Cyrodiil Updates for Update 18

ZOS_BrianWheeler

No loot on the guards.

patents

Please don’t nerf ballista player damage!!

Darkmage1337

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

No loot on the guards.

Guards don't drop loot. Tell us something we don't know.

3rd Annual Jubilee Cake (Memento): " You can't use this collectible in this zone. "
Any fix for that, now or in the future?

Also:
Ayleid Well Health Buff (ON): https://imgur.com/7M14hNM
2 minutes later, Ayleid Well Health Buff (OFF): https://imgur.com/O4hZT1g

@ZOS_BrianWheeler Mind making it so that the Ayleid Well Health Buff bonus carries over into Cyrodiil Delves, since the Cyrodiil Delves are a part of Cyrodiil, a part of Cyrodiil daily quests, and a part of Cyrodiil PvP in general.

Thanks.

GaunterODim

Darkmage1337 wrote: »

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

No loot on the guards.

Guards don't drop loot. Tell us something we don't know.

3rd Annual Jubilee Cake (Memento): " You can't use this collectible in this zone. "
Any fix for that, now or in the future?

If you refer to that you cant use in cyrodiil, then that is intended. Plenty memento are just there for the bling bling shiny part which would distract from what happens and would produce more laggs. Imagine all of the 100 people fighting have their shiny memento of choice in the quickslot.

Additionaly, some change the appeareance of your character which is why disguises dont work as well. (There is one from greenshade that makes your character almost invisible)

Darkmage1337

GaunterODim wrote: »

Darkmage1337 wrote: »

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

No loot on the guards.

Guards don't drop loot. Tell us something we don't know.

3rd Annual Jubilee Cake (Memento): " You can't use this collectible in this zone. "
Any fix for that, now or in the future?

If you refer to that you cant use in cyrodiil, then that is intended. Plenty memento are just there for the bling bling shiny part which would distract from what happens and would produce more laggs. Imagine all of the 100 people fighting have their shiny memento of choice in the quickslot.

Additionaly, some change the appeareance of your character which is why disguises dont work as well. (There is one from greenshade that makes your character almost invisible)

Yet Costumes and The Outfit System are allowed?
If you can wear a Wedding Dress over your character (Costume) or trans-mog heavy-armor on top of your equipped light armor to disguise yourself as being more-tanky to deter away enemy players (Outfit System) then why can you not use Mementos like "Storm Atronach Transform" that was legitimately paid for via RNG from within the Crown Crate store. Real money was paid, yet this virtual good/product is entirely unusable. Unlike costumes and outfits, which can be used.

And to your other point, people have potions quickslotted, so Mementos wouldn't be "spammed" like you think they would, lol.
Only after a PvP battle has ended, sure, maybe, to look cool and/or taunt the other dead enemy players. But then again, you still have emotes that also work for this, like /sitchair, /sweep, etc.
So, I don't see where the discrimination is coming from. Costumes are allowed. "Outfits" are allowed. Emotes are allowed. But not Mementos? Is there a technical reason why? Lol.
It makes no sense to have to leave Cyrodiil to constantly re-apply an ESO events' Memento XP buff.
(Jester Festival XP event, ESO Anniversary XP event, Halloween's Witchmother XP event, New Years' A New Life event, etc.)
TL;DR: @ZOS_BrianWheeler why not allow Mementos in Cyrodiil and Imperial City? Costumes, Outfits, and Emotes are all allowed/enabled in PvP. But not Mementos? Mementos have no combat effect and are purely cosmetic just like Costumes, Outfits, and Emotes. It sure would save players' a lot of travel time and loading-screen/lag time fustration of having to constantly re-apply the event Memento XP buff by leaving ImpCity/Cyrodiil and re-entering, when they could simply do it from within ImpCity/Cyrodiil (whether it be overland, at the factions' safe-area, or even from within a Delve).

