Did CP Removal Improve or Worsen Balance?

Stamicka

I'm seeing a lot of different opinions on CP removal, some say it made balance better and the game more fun, some say it worsened balance. What do you think?

Gilvoth

Balance Improved

much better. absolutely!
i am happy with results so far.

incite

Having cp removed ask for adjustments, not only in your gameplay but most importantly, in your gear setup.

Everyone having trouble in sustaining etc etc, so if no cp campaigns would become a permanent thing, most of us will have to go with diff food/drink, glyphs, traits, sets,..

So atm its hard to say considering most of the cp players wont adjust this cause its only for a week.

Overall, if we did adjust, i reckon the game will be more balanced than with cp, which is pretty logic if you think about it

Toc de Malsvi

What's the Difference?

Matter of perspective.

It changed balance and created issues where there were none, and solved some issues that were there. I don't find as many super invincible targets, yet poisons, procsets, and siege are incredibly powerful at times.

There is definitely more to it than that but in short the balance is different.

Cathexis

Balance Improved

I think the balance is better because there are fewer variables, and this creates a more limited the extreme to which players can stack certain stats, the same way caps did. It also negates the gap between players based on cp levels.

Derra

Balance Got Worse

If you ran mainly in groups of players (not necessarily in your grp) with more than 8 people it improved.

If you ran mainly in groups with less than 4 it unarguably feels way worse if you don´t gank.

Since the majority of people mainly run in or alongside larger groups - most will feel it got improved. The counterplay options smallgrps have when outnumbered are significantly weaker without CP. Zerg on.

Asmael

Balance Got Worse

I can literally just use Heavy attack > Ability on someone and drop him from 100 to 10%. Health is low as ****, people die very easily, resource poisons are a big WTF, costs have been increased since CPs were introduced and balanced around the new CP count. Side consequence of sustain being so bad that people can't really invest anything into tanky sets, so the pure damage / ganking spec will absolutely wreck you down in 2 hits.

I used that double AP week to get a fishing achievement, and met 6 different people. I was using a PvE build with literally no adjustement, so meant for sustained damage. How the hell is that balanced that a non-burst build can burn down people within 3 seconds? Yes, even that dude with 35k+ HP, full impen and heavy armor.

CPs aren't balanced, but having none of those isn't balance either, damage is out of control in both cases, the only difference is that CP campaigns allow you to be able to invest into survivability without your sustain going down the drain.

Mayrael

Balance Improved

Asmael wrote: »

I can literally just use Heavy attack > Ability on someone and drop him from 100 to 10%. Health is low as ****, people die very easily, resource poisons are a big WTF, costs have been increased since CPs were introduced and balanced around the new CP count. Side consequence of sustain being so bad that people can't really invest anything into tanky sets, so the pure damage / ganking spec will absolutely wreck you down in 2 hits.

I used that double AP week to get a fishing achievement, and met 6 different people. I was using a PvE build with literally no adjustement, so meant for sustained damage. How the hell is that balanced that a non-burst build can burn down people within 3 seconds? Yes, even that dude with 35k+ HP, full impen and heavy armor.

CPs aren't balanced, but having none of those isn't balance either, damage is out of control in both cases, the only difference is that CP campaigns allow you to be able to invest into survivability without your sustain going down the drain.

Its because most of the people think that switching food to drinks will do the trick and its all they have to do, to adapt to no CPs. You cant no longer play pure dps build without consequences, you need to invest something into defences. Its not true that surviveability and sustain got worse, I can tank players and never run dry as I used to, although I dont have my dps as high as I used to have. So in general it forces us to sacrifice some of our strenghts to build more balanced toons, you still can build a glass canon but you have to bare the consequences of it (like even tank can get you harmed)

kkravaritieb17_ESO

Balance Improved

My only issue with no cp is the coldfire siege.They are just way too powerful for the minimal effort required to use them. A cold stone treb can almost 1 shot you. And please spare me the wise ass arguments about avoiding the red circles because when you get sieged by 10+ sieges gl with that. Siege needs some adjusting in no cp. In bigger groups you won't completely feel this but smaller groups will definately feel the coldfire sieges.

Turelus

I would say both, it creates new ones whilst solving others.

