The Gold Road Chapter – which includes the Scribing system – and Update 42 is now available to test on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/656454/
ZoS incompetence rears its head again (re: initial champion points nerf)
onlinegamer1
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What is it with ZOS that causes them to make such bad decisions about ESO?
"You can keep earning XP and you'll get more champion points when CS goes live."
"Uh, oops, no, its fixed at 30 pts for everyone with 1 or more Vets, sorry you wasted your time."
Seriously? That is a monumental level of incompetence.
Here are some alternate ideas which I am going to free-type right now, thinking them up as I go. Let see... uh...
1. You get base of 30. Then you get +1 extra for each Vet char you have.
2. You get base of 30. Then you get +1 for every 10 Vet levels all your characters have.
3. You get 1 base, but you get +1 for every 3 Vet levels all your characters have.
Lets stop there. Say I have one account with 8 VR14s (the max you could have) and one account with only 1 VR1.
1. I get 38 CPs vs 31 CPs
2. I get 41 CPs vs 30 CPs
3. I get 38 CPs vs 1 CPs
So, while FREE THINKING, I came up with NOT ONE, NOT TWO, but THREE SUPERIOR IDEAS TO ZOS which doesn't RENEG on their promise that XP earned now will grant more CPs, YET still keeps players fairly balanced with each other except for the last option (which we can eliminate).
Whoever is the "idea person" over at ZOS needs ... better ideas.
EDIT:
Ok, I spent 60 seconds thinking this time.
Idea 4:
- You gain the greater of the following two numbers of CPs when the Champion System goes live, with a CAP of 50 CPs:
A. You gain 1 Champion point for every 1 million XP you've earned on all your VR characters.
B. You gain 30 CPs.
Examples:
- You have only 1 VR1 character. You gain 30 CPs. (due to B )
- You have 1 VR 14 and 1 VR 5. You gain 30 CPs. (due to B )
- You have 2 VR14s, and a VR5, all of which are exactly those levels (no extra XP earned). You gain 14+14+5 = 33 CPs.
- You have 1 VR14 but gained 20 million EXP on it since ZoS announced the Champion System and promised the XP earned would count: You gain 34 CPs.
- You have 8 VR14s (regardless of XP). You gain 50 CPs (you hit cap)
Difference between the lowest possible char and highest possible char: 20 CP difference (30 vs 50).
Again, I am a random player and spent precisely 60 seconds thinking of this solution, not a paid game designer hired by ZoS.
Edited by onlinegamer1 on December 21, 2014 7:06PM "You can keep earning XP and you'll get more champion points when CS goes live."
"Uh, oops, no, its fixed at 30 pts for everyone with 1 or more Vets, sorry you wasted your time."
Seriously? That is a monumental level of incompetence.
Here are some alternate ideas which I am going to free-type right now, thinking them up as I go. Let see... uh...
1. You get base of 30. Then you get +1 extra for each Vet char you have.
2. You get base of 30. Then you get +1 for every 10 Vet levels all your characters have.
3. You get 1 base, but you get +1 for every 3 Vet levels all your characters have.
Lets stop there. Say I have one account with 8 VR14s (the max you could have) and one account with only 1 VR1.
1. I get 38 CPs vs 31 CPs
2. I get 41 CPs vs 30 CPs
3. I get 38 CPs vs 1 CPs
So, while FREE THINKING, I came up with NOT ONE, NOT TWO, but THREE SUPERIOR IDEAS TO ZOS which doesn't RENEG on their promise that XP earned now will grant more CPs, YET still keeps players fairly balanced with each other except for the last option (which we can eliminate).
Whoever is the "idea person" over at ZOS needs ... better ideas.
EDIT:
Ok, I spent 60 seconds thinking this time.
