Purge and Unstable Wall

G0ku

Yesterday I was told that purging right now will whipe the whole raid as it´s bugged and will refresh the cooldown of unstable wall of fire from destrostaff. Yet I miss a thread regarding this bug on the forums.

Is the bug for real, someone knew of this issue?

SienneYviete

Yes it's for real there has been a few threads on this, one which discussed how this is possible was removed by the devs, there is also this one.
forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/140648/wall-of-elements/p1

Turelus

Maybe this too is working as intended? :disagree:

Gorthax

what cool down on WoE lol

Valnas

#gina #jessica this is a very annoying issue. Purge is like pouring gas on a fire (accellerant on all dots). This cannot be working as intended.

Also, Cleanse doesn't appear to give the magicka regen benefit of the support tree (10% regen) like efficient purge/purge do. Can anyone confirm this ?

david.haypreub18_ESO

Is this bug still in the game as of latest patch? I didn't see anything about it in the patch notes, so I'm not sure if I should start using Purge again or not.

Draxys

this problem was compounded by all the legolas heroes lethal arrowing everyone and double debuffing them, luckily that's (hopefully) fixed... purify isn't enough though, this needs fixing asap

MiyaTheUnbroken

Draxys wrote: »

this problem was compounded by all the legolas heroes lethal arrowing everyone and double debuffing them, luckily that's (hopefully) fixed... purify isn't enough though, this needs fixing asap

It is allegedly fixed.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/142486/patch-notes-v1-5-7#latest

david.haypreub18_ESO

I don't see anything in those patch notes that mentions Purge?

Draxys

david.haypreub18_ESO wrote: »

I don't see anything in those patch notes that mentions Purge?

purge bug was not fixed, lethal arrow debuff stacking was

david.haypreub18_ESO

I'm glad they fixed the debuff stacking, but the Purge bug to me is just as bad if not worse. It needs to be hotfixed.

Cody

so just dont use purge anymore then?

SienneYviete

Cody wrote: »

so just dont use purge anymore then?

This, pretty much we have been forced to do however trying to get all the other peeps in cyro to do the same is pretty darn hard to do.

ToRelax

Uhm... where is the problem exactly... seriously?
The game has this one "issue" by that a zergball could possibly wipe by anything else than just another zergball or their own stupidity and it's considered gamebreaking now? I heard people complaining about another bug with Wall of Elements, didn't experience that myself, may be. But just the Purge thing with a ground based AoE (so a sorc can negate it) I think is rather adding to the game experience.
And it's not as if purge was the only skill with that you are in certain situations able to harm your alliance mates... healing in sneak, standing between them with curse and unstable core, absorbing there heals because you can't watch your health yourself, setting up useless siege weapons, using them wrong etc.
Can all be very annoying as well (besides curse, buff curse :P ).

Edit: Typos. You can keep the rest.

Huntler

ToRelax wrote: »

Uhm... where is the problem exactly... seriously?
The game has this one "issue" by that a zergball could possibly wipe by anything else than just another zergball or their own stupidity and it's considered gamebreaking now? I heard people complaining about another bug with Wall of Elements, didn't experience that myself, may be. But just the Purge thing with a ground based AoE (so a sorc can negate it) I think is rather adding to the game experience.
And it's not as if purge was the only skill with that you are in certain situations able to harm your alliance mates... healing in sneak, standing between them with curse and unstable core, absorbing there heals because you can't watch your health yourself, setting up useless siege weapons, using them wrong etc.
Can all be very annoying as well (besides curse, buff curse :P ).

Edit: Typos. You can keep the rest.

I don't.... I don't even know how to respond to people like this.... are you real?

krim

Im outraged really, I use purge more than anything even sap.

ToRelax

Huntler wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Uhm... where is the problem exactly... seriously?
The game has this one "issue" by that a zergball could possibly wipe by anything else than just another zergball or their own stupidity and it's considered gamebreaking now? I heard people complaining about another bug with Wall of Elements, didn't experience that myself, may be. But just the Purge thing with a ground based AoE (so a sorc can negate it) I think is rather adding to the game experience.
And it's not as if purge was the only skill with that you are in certain situations able to harm your alliance mates... healing in sneak, standing between them with curse and unstable core, absorbing there heals because you can't watch your health yourself, setting up useless siege weapons, using them wrong etc.
Can all be very annoying as well (besides curse, buff curse :P ).

