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• [COMPLETE] Xbox: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – June 17, 10:00PM EDT (June 18, 2:00 UTC) - June 18, 5:00AM EDT (9:00 UTC)
• [COMPLETE] PlayStation®: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – June 17, 10:00PM EDT (June 18, 2:00 UTC) - June 18, 5:00AM EDT (9:00 UTC)
Player Scam Policy
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Stanley✭✭Here we go .. it has started already.
CS deciding what agreements players have made and suspending players who they decide are lying to other players.. madness
"Greetings.
It has been reported to us, that you have been scamming certain players by offering them a vampire bite - getting the money off them and leaving without keeping your part of the deal.
Due to your chatlog I can verify that the actions you took are against our terms of service.
This is a written first warning.
Do not continue with this behavior, or further actions against you have to be taken - leading to suspension from the game or, if continued, permanent ban.
Kind Regards,"
there is no right of appeal offered here and no specific citing of any clause within the TOS.
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I wish they would ban them. I wish they would ban the guilds that are setting up to kill the rare spawn to keep their pockets full. I wish they would ban ANYONE that BUYS gold. In other words I wish they would ban all "low life shady characters" I think that if the person that started this post was not looking to see what he could do about someone scamming him, then he should be banned as well. He should be banned for two reasons, a) he is a COWARD that is posting in the CUSTOMER SERVICE section trying to see if he can STEAL someones gold and not get into trouble, and b) just not very smart
Please Zenimax, BAN ALL people that are doing things that are unethicial, we LIVE in a world FULL of unethicial people... I am not going to pay a subscription for the priviledge of dealing with the lowlife losers that want to cheat people out of anything.0 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
No, you can still do that. You can scam other characters as RP. You just need to make sure their players know and understand what your character is doing, and that they're okay with that. You know, like you have to do with a lot of RP.Scamming violates the TOS . No scamming roleplayers allowed ...
"But, my character would..." is only ever valid after the other participating players have signed off on it and are in fact okay with whatever you're doing.
Remember, RPing is about building a story together, taking on the role of a betrayer can be fun, but it's also a pretty hefty responsibility as well. Otherwise it degenerates into simple trolling.
EDIT: And scamming for a werewolf bite is pretty hard to justify as RP under any circumstances. Lycanthropes and vampires are cursed in TES. This isn't something a character should be seeking out, and spending money on.Edited by starkerealm on April 15, 2014 4:19PM3 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭there is no right of appeal offered here and no specific citing of any clause within the TOS.
That's because it was a warning, no action was taken. They said, "hey, cut this out."
So, what could you appeal?
You want them to unwarn you? Take away your memory of being told to cut it out? Closest you can get to that is probably by downing a fifth of absinthe and waking up tomorrow wondering why your pants are now stapled to the ceiling.8 -
DewiMorgan✭✭✭Incidentally, if/when I get bitten, I'll be /zone chatting that I'm happily giving out bites for free to anyone who asks, to combat griefers. There's no money in selling bites and camping spawns, if people can get it for free.4 -
So if you role play a shady character that rips people off you should be punished for it?
Not if the other player has not agreed to role play or is not aware that you are role playing. Then the player is shady, not only the character.
Ebonheart Pact :: Nord Dragon Knight :: Blacksmith4 -
I would love being able to hunt player vampires.Ebonheart Pact :: Nord Dragon Knight :: Blacksmith2
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TheSzerdi✭✭I actually have no personal interest in scamming other than curiosity. I think the disadvantages of vamp/were outweigh the advantages for PvP, so I doubt I'll deal with it at all. Personally I prefer straight bandit/pirate interactions like, "Pay me or die!" *loots corpse* Since ESO doesn't support that type of interaction anyway I'll just keep ganking reinforcement lines in Cyrodiil with my friends.
Edit to add: It's nice to have an official response on their policy. Be interesting to see if they'll change game mechanics to limit possible scamming further.
Edit 2 to add: I just re-read the rules of conduct in the TOS and didn't see anything specifically about scamming. Will it be added? Or is Zenimax just using a catch-all like "Engage in disruptive behavior in chat areas, game areas, forums, or any other area or aspect of the Services."?Edited by TheSzerdi on April 15, 2014 11:48PM0 -
dermottib14_ESO✭✭✭
Scamming violates our terms of service and we will address it accordingly.Is there one? Or is it whatever you can get away with like in EVE?
