It’s to encourage use of the random queue, which helps players get specific dungeons done sooner because you in the random queue fill their missing roles. If you go as a group of four, you’re getting rewarded for doing what the game chooses for you. Otherwise we’d all just run FG1 on norm for those rewards.

The rewards for a random normal are the same as the rewards for a random vet, so unless you are looking for that additional challenge, there is no need to put yourself through vet to get the bonus.

Edited because coffee.

virtus753 wrote: »

It’s to encourage use of the random queue, which helps players get specific dungeons done sooner because you in the random queue fill their missing roles. If you go as a group of four, you’re getting rewarded for doing what the game chooses for you. Otherwise we’d all just run FG1 on norm for those rewards.

The rewards for a random normal are the same as the rewards for a random vet, so unless you are looking for that additional challenge, there is no need to put yourself through vet to get the bonus.

Edited because coffee.

Kartalin wrote: »

People doing random dungeons get grouped in with people wanting specific dungeons to farm certain sets. This way gear farmers can achieve their goals and then gives some extra bonus for the random group finders for helping out. That’s what I feel the reasoning is at least.

Otherwise everyone would speed run FG1 daily across multiple characters and people queuing for specific dungeons might never get a group

I hear both of you, but I feel like both your comments are making it seem like people are only doing dungeons for the dailies. People like myself are also trying to get achievements, monster helms, skins and personalities so im not trying to be playing with people not looking to play for something similar.

I also never said to remove random dungeons, I said to just give the rewards to the first dungeon completed. This way everyone benefits.

People that choose to do FG1 would probably be because they only want transmutes or dont have much time to play, so it benefits them by completing something quickly. People that que up randomly are willing to do anything. People that que up for specific dungeons are actually trying to complete them.

This would also heavily decrease the amount of fake tanks/healers we have besides in FG1. People like myself mainly que up as a fake tank because I know I can blast through any normal content and just want my transmutes asap. This ruins the experience for others that have no self heals and keep dying because they thinking they will get a tank/healer to protect them.

The other aspect is that, if you're doing specific dungeons in order to complete Undaunted dailies, you're already getting some compensation; a person just filling in wherever wouldn't get that reward apart from the random daily bonus. So it kind of evens out.

OsUfi wrote: »

nb_rich wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

It’s to encourage use of the random queue, which helps players get specific dungeons done sooner because you in the random queue fill their missing roles. If you go as a group of four, you’re getting rewarded for doing what the game chooses for you. Otherwise we’d all just run FG1 on norm for those rewards.

The rewards for a random normal are the same as the rewards for a random vet, so unless you are looking for that additional challenge, there is no need to put yourself through vet to get the bonus.

Edited because coffee.

Kartalin wrote: »

People doing random dungeons get grouped in with people wanting specific dungeons to farm certain sets. This way gear farmers can achieve their goals and then gives some extra bonus for the random group finders for helping out. That’s what I feel the reasoning is at least.

Otherwise everyone would speed run FG1 daily across multiple characters and people queuing for specific dungeons might never get a group

This would also heavily decrease the amount of fake tanks/healers we have besides in FG1. People like myself mainly que up as a fake tank because I know I can blast through any normal content and just want my transmutes asap. This ruins the experience for others that have no self heals and keep dying because they thinking they will get a tank/healer to protect them.

If people are dying when you're queuing as a fake tank ruining their experience, stop queuing as a god damn fake tank or slot a flipping taunt.

It's almost like the OP stated the problem and identified the cause of it (themself) in the same post.

Random solo dungeon when? PVP players have tons of geode sources, where is the love for PVE players.

nb_rich wrote: »

I hear both of you, but I feel like both your comments are making it seem like people are only doing dungeons for the dailies. People like myself are also trying to get achievements, monster helms, skins and personalities so im not trying to be playing with people not looking to play for something similar.

People aren't doing Random Dungeons for things like achieves or Monster Helms. People do Random Daily Dungeons for the rewards you get for doing the first one, aka the experience, the Transmutes, and in my case, for Class Script Scraps. If you're trying to get Dungeon-specific things then you need to queue for or travel to the Dungeon directly.

And the way those queues for specific Dungeons get filled is via people doing Random Dailies. Literally everyone who queues into a random Dungeon is punted into a group with one to three people looking to do specific Dungeons. I usually grab Pledges before queuing for a Random Daily because there's a good chance the group you'll be put into is one doing that specific Dungeon.