Idea 4:
- You gain the greater of the following two numbers of CPs when the Champion System goes live, with a CAP of 50 CPs:
A. You gain 1 Champion point for every 1 million XP you've earned on all your VR characters.
B. You gain 30 CPs.
Examples:
- You have only 1 VR1 character. You gain 30 CPs. (due to B )
- You have 1 VR 14 and 1 VR 5. You gain 30 CPs. (due to B )
- You have 2 VR14s, and a VR5, all of which are exactly those levels (no extra XP earned). You gain 14+14+5 = 33 CPs.
- You have 1 VR14 but gained 20 million EXP on it since ZoS announced the Champion System and promised the XP earned would count: You gain 34 CPs.
- You have 8 VR14s (regardless of XP). You gain 50 CPs (you hit cap)
Difference between the lowest possible char and highest possible char: 20 CP difference (30 vs 50).
Again, I am a random player and spent precisely 60 seconds thinking of this solution, not a paid game designer hired by ZoS.
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Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The initial amount of champion points was always meant to be capped, they made it no secret.13 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭@onlinegamer1
Yeh because the people that leveled 7 characters to max level in 3 days using the Scorpion grind and/or the bittermaw grind should really be ahead of everyone else in the new system.Edited by timidobserver on December 20, 2014 12:17AMV16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)37 -
dharbert✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭timidobserver wrote: »@onlinegamer1
Yeh because the people that leveled 7 characters to max level in 3 days using the Scorpion grind and/or the bittermaw grind should really be ahead of everyone else in the new system.
I can see both sides of this. On the one hand, ZOS did say that our XP gain past VR14 was being tracked and was going to benefit us when the Champion System comes out. Apparently, they changed their mind.
On the other hand, even if everyone starts off equally with 30 Champion points, your character is still VR14 and the other player who got 30 Champion points is only VR1 and is still nowhere near your level. You still have better gear, more health, more skills, etc....3 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The initial amount of champion points was always meant to be capped, they made it no secret.
True, but not capped at a number equal to a vet 1 character. Let's not try to brush this under the rug with lies.
They said they were tracking xp beyond v14 - this means that you would get more points for being v5 than v1, or more for having played v14 longer than someone who just hit v14 the day 1.6 launches. We all knew this, let's not pretend we didn't.
What it meant was that me, having 5 v14s didn't expect to start with 150 points, but did expect to have more points than the guy that just hit v1 with one character the day 1.6 launches. Especially since that means he will have 8 opportunities to earn xp through silver/gold, where I only have 2 and a half (I also have a v5) (Also, I have done silver/gold on them all, so even players that just grinded can at least go back and do the quests).
I'm sure those players that don't play much or level slowly are loving this, but in the end, it's really not fair to some of us.-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC9 -
firstdecan✭✭✭✭✭
✭Is this true? Last I read (somewhere) was that the intention was to allow characters with multiple VR toons to contribute to their initial pool. A player with 1 VR14 toon would get 'x' amount of champ points, whereas a payer with 2 VR 14 toons would get 1.5x or 2x champ points. The intention was to cap it, but the last I read the cap would be high enough where progression on multiple characters would count.
I know everything is conjecture right now, and also subject to change, but I wonder if there is an official source for the 30 point cap.1 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭firstdecan wrote: »Is this true? Last I read (somewhere) was that the intention was to allow characters with multiple VR toons to contribute to their initial pool. A player with 1 VR14 toon would get 'x' amount of champ points, whereas a payer with 2 VR 14 toons would get 1.5x or 2x champ points. The intention was to cap it, but the last I read the cap would be high enough where progression on multiple characters would count.
I know everything is conjecture right now, and also subject to change, but I wonder if there is an official source for the 30 point cap.