Say you offer vamp bite for 20k, collect the gold, then walk away. Will ESO punish people for scamming or is it legit?
Edit to add: I searched support and forums, but didn't see an answer.
Oh really? You scammed me out of $14.95 a month. I can't even progress past the main storyline quest to get to veteren content. Sorry over a week and not fixing a GAME BREAKING bug is unacceptable.
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Kililin✭✭✭✭You can not roleplay a criminal without some kind of legal system.
For example if your legal status was lowered with every criminal action, to the point you became attackable by your own faction it would be ok for me. And you could roleplay a criminal/outlawed, but this game does not provide the mechanics, therefore it is forbidden by the TOS.
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OMG! Wouldn't that be so freaking awesome. I love it! Yes by all means then let the freaking cheats, cheat, but if you get caught.... Paying the fine, Oh wait, you don't have enough gold? I am sorry now you cannot leave x area, FILLED with other low life criminals that got caught. Oh wait, like in real life you come into town with your band of thieves and the town AND PLAYERS in that town rally, kill you and spawncamp your corpse for a freaking month until you stop resubscribingYou can not roleplay a criminal without some kind of legal system.
For example if your legal status was lowered with every criminal action, to the point you became attackable by your own faction it would be ok for me. And you could roleplay a criminal/outlawed, but this game does not provide the mechanics, therefore it is forbidden by the TOS.
Oh a lil gangland justice
1 -
Here we go .. it has started already.
CS deciding what agreements players have made and suspending players who they decide are lying to other players.. madness
"Greetings.
It has been reported to us, that you have been scamming certain players by offering them a vampire bite - getting the money off them and leaving without keeping your part of the deal.
Due to your chatlog I can verify that the actions you took are against our terms of service.
This is a written first warning.
Do not continue with this behavior, or further actions against you have to be taken - leading to suspension from the game or, if continued, permanent ban.
Kind Regards,"
there is no right of appeal offered here and no specific citing of any clause within the TOS.
Good, I hope they perma ban you if chat logs support the accusation.5 -
Holycannoli✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Screw EVE, here in ESO scammers should be banned. Simple as that. Address the problem now and let people know scamming will not be tolerated.Here we go .. it has started already.
CS deciding what agreements players have made and suspending players who they decide are lying to other players.. madness
"Greetings.
It has been reported to us, that you have been scamming certain players by offering them a vampire bite - getting the money off them and leaving without keeping your part of the deal.
Due to your chatlog I can verify that the actions you took are against our terms of service.
This is a written first warning.
Do not continue with this behavior, or further actions against you have to be taken - leading to suspension from the game or, if continued, permanent ban.
Kind Regards,"
there is no right of appeal offered here and no specific citing of any clause within the TOS.
Perfect. That's exactly what I want to see. They're being lenient at first. Personally I would be harsher - one warning and the next time banned - but that's me. I have no tolerance for scammers.Edited by Holycannoli on April 17, 2014 2:25AM7 -
Cry_Wolfe✭✭✭Soraellion wrote: »They can't start policing stuff like that, it would get silly. "deal with it" (or HTFU as we call it in EVE) will/should probably be their reply.
EvE culture is nothing to be proud of.
jestertrek.blogspot.fi/2014/03/the-bonus-round.html?
keep EvE idiocy in EvE please, the gaming world has now done that type of bastardry and can move on to encouraging people to stay human.
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cheeser123✭✭✭dermottib14_ESO wrote: »Oh really? You scammed me out of $14.95 a month. I can't even progress past the main storyline quest to get to veteren content. Sorry over a week and not fixing a GAME BREAKING bug is unacceptable.
...how is this remotely relevant?1 -
South_of_Heaven✭✭✭You are asking ZOS to protect people from their own stupidity on top of solving all other issues the game already has. It is impossible.
