New Sorc shields after playing a few hours.

HoloYoitsu

Minalan

HoloYoitsu wrote: »

You must love @wrobel then. He thinks you should stack health and crit, and become a sorc tank!

HoloYoitsu

Minalan wrote: »

HoloYoitsu wrote: »

You must love @wrobel then. He thinks you should stack health and crit, and become a sorc tank!

Yes, and I really love how he moved Block Expertise to "the tanking tree" so that I can now "cast more skills" by being able to "put more points into both block expertise and skill cost reduction".

Such amaze.

Xsorus

ToRelax wrote: »

Killa4hire89 wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Killa4hire89 wrote: »

bardx86 wrote: »

Killa4hire89 wrote: »

Ok, I don't want to come across as ride or crude here but NO CLASS in the game could stack pure offense like a sorc could. For templar and DK (the two classes I play) you are pretty much forced to wear impenetrable to even have a chance at survivability. When you combine the fact that shields were A: a hard counter to any critical hits and B: Shielding sorcs against upwards of 20k magic damage you begin to see the problem.

Sorcs (prior to DB) were able to run 45k plus magic, have around 20kish health and 20k shields. Factor this with 8-10k instant proc frags and 5-7k curse with 5-7k detonation and mages fury it was very possible to one ahot people by stacking damage. Factor in the CP system and sorcs could achieve high enough stam management to where they would never run out of stam.

So we have a class with 20k health, 20k shields that completely prevent crits, and enough potential burst to one shot people.

I feel the duration nerf is a good thing but I would have prefered for ALL shields in game to have scaled with max health. This would make hardened on the same level as blazing and or igneous shield which would make sorcs have the same choice dks and templars have to make.
Damage or survivability.

As far as damage it needs a huge nerf for everything except mag DK. This is an mmo not CoD.

Seriously gonna use a templar as a compare? You can heal dude! In fact a well played Templar prior to DB was impossible to kill although they probably couldn't kill a sorc but now there is now way a sorc can take down a templar and the sorc will get face roled by the templar. Anyhow the duration nerf is horrible way to address this, even tho I don't believe there was even a problem. No other class has to spam 2 spells every 5-6 sec in and out of combat to stay alive. Scaling of health is just stupid, I'm sorry. Nothing on a sorc should scale off health.

Clearly you play no other class. Why should mag DK and magplar be given the choice to either invest health to make their shield worthwhile or have a useless shield. We are seeking balance. Making sorc shield (indeed every shield including healing ward and harness magic) scale with health would give health a better meaning. Also this would reduce damage and while their at it they should give a buff to other weaker shields like igneous, blazing, and bone shield. I don't mind the duration nerf, however I would prefer the health tratment.

Also don't try and say sorc was balanced in last patch. Sorcs could easily tank 5-6 people 28th shields, los, and streak. And during this hypothetical fight, the sorc could do massive stacked damage with curse frag and detonation. This is not balanced.

You don't seem to know your classes any better though. A Templar or DK doesn't need impenetrable. You are also adding together relatively high Sorc stats and call the result OP - if you want to make an argument, provide an actual build or screenshot to make your argument about.
Basing magicka shields on health is still a terrible idea, and I don't really want to write it all down again. There are enough threads about that one, I'm sure. Also, how is the stacked Sorc burst any better then the instant NB burst that you do not see coming? And yeah, if a Sorc could tank 5-6 players, than those players were bad.

Lol you lost all credibility when you said temp or dk don't need impen. You try running a magplar or mag dk without inpen. I'll laugh as I melt you, or better yet when a nb jumps ya.

I also never said sorc stacked dmg was better. I simply pointed out sorcs great stacked dmg to counter someone earlier who made the ridiculous comment that sorcs had the worst dps. That honor falls to mag dk lol.

Personally this is how I see the game. NB should have best burst in game FROM stealth. Sorc should be best burst not from stealth. Both of these classes however should have very limited survivability. Templar and DK should have mediocre dmg but best survivability BY FAR. Instead s orc had one of the best survivability set ups with probably the second best burst in game.

Just my personal opinion.

holosoul wrote: »

Killa4hire89 wrote: »

You SHOULD melt. Invest in impen, try other playstyles other than shield an shield and weeeeeee. If you play glass cannon you should have little mitigation.

Infused/divines on small pieces will give you the equiv of maybe 500 - 800 magicka
if you compare that to 20% crit resist, it's almost an apples and oranges comparison, that screams, "this is the pvp stat"

Do you honestly believe that "most" sorcs don't already run impen? Perhaps the fact that you think that demonstrates exactly how squishy sorc health is.