The problem with them having CP and no CP PvP is trying to balance around both, with CP PvP being harder to balance as there are more variables to look it.

psychotic13

Balance Got Worse

You nerf proc sets cause they were over performing, now they're back at the top of the food chain, and these zergs are out in force

Another thing, expect the economy to be broken everyone is farming millions of AP literally, there's loads of people flipping Nikel and getting like 13k AP a tick.

Expect there to be a lot of gold jewellery bought from the vendor this weekend, along with akaviri pages and anything else people will use to convert there millions of AP to gold

ZoM_Head

Balance Improved

More balanced, more strategic, siege weapons are very deadly once again, vampires taking the full 25% more damage from all fire sources (35% from a mDK with engulfing flames), makes you think twice when you see a group, makes me more...aware and consider options.

Stam builds are a bit more stronger than a magicka build (mainly due to better sustain?) but can be managed.

I am seriously considering switching to Azura on EU for main camp after the even.

lolo_01b16_ESO

Balance Got Worse

By design having cp balances out builds. Damage focussed builds get more sustain and sustain focussed builds get more damage. Additionally the impact of your gear is smaller when you have cp.

However I don't mind those changes as they make me stronger compared to the average player.

Strider_Roshin

Balance Got Worse

Proc sets are very powerful in non-CP, and the destro ult hits harder than it did pre-nerf in a CP campaign. Also non-CP is much more brutal for stam builds.

Methariorn

Balance Got Worse

Proc sets are out of scale without cp. About the massive zerg running 24/7 (tonight I've played until 3am and I saw zergball of 30-40 players at that hour....) I don't know if they just compensate for the no cp or the double ap gain have bring a ton of players in PvP.

Izaki

Balance Got Worse

All the stuff that was way too strong (cost poisons, proc sets, etc.) is so much stronger in non CP, its insane. So basically, removing CP exposed the real problems with balance, but it did not improve it at all.

AJ_1988

At first it was better, like the good old days where siege counters zergs. But now it's just so farming, proxy det spam and the only ulti I see is eye of the storm. It's laggy as hell and had more dropouts today than I had in the last week. Also doesn't help when it's blue vs orange and don't have the pop to provide battle data as it's just always steam rolls.

danno8

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

Proc sets are very powerful in non-CP, and the destro ult hits harder than it did pre-nerf in a CP campaign. Also non-CP is much more brutal for stam builds.

It's also more brutal for magicka builds. Why? Because you get 1 break free and that uses 70% of your stamina. If you have a poison on you, you simply can't break free unless you are at 100% stamina or close to it.

cjthibs

Balance Improved

kkravaritieb17_ESO wrote: »

My only issue with no cp is the coldfire siege.They are just way too powerful for the minimal effort required to use them. A cold stone treb can almost 1 shot you. And please spare me the wise ass arguments about avoiding the red circles because when you get sieged by 10+ sieges gl with that. Siege needs some adjusting in no cp. In bigger groups you won't completely feel this but smaller groups will definately feel the coldfire sieges.

A boulder dropped from the sky that's imbued with daedric magic shouldn't almost 1 shot you...?

cjthibs

Balance Improved

danno8 wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

Proc sets are very powerful in non-CP, and the destro ult hits harder than it did pre-nerf in a CP campaign. Also non-CP is much more brutal for stam builds.

It's also more brutal for magicka builds. Why? Because you get 1 break free and that uses 70% of your stamina. If you have a poison on you, you simply can't break free unless you are at 100% stamina or close to it.

It's more brutal for everyone...both stam and magicka lost their cost reductions and regen cp bonuses.
It's why I don't run all points in one stat pool, got to round out your build if you plan to play non-CP.

DHale

Balance Got Worse

I don't think balance improved but baddies are even worse and die even faster. Every gank..... epic failure incaps for 4 k. Thanks for the ap.

xboxNA corin6

Balance Got Worse

I haven't had much time lately, but last night I logged on and two stam builds tried to gank me off my mount, i got up with 1k HP and turned around and roflstomped both of them in under 20 seconds without ultimates. I only play mag sorc, with the buffs and no CP, I feel pretty overpowered. I don't have any gold gear and I'm running lich WP pirate skeleton with about 1k impen and I've only been playing since November. I know bad players are bad, but still, that 1v2 wasway too easy being that I was completly off guard. No shield or defensive rune.

xboxNA corin6

Balance Got Worse

cjthibs wrote: »

kkravaritieb17_ESO wrote: »

My only issue with no cp is the coldfire siege.They are just way too powerful for the minimal effort required to use them. A cold stone treb can almost 1 shot you. And please spare me the wise ass arguments about avoiding the red circles because when you get sieged by 10+ sieges gl with that. Siege needs some adjusting in no cp. In bigger groups you won't completely feel this but smaller groups will definately feel the coldfire sieges.

