Wait, they also get heads???

TequilaFire · December 2015

Islyn wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

Islyn wrote: »

No way.

Alliance Skills take FOR EVER to level unless you leech AP constantly with a resto staff, and we still have to cope with it.

Oh I see being a healer and keeping your teammates alive is now called leeching.

Yeah shooting all and sundry with a resto staff IS LEECHING so just handle it. Also, make your own post. Different issue.

I will post when and where I want.

Healers are also the biggest targets taken out first - learn your facts.

Unsent.Soul · December 2015

Draxys wrote: »

People can already buy the gear that comes from pvp, so I don't see the problem here. Gear and skill lines are two completely different issues.

People will never realize the difference. Too busy wanting to cry and scream how it's unfair...

Also you can buy the pieces with gold or AP, not both just 1 or the other. If only people actually read the update they might not be so ignorant.

ZOS_KaeylaW · December 2015

Hi, everyone.

We understand that people are going to disagree from time to time, but please remember to keep your comments respectful at all times on our forums, even when you disagree with others. Insults or other disruptive behavior do not help further discussion and can move a thread off topic quickly. We encourage sharing opinions, but we ask that they are constructively stated when doing so, as this will help keep the discussion on track.

Thank you!

eliisra · December 2015

Unsent.Soul wrote: »

Draxys wrote: »

People can already buy the gear that comes from pvp, so I don't see the problem here. Gear and skill lines are two completely different issues.

People will never realize the difference. Too busy wanting to cry and scream how it's unfair...

Also you can buy the pieces with gold or AP, not both just 1 or the other. If only people actually read the update they might not be so ignorant.

I think they're mostly upset that someone who rarely or never did a VR dungeon might get a monster set. I kinda get that. But this isn't the highest tier raid gear, monster sets have been in the game for ages. More ways of getting them, outside of crap rng, is good for everyone including unlucky PvE'ers.

Also have a strong feeling that farming the helm will be the main way to go still. Farming is free. Spending all your gold or AP gambling with "helmet boxes" trying to get right trait/type, wont be done as causally. Bet the prices will be insane.

I sure as hell wont use that merchant as the main way of getting helmets or shoulders. I will still grab my daily gold keys and join farm runs for helms I need, than feel sorry for the poor dude that just spent millions on well fitted items.

mdylan2013 · December 2015

PVP players can use AP to buy them, PVE players can use gold.

Everyone can use the merchant. There's really not much need for all the drama.

Islyn · December 2015

Wollust wrote: »

Stop cyring and making threads about this. You don't want a discussion because you are way too much convinced that you and only you are 100% right and everyone else is wrong.

That is false.

Discuss all you like - but as far as the boss heads go, I feel that I am right and that it is wrong.

If there was an across the board token system that would be different.

It is not because I don't want people to have them, it is because I do not get how everything just gets handed to people to buy into.

I am not crying.

The other thing is: Why does any PVPer care if we buy alliance war skills?

You want us to EARN them, presumably so you have more people to PVP with (farm AP off of), because let's face it, once most of us have them, we won't set foot in Cyrodiil for PVP.

Well the same goes with the monster heads. Like any PVPer would come and help with a dungeon if they already bought the hat they like? They wouldn't (mostly).

I would like people to actually still want to DO ANYTHING in game other than PVP, same as i guess PVP people feel about PVE people.

That is why I think I am right on this issue.

I think that's pretty fair.

mdylan2013 · December 2015

Islyn wrote: »

Wollust wrote: »

Stop cyring and making threads about this. You don't want a discussion because you are way too much convinced that you and only you are 100% right and everyone else is wrong.

That is false.

Discuss all you like - but as far as the boss heads go, I feel that I am right and that it is wrong.

If there was an across the board token system that would be different.

It is not because I don't want people to have them, it is because I do not get how everything just gets handed to people to buy into.

I am not crying.

The other thing is: Why does any PVPer care if we buy alliance war skills?

You want us to EARN them, presumably so you have more people to PVP with (farm AP off of), because let's face it, once most of us have them, we won't set foot in Cyrodiil for PVP.

Well the same goes with the monster heads. Like any PVPer would come and help with a dungeon if they already bought the hat they like? They wouldn't (mostly).

I would like people to actually still want to DO ANYTHING in game other than PVP, same as i guess PVP people feel about PVE people.

That is why I think I am right on this issue.

I think that's pretty fair.

You're making way too many assumptions about PVP players.

I play PVP mainly, but I also help out guild members to farm for the Engine Guardian.

