Why is everyone so adverse to grouping for NM?

Demonwolff · May 4

I think over all most would love to Group but there are barriers for some. Be it work, health, physical limitation, age, or maybe a self doubt that prevents them from Joining. At 53 I'm well aware that this Community is welcoming and helpful in general well beyond many others. I've played some very unhealthy, toxic games over the years. But More to the other barriers Time becomes an issue I have friends that work Fri -Sun and only play Mon-Thurs 11-5 or Work Mon to Fri and only play Sat but only 9 am to noon. Then you have someone with health issues who can only play for 30 minutes to an hour at a time. Maybe the individual has a physical limitation and feels they cant grp. While we all appreciate that and would not hold it against them it becomes a personal thing at that point so more and more people tend to solo. We can change this by pulling them in and just letting them be them.

frogthroat · May 4

Elvenheart wrote: »

To answer the OP’s question, it’s not that I don’t like grouping for NM. It’s just that my playtime is limited and sporadic and can be interrupted at any moment by RL issues that it’s hard for me to group because I may have to drop out at a moment’s notice and I don’t want to inconvenience other players. The only time I’ll risk it is when I think there’s a chance I won’t be interrupted long enough to finish.

The few groups I have tried in NM, they are all easy come, easy go. Just apply, get in group. Maybe say something when you leave, but not necessary. As long as you actually leave the group when you leave and not stay in the group offline.

KazaiDaGod · May 4

I remember playing Trials for the first time....."I was lost, but there was a lead and also a direction and also an end goal"

NM at the moment is a hodge podge of people with no direction and others with no idea of the quest for the end goal, and others just running around like chicks without you know what.

I bagged NM at the start, but so many days in I think I am getting the hang of it.

AzuraFan · May 4

Demonwolff wrote: »

Maybe the individual has a physical limitation and feels they cant grp.

I'm in that category. I don't mind grouping at all. I pug dungeons all the time, but dungeons take anywhere from 10 minutes to 30 minutes (though 30 minutes is rare, and usually only if the pug is struggling). That's okay.

Due to an RSI, I can't do combat-heavy areas for long periods. I can do one arc in the IA, two on a good day. And sometimes when I do two, I regret it when the pain comes later.

That's why I don't enjoy combat-focused areas in ESO. When the feedback about the Night Market started coming in on PTS, I knew there was no way I'd be able to do it because it's not a 5-30 minute thing.

If it was casual grouping, where I could just run with a zerg, then maybe I would have given it a try, done my 30 minutes (or a bit more on a good day), and left. But it doesn't sound like it is. I wouldn't want to be in a group of strangers who need a group to get stuff done, and I have to drop 20 minutes in because it's a bad day and pain is flaring up. Even if the group might not mind, I wouldn't feel good about it.

I'm not bothered by the Night Market. No rage quitting or angst here. But I wouldn't say no to a normal difficulty option when they bring it back.

Tandor · May 4

OccultNerd wrote: »

So....I generally play solo, I group up for trials/end etc but that's it. I play solo because I don't need a group for normal overland content,wbs, public dungeons etc.. I'm not an elitist, my DPS isn't amazing but I get on fine for the content I play.

Along comes Night Market...you need to group/follow a group/ sneak etc.. no problem, it was advertised as group content.

What I don't understand is why so many players refuse to group up and then come to the forums or FB groups and moan because they expected to do solo NM and they can't, so that's it they are quitting....what is they actual issue? Why won't these players join a team?

I've seen people asking for a solo or easier version of NM, why? Especially after the majority of players wanted harder content!

It's interesting that you introduce your comments by saying you mostly solo, but then add that you group for trials and endgame which puts you closer to the elite level than most who solo and don't find the NM to be for them. That's fine, however, and I don't believe that most who take that view have indicated that they have any intention of quitting the game over it.

Nonetheless, it wasn't advertised as just group content, it was clearly stated that "many of the event zone’s challenges were designed for groups in mind, so be prepared for a tough fight if you’re venturing into the zone solo".

Personally, I think it would have been a lot better if it had been introduced with separate normal and veteran modes similar to the way dungeons are handled. I hope that's reflected in any changes made if and when it returns.

