Shield breaker set/ Shield stacking

Asmael

I'm killing sorcerers on my magicka DK (so I have to burst thru Hardened + Harness) and don't even have Proxy det unlocked. Granted, this is not easy, and requires pretty good timing and constant pressure, but it's very doable.

If you need Shield breaker on a stamina build to kill a sorc, you either:
1) Are a tank / Low damage build
2) Are doing something really wrong

...Simply because you have only one shield (Hardened ward) to break to damage your opponent's health.

I don't even know why shield breaker came out for stamina builds, since the issue was the stacking of hardened / harness that made sorcs pretty much unkillable by a single magicka build. No matter how I look at this set, it feels like poor design

One thing is sure, as long as we're in this "DPS / burst only" meta, shields need to be as strong as they currently are (even more for %health based ones), because of how strong stamina burst currently is. Good thing is, a revamp to CPs is coming with, maybe, a physical resistance star or equivalent.

As for the comments saying "it's only sorcs", my mag DK haz a resto staff saying "healing ward" on it, so, no, it's not just sorcs.

"Shield spamming is the issue", no, infinite resources that allow infinite shield spamming is the issue.

Alorier

Don't see what the problem is do you see Night blades crying over detection pots nope it's part of the game learn how to deal with it

Didgerion

The shield breaker and shield stacking fix is simple.
Make shields crit-able and let shield breaker guarantee 100% crit chance on shields instead of hitting the life directly.

bardx86

davidtxr wrote: »

Don't see what the problem is do you see Night blades crying over detection pots nope it's part of the game learn how to deal with it

how much damage do detection pots do again? NB's still have fear, vigor, rapid movement.

bardx86

avid_mdb16_ESO wrote: »

The shield breaker and shield stacking fix is simple.
Make shields crit-able and let shield breaker guarantee 100% crit chance on shields instead of hitting the life directly.

Shields would have to be increased in strength then.

bardx86

bardx86 wrote: »

davidtxr wrote: »

Don't see what the problem is do you see Night blades crying over detection pots nope it's part of the game learn how to deal with it

how much damage do detection pots do again? NB's still have fear, vigor, dodge roll, block, passive dodge, rapid movement.

olsborg

Wouldnt need shiedbreaker if shields wasnt stackable, beating through hardward and healward and other shields that stack with eachtother is BS.

Brrrofski

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

How about no. I use shield breaker and shield users are still hard to kill cause once they realize there is a shield breaker user they run away or immediately gun down the shield breaker user. Shield breaker is not OP at all an extremely laughably easy to counter cause after all it only work with light and heavy attacks and bow light attacks only go so fast and go so far. Most skills in the game have father range than bow light attacks.

But if you're still against shield breaker and want different options than another one is shields become part of the major/minor were shields from skills are major shields and of course give bigger ones while shields from sets and enchantments are minor shields and not so powerful and like all major/minor skills you can have one major shield and one minor shield on at once.

Honestly, as a Stam build if you have trouble taking out shields your build just ain't good enough.

The irony is, it magica users who needs shield breaker, not stam. The real problem occurs with harness magica stacking with conjured ward. It's real challenge taking out a sorc using both as a magica build.

I've been killed by shieldbreaker on a Stam nightblade. Dk cast igneous shield near me. I go down in an instant. 5 x shieldbreaker. Really?

I don't think it should work with a bow. Spamming one button from 20+ metres to get 10k+ damage in 5 seconds. Do people really think that's balance? Melee is fine. There's a risk involved. But you got these people standing at the back of group just spamming one button. It's ridiculous.

Glad I don't feel the need to use a crutch set. I run my stam builds without training wheels. I put time and effort into my build. I worked out stats, gear and solid skill rotations. That kills sorcs fine on my stamblade, stam Dk and stam Sorc.

Brrrofski

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Increase strength of shields, make shields take crit damage, and have shield breaker do like 4k extra damage to shields. Also, make it so shields have to be completely gone before they can be reapplied.
.

This would be a much more balanced option. Shield breaker should do additional damage to shields. The set should be called shield ignorer currently.

Shields should take crit damage anyway, regardless of set. Shield breaker should mean your attacks do more damage. Either a set amount or %.