I don't have an issue with PVE players having the ability to get alliance war skills through other activities other than PVP. But at the same time the Undaunted skill line is really only a PVE based skill line.

Why do some people have such animosity for players that don't want to play the game the way they play it? It's really odd.

Islyn · December 2015

mdylan2013 wrote: »

Islyn wrote: »

Wollust wrote: »

Stop cyring and making threads about this. You don't want a discussion because you are way too much convinced that you and only you are 100% right and everyone else is wrong.

That is false.

Discuss all you like - but as far as the boss heads go, I feel that I am right and that it is wrong.

If there was an across the board token system that would be different.

It is not because I don't want people to have them, it is because I do not get how everything just gets handed to people to buy into.

I am not crying.

The other thing is: Why does any PVPer care if we buy alliance war skills?

You want us to EARN them, presumably so you have more people to PVP with (farm AP off of), because let's face it, once most of us have them, we won't set foot in Cyrodiil for PVP.

Well the same goes with the monster heads. Like any PVPer would come and help with a dungeon if they already bought the hat they like? They wouldn't (mostly).

I would like people to actually still want to DO ANYTHING in game other than PVP, same as i guess PVP people feel about PVE people.

That is why I think I am right on this issue.

I think that's pretty fair.

You're making way too many assumptions about PVP players.

I play PVP mainly, but I also help out guild members to farm for the Engine Guardian.

I don't have an issue with PVE players having the ability to get alliance war skills through other activities other than PVP. But at the same time the Undaunted skill line is really only a PVE based skill line.

Why do some people have such animosity for players that don't want to play the game the way they play it? It's really odd.

Read through these forums since Early Access as I have and I am sure you will see that you yourself are actually not the standard 'PVPer'

Many PVPers *do indeed* mind and feel we should grind PVP to get skill line.

I have zero animosity toward whoever for whatever.

I have issues with stuff we had to earn all along now being available to simply buy, by anyone.

I don't know what the Undaunted skill line has to do with it. I am sorry if I misunderstand you.

Anyway, I have been trying to respond to people to further explain but it is boring and just annoying me to keep repeating myself.

I'm just going to leave this now because I know the 'Give It To Me Now' crowd will always bash and beat down the 'Earn it' crowd.

It's a game after all, and I should not care so much.

gw2only1b14_ESO · December 2015

ajwest927 wrote: »

They probably make the monster helm soo expensive that only the most active pvper can afford them.

The Most active Pvpers already have owned them it will be the average joe player that will now be able to earn one

Digerati · December 2015

Islyn wrote: »

Trying to get a razz out of me on this will never happen.

It's wrong and even the whiniest of you know it.

No matter what you say.

>starts whining thread
>"whiniest of you"

Islyn · December 2015

Digerati wrote: »

Islyn wrote: »

Trying to get a razz out of me on this will never happen.

It's wrong and even the whiniest of you know it.

No matter what you say.

>starts whining thread
>"whiniest of you"

*smh*

So saying that heads should not be sold is whining?

How?

It was whining that made this whole thing happen in the first place and not by me.

I mean clever SLAM to me and all so High Five if that was your goal - but how is an honest opinion without all the hyperbole people like to post whining?

Apoxsee · December 2015

Don't know if it has been mentioned or not but it is going to be a vendor. A vendor that comes twice a week that will have a random set (not just heads and shoulders but also other gear) with random traits. This means the RNG demon will still be in affect and the traits that people want will not show every time.

To be honest it will probably be still faster for a pvp'er to get it the old fashion way of grinding out the dungeons as we always have... This just gives anyone a chance to buy it, not just pvp'ers. I am really struggling with the OP position. Reaction before any information about the system seems to me to waste a lot of energy for nothing.

DRXHarbinger · December 2015

I got 2 Bogdan helms today in a row. 1 v1 and a v8. Light impenetrable and heavy Devines. Beast for a sorc.

I am all for them being sold. Just not cheap. They aren't on par with a crappy shield motif is all I'm saying. Several million AP and at least several hundred k gold. Good is harder to come by and wasting it on a helm which may be the wrong weight etc can do you over in terms of repairs and other stuff you need. Squandering AP doesn't mean squat.

Islyn · December 2015

Apoxsee wrote: »

I am really struggling with the OP position.

Yeah so am I. Seriously.

daemonios · December 2015

Apoxsee wrote: »

Don't know if it has been mentioned or not but it is going to be a vendor. A vendor that comes twice a week that will have a random set (not just heads and shoulders but also other gear) with random traits. This means the RNG demon will still be in affect and the traits that people want will not show every time.