Fruity_Ninja · May 4

Orbital78 wrote: »

Gabriel_H wrote: »

There's a difference between those who are complaining and those who don't want to group. Grouping negates Ring of the Pale Order

Overall the group finder has been shining this event. It varies greatly in quality of experience. Some groups one raid stomps, and sometimes two/24 struggle bus.

Agree, group finder has been a saviour of the event

And re: the groups, you get a good tank and healer- things go much smoother! 12 DPS groups are rough, particularly on a skirmish!

BardokRedSnow · May 4

SilverBride wrote: »

BardokRedSnow wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

OccultNerd wrote: »

I've seen people asking for a solo or easier version of NM, why? Especially after the majority of players wanted harder content!

The majority do not want harder content. It was a the same handful of players in the pinned overland thread asking for more difficulty. That is far from the majority of players.

This is a lie

Actually it isn't. Go take a look at that monster of a thread. It's mostly the same handful of players. Also, I never ever heard anyone in zone chat, or guild chat, or anywhere in game complaining that the game was too easy.

The biggest problem you guys have here is that you think this small cut of the community, the forums, is actually an accurate representation of the community at large. It is a very small and also very vocal minority.

Especially since for many here, eso is the only game you play and all you think about. I promise you, Zos is not that way, because they want money, and are constantly trying to pull in a bigger audience.

BardokRedSnow · May 4

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

BardokRedSnow wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

OccultNerd wrote: »

I've seen people asking for a solo or easier version of NM, why? Especially after the majority of players wanted harder content!

The majority do not want harder content. It was a the same handful of players in the pinned overland thread asking for more difficulty. That is far from the majority of players.

This is a lie

Actually it isn't. Go take a look at that monster of a thread. It's mostly the same handful of players. Also, I never ever heard anyone in zone chat, or guild chat, or anywhere in game complaining that the game was too easy.

I've occasionally heard a few players in zone chat complain about the game being too easy.

But I don't think the majority want harder content, because if that were so then I'd expect to hear a lot more complaints about it in zone chat.

Just like the forums, most people do not talk in zone chat. The kind of people that do regularly overall are also not the most experienced players. This is a general thing I've observed, not a rule mind you.

Pulling polls from these forums and zone chat when there's thousands of players is crazy work. A better example is look at games that have more players than eso does, world of warcraft is probably the best example. MMO players want challenge as much as they also want casual content thats easy going. ESO has been leaning way too hard on the latter to keep people interested. Clearly. Everyone and especially Zos has noticed the player count in the steam charts and other examples, its not like this is theoretical.

People spend all this time gathering countless sets, gold and other currencies, filling up the stickerbook, gathering transmutes etc, and people here think what we just like collecting stuff to never use for its own sake? Of course people want a challenge. And the most annoying thing I've seen from this community here is despite the game being advertised for "everyone" and most of the content being casual, when something more interesting and demanding pops up for those who do want a challenge, and this is maybe once every other year or so, people here gather the pitchforks.

rothan117 · May 4

I do not group because I have to go afk frequently and without warning. My real life situation dictates that I do not group as I cannot expect the group to pause for me with no notice and with what would be an annoying frequency.

frogthroat · May 4

rothan117 wrote: »

I do not group because I have to go afk frequently and without warning. My real life situation dictates that I do not group as I cannot expect the group to pause for me with no notice and with what would be an annoying frequency.

I don't think anyone minds. People join, people leave. If you need to go for a few minutes, most likely no one notices in the group. You might want to (optionally) say "afk 5 mins" if it is short. Or leave the group if it's a longer pause.

This is not like a trial/dungeon where you are expected to stay until end. It's more like join whenever, leave whenever.

spartaxoxo · May 4

rothan117 wrote: »

I do not group because I have to go afk frequently and without warning. My real life situation dictates that I do not group as I cannot expect the group to pause for me with no notice and with what would be an annoying frequency.

If it were a dungeon that would be true. But there are completely unstructured event zone groups and everyone is doing their own thing and don't care.

Destai · May 4

I'm not personally against grouping for this content. Actually, I think it's great there's some true group content where your choices matter, build-wise.

But, I don't like that the required group size is so high. I truly hoped for meaningful group content that my small group could do at our leisure. It didn't turn out that way. Again, the communication around group size and difficulty was not clear. I was under the impression you could reasonably solo this, but being grouped would be more effective. That's not the case. And the game itself doesn't enforce a minimum group size.