A sorc, even before this patch, would have to be basically the lowest IQ player on the server to have 0 impen

You guys are pretty arrogant. I run 0 impen and I think I'm doing pretty well with my Sorc. And so do the Templars and DKs without impen in my guild. Seriously, it doesn't help you to question my credibility. We went through that already.

I'm sorry; but the other guy is correct... If you ran zero impen and weren't a sorc last patch you were a damn idiot... I would one shot you 100% of the time before you could even react.

ToRelax

Xsorus wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Killa4hire89 wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Killa4hire89 wrote: »

bardx86 wrote: »

Killa4hire89 wrote: »

Ok, I don't want to come across as ride or crude here but NO CLASS in the game could stack pure offense like a sorc could. For templar and DK (the two classes I play) you are pretty much forced to wear impenetrable to even have a chance at survivability. When you combine the fact that shields were A: a hard counter to any critical hits and B: Shielding sorcs against upwards of 20k magic damage you begin to see the problem.

Sorcs (prior to DB) were able to run 45k plus magic, have around 20kish health and 20k shields. Factor this with 8-10k instant proc frags and 5-7k curse with 5-7k detonation and mages fury it was very possible to one ahot people by stacking damage. Factor in the CP system and sorcs could achieve high enough stam management to where they would never run out of stam.

So we have a class with 20k health, 20k shields that completely prevent crits, and enough potential burst to one shot people.

I feel the duration nerf is a good thing but I would have prefered for ALL shields in game to have scaled with max health. This would make hardened on the same level as blazing and or igneous shield which would make sorcs have the same choice dks and templars have to make.
Damage or survivability.

As far as damage it needs a huge nerf for everything except mag DK. This is an mmo not CoD.

Seriously gonna use a templar as a compare? You can heal dude! In fact a well played Templar prior to DB was impossible to kill although they probably couldn't kill a sorc but now there is now way a sorc can take down a templar and the sorc will get face roled by the templar. Anyhow the duration nerf is horrible way to address this, even tho I don't believe there was even a problem. No other class has to spam 2 spells every 5-6 sec in and out of combat to stay alive. Scaling of health is just stupid, I'm sorry. Nothing on a sorc should scale off health.

Clearly you play no other class. Why should mag DK and magplar be given the choice to either invest health to make their shield worthwhile or have a useless shield. We are seeking balance. Making sorc shield (indeed every shield including healing ward and harness magic) scale with health would give health a better meaning. Also this would reduce damage and while their at it they should give a buff to other weaker shields like igneous, blazing, and bone shield. I don't mind the duration nerf, however I would prefer the health tratment.

Also don't try and say sorc was balanced in last patch. Sorcs could easily tank 5-6 people 28th shields, los, and streak. And during this hypothetical fight, the sorc could do massive stacked damage with curse frag and detonation. This is not balanced.

You don't seem to know your classes any better though. A Templar or DK doesn't need impenetrable. You are also adding together relatively high Sorc stats and call the result OP - if you want to make an argument, provide an actual build or screenshot to make your argument about.
Basing magicka shields on health is still a terrible idea, and I don't really want to write it all down again. There are enough threads about that one, I'm sure. Also, how is the stacked Sorc burst any better then the instant NB burst that you do not see coming? And yeah, if a Sorc could tank 5-6 players, than those players were bad.

Lol you lost all credibility when you said temp or dk don't need impen. You try running a magplar or mag dk without inpen. I'll laugh as I melt you, or better yet when a nb jumps ya.

I also never said sorc stacked dmg was better. I simply pointed out sorcs great stacked dmg to counter someone earlier who made the ridiculous comment that sorcs had the worst dps. That honor falls to mag dk lol.

Personally this is how I see the game. NB should have best burst in game FROM stealth. Sorc should be best burst not from stealth. Both of these classes however should have very limited survivability. Templar and DK should have mediocre dmg but best survivability BY FAR. Instead s orc had one of the best survivability set ups with probably the second best burst in game.

Just my personal opinion.

holosoul wrote: »

Killa4hire89 wrote: »

You SHOULD melt. Invest in impen, try other playstyles other than shield an shield and weeeeeee. If you play glass cannon you should have little mitigation.

Infused/divines on small pieces will give you the equiv of maybe 500 - 800 magicka
if you compare that to 20% crit resist, it's almost an apples and oranges comparison, that screams, "this is the pvp stat"

Do you honestly believe that "most" sorcs don't already run impen? Perhaps the fact that you think that demonstrates exactly how squishy sorc health is.

A sorc, even before this patch, would have to be basically the lowest IQ player on the server to have 0 impen

You guys are pretty arrogant. I run 0 impen and I think I'm doing pretty well with my Sorc. And so do the Templars and DKs without impen in my guild. Seriously, it doesn't help you to question my credibility. We went through that already.