To be honest it will probably be still faster for a pvp'er to get it the old fashion way of grinding out the dungeons as we always have... This just gives anyone a chance to buy it, not just pvp'ers. I am really struggling with the OP position. Reaction before any information about the system seems to me to waste a lot of energy for nothing.

You know who else could sell them? Other players.

I would have literally zero issues with making monster sets BoE rather than BoP, just like PvP gear. Then those lucky players who get helms can sell them to others who aren't so lucky or don't want to run the gauntlet and farm them, without flipping the game upside down. Monster sets come from monsters in vet dungeons. It makes no sense to have a random NPC vendor selling them out of the blue.

The game is losing any semblance of coherence, and it's losing it fast. These "fixes" to real issues - and I never doubted that the difficulty in getting a specific monster set with a specific trait in a specific weight IS an issue - are turning ESO into a patchwork of random rules.

Vamp/WW bite in the crown store first, then monster set vendor, already people are crying for undaunted/alliance war skills to be unlocked via alternative ways... Like others here, I don't like where this is going. It has nothing to do with wanting people to grind just as hard as I did.

Islyn · December 2015

daemonios wrote: »

Apoxsee wrote: »

Don't know if it has been mentioned or not but it is going to be a vendor. A vendor that comes twice a week that will have a random set (not just heads and shoulders but also other gear) with random traits. This means the RNG demon will still be in affect and the traits that people want will not show every time.

To be honest it will probably be still faster for a pvp'er to get it the old fashion way of grinding out the dungeons as we always have... This just gives anyone a chance to buy it, not just pvp'ers. I am really struggling with the OP position. Reaction before any information about the system seems to me to waste a lot of energy for nothing.

You know who else could sell them? Other players.

I would have literally zero issues with making monster sets BoE rather than BoP, just like PvP gear. Then those lucky players who get helms can sell them to others who aren't so lucky or don't want to run the gauntlet and farm them, without flipping the game upside down. Monster sets come from monsters in vet dungeons. It makes no sense to have a random NPC vendor selling them out of the blue.

The game is losing any semblance of coherence, and it's losing it fast. These "fixes" to real issues - and I never doubted that the difficulty in getting a specific monster set with a specific trait in a specific weight IS an issue - are turning ESO into a patchwork of random rules.

Vamp/WW bite in the crown store first, then monster set vendor, already people are crying for undaunted/alliance war skills to be unlocked via alternative ways... Like others here, I don't like where this is going. It has nothing to do with wanting people to grind just as hard as I did.

Eyecon74 · December 2015

I am not worried either way, the sets are not exactly game changers, other than Molag Kena most of the sets get in the way of proper builds, I have every set but never even use them as they mess up my builds.. You'll find most people don't even use them, yea, they're fun for a bit but after finally getting my Engine Guardian shoulders I used them for 2 days then switched back to my set items, I feel you lose more than you gain with these sets.
Even when the trader gets here it's going to be random and incredibly costly, I'd rather run the dungeons then have to spend a fortune on something I'll only use for a week..
Also, how does it affect you if a PVP player buys the helmet/shoulder..? If you're that much of a PVE purist you'll likely never even meet..

Alucardo · December 2015

daemonios wrote: »

You know who else could sell them? Other players.

I would have literally zero issues with making monster sets BoE rather than BoP, just like PvP gear. Then those lucky players who get helms can sell them to others who aren't so lucky or don't want to run the gauntlet and farm them, without flipping the game upside down. Monster sets come from monsters in vet dungeons. It makes no sense to have a random NPC vendor selling them out of the blue.

The game is losing any semblance of coherence, and it's losing it fast. These "fixes" to real issues - and I never doubted that the difficulty in getting a specific monster set with a specific trait in a specific weight IS an issue - are turning ESO into a patchwork of random rules.

This is what I've been saying all along. They could turn it into a nice little economy if the monster drops were BoE. The PVErs do the thing they enjoy doing, and instead of dropping stuff they will most likely just decon, they can sell it to PVPers or other PVErs for profit. Would make running all them dungeons mean something more to them.
Now we'll both be able to just buy them for gold from some vendor. Granted it could take a while as it's a random piece every week, but still.
Having no vendor but making them BoE would mean no animosity and everyone will most likely be happy.

daemonios · December 2015

Alucardo wrote: »

daemonios wrote: »

You know who else could sell them? Other players.