Now, I'm seeing comments on not being able to teleport to your group or respawn where you died. Add on the reports of not getting credit for skirmishes if you die, which you will if you get separated, and it's just not something I want to tolerate. These things need to launch in a better state. I'm sorry, this is an old game, I expect things to be better implemented by now.

colossalvoids · May 4

First of all looking how fast groups getting delisted signifies grouping, but forums are telling the other storey or one which isn't seen. A huge subset of players hate grouping, other people, MMOs etc. and they do feel neglected when a quarterly release goes against their interests, wants and likes. They probably don't care that there were literal years with no content for some kinds of players, or that this year would lack in some other departments and they're not being solely targeted by fun police.

There's a lot of reasons to why, but I don't think that really matters as they would remain and are a part of the playerbase, this current issue is of zos's making, their marketing team and overall vagueness is at play, it's not an issue of the release by itself. If they were more clear, if they weren't afraid to exclude some players naming their target demographics out loud and were playing more attention to how people perceive devs words overall.

Soarora · May 4

colossalvoids wrote: »

First of all looking how fast groups getting delisted signifies grouping, but forums are telling the other storey or one which isn't seen.

Reading between the lines on some people’s posts, it’s clear to me that there are people unable to find groups who didn’t actually try to make a listing. They’re just looking in group finder and their guilds but not actually making a listing or asking people for a group. Not claiming everyone’s not trying, but I have seen people who clearly aren’t.

Edit: and to be clear, I get it, you don’t know what you’re doing and don’t want to lead, I assume. But someone might join and take over leading the group. Or you’ll end up with 11 people who also don’t know what’s going on and you’ll learn together.

manukartofanu · May 4

The answer is "not everyone". And not even the majority.
The real problem is that in recent years ZOS has been pandering to the loud casual majority. This majority doesn't want to play the game, they want to log in for 10 minutes, get ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING, and never come back. As a result, the online population kept dropping, there was nobody to play with, and the game essentially turned into a paradise for solo players while becoming completely uninteresting and unplayable for those who actually want an MMO experience. Which would be fine, except that as a solo game, ESO can't even compete with Skyrim, and that's exactly what we've been seeing in recent years. And those solo players left too.
Night Market is a partial solution to the problem. We got MMO content with some actual replayability again. And, horror of horrors, you can't get everything at once! Who doesn't like that? Well, basically the people who wouldn't have been playing the game without Night Market anyway. They've crawled out to complain that they can't get everything in 10 minutes of gameplay. Meanwhile, there's no livelier zone in the actual game. I was forming skirmish groups at the deadest hours, and even then they filled up within minutes. During the day it's genuinely hard to even join a new group fast enough, it's easier to just make your own. For any purpose.
Yes, there's a real issue that people don't understand what's going on, not enough information and explanations out there. The trial is still hard to get through, people don't understand the mechanics. But isn't that exactly what the community is here for?

Maitsukas · May 4

I'm a solo player and if the mood strikes, I break out of my introvert bubble and group up with other players. It really helps with how difficult Night Market is for the non-hardcore players.

FurryCandyHearts · May 4

OccultNerd wrote: »

So....I generally play solo, I group up for trials/end etc but that's it. I play solo because I don't need a group for normal overland content,wbs, public dungeons etc.. I'm not an elitist, my DPS isn't amazing but I get on fine for the content I play.

Along comes Night Market...you need to group/follow a group/ sneak etc.. no problem, it was advertised as group content.

What I don't understand is why so many players refuse to group up and then come to the forums or FB groups and moan because they expected to do solo NM and they can't, so that's it they are quitting....what is they actual issue? Why won't these players join a team?

I've seen people asking for a solo or easier version of NM, why? Especially after the majority of players wanted harder content!

Night market is gross and offensive for reasons i am not at liberty to entirely disclose here on thew forums. I find the entire premise repugnant. Pledging myself to any of the 3 miscreants is repugnant. And the starter quest those who would rule is repugnant. The house looks like a frat boy party palace and not at all like a house i would like to live in. I really can't say more but the entire NM is more repugnant than scribing and scrying and the witches fest and tales of tribute and all the other stuff they've added to the game. I thiunk it's even more offensive than the ridiculous over the top graphiical effects they keep adding to the game: even more so than chakram shields animation, night market is offensive to me. If only i could say more and be specific, but you know, it's forbidden.

