Official Discussion Thread for “Your Guide to ESO Plus™ Premium Membership”

TheBonesXXX

After deliberating a bit, I have come to this conclusion. I am not going to completely count Zenimax out. I am going to leave this bit here and a warning to the developers to heed.

I don't care about the game store if it's selling items such as Manimarco's costume, because I do not really care about impersonal objects. I really dont, I rather be able to mix and match in game stuff and dye it as I see fit.

I am not stupid however, introducing an idea to the public you know they are going to reject then slowly let it creep in as they slowly accept bits and pieces of it is not being a transparent developer, its arrogant - so do not try to be slick about it.

Your lack of transparency as far as I'm concerned is annoying already. I do not expect you to reveal every in game project you have going on, because suspense and delivery is all apart of the impression and entertainment value of a game, so I understand.

But don't try any form of duplicity on the player base, you will have a harder time with your reputation since you already are flirting with this games assured destruction.

-> Many games introduced a cash shop with vanity items, then took away in game vanity to boost their sales and the suckers ate it up like candy. My personality is reflected in my character, do not ruin the feeling of the game. Part of the entertainment value for the majority of your player-base is conveying a unique persona with your character in the game.

Introducing mounts into the cash shop is concerning, because then you take away entertainment value from the game. You take away the efforts made by players to earn a mount that is unique to the elite, you take away the status and you share it with everyone. This is not real world politics, there are no need for saftey nets in a video game.

No, not everyone is equal and nor should they be. The scoreboards reflect player efforts and they should be recognized. Mounts come from the ancient ways of Europe when owning a horse was prestige. Mounts are a prestige, so I certainly am skeptical you are going to make this prestige easy access for every person who doesn't want to be ENTERTAINED while earning their mount.

I hope you reserve the best versions of your mounts in game and not for the cash shop example, putting a Guar mount in the cash shop means there should be a GREATER version in the game. A version superior and a lot harder to get.

-or-

At least add the ability to up-armor in game mounts through their own vanity system unless you introduce mounted combat, then add the same vanity in-game you would the awesome and beautifully done gear you have put in the game.

Cash shops are a complete code red for many of us players who have been around. It screams we care about money rather than the quality of our game, the quality of our story telling. We're playing this game to be entertained, instead of sitting in the seats of an ancient Greek theater we are in the story. We are the characters in the story.

I could care less about it going b2p, I care about if you handle money before story telling. I am like many of the people here educated, I already READ all of the stories. I do not want to HEAR about Achilles, Heracles, Beowulf, and Alexander. I want to BE Achilles, Heracles, Beowulf, Monkey King, Sun Tzu, Conan, William Wallace, Shocka Zulu, and Alexander in PvP and PvE.

Don't entertain my notion of wanting to be a kid for a part of my day and entertain the stories that have already been said for the last 10 thousand years. I have those books on my shelves already and I don't need you, I want to enjoy your story telling.

Don't screw it up with bad business, because if you put your business before the quality of your craftsmanship then your word is no longer valid and your reputation diminishes, not that you're a templar; so I do not expect you to care about coming back from the holy land.

Your job is simple, pull me into your story. Make the story amazing, show me what you are capable of.

I am not going to immediately dismiss b2p, I am still dissapointed as an old school gamer, because I still am completely skeptical about how you, Zenimax and yes you, Matt Frior & team will handle story and entertainment before business.

tiamak

Ok, obviously, I didn't read all postings in this thread. So, please forgive me if I add something old.

Like some of the previous posters, I don't get all the rage about the upcomming B2P-model. Here are the reasons why I don't:

1. You have to pay for the game. That makes it unattractive for quite a lot of nasty people, namely those that just download the client, enter the world with a shattering "Hear me rock'n'rule all you n00b!" and then try to grind the maximum out of it so they don't have to pay for a good game. That's those guys who don't care for the game, who will most likely be gone in a month or so, but instantly be replaced by another lot of this kind.

2. Those people who want to pay a sub can still do so. And if you do so, basically nothing will change for you. They say that you'll have access to all DLC to come. Well, we'll have to wait and see if this will indeed be the case. But, if this turns out to be true, it's quite good for the subscribers: in other games, no matter whether you pay a monthly fee or not, you have to buy the larger content addons (cf. LoTRO, WoW).