I'm sorry; but the other guy is correct... If you ran zero impen and weren't a sorc last patch you were a damn idiot... I would one shot you 100% of the time before you could even react.

First off, this is about the current update, not the previous one. Secondly, there are not many gankers who would manage to kill any of us, or even get away with it. And lastly, why make the same mistake as the posters I addressed earlier? I'm pretty sure my guildmates are no idiots.

AshTal

I am ok with the shield nerf - granted its not what I would have done I would have just limited the shield to be a % of max health to avoid shield stacking.

What gets me is the insane nerfs the sorc got while getting nothing in return.

1) We have no spamable good damage ability.
2) Our heals are tied to pets which completely suck.
3) Our pets completely suck
4) We have a load of great abilities but none of that really matters in PvP it is about burst damage & bust healing everything is doesn't do much
5) Bolt escape is nerfed to hell, its not like its even an escape with everyone running wrecking blow or teleport strike they just keep up with us only difference is their ability doesn't screw their resources
6) A lot of our abilities are toggled and so take up space on both bars.
7) NB is king in PvP and now we have no real counter to deal with the insane burst damage they kick out from hiding.

Master_Kas

1. Reduce the bolt nerf to 30% ish like dodgeroll Or remove it completly (anyone can spam a gapcloser)

2. Make the bolt teleport you the direction you aim it (like before)

Let sorc be the king of kiting again, it's supposed to be a ranged caster type class when magicka. These changes would make sorc way more fun but one can dream. ^^

My main/mains are two nbs and I still want these changes made. Bolt escape should not be the way it is now.

@DeanTheCat Don't hate me I miss bolting around sometimes.

Francescolg

Minalan wrote: »

Templar can heal up more damage than one player can dish out. Often more than two or three can. Balance. 45K health. Full impen. Capped armor and resist. Jesus beam spam left and right, after you're already on the ground. F*** you @wrobel

First of all, we don't need flamers in ESO, you should learn to watch your mouth in the internet.. About Wroebel, I agree, that another job would suit him more. I say so because of the Sorc class, and that so many OP things remained untouched for such a long time..

The Templar you met, that could have been me, and it is good that you mention this spec, as by doing so, you give me the chance to rectify your point.. And your total lack of knowledge about Templars!

NOT ALL TEMPLARS CAN HEAL THEMSELVES WITH JUST ONE CLICK!

To get an 8-9k absorb shield as a Templar,
I have to put 50k points in health!

Instead, a Sorc with 50 k in magicka (or similar with spell dmg), will get a Hardened Ward for the DOUBLE absorb value, somewhere around 15k dmg absorb.

A Templar with so many HP WILL NEVER be able to heal more damage than an average NB/Sorc build can dish out and his Jesus beam will be a basic dmg beam. Except he runs only HP+spell dmg+magicka but that would be a handicap, because such a build would have no regeneration, stamina, etc.., at all.

The reason, why you can't kill such a build, is not the class (!!!!) but the combination of a) giving up everything else to reach 50k HP, in order to b) get a tiny tiny 8k absorb shield, WHICH is STILL just 50 % of a Sorc shield, and, by doing so, you give up everything else!! (that is why he plays in a group..) While you Sorc, with the 80% better shield, can still proc a CF on every single shield recast.

The Templar, instead, will not be able to heal, nor to do enough dmg by one single skill because he put everything in health points..

Come on, dude! First play the other classes, and then come back to the forums to discuss, when you've enough experience with that specific Templar build..

Derra

holosoul wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

[
You guys are pretty arrogant. I run 0 impen and I think I'm doing pretty well with my Sorc. And so do the Templars and DKs without impen in my guild. Seriously, it doesn't help you to question my credibility. We went through that already.

That's nice, enjoy your 1k magicka?

"Idk what i´m talking about" is all your statement tells people.

Xsorus wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Killa4hire89 wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Killa4hire89 wrote: »

bardx86 wrote: »

Killa4hire89 wrote: »

Ok, I don't want to come across as ride or crude here but NO CLASS in the game could stack pure offense like a sorc could. For templar and DK (the two classes I play) you are pretty much forced to wear impenetrable to even have a chance at survivability. When you combine the fact that shields were A: a hard counter to any critical hits and B: Shielding sorcs against upwards of 20k magic damage you begin to see the problem.

Sorcs (prior to DB) were able to run 45k plus magic, have around 20kish health and 20k shields. Factor this with 8-10k instant proc frags and 5-7k curse with 5-7k detonation and mages fury it was very possible to one ahot people by stacking damage. Factor in the CP system and sorcs could achieve high enough stam management to where they would never run out of stam.

So we have a class with 20k health, 20k shields that completely prevent crits, and enough potential burst to one shot people.