I mean there counters to it one on one. Run combat prayer instead of healing ward, stop shielding, pressure and put them on the defensive. When you're fighting multiple enemies and you got someone with a bow just sneaking and spamming light attack, you got no chance. That isn't balance.

Also, harness magica and conjured ward need to stop stacking. I say that as someone who plays as a sorc and against sorcs.

Kahen40k

https://youtube.com/watch?v=CsbbEPmfxzI

LizardThixvim

I want shield breaker to do damage to my actual shield breaking my shield, not killing my health i also want shields to not stack, and its frustrating putting 153 days of gameplay into my sorc i played since beginning of eso release, and perfected a build where i need only conjured ward and healing ward, no idea how people can have 3-4 shields on their bar, there simply isnt enough room, but even with all that experience and gameplay, and getting to know my character and class, all someone needs to do is spam light attack to kill me, is bs to be honest, if the set actually broke my shield, spamming light attack takes your shield off but then with no shield nothing happens, is how the set should work, then i wouldnt care about the set at all, the fact you die from using a shield because a guy spammed light attack is stupid.

Casual player who got the game 2 days ago using shield breaker > sorc who has played since release

Tankqull

acw37162 wrote: »

You left out the information that even if someone is tagging you with shield breaker you can streak away and have a morph of streak that eats projectiles.

You also left out that the stamina build who is hitting you with 13 K uppercuts, can't crit your 25 K worth of shields, is improbable to weave a heavy or light into wreking blow as its a channel and you loose empower on the light attack and they burned there entire 30 K stamina pool to chase you down after 4 streaks and you still have magica left to shield up and proc a frag.

I'm not feeling a ton of sympathy for the magica sorcs they are one of the most tanky, hardest hitting, and most mobile classes in the game.

Your only hard counter is one set of gear not everyone has or a Zerg catching you low on magica.

aehm BoL only protects from projectiles using mana to be fired... (+ overload)

Shield breaker procs from light AND heavy attacks and you are not facing a 25k shield only a 9-11k in 99% of the cases.

burned your stamina? after 4 streaks? i did not spend any stamina while chasing a streaking sorc as any gap closer costs me less than my stam reg provides...

that is at least true...

every stam user not using is is simply a moron - there are way to much shields in pvp willingly or passivly applied by the cp system to not use it as one proc equalized 10 hundings empowered attacks - in average i have had since its implemntation 3 procs per fight make out of it what ever you want...
but insisting it to be subpar set is nothing but purely moronic.

timidobserver

Asmael wrote: »

I'm killing sorcerers on my magicka DK (so I have to burst thru Hardened + Harness) and don't even have Proxy det unlocked. Granted, this is not easy, and requires pretty good timing and constant pressure, but it's very doable.

If you need Shield breaker on a stamina build to kill a sorc, you either:
1) Are a tank / Low damage build
2) Are doing something really wrong

...Simply because you have only one shield (Hardened ward) to break to damage your opponent's health.

I don't even know why shield breaker came out for stamina builds, since the issue was the stacking of hardened / harness that made sorcs pretty much unkillable by a single magicka build. No matter how I look at this set, it feels like poor design

One thing is sure, as long as we're in this "DPS / burst only" meta, shields need to be as strong as they currently are (even more for %health based ones), because of how strong stamina burst currently is. Good thing is, a revamp to CPs is coming with, maybe, a physical resistance star or equivalent.

As for the comments saying "it's only sorcs", my mag DK haz a resto staff saying "healing ward" on it, so, no, it's not just sorcs.

"Shield spamming is the issue", no, infinite resources that allow infinite shield spamming is the issue.

There is a difference between having access to a single decent shield on your off bar running a build that entirely relies on having massive shields up 100% of the time. Obviously, the build(mainly Sorcs ATM) aiming to have massive shields up 100% of the time is going to have more of an issue with shield-breaker.