A boulder dropped from the sky that's imbued with daedric magic shouldn't almost 1 shot you...?

No because this is a video game, and 1 siege hit shouldn't be an end all when aoes and other players are applying pressure. I can understand 60 or 70% your health pool, but anything over that is ridiculous for a video game.

xboxNA corin6

Balance Got Worse

danno8 wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

Proc sets are very powerful in non-CP, and the destro ult hits harder than it did pre-nerf in a CP campaign. Also non-CP is much more brutal for stam builds.

It's also more brutal for magicka builds. Why? Because you get 1 break free and that uses 70% of your stamina. If you have a poison on you, you simply can't break free unless you are at 100% stamina or close to it.

But this kind of allows for different options within your gear and enchants. You can't just run pure stat/damage anymore, and that's a good thing. More variety in builds, and sets like bloodthorn and amberplasm become more popular instead of lame pure builds that CP promotes.

Durham

Balance Got Worse

Can't really tell ....I have never seen so many zergs running around... I miss my low pop Had.

Lexxypwns

Balance Got Worse

If you voted that balance improved you don't play mDK and likely don't play any stam classes either. There's just no natural regen or cost reduction on MDK so sustain is nuts without CP and puts too much of a tax on you to make a really strong build, in comparison to other mag builds. Stam is rough without the bonus sources of damage and sustain.

Patouf

Balance Got Worse

With no cp campaign there is less options, so we will be all zerged or we will be in a zerg (PU or with guild mates).

I prefer CP campaign, because it is too easy to kill on no cp campaign, one shot build, zerg ulti destro, magicka can not break free easily, stam are dead against one balista.

I prefer the all gameplay witt champion points but there is less lag without.

Artemiisia

Balance Improved

balance is way better now without cp, feels like everyone has a chance on getting kills or being killed

danno8

cjthibs wrote: »

danno8 wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

Proc sets are very powerful in non-CP, and the destro ult hits harder than it did pre-nerf in a CP campaign. Also non-CP is much more brutal for stam builds.

It's also more brutal for magicka builds. Why? Because you get 1 break free and that uses 70% of your stamina. If you have a poison on you, you simply can't break free unless you are at 100% stamina or close to it.

It's more brutal for everyone...both stam and magicka lost their cost reductions and regen cp bonuses.
It's why I don't run all points in one stat pool, got to round out your build if you plan to play non-CP.

Oh I know it's hard for everyone. Which is actually good imo. But we all know you get kills from CC's-->damage. And now that is much easier to pull over on a magicka build than a stamina build.

That is to say magicka build out of stamina is dead, stamina build out of magicka...still ok but just lost one of their utilities.

cjthibs

Balance Improved

xboxNA corin6 wrote: »

cjthibs wrote: »

kkravaritieb17_ESO wrote: »

My only issue with no cp is the coldfire siege.They are just way too powerful for the minimal effort required to use them. A cold stone treb can almost 1 shot you. And please spare me the wise ass arguments about avoiding the red circles because when you get sieged by 10+ sieges gl with that. Siege needs some adjusting in no cp. In bigger groups you won't completely feel this but smaller groups will definately feel the coldfire sieges.

A boulder dropped from the sky that's imbued with daedric magic shouldn't almost 1 shot you...?

No because this is a video game, and 1 siege hit shouldn't be an end all when aoes and other players are applying pressure. I can understand 60 or 70% your health pool, but anything over that is ridiculous for a video game.

You don't have to stand under the enormous boulder dropping on your head ya know...

arkansas_ESO

Balance Improved

Balance improved with the exceptions of a few special cases. I'd probably play in Azura's full time if proc sets, destro ult, and poisons were disabled in the campaign.