Premade groups are ruining battlegrounds...

wheem_ESO

Yes

idk wrote: »

Besides the poll being pointless outside of the bias OP put into it, why do people complain about premades vs making their own premade?

Seriously. Not trying to be funny. It seems like the best solution. I seriously doubt Zos will give us the opportunity to avoid getting paired against anyone grouped with another player since it would most certainly slow the queues down. Very bad idea for the game.

Because being on either end of pug-stomping is boring and totally devoid of fun. If we actually had premade-vs-premade games to queue for, I'd definitely be willing to join up with others and put together a group-friendly build. But stomping on solo queued players a huge % of the time, with an occasional even'ish matchup is boring, and ruins the other players' fun as well.

Anethum

Yes

actually, should be option in Queue "only solo random queue".
matchmaking doesn't work enouch good.
90% of times when i came bgs in summerset were vs premades.
There mostly were new faces, and its nice, it says that population now good, but premade vs random things isn't challenging.
And as premade u very often nuke randoms, which is not interesting at al if group isn't enouch adequate to not zergball in such case

Baconlad

You can tell it's a premades when you consistently see the same players. Some of them swapping healing duties by swapping toons.

idk

wheem_ESO wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Besides the poll being pointless outside of the bias OP put into it, why do people complain about premades vs making their own premade?

Seriously. Not trying to be funny. It seems like the best solution. I seriously doubt Zos will give us the opportunity to avoid getting paired against anyone grouped with another player since it would most certainly slow the queues down. Very bad idea for the game.

Because being on either end of pug-stomping is boring and totally devoid of fun. If we actually had premade-vs-premade games to queue for, I'd definitely be willing to join up with others and put together a group-friendly build. But stomping on solo queued players a huge % of the time, with an occasional even'ish matchup is boring, and ruins the other players' fun as well.

It is your choice to group or not, but it is very unlikely Zos is going to provide a choice when queuing which would make the queues more restrictive. After all, this is an MMO.

Thogard

No

Anethum wrote: »

actually, should be option in Queue "only random queue".
matchmaking doesn't work enouch good.
90% of times when i came bgs in summerset were vs premades.
There mostly were new faces, and its nice, it says that population now good, but premade vs random things isn't challenging.
And as premade u very often nuke randoms, which is not interesting at al if group isn't enouch adequate to not zergball in such case

I see nothing but vet players when I queue on my stamden.

I see nothing but new players when I solo queue on my brand new Stam sorc.

That’s just how the MMR system is now.

Anethum

Yes

bgs ruined by system, which doesn't allow to choose

hesobad

Yes

Simple solution:

Solo Que for random BGs

Group Que for random BGs

Done. Now pay me ZOS

SouthernSoldjer

No

Can we not get cp back, my pre made group is op either way.

Sylosi

idk wrote: »

After all, this is an MMO.

Well on that basis you wouldn't have four man teams in instanced content, which is basically totally opposed to the core idea of an MMORPG - massively multiplayer set in a persistent world.

SugaComa

No

No there not ...

The truth is premade group who work as a team and are better than you are ruining your game

Take 10 premade groups who understand the way Bags work and put them in pug groups together they'll still wreck you

Some pugs instantly gel as a team cos they know how to work as a team and do it

Others don't so you come here blaming their superior understanding of team work and play rather than looking at your selves and going how can I change to compete

Well first watch how they work as a team secondly watch how your own team is working

Make a change to your style to fit what's missing form yours that they have

This is purely a learn to play thing

Had it in socom yrs ago and proved it has nothing to do with being premade but about skill and fitting into the team dynamic your have

d3adkid

No

Battlegrounds is all about teamwork so it is advisable to make friends then from groups. Other option you have is to enslave some Argonians.

Aliyavana

Yes

Truth is no one wants to be in the receiving end of a premade group. If a team doesn't even want to leave the spawn and the other team has their teammates completely leave its not really fair

wheem_ESO

Yes

d3adkid wrote: »

Battlegrounds is all about teamwork so it is advisable to make friends then from groups. Other option you have is to enslave some Argonians.

Why? So I can spend a huge percentage of my BG time stomping on solo queue'd players that have no chance against my premade? How boring.