But like someone else said, if a person gets the reward from doing any Dungeon they can freely pick, literally everyone will just go for fast easy Dungeons like FG. And without any incentive to run Random Dailies because everyone's getting their reward from just doing FG every day, queues for specific Dungeons wind up taking AGES to fill.

OsUfi wrote: »

nb_rich wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

It’s to encourage use of the random queue, which helps players get specific dungeons done sooner because you in the random queue fill their missing roles. If you go as a group of four, you’re getting rewarded for doing what the game chooses for you. Otherwise we’d all just run FG1 on norm for those rewards.

The rewards for a random normal are the same as the rewards for a random vet, so unless you are looking for that additional challenge, there is no need to put yourself through vet to get the bonus.

Edited because coffee.

Kartalin wrote: »

People doing random dungeons get grouped in with people wanting specific dungeons to farm certain sets. This way gear farmers can achieve their goals and then gives some extra bonus for the random group finders for helping out. That’s what I feel the reasoning is at least.

Otherwise everyone would speed run FG1 daily across multiple characters and people queuing for specific dungeons might never get a group

This would also heavily decrease the amount of fake tanks/healers we have besides in FG1. People like myself mainly que up as a fake tank because I know I can blast through any normal content and just want my transmutes asap. This ruins the experience for others that have no self heals and keep dying because they thinking they will get a tank/healer to protect them.

If people are dying when you're queuing as a fake tank ruining their experience, stop queuing as a god damn fake tank or slot a flipping taunt.

Then why do it knowing you are potentially making a worse experience for others? It doesn't take that much longer to actually kill stuff that's directly in your path than it does to just rush through it and leave people behind to deal with it.

Something I've had happen several times over the last few days is people just rush rush rushing ahead, they aggro everything for the whole group, manage to get through a door...while myself and usually one or sometimes two other people are stuck running around trying to figure out what enemy is keeping US from getting through the door because of being in-combat. So not only is blitzing through a Dungeon at Mach <snip> potentially ruining the experience for others, it can also cause frustrating issues where they get stuck because they're in combat with mobs five rooms back. And it's made even worse if whoever's run ahead winds up being unable to get to a Boss to just yank everyone to them.

OsUfi wrote: »

nb_rich wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

It’s to encourage use of the random queue, which helps players get specific dungeons done sooner because you in the random queue fill their missing roles. If you go as a group of four, you’re getting rewarded for doing what the game chooses for you. Otherwise we’d all just run FG1 on norm for those rewards.

The rewards for a random normal are the same as the rewards for a random vet, so unless you are looking for that additional challenge, there is no need to put yourself through vet to get the bonus.

Edited because coffee.

Kartalin wrote: »

People doing random dungeons get grouped in with people wanting specific dungeons to farm certain sets. This way gear farmers can achieve their goals and then gives some extra bonus for the random group finders for helping out. That’s what I feel the reasoning is at least.

Otherwise everyone would speed run FG1 daily across multiple characters and people queuing for specific dungeons might never get a group

This would also heavily decrease the amount of fake tanks/healers we have besides in FG1. People like myself mainly que up as a fake tank because I know I can blast through any normal content and just want my transmutes asap. This ruins the experience for others that have no self heals and keep dying because they thinking they will get a tank/healer to protect them.

If people are dying when you're queuing as a fake tank ruining their experience, stop queuing as a god damn fake tank or slot a flipping taunt.

So I must waste my time waiting in a long queue to do a random dungeon im probably going to get a fake tank/healer in anyways lol. I may as well queue up as the tank myself. Base game dungeons and even some dlc ones most experienced players can solo

People que up as fake tanks and healers cause they want to just get the transmutes and get up outta there.

DenverRalphy wrote: »

The RND rewards are purposely there as an incentive for players who wouldn't otherwise be looking to run a dungeon to help out others who do. Before the RND and its rewards, players looking to complete a specific dungeon for whatever the reason, could spend hours looking and waiting for some kind soul to join their group and run the dungeon. The RND was created to provide a persistant pool of volunteers to jump in and help out.

Take that exclusivity away from Random Dailies and that pool of volunteers evaporates. Leaving most anyone who wants to run anything other than FG1 out in the cold.

I hear you, but somewhat disagree.

Vet and normal dailies give the same xp and transmutes for completing the daily so I would assume majority of people would just do the normal daily leaving Vet dungeon players waiting hours regardless. Im also pretty sure majority of people dont use random dungeons after completing the daily besides people needing 1 transmute or leveling up a new character which would all be done in normal dungeons not vet.

