DK- To Nerf or Not to Nerf

Quaesivi · June 2014

Also, to all that keeps whining DK is OP, just face against or play with a non-magicka, non pansy crossdresser DK wielding a staff that uses to stick it to him/herself or the others >_> I feel happy if I can pass a 400 dps mark, 500 is miraculous, you nerf staves and light armor, then you can see the actual power of the classes.

AlexDougherty · June 2014

Aenthel wrote: »

Also, to all that keeps whining DK is OP, just face against or play with a non-magicka, non pansy crossdresser DK wielding a staff that uses to stick it to him/herself or the others >_> I feel happy if I can pass a 400 dps mark, 500 is miraculous, you nerf staves and light armor, then you can see the actual power of the classes.

Nerfing staves/light armour is not the answer. They keep nerfing, and all it does is mess up the classes.

As I said before what they need to do is boost (or buff if you prefer) the other classes until they match the DK.

Read my lips no more Nerfing, as a certain US president would say.
(Ok, he wouldn't care about a computer game, but if he did)

subecsanur · June 2014

No buff! Just fix the other classes! Don't nerf the only class that seems to be playable and giving some enjoyment of playing in this game. Just fix the others that are broken or somewhat un-polished. Maybe no one played them in PTS or something but how is it so many flaws in 2 classes occur at high lvls despite more half a year of testing?

Again just fix the broken ones, if that means buffing then so be it. Please no more nerfing for a quick fix.

xaraan · June 2014

They need a couple minor nerfs IMO, but nothing major. Talons needs to be reworked, it was nerfed wrong. Instead of making it a smaller AoE they should have just allowed CC break/Dodge roll to give a player immunity for so many seconds afterward (I know you are immune 'while' dodge rolling but that is useless against it being spammed and didn't solve issue). They have refused to do this easy fix b/c it's a "soft CC" from the beginning, yet you can CC break out of various powers that still allow you to run around and make attacks. CC break should work against anything like that IMO.

The main reason this needs fixed is that in combination with charge it's broken. If you get shield charged and knocked down, then Talon'd, you can't dodge roll out of the talon b/c you are laying down and you can't CC break the knock down b/c you are in a talon so you just lay there until you die. If they just made CC break break anything this would be solved.

If they fixed Talons it would help the perception of balance quite a bit. I think magma armor needs to be nerfed as well and possibly standard weakened by about 5%. Other than that the weaker classes just need buffed up.

I would also make creatures that are of an element immune or almost immune to that element. Why would a fire attack kill a flame atronoch? It would make casters have to rework certain bars to fight certain enemies and not just faceroll everything with impulse and the like.

AlexDougherty · June 2014

xaraan wrote: »

They need a couple minor nerfs IMO, but nothing major. Talons needs to be reworked, it was nerfed wrong.

This is why I'm against nerfing, the nerfs aren't right. Reworking talon's so it works would be alright. I'm not against nerfs in principle, it's just that Zos's solution to every imbalance so far has been a nerf, soon we will end up with characters that can't open a pickle jar. They need to stop with the nerfs and start with some boosts.

I would also make creatures that are of an element immune or almost immune to that element. Why would a fire attack kill a flame atronoch?

Might be problematic, especially as DK is mainly fire orientated, and I can imagine the swearing when a sorc tries to kill a storm attronach with imunity to his lightning. Not saying they shouldn't but they need to offer some way to realign our abilities when they clash, otherwise we are going down.

hk11 · June 2014

Is it DKs that are overpowered or DKs in LA with staves? We would have been better off with 8 defined classes.

Melian · June 2014

EvilIguana wrote: »

Melian wrote: »

Don't nerf, and I say that as someone whose NB is VR1 and whose DK is level
12. Buff the weakest classes if necessary; it creates less negativity.

Assume that the ideal "power level" of a class is 100. A properly challenging enemy has a monster power level of 100. Class A currently has a power level of 110, class B a power level of 90. If we buff class B so that it has a power level equal to class A then suddenly the content is too easy. So now we have to increase the power level of every monster by 10% to compensate. That is a lot of work, especially given that a player power level of 110 versus a monster power level of 110 plays identically to 100 vs 100.

But wait, we did all that work but we screwed up. Class B now has a power level of 120. By your logic we now have to buff class A up to 120, then buff all the monsters up to 120. That is silly. If a class is overpowered you nerf it. If a class in underpowered you buff it. The idea that you should only ever adjust things upward is silly in abstract and unworkable in practice. People need to stop.

When did I say "you should only ever adjust things upward"? Show me where I said that.

Is PvE too easy for DKs, to the point where it becomes boring? I haven't seen anyone say that; only that they can't compete with DKs (in PvP or for a place in a group). That tells me the problem is balance between the classes, not between players and environment, in which case better off buffing the weaker classes: DK will lose their advantage, but at least they won't have to change their playstyle as well. Mind you, I don't feel like my NB needs buffing, but I seem to be in the minority there.

Shaun98ca2 · June 2014

Melian wrote: »

EvilIguana wrote: »

Melian wrote: »

Don't nerf, and I say that as someone whose NB is VR1 and whose DK is level
12. Buff the weakest classes if necessary; it creates less negativity.

Assume that the ideal "power level" of a class is 100. A properly challenging enemy has a monster power level of 100. Class A currently has a power level of 110, class B a power level of 90. If we buff class B so that it has a power level equal to class A then suddenly the content is too easy. So now we have to increase the power level of every monster by 10% to compensate. That is a lot of work, especially given that a player power level of 110 versus a monster power level of 110 plays identically to 100 vs 100.

But wait, we did all that work but we screwed up. Class B now has a power level of 120. By your logic we now have to buff class A up to 120, then buff all the monsters up to 120. That is silly. If a class is overpowered you nerf it. If a class in underpowered you buff it. The idea that you should only ever adjust things upward is silly in abstract and unworkable in practice. People need to stop.

When did I say "you should only ever adjust things upward"? Show me where I said that.

Is PvE too easy for DKs, to the point where it becomes boring? I haven't seen anyone say that; only that they can't compete with DKs (in PvP or for a place in a group). That tells me the problem is balance between the classes, not between players and environment, in which case better off buffing the weaker classes: DK will lose their advantage, but at least they won't have to change their playstyle as well. Mind you, I don't feel like my NB needs buffing, but I seem to be in the minority there.

They don't have to say it cause they wont. Everybody else watching see it. VR content pulling 8 mobs and destroying them is obviously not intended. You can see the content is trivialized just by watching them.