GaunterODim

Because its just clothes

Darkmage1337

GaunterODim wrote: »

Because its just clothes

Mementos collectibles are simply animations and cosmetic, just like emotes. Clothes: (via Costumes and/or Outfits) are cosmetics, too.
None of these effect PvP combat in any way; except maybe Costumes and Outfits, which disguise your character's equipped-gear; but that's just a psychological effect, not an actual in-game advantage.

Mementos already function the same way (purely cosmetic) just like Outfits, Costumes, and Emotes; so, why are Mementos disabled in PvP, but not the other 3? Mementos should be enabled in ImpCity/Cyrodiil, to be in line with the other 3 options (Costumes, Outfits, and Emotes) that are already enabled and available to be utilized.

GaunterODim

On the addition of your last post- If it would give people enough of an advantage to use the mementos to distract, the swapping with potions wouldnt be the problem. Swapping quickslotted items is, well quick. You dont even need to stop, just jump and by the time youve landed you can choose a potion of your choice.

And you shouldnt generalize things too much about animations. There is a difference between having a light effects show and your character dancing (or whatever emote).
I feel like youre comparing apple with pears, some things can be compared when they have similarities, but should they always? I think the explanations of my first post were sufficient.

Darkmage1337

A four-worded comparison/explanation is not much of an explanation nor conversation, and more of a trollish-type of response of "don't know, don't care, move along."

My posts were pretty compelling, reasonable, and information-detailed, if anyone actually read them.
But instead we were updated with "No loot on the guards" -- which we've known for 4+ years now, already.

I have been an ESO subscriber since PC-NA launch, I primarily play ESO for the PvP, yet, in my several years worth of crowns both accumulated via subscription and crowns purchased during crown sales, and of all the crowns spent on crown crates, I always receive Mementos but cannot ever use any of them in the areas in which I play. So what was the point?
Obviously a refund is not an option; so, why not simply enable them? Lol. Mementos literally cause zero harm. Zero negative impact.

GaunterODim

GaunterODim wrote: »

Darkmage1337 wrote: »

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

No loot on the guards.

Guards don't drop loot. Tell us something we don't know.

3rd Annual Jubilee Cake (Memento): " You can't use this collectible in this zone. "
Any fix for that, now or in the future?

If you refer to that you cant use in cyrodiil, then that is intended. Plenty memento are just there for the bling bling shiny part which would distract from what happens and would produce more laggs. Imagine all of the 100 people fighting have their shiny memento of choice in the quickslot.

Additionaly, some change the appeareance of your character which is why disguises dont work as well. (There is one from greenshade that makes your character almost invisible)

FIRST post!

Darkmage1337

GaunterODim wrote: »

GaunterODim wrote: »

Darkmage1337 wrote: »

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

No loot on the guards.

Guards don't drop loot. Tell us something we don't know.

3rd Annual Jubilee Cake (Memento): " You can't use this collectible in this zone. "
Any fix for that, now or in the future?

If you refer to that you cant use in cyrodiil, then that is intended. Plenty memento are just there for the bling bling shiny part which would distract from what happens and would produce more laggs. Imagine all of the 100 people fighting have their shiny memento of choice in the quickslot.

Additionaly, some change the appeareance of your character which is why disguises dont work as well. (There is one from greenshade that makes your character almost invisible)

FIRST post!

Dye-Station/Outfits and Crown-Store Costumes also change the appearance of your character and "disguise them", and they are allowed. So there is no need for the other in-game item disguises when you can replicate most of them in the Outfit System; or, like I said, use an Outfit customization (like slotting heavy armor cosmetics over your light-armor gear) to disguise yourself instead of using an actual disguise item.
I understand your point with the invisible pink-mist disguise from Greenshade being disabled, obviously; but, the Goblin Shadowsilk Gem disguise was also allowed. But, again these are disguise-items, not Mementos. Mementos were designed to be collected, played with, and used..
The invis-disguise item that you are referring to was never meant to be used outside the 1 quest (or so) that it is associated with, hence it being not allowed as well (I haven't done it, so I don't know the specifics). But, in that specific outlier example, we can easily come to our own conclusion. However, you didn't spend 25,000+ crowns to receive that item-disguise whereas numerous players have spent 25,000+ crowns on crates and have not gotten a mount and have only gotten Mementos, which, again, we can't even use..

