XP gain in PVP is going to pale to PVE

cozmon3c_ESO

XP gain in PVP is going to pale to PVE
Always has, and this needs to change. we need to be equally rewarded for doing things players like to do. right now its, lets find and awesome grind spot, woohoo fun!!!! lol.

What do pvp players like doing in pvp, well i think its safe to say we like to kill people, and yet we are barely rewarded for that, hell ive been playing a year and when 1.6 comes out ill only have 65 champion points to spend, lol. that shows the crazy disparity there, i guarantee all pve players have there 70 champion points at the start.

Fix
-Give more xp per player kill
-Give more xp for quests in cyrodiil based on pvping.
-give us more daily quests for pvping along side the kill quests board, spread out between the gates. like for example (kill 20 players higher ranked then you). (kill 20 players lower ranked then you). (kill 20 players higher champion level then you) (kill 20 people lower champion rank then you). (kill 200 players). (Take 50 resources). (Take 25 keeps). (Be present for 4 scroll turn ins) (kill 100 dragon knights and templars). (kill 100 sorcerers and night blades) (Kill 100 sorcerers and dragon knights) (kill 100 night blades and templars). (kill five bosses in delves). (do 10 quests in towns (like cheydenhal)) etc.

see its easy to add more quests into cyrodiil, i can come up with these all day. yet we have a bunch of bounty boards and only one involves actually pvping, lol.

technohic

I would like the player killing quests to be available for pick up with the siege vendors that spawn that the keeps. That way, you can also refresh quests while isolated or when needing to move quickly.

Also; not sure if there is any reason to not have each player kill give like 300-400 xp or something? They are harder to kill than mass groups of mobs (ok, maybe not always but most the time)

Fatalyis

It needs to be raised, and by quite a bit. I gave up leveling at VR5 after hearing that they were removing Veteran Ranks, and stuck to just PvPing....and I've only hit 1 VR rank in the last month. It's painfully slow with such low XP in Cyrodiil.

Sparky617

I support this idea. I don't PvP much, but the xp gains should be on par with PvE. I would roll a new character just for PvP so that I didn't feel the need to tweak my morphs every time I want to do PvP.

david.haypreub18_ESO

I have no idea why ZOS has been so stingy with PvP xp, and I think that the problem is going to get MUCH worse in 1.6.

PvPers will be forced to do a lot of PvE if they hope to get competitive... that is not good for the game.

Sotha_Sil

I really like your ideas for the quests, but we should be able to get them all at the same time.

ElliottXO

If you refer to PVE please point out that you mean mindless mob grinding, because I am a PVE dungeon player and I get [snip] of XP.

I don't understand where the difficulty is to increase XP given from dungeon booses or the undaunted dailies.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity]

Zershar_Vemod

Used to get much more xp in PvP during beta, then the crying started and it was nerfed to the ground. I honestly doubt we'll ever get that amount of xp gain back..

glak

Zershar_Vemod wrote: »

Used to get much more xp in PvP during beta, then the crying started and it was nerfed to the ground. I honestly doubt we'll ever get that amount of xp gain back..

I blame the impulse-spamming, cannon-balling zergs.

Fruitdog

gaining an alliance rank should give you 400,000 xp

Yolokin_Swagonborn

PvP XP gain needs to be looked at in the long run but here are a few simple things they can do for now,

The major problem with the current quests it that they either easy to finish (killing 20 players in thornblade can take 5 minutes during a big siege) or they are inconvenient (i.e. you have the wrong quest for the wrong keep).

It is a major time sink to keep porting back to the spawn zone every 10-15 to turn these in or try to have one person in your group share them. PvP'ers dont need time sinks or incentives to stay in the game. We like to kill things, that is time sink enough.

The objectives of PvP quests should be increased to keep more players in the field. Here are a few suggestions.

• Create a kill 100 players quest, with scaled up experience and AP (i.e. quest gives 5x more XP and AP than the kill 20). You would select this quest instead of the kill 20 as they would conflict.
• Create a "Capture 6 resources" quest, again, scaled up 6x XP and AP gain over the capture Aleswell mine quest.
• Create a "Capture 3 keeps" quest, scaled as well.

