Chain Pull Enemy Faction on Keep Walls

IcyDeadPeople

We've observed a number of players using DK fiery grip ability to chain pull enemy faction members up on top of keeps.

Members of certain guilds in opposing factions have been using this technique to help each other capture the imperial city keeps and repeatedly swap the emperor title.

Not entirely certain whether this is prohibited, but it does not seem to be the intended gameplay experience for capturing a keep. On the short term Celarus campaign, the factions engaging in this practice have repeatedly changed emperor dozens of times within the past couple days.

I understand the capacity for two factions to become allied and team up against a third is an important part of the three faction alliance war; however, it would be helpful if someone from the community team could weigh in and make it clear what sort of collaboration is permitted or what crosses the line.

[Moderator Note: Edited to remove content containing player names.]

hereticjhedmanb14a_ESO

I wouldn't exactly say this falls under "collaboration". It is a deliberate degradation of the Emperor title because now it's as easy as taking 6 keeps in the time it takes for us (EP) to capture 1 against double the odds.

Vis

This exploit of the game mechanics has been going on since the beginning of the game. I am alright with its use because I have already lost respect for the "former" title having seen it famed for a while now and have even been invited to farm it.

Cody

its been going on for awhile. idk why ZOS has not at least acknowledged it(if they did, then I missed it) its pretty lame, iv seen it first hand myself.

Tintinabula

This is why ZOS determined that (about a month ago) players from one account could not have two characters from different factions on the same campaign..

however...they have not prohibited their purchase of a second account and doing this. Therefore it is a reasonable assumption that if ZOS gets paid..this is allowed.


P.S. what really eats me about this is they WILL fix this..they will HAVE to address this when enough ppl catch on and it becomes rampant..THEN when EVERYONE in Cyrodiil ignores objectives and intended game mechanics and runs around impulse zerging and chain pulling their friends into keeps ONLY THEN will it be addressed...so..please tell your friends..sieging keeps is for nubs...chain pull your guild.

FENGRUSH

Whoever came up with this is brilliant!

Okspaghetti

Get some accounts banned... Flipping the ring in less than 40min is a bit silly.

I understand sometimes factions want to gang up on the other to capture one keep, maybe even dethrone a long standing emp. But This is out of control.

I imagine this will stop once the new campaigns come out. The higher population servers will limit the power one guild may have on a server.

Tintinabula

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Whoever came up with this is brilliant!

was it you Fen? Are you in one of those PTS guilds who held this as a deep dark dirty secret for release?

FENGRUSH

Tintinabula wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Whoever came up with this is brilliant!

was it you Fen? Are you in one of those PTS guilds who held this as a deep dark dirty secret for release?

Yes of course. When I first invented pulling people into keeps with DK chain last year everyone froze in place and wasnt sure what had just happened. At this point we all agreed that the world was not yet ready for this and we buried this as a deep dark dirty secret (the three Ds). I knew when the moment was right, we would reveal this power to the world, and it would change forever as we know it.

Okspaghetti

Fengrush, you're DC right? Grats on Emp, Well deserved.

yes everyone knows about it, but just not many people do it because its frowned upon.

Rylana

My DK usually uses its chain to pull people off of walls.

It amuses me to go fishing.

y u no do it liek me?

Okspaghetti

Its fine to pull people up with the intent to kill them, but pulling up groups so they can capture an undefended keep is a different story.

FENGRUSH

Okspaghetti wrote: »

Fengrush, you're DC right? Grats on Emp, Well deserved.

yes everyone knows about it, but just not many people do it because its frowned upon.

Thanks. 13 hours of killing EP/AD straight paid off Friday night.

Tintinabula

Okspaghetti wrote: »

Its fine to pull people up with the intent to kill them, but pulling up groups so they can capture an undefended keep is a different story.

worst feeling in the world is pulling up someone who kills you and then starts a killing spree. I try to make sure those I pull up are first sergeants or lower. Having to scream for a team of players to come kill a psycopathic unkillable sorc or DK is embarrassing :P

sevcik.miroslaveb17_ESO

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Whoever came up with this is brilliant!

May I ask what is brilliant about some dumb [snip] that has nothing better to do then to find exploits? This is NOT valid tactic and since we do not have friendly fire this behaviour should be banned with no excuse.

This is like when I was playing unique free wow server. They had possibility to group up with the other faction. You know what some brilliant folks invented? Ah lets kill your faction! You will heal us and there is nothing they can do about that because they can't attack our healer! Brilliant right?

I tell you what, people SHOULD play the game improve the skills not to search for exploits to [snip] up the game for others.

If you play paintball in real life try to exploit there I recommend it really. Do it just once and be prepared for fire from ALL participants from 5m range and full mag. It is usual punishment for *** who does not respect rules.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity]

Okspaghetti

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Okspaghetti wrote: »

Fengrush, you're DC right? Grats on Emp, Well deserved.

yes everyone knows about it, but just not many people do it because its frowned upon.