I feel the duration nerf is a good thing but I would have prefered for ALL shields in game to have scaled with max health. This would make hardened on the same level as blazing and or igneous shield which would make sorcs have the same choice dks and templars have to make.
Damage or survivability.

As far as damage it needs a huge nerf for everything except mag DK. This is an mmo not CoD.

Seriously gonna use a templar as a compare? You can heal dude! In fact a well played Templar prior to DB was impossible to kill although they probably couldn't kill a sorc but now there is now way a sorc can take down a templar and the sorc will get face roled by the templar. Anyhow the duration nerf is horrible way to address this, even tho I don't believe there was even a problem. No other class has to spam 2 spells every 5-6 sec in and out of combat to stay alive. Scaling of health is just stupid, I'm sorry. Nothing on a sorc should scale off health.

Clearly you play no other class. Why should mag DK and magplar be given the choice to either invest health to make their shield worthwhile or have a useless shield. We are seeking balance. Making sorc shield (indeed every shield including healing ward and harness magic) scale with health would give health a better meaning. Also this would reduce damage and while their at it they should give a buff to other weaker shields like igneous, blazing, and bone shield. I don't mind the duration nerf, however I would prefer the health tratment.

Also don't try and say sorc was balanced in last patch. Sorcs could easily tank 5-6 people 28th shields, los, and streak. And during this hypothetical fight, the sorc could do massive stacked damage with curse frag and detonation. This is not balanced.

You don't seem to know your classes any better though. A Templar or DK doesn't need impenetrable. You are also adding together relatively high Sorc stats and call the result OP - if you want to make an argument, provide an actual build or screenshot to make your argument about.
Basing magicka shields on health is still a terrible idea, and I don't really want to write it all down again. There are enough threads about that one, I'm sure. Also, how is the stacked Sorc burst any better then the instant NB burst that you do not see coming? And yeah, if a Sorc could tank 5-6 players, than those players were bad.

Lol you lost all credibility when you said temp or dk don't need impen. You try running a magplar or mag dk without inpen. I'll laugh as I melt you, or better yet when a nb jumps ya.

I also never said sorc stacked dmg was better. I simply pointed out sorcs great stacked dmg to counter someone earlier who made the ridiculous comment that sorcs had the worst dps. That honor falls to mag dk lol.

Personally this is how I see the game. NB should have best burst in game FROM stealth. Sorc should be best burst not from stealth. Both of these classes however should have very limited survivability. Templar and DK should have mediocre dmg but best survivability BY FAR. Instead s orc had one of the best survivability set ups with probably the second best burst in game.

Just my personal opinion.

holosoul wrote: »

Killa4hire89 wrote: »

You SHOULD melt. Invest in impen, try other playstyles other than shield an shield and weeeeeee. If you play glass cannon you should have little mitigation.

Infused/divines on small pieces will give you the equiv of maybe 500 - 800 magicka
if you compare that to 20% crit resist, it's almost an apples and oranges comparison, that screams, "this is the pvp stat"

Do you honestly believe that "most" sorcs don't already run impen? Perhaps the fact that you think that demonstrates exactly how squishy sorc health is.

A sorc, even before this patch, would have to be basically the lowest IQ player on the server to have 0 impen

You guys are pretty arrogant. I run 0 impen and I think I'm doing pretty well with my Sorc. And so do the Templars and DKs without impen in my guild. Seriously, it doesn't help you to question my credibility. We went through that already.

I'm sorry; but the other guy is correct... If you ran zero impen and weren't a sorc last patch you were a damn idiot... I would one shot you 100% of the time before you could even react.

Anyone who played 1.6 extensively has no need for impen on magica builds currently and not in TG.

You could survive higher dmg back then and you can survive without impen now just fine. It´s somewhat different on stam builds.

holosoul

Derra wrote: »

holosoul wrote: »

That's nice, enjoy your 1k magicka?

"Idk what i´m talking about" is all your statement tells people.

On a gold v16 item a base enchant is 868 magicka (on large pieces)
There are only 3 large pieces, but let's pretend all 7 pieces are large.

7 large pieces * 868 = 6,076 magicka
6,076 * 1.2 (all 7 LARGE infused) = 7,291

So even if you could wear 7 large pieces, 7 infused would still only give you 1,215 magicka

Good day to you sir.

milesrodneymcneely2_ESO

Sandman929 wrote: »

Damage is absolutely out of control in this game, and ZOS just keeps swinging the pendulum back and forth between magicka damage and stamina damage. There's no incentive at all for mitigation at the moment, no reason to invest a single attribute point into health or armor because it doesn't buy you anything but a fraction of a second longer to survive.

Soft caps.

Master_Kas

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom any chance we'll see streak adjusted? Or change the name of the skill to "try to outrun critrush" atleast, because you aren't escaping anything currently.