These could all be placed on a new "challenge board" next to the other bounty and pvp quest boards. Picking one of these quests prevents you from taking the normal kill 20 or capture X resource until you turn it it.

Correct me if I am wrong but the current the bounty quests are only available once per day. So 1 Day of PvP = kill 20 Players + 20 x 4 classes = 100 kills that you get credit for per day.

Even if the challenges were only dailies, adding this challenge board would double the potential XP gain per day from killing players alone not to mention the resource challenges.

PvE'ers can keep doing different quests for more XP. There is no (current) limitation on the amount of quests you can do in a day. PvP content is more repetitive in nature but also completely different. There should be no limit to the amount of XP you should get from that if you are doing what you want to do.

Aimelin

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

PvP XP gain needs to be looked at in the long run but here are a few simple things they can do for now,

The major problem with the current quests it that they either easy to finish (killing 20 players in thornblade can take 5 minutes during a big siege) or they are inconvenient (i.e. you have the wrong quest for the wrong keep).

It is a major time sink to keep porting back to the spawn zone every 10-15 to turn these in or try to have one person in your group share them. PvP'ers dont need time sinks or incentives to stay in the game. We like to kill things, that is time sink enough.

The objectives of PvP quests should be increased to keep more players in the field. Here are a few suggestions.

• Create a kill 100 players quest, with scaled up experience and AP (i.e. quest gives 5x more XP and AP than the kill 20). You would select this quest instead of the kill 20 as they would conflict.
• Create a "Capture 6 resources" quest, again, scaled up 6x XP and AP gain over the capture Aleswell mine quest.
• Create a "Capture 3 keeps" quest, scaled as well.

These could all be placed on a new "challenge board" next to the other bounty and pvp quest boards. Picking one of these quests prevents you from taking the normal kill 20 or capture X resource until you turn it it.

Correct me if I am wrong but the current the bounty quests are only available once per day. So 1 Day of PvP = kill 20 Players + 20 x 4 classes = 100 kills that you get credit for per day.

Even if the challenges were only dailies, adding this challenge board would double the potential XP gain per day from killing players alone not to mention the resource challenges.

PvE'ers can keep doing different quests for more XP. There is no (current) limitation on the amount of quests you can do in a day. PvP content is more repetitive in nature but also completely different. There should be no limit to the amount of XP you should get from that if you are doing what you want to do.

They could also change it so the quests auto "turn" in at completion, to keep people in the battlefield, have it so you can aquire the quests from other sources than the bounty boards, have guards or "commanders" at keeps / outposts grant the quests, less downtime, more pvp action, and actually make the quests or player kills grant more xp, the whole promise that was made at the beginning that pvp lvling would be viable is a complete joke right now

ElliottXO

glak wrote: »

Zershar_Vemod wrote: »

Used to get much more xp in PvP during beta, then the crying started and it was nerfed to the ground. I honestly doubt we'll ever get that amount of xp gain back..

I blame the impulse-spamming, cannon-balling zergs.

Wrong. It was the whiners crying about that they would out level their PVE zone if they go for a couple of hours of PvP.

Yolokin_Swagonborn

ElliottXO wrote: »

glak wrote: »

Zershar_Vemod wrote: »

Used to get much more xp in PvP during beta, then the crying started and it was nerfed to the ground. I honestly doubt we'll ever get that amount of xp gain back..

I blame the impulse-spamming, cannon-balling zergs.

Wrong. It was the whiners crying about that they would out level their PVE zone if they go for a couple of hours of PvP.

If something is broken or nerfed in PvP, you can usually safely assume it had the potential to mildly inconvenience some PvE carebear and it got changed on their behalf.

Their influence over a portion of the game they don't even play is astounding.

IxSTALKERxI

I don't see why XP gain can't be at least x5 the amount of AP gained. Not many people can average over 50k ap / hr, which would be like 250k xp. Which is still less then a grind spot.