Edit: Typos. You can keep the rest.

I don't.... I don't even know how to respond to people like this.... are you real?

Yes. I'd say just start at the beginning and do it step by step .

Talcyndl

Interesting that someone with a rather extensive list of "Things to fix" doesn't seem to care about the broken skill that currently has the most "WTF just happened" impact on play in Cyrodiil.

ToRelax

Talcyndl wrote: »

Interesting that someone with a rather extensive list of "Things to fix" doesn't seem to care about the broken skill that currently has the most "WTF just happened" impact on play in Cyrodiil.

Indeed. Makes me really wonder what the problem with this skill is when even I cannot find it.

Talcyndl

ToRelax wrote: »

Talcyndl wrote: »

Interesting that someone with a rather extensive list of "Things to fix" doesn't seem to care about the broken skill that currently has the most "WTF just happened" impact on play in Cyrodiil.

Indeed. Makes me really wonder what the problem with this skill is when even I cannot find it.

You caught us. Purge isn't broken. It doesn't routinely wipe groups on which it is cast. All a big lie we invented because....errrr....wait, someone remind me why we invented this whole thing.

If you are actually curious, and not simply bored and trolling atm, I posted this in another thread (the one ZOS admitted they know about the bug), but it should go here as well. A guildy posted it in our forums, so the credit goes to him.

A Purge cast upon friendlies while in an enemy Wall of Elements, Oil Pot, Veil of Blades, Caltrops or Standard of Might will cause the unticked DoTs to tick-off all at once (instead of removing them), creating health drops that are next to impossible to heal through. It not only defeats the purpose of Purge, but turns what should be a life-saver into a grave-digger. Basically, the ability does the exact opposite of what you are trying to prevent.

Pretty serious bug.

ToRelax

Talcyndl wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Talcyndl wrote: »

Interesting that someone with a rather extensive list of "Things to fix" doesn't seem to care about the broken skill that currently has the most "WTF just happened" impact on play in Cyrodiil.

Indeed. Makes me really wonder what the problem with this skill is when even I cannot find it.

You caught us. Purge isn't broken. It doesn't routinely wipe groups on which it is cast. All a big lie we invented because....errrr....wait, someone remind me why we invented this whole thing.

If you are actually curious, and not simply bored and trolling atm, I posted this in another thread (the one ZOS admitted they know about the bug), but it should go here as well. A guildy posted it in our forums, so the credit goes to him.

A Purge cast upon friendlies while in an enemy Wall of Elements, Oil Pot, Veil of Blades, Caltrops or Standard of Might will cause the unticked DoTs to tick-off all at once (instead of removing them), creating health drops that are next to impossible to heal through. It not only defeats the purpose of Purge, but turns what should be a life-saver into a grave-digger. Basically, the ability does the exact opposite of what you are trying to prevent.

Pretty serious bug.

Pretty much what I am talking about. I just don't see why an organized group, if there is no random purging, would die by it? Seriously, just spamming purge in a zergball is not always a good tactic anymore, how does it break PvP?
What happens if you spread out? Are the players just not good enough or don't have the set up to survive outside the zerg? It's not the enemy killing you with WoE, it's you purging it. What good is a meatbag if you spread out (and can eventually purge even, without wiping your own group)?
I seriously don't see the problem, I see players dieing ingame purging when they are zergballing and I see people complaining on the forums about it. I never see small groups dieing this way.

Jaerlach

ToRelax wrote: »

Talcyndl wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Talcyndl wrote: »

Interesting that someone with a rather extensive list of "Things to fix" doesn't seem to care about the broken skill that currently has the most "WTF just happened" impact on play in Cyrodiil.

Indeed. Makes me really wonder what the problem with this skill is when even I cannot find it.

You caught us. Purge isn't broken. It doesn't routinely wipe groups on which it is cast. All a big lie we invented because....errrr....wait, someone remind me why we invented this whole thing.