FurryCandyHearts · May 4

illutian wrote: »

I think I've come up with a perfect explanation as to why I dislike forced-group content.

I like your presence, not your company.

wait until they add voice chat for pc in cross play when it comes out, you won't be liking either then.

rockDokRock · May 4

OccultNerd wrote: »

So....I generally play solo, I group up for trials/end etc but that's it. I play solo because I don't need a group for normal overland content,wbs, public dungeons etc.. I'm not an elitist, my DPS isn't amazing but I get on fine for the content I play.

Along comes Night Market...you need to group/follow a group/ sneak etc.. no problem, it was advertised as group content.

What I don't understand is why so many players refuse to group up and then come to the forums or FB groups and moan because they expected to do solo NM and they can't, so that's it they are quitting....what is they actual issue? Why won't these players join a team?

I've seen people asking for a solo or easier version of NM, why? Especially after the majority of players wanted harder content!

It's not so much being adverse to grouping... it's the fact it's like herding cats and watching everyone just wanders off in their own direction with their own idea as to how this is going to work out. Spoiler alert... not great.

CameraBeardThePirate · May 4

rockDokRock wrote: »

OccultNerd wrote: »

So....I generally play solo, I group up for trials/end etc but that's it. I play solo because I don't need a group for normal overland content,wbs, public dungeons etc.. I'm not an elitist, my DPS isn't amazing but I get on fine for the content I play.

Along comes Night Market...you need to group/follow a group/ sneak etc.. no problem, it was advertised as group content.

What I don't understand is why so many players refuse to group up and then come to the forums or FB groups and moan because they expected to do solo NM and they can't, so that's it they are quitting....what is they actual issue? Why won't these players join a team?

I've seen people asking for a solo or easier version of NM, why? Especially after the majority of players wanted harder content!

It's not so much being adverse to grouping... it's the fact it's like herding cats and watching everyone just wanders off in their own direction with their own idea as to how this is going to work out. Spoiler alert... not great.

At that point just join a new group or make a group listing yourself (it will fill, I promise).

It takes 5 seconds to leave group and join a new listing, and I promise that you will find a listing where everyone is traveling together.

DenverRalphy · May 4

FurryCandyHearts wrote: »

OccultNerd wrote: »

So....I generally play solo, I group up for trials/end etc but that's it. I play solo because I don't need a group for normal overland content,wbs, public dungeons etc.. I'm not an elitist, my DPS isn't amazing but I get on fine for the content I play.

Along comes Night Market...you need to group/follow a group/ sneak etc.. no problem, it was advertised as group content.

What I don't understand is why so many players refuse to group up and then come to the forums or FB groups and moan because they expected to do solo NM and they can't, so that's it they are quitting....what is they actual issue? Why won't these players join a team?

I've seen people asking for a solo or easier version of NM, why? Especially after the majority of players wanted harder content!

Night market is gross and offensive for reasons i am not at liberty to entirely disclose here on thew forums. I find the entire premise repugnant. Pledging myself to any of the 3 miscreants is repugnant. And the starter quest those who would rule is repugnant. The house looks like a frat boy party palace and not at all like a house i would like to live in. I really can't say more but the entire NM is more repugnant than scribing and scrying and the witches fest and tales of tribute and all the other stuff they've added to the game. I thiunk it's even more offensive than the ridiculous over the top graphiical effects they keep adding to the game: even more so than chakram shields animation, night market is offensive to me. If only i could say more and be specific, but you know, it's forbidden.

Have you not read, experienced, or followed any TES lore prior to the Night Market? Cannabilism, <sex with corpses> (the word for that is actually censored on the forums), slavery, sex trafficing, filicide... the list goes on and on.

Luneca · May 4

I refuse to group because the people that group with me will become tainted by my karma.

Not everyone can just join a party and get along well. The moment I do anything, even a simple greeting, the party is fated to fail. It always ends the same way. Everyone plotting against each other. Players t-bagging their teammates when they die or dancing over their bodies as if they are doing some sick ritual. Sometimes, one will simply leave the others in the dust with lots of enemies to punish them.

I've seen it all. The darkness. The despair. The true meaning of the Night Market. It's true purpose.