On top of this, XP gain is crucial in 1.6. Champion system drastically makes characters more powerful then others. This basically forces every person to abandon cyrodiil for 5 months if they ever dream to be competitive in the future. It's really silly.

ElliottXO

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

ElliottXO wrote: »

glak wrote: »

Zershar_Vemod wrote: »

Used to get much more xp in PvP during beta, then the crying started and it was nerfed to the ground. I honestly doubt we'll ever get that amount of xp gain back..

I blame the impulse-spamming, cannon-balling zergs.

Wrong. It was the whiners crying about that they would out level their PVE zone if they go for a couple of hours of PvP.

If something is broken or nerfed in PvP, you can usually safely assume it had the potential to mildly inconvenience some PvE carebear and it got changed on their behalf.

Their influence over a portion of the game they don't even play is astounding.

On the other hand I do not understand why it is so difficult to implement a switch to enable and disable XP gains in cyrodil.

Seriously, it can't be that hard right?

asteldian

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

ElliottXO wrote: »

glak wrote: »

Zershar_Vemod wrote: »

Used to get much more xp in PvP during beta, then the crying started and it was nerfed to the ground. I honestly doubt we'll ever get that amount of xp gain back..

I blame the impulse-spamming, cannon-balling zergs.

Wrong. It was the whiners crying about that they would out level their PVE zone if they go for a couple of hours of PvP.

If something is broken or nerfed in PvP, you can usually safely assume it had the potential to mildly inconvenience some PvE carebear and it got changed on their behalf.

Their influence over a portion of the game they don't even play is astounding.

Given that PvP is the reason many pvers get screwed by skill changes I find the statement ironic.
That aside,, PvP, dungeons, trials and DSA need bigger xp rewards. No one wants to mob grind for their CP.

pppontus

Everyone who's not questing or grinding overland mobs gets the short end of the stick in 1.6. Rather, we get absolutely nothing at all. So when we hit AR50 we'll have 400CP and the questers have 3600, yippie

cozmon3c_ESO

asteldian wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

ElliottXO wrote: »

glak wrote: »

Zershar_Vemod wrote: »

Used to get much more xp in PvP during beta, then the crying started and it was nerfed to the ground. I honestly doubt we'll ever get that amount of xp gain back..

I blame the impulse-spamming, cannon-balling zergs.

Wrong. It was the whiners crying about that they would out level their PVE zone if they go for a couple of hours of PvP.

If something is broken or nerfed in PvP, you can usually safely assume it had the potential to mildly inconvenience some PvE carebear and it got changed on their behalf.

Their influence over a portion of the game they don't even play is astounding.

Given that PvP is the reason many pvers get screwed by skill changes I find the statement ironic.
That aside,, PvP, dungeons, trials and DSA need bigger xp rewards. No one wants to mob grind for their CP.

No man if it gets Nerf in pvp it most likely means it was OP in Pve as well, you're just fighting mindless monsters who can't complain about it.

That being said, doing dungeons should give you more xp then the grind spots. Promotes group play, and the lfg system will most likely be full of people looking to run stuff.

AhPook_Is_Here

You actually get about the same for killing a vr14 player as you do for killing a vr14 trash mob.It's true, sometimes killing the trash mob is easier. I imagine tower farmers are going to make some decent exp as long as they can keep grinding players. The other thing you get in PVP that you don't get in PVE is PVP rank, which leads to skill points and unlocking useful passives and also emperor grinding which leads to some nice passives as well.

PVP quests give a lot more vet points than most other quests in the game. My daily kill quests give around 50k vet points each and I think the capture resource quest gives about 20k every time you turn it in. That any competent player should be able to solo with a bow.

Sanctum gives around 10k for completing the weekly/repeatable quest. I think all trials do too. The vet daily around 10k.

I think really you just need to find a good spot to grind players. It wouldn't matter to me if they double the exp for players but the pvp daily quests already reward 2 to 5 times more exp than other harder daily quests.

wOOOOt_of_SD

We need this so much!!