If you are actually curious, and not simply bored and trolling atm, I posted this in another thread (the one ZOS admitted they know about the bug), but it should go here as well. A guildy posted it in our forums, so the credit goes to him.

A Purge cast upon friendlies while in an enemy Wall of Elements, Oil Pot, Veil of Blades, Caltrops or Standard of Might will cause the unticked DoTs to tick-off all at once (instead of removing them), creating health drops that are next to impossible to heal through. It not only defeats the purpose of Purge, but turns what should be a life-saver into a grave-digger. Basically, the ability does the exact opposite of what you are trying to prevent.

Pretty serious bug.

Pretty much what I am talking about. I just don't see why an organized group, if there is no random purging, would die by it? Seriously, just spamming purge in a zergball is not always a good tactic anymore, how does it break PvP?
What happens if you spread out? Are the players just not good enough or don't have the set up to survive outside the zerg? It's not the enemy killing you with WoE, it's you purging it. What good is a meatbag if you spread out (and can eventually purge even, without wiping your own group)?
I seriously don't see the problem, I see players dieing ingame purging when they are zergballing and I see people complaining on the forums about it. I never see small groups dieing this way.

OK take a keep while spread out so purge is safe. No? OK then. So there's a problem.

The two biggest issues in pvp: purge and healing springs lag, both have the highest impact in the most important parts of the campaign, keep and scroll captures.

ToRelax

Jaerlach wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Talcyndl wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Talcyndl wrote: »

Interesting that someone with a rather extensive list of "Things to fix" doesn't seem to care about the broken skill that currently has the most "WTF just happened" impact on play in Cyrodiil.

Indeed. Makes me really wonder what the problem with this skill is when even I cannot find it.

You caught us. Purge isn't broken. It doesn't routinely wipe groups on which it is cast. All a big lie we invented because....errrr....wait, someone remind me why we invented this whole thing.

If you are actually curious, and not simply bored and trolling atm, I posted this in another thread (the one ZOS admitted they know about the bug), but it should go here as well. A guildy posted it in our forums, so the credit goes to him.

A Purge cast upon friendlies while in an enemy Wall of Elements, Oil Pot, Veil of Blades, Caltrops or Standard of Might will cause the unticked DoTs to tick-off all at once (instead of removing them), creating health drops that are next to impossible to heal through. It not only defeats the purpose of Purge, but turns what should be a life-saver into a grave-digger. Basically, the ability does the exact opposite of what you are trying to prevent.

Pretty serious bug.

Pretty much what I am talking about. I just don't see why an organized group, if there is no random purging, would die by it? Seriously, just spamming purge in a zergball is not always a good tactic anymore, how does it break PvP?
What happens if you spread out? Are the players just not good enough or don't have the set up to survive outside the zerg? It's not the enemy killing you with WoE, it's you purging it. What good is a meatbag if you spread out (and can eventually purge even, without wiping your own group)?
I seriously don't see the problem, I see players dieing ingame purging when they are zergballing and I see people complaining on the forums about it. I never see small groups dieing this way.

OK take a keep while spread out so purge is safe. No? OK then. So there's a problem.

[...]

Did you try? Did you get a raid together, consisting of experienced players who are acceptable PvPers outside their zerg? I don't know of any such group of more than maybe 12 players on the EU Megaserver. But that's another "problem".

Jaerlach

ToRelax wrote: »

Jaerlach wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Talcyndl wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Talcyndl wrote: »

Interesting that someone with a rather extensive list of "Things to fix" doesn't seem to care about the broken skill that currently has the most "WTF just happened" impact on play in Cyrodiil.

Indeed. Makes me really wonder what the problem with this skill is when even I cannot find it.

You caught us. Purge isn't broken. It doesn't routinely wipe groups on which it is cast. All a big lie we invented because....errrr....wait, someone remind me why we invented this whole thing.

If you are actually curious, and not simply bored and trolling atm, I posted this in another thread (the one ZOS admitted they know about the bug), but it should go here as well. A guildy posted it in our forums, so the credit goes to him.