Everyone is going off of this from ESO Live that just aired:Since we changed each constellation to max out at 100 stars, that changed the significance of each point. That changed the way we want players to be spending points, it’s currently around 1 hour of play-time to earn a Champion point. As long as you have a Veteran Rank character, you will start with 30 points in the Champion System once 1.6 goes live. Every character on your account will have those 30 points to spend, it’s not a shared pool. There’s several reasons why we did that, is that we didn’t want players to be vastly separated at the start of the system. Everything has been re-balanced, trials, dungeons, overworld, etc… We wanted to make sure that players can continue doing the content that they currently can do. We wanted to avoid situations where certain pieces of game content have become significantly harder when the Champion System releases. When the system first comes out, there is a respec system that will be pretty cheap so that players can experiment and get comfortable with the system. Later on there will be a standard gold cost for re-speccing your Champion passives.
And we are hoping for clarification, but it certainly reads that way.
-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC1 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm sure those players that don't play much or level slowly are loving this, but in the end, it's really not fair to some of us.
Anyone who grinded xp in the hope of gaining an initial advantage in the CP amount knew he is risking being over the cap already and not getting anything from his grind(since the actual cap was unknown).
I have four veteran characters and i am not bothered by this.8 -
onlinegamer1✭✭✭✭✭
✭"There’s several reasons why we did that, is that we didn’t want players to be vastly separated at the start of the system."
I think they don't know what the word "vastly" means. Everyone at 30 is NO SEPARATION.
My 1st idea (which I WINGED as I was typing) is superior in that there is a TINY difference, but the player's time spent leveling isn't POOPED on entirely.11 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm sure those players that don't play much or level slowly are loving this, but in the end, it's really not fair to some of us.
Anyone who grinded xp in the hope of gaining an initial advantage in the CP amount knew he is risking being over the cap already and not getting anything from his grind(since the actual cap was unknown).
I have four veteran characters and i am not bothered by this.
What about those of us that didn't grind? I have completed the quests on all my guys, I have no content to go back and do for points. My choices are PvP (which I don't like) or grinding for points (which isn't what I pay a sub for). I'd love to just do quests and earn points. I now have two non vet characters that I can do that with, that's it, until they add more content to the game. Or slowly walk my way up the ladder with daily pledges (a little slower than being able to spend a few hours questing).-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC9 -
Rev Rielle✭✭✭✭✭
✭If you think playing the game is wasting your time then honestly I think you need to take a critical look at the reasons why you play.Edited by Rev Rielle on December 20, 2014 12:49AMIf you can be anything, be kind.19 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm sure those players that don't play much or level slowly are loving this, but in the end, it's really not fair to some of us.
Anyone who grinded xp in the hope of gaining an initial advantage in the CP amount knew he is risking being over the cap already and not getting anything from his grind(since the actual cap was unknown).
I have four veteran characters and i am not bothered by this.
What about those of us that didn't grind? I have completed the quests on all my guys, I have no content to go back and do for points. My choices are PvP (which I don't like) or grinding for points (which isn't what I pay a sub for). I'd love to just do quests and earn points. I now have two non vet characters that I can do that with, that's it, until they add more content to the game. Or slowly walk my way up the ladder with daily pledges (a little slower than being able to spend a few hours questing).
They mentioned in the live that they aim for all activities in the game to award champion points at roughly the same rate. So whatever your favorite activity is, chances are you will be able to gain CP through it.2 -
Teargrants✭✭✭✭✭
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What if my favorite activity is AFKing?
They mentioned in the live that they aim for all activities in the game to award champion points at roughly the same rate. So whatever your favorite activity is, chances are you will be able to gain CP through it.POST EQVITEM SEDET ATRA CVRA
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~Teargrants YouTube~
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xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm sure those players that don't play much or level slowly are loving this, but in the end, it's really not fair to some of us.
Anyone who grinded xp in the hope of gaining an initial advantage in the CP amount knew he is risking being over the cap already and not getting anything from his grind(since the actual cap was unknown).
I have four veteran characters and i am not bothered by this.