3. When ZOS announced the payment model back in summer 2013, many gamers and gaming magazins were quite upset with their decision to make it P2P. All kinds or worries were brought up. And I wonder, would all those people who now cancel their subs in pure rage have refrained from playing ESO in the first place if it had started as a B2P game?

That being said, I have some minor worries as well: Matt Firor defended the monthly fee for ESO by saying that in a free environment, such as the ES-series is known and loved for, there shouldn't be monetary borders between players and players or players and content. (Read a german interview here.) I hope, they manage to minimize the impact of the crown store on the game. Sure, there's DLC to buy there. But I don't want to see shop buttons all over the UI after 1.6. Also, there might be P2W thingies in the shop. Seeing that you get at least 1.500 crowns for a sub, I'm afraid that there will be some things to buy that could make a difference.

Whatever, I'll just wait and see. If ESO post 1.6 doesn't feel like a nice place anymore, I'll simply cancel my sub. It's not that I can't play anymore then. Oh wait, that's another advantage of the new model ...

Iago

Oh jeez thanks, next time use some vaseline ZOS, oh and by the by dinner first would have been great.......

kevlarto_ESO

Sad panda overall, going to keep my sub with the ESO pass, as long as I am having fun and I feel like my sub still has value I will stick around other wise, I will have to move on back to single player games, mmo's are getting to a point with me not worth the hassle, but I have been playing them since the 90's maybe time to retire.

Murmeltier

I cant understand the Aggro here. It sounds like a Rampage of Drama-Queens on the Market Place in Rawl-Ka.

For sure, i was shocked too, as i have read those Informations, but for the Queen of the Aldmeri Dominion, stop this Theatre.

Plain and simple, you paid before to play Teso with a Subscription, and now you pay to play Teso with ESO+. Two different Systems, before it called Abo, now it will be ESO+. Thats all, and do you know what, you get more for the same Money.

As a ESO+ Member you get the full Game and all Updates in the Future. Additional some Crowns and a little (+10% Bonus) to Gold/Exp etc. With the Crowns you can choose special Mounts, Costumes. Before, you dont have had this +10% Bonus, or you cant choose new Mounts, Special Costumes and so on. So, with ESO+ you get all you have had before AND some new Bonus, Options.

So why you are so angry, you get more and instead of beeing happy, you go on Rampage. The new Console Versions of Teso will bring more Money and with that, Zenimax can support this Game longer, better. So please listen, you get more and not less. Thats the whole Truth, thats all.

Sure, if Zenimax ever offers other Things then Cosmectis like Mounts, Costumes, then you have a real Reason to go Berserk.

I am not 100% sure, if they will ever offer more then this, we will see. The +10% Bonus and the Soul Gems, Potions are harmless. But if they offer more like Equip or Materials, then they will lose more Money than they will get, as i said before.

So to the End, you get more, not less. Do you go on Rampage at Christmas too?

I stay on the Game, i will be a happy Premium ESO+ User and buy me some nice Things with my Crowns. And i will buy some Crowns more, to Support the Game.

It is one of the best MMORPGs outthere in the Market .

Naivefanboi

mamericus wrote: »

And to think I spent so much of my time defending this game... Thanks for the fun while it lasted. I still love the ES franchise and I'll be looking forward to the next ES single player RPG.

why? ill be moving on from the brand completely, note even gonna bother with fallout if bethesda or zos have anything to do with it

vhdleb17_ESO

Please rename the game as well. From ESO to ISO (Ingame Shop Online).

Btw. I bought a product that was advertised as abo model only and nothing else. Now the product seems to be broken within the warranty period of 2 years. Please give me my money back.