A Purge cast upon friendlies while in an enemy Wall of Elements, Oil Pot, Veil of Blades, Caltrops or Standard of Might will cause the unticked DoTs to tick-off all at once (instead of removing them), creating health drops that are next to impossible to heal through. It not only defeats the purpose of Purge, but turns what should be a life-saver into a grave-digger. Basically, the ability does the exact opposite of what you are trying to prevent.

Pretty serious bug.

Pretty much what I am talking about. I just don't see why an organized group, if there is no random purging, would die by it? Seriously, just spamming purge in a zergball is not always a good tactic anymore, how does it break PvP?
What happens if you spread out? Are the players just not good enough or don't have the set up to survive outside the zerg? It's not the enemy killing you with WoE, it's you purging it. What good is a meatbag if you spread out (and can eventually purge even, without wiping your own group)?
I seriously don't see the problem, I see players dieing ingame purging when they are zergballing and I see people complaining on the forums about it. I never see small groups dieing this way.

OK take a keep while spread out so purge is safe. No? OK then. So there's a problem.

[...]

Did you try? Did you get a raid together, consisting of experienced players who are acceptable PvPers outside their zerg? I don't know of any such group of more than maybe 12 players on the EU Megaserver. But that's another "problem".

Sure you can take dragonclaw or brindle or kingscrest this way but you're not pushing a scroll with 12 people without your pugs coming and a lagfeat ensuing.

Talcyndl

Purge was used by every good group and many random pugs as well. Even after the change to oil, it was considered an essential skill. Now, it is a negative in almost every situation where it would have been used.

As for good groups not using it...they don't. But the great/sucky thing about Cyrodiil, is you are playing with other people. Many times they are trying to be helpful. Because the purge bug, their "help" can wipe entire groups. That's especially true rushing breaches or on keep and resource flags.

ToRelax

Jaerlach wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Jaerlach wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Talcyndl wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Talcyndl wrote: »

Interesting that someone with a rather extensive list of "Things to fix" doesn't seem to care about the broken skill that currently has the most "WTF just happened" impact on play in Cyrodiil.

Indeed. Makes me really wonder what the problem with this skill is when even I cannot find it.

You caught us. Purge isn't broken. It doesn't routinely wipe groups on which it is cast. All a big lie we invented because....errrr....wait, someone remind me why we invented this whole thing.

If you are actually curious, and not simply bored and trolling atm, I posted this in another thread (the one ZOS admitted they know about the bug), but it should go here as well. A guildy posted it in our forums, so the credit goes to him.

A Purge cast upon friendlies while in an enemy Wall of Elements, Oil Pot, Veil of Blades, Caltrops or Standard of Might will cause the unticked DoTs to tick-off all at once (instead of removing them), creating health drops that are next to impossible to heal through. It not only defeats the purpose of Purge, but turns what should be a life-saver into a grave-digger. Basically, the ability does the exact opposite of what you are trying to prevent.

Pretty serious bug.

Pretty much what I am talking about. I just don't see why an organized group, if there is no random purging, would die by it? Seriously, just spamming purge in a zergball is not always a good tactic anymore, how does it break PvP?
What happens if you spread out? Are the players just not good enough or don't have the set up to survive outside the zerg? It's not the enemy killing you with WoE, it's you purging it. What good is a meatbag if you spread out (and can eventually purge even, without wiping your own group)?
I seriously don't see the problem, I see players dieing ingame purging when they are zergballing and I see people complaining on the forums about it. I never see small groups dieing this way.

OK take a keep while spread out so purge is safe. No? OK then. So there's a problem.

[...]

Did you try? Did you get a raid together, consisting of experienced players who are acceptable PvPers outside their zerg? I don't know of any such group of more than maybe 12 players on the EU Megaserver. But that's another "problem".

Sure you can take dragonclaw or brindle or kingscrest this way but you're not pushing a scroll with 12 people without your pugs coming and a lagfeat ensuing.