What about those of us that didn't grind? I have completed the quests on all my guys, I have no content to go back and do for points. My choices are PvP (which I don't like) or grinding for points (which isn't what I pay a sub for). I'd love to just do quests and earn points. I now have two non vet characters that I can do that with, that's it, until they add more content to the game. Or slowly walk my way up the ladder with daily pledges (a little slower than being able to spend a few hours questing).
They mentioned in the live that they aim for all activities in the game to award champion points at roughly the same rate. So whatever your favorite activity is, chances are you will be able to gain CP through it.
I like questing. But with only two non vets and one half way through vet ranks, the amount of quests I have available is MUCH less than someone whose first character just hit v1.
Unless they plan on giving us a million points every time we do an undaunted pledge or run the arena, my v14s aren't going to earn that many points.-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC8 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm sure those players that don't play much or level slowly are loving this, but in the end, it's really not fair to some of us.
Anyone who grinded xp in the hope of gaining an initial advantage in the CP amount knew he is risking being over the cap already and not getting anything from his grind(since the actual cap was unknown).
I have four veteran characters and i am not bothered by this.
What about those of us that didn't grind? I have completed the quests on all my guys, I have no content to go back and do for points. My choices are PvP (which I don't like) or grinding for points (which isn't what I pay a sub for). I'd love to just do quests and earn points. I now have two non vet characters that I can do that with, that's it, until they add more content to the game. Or slowly walk my way up the ladder with daily pledges (a little slower than being able to spend a few hours questing).
They mentioned in the live that they aim for all activities in the game to award champion points at roughly the same rate. So whatever your favorite activity is, chances are you will be able to gain CP through it.
I like questing. But with only two non vets and one half way through vet ranks, the amount of quests I have available is MUCH less than someone whose first character just hit v1.
Unless they plan on giving us a million points every time we do an undaunted pledge or run the arena, my v14s aren't going to earn that many points.
They said that they want all activities to award roughly the same amount of champion points. I am fairly sure that includes the activities done by veteran rank 14 characters who already did the majority of quests.1 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Teargrants wrote: »
In that case you will be collecting Enlightement. It is something like rested XP (except you collect it even when online) and while you have it, your champion points bar gets a 4x boost.5 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm sure those players that don't play much or level slowly are loving this, but in the end, it's really not fair to some of us.
Anyone who grinded xp in the hope of gaining an initial advantage in the CP amount knew he is risking being over the cap already and not getting anything from his grind(since the actual cap was unknown).
I have four veteran characters and i am not bothered by this.
What about those of us that didn't grind? I have completed the quests on all my guys, I have no content to go back and do for points. My choices are PvP (which I don't like) or grinding for points (which isn't what I pay a sub for). I'd love to just do quests and earn points. I now have two non vet characters that I can do that with, that's it, until they add more content to the game. Or slowly walk my way up the ladder with daily pledges (a little slower than being able to spend a few hours questing).
They mentioned in the live that they aim for all activities in the game to award champion points at roughly the same rate. So whatever your favorite activity is, chances are you will be able to gain CP through it.
I like questing. But with only two non vets and one half way through vet ranks, the amount of quests I have available is MUCH less than someone whose first character just hit v1.
Unless they plan on giving us a million points every time we do an undaunted pledge or run the arena, my v14s aren't going to earn that many points.
They said that they want all activities to award roughly the same amount of champion points. I am fairly sure that includes the activities done by veteran rank 14 characters who already did the majority of quests.
They also said they were tracking xp past v14 so that when you earned xp you'd still get credit for it when the champion system rolled out.
But, let's be real, when they say that, they mean they want pve and pvp to award the same amount of points per hour played. But anyone that has leveled even one character should know that there is a big difference between points earned from killing a dungeon boss and from turning in quests (huge difference actually). Those that still have questing, especially main story questing, will have a huge advantage in the rate they gain points over a PvEr that has completed most of the content and just running a pledge a day.-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC5 -
Gyudan✭✭✭✭✭
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I think it's more about having spent a lot of time building different characters, and being "rewarded" with a clear disadvantage compared to the newcomers.Rev Rielle wrote: »If you think playing the game is wasting your time then honestly I think you need to take a critical look at the reasons why you play.