All I'm saying is a simple explanation (communication directly from ZOS) regarding Memento usage in PvP areas would be nice, even if it is one-sentence/five words, like Brian's post above.

For example: "We are looking into re-enabling and allowing Mementos back into PvP areas, sometime in the future, but no ETA."
Boom, done, rant over / problem solved. @ZOS_BrianWheeler (Feel free to copy/paste )

Morgul667

Darkmage1337 wrote: »

GaunterODim wrote: »

GaunterODim wrote: »

Darkmage1337 wrote: »

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

No loot on the guards.

Guards don't drop loot. Tell us something we don't know.

3rd Annual Jubilee Cake (Memento): " You can't use this collectible in this zone. "
Any fix for that, now or in the future?

If you refer to that you cant use in cyrodiil, then that is intended. Plenty memento are just there for the bling bling shiny part which would distract from what happens and would produce more laggs. Imagine all of the 100 people fighting have their shiny memento of choice in the quickslot.

Additionaly, some change the appeareance of your character which is why disguises dont work as well. (There is one from greenshade that makes your character almost invisible)

FIRST post!

Dye-Station/Outfits and Crown-Store Costumes also change the appearance of your character and "disguise them", and they are allowed. So there is no need for the other in-game item disguises when you can replicate most of them in the Outfit System; or, like I said, use an Outfit customization (like slotting heavy armor cosmetics over your light-armor gear) to disguise yourself instead of using an actual disguise item.
I understand your point with the invisible pink-mist disguise from Greenshade being disabled, obviously; but, the Goblin Shadowsilk Gem disguise was also allowed. But, again these are disguise-items, not Mementos. Mementos were designed to be collected, played with, and used..
The invis-disguise item that you are referring to was never meant to be used outside the 1 quest (or so) that it is associated with, hence it being not allowed as well (I haven't done it, so I don't know the specifics). But, in that specific outlier example, we can easily come to our own conclusion. However, you didn't spend 25,000+ crowns to receive that item-disguise whereas numerous players have spent 25,000+ crowns on crates and have not gotten a mount and have only gotten Mementos, which, again, we can't even use..

All I'm saying is a simple explanation (communication directly from ZOS) regarding Memento usage in PvP areas would be nice, even if it is one-sentence/five words, like Brian's post above.

For example: "We are looking into re-enabling and allowing Mementos back into PvP areas, sometime in the future, but no ETA."
Boom, done, rant over / problem solved. @ZOS_BrianWheeler (Feel free to copy/paste )

I see mementos as the last of our issues

If it makes the game less laggy im fine without then in cyrodill

Ranger209

Silly question but do any mementos create LOS issues? I have seen people throw down cakes at chest spawns of dolemans to try and be cute and interfere with chest interaction.

Sharee

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

I'm going to try this with a Melee char, and see if the new crossbow pull can be used to segment the flag guards away from each other (as it seems that they don't like to move), and kill them one on one (puling them into the tower doorway)

They cannot be pulled with the DK chain so silver leash probably won't work either.

geonsocal

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

No loot on the guards.

gracias senor...must have just been wishful thinking on my part to think I had heard resource guards would start dropping loot...

not that I really need more stuff, but, you know - who can say no to free stuff

reiverx

You should be able to use mementos at your home base. There's no reason to disallow it and would help with those XP buffs.

frozywozy

patents wrote: »

Please don’t nerf ballista player damage!!

I remember a patch a few years ago where they adjusted normal bolt balistas and stone trebs to deal more damage against walls while all other sieges (fire / lightning balistas, catapults, fire trebs) were more focus on players.