I also think people aren’t reading that I said add the daily reward to the first dungeon we complete not remove the random dungeon queue. Give us the 10 transmutes, then they should work on making the rewards for random queues better and permanent (not just a daily to be done once a day). Random normal and vet dailies need separate rewards and should get a lot more rewards/incentives for queuing up for a random vet dungeon

Ardriel wrote: »

You get a reward for a random dungeon because it’s random. That means there’s a certain amount of risk involved, and that risk is rewarded. You might be lucky and get FG1, or you might be unlucky and end up with a difficult DLC dungeon. There are actually DLC dungeons that can turn into a real ordeal even on Normal difficulty with certain players.
There’s no need to reward players for specifically choosing a dungeon. Loot and a little XP are already reward enough.

The risk-reward is not even worth it. Firstly you get the same xp and transmutes from the daily regardless if you pick vet or normal, so having random vet que is pretty much pointless.

When it comes to thinking someone shouldn’t be rewarded for selecting their own dungeon that can go either way. I dont believe if I select a vet DLC dungeon, someone with no eso plus or dlcs should be awarded more then me because they are doing random normal dungeons. Even with the normal and vet randoms, why are they the same daily rewards? I’m not even getting extra transmutes for completing a random vet dungeon instead of a random normal dungeon. Makes no sense to me personally

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Arunei wrote: »

nb_rich wrote: »

OsUfi wrote: »

nb_rich wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

It’s to encourage use of the random queue, which helps players get specific dungeons done sooner because you in the random queue fill their missing roles. If you go as a group of four, you’re getting rewarded for doing what the game chooses for you. Otherwise we’d all just run FG1 on norm for those rewards.

The rewards for a random normal are the same as the rewards for a random vet, so unless you are looking for that additional challenge, there is no need to put yourself through vet to get the bonus.

Edited because coffee.

Kartalin wrote: »

People doing random dungeons get grouped in with people wanting specific dungeons to farm certain sets. This way gear farmers can achieve their goals and then gives some extra bonus for the random group finders for helping out. That’s what I feel the reasoning is at least.

Otherwise everyone would speed run FG1 daily across multiple characters and people queuing for specific dungeons might never get a group

This would also heavily decrease the amount of fake tanks/healers we have besides in FG1. People like myself mainly que up as a fake tank because I know I can blast through any normal content and just want my transmutes asap. This ruins the experience for others that have no self heals and keep dying because they thinking they will get a tank/healer to protect them.

If people are dying when you're queuing as a fake tank ruining their experience, stop queuing as a god damn fake tank or slot a flipping taunt.

So I must waste my time waiting in a long queue to do a random dungeon im probably going to get a fake tank/healer in anyways lol. I may as well queue up as the tank myself. Base game dungeons and even some dlc ones most experienced players can solo

People que up as fake tanks and healers cause they want to just get the transmutes and get up outta there.

Or, just maybe, you can put on a Taunt or be the first to pull stuff and actually Tank? This is the selfish attitude people get tired of seeing in Random Dungeons. ESPECIALLY because if you get in a DLC Dungeon, a fake Tank may very well just wind up causing wipes.

When I queue as a Healer, it's on my actual healer. And I do healing. I know, crazy concept.

This is what I do quite often. I slap inner fire on my flex slot and just tank it myself.

I have a Pureclass 1bar DK who's meant to be DD but I've been working on so he can also act as a competent Tank just for situations where we get someone that's queued as a Tank but can't actually do the job (or just refuses to because they're DD who feel entitled to skip the queue regardless of how bad it's going to make things for their group). It isn't too awfully hard to swap some stats and Skills around, especially since we can reallocate our Attribute Points freely and for free these days.

Otherwise on my DDs, as annoying as the queue can be to sit in, I sit in it. I have characters who 100% can charge at the speed of light through most Normal Dungeons. That doesn't mean I feel entitled to queue as a Tank and leave the rest of my group in the dust.

I've said it in another thread; as annoying as it is, people rushing ahead won't keep you from getting a quest done or something in the long run. That one instance won't be the only time you do that Dungeon 99% of the time (unless a person just never does Dungeons again after that or some other extreme). But there's a difference between speedrunners and people who skip the queue to speedrun. At least in the case of just speedrunning, the people doing it are usually capable of actually dealing with Bosses or getting to them so anyone left behind gets to said Bosses. But people who queue as fake Tanks or Healers oftentimes seem incapable of actually doing things by themselves and it turns into a mess.