This issue is very similar to the one we had when update 5 went live with the undaunted level. Players suddenly got access to level 9 undaunted instead of level 5, with the dungeon achievements granting quick xp in that line. Those who had done the achievements before never got back credited and ended up reaching the max level in the undaunted line much later than those who had barely started dungeoning.
The Undaunted level wasn't much of a concern because it only takes a few weeks to max it anyway. The champion system, however, is supposedly the ground for the entire character progression after level 50, amounting to hundreds of hours of playtime.Wololo.6 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm sure those players that don't play much or level slowly are loving this, but in the end, it's really not fair to some of us.
Anyone who grinded xp in the hope of gaining an initial advantage in the CP amount knew he is risking being over the cap already and not getting anything from his grind(since the actual cap was unknown).
I have four veteran characters and i am not bothered by this.
What about those of us that didn't grind? I have completed the quests on all my guys, I have no content to go back and do for points. My choices are PvP (which I don't like) or grinding for points (which isn't what I pay a sub for). I'd love to just do quests and earn points. I now have two non vet characters that I can do that with, that's it, until they add more content to the game. Or slowly walk my way up the ladder with daily pledges (a little slower than being able to spend a few hours questing).
They mentioned in the live that they aim for all activities in the game to award champion points at roughly the same rate. So whatever your favorite activity is, chances are you will be able to gain CP through it.
I like questing. But with only two non vets and one half way through vet ranks, the amount of quests I have available is MUCH less than someone whose first character just hit v1.
Unless they plan on giving us a million points every time we do an undaunted pledge or run the arena, my v14s aren't going to earn that many points.
They said that they want all activities to award roughly the same amount of champion points. I am fairly sure that includes the activities done by veteran rank 14 characters who already did the majority of quests.
They also said they were tracking xp past v14 so that when you earned xp you'd still get credit for it when the champion system rolled out.
I'm getting a feeling you just want to complain for the sake of complaining.
"Yea they said they will do X, but in the past they said they will do Y and did not, so i am going to complain about them not doing X in advance!"
Have fun.
Edited by Sharee on December 20, 2014 1:05AM4 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm sure those players that don't play much or level slowly are loving this, but in the end, it's really not fair to some of us.
Anyone who grinded xp in the hope of gaining an initial advantage in the CP amount knew he is risking being over the cap already and not getting anything from his grind(since the actual cap was unknown).
I have four veteran characters and i am not bothered by this.
What about those of us that didn't grind? I have completed the quests on all my guys, I have no content to go back and do for points. My choices are PvP (which I don't like) or grinding for points (which isn't what I pay a sub for). I'd love to just do quests and earn points. I now have two non vet characters that I can do that with, that's it, until they add more content to the game. Or slowly walk my way up the ladder with daily pledges (a little slower than being able to spend a few hours questing).
They mentioned in the live that they aim for all activities in the game to award champion points at roughly the same rate. So whatever your favorite activity is, chances are you will be able to gain CP through it.
I like questing. But with only two non vets and one half way through vet ranks, the amount of quests I have available is MUCH less than someone whose first character just hit v1.
Unless they plan on giving us a million points every time we do an undaunted pledge or run the arena, my v14s aren't going to earn that many points.
They said that they want all activities to award roughly the same amount of champion points. I am fairly sure that includes the activities done by veteran rank 14 characters who already did the majority of quests.
They also said they were tracking xp past v14 so that when you earned xp you'd still get credit for it when the champion system rolled out.
I'm getting a feeling you just want to complain for the sake of complaining.
"Yea they said they will do X, but in the past they said they will do Y and did not, so i am going to complain about them not doing X in advance!"
Have fun.