XP for PVP needs a serious boost! Like at least 4 times the current value for kills.
And also PVP quests, that reward more and more of them like to OP suggests.
Let us have 10 different PVP quests running, to reward doing different Things in pvp, like xp for 10 ressource camp captures, 10 keep takes, 10 scroll takes etc.

And a big daily bonus for clearing PVE quest hubs, to make more players go for them.

reften

I believe Zos refuses to do this...because, PvP'ers, will PvP no matter what. There isn't a shortage of groups to be found in the PvP world.

But as we know, finding a group in craglorn, or even for undaunted dailies can be tough.

Certain people do not like to PvP. They like the PvE aspect of the game only.

Zos doesn't want a large portion of their player base only PvP'ing...leaving the PvE'rs with no-one to group with.

Francescolg

Don't forget that raising pvp-exp (/cp) gain will favorize the organized raid groups that simply are farming 24/h. So, while the (better) organized PvE groups stay stucked to "limitations by content", the organized PvP-group can farm as crazy.
(This gets all nullified by the argument that out of the maintime, there's as good as no pvp but THIS is another argument of a dieing game)


Whatever they do, an aequiibrium of points gained will never be possible!

Lets look at the easiest form of CP-gain, the single player doing PvP or PvE-single player-Quests.
In this case the less skilled player will obviously choose PvE for CP-farming, while classes as a NB will have a better position in PvP (ganking). Just for the 1-man scenario.
I fear that many players, who are not such successfull in PvP will simply leave it, and we already haven't many casuals left in PvP

pppontus

Francescolg wrote: »

Don't forget that raising pvp-exp (/cp) gain will favorize the organized raid groups that simply are farming 24/h. So, while the (better) organized PvE groups stay stucked to "limitations by content", the organized PvP-group can farm as crazy.
(This gets all nullified by the argument that out of the maintime, there's as good as no pvp but THIS is another argument of a dieing game)


Whatever they do, an aequiibrium of points gained will never be possible!

Lets look at the easiest form of CP-gain, the single player doing PvP or PvE-single player-Quests.
In this case the less skilled player will obviously choose PvE for CP-farming, while classes as a NB will have a better position in PvP (ganking). Just for the 1-man scenario.
I fear that many players, who are not such successfull in PvP will simply leave it, and we already haven't many casuals left in PvP

Well, there is already diminishing returns on AP for farming .. ehm .. bad players. If someone dies a lot, make them worth less XP too.

reften

pppontus wrote: »

Francescolg wrote: »

Don't forget that raising pvp-exp (/cp) gain will favorize the organized raid groups that simply are farming 24/h. So, while the (better) organized PvE groups stay stucked to "limitations by content", the organized PvP-group can farm as crazy.
(This gets all nullified by the argument that out of the maintime, there's as good as no pvp but THIS is another argument of a dieing game)


Whatever they do, an aequiibrium of points gained will never be possible!

Lets look at the easiest form of CP-gain, the single player doing PvP or PvE-single player-Quests.
In this case the less skilled player will obviously choose PvE for CP-farming, while classes as a NB will have a better position in PvP (ganking). Just for the 1-man scenario.
I fear that many players, who are not such successfull in PvP will simply leave it, and we already haven't many casuals left in PvP

Well, there is already diminishing returns on AP for farming .. ehm .. bad players. If someone dies a lot, make them worth less XP too.

and the farmers are aware of this...that's why after players aren't worth anything, the suicide into the players.

technohic

They could just give diminishing returns on XP based on your alliance rank vs your killed players alliance rank and your level to their level. Not eliminate XP entirely but the bigger the gap, the lower. Then diminishing returns for number of players in the area compared to the number of players in the opposition you are fighting. Seems there is already something in there that does that because AP is reduced based on your group size so maybe it just needs to be stiffer.