Arunei wrote: »

nb_rich wrote: »

OsUfi wrote: »

nb_rich wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

It’s to encourage use of the random queue, which helps players get specific dungeons done sooner because you in the random queue fill their missing roles. If you go as a group of four, you’re getting rewarded for doing what the game chooses for you. Otherwise we’d all just run FG1 on norm for those rewards.

The rewards for a random normal are the same as the rewards for a random vet, so unless you are looking for that additional challenge, there is no need to put yourself through vet to get the bonus.

Edited because coffee.

Kartalin wrote: »

People doing random dungeons get grouped in with people wanting specific dungeons to farm certain sets. This way gear farmers can achieve their goals and then gives some extra bonus for the random group finders for helping out. That’s what I feel the reasoning is at least.

Otherwise everyone would speed run FG1 daily across multiple characters and people queuing for specific dungeons might never get a group

This would also heavily decrease the amount of fake tanks/healers we have besides in FG1. People like myself mainly que up as a fake tank because I know I can blast through any normal content and just want my transmutes asap. This ruins the experience for others that have no self heals and keep dying because they thinking they will get a tank/healer to protect them.

If people are dying when you're queuing as a fake tank ruining their experience, stop queuing as a god damn fake tank or slot a flipping taunt.

So I must waste my time waiting in a long queue to do a random dungeon im probably going to get a fake tank/healer in anyways lol. I may as well queue up as the tank myself. Base game dungeons and even some dlc ones most experienced players can solo

People que up as fake tanks and healers cause they want to just get the transmutes and get up outta there.

Or, just maybe, you can put on a Taunt or be the first to pull stuff and actually Tank? This is the selfish attitude people get tired of seeing in Random Dungeons. ESPECIALLY because if you get in a DLC Dungeon, a fake Tank may very well just wind up causing wipes.

When I queue as a Healer, it's on my actual healer. And I do healing. I know, crazy concept.

Im not gone act like its not selfish, but its also my time so Im not going to waste it, and having the daily like this is what causes us to do this.

If I’m done work I ain’t got much time to play so sitting in a que for 40+ minutes is not ideal. Got to consider if my guild or friends have a trial set up a specific time. Have to consider you really can’t do much while queued up. For example I'm working in the zone stories for my archanist and if I go into a dungeon while in a zone story area, it kicks me outside of it and have to redo everything again or run through the whole delve/zone story area again so can’t do that. If I decide to do world bosses or incursions then because if I'm “In Combat” i wont be able to join the dungeon and could miss it. You really just stand around and do writs lol.

nb_rich wrote: »

Arunei wrote: »

nb_rich wrote: »

OsUfi wrote: »

nb_rich wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

It’s to encourage use of the random queue, which helps players get specific dungeons done sooner because you in the random queue fill their missing roles. If you go as a group of four, you’re getting rewarded for doing what the game chooses for you. Otherwise we’d all just run FG1 on norm for those rewards.

The rewards for a random normal are the same as the rewards for a random vet, so unless you are looking for that additional challenge, there is no need to put yourself through vet to get the bonus.

Edited because coffee.

Kartalin wrote: »

People doing random dungeons get grouped in with people wanting specific dungeons to farm certain sets. This way gear farmers can achieve their goals and then gives some extra bonus for the random group finders for helping out. That’s what I feel the reasoning is at least.

Otherwise everyone would speed run FG1 daily across multiple characters and people queuing for specific dungeons might never get a group

This would also heavily decrease the amount of fake tanks/healers we have besides in FG1. People like myself mainly que up as a fake tank because I know I can blast through any normal content and just want my transmutes asap. This ruins the experience for others that have no self heals and keep dying because they thinking they will get a tank/healer to protect them.

If people are dying when you're queuing as a fake tank ruining their experience, stop queuing as a god damn fake tank or slot a flipping taunt.

So I must waste my time waiting in a long queue to do a random dungeon im probably going to get a fake tank/healer in anyways lol. I may as well queue up as the tank myself. Base game dungeons and even some dlc ones most experienced players can solo

People que up as fake tanks and healers cause they want to just get the transmutes and get up outta there.

Or, just maybe, you can put on a Taunt or be the first to pull stuff and actually Tank? This is the selfish attitude people get tired of seeing in Random Dungeons. ESPECIALLY because if you get in a DLC Dungeon, a fake Tank may very well just wind up causing wipes.

