... can you not respect that others like myself, prefer restrictions and boundaireies and rules in their PvP? If not, that is your own personal shortcoming. I’ve shown and vocalized my respect for other players’ desires and style of play, yet you continue to be dismissive of mine. Hmmm.

Beardimus

Enkil wrote: »

Haashhtaag wrote: »

Enkil wrote: »

All I would really want is one 7-day campaign with locks... if it’s lower pop that’s fine. Keep the rest of them as FFA.

You want a more dead campaign than Shor, that’s how you get it.

If by “dead” you mean not full of zergs, then sure. I think that if one such campaign existed, the more faction loyalist types might gravitate toward it and it would maybe be a medium pop campaign on most platforms.

I, like many other PvPers, want to play on a campaign where your loyalty/hopping is locked in for the duration (7days).

Anyone that likes the current FFA hopping (I know it’s not even really relevant on Vivec) can go about play as normal. Those that like FFA have all the campaigns already.

Why the F are y’all so staunchly opposed to us having at lease ONE locked campaign that could be a home to people by want to play for a certain faction?? Can u please explain this vocal opposition to giving us a place we want to play?

Spot on, I'd be happy with that and a couple of my guilds would fully support it. I can see no reason for not locking at least one right now.

The short sighted folks also can't see that it would help the vivec lag they also moan about. ZOS need players to spread out yet they don't, They ball up in Vivec. The more reasons to spread the better

Beardimus

How about we change the narrative and focus on part of the problem constructively.

Which is : Some of us would prefer Alliance loyalty to mean something, to encourage decent play as a team, common goal towards something.

It feels that's how the game is intended, it might not feel that way for everyone but there are enough that this should be viable for those that want it - without impacting those that don't care. One suggestion is one faction locked campaign. Any downside?

Loyalty - Why doesn't that happen right now?. Why do people feel the need to switch about? Is AP as a currency to farm the issue? Instant gratification of just wanting a fight? With battleground a great place for instant fights seems unlikely.

Enkil

Yes please, let’s get to the crux

Tommy_The_Gun

"Team switching" should not be the case if we are talking about team based PvP game. Why we even have to discuss that ? Is it not that obvious ?

When the game originally launched (2014)
PvP had this kind of restriction and it was much better (campaigns were alliance - locked). People were playing to win campaign. That was the main goal. Today we have came to a point where only thing that matters is AP... It should not be like that. Farming AP should not be the main goal of a 30-day campaign imho.