Either way; they don't have to go full bore on a boost here, but they could go a lot more toward PvP at the moment without risking outpacing PvE at all. The gap is just so big, steps should be taken quickly.

daemonios

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

XP gain in PVP is going to pale to PVE
Always has, and this needs to change. we need to be equally rewarded for doing things players like to do. right now its, lets find and awesome grind spot, woohoo fun!!!! lol.

What do pvp players like doing in pvp, well i think its safe to say we like to kill people, and yet we are barely rewarded for that, hell ive been playing a year and when 1.6 comes out ill only have 65 champion points to spend, lol. that shows the crazy disparity there, i guarantee all pve players have there 70 champion points at the start.

Fix
-Give more xp per player kill
-Give more xp for quests in cyrodiil based on pvping.
-give us more daily quests for pvping along side the kill quests board, spread out between the gates. like for example (kill 20 players higher ranked then you). (kill 20 players lower ranked then you). (kill 20 players higher champion level then you) (kill 20 people lower champion rank then you). (kill 200 players). (Take 50 resources). (Take 25 keeps). (Be present for 4 scroll turn ins) (kill 100 dragon knights and templars). (kill 100 sorcerers and night blades) (Kill 100 sorcerers and dragon knights) (kill 100 night blades and templars). (kill five bosses in delves). (do 10 quests in towns (like cheydenhal)) etc.

see its easy to add more quests into cyrodiil, i can come up with these all day. yet we have a bunch of bounty boards and only one involves actually pvping, lol.

Love every bit of your post. This needs to happen (as well as increased XP from Trials / Veteran Dungeons).

SanderBuraas

Totally. Pvp should also be a way to obtain experience on par with pve. Some of us can't stand doing pve content, which is why we should have the possibility to gain experience as we spend many hours in Cyrodiil.

Jahosefat

david.haypreub18_ESO wrote: »

I have no idea why ZOS has been so stingy with PvP xp, and I think that the problem is going to get MUCH worse in 1.6.

PvPers will be forced to do a lot of PvE if they hope to get competitive... that is not good for the game.

I believe the concern they have stated is "win-trading" in cyrodiil. I think they are worried that if the XP bonuses were too high people would sell spots in "win-trade-groups" and stuff (which would be bad). I personally would like more XP gains in cyro though, and I think you could do it where win-trading wasn't very easy or possible but who knows. I blame the black alliance.

cozmon3c_ESO

Francescolg wrote: »

Don't forget that raising pvp-exp (/cp) gain will favorize the organized raid groups that simply are farming 24/h. So, while the (better) organized PvE groups stay stucked to "limitations by content", the organized PvP-group can farm as crazy.
(This gets all nullified by the argument that out of the maintime, there's as good as no pvp but THIS is another argument of a dieing game)


Whatever they do, an aequiibrium of points gained will never be possible!

Lets look at the easiest form of CP-gain, the single player doing PvP or PvE-single player-Quests.
In this case the less skilled player will obviously choose PvE for CP-farming, while classes as a NB will have a better position in PvP (ganking). Just for the 1-man scenario.
I fear that many players, who are not such successfull in PvP will simply leave it, and we already haven't many casuals left in PvP

Jahosefat wrote: »

david.haypreub18_ESO wrote: »

I have no idea why ZOS has been so stingy with PvP xp, and I think that the problem is going to get MUCH worse in 1.6.

PvPers will be forced to do a lot of PvE if they hope to get competitive... that is not good for the game.

I believe the concern they have stated is "win-trading" in cyrodiil. I think they are worried that if the XP bonuses were too high people would sell spots in "win-trade-groups" and stuff (which would be bad). I personally would like more XP gains in cyro though, and I think you could do it where win-trading wasn't very easy or possible but who knows. I blame the black alliance.

I haven't really run into kill trading, you have to wait like 5 minutes between kills to get full benifit out of killing the same person. It's much more efficient just swapping from fighting red then after a bit switch to fighting blue. And if you defend stuff you make some decent ap (not sure about xp wise).

Emma_Overload

I think PVP players should get lots of XP for PVPing right around the same time I get lots of AP for grinding Craglorn... that way you guys get your CP and I get my Caltrops and Vigor!