Thanks. 13 hours of killing EP/AD straight paid off Friday night.

You mean killing EP? AD are sided with you.

Lettigall

Until there are not option to kill traitor ban hammer should hit all involved- puller and pulled ups. They all know that it's exploit and still doing so there should be zero tolerance.

If there would be penalty system for puller like traitor status it would be ok. In wich friendly NPC's could attack traitor(not players because traitors would abuse their punishment by farming starting zones).

Limitless

ESO PvP at it's finest.

dem chains doe!

Singular

Ha! That's fantastic. People are such clever monkeys!

You should have sniped a few once they got up that wall! Then they would have thought they were being attacked and fight back.

Ser Lobo

sevcik.miroslaveb17_ESO wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Whoever came up with this is brilliant!

May I ask what is brilliant about some dumb [snip] that has nothing better to do then to find exploits? This is NOT valid tactic and since we do not have friendly fire this behaviour should be banned with no excuse.

This is like when I was playing unique free wow server. They had possibility to group up with the other faction. You know what some brilliant folks invented? Ah lets kill your faction! You will heal us and there is nothing they can do about that because they can't attack our healer! Brilliant right?

I tell you what, people SHOULD play the game improve the skills not to search for exploits to [snip] up the game for others.

If you play paintball in real life try to exploit there I recommend it really. Do it just once and be prepared for fire from ALL participants from 5m range and full mag. It is usual punishment for *** who does not respect rules.

So much anger.

Players cheat. They always do, they always will. No reason to get mad at them for cheating, really. Just take your toys and go somewhere else.

And wiping in paintball has been around since the first day paintball came into existance. "I shot you." "No you didn't." "Yeah I did, its right there on your jacket." "Nope, that's just splatter." wipe, wipe, wipe.

Name a game, and I'll show you cheaters. People even cheat at solitaire!



That said, devs should do something about this. What? I don't know. But collusion between guilds is going to do more harm to the concept of Cyrodiil than help.

[Moderator Edit: Edited quote from moderated post.]

sevcik.miroslaveb17_ESO

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

sevcik.miroslaveb17_ESO wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Whoever came up with this is brilliant!

May I ask what is brilliant about some dumb fu*k that has nothing better to do then to find exploits? This is NOT valid tactic and since we do not have friendly fire this behaviour should be banned with no excuse.

This is like when I was playing unique free wow server. They had possibility to group up with the other faction. You know what some brilliant folks invented? Ah lets kill your faction! You will heal us and there is nothing they can do about that because they can't attack our healer! Brilliant right?

I tell you what, people SHOULD play the game improve the skills not to search for exploits to fu*k up the game for others.

If you play paintball in real life try to exploit there I recommend it really. Do it just once and be prepared for fire from ALL participants from 5m range and full mag. It is usual punishment for *** who does not respect rules.

So much anger.

Players cheat. They always do, they always will. No reason to get mad at them for cheating, really. Just take your toys and go somewhere else.

And wiping in paintball has been around since the first day paintball came into existance. "I shot you." "No you didn't." "Yeah I did, its right there on your jacket." "Nope, that's just splatter." wipe, wipe, wipe.

Name a game, and I'll show you cheaters. People even cheat at solitaire!



That said, devs should do something about this. What? I don't know. But collusion between guilds is going to do more harm to the concept of Cyrodiil than help.

I have never seen cheating in basketball, when I was playing activly for 10 years. Yes judges sometimes judge something wrong, but nithing serious. Pulling enemy on your own keep is scoring at your own basket... That never happend.

And yes it makes me angry. Years back there was a fraction of hackers. Today, there is so many of them. Truth to be told, when I get bored by ESO, I will quit online gaming except of some coop stuff.

Manoekin

Tintinabula wrote: »

Okspaghetti wrote: »

Its fine to pull people up with the intent to kill them, but pulling up groups so they can capture an undefended keep is a different story.

worst feeling in the world is pulling up someone who kills you and then starts a killing spree. I try to make sure those I pull up are first sergeants or lower. Having to scream for a team of players to come kill a psycopathic unkillable sorc or DK is embarrassing :P

I remember a couple of times where during a large siege a DK thought it would be a good idea to chain an emperor DK up thinking he was safe with his 30 other buddies. The devastation...

frwinters_ESO

many times you see this happen in keeps with scrolls. they get up on the walls right to the inner keep with DK helping them, get the scrolls, jump over walls and run.

Armitas

They have a policy regarding exploitation but there is no presence behind that policy. You can report players all day long only to watch them continue to exploit everyday. No one takes exploits seriously because ZOS has not given them any reason to take them seriously. ZOS has allowed exploiters to run rampant and turn important aspects of their game into a farce and ruin the game for the rest of the player base.

They need to provide a reason not to exploit, not just a policy not to exploit. Because a policy without enforcement is only going to punish the players that don't exploit and reward those that do.