Kahen40k

Casts_Many_Storms wrote: »

I want shield breaker to do damage to my actual shield breaking my shield, not killing my health i also want shields to not stack, and its frustrating putting 153 days of gameplay into my sorc i played since beginning of eso release, and perfected a build where i need only conjured ward and healing ward, no idea how people can have 3-4 shields on their bar, there simply isnt enough room, but even with all that experience and gameplay, and getting to know my character and class, all someone needs to do is spam light attack to kill me, is bs to be honest, if the set actually broke my shield, spamming light attack takes your shield off but then with no shield nothing happens, is how the set should work, then i wouldnt care about the set at all, the fact you die from using a shield because a guy spammed light attack is stupid.

Casual player who got the game 2 days ago using shield breaker > sorc who has played since release

153 days of sorc, which i assume is your main char, and you get killed by random spamming light attack? I don't want to be rude m8, but maybe you should consider focusing to pve.....

On side note, can somebody explain how exactly do you get overwelmed by a shield breaker user? Maybe i'm very unlucky when i pick my opponents, but every time i used it and faced a competent sorc, it never make any difference.

I played a few times sorc in pvp as well (and i'm a pretty bad one), but honestly i never found it to be an issue and all good sorc that i know laugh about it, so i don't get how ppl can complain, even if you clai to be so experienced.

Brrrofski

Kahen40k wrote: »

Casts_Many_Storms wrote: »

I want shield breaker to do damage to my actual shield breaking my shield, not killing my health i also want shields to not stack, and its frustrating putting 153 days of gameplay into my sorc i played since beginning of eso release, and perfected a build where i need only conjured ward and healing ward, no idea how people can have 3-4 shields on their bar, there simply isnt enough room, but even with all that experience and gameplay, and getting to know my character and class, all someone needs to do is spam light attack to kill me, is bs to be honest, if the set actually broke my shield, spamming light attack takes your shield off but then with no shield nothing happens, is how the set should work, then i wouldnt care about the set at all, the fact you die from using a shield because a guy spammed light attack is stupid.

Casual player who got the game 2 days ago using shield breaker > sorc who has played since release

153 days of sorc, which i assume is your main char, and you get killed by random spamming light attack? I don't want to be rude m8, but maybe you should consider focusing to pve.....

On side note, can somebody explain how exactly do you get overwelmed by a shield breaker user? Maybe i'm very unlucky when i pick my opponents, but every time i used it and faced a competent sorc, it never make any difference.

I played a few times sorc in pvp as well (and i'm a pretty bad one), but honestly i never found it to be an issue and all good sorc that i know laugh about it, so i don't get how ppl can complain, even if you clai to be so experienced.

It's group play. They hang around at the back of the group spamming bow light attacks.

That's where I find it an issue. One on one it's fine.

Ezareth

Casts_Many_Storms wrote: »

Hello, sorry for long paragraph ;p

I have played Magicka Sorcerer since the beginning of game launch, but shield breaker destroys the whole Gameplay of playing any magicka build, the set was probably intended to counter shield stacking, which I agree with I hate shield stacking, I use 2 shield, healing ward, and conjured ward, which is now a death risk with shield breaker, so I tried replacing healing ward with other healing, blessing of restoration, healing springs, mutagen, dark deal, all of which are too insignificant to heal a guy spamming shield breaker at you, and if you don't use a shield you die, as stamina builds can hit you with a 13k+ uppercut, baring in mind, I am wearing, 1 heavy chest, medium pants, all rest light armor, for the undaunted passives, and to maximise defence, if I try use a shield to mitigate some of the damage they spam light attacks killing you in seconds, using shield breaker, bow with decrease health enchant, dealing additional 500+ unresistable damage to you. It doesn't just affect Sorcerer, magicka dk I use igneous shield to boost healing of blessing of restoration I die from shield breaker, Templar use radiant ward or sun shield die from shield breaker, magicka Night Blade healing ward to heal die from shield breaker, magicka sorc die from shield breaker.

Now is there anything that is planned for this set?

1) Add a cool down timer to the shield breaker, making it only hit you with a shield every 6 seconds or so.

2) Remove shield breaker completely and find an alternative option to shield stacking problem.

3) Remove shield breaker, and for damage shields why not add an option that only your strongest shield applies, for example if you have healing ward giving 7k shield, light armor skill giving 5k shield, and conjured ward giving 11k shield, then if you use all 3, you get the damage shield from conjured ward, get healing from healing ward (but no damage shield), and light armor skill you absorb magicka (but no damage shield) would solve a lot of shield stacking problems and there would be no need for shield breaker to exist anymore.