Naivefanboi

vaagventje17eb17_ESO wrote: »

F2p ruined every game to a bunch of low life no skill players who just pay for stuff so they are awesome and have put no skill in the game what so ever. this is over crowd server. make it easier for gold-sellers to make a endless amount of accounts over and over again and sell there gold. but hell selling gold? its gonna be buy 2 win anyway. so i guess selling gold wil be okey basically. or else this is kinda or a hypocritical statement. making it f2p wil fill the game with to many gamers who just wanna *** with the game. and troll. this is the worst decision you guys have ever made. think this true. if its because you can ask subscription fees on the console and think this is fair? its not fair. you are spitting in the eyes of the players who payed for this all those months. if you really need money. up the sub fee's really. i rather pay dubble the price, then let this game go f2p.

don't do it ZOS. look at other games that did this. those other games are the games people stopped playing to play a proper game like this. going F2p means this game wil last til the next launch of a great mmorpg game. and that wont take to long in the current game develop environment.

think properly about what this does. and the respect less of the actions you are doing against you subscribers. its not about the money zos. its about having a game that needs skill to play, and you cant juts buy you way in to like some rich spoiled brath. this game is fair to everyone in the game. and this wil make it unfair for the people who supported you true all the stuff. the bugs. everything and we keep paying you guys. why do you feel the need to do this. it makes no sense. its stupid. and not how its suppose to be. stop this before you let it get out of hand. or do you guys want the imperial city to be filled with people who dont pay anything?

and will never pay anything. but wil still use and abuse your content. selling gold wil be easy. botting. pff they can make 20 account to try and try and try again to make it work. you guys had such a good security. but this wil destroy that. welcome to all goldsellers! botters! spammers! everybody is welcome now. god banned? no worries its free!!! so jsut make a new account and get righ to it! nobody can stop you now because its buy to win. so yeah ZOS is basically telling us goldsellers wil be okey. hell ZOS is gonna do the same. so stopping the other goldsellers, wil be very hypocritical of them. but yeah i think i said enough. i just hope you guys thought this true, and it wont be like the other stuff. because you wil only get 1 chance to get this right. or you game is wiped of the map by the next game... i heard wow's expesian was looking nice... it might already be out. but at least wow is not play to win you see? that is why they succeeding so much. having a trial til level 20 or somthing would be more fitting. but "premium members" worst idea ever made by any company. check the number of other games that tried this. and you wil see

bottom line is they are making money from the subs, BUT just not enough.
so now they are gonna milk the diehard fans that stay and wanna sub scribe to "support" the game rofl. nothing makes me more loyal then being stabbed in th back am i right?
ZOS knows alot of people are gonna leave, they dont CARE, theyre expecting it.
just like rift did. once everyone who hates the change enough to leave, leaves theyll just simply move on to the next ones because they will be makeing MORE money now with cash shop and sub options.

well we did say we wanted some more mounts besides horses.....not what we meant. dont make them a raid drop no no no, cash shop like we signed up fro some wow vomit. just pathetic. havent been able to login and play since hearing about this cashout

Naivefanboi

Dekkameron wrote: »

This only happened i think because of the console players whining about having to pay a subscription...

no its cause garbage like destiny sells millions of copies lol. this game wont even be given a fair shot, people will be playing gta5/destiny/DA

im sure console crowd will cry about how long and hard it is to get to 50, boost me in the cash shop wow does it.... xD

Darkonflare15

jjf42001_ESO wrote: »

Dekkameron wrote: »

This only happened i think because of the console players whining about having to pay a subscription...

no its cause garbage like destiny sells millions of copies lol. this game wont even be given a fair shot, people will be playing gta5/destiny/DA

im sure console crowd will cry about how long and hard it is to get to 50, boost me in the cash shop wow does it.... xD

Nope there plenty of people who just want to play the game on console. I am definitely getting this on console and I already got 2 vet characters.

glak

Murmeltier wrote: »

Sure, if Zenimax ever offers other Things then Cosmectis like Mounts, Costumes, then you have a real Reason to go Berserk.

I am not 100% sure, if they will ever offer more then this, we will see. The +10% Bonus and the Soul Gems, Potions are harmless. But if they offer more like Equip or Materials, then they will lose more Money than they will get, as i said before.