Gave me a good laugh, thanks.CrimsonThomas wrote: »Players can only acquire the skill line through these rare Vampire/Werewolf beasts. They have the right to this content by purchasing the game and paying the monthly subscription. The boss-campers have no right to bar off content they do not own for resale. That is theft of property purchased by the affected players and Zenimax could take this a hundred different ways with legal responses, as these people are essentially stealing their intellectual property for resale, which they have no legal right to do.0 -
MysticAura✭✭✭With the thief and brotherhood guilds on the horizon. I hope that they work this type of thing into the justice system.
While I do think these people should be punished, I also believe that they should be punished In game, not out. Botting and gold selling are ooc issues, but this vamp/were thing really doesn't fit the same category.0 -
Holycannoli✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭South_of_Heaven wrote: »You are asking ZOS to protect people from their own stupidity on top of solving all other issues the game already has. It is impossible.
Paying someone for a quick and simple service and said person logging off instead of delivering is not stupidity. It's not some elaborate scam like a nigerian email. Since there's no secure trade window for buying a bite you have to do it the old fashioned way and give them the money first, and they have an oral agreement at that point.
In the real world it's considered fraud and is highly prosecutable.
Edited by Holycannoli on April 17, 2014 2:36AM6 -
Jadeviper1974✭✭✭
Seriously? Wow ...There are some phases where groups are camping the mobs to not let people get bites on their own, to corner the market. My question is why is nobody logging out and back in to get to a new phase instead?
Ok then, i guess that should be reported to ZOS, extortion and all that ...
I wouldn't say this is extortion, you may have the definition of the word mixed up there. These people are just limiting the supply on something that has become a commodity and because of this they can price gouge(Which is an anti-competetive business tactic). In that sense, I can see how this can be frustrating. But there are many phases in this game and the possibility that every phase is filled with people camping this spot just to block other people is low. People just simply need to change phases and move on, don't be upset that some people actually want to corner whatever market they can because the normal market system in this game is flawed and limits growth.
Uhh, price gouging is a form or extortion. I'm not judging I'm just saying.What is written above are my honest opinions. If you agree then; "Great!" If you disagree; "Great!" I really couldn't care less either way.0 -
Makkir✭✭✭✭✭
✭Most other games have policies against intentionally taking advantage of other players. If they wrote out a "Written Agreement" in game in chat "I will bite you for 20k" and one party paid, then the other party is expected to follow through. I doubt, if it really did go down like that, it would be tolerable. In an MMO we are expected to have social interactions like these.1 -
Cry_Wolfe✭✭✭
1It is all very well people wanting lies to be policed in an mmorpg.
1
They individually decide it is a "scam" to lie to someone about a Vampire or WW bite but it is magically ok to lie about turning up to a raid or leave a guild where they made promises etc etc ..usually because of special pleading .. this case is different than that case ...
2
How about "scamming" people for gold by charging ridiculous prices for items because some people dont know what the average price for something is ?
One thing is business the other thing is a scam .. apparently.
3
How many of you agreed exactly when you were going to get a bite ? did you assume it was 3 mins after you paid or .. 3 years or a thousand years ?
If you dont want to invest your time and resources into developing mutually beneficial relationships or gaining knowledge such that you are less likely to be "scammed" or ripped off or .. disappointed then do that.. dont come bleating to the developers because your view of the world doesnt match.
4
No one forced you to trade gold for the promise of a bite. You took a calculated risk and maybe it paid off maybe it did not.
5
We need developers removing genuine barriers to play eg people selling gold for real world currency and [people hacking accounts .. not for in game disputes about trades or agreements to perform in a particular way.
6
We should not allow players to change character names . .that way there is less opportunity to escape an in game reputation.
Many Guilds have restrictive access to raid spots for this very reason. Amongst the higher tier guilds, a player getting a bad name with one guild will influence his ability to join another. Tardy behavior by the way.. is not scamming.
2
Overpriced goods are just that, the decision to buy those goods at that price is completely up to the buyer, this is not a scam
3
are you trying to say that in the REAL WORLD, that when you give money for goods or services, that the vendor then has complete free reign over the delivery window of those goods and services? This is a scam.
4
Trade of money for goods or services is not a risk, it is a contract.
5
You make no sense here. Are you implying that the inability to buy gold via RMT is a genuine barrier to play? That people should be able to hack accounts?
6
I have even less of an idea about your last sentence. I apologise for my ignorance: we can change names? Character names or account names?
otherwise.. everything else you said makes sense.