Citidel

This is fine during a siege, and people are actually playing but "need to flip keeps cuz no one is on hue" is not the time to do this.

Sadly it seems this is ok with Zeni and their PVP dev @ZOS_BrianWheeler‌ so this must be approved and official, each and every ticket has been ignored... and each and every time its been brought up its been brushed to the side.

FENGRUSH

Okspaghetti wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Okspaghetti wrote: »

Fengrush, you're DC right? Grats on Emp, Well deserved.

yes everyone knows about it, but just not many people do it because its frowned upon.

Thanks. 13 hours of killing EP/AD straight paid off Friday night.

You mean killing EP? AD are sided with you.

I was the first emp on this cycle. I fought AD all the way to the last keep. I held EP 2v25 @ chalman for over an hour while the rest of DC capped the other keeps. I killed AD repeatedly that day at Aleswell farm racking up 100+ kills in 15 mins with just one other guy until they decided to go somewhere else.

The only resistance at the last keep was EP though. The same EP that are led by people that got fed AP by DC players and had DC players help them take keeps from AD 2 cycles ago.

You can cry and *** about DKs pulling people over walls to essentially do whats been a problem in Cyrodill, allowing people to 'trade' emps with 2 factions vs 1 all you want. But realize the real problem is trading emps, not pulling people over walls. Theyre both issues.

But dont forget that the same EP complaining about this, have done the very same trading on that server. Its embarrassing to see you guys cry because youre not the one being traded with.

For how most emps have been crowned on celarus, my emp was actually well deserved, as you say.

Citidel

Well deserved and I wish i was there to enjoy the fight with you, well against you.

I miss fighting the Emperor and having to try hard to stay alive vs their double siege damage, oil pot ftw? But I havent done that since the widespread use of caltrops.

EDIT:
Chain Pulling is just a tiny part of the whole package. The trading is the issue, as you said.

SoulScream

One of my first PVP lessons was to always use immoveable before going close to the wall edge!

bigzz03

HEY!!! I'm famous now!! wooooo!!!!

Ok, so I'm really curious about something here. You guys sit here and complain about people "EXPLOITING" and "CHEATING" in PvP. Please someone explain to me where either one of these takes place in this video, OR anything else we did this weekend.

1. IF ZoS did not want alliances working together there would NOT be a way to contact other alliances using a special system "/tell name, blah blah blah". This system is setup just for communication in PvP.

2. IF ZoS did not want people to be able to bypass walls of keeps they would adjust the vertical that chain pull has. There is no reason to shorten it from a straight pull, but if ZoS was able to shorten the vertical on chain pull this wouldn't happen, just like ambush and bolt escape don't allow you vertical jumps.

3. IF ZoS didn't think about players being able to do this they would NOT have made it where you HAD to have a wall down in a keep in order to flip it. THATS RIGHT!! you can NOT take a keep if BOTH walls have no holes in them. That means they thought about people using chain pull to help other alliances get passed a wall, but you can't go past BOTH walls!

If you guys would take a second to think about the mechanics of AvA and the way ZoS has set up their pvp system you would realize they did think about what they were doing. It's PvP, not everything is supposed to be good, there needs to be bad stuff (2 alliances working against another type of thing).

NOW, where ZoS messed up is by thinking that so many people would play this game and start with 10 campaigns, and then add a 2 week campaign. What this allowed was people to spread out over all the campaigns and lower the population enough to allow this type of alliance team play to happen. If they would have only started with 4-5 campaigns they would be populated enough people would not be able to use this tactic as there would be too many opposing forces to allow it to happen.

As they say, "Hate the game, not the player"

P.S. - Thank you for starting my career on the big screen. Makes me smile seeing me as the staring actor!


-Bigzz The Tank

Fuzzylumpkins

The only thing prohibited are smiles and fun!

The fiery grip being exploited in such a manner should have been spotted a mile away by devs, most certainly after deciding Realms would be mirrored classes. Insight and forethought were short with these devs.

Citidel

bigzz03 wrote: »

HEY!!! I'm famous now!! wooooo!!!!

As they say, "Hate the game, not the player"

-Bigzz The Tank

Famous sure, if that makes you happy I'm also guessing you should be Bigzz the Former Emperor as well. You can say things all you want honestly, we cant stop you even though we want to. Guess its just like the guild bank dupe bug, It didnt effect PVP at all but dear god that got fixed super fast didnt it? But I'm sure that was totally intended as well.

Sorry Everyone Bigzz has spoken this thread is done, Officially sanctioned by ZOS and the ESO team because "how could they not know." All working as intended too which is the best part. No fear of bannings, or removal of Titles\Buffs\AP its like the people that would like to play the game get shafted and the ones that want to do things that make little to no sense PVP wise get to dictate what we get to do.

All hail the keep flippers and their unstoppable army of amazing players.