I don't understand how the people who keep making these, "Well build your own group!" suggestions don't get that. Being on either end of a pug stomp is not fun. At all.

d3adkid

No

wheem_ESO wrote: »

d3adkid wrote: »

Battlegrounds is all about teamwork so it is advisable to make friends then from groups. Other option you have is to enslave some Argonians.

Why?

Ok. Ill agree with what you say and consider that ZOS gives us a separate matchmaking with people who can strictly queue solo.
1] All the people that queue with you will have the same mentality of not listening to their team mates most of the time.
2] People are gonna queue as tank but come with dps build.
3] Nobody wants to heal others, nobody wants to tank all the time.
4] Infighting will occur after which players will start to leave, leaving 1-2 players on each group at the worst cases or maybe you will be back to where the only person in your group is you.

Why do you want this?

Thestephenmcraeub17_ESO

No

Getting steamrolled by premades is no fun. But if you ban that option, BGs will lose a lot of players. That is worse than having rounds where you get 0 points and humiliated for 10 minutes.

Also, (and I know some people don't think this is a valid point, but they are wrong) JUST MAKE YOUR OWN PREMADE GROUP. You can't throw a rock without hitting a PvP guild in this game, join one, make a group, and fight fire with fire. It's not like it's a resource only available to a select few, anyone can get some players together and run premades in BGs. Some will admittedly be better than others, but you gotta learn somehow.

labambao

No

Most of good players dont play bg since Summerset patch, because they are to tired to wait 2hours que time to play 15 min.

labambao

No

So dont cry about premades. Premades was playing before summerset, not now.

SUNMorph

In my opinion, i would love to wait 30min for an BG if i join as soloplayer not an premadegroup that is owning the BG, atm i wait not long, but 50% of the time people leaving the BGs after 1 min if they see there is an Premade in that BG.

Premades should fight Premades.

Soloplayer BG should fight Soloplayer BG.

yeah, you get maybe people that do not"akt the right way" in Solo BGs then, and the most people whant kill (you see that so often in Capture or Chaosball).

But you get these people now aswell, and you get the Premades that are owning the BG.

In my Opinion, that must be extrem boring for an premade if they have no real enemys in an BG.

Is it not more fun and challanging fight the same premades?

MurderMostFoul

No

I'm going to restate my support for this option:

Maulkin wrote: »

This has been said countless of times. They don't even need 4 queues. Two will do fine:



2 Queues, a small and a large group queue, with solo players falling into both. Trio +1 random is strong enough to take on a Quartet (full premade). And solo players are fine mixing with duos.

This is both easier to implement than MMR and it will cause smaller fragmentation of the relatively small player base than proper MMR would cause.

Under this very simple system, you wouldn't even need separate queues. All folks joining would be auto sorted and all matches would be:

singles/duos v. singles/duos

or

single+trio/quartet v. single+trio/quartet

You could even have MMR operate within these confines to increase match quality further. I know ZOS tried to address the the PUG v. Premade issue with MMR inflation, but the issue remains, causing the vast majority of those matches to be totally noncompetitive. The system outlined above would greatly improve match quality.

Anethum

Yes

I can conclude now, that MMR without separation of random and premade groups doesn't work.
I mean...in queue menu should be "[*] Random only groups" option for those who queue solo, to have a choice for competitive fights for both sides.
@ZOS_JessicaFolsom , @ZOS_GinaBruno Please, at least try. Respect our time please

Strider__Roshin

No

No, magsorcs are ruining BGs since they effortlessly kill steal with Mage's Fury.

VaranisArano

Daus wrote: »

No, magsorcs are ruining BGs since they effortlessly kill steal with Mage's Fury.

Magsorcs ruining BGs with kill stealing since...well, ever since BGs first came out.

Actually lets just make this a Nerf Sorcs complaint in general, since my Stam Sorc also kill steals with Mages Fury

Blaqueflame

No

VaranisArano wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

I wonder how many people think 4 good players are "premades".

As much as people like to think ESO caters to "noobs," the combat is not forgiving at all. The better and more experienced player almost always wins.

4 good players placed together randomly can crush the other teams, but they are unlikely to stay in that group if they continue playing BGs. Many of the complaints I see come from running into the same group of players (so, in a pre-made) over and over again due to the smaller population of battlegrounds. In that situation, it starts to feel like getting farmed at a Cyrodiil resources, but where the only option to walk away is to stop playing BGs for awhile.