Why don't players group up? Because some groups aren't meant to help anyone.

BardokRedSnow · May 4

DenverRalphy wrote: »

FurryCandyHearts wrote: »

OccultNerd wrote: »

So....I generally play solo, I group up for trials/end etc but that's it. I play solo because I don't need a group for normal overland content,wbs, public dungeons etc.. I'm not an elitist, my DPS isn't amazing but I get on fine for the content I play.

Along comes Night Market...you need to group/follow a group/ sneak etc.. no problem, it was advertised as group content.

What I don't understand is why so many players refuse to group up and then come to the forums or FB groups and moan because they expected to do solo NM and they can't, so that's it they are quitting....what is they actual issue? Why won't these players join a team?

I've seen people asking for a solo or easier version of NM, why? Especially after the majority of players wanted harder content!

Night market is gross and offensive for reasons i am not at liberty to entirely disclose here on thew forums. I find the entire premise repugnant. Pledging myself to any of the 3 miscreants is repugnant. And the starter quest those who would rule is repugnant. The house looks like a frat boy party palace and not at all like a house i would like to live in. I really can't say more but the entire NM is more repugnant than scribing and scrying and the witches fest and tales of tribute and all the other stuff they've added to the game. I thiunk it's even more offensive than the ridiculous over the top graphiical effects they keep adding to the game: even more so than chakram shields animation, night market is offensive to me. If only i could say more and be specific, but you know, it's forbidden.

Have you not read, experienced, or followed any TES lore prior to the Night Market? Cannabilism, <sex with corpses> (the word for that is actually censored on the forums), slavery, sex trafficing, filicide... the list goes on and on.

Bro should never read Vivecs 36 sermons, especially 14 lol

FurryCandyHearts · May 4

DenverRalphy wrote: »

FurryCandyHearts wrote: »

OccultNerd wrote: »

So....I generally play solo, I group up for trials/end etc but that's it. I play solo because I don't need a group for normal overland content,wbs, public dungeons etc.. I'm not an elitist, my DPS isn't amazing but I get on fine for the content I play.

Along comes Night Market...you need to group/follow a group/ sneak etc.. no problem, it was advertised as group content.

What I don't understand is why so many players refuse to group up and then come to the forums or FB groups and moan because they expected to do solo NM and they can't, so that's it they are quitting....what is they actual issue? Why won't these players join a team?

I've seen people asking for a solo or easier version of NM, why? Especially after the majority of players wanted harder content!

Night market is gross and offensive for reasons i am not at liberty to entirely disclose here on thew forums. I find the entire premise repugnant. Pledging myself to any of the 3 miscreants is repugnant. And the starter quest those who would rule is repugnant. The house looks like a frat boy party palace and not at all like a house i would like to live in. I really can't say more but the entire NM is more repugnant than scribing and scrying and the witches fest and tales of tribute and all the other stuff they've added to the game. I thiunk it's even more offensive than the ridiculous over the top graphiical effects they keep adding to the game: even more so than chakram shields animation, night market is offensive to me. If only i could say more and be specific, but you know, it's forbidden.

Have you not read, experienced, or followed any TES lore prior to the Night Market? Cannabilism, <sex with corpses> (the word for that is actually censored on the forums), slavery, sex trafficing, filicide... the list goes on and on.

THe point of any decent mmo is to be a hero and STOP IT, not to join in on the mischief making.

SeaGtGruff · May 4

BardokRedSnow wrote: »

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

BardokRedSnow wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

OccultNerd wrote: »

I've seen people asking for a solo or easier version of NM, why? Especially after the majority of players wanted harder content!

The majority do not want harder content. It was a the same handful of players in the pinned overland thread asking for more difficulty. That is far from the majority of players.

This is a lie

Actually it isn't. Go take a look at that monster of a thread. It's mostly the same handful of players. Also, I never ever heard anyone in zone chat, or guild chat, or anywhere in game complaining that the game was too easy.

I've occasionally heard a few players in zone chat complain about the game being too easy.

But I don't think the majority want harder content, because if that were so then I'd expect to hear a lot more complaints about it in zone chat.

Just like the forums, most people do not talk in zone chat. The kind of people that do regularly overall are also not the most experienced players. This is a general thing I've observed, not a rule mind you.