I think that made sense. The new definition of balistas being focus on counter-sieging enemy sieges is meh.

The only changes I would have brought to sieges this patch would have been ice trebs (root enemies).

Also, fire sieges should apply a dot on wooden doors.

dotme

"Adjusted the draw distance around all Keeps in an effort to improve the client framerate."

Source: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/407045/pts-patch-notes-v4-0-0/p1

Really? I'm assuming that means the draw distance is reduced? There are already circumstances where you can stand on a keep wall and be unable to see the offense siege weapons hitting it (making it impossible to counter-siege). Same with forward camps, which sometimes don't become visible until you're very close to them.

I really hope there are some exceptions to this adjustment, otherwise we'll be living in a world of invisible siege and camps.

TequilaFire

dotme wrote: »

"Adjusted the draw distance around all Keeps in an effort to improve the client framerate."

Source: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/407045/pts-patch-notes-v4-0-0/p1

Really? I'm assuming that means the draw distance is reduced? There are already circumstances where you can stand on a keep wall and be unable to see the offense siege weapons hitting it (making it impossible to counter-siege). Same with forward camps, which sometimes don't become visible until you're very close to them.

I really hope there are some exceptions to this adjustment, otherwise we'll be living in a world of invisible siege and camps.

Yeah, I already notice a shorter draw distance on PS4 than I do on PC.
There are times on PS4 when standing on the BRK mine side wall you can't see the enemy siege right in front of you unless you take a few steps forward.

Sordidfairytale

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

...Ballista had their damage vs. players reduced but increased vs. Siege because their intended design is to be Anti Siege, not Anti Player. The reduction in damage can be re-analyzed however during the PTS cycle...

Forgive me, I've not had the chance to get into PVP on the PTS yet.

Did we get a lightning catapult? A frostie? Or are we limited to just oil catapults reducing stamina and meatbag reducing your appetite?

TheBonesXXX

@ZOS_BrianWheeler Please let the rumors be true and you are adding faction locked campaigns again.

Avran_Sylt

@Darkmage1337

His response was succinct and to the point. The question was not asked "Why do the guards not drop loot?" Which would not have been responded to anyway.

A likely reason why mementos are not enabled in campaigns, is that they have additional effects that make them interesting.

Interaction prompts (blocking doorways), extra damage on hit (ganking), snaring enemies who stand in them (psuedo abilities), altering character model (masking attacks). If I was to be more conservative with my guess, I'd say that the effects could impact server performance.

Going through all the mementos and 'balancing' them to be able to be used or not, isn't currently on the slate, I would imagine.

RDMyers65b14_ESO

Wow. Some people don't remember the issue that mementos caused? Finvir's was specifically used to troll scroll runs. People complained about the questionable meat bag being used to vomit on the dead... and don't forget that the kopi flower makes one practically invisible... Of course, there was the costume of a skeleton that made people think it was part of the scenery and not an enemy player. Yes, I would like to have the XP bonus things in Cyrodil, but too much abuse of the others means that the use of mementos is gone. Besides, it isn't that bad to hop out of Cyrodil and use the cake, unless you have a queue. Mementos are the LEAST of the issues.

While I am hopeful about the proposed changes for performance, I am truly hoping that campaign locks will become a thing. Too much faction hopping. There were problems before the locks were removed and it has gotten increasingly worse.

Darkmage1337

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

@Darkmage1337

His response was succinct and to the point. The question was not asked "Why do the guards not drop loot?" Which would not have been responded to anyway.

A likely reason why mementos are not enabled in campaigns, is that they have additional effects that make them interesting.

Interaction prompts (blocking doorways), extra damage on hit (ganking), snaring enemies who stand in them (psuedo abilities), altering character model (masking attacks). If I was to be more conservative with my guess, I'd say that the effects could impact server performance.

Going through all the mementos and 'balancing' them to be able to be used or not, isn't currently on the slate, I would imagine.