Then you would be wrong. I've explained my position several times in the main thread about this issue. It's pretty clear it's about more than "just complaining."-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC9 -
smacx250✭✭✭✭✭I wonder - and it is really no more than that - if something else will happen in the final phase when the VR levels are removed. Such as, for now everyone gets 30 champion points but also keeps their VR levels, and then when the final phase rolls out and VR levels go away, some other kind of champion point compensation is given in place of the "lost" VR levels.
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xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I wonder - and it is really no more than that - if something else will happen in the final phase when the VR levels are removed. Such as, for now everyone gets 30 champion points but also keeps their VR levels, and then when the final phase rolls out and VR levels go away, some other kind of champion point compensation is given in place of the "lost" VR levels.
I wonder that too. Love to hear from ZoS on the subject.-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC0 -
Enodoc✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm sure those players that don't play much or level slowly are loving this, but in the end, it's really not fair to some of us.
Anyone who grinded xp in the hope of gaining an initial advantage in the CP amount knew he is risking being over the cap already and not getting anything from his grind(since the actual cap was unknown).
I have four veteran characters and i am not bothered by this.
What about those of us that didn't grind? I have completed the quests on all my guys, I have no content to go back and do for points. My choices are PvP (which I don't like) or grinding for points (which isn't what I pay a sub for). I'd love to just do quests and earn points. I now have two non vet characters that I can do that with, that's it, until they add more content to the game. Or slowly walk my way up the ladder with daily pledges (a little slower than being able to spend a few hours questing).
They mentioned in the live that they aim for all activities in the game to award champion points at roughly the same rate. So whatever your favorite activity is, chances are you will be able to gain CP through it.
I like questing. But with only two non vets and one half way through vet ranks, the amount of quests I have available is MUCH less than someone whose first character just hit v1.
Unless they plan on giving us a million points every time we do an undaunted pledge or run the arena, my v14s aren't going to earn that many points.
They said that they want all activities to award roughly the same amount of champion points. I am fairly sure that includes the activities done by veteran rank 14 characters who already did the majority of quests.
When all activities that give the most XP are already completed though, and those activities can only be done once, this can't happen, as CPs come from XP.
Also, there'a already a thread on this. If we want ZOS to comment on this issue, it's best if all the thoughts are in one place http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/143523/champion-points/p1Edited by Enodoc on December 20, 2014 1:32AMUESP: The Unofficial Elder Scrolls Pages - A collaborative source for all knowledge on the Elder Scrolls series since 1995
Join us on Discord - discord.gg/uesp3 -
xMovingTarget✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Hmmm. So player Bob just starts to play the game and makes it barely to vr1 before champ hits, he gets 30 points.
Whilst myself playing this since 30.3.2014(early headstart) with like 1000+ hours ingame playtime, multiple vr14s, cleared all content also gets 30? This is my understanding after the live show. This needs clarification.
This does sound so wrong. What did they track xp for then?Edited by xMovingTarget on December 20, 2014 2:14AM9 -
RDMyers65b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭When Maria Aliprando, Gameplay Designer on the Champion System gave her answer, she said:
Continue to play! We are tracking your XP as you advance your way through Veteran Ranks and even past VR14. When the Champion System comes out we will reward you points right away based on the amount of XP you have earned up to a cap. In general, most people won’t reach the cap and we do not know what that cap is yet. We're still working out that value and making sure to take a look at the XP you all are earning.
They have /always/ said it didn't matter how many Veteran characters you have, everyone would get the same no matter if they were V1 or V14. The only thing new is we now know the cap is 30 champion points.Edited by RDMyers65b14_ESO on December 20, 2014 4:18AM5 -
derpsticks✭✭✭✭Those 30 points are the equivalent of 5 days play time as if it were used to solely grind champion points without rested xp (aka enlightenment).
This is because they stated that the rate to gain a point while enlightened is 1 hour. They also said enlightenment grants 4x the regular amount of xp towards a champion point. I don't think this means xp is earned 4x faster while enlightened, it is just 4x more valuable.