Are skill points and barber shop just as harmless?

grimjim398

I love that so many of you are quoting the current promises Zenimax is making about the crown shop as if they are absolute gospel; the company has already proven you can't trust it to say what it actually means to do even one or two months out. So good luck with the transition to those who are staying. I don't feel any rage; I just simply prefer the subscription model and the fact that ZOS went with that to begin with is the only reason I tried this game at all. I spent my last hour in the game following zone chat in one of the newbie areas and realizing that's where the game is going. With the Justice System coming in, and the thousands of newbies running around town setting off this spell and that spell like the little idiots they are, I imagine the game will soon become pretty much unlivable in most towns. And I don't plan to wait around to find out. I don't need to defend that decision to you since, you know, it's my life and I don't owe you or Zenimax anything. If I want to play a B2P or F2P game there are lots and lots of choices beyond Elder Scrolls. I see no reason to stay in this game because I've basically played it all, and there is now nothing unique about this game model to keep me here.

I'm not making any predictions, and I don't care whether this game succeeds or fails. What has left a bad taste in my mouth is the fact that the developer can talk so brightly and falsely about whatever direction the game is going in even when the company shifts direction completely. I've never played WoW but maybe it's time I did, since Blizzard at least is a company worth respecting. Zenimax is not, period.

I have thirteen days left of paid time and if I choose to post here every day until that is over, then the rest of you will just have to deal with it. Enjoy your crown store and your cute little dress up dolls; that's what you're getting, and boy, I'm sure it's just going to be terrific.

Nazon_Katts

Can we get TES themed credit cards with our ESO Plus membership?

Warraxx

How much $ to become Emp?

Arandear

Feel pretty sad for all the time I spent defending this game, but also ambitious to see if and how many people come and play the game.

rotaugen454

In the forums, you are going to find the most hard core players. The majority probably support this move however. I have mixed feelings. It WILL bring in two friends that would not otherwise be in the game with me, and I can buy a copy for my wife and young son so they can run around with me as well, so I like it in that respect. I am worried that the community will be flooded with immaturity and disrespect towards other players. You see some now, but I imagine it will be far worse. I am staying regardless.

arxerisdam

Murmeltier wrote: »

I cant understand the Aggro here. It sounds like a Rampage of Drama-Queens on the Market Place in Rawl-Ka.

For sure, i was shocked too, as i have read those Informations, but for the Queen of the Aldmeri Dominion, stop this Theatre.

Plain and simple, you paid before to play Teso with a Subscription, and now you pay to play Teso with ESO+. Two different Systems, before it called Abo, now it will be ESO+. Thats all, and do you know what, you get more for the same Money.

As a ESO+ Member you get the full Game and all Updates in the Future. Additional some Crowns and a little (+10% Bonus) to Gold/Exp etc. With the Crowns you can choose special Mounts, Costumes. Before, you dont have had this +10% Bonus, or you cant choose new Mounts, Special Costumes and so on. So, with ESO+ you get all you have had before AND some new Bonus, Options.

So why you are so angry, you get more and instead of beeing happy, you go on Rampage. The new Console Versions of Teso will bring more Money and with that, Zenimax can support this Game longer, better. So please listen, you get more and not less. Thats the whole Truth, thats all.

Sure, if Zenimax ever offers other Things then Cosmectis like Mounts, Costumes, then you have a real Reason to go Berserk.

I am not 100% sure, if they will ever offer more then this, we will see. The +10% Bonus and the Soul Gems, Potions are harmless. But if they offer more like Equip or Materials, then they will lose more Money than they will get, as i said before.

So to the End, you get more, not less. Do you go on Rampage at Christmas too?

I stay on the Game, i will be a happy Premium ESO+ User and buy me some nice Things with my Crowns. And i will buy some Crowns more, to Support the Game.

It is one of the best MMORPGs outthere in the Market .

Actually i see this more like a trick to milk the cow, yeah they give you crowns for your subscription for vanity stuff and that and i bet there will be vanity stuff tha will cost over 9000 crowns, and dont forget the p2w stuff first potions then gem souls then armors swords etc etc because the forged and buyable items are simple worthless and dont work at all.

F2P is just the door to milking the cow (yes you guess rigth the players) and to say the true i doubt we see much content, they will concentrate on vanity items, why ? becase vanity items are more easy and less expensive to be made and can give a much more income than playable content.

