Guild summit, cool. How about one for solo?

Bloodfang · December 2014

pppontus wrote: »

NadiusMaximus wrote: »

I see your guys point, it would be pointless. Since the player base is such a wide spectrum of play style, the company should only listen to the people that can shout the loudest with the perceived loudest voice. Once again the independent majority is shut out by the politics of the minority in power.

No, they should listen to the ones who they can possibly provide content for that will make them stay a long time. I personally do not believe that solo-exclusive players will be around for a long time, because it is completely inevitable that you run out of content to do. Unless you like sitting around in towns, or rerolling and doing the same content again, there is no way they can keep releasing new content at the pace you will complete it.

That can't be very difficult to understand right? Imagine if Craglorn was solo, how long would it take to complete it? 4 hours maybe? And that's pretty much all the new content that has been introduced to the game since launch, and they were working on that pre-launch even..

The game needs content that is very difficult and takes time to complete, so that they have enough time to make new.. and it needs PvP because PvP can sustain itself for a long time since it's essentially "player made" content. All of these make guilds very, very important for ZOS.

I do my best to convert the soloists to groupists nowadays, because otherwise I know that they will leave the game and not come back once they run out of things to do.

I've been playing casually. I completed Cadwell Gold in 700 hours and I'm at VR12. Thats averaging at 46,6 hours per Zone.

The last time I checked Craglorn is bigger than a normal Zone. 4 hours? More like 50+ hours.

If you count that casual gamer plays max 20 hours per week, you come to the conclusion that they need 35 weeks to complete Cadwell Gold. That is exactly 8 months.

diabeticDemon18 · December 2014

pppontus wrote: »

NadiusMaximus wrote: »

I see your guys point, it would be pointless. Since the player base is such a wide spectrum of play style, the company should only listen to the people that can shout the loudest with the perceived loudest voice. Once again the independent majority is shut out by the politics of the minority in power.

No, they should listen to the ones who they can possibly provide content for that will make them stay a long time. I personally do not believe that solo-exclusive players will be around for a long time, because it is completely inevitable that you run out of content to do. Unless you like sitting around in towns, or rerolling and doing the same content again, there is no way they can keep releasing new content at the pace you will complete it.

That can't be very difficult to understand right? Imagine if Craglorn was solo, how long would it take to complete it? 4 hours maybe? And that's pretty much all the new content that has been introduced to the game since launch, and they were working on that pre-launch even..

The game needs content that is very difficult and takes time to complete, so that they have enough time to make new.. and it needs PvP because PvP can sustain itself for a long time since it's essentially "player made" content. All of these make guilds very, very important for ZOS.

I've been a GM since launch, I've seen all the kinds of players - 90% of those who mainly play it as a solo RPG does the content up to Cadwell's Gold, then stay subbed ~1 month maybe doing a little group content - but if they don't get sucked in to it or play with their guildies they will leave and not log in again. Maybe they will be back at some point, who knows. But I have 100s of inactive members that have followed this pattern. On the contrary, most of those who are mainly interested in group play, Trials or PvP.. they are still here (of course a lot have been lost due to bugs and game issues, but yeah). Because... what I said.

I do my best to convert the soloists to groupists nowadays, because otherwise I know that they will leave the game and not come back once they run out of things to do.

The thing is though, at least for me (a largely solo player), that is what I enjoy. I enjoy the leveling process and meeting people to play with. I don't group to do hard things, I just talk to other people and go quest or train things with them. I don't want a game where the solo players are left out because it's an MMO, honestly the larger part of most MMO player bases are in fact solo casual players. They should actually have the biggest word in what happens, the majority is always right.

AlnilamE · December 2014

NadiusMaximus wrote: »

Just asking. When will we have a chance to give input at the same level?

Sure! Give them a list of the top 20 solo players.

Though you may be surprised how many of those are actually in a guild.

diabeticDemon18 · December 2014

AlnilamE wrote: »

NadiusMaximus wrote: »

Just asking. When will we have a chance to give input at the same level?

Sure! Give them a list of the top 20 solo players.

Though you may be surprised how many of those are actually in a guild.

As sad as it is... probably 100%

diabeticDemon18 · December 2014

diabeticDemon18 wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

NadiusMaximus wrote: »

I see your guys point, it would be pointless. Since the player base is such a wide spectrum of play style, the company should only listen to the people that can shout the loudest with the perceived loudest voice. Once again the independent majority is shut out by the politics of the minority in power.