Pulling polls from these forums and zone chat when there's thousands of players is crazy work. A better example is look at games that have more players than eso does, world of warcraft is probably the best example. MMO players want challenge as much as they also want casual content thats easy going. ESO has been leaning way too hard on the latter to keep people interested. Clearly. Everyone and especially Zos has noticed the player count in the steam charts and other examples, its not like this is theoretical.

People spend all this time gathering countless sets, gold and other currencies, filling up the stickerbook, gathering transmutes etc, and people here think what we just like collecting stuff to never use for its own sake? Of course people want a challenge. And the most annoying thing I've seen from this community here is despite the game being advertised for "everyone" and most of the content being casual, when something more interesting and demanding pops up for those who do want a challenge, and this is maybe once every other year or so, people here gather the pitchforks.

I'm not brandishing any pitchforks here; I've been in the Night Market every day on two servers since it opened, and am doing what I can to enjoy it and to help kill the mobs and bosses. I do have some gripes about its design, mind you, such as the way the quest items for the district dailies have such small areas of detection when the areas they can be in are usually quite big-- the propaganda one is probably the worst on that account-- but overall I'm having fun. Frustration can be high, yes, but there is also much fun to be had.

My main gripe about this event zone is that the devs almost seem to have sadistically gone out of their way to make the players' experiences extremely frustrating, such as with the tiny range of detection for quest objectives which are scattered around large target areas filled with overpowered trash mobs, or the way the wandering Calamity bosses can meander through the Skirmish areas while players are fighting the Skirmish mobs and bosses and adds-- often at the worst possible moment, such as wandering in and wrecking a group of players who have finally whittled the Skirmish boss down to low health and are about to finish it off. This could be a source of fun, except apparently there are players who get upset if a Calamity wanders through and starts killing everyone, because they think that someone must have "pulled" the Calamity into the Skirmish area during the fight. I saw that happen last night during a Skirmish-- I jumped into the fight because both the Skirmish boss and the Calamity were being fought, and a large group of players were trying to take them both down. Players were being killed left and right, rezzing on the safe rooftop, and jumping back down for more. When it was finally all over, someone started yelling at the group demanding to know who "pulled" the Calamity. Like, dude, do you not know how the devs programmed the Calamities? We don't need that kind of toxic hostility between players, and some of the things about how the Night Market is designed almost seem purposely intended to generate levels of frustration which can lead to toxic hostility between players. But, hey, it's supposed to be fun, because it's a game, so let's all be chill and laugh about getting repeatedly wrecked-- except that isn't how some players are reacting to it.

I actually came back to this thread to clarify something I had suggested about "passive kill credit." I don't think the kills I've been seeing pop up when I'm not actively fighting anything are coming from other players in my "soft group" killing stuff, but instead are from enemies I'd done damage to but not killed, then some other player came along and killed them, the way you can get credit and AP for killing enemy players in Cyrodiil by scoring some hits on them and then they get killed-- even if you yourself are currently dead and rezzing. I'm not sure what kind of time window exists for getting kill credit that way, but that's what I'm seeing in the Night Market, not passive credit for being grouped (hard or soft) with someone who kills something. I'm just clarifying that because I was afraid my earlier comment might lead to players accusing each other of leaching kills just by standing around doing absolutely nothing, as I've read is sometimes the case during dolmen farming.

Wildberryjack · May 4

OccultNerd wrote: »

I've seen people asking for a solo or easier version of NM, why? Especially after the majority of players wanted harder content!

Because half the time we can't find a group and those districts can not be solo'd as they are. So we end up having to just forget it. I've seen even vet geared players get swarmed and melted when trying to solo, what chance does a casual player have?

Frayton · May 4

OccultNerd wrote: »

I've seen people asking for a solo or easier version of NM, why? Especially after the majority of players wanted harder content!

How do you know the majority of players wanted harder content? ESO is a casual game, played mostly by casual players and a lot of solo players, so putting a zone in that's just trial trash and dungeon bosses is too hard for them. Also, ZOS makes "play your way" a major selling point and people expect that, so when they can't, there's backlash.

DenverRalphy · May 4

FurryCandyHearts wrote: »

DenverRalphy wrote: »

FurryCandyHearts wrote: »

OccultNerd wrote: »

So....I generally play solo, I group up for trials/end etc but that's it. I play solo because I don't need a group for normal overland content,wbs, public dungeons etc.. I'm not an elitist, my DPS isn't amazing but I get on fine for the content I play.