Its a lie you get more for your money is never that way ever.

Nothing is free in this life not even the air you breath.

Rashishane

Before anyone reads this please understand that I am posting from work so I did not read every post on here, I apologize if these questions were already asked and/or answered.

ZOS, my current understanding of these boosters to XP, Gold pickup, Research times, and craft inspire is that people who sub will automatically get these 10% boosters (we will have already paid for them with our sub) and people who choose the non-sub model of play will be able to purchase these boosters at the exact same 10% rate. I have a few questions regarding this-

1. You are providing boosters to fly through content faster, are you going to be increasing the amount of XP it will take to level making it take an excruciating amount of time to level without the boosters? If you do it will render the boosters a useless money grab punishment for not spending enough RL money.
2. I plan to keep my sub- how will my boosters work? For example: will I get one xp booster per month that is a one time consumable increasing my XP by 10% for an hour or so (requiring me to go buy more in the crown store when they run out)? Will my booster be permanent (automatically applied character effect) since I am a sub and last as long as my subscription (30, 90,180 days)?
3. On the other side, for people who do not sub- will their xp boost be a one time consumable lasting for a certain period of time (requiring them to buy a new one every hour or so) or a boost that lasts for a month?
4. Will these boosts be stackable? Please tell me that you cannot put 5 10% XP boosts on your character at once.

Seravi

As someone who has been here since Beta, vanity items are NOT what I am looking for. Give us more armor and weapons we can craft and dye and more content that is NOT group specific. Don't give us costumes that we cannot dye or upgrade to suit our needs. Most of my characters wear light armor and the current selection of what I can craft is getting old. Put your time and resources into giving players in game items and content that will keep them around. Most of us have been to oblivion and back with this game dealing with server issues, bugs, broken quests, bots and gold spammers. Don't slap us in the face by opening the door and letting the riff raff in again and telling us it will be okay because we now have a cute dress costume or a pet we can purchase with crowns.

arxerisdam

Turelus wrote: »

Well, this will be interesting. :disagree:

I can't say I am over the moon about this announcement but for the most part I don't see much changing for me.

My biggest worry is that we're going to see a repeat of SWTOR, where eventually the only worthwhile items (even just cosmetic) will come from the store. Meaning that the games content won't actually have meaningful items to grind for.

Most likely

Bored_One

My heart sunk when I saw this update news. After the announcement for champion system and upcoming details for 1.6, I decided to take a short break for other entertaining subjects (still subscribed btw). I come back to check up on the forums to see this? You have failed me zos. And it hurts. Cheers to the fun while it lasted, I guess.

arxerisdam

Scinder wrote: »

There was little choice but to re-look at a model and its probably the only model that would work. It works fine in other games and so long as they don't gate content with money or provide massive player boosts in the shop, it should work here.

as long? yeah sure they wont do that xD i bet is the first thing youll see in the shop.

just milk the cow boys!

AntonTakk

Rashishane wrote: »

Before anyone reads this please understand that I am posting from work so I did not read every post on here, I apologize if these questions were already asked and/or answered.

ZOS, my current understanding of these boosters to XP, Gold pickup, Research times, and craft inspire is that people who sub will automatically get these 10% boosters (we will have already paid for them with our sub) and people who choose the non-sub model of play will be able to purchase these boosters at the exact same 10% rate. I have a few questions regarding this-

Obviously I am not ZOS, so take this with a grain of salt:

My understanding is that the 10% increases are simply a passive fact of life for subscribed players. there is no item to use, no item to buy, and they can only be gotten via subscription, not with gold, not with crowns, etc

Rashishane

AntonTakk wrote: »

Rashishane wrote: »

Before anyone reads this please understand that I am posting from work so I did not read every post on here, I apologize if these questions were already asked and/or answered.

ZOS, my current understanding of these boosters to XP, Gold pickup, Research times, and craft inspire is that people who sub will automatically get these 10% boosters (we will have already paid for them with our sub) and people who choose the non-sub model of play will be able to purchase these boosters at the exact same 10% rate. I have a few questions regarding this-

Obviously I am not ZOS, so take this with a grain of salt:

My understanding is that the 10% increases are simply a passive fact of life for subscribed players. there is no item to use, no item to buy, and they can only be gotten via subscription, not with gold, not with crowns, etc

It looks like the boosters can be bought from the crown market with crowns. I am assuming this is their way of giving non-subs the same experience as subbers (if they pay for it).