Edited by Cry_Wolfe on April 17, 2014 2:47AM2 -
South_of_Heaven✭✭✭Holycannoli wrote: »South_of_Heaven wrote: »You are asking ZOS to protect people from their own stupidity on top of solving all other issues the game already has. It is impossible.
Paying someone for a quick and simple service and said person logging off instead of delivering is not stupidity. It's not some elaborate scam like a nigerian email. Since there's no secure trade window for buying a bite you have to do it the old fashioned way and give them the money first, and they have an oral agreement at that point.
In the real world it's considered fraud and is highly prosecutable.
Yes, you are right, trusting a total stranger on the internet, giving him your money and expecting him to keep his word is not stupid, not stupid at all!
As for your real life comparison... maybe I should also start suing people who beat me up in pvp...!
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Holycannoli✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭South_of_Heaven wrote: »Yes, you are right, trusting a total stranger on the internet, giving him your money and expecting him to keep his word is not stupid, not stupid at all!
As for your real life comparison... maybe I should also start suing people who beat me up in pvp...!
You either don't understand, come from EVE, or you're trying to justify scamming by blaming the victim and not the perpetrator. Which one is it?
and it's not about "keeping his word". It's a business transaction. One pays, the other delivers. In almost every transaction the buyer pays before the goods or services are delivered.
This is a case of someone in chat saying "WTS vampire bite, 20k", someone agrees to buy for that price, the seller takes the money and logs off. There is zero defense for that. It's fraud pure and simple.Edited by Holycannoli on April 17, 2014 3:02AM4 -
Cry_Wolfe✭✭✭South_of_Heaven wrote: »You are asking ZOS to protect people from their own stupidity on top of solving all other issues the game already has. It is impossible.
Gave me a good laugh, thanks.CrimsonThomas wrote: »Players can only acquire the skill line through these rare Vampire/Werewolf beasts. They have the right to this content by purchasing the game and paying the monthly subscription. The boss-campers have no right to bar off content they do not own for resale. That is theft of property purchased by the affected players and Zenimax could take this a hundred different ways with legal responses, as these people are essentially stealing their intellectual property for resale, which they have no legal right to do.
No, it is being asked that as well as solving all the other issues in game, that ZOS also deal with the results of their choices as per game mechanics specifically as regards spawn camping and extermination of mobs that gift extra skill lines, with the purpose of then charging other players for access to said skill lines, where upon at delivery of the specified service charge services are withheld.
Thank you for your time.
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Cry_Wolfe✭✭✭South_of_Heaven wrote: »
Yes, you are right, trusting a total stranger on the internet, giving him your money and expecting him to keep his word is not stupid, not stupid at all!
As for your real life comparison... maybe I should also start suing people who beat me up in pvp...!
Companies such as Paypal turn a tidy profit handling the risk of internet fraud.0 -
South_of_Heaven wrote: »Holycannoli wrote: »As for your real life comparison... maybe I should also start suing people who beat me up in pvp...!
Lawyer up sunshine.
Perhaps you will find an ethical lawyer who will inform you as to why this line of reasoning is fallacious or perhaps not...0 -
Jadeviper1974✭✭✭Holycannoli wrote: »Screw EVE, here in ESO scammers should be banned. Simple as that. Address the problem now and let people know scamming will not be tolerated.Here we go .. it has started already.
CS deciding what agreements players have made and suspending players who they decide are lying to other players.. madness
"Greetings.
It has been reported to us, that you have been scamming certain players by offering them a vampire bite - getting the money off them and leaving without keeping your part of the deal.
Due to your chatlog I can verify that the actions you took are against our terms of service.
This is a written first warning.
Do not continue with this behavior, or further actions against you have to be taken - leading to suspension from the game or, if continued, permanent ban.
Kind Regards,"
there is no right of appeal offered here and no specific citing of any clause within the TOS.
Perfect. That's exactly what I want to see. They're being lenient at first. Personally I would be harsher - one warning and the next time banned - but that's me. I have no tolerance for scammers.
As far as I am concerned their warning was the TOS, so banning them out of had is perfectly acceptable.What is written above are my honest opinions. If you agree then; "Great!" If you disagree; "Great!" I really couldn't care less either way.2