Am I seeing it correctly that you are complaining that your own group is less effective the more random players you have on your side, currently?
Would it solve that issue then, if ZOS would not hide information but rather inform people about purge and write it in it's tooltip? I see a risk for exploiting here of course. I also don't think if this was intended as it is it would be good game design. But I find it better for the moment than if purge would just remove those effects or not effect them at all because of the lack of counters against zergs.

edit: typo

Jaerlach

I'm not in an elite guild but i am at least informed. But the reality is that any big push will bring more allies and more enemies and put em all in an enclosed space, where laggy strategies and strats based on the bug (woe and meat bag the flag to elicit a purge, etc) are decisive. There's nothing anyone can do to stop that. And that's why it has to be fixed.

Etaniel

ToRelax wrote: »

Jaerlach wrote: »

Am I seeing it correctly that you are complaining that your own group is less effective the more random players you have on your side, currently?
Would it solve that issue then, if ZOS would not hide information but rather inform people about purge and write it in it's tooltip? I see a risk for exploiting here of course. I also don't think if this was intended as it is it would be good game design. But I find it better for the moment than if purge would just remove those effects or not effect them at all because of the lack of counters against zergs.

edit: typo

I think you are missing the point here. You can't really get rid of purge when you're trying to cap a keep for example. When going through the inner breach, there's always going to be oil, don't purge the oil, you will most likely die. But, as it stands now, if you purge when under the oil, you will insta die because someone spammed wall of elements on the breach and purging the oil wil have the side effect of triggering the full dmg of the wall instantly.
Heal through the dmg and don't purge while going through? that's where the random factor comes in and you might get accidently purged to death. And you can't really go through a well defended breach solo so that's not an option either.

There's nothing to argue about, it just needs fixing. (although i've never actually experienced the unstable wall bug, only heard about it)

Jaerlach

Etaniel wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Jaerlach wrote: »

Am I seeing it correctly that you are complaining that your own group is less effective the more random players you have on your side, currently?
Would it solve that issue then, if ZOS would not hide information but rather inform people about purge and write it in it's tooltip? I see a risk for exploiting here of course. I also don't think if this was intended as it is it would be good game design. But I find it better for the moment than if purge would just remove those effects or not effect them at all because of the lack of counters against zergs.

edit: typo

I think you are missing the point here. You can't really get rid of purge when you're trying to cap a keep for example. When going through the inner breach, there's always going to be oil, don't purge the oil, you will most likely die. But, as it stands now, if you purge when under the oil, you will insta die because someone spammed wall of elements on the breach and purging the oil wil have the side effect of triggering the full dmg of the wall instantly.
Heal through the dmg and don't purge while going through? that's where the random factor comes in and you might get accidently purged to death. And you can't really go through a well defended breach solo so that's not an option either.

There's nothing to argue about, it just needs fixing. (although i've never actually experienced the unstable wall bug, only heard about it)

Lucky EU. In na, you intentionally target oil cats, meatbags and woe into choke points to wipe a zerg. Either they are slowed and healcut and die to your damage or explode in purge. The only counter is retreating manuever and purify spam. Only vwry organized groups pull it off.

ToRelax

@Etaniel , @Jaerlach something wrong with those quotations ^^ ?

Anyway:

Jaerlach wrote: »

Lucky EU. In na, you intentionally target oil cats, meatbags and woe into choke points to wipe a zerg. Either they are slowed and healcut and die to your damage or explode in purge. The only counter is retreating manuever and purify spam. Only vwry organized groups pull it off.

That happens in EU as well of course, just that intelligent groups are clever enough to go around and attack the meatbag directly in it's deadzone.

Tripwyr

ToRelax wrote: »

@Etaniel , @Jaerlach something wrong with those quotations ^^ ?

Anyway:

Jaerlach wrote: »

Lucky EU. In na, you intentionally target oil cats, meatbags and woe into choke points to wipe a zerg. Either they are slowed and healcut and die to your damage or explode in purge. The only counter is retreating manuever and purify spam. Only vwry organized groups pull it off.

That happens in EU as well of course, just that intelligent groups are clever enough to go around and attack the meatbag directly in it's deadzone.

Yeah, I get the feeling Jaerlach isn't in a particularly high-level group if he's having problems with this. Organized groups figured out how to deal with this weeks ago.