So 30 points at 4 hours each is 120 hours or exactly 5 days /played.
Even with 1000 hours of play time since early release they are still awarding you for 12% of that time.
Who here has /played at least 5 days time since 1.5 went live?
Sure someone with a total of 10 days or 240 hours /played will get a 50% play time equivalent award, do they deserve it? Yes.
For them that 10 days probably consisted of mostly non vet content, with around a day of vr1+. So here ZOS applied enough rested xp to earn those 30 points at a rate of 1 per hour. Therefore, a new 10 day account spent 8.75 days building enlightenment, and the remaining 1.25 earning champion points. In other words, they were awarded champion points for 12.5% of their time.
Lets assume that a 1000 hour account also spent 10 days online, post 1.5.
Now, this means they spent 240 hours either earning champion points, leveling an alt, or just messing around. They most likely didn't level a non vet character and instead played with a vr character. At worst, having no enlightenment, this player could earn 60 champion points at 1 per 4 hours on a vet character. However, the vast majority of players most likely spent a large portion of their 10 days time earning at a vastly inefficient rate so instead of awarding points for 25% of the hours played they were probably awarded something closer to average. In this case, my best guess is the average was darn close to awarding these players for 12.5% of the hours they played.
So the rate at which a new player could earn champion points within 10 days using enlightenment is roughly the same rate that an average vet player was earning them without enlightenment in the same time frame.
Am I saying you should've been awarded more? Maybe, maybe not. It is hard to say.
Finally lets look at how many points leveling from vr1 to vr14 should award.
Lets assume the same ratio of days spent earning enlightenment to days spent using enlightenment as applied above to earn 30 points.
There, we had to spend 8.75 days to earn 1.25 days of enlightened time which gave us 30 points.
So every 210 hours spent gathering enlightenment to get 30 points at a ratio of 7 hours spent earning to 1 hour spent yeilding 1 champion point.
Now, given 14000000 total xp to get to vr14 and since we know that points are usually awarded 4 times slower than enlightened points, we can divide by 4 yeilding a total of 3500000 enlightened xp needed to get the same number of points 14000000xp awards regularly.
Now we know 7 hours time is needed for each point to be earned entirely by enlightenment. So we divide by 7 yeilding 500000 xp needed per point regularly. Dividing by 4 again we get 125000xp per point when enlightened.
Therefore we can get up to 28 points if leveling to vr14 without enlightenment and 112 points if we level entirely using enlightenment.
I cant remember if 50 becomes vr1 instantly or if an additional 1M xp is needed to get there. If so, then leveling from 50-vr14 would yield 30 points.
So in conclusion, the 30 points awarded are equivilent to 10 days spent leveling an alt and using up any earned enlightenment, the average number of champion points a player earned while playing at vr14, and the number awarded to a player who leveled a character from 50 to vr14.
I think this is fair and covers the majority of players. I am sorry if anyone falls outside of these categories.
Please correct any of this if I am wrong. This was just how I saw it all, and I might have based some of those on wrong info.7 -
onlinegamer1✭✭✭✭✭
✭So far, 0 people defending ZoS have actually addressed the point in the OP.
It's a HORRIBLE DECISION to give "one VR1" accounts and "8 VR14s" accounts exactly and precisely 30 CPs. The VR1 didnt earn it, and the 8 VR14s was lied to and isn't getting what they earned.
I proposed 3 alternate ideas in the OP which I made up on the spot with 0 thought which are MASSIVELY SUPERIOR to what ZoS is proposing to do. And no one who is defending ZoS even remotely acknowledged that.Edited by onlinegamer1 on December 20, 2014 5:22AM13 -
drschplatt✭✭✭✭I couldn't give a rats patooty about the people who were grinding their way to 14. All I know is that I spend hours playing the game the way ZOS wanted it played without grinding but doing the horrible and boring Gold and Silver quest line because we were told that VR experience was being tracked and that it would be converted properly with the champion system. As a reward, ZOS is giving me a giant middle finger telling me that the time I spent doing that now means f*** all and I should have just parked at VR1, unsubbed, and come back in January.