When I queue as a Healer, it's on my actual healer. And I do healing. I know, crazy concept.

Im not gone act like its not selfish, but its also my time so Im not going to waste it, and having the daily like this is what causes us to do this.

Cool, great, awesome, so you'll waste everybody else's? By your own posts, people die in your dungeons when you're fake tanking, so clearly you're not a god tier DPS, wreck everything before it hits kinda player either. Jesus wept, the entitlement of some members of this community...

I do think the system needs a small rework.

We probably don't need random normal dungeon XP rewards. It incentivises highCP players to grind XP by rushing dungeons, which makes for an absolutely terrible first-time dungeon experience for others. Instead they could increase the XP that dungeon quests provide so that doing the dungeons is still encouraged for new players but highCP players will gravitate more towards the daily random veteran dungeons instead, once they have completed all the dungeon quests.
That should be enough to change the dungeon etiquette in normal dungeons for the better and make veteran dungeons in general more popular - which is something everyone can appreciate, provided the XP is actually worthwhile.

Arunei wrote: »

Ratzkifal wrote: »

I do think the system needs a small rework.

We probably don't need random normal dungeon XP rewards. It incentivises highCP players to grind XP by rushing dungeons, which makes for an absolutely terrible first-time dungeon experience for others. Instead they could increase the XP that dungeon quests provide so that doing the dungeons is still encouraged for new players but highCP players will gravitate more towards the daily random veteran dungeons instead, once they have completed all the dungeon quests.
That should be enough to change the dungeon etiquette in normal dungeons for the better and make veteran dungeons in general more popular - which is something everyone can appreciate, provided the XP is actually worthwhile.

The only issue is this mindset that high CP = high skill or ability, but it doesn't. You can be over 1k CP just from doing all sorts of things like questing, taking part in Events (especially the double exp ones like the Jubilee) and doing Master Writs. I'm going on CP 1.9k and I really don't like doing Vet Dungeons because of the constant worry of getting a Vet DLC that I don't know mechanics of.

Which is actually another point; people complaining about randoms in Vet Dungeons who don't know mechanics. If you want to encourage people, regardless of CP, to do Vet Randoms more, I think the place to start would be with people being more willing to actually realize that someone queing for Vet Randoms isn't coming into a Vet DLC on purpose. Most are probably praying they get a base game Vet, but we can't control whether we wind up in base game or DLC Dungeons. If people didn't get mad and impatient over someone not knowing every mechanic in every Vet DLC, we'd probably see more people be willing to try.

It also doesn't help that the rewards are the same. If we want more people who are capable of handling any Vet DLC Dungeons they get punted into with the Randoms queue, another thing to ask for is making the rewards more appealing. Double the exp and Transmutes for example, offer 3 or 4 Class Script Scraps instead of only 2. As it is most people aren't going to queue for Random Vets just because there's no real reason to for the average person.

I don't see the issue. You can still do normal dungeons, you just don't get extra rewards for a daily random normal. If you are at 1000CP while also not being high skill or ability, you also aren't in need to get massive amounts of XP fast for any reason whatsoever. There are plenty of ways to gain XP in this game if you are trying to level something. You can quest while using the skill, you can grind out an area with high enemy density, dolmen surf in Alik'r, you can do crafting writs and master writs while having the skill slotted. You don't need the daily random dungeon for that.
When I'm talking about a high CP player rushing through a dungeon and ruining the experience for a new player, I'm not talking about a low skill player at a high champion point count. But that doesn't make the scenario where rushing happens any less real. The first dungeons you do are people's first impressions of dungeons as a whole, and also of the cooperative aspects of the playerbase as a whole. Giving players bad first impressions is way worse than not giving high CP players an easy way to get XP, because those players don't even stick around long enough to reach highCP levels.
Nobody complains about randoms in vets not knowing the mechanics. People complain about randoms not telling they don't know the mechanics, or about people not willing or able to listen/learn the mechanics, or simply preventing a successful completion of the dungeon in whatever way, in which case, stick to the normal dungeons until you're ready.

I do agree that increasing the rewards on random veteran dungeons would work as an alternative. I'd be fine with that too so long as the increase feels worth it and you can only get the rewards from one - normal or vet.

Ratzkifal wrote: »

Arunei wrote: »

Ratzkifal wrote: »

I do think the system needs a small rework.