No, they should listen to the ones who they can possibly provide content for that will make them stay a long time. I personally do not believe that solo-exclusive players will be around for a long time, because it is completely inevitable that you run out of content to do. Unless you like sitting around in towns, or rerolling and doing the same content again, there is no way they can keep releasing new content at the pace you will complete it.

That can't be very difficult to understand right? Imagine if Craglorn was solo, how long would it take to complete it? 4 hours maybe? And that's pretty much all the new content that has been introduced to the game since launch, and they were working on that pre-launch even..

The game needs content that is very difficult and takes time to complete, so that they have enough time to make new.. and it needs PvP because PvP can sustain itself for a long time since it's essentially "player made" content. All of these make guilds very, very important for ZOS.

I've been a GM since launch, I've seen all the kinds of players - 90% of those who mainly play it as a solo RPG does the content up to Cadwell's Gold, then stay subbed ~1 month maybe doing a little group content - but if they don't get sucked in to it or play with their guildies they will leave and not log in again. Maybe they will be back at some point, who knows. But I have 100s of inactive members that have followed this pattern. On the contrary, most of those who are mainly interested in group play, Trials or PvP.. they are still here (of course a lot have been lost due to bugs and game issues, but yeah). Because... what I said.

I do my best to convert the soloists to groupists nowadays, because otherwise I know that they will leave the game and not come back once they run out of things to do.

The thing is though, at least for me (a largely solo player), that is what I enjoy. I enjoy the leveling process and meeting people to play with. I don't group to do hard things, I just talk to other people and go quest or train things with them. I don't want a game where the solo players are left out because it's an MMO, honestly the larger part of most MMO player bases are in fact solo casual players. They should actually have the biggest word in what happens, the majority is always right.

Hey now... who LOL'd this?!? That was not a joke... #rude lol

AlnilamE · December 2014

diabeticDemon18 wrote: »

diabeticDemon18 wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

NadiusMaximus wrote: »

I see your guys point, it would be pointless. Since the player base is such a wide spectrum of play style, the company should only listen to the people that can shout the loudest with the perceived loudest voice. Once again the independent majority is shut out by the politics of the minority in power.

No, they should listen to the ones who they can possibly provide content for that will make them stay a long time. I personally do not believe that solo-exclusive players will be around for a long time, because it is completely inevitable that you run out of content to do. Unless you like sitting around in towns, or rerolling and doing the same content again, there is no way they can keep releasing new content at the pace you will complete it.

That can't be very difficult to understand right? Imagine if Craglorn was solo, how long would it take to complete it? 4 hours maybe? And that's pretty much all the new content that has been introduced to the game since launch, and they were working on that pre-launch even..

The game needs content that is very difficult and takes time to complete, so that they have enough time to make new.. and it needs PvP because PvP can sustain itself for a long time since it's essentially "player made" content. All of these make guilds very, very important for ZOS.

I've been a GM since launch, I've seen all the kinds of players - 90% of those who mainly play it as a solo RPG does the content up to Cadwell's Gold, then stay subbed ~1 month maybe doing a little group content - but if they don't get sucked in to it or play with their guildies they will leave and not log in again. Maybe they will be back at some point, who knows. But I have 100s of inactive members that have followed this pattern. On the contrary, most of those who are mainly interested in group play, Trials or PvP.. they are still here (of course a lot have been lost due to bugs and game issues, but yeah). Because... what I said.

I do my best to convert the soloists to groupists nowadays, because otherwise I know that they will leave the game and not come back once they run out of things to do.

The thing is though, at least for me (a largely solo player), that is what I enjoy. I enjoy the leveling process and meeting people to play with. I don't group to do hard things, I just talk to other people and go quest or train things with them. I don't want a game where the solo players are left out because it's an MMO, honestly the larger part of most MMO player bases are in fact solo casual players. They should actually have the biggest word in what happens, the majority is always right.

Hey now... who LOL'd this?!? That was not a joke... #rude lol

Not me, but your comment of "the majority is always right" deserved it. :-P

ZOS_JessicaFolsom · December 2014

For our next summit (which we intend to have next year), we do plan to expand attendees to community leaders as well as guild representatives.