They are just some ideas to make the game more balanced and skill based and not have easy options to kill magicka builds by spamming light attack.

Thanks

@brianwheeler

@Wrobel

@GinaBruno

If some trashcan starts spamming you with shield breaker light attacks just do what I do.

Fire up overload with Crit surge and degeneration and 2-shot them and be sure to throw a couple of dodge rolls in while you're closing on them.

As a 5 piece bonus Shield breaker is terrible compared to 5 piece hundings.

I know this set may be difficult to counter for many newer or unskilled players but the best defense is always a good offense. If you're the one doing the damage instead then that 5 pc bonus has zero effect. The set is only dangerous when you let them keep spamming you with it while ignoring them, or letting them hit you while you're running away. Wrobel ensured that Sorcs have zero chance to escape any stamina build now so it is kill or be killed. Be sure and get a couple teabags on their corpse before moving on to their buddies.

Ezareth

acw37162 wrote: »

You left out the information that even if someone is tagging you with shield breaker you can streak away and have a morph of streak that eats projectiles.

You also left out that the stamina build who is hitting you with 13 K uppercuts, can't crit your 25 K worth of shields, is improbable to weave a heavy or light into wreking blow as its a channel and you loose empower on the light attack and they burned there entire 30 K stamina pool to chase you down after 4 streaks and you still have magica left to shield up and proc a frag.

I'm not feeling a ton of sympathy for the magica sorcs they are one of the most tanky, hardest hitting, and most mobile classes in the game.

Your only hard counter is one set of gear not everyone has or a Zerg catching you low on magica.

Except Ball of Lightning only absorbs magick projectiles.

Except every *skilled* player in the game who uses wrecking blow weaves light or heavy/medium attacks with the 2 hander already.

Except no stamina player loses anywhere close to the amount of stamina sprinting after a sorc as the sorc loses magicka for casting 4 bolt escapes in a row.

Magicka sorcs are only the now the 3rd LEAST mobile class in the game, ahead of magicka DKs and magicka Templar. There isn't a stamina build that is less mobile and a magicka NB can move further and faster for longer than any Sorc....while stealthed.

Peel_Ya_Cap_517

I have both a magicka sorc and a stam nightblade..

With my nightblade, it is damn near impossible to kill a shield-stacking sorc and although I don't use Shield Breaker, I think it is totally justified in its existence. I think maybe it could use just a two-second cooldown or something.

Brrrofski

Peel_Ya_Cap_517 wrote: »

I have both a magicka sorc and a stam nightblade..

With my nightblade, it is damn near impossible to kill a shield-stacking sorc and although I don't use Shield Breaker, I think it is totally justified in its existence. I think maybe it could use just a two-second cooldown or something.

No, it's really not. You either have a bad build or bad rotation. Sorry, but it's ture.

Spambush - suprise attack with light attack weave - fear - soul harvest - (maybe another suprise attack) - light atrack - executioner.

3-5 seconds burst. With the right stats a sorc might not even get shield back up. You really shouldn't have a problem with sorcs.

Stamblades yave no place to QQ about anything. My stam Nb at vet 4 is an absolute monster. It's not even fair playing it

"shield stacking sorc" means TWO if you're a Stam build. One of which is not very big at all

Peel_Ya_Cap_517

Brrrofski wrote: »

Peel_Ya_Cap_517 wrote: »

I have both a magicka sorc and a stam nightblade..

With my nightblade, it is damn near impossible to kill a shield-stacking sorc and although I don't use Shield Breaker, I think it is totally justified in its existence. I think maybe it could use just a two-second cooldown or something.

No, it's really not. You either have a bad build or bad rotation. Sorry, but it's ture.

Spambush - suprise attack with light attack weave - fear - soul harvest - (maybe another suprise attack) - light atrack - executioner.

3-5 seconds burst. With the right stats a sorc might not even get shield back up. You really shouldn't have a problem with sorcs.