Getting crushed once or twice by the random selection of good players on a team happens sometimes, and no doubt some players mistake that for a pre-made group. More problematic, however, is facing the same group of players over and over again where you can make a pretty good assumption that's a pre-made group where there's very little chance for the new or less experienced player to fight back effectively. As you say, the combat is not forgiving. Without the option to avoid that pre-made group they've been failing to beat, the only options are get good or quit playing.

Which is to say, if this were just a problem with players mistaking random selection of good players to be on a team together, we wouldn't expect to see people being beaten by the same group of teammates over and over again, which is a significant problem for Battlegrounds. Even in Cyrodiil, I'll fight the group that's farming PUGs at a resource once or twice, but if I see no chance at victory, I'm not going to through myself at them the 3rd or 4th time without reinforcements. That's be silly because I know the result and I don't enjoy being farmed over and over again. Its not any different for me in BGs. If I'm meeting the same group over and over and I can't beat them, I'm going to take a break (and probably research/practice counters, because "get good" doesn't happen instantly).

Forming a group is terrific fun and a great way to learn cooperative pvp - I am totally stoked for that learning. However, a newly established 4 man grp, with new pvp-ers is in no way "evenly matched" with a power team of 4. I think a ranking system is necessary - with teams needing to fight to move up the ranks, matching against increasingly more challenging players. Many of us want the challenge of improving, but there's little motivation for doing it. if and when you are being obliterated.

When my team is in a position to obliterate others, we generally don't find that a fun match. Fun is fighting people at roughly the same or a little better level, to improve, increase ranks/rewards/and earn the privilege of mastering increasingly challenging fights.

A ranking system for solo and grp play seems sensible.

Also, I completely agree with you that throwing oneself into a clearly unbeatable fight is the epitome of non-strategic. Watching people throw themselves into a wall of red, and dying seconds later, only to endlessly rinse and repeat insults my intelligence. May as well call yourself a cow and sign up for slaughter.

damtotb16_ESO

Yes

I stopped playing premades because I don't need a group of experienced players to back me up plus it felt silly to play premade vs random player who do pvp maybe few weeks. Ah yes I never miss an opportunity to troll whisper team who rolls premade, sorry I just can't help it

tolgeee

Yes

VaranisArano wrote: »

Pre-made groups are exactly who Battlegrounds was made for. You know, those small group players who were previously complaining "We can't get good small-scale PVP in Cyrodiil without getting zerged down!" Those people became the pre-made groups of Battlegrounds where they get to farm random players to their hearts' content without getting zerged down.

I think Battlegrounds needs a better matchmaking system, assuming the population can handle it. Otherwise BGs loses too many players who don't want to be farmed by pre-made groups. In Cyrodiil, you can walk away from a group that's farming you and still do PVP elsewhere. In BGs, the only way to stop getting farmed is to get good or quit playing.

We are not living in the game game like stop guarding this injustice.

SirFearless

Aliyavana wrote: »

Yes, nothing you can really do when your In a pug and the other group is a 4 stack of experienced pvpers.



Truth is no one wants to be in the receiving end of a premade group. If a team doesn't even want to leave the spawn and the other team has their teammates completely leave and one left its not really fair.

i solo queue since i can't find a pvp guild and have won games like that(mostly in under 50s but it has happen in 50+ bgs also)

Drdeath20

Yes

Many people refuse to even try battlegrounds bcz they dont feel like getting wreked by the numerous premade groups that play.

Add options to que's and more people will try the game mode.

NupidStoob

Yes

If playerpop doesn't allow separation of the queues just remove one altogether. Idc if there is only solo or only group, but at least level the playing field. As soon as you run into a group as soloplayer and have the wrong teammates there is nothing you can do. You can't even keep queuing after the match is over as you will run into the same *** until the premade group finally gets tired of it.

jcm2606

Yes

Too few players, so separating groups into their own queue will kill queuing? Great, remove MMR so I don't match against premades endlessly.

Doesn't completely solve the problem, but in doing so I don't have to deal with the endless wrath of premades, the premades can continue to play on, and everybody gets faster queues because match making is basically random. Win, win, win.

VikingBerserker

No

I used to get crushed in lv50 bgs, so i stuck to pre50 bgs where the gear investment and skill lv was lower. The experience I gained there turned me into the killer I am today.