Rodario · December 2014

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

For our next summit (which we intend to have next year), we do plan to expand attendees to community leaders as well as guild representatives.

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌ Do we (the community) get to vote on who our community leaders are?

diabeticDemon18 · December 2014

AlnilamE wrote: »

diabeticDemon18 wrote: »

diabeticDemon18 wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

NadiusMaximus wrote: »

I see your guys point, it would be pointless. Since the player base is such a wide spectrum of play style, the company should only listen to the people that can shout the loudest with the perceived loudest voice. Once again the independent majority is shut out by the politics of the minority in power.

No, they should listen to the ones who they can possibly provide content for that will make them stay a long time. I personally do not believe that solo-exclusive players will be around for a long time, because it is completely inevitable that you run out of content to do. Unless you like sitting around in towns, or rerolling and doing the same content again, there is no way they can keep releasing new content at the pace you will complete it.

That can't be very difficult to understand right? Imagine if Craglorn was solo, how long would it take to complete it? 4 hours maybe? And that's pretty much all the new content that has been introduced to the game since launch, and they were working on that pre-launch even..

The game needs content that is very difficult and takes time to complete, so that they have enough time to make new.. and it needs PvP because PvP can sustain itself for a long time since it's essentially "player made" content. All of these make guilds very, very important for ZOS.

I've been a GM since launch, I've seen all the kinds of players - 90% of those who mainly play it as a solo RPG does the content up to Cadwell's Gold, then stay subbed ~1 month maybe doing a little group content - but if they don't get sucked in to it or play with their guildies they will leave and not log in again. Maybe they will be back at some point, who knows. But I have 100s of inactive members that have followed this pattern. On the contrary, most of those who are mainly interested in group play, Trials or PvP.. they are still here (of course a lot have been lost due to bugs and game issues, but yeah). Because... what I said.

I do my best to convert the soloists to groupists nowadays, because otherwise I know that they will leave the game and not come back once they run out of things to do.

The thing is though, at least for me (a largely solo player), that is what I enjoy. I enjoy the leveling process and meeting people to play with. I don't group to do hard things, I just talk to other people and go quest or train things with them. I don't want a game where the solo players are left out because it's an MMO, honestly the larger part of most MMO player bases are in fact solo casual players. They should actually have the biggest word in what happens, the majority is always right.

Hey now... who LOL'd this?!? That was not a joke... #rude lol

Not me, but your comment of "the majority is always right" deserved it. :-P

That "#rude lol" was meant as a "#rude

lol" like separate haha I didn't actually care and I definitely was joking when I said "the majority is always right"

AlexDougherty · December 2014

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

For our next summit (which we intend to have next year), we do plan to expand attendees to community leaders as well as guild representatives.

Not to be funny, but what is your definition of community leader?
Not that I see myself as one, but I am curious what the parameters for one is going to be.

LonePirate · December 2014

AlexDougherty wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

For our next summit (which we intend to have next year), we do plan to expand attendees to community leaders as well as guild representatives.

Not to be funny, but what is your definition of community leader?
Not that I see myself as one, but I am curious what the parameters for one is going to be.

I am guessing some of the criteria will include Twitch streaming, YouTube videos, website/blog updates or anything that can be used to demonstrate the person has other people who follow or pay attention to them.

AlexDougherty · December 2014

LonePirate wrote: »

AlexDougherty wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

For our next summit (which we intend to have next year), we do plan to expand attendees to community leaders as well as guild representatives.

Not to be funny, but what is your definition of community leader?
Not that I see myself as one, but I am curious what the parameters for one is going to be.

I am guessing some of the criteria will include Twitch streaming, YouTube videos, website/blog updates or anything that can be used to demonstrate the person has other people who follow or pay attention to them.

Ok, that makes sense.

As I said I'm justr curious on how they will pick the community leaders.
Fortunately I don't do any of that, so there is nothing I need to stop doing (God I wouldn't want to be responsible for fixing the game

)

ShadowHvo · December 2014

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌

It would be delightful if you could let guilds submit applications for the next guild summit, since the last bundle largely seemed to be only about giant 300+ members guilds. It would be nice to get guilds with less but equally active members in to share their opinions as well.

I'm saying that because when listening to the clips from the summit, people were all about forcing guilds to have high numbers of players, which leaves smaller, but equally friendly and helpful guilds of friends out in the dust.

xANTIxMATTERx · December 2014

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

For our next summit (which we intend to have next year), we do plan to expand attendees to community leaders as well as guild representatives.