Stamblades yave no place to QQ about anything. My stam Nb at vet 4 is an absolute monster. It's not even fair playing it

You're battle-leveled lol ^^^

LizardThixvim

Kahen40k wrote: »

Casts_Many_Storms wrote: »

I want shield breaker to do damage to my actual shield breaking my shield, not killing my health i also want shields to not stack, and its frustrating putting 153 days of gameplay into my sorc i played since beginning of eso release, and perfected a build where i need only conjured ward and healing ward, no idea how people can have 3-4 shields on their bar, there simply isnt enough room, but even with all that experience and gameplay, and getting to know my character and class, all someone needs to do is spam light attack to kill me, is bs to be honest, if the set actually broke my shield, spamming light attack takes your shield off but then with no shield nothing happens, is how the set should work, then i wouldnt care about the set at all, the fact you die from using a shield because a guy spammed light attack is stupid.

Casual player who got the game 2 days ago using shield breaker > sorc who has played since release

153 days of sorc, which i assume is your main char, and you get killed by random spamming light attack? I don't want to be rude m8, but maybe you should consider focusing to pve.....

On side note, can somebody explain how exactly do you get overwelmed by a shield breaker user? Maybe i'm very unlucky when i pick my opponents, but every time i used it and faced a competent sorc, it never make any difference.

I played a few times sorc in pvp as well (and i'm a pretty bad one), but honestly i never found it to be an issue and all good sorc that i know laugh about it, so i don't get how ppl can complain, even if you clai to be so experienced.

Its the ones who hide, in a group and spam weighted bow light attacks at you from a distance, the melee guys, and single 1v1 is no problem

Brrrofski

Peel_Ya_Cap_517 wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Peel_Ya_Cap_517 wrote: »

I have both a magicka sorc and a stam nightblade..

With my nightblade, it is damn near impossible to kill a shield-stacking sorc and although I don't use Shield Breaker, I think it is totally justified in its existence. I think maybe it could use just a two-second cooldown or something.

No, it's really not. You either have a bad build or bad rotation. Sorry, but it's ture.

Spambush - suprise attack with light attack weave - fear - soul harvest - (maybe another suprise attack) - light atrack - executioner.

3-5 seconds burst. With the right stats a sorc might not even get shield back up. You really shouldn't have a problem with sorcs.

Stamblades yave no place to QQ about anything. My stam Nb at vet 4 is an absolute monster. It's not even fair playing it

You're battle-leveled lol ^^^

Yeh, to vet 15. Which makes it almost as good as 16. So at 16, it'll be stronger. What's your point?

LizardThixvim

Peel_Ya_Cap_517 wrote: »

I have both a magicka sorc and a stam nightblade..

With my nightblade, it is damn near impossible to kill a shield-stacking sorc and although I don't use Shield Breaker, I think it is totally justified in its existence. I think maybe it could use just a two-second cooldown or something.

Its a set that is needed I much agree, while the current meta is stacking shields, if they change shields to be like older shields, then shield breaker was never needed, but as the game is now, shield breaker is needed, but its overkill atm, i wouldn't care about it if it broke my shield and not my health bar.

Tankqull

Peel_Ya_Cap_517 wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Peel_Ya_Cap_517 wrote: »

I have both a magicka sorc and a stam nightblade..

With my nightblade, it is damn near impossible to kill a shield-stacking sorc and although I don't use Shield Breaker, I think it is totally justified in its existence. I think maybe it could use just a two-second cooldown or something.

No, it's really not. You either have a bad build or bad rotation. Sorry, but it's ture.

Spambush - suprise attack with light attack weave - fear - soul harvest - (maybe another suprise attack) - light atrack - executioner.

3-5 seconds burst. With the right stats a sorc might not even get shield back up. You really shouldn't have a problem with sorcs.

Stamblades yave no place to QQ about anything. My stam Nb at vet 4 is an absolute monster. It's not even fair playing it

You're battle-leveled lol ^^^

i´m a v16 stam-NB and sorcs are not a problem at all - beside the few top of the pop sorcs. if you have problems its entirely your problem and not the shields of a sorc.

Peel_Ya_Cap_517

Brrrofski wrote: »

Peel_Ya_Cap_517 wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Peel_Ya_Cap_517 wrote: »

I have both a magicka sorc and a stam nightblade..