I would have literally zero issues with making monster sets BoE rather than BoP, just like PvP gear. Then those lucky players who get helms can sell them to others who aren't so lucky or don't want to run the gauntlet and farm them, without flipping the game upside down. Monster sets come from monsters in vet dungeons. It makes no sense to have a random NPC vendor selling them out of the blue.

The game is losing any semblance of coherence, and it's losing it fast. These "fixes" to real issues - and I never doubted that the difficulty in getting a specific monster set with a specific trait in a specific weight IS an issue - are turning ESO into a patchwork of random rules.

This is what I've been saying all along. They could turn it into a nice little economy if the monster drops were BoE. The PVErs do the thing they enjoy doing, and instead of dropping stuff they will most likely just decon, they can sell it to PVPers or other PVErs for profit. Would make running all them dungeons mean something more to them.
Now we'll both be able to just buy them for gold from some vendor. Granted it could take a while as it's a random piece every week, but still.
Having no vendor but making them BoE would mean no animosity and everyone will most likely be happy.

You know why I think they still haven't made this gear BoE?

*puts on tinfoil hat*

I'm completely convinced they intended to sell undaunted keys in the crown store. I mean, what is even the logic of separating helms and shoulders? You want a helm, you run the dungeon where the corresponding boss is. You want a shoulder, you do some random dungeons, get some keys with an inexplicable daily limit per key type and character, open some boxes for random shoulders or even none at all... Wait, WTF?

This is a classic F2P MMO lottery. Seen it countless times. The only thing that stopped ZOS from selling key bundles was the vocal rejection of (most) F2P shenanigans by the community. But as long as monster sets are BoP, there's always the chance ZOS will surrender to the dark side and offer keys for real people money. For convenience, of course.

*takes off tinfoil hat*

Alucardo · December 2015

daemonios wrote: »

You know why I think they still haven't made this great BoE?

*puts on tinfoil hat*

I'm completely convinced they intended to sell undaunted keys in the crown store. I mean, what is even the logic of separating helms and shoulders? You want a helm, you run the dungeon where the corresponding boss is. You want a shoulder, you do some random dungeons, get some keys and open some boxes for random shoulders or even none at all... Wait, WTF?

Nawwwwwwwwww surely not. That would be an insanely stupid move on their part, and they know it. My original thought was because they wanted to keep them "special". That was until I found out they were planning to sell them for gold..
BoE would be the perfect solution, and I hope they see that before they drop this vendor thing into Cyrodiil.

TERMINAT0R_XVII · December 2015

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Average players will get around 50k AP per day in pvp, a good part of this AP is needed to buy siege, repair kits etc.

Assuming a monster helmet/shoulder piece cost will cost at least 1m AP, that translates to 20 days of constant pvp without buying siege, repair kits etc.

Running a dungeon like CoH for 30 times (I farmed CoH until I got the medium infused head so I know what Im talking about) will only take 4-7 days for average players.

Anyone that thinks that this system heavily favors pvp players is misjudging the amount of AP gained during an average day of pvp.

On top of that, each week there will be a random monster set for sale. It might take a couple months before the pvp players can actually monster helmet/shoulder that they want.

The only vet 16 helm I got is bloodspawn and it is in medium. I have at least 1 of each shoulder not including armor type and trait EXCEPT the two from the imperial city. I have yet to pull a lord warden or Molag Kena shoulder yet so if the first set is Molag Kena or Lord warden I'm going to buy the whole set. If its one of the standard vet dungeon sets I'm just buying the helm. I just finished my standard vet shoulder sets out with the Engine Guardian arm cops 2 days ago. all at vet 16 mind you. I'm welcoming the new set merchant. Especially for those rare dungeon only armor sets you can only get inside the dungeons

Hope499 · December 2015

Being able to buy Monster helm sets, is WRONG.

For all of us who have grinded, for hours and hours, maybe even 100 TIMES for a single dungeon, just to get a helm..

Mixing up what I use as light/heavy just because it will only drop in light.

Or the great feeling when it finally DOES drop, with everything you wanted.

This is a cheap tactic....cheesy and cheap and low....unless ZoS can give me back time, its not really fair either.

I am sitting at 2mil gold....wtf is it to me (or most people) to buy whatever they want?

Why do you all act like grinding is something new this game invented? It gives you a REASON to run these dungeons and play the content.

ZoS, you think anyone is ever going to give a *** about dungeons after you do this??