This is insulting and pathetic.Foräois - Imperial Sorcerer of Ineptitude.
Widoch - Nord Dragon Knight of Ignorance.
Billy Bob - Dunmer Templar of Chicken and Noodles.
Blades of Vengeance15 -
derpsticks✭✭✭✭@onlinegamer1
My post above explains how ZOS is not basing the number of points awarded on what a player currently has on their account, but what could be accomplished given about 10 days /played.
Based on the above, I can see how an account with a VR1 should be given 30 points because that is the amount that would've been awarded for the enlightenment xp accumulated during those days.
Looking at your scenarios, one does not support what I just stated and I wont talk about it. The other two are very similar but the one that counts every 3 VR ranks is kind of odd and I won't talk about it.
The other one, counting an extra point for each additional VR character makes the most logical sense of the 3. I still don't think is comes close to compensating what some players have lost. Considering there will have been almost 90 days of game time playable since 1.5.2 released up to the time 1.6 rolls out, ZOS has chosen to compensate for what seems to be a maximum of 10 days /played within that time and nothing more.
Furthermore, that 10 days /played is not equivilent to what 10 days of earning champion points at the regular non enlightened rate would be. It rewards half as many champion points that a vr14 should've received if all 10 days were played by that vr14. This is because leveling an alt and leveling vr1 to vr14 yield half as many points and ZOS chose to equate a player performing these actions with a player purely playing a vr14.
While you include an additional 8 points because a player might have all 8 characters at vr rank, you should look at time played on these characters rather than the number you have.
60 champion points can be accumulated by a vr14 over 10 days. Assuming a player with 8 vr characters played each of them arbitrarily it would be safe to assume the average number of points earned between leveling vr1 to vr14 and pure vr14 play should be awarded instead. That number would be 45.
Now assuming a mix of all 3 cases took place we should use the average between each of them. That number would be 40.
While I understand why ZOS took the actions it did, I think they should award 40 points to everyone with greater than or equal to 10 days /played, award 30 points to everyone with less, and none to those players who have not reached vr ranks.0 -
Faulgor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭... Nothing Maria said invalidates what was stated earlier. It's just that everyone gets at least 30 champion points once Update 6 goes live so you can enjoy the new system even if you didn't level your vet character yet, and so there is not a huge gap at the start between players with 0 champion points and players with more than 0 champion points - because, as she also said, the first points are the most valuable.
On top of that 30 points, you'll still get more champion points based on your accumulated exp.Alandrol Sul: He's making another Numidium?!?
Vivec: Worse, buddy. They're buying it.3 -
Guppet✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'm sure those players that don't play much or level slowly are loving this, but in the end, it's really not fair to some of us.
Anyone who grinded xp in the hope of gaining an initial advantage in the CP amount knew he is risking being over the cap already and not getting anything from his grind(since the actual cap was unknown).
I have four veteran characters and i am not bothered by this.
What about those of us that didn't grind? I have completed the quests on all my guys, I have no content to go back and do for points. My choices are PvP (which I don't like) or grinding for points (which isn't what I pay a sub for). I'd love to just do quests and earn points. I now have two non vet characters that I can do that with, that's it, until they add more content to the game. Or slowly walk my way up the ladder with daily pledges (a little slower than being able to spend a few hours questing).
You already admit that you expected to be over the cap. So you already knew you had used up content, that you would not be rewarded for completing. Unless you stopped playing once you thought you were at the cap, you knowingly did this to yourself, but now you want sympathy? You play 70+ hours a week (Taken from your 110 days played), you'll get ahead soon enough once the system is out.
6