With my nightblade, it is damn near impossible to kill a shield-stacking sorc and although I don't use Shield Breaker, I think it is totally justified in its existence. I think maybe it could use just a two-second cooldown or something.

No, it's really not. You either have a bad build or bad rotation. Sorry, but it's ture.

Spambush - suprise attack with light attack weave - fear - soul harvest - (maybe another suprise attack) - light atrack - executioner.

3-5 seconds burst. With the right stats a sorc might not even get shield back up. You really shouldn't have a problem with sorcs.

Stamblades yave no place to QQ about anything. My stam Nb at vet 4 is an absolute monster. It's not even fair playing it

You're battle-leveled lol ^^^

Yeh, to vet 15. Which makes it almost as good as 16. So at 16, it'll be stronger. What's your point?

The point is, once you lose that extra free health at v16, you will not be able to stand toe-to-toe with a good Sorc

Come back when you're there

LizardThixvim

Many "skilled" players on at least EU PC server have learned to weave, light attacks in between the uppercut (wrecking blow) animation cancelling, same with NB concealed weapon.

Alorier

Happily running though eso forums spamming light attack on my bow

Peel_Ya_Cap_517

Tankqull wrote: »

Peel_Ya_Cap_517 wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Peel_Ya_Cap_517 wrote: »

I have both a magicka sorc and a stam nightblade..

With my nightblade, it is damn near impossible to kill a shield-stacking sorc and although I don't use Shield Breaker, I think it is totally justified in its existence. I think maybe it could use just a two-second cooldown or something.

No, it's really not. You either have a bad build or bad rotation. Sorry, but it's ture.

Spambush - suprise attack with light attack weave - fear - soul harvest - (maybe another suprise attack) - light atrack - executioner.

3-5 seconds burst. With the right stats a sorc might not even get shield back up. You really shouldn't have a problem with sorcs.

Stamblades yave no place to QQ about anything. My stam Nb at vet 4 is an absolute monster. It's not even fair playing it

You're battle-leveled lol ^^^

i´m a v16 stam-NB and sorcs are not a problem at all - beside the few top of the pop sorcs. if you have problems its entirely your problem and not the shields of a sorc.

***

On my Sorc I never get killed by nightblades. I don't even use any detects, just put on shields and wait for them to Ambush me. I also very, very rarely see "Shield Breaker" in my death log, so I think this "problem" is way over-stated.

Brrrofski

Peel_Ya_Cap_517 wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Peel_Ya_Cap_517 wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Peel_Ya_Cap_517 wrote: »

I have both a magicka sorc and a stam nightblade..

With my nightblade, it is damn near impossible to kill a shield-stacking sorc and although I don't use Shield Breaker, I think it is totally justified in its existence. I think maybe it could use just a two-second cooldown or something.

No, it's really not. You either have a bad build or bad rotation. Sorry, but it's ture.

Spambush - suprise attack with light attack weave - fear - soul harvest - (maybe another suprise attack) - light atrack - executioner.

3-5 seconds burst. With the right stats a sorc might not even get shield back up. You really shouldn't have a problem with sorcs.

Stamblades yave no place to QQ about anything. My stam Nb at vet 4 is an absolute monster. It's not even fair playing it

You're battle-leveled lol ^^^

Yeh, to vet 15. Which makes it almost as good as 16. So at 16, it'll be stronger. What's your point?

The point is, once you lose that extra free health at v16, you will not be able to stand toe-to-toe with a good Sorc

Come back when you're there

You do realise that you don't get extra health right?

Battle levelling has changed, it amplifies your stats to what they would be at vet 15.

So I'll have the same health, same stam, same stam regen, same everything. Oh, apart from and extra spell damage from 3 piece agility. I'll be even stronger. No wonder you can't kill a sorc on the most op burst damage class, you don't understand the game.

I have vr16s who I pvp with and do just fine. My stam DK and magica NB are 16 and do fine against sorcs.

Come back when you understand how the game works and figure out how to burst 25k damage on a stamblade lol

Ankael07

Fairly easy to outdamage 2150 dmg in 1v1 against a nb.I just pop a detect potion with spell damage and try to burst them down before they realize Im experienced against shield breaker.Dk's and their reflective scales on the other hand is a nuisance for me currently