Hope499 · December 2015

Islyn wrote: »

Wollust wrote: »

Stop cyring and making threads about this. You don't want a discussion because you are way too much convinced that you and only you are 100% right and everyone else is wrong.

That is false.

Discuss all you like - but as far as the boss heads go, I feel that I am right and that it is wrong.

If there was an across the board token system that would be different.

It is not because I don't want people to have them, it is because I do not get how everything just gets handed to people to buy into.

I am not crying.

The other thing is: Why does any PVPer care if we buy alliance war skills?

You want us to EARN them, presumably so you have more people to PVP with (farm AP off of), because let's face it, once most of us have them, we won't set foot in Cyrodiil for PVP.

Well the same goes with the monster heads. Like any PVPer would come and help with a dungeon if they already bought the hat they like? They wouldn't (mostly).

I would like people to actually still want to DO ANYTHING in game other than PVP, same as i guess PVP people feel about PVE people.

That is why I think I am right on this issue.

I think that's pretty fair.

This, this and this....so much this.....

killingspreeb16_ESO · December 2015

Hope499 wrote: »

Being able to buy Monster helm sets, is WRONG.

For all of us who have grinded, for hours and hours, maybe even 100 TIMES for a single dungeon, just to get a helm..

Mixing up what I use as light/heavy just because it will only drop in light.

Or the great feeling when it finally DOES drop, with everything you wanted.

This is a cheap tactic....cheesy and cheap and low....unless ZoS can give me back time, its not really fair either.

I am sitting at 2mil gold....wtf is it to me (or most people) to buy whatever they want?

Why do you all act like grinding is something new this game invented? It gives you a REASON to run these dungeons and play the content.

ZoS, you think anyone is ever going to give a *** about dungeons after you do this??

Then give to PvPer new set(head+shoulder) to buy only with AP and who care if those damn set are so good in PvE,you will be forced to do PvP for months even if you don't like it.

i hate PvE with passion so i don't want to do PvE for my PvP gear,alredy grinding mob for trophy is boring enough

DRXHarbinger · December 2015

Think some people bought the wrong game. You bought an ES game for PVP play only? Someone got bullied off COD didn't they?

killingspreeb16_ESO · December 2015

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

Think some people bought the wrong game. You bought an ES game for PVP play only? Someone got bullied off COD didn't they?

no some people(like me)play PvP on every MMO,PvE for me is boring the fact that i need to do PvE to take the best PvP gear is stupid.

some people shold start thinking a bit that every player play differenlty

DRXHarbinger · December 2015

You're wrong. Why are they the best PVP gear? Explain that to us? Why should you get the hardest grind, grindless because you cba? It's a PVE item so stop all this PVP gear crap. Evidently it's not PVP gear. I've never been killed by a lich crystal, Skoria comet or mephala Web in pvp. You are all going to be greatly dissapointed when you get your grindless mouse clicking fingers on them. I mean that you really are.

Sallington · December 2015

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

Think some people bought the wrong game. You bought an ES game for PVP play only? Someone got bullied off COD didn't they?

ESO is turning into COD with all of this DLC/Crown store BS.

Yolokin_Swagonborn · December 2015

This game has always catered to PvE'ers first and left PvP in the dust. However, when every PvP finally gets a cookie, PvE wants ten bites out of it first.

For a year, PvE was the only thing ZOS cared about
Craglorn came out and PvP suffered single digit framerates for two months that destroyed our community.
Exploiters ran rampant in PvP and were not dealt with. Troll one RP event in PvE and a GM would ban you.
PvP gear and rewards for the worth was crap for so long and PvPers had to run trials to get gear.
AP grind, (other than vigor) was much easier than Undaunted passives. Then vigor was fixed.
When the imperial city came out, all the PvE'ers cried that it was 100% Tel Var loss
ZOS changed the ENTIRE PVP meta so that PvE bads could bunch up, spam breath of life, and never die.

PvP'ers have always been second class citizens of Tamriel in this game. But whenever the developers do remember we exist and throw something cool our way, PvE be like:

Luigi_Vampa · December 2015

Islyn wrote: »

The issue is, once you have everything in game, there is no reason to play any more until new stuff comes out.

It is not that re-running the same dungeon over and over (and over) is a blast, because it isn't. It's funny when we make it funny, joking around on TS etc - but it's not fun.

This is the difference between us PvPers and you PvEers, we play to play. You play for rewards. We want our gear so that we can compete, you want your gear so that you can wait for the next gear grind.