Could you be more specific, because I don't see any of the 49 Mementos on my collections list doing those things you stated towards other players. Maybe only to you yourself, sure. But that should be allowed anyways, regardless. It's your character. You play/do what you want. Or, in this case, at least have the option to. And, currently, we do not have options.

A midway compromise would be to allow Mementos from the Crown Store, because 1. they were purchased/paid-for with real money and should be allowed to be used at any time under any circumstance by the player, and 2. they are mostly all purely cosmetic (like Outfits and Costumes), from what I can tell. The dungeon/quest-specific Memento rewards tend to be more-unique, but still would not game-breaking in PvP, from what I can tell.

Here's a run-down:
Almalexia's Lantern memento, summons a ball of light (like the Mage-Light ability from the Mage's Guild skill-line),
Blackfeather Court Whistle memento, you use it on a dead body to summon a flock of crows onto them
Blade of the Blood Oath memento, your character cuts their own hand with a knife and squeezes blood from it (it doesn't actually do damage, it's just an animation)
Box of Forbidden Relics memento, your character kneels onto the ground and performs the Black Sacrament (Dark Brotherhood ritual)
Coin of Illusory Riches memento, a bunch of gold coins fall ontop of your character (from the Thieves Guild)
Discourse Amaranthine memento, summons a vision of the Deadric Prince Herma Mora (the floating eye-ball)
Fetish of Anger memento, turns your character/monitor screen into a red-tint for 30-60 seconds or so (as if you were playing the game and everything was made out of red-coloration)
Finvir's Trinket memento, creates a vertical beam of light through your character (sort of Angelic, like a Halo or spot-light or something)
Fire-Breather's Torches, Juggler's Knives, Sword-Swallower's Blade mementos, are all pretty self-explanatory in that they are animations/emotes doing those said activities. Same with the crown-purchased Storm Orb Juggle and Fiery Orb memento (from Storm and Flame crates, respectively)
Malacath's Wrathful Flame memento, your character goes into a war-cry with a battle-axe in the air, and you get flames summoned behind you (great PvP applications, here)
Twilight Shard memento, your character levitates and summons Azura's Moon and Sun light/hologram for a few seconds

And so on.

Again, I am looking at my current list of 49 Mementos right now, and I don't see any that "damage or snare other players."
Plus, Mudballs from the Jester Event are allowed (the in-game stackable item [not the memento version], the usable/consumable Mudball item "disorients the target for 8 seconds (3-second cooldown)" -straight from the tooltip. Pretty OP in PvP, no?
I have a stack of 200 in my guild's bank.

Darkmage1337

RDMyers65b14_ESO wrote: »

Wow. Some people don't remember the issue that mementos caused? Finvir's was specifically used to troll scroll runs. People complained about the questionable meat bag being used to vomit on the dead... and don't forget that the kopi flower makes one practically invisible... Of course, there was the costume of a skeleton that made people think it was part of the scenery and not an enemy player. Yes, I would like to have the XP bonus things in Cyrodil, but too much abuse of the others means that the use of mementos is gone. Besides, it isn't that bad to hop out of Cyrodil and use the cake, unless you have a queue. Mementos are the LEAST of the issues.

While I am hopeful about the proposed changes for performance, I am truly hoping that campaign locks will become a thing. Too much faction hopping. There were problems before the locks were removed and it has gotten increasingly worse.

I never said that Mementos are more important than the other Cyrodiil issues, nor do I think that they are, either. However, you don't need to create the illusion that better Cyrodiil lag/CPU performance improvements, siege weapon adjustments, more Cyrodiil quests/dailies, and all of the other mentioned things that were mentioned are not necessarily mutually exclusive. Some, if not all, can be independent of each other. Meaning: we can have Cyrodiil lag/CPU performance improvements by ZOS adjusting the server-side passive-ability checks and technical stuff and we can also have siege balance adjustments and we can and also have more/new Cyrodiil quests/activities AND we can also have the Ayelid Well situation fixed and we can also have the Mementos usage back in Cyrodiil again, like we used to.