(pulled from the crown store wishlist discussion)

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hello everyone!

As part of Update 6, we are introducing the Crown Store: an in-game store where you can purchase customization and convenience items. The store offers consumables you can use to save time on in-game activities (like experience and crafting boosters, for example) .......

You can view some of the planned Crown Store items at the following link, beginning at 23:59 http://www.twitch.tv/zenimaxonlinestudios/v/3711373

ricku1967

about the "crown" store - (costumes)--how dare they!!! that unforgivable, might as well drop my sub right now. (pets). uh oh, that's P2W right there, the game is ruined....(buy potions and soul gems that are no stronger than the ones at vendors in game right now and not better than player crafted ones) - how can they do that?!?! this game is going to crap. (special mounts that aren't better than mounts already in game, just different looking)..oh my, that's taking it too far..this is ridiculous.

over react much?? right now there is nothing in the "crown" store that will make anyone "overpowered" and make the game "P2W". and there is no evidence it will ever happen. people are going off other games and automatically assuming it will happen with this game. where is the evidence that will happen? this game isn't F2P. its B2P..yes, there is a difference. there will still be a sub fee for those who choose to use it and the game will be no different than it is now, just extra perks for those who pay a sub fee. The game will still make money for DLC. I do not have a problem with this as long as they stick to what they have announced.

If they ever put things in the "crown" store that will make the game P2W, then i will stop playing the game. No big deal, there are other games in the world and i will have no problem dropping this game if that ever happens. but i am at least going to see what happens. not over react and stop playing today.

phreatophile

I watched "ESO Live: All about Tamriel Unlimited"

Parts of it looked like a hostage video and I'm trying to decide if Paul's shirt was a distress signal like when they fly the flag upsidedown at an embassy.

Kidding aside, lots of cool items in crown shop. So far this doesn't look to bad.

Like most everyone else that's staying, the day I see P2W items in the store, I'm out, but for now looks pretty cool.

beefers96

If your membership ends, you’ll still be able to play ESO (and keep any items and rewards you earned playing within DLC), but you won’t be able to access DLC game pack content that you haven’t purchased separately.

*sigh*

LotRO did the same thing to me... I should be used to it by now, I guess. I subscribed to that game for years, spent hundreds of dollars. Let the subscription lapse, however, and I can't access content in areas that were included in the original release; when I bought the dang game.

Now you're doing it. So far I've spent around $150 paying for a subscription. Even when I stopped playing, I kept paying - just because I saw the potential that the game could have. Just assume that DLC is around $30 a pack... I'll expect the first five to be credited to my account regardless of my subscription status...

calamity

My main concern is that this doesn't lead to dumbing down the game, as usually happens. I have no desire to play something mindless and unchallenging.

Also: requesting a lifetime sub option!

ricku1967

@calamity they did say when "tamriel unlimited" is released, it will be the same exact game as we are playing now, only with update 1.6 attached. so i think its safe to assume its not going to be "dumb down".

tedefumpb16_ESO

Maybe it is worth that everyone gives his opinion, maybe not.
I can see the pros and cons in both subscription/no-subscription systems.
Both has their advantages, I guess.

But, the crown shop... No, really, this is a mistake.

Everybody is paying, or nobody is paying.
This is fair. Everybody is the same.
This makes the community of player consistent.
This does not encourage cleavage between groups of players.

But the crown shop... Come on.
Whatever you sell in there. Useful or useless stuff. Beautiful or ugly.
What are the advantages of this crown shop ?
What does it bring, other than cleavage ?

Money ? Subscription for everyone was fine then.

I feel like this crown shop is going to tear the game apart.
Two official categories of players, two official categories of content.
The players who pay, the players who don't.
The content you need to pay for, the content you don't need to pay for.

This really doesn't sound like a good idea to mix them in the same virtual environment.