Approximately when next year do you plan on hosting this? I know there is interest in my guild. Maryland isn't too far!

Tandor · December 2014

Perhaps we could kill two birds with one stone by introducing a proper auction house-based trading system while switching the existing guild auction system from trading kiosks to summit invitations

!

Let's hope that the definition of a community leader isn't someone who runs a guild

!

Dagoth_Rac · December 2014

Saying solo players have crafting writs is a silly comparison. Imagine if endgame groups could only go out and pick flowers together? They would have a fit. There need to be action and combat centered repeatable content for solo players. And not the PvE Cyrodiil daily quests. Getting around Cyrodiil is a pain for a solo player and casual solo players don't want to get ganked all the time.

Create a bunch of new solo delves with repeatable quests and content. Spread them around the various faction zones. Make them scale to player. Have the Mages Guild or Fighters Guild provide some special incentives for a random one or two each day, similar to Undaunted Pledges.

I do group content about 80% of the time. Between the group dungeons and Craglorn daily quests, there is plenty to keep me busy. Yeah, I have done it all before, but I can do 2 or 3 different things a night and still go weeks without repeating a dungeon or Crag daily. And that is playing every day! If I only played 2 or 3 days a week, like many casual solo players, I could go months without seeing the same boss twice.

I see no issue with giving players who solo 80% of the time similar options. Will they eventually have to do content they have already done? Yes. But that is what happens to group players, as well. I don't ragequit because today's normal pledge is Vaults of Madness and I did that a few weeks ago. If a solo player does some new "Delve of the Lurchers" in Bangkorai and then gets the same delve as a quest a few weeks later, he'll be fine.

mandragor1996 · December 2014

Rodario wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

For our next summit (which we intend to have next year), we do plan to expand attendees to community leaders as well as guild representatives.

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌ Do we (the community) get to vote on who our community leaders are?

I sense a LOL contest in the works

AlnilamE · December 2014

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

Saying solo players have crafting writs is a silly comparison. Imagine if endgame groups could only go out and pick flowers together? They would have a fit. There need to be action and combat centered repeatable content for solo players. And not the PvE Cyrodiil daily quests. Getting around Cyrodiil is a pain for a solo player and casual solo players don't want to get ganked all the time.

Create a bunch of new solo delves with repeatable quests and content. Spread them around the various faction zones. Make them scale to player. Have the Mages Guild or Fighters Guild provide some special incentives for a random one or two each day, similar to Undaunted Pledges.

I do group content about 80% of the time. Between the group dungeons and Craglorn daily quests, there is plenty to keep me busy. Yeah, I have done it all before, but I can do 2 or 3 different things a night and still go weeks without repeating a dungeon or Crag daily. And that is playing every day! If I only played 2 or 3 days a week, like many casual solo players, I could go months without seeing the same boss twice.

I see no issue with giving players who solo 80% of the time similar options. Will they eventually have to do content they have already done? Yes. But that is what happens to group players, as well. I don't ragequit because today's normal pledge is Vaults of Madness and I did that a few weeks ago. If a solo player does some new "Delve of the Lurchers" in Bangkorai and then gets the same delve as a quest a few weeks later, he'll be fine.

While the delves don't have repeatable quests or new bosses at this time, ZOS has been working on expanding delves for a zone in each update.

I would really enjoy it if the regular zone delves had multiple bosses like some of the ones in Cyrodiil do. I have two characters who have completed all those bosses/skyshards and I am looking at sending a third one there too.

ZOS_JessicaFolsom · December 2014

We're still in the very first phase of planning for the next summit, but we'll keep you updated. Picking people for these is always challenging. We do our best to have a good mix of people from around the globe who we feel represent different interests and playstyles within our community. With space being limited (we hold the summits at our studio), we do have to be selective. That said, we're open to ideas on how to best select attendees that you feel adequately represent you. We also very much want to make sure we're able to livestream the summit this time.

NadiusMaximus · December 2014

Anyway, now that it's settled sort of.

I'd like to see something like this.

1. Malique the liar randomly goes from spot to spot, right.?

2. OK, if he is in one place, there is at least one sort of random place open for another npc.

3. Make that npc a random deity or deadric prince in disguise. It could be anything or anyone, again a random thing, a deer, butterfly, anything. So if your just going by, you would miss it if not actively hunting it. Even then it would be hard.