We probably don't need random normal dungeon XP rewards. It incentivises highCP players to grind XP by rushing dungeons, which makes for an absolutely terrible first-time dungeon experience for others. Instead they could increase the XP that dungeon quests provide so that doing the dungeons is still encouraged for new players but highCP players will gravitate more towards the daily random veteran dungeons instead, once they have completed all the dungeon quests.
That should be enough to change the dungeon etiquette in normal dungeons for the better and make veteran dungeons in general more popular - which is something everyone can appreciate, provided the XP is actually worthwhile.

The only issue is this mindset that high CP = high skill or ability, but it doesn't. You can be over 1k CP just from doing all sorts of things like questing, taking part in Events (especially the double exp ones like the Jubilee) and doing Master Writs. I'm going on CP 1.9k and I really don't like doing Vet Dungeons because of the constant worry of getting a Vet DLC that I don't know mechanics of.

Which is actually another point; people complaining about randoms in Vet Dungeons who don't know mechanics. If you want to encourage people, regardless of CP, to do Vet Randoms more, I think the place to start would be with people being more willing to actually realize that someone queing for Vet Randoms isn't coming into a Vet DLC on purpose. Most are probably praying they get a base game Vet, but we can't control whether we wind up in base game or DLC Dungeons. If people didn't get mad and impatient over someone not knowing every mechanic in every Vet DLC, we'd probably see more people be willing to try.

It also doesn't help that the rewards are the same. If we want more people who are capable of handling any Vet DLC Dungeons they get punted into with the Randoms queue, another thing to ask for is making the rewards more appealing. Double the exp and Transmutes for example, offer 3 or 4 Class Script Scraps instead of only 2. As it is most people aren't going to queue for Random Vets just because there's no real reason to for the average person.

I don't see the issue. You can still do normal dungeons, you just don't get extra rewards for a daily random normal. If you are at 1000CP while also not being high skill or ability, you also aren't in need to get massive amounts of XP fast for any reason whatsoever. There are plenty of ways to gain XP in this game if you are trying to level something. You can quest while using the skill, you can grind out an area with high enemy density, dolmen surf in Alik'r, you can do crafting writs and master writs while having the skill slotted. You don't need the daily random dungeon for that.
When I'm talking about a high CP player rushing through a dungeon and ruining the experience for a new player, I'm not talking about a low skill player at a high champion point count. But that doesn't make the scenario where rushing happens any less real. The first dungeons you do are people's first impressions of dungeons as a whole, and also of the cooperative aspects of the playerbase as a whole. Giving players bad first impressions is way worse than not giving high CP players an easy way to get XP, because those players don't even stick around long enough to reach highCP levels.
Nobody complains about randoms in vets not knowing the mechanics. People complain about randoms not telling they don't know the mechanics, or about people not willing or able to listen/learn the mechanics, or simply preventing a successful completion of the dungeon in whatever way, in which case, stick to the normal dungeons until you're ready.

I do agree that increasing the rewards on random veteran dungeons would work as an alternative. I'd be fine with that too so long as the increase feels worth it and you can only get the rewards from one - normal or vet.

If people are to stick to the Normal Dungeons until they're ready, then shouldn't there still be rewards for the people learning? And why shouldn't people who have less skill be rewarded for doing a Random Normal as well? Then you run into the problem of people not only not queuing for Vet Randoms because people are expecting anyone to know mechs (in response to people getting mad if someone doesn't say they don't know, instead of just assuming from the get-go that people in a Random Vet won't know mechs for any given one, especially Vet DLC), but without an incentive to do even Normal Randoms, those would largely stop getting run too.

And then that creates the problem of people trying to do Dungeons either for the sake of doing them, say for the quest or a Pledge, or new people getting into Dungeons once they can start using the LFG Tool, but there being few people in the queue to put them with. It could also potentially create a problem where more experienced people who run Normals a lot stop doing it and thus there are fewer knowledgeable people overall doing the content to help out newer players.

The best bet really would be to give the Vet Random queue better rewards, and thinking about it, it's kind of a surprise that eleven years in and Vet Randoms have never been given a boost. Hell, maybe they could consider even adding something like Trade Bars for Vet Randoms? Nothing crazy, just like...I dunno, 50 or so. Not so much that you can just farm the heck out of them, but enough of a trickle that doing Vet Randoms regularly can get you a decent number for one or two extra things from the Bazaar or make it easier to get stuff from the Impressario.