Each individual adjustment all take differents amounts of time and/or different people to work on them from different departments; and, something like Cyrodiil lag/CPU performance improvements haven taken over the course of 4 years to get worked on and 'fixed' to a playable/tolerable level, whereas Mementos, I'd imagine, would take a few hours or a few days, or few lines of code, so to speak. (In comparison!) Again, no, I am not weighing 'Mementos-usage is more important than X, Y, and Z changes for Cyrodiil.'
@ZOS_BrianWheeler already said that the Cyrodiil CPU/lag performance improvements are coming, siege adjustments are coming, new Cyrodiil quests/activities are coming. So, I merely suggested: "Hey, here are two things that are not currently coming for Cyrodiil this update, nor are they even mentioned to be 'in the works or are even being looked at!'" (Ayleid Well Health Buff issue and Memento usage issue, both in my previous posts.)
I have not seen anyone mention these topics and suggestions anywhere else, and they are both directly Cyrodiil-related things.
We use to be able to use Mementos in Cyrodiil. Now we cannot. We use to have CP-enabled Battlegrounds. Now we do not.
The list goes on. Again, I don't see why we can't have both. ZOS is already making Battlegrounds queues into game-mode specific queues next update (e.g. queue for objective-mode games or deathmatch games, etc.) So we can't we have CP-enabled Battlegrounds again, too? We have CP-enabled Cyrodiil campaigns and CP-disabled Cyrodiil campaigns. We have both, there. But not in BGs.

Again, these topics and issues are not mutually exclusive, so you or anyone else do not need to be defensive, dismissive, or antagonist in replying non-constructive things like "your idea is less important than X, Y, and Z" (or other issues).
We are not comparing and weighing issues here, we are suggesting new ideas and things to be looked at, examined, adjusted, tweaked, etc. And, hopefully implemented in a future update, for the betterment of everyone. Regardless of what gets done first in the workload..

MaxwellC

@ZOS_BrianWheeler
Just wanna say that in my opinion the guards are way too strong with this PTS. The live version is perfect but for resources it seems exceeding difficult for a solo player like myself to take it in a decent time during or before a offensive/defensive event happens at a keep.

Beardimus

@MaxwellC I disagree totally.

What's your strategy? How do you do it. I've been training people in Sotha Sil how to do it which is harder than PTS. You need a plan.

Charge in like its love Vivec pulling all the guards and you make it really hard for yourself.

Great move to make.guards mean something @ZOS_BrianWheeler and I agree one or two more in or on top of the tower would.be good to stop the tower farmers or.give them a headache.

Beardimus

Also @ZOS_BrianWheeler good work on making catapults mean something. I think a summary from you on what siege is meant fir what would help. And address the less used stuff.

I had no idea ballistas were anti siege. I thought it was for rapid fire structure damage and people.

On love everyone buys Pact Ballista and Stone teen for that reason. Give us your view of each type and element type and what its really for, would be great.

Keep up the good work. And don't forget alliance lock at least on quieter campaigns

MaxwellC

@Beardimus
Strategy is to pick off the mage guard from the top and handle the healer below then focus on the rest of the healers since they have less armor (at-least it seems that way).
Sotha sil is a non CP If I recall correctly but to compare that to the PTS is nowhere near accurate especially since they've received a damage increase which almost makes them feel like maxed level resource nodes.

I prefer the current live one as they're something you can take solo at a pretty decent time then move back to capturing the keep. The PTS one feels more time consuming and I feel that would be a issue when trying to support the capture by getting a resource node for a spawn point only to miss out of getting credit towards capping the keep nearby.

geonsocal

so, solo time now in a cp campaign to take a resource (let's say level 3) is about 3 to 4 minutes (depending on the type of build used)...

what would be the approximate time it would take to solo for these new iterations of the resources?