4. Once found, they would port you, and your group if need be, to an area randomly. It is a phased delve, so it won't interfere with anyone else. It could be fungal grotto, a trial map, it could be any where the group leader has already cleared, but the mobs inside would be different.

5. The end boss would also be randomly chosen out of a list of bosses already defeated by the group leader. All these stats are already kept track of for achievements, so it's just down to the rng being implemented.

The reason for all the randomness is in the system now there is no fear of failure at a certain point. Trials at first were hard and challenging. That is fun. After while, people learned the mechanics and built accordingly to deal with them. Once that happened, groups were clearing the content faster and faster.

Now that's cool, but gets old after awhile, because there is no fear of failure, not that I'm saying it's easy to do perfect everytime, but I'm saying you know what to expect every time you go in.

Imagine not knowing, not knowing who, or what your going to face. ... Every single time. That would be fun.

Sindala · December 2014

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

We're still in the very first phase of planning for the next summit, but we'll keep you updated. Picking people for these is always challenging. We do our best to have a good mix of people from around the globe who we feel represent different interests and playstyles within our community. With space being limited (we hold the summits at our studio), we do have to be selective. That said, we're open to ideas on how to best select attendees that you feel adequately represent you. We also very much want to make sure we're able to livestream the summit this time.

The problem here is as you say yourself...'adequately represents you'.
Nobody but myself 'adequately represents me' and i'm sure everyone else feels the same way.
You mite as well just hold an in-game lottery as the best idea's don't always come from the people you think they will, and the loudest don't always have the best knowledge of the game.

Rodario · December 2014

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

We're still in the very first phase of planning for the next summit, but we'll keep you updated. Picking people for these is always challenging. We do our best to have a good mix of people from around the globe who we feel represent different interests and playstyles within our community. With space being limited (we hold the summits at our studio), we do have to be selective. That said, we're open to ideas on how to best select attendees that you feel adequately represent you. We also very much want to make sure we're able to livestream the summit this time.

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌ I think you should fill at least one (preferably all) "Community Leader" spot(s) by holding a vote on these forums as to who that should be.

Start a thread where people can nominate themselves and give a short description of the playstyle they represent and what they'd like to bring up at the summit, then hold a vote (poll). If there's more than ten likely candidates, you might need to create a seperate site for the poll, or have elimination rounds.

Hektlk · December 2014

xANTIxMATTERx wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

For our next summit (which we intend to have next year), we do plan to expand attendees to community leaders as well as guild representatives.

Approximately when next year do you plan on hosting this? I know there is interest in my guild. Maryland isn't too far!

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

We're still in the very first phase of planning for the next summit, but we'll keep you updated. Picking people for these is always challenging. We do our best to have a good mix of people from around the globe who we feel represent different interests and playstyles within our community. With space being limited (we hold the summits at our studio), we do have to be selective. That said, we're open to ideas on how to best select attendees that you feel adequately represent you. We also very much want to make sure we're able to livestream the summit this time.

I'm a pretty big deal.

Turelus · December 2014

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

For our next summit (which we intend to have next year), we do plan to expand attendees to community leaders as well as guild representatives.

Have you considered hosting an actual player gathering event much like EVE Online's fanfest or World of Warcrafts Blizcon?
Listening to the recordings which are available for the guild summit made me wish I could have sat in some of those round tables and asked questions, debated mechanics and done what the few there did.

I have flown to Iceland for the past two years (and will be going again next year) for EVE fanfest because of the fantastic access to developers, the round tables where good debate on mechanics happens.

Turelus · December 2014

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

We're still in the very first phase of planning for the next summit, but we'll keep you updated. Picking people for these is always challenging. We do our best to have a good mix of people from around the globe who we feel represent different interests and playstyles within our community. With space being limited (we hold the summits at our studio), we do have to be selective. That said, we're open to ideas on how to best select attendees that you feel adequately represent you. We also very much want to make sure we're able to livestream the summit this time.

I would like to see some of the critical players from EU Thornblade there, ones who won't be scared to ask hard questions and not just enter fanboy mode.
I don't mean I want rude or abusive people there, but ones who know the issues I as a PVP raid leader and co-guild leader on EU Thornblade suffer and have the willingness to represent that with hard questions.