Along comes Night Market...you need to group/follow a group/ sneak etc.. no problem, it was advertised as group content.

What I don't understand is why so many players refuse to group up and then come to the forums or FB groups and moan because they expected to do solo NM and they can't, so that's it they are quitting....what is they actual issue? Why won't these players join a team?

I've seen people asking for a solo or easier version of NM, why? Especially after the majority of players wanted harder content!

Night market is gross and offensive for reasons i am not at liberty to entirely disclose here on thew forums. I find the entire premise repugnant. Pledging myself to any of the 3 miscreants is repugnant. And the starter quest those who would rule is repugnant. The house looks like a frat boy party palace and not at all like a house i would like to live in. I really can't say more but the entire NM is more repugnant than scribing and scrying and the witches fest and tales of tribute and all the other stuff they've added to the game. I thiunk it's even more offensive than the ridiculous over the top graphiical effects they keep adding to the game: even more so than chakram shields animation, night market is offensive to me. If only i could say more and be specific, but you know, it's forbidden.

Have you not read, experienced, or followed any TES lore prior to the Night Market? Cannabilism, <sex with corpses> (the word for that is actually censored on the forums), slavery, sex trafficing, filicide... the list goes on and on.

THe point of any decent mmo is to be a hero and STOP IT, not to join in on the mischief making.

Those repulsive acts I listed (except perhaps the necro sex one) are all accepted practices within TES lore. The character you're playing interacts and accpets them on a regular basis throughout the game. :shrug: Just sayin.

Heck, Jesters festival even makes jovial cracks about Bosmer, their neighbors, and what's for dinner.

moo_2021 · May 4

Luneca wrote: »

I refuse to group because the people that group with me will become tainted by my karma.

Not everyone can just join a party and get along well. The moment I do anything, even a simple greeting, the party is fated to fail. It always ends the same way. Everyone plotting against each other. Players t-bagging their teammates when they die or dancing over their bodies as if they are doing some sick ritual. Sometimes, one will simply leave the others in the dust with lots of enemies to punish them.

I've seen it all. The darkness. The despair. The true meaning of the Night Market. It's true purpose.

Why don't players group up? Because some groups aren't meant to help anyone.

Is this an invitation to some secret guild? I'm feeling tempted to be that player after reading this

Syldras · May 4

It's as simple as that: Grouping is not fun for everyone. I do group during the current event (the first time in ESO, actually - I've only soloed before) because the Night Market is too tedious to solo. But grouping itself can be a just as frustrating experience (at least that's my observation from having been part of a whole bunch of group finder groups during the past few days). I still do it because I want specific rewards, so I have decided it's worth the hassle for me, but is it a particularly fun experience? Not for me. I won't complain though, because I have chosen to do it. But since the question of this thread is why some people are averse to grouping, here it is:

Sometimes it works well, then I'm fine with it. But too often I've seen a group leaders running around confusedly (sometimes 7 times around the same block...), not being able to find a boss, basically acting like they never used a map before (well, depending on their age they might actually never have - but unfortunately, ESO has no route planner for dungeons).

To avoid such frustrations, I have started just creating my own groups, since at least I know what to do, where to go, and how to navigate, but even then the experience can feel like herding cats/fleas/puppies (insert your language's common comparison here). Don't get me wrong, I don't expect perfection, and I try to help the best I can if I see someone struggling. I also understand very well that not everyone has the same skills or knowledge about the game. But I'm not even talking about combat skills here. You have people who run around who knows where, and don't react to chat either, so you can't really coordinate anything or tell them to stop if they make some nonsense - and sometimes I had the impression that I was already lucky if, from a group of 12, 6 people somehow made it to the boss we had agreed on fighting.

Not sure if I expect too much, but sometimes it feels frustrating. I've been in groups that clearly weren't super powerful (where some number of members had already left or there were several player characters with a lower level) - is it really necessary to tell people to tackle mobs one by one then instead of attacking all of them - plus the boss - at once? Or that it might be a good idea to wait at a boss until everyone has respawned to attack together, instead of having people run into their death one after another (and the boss resetting after each one of them)? And yes, if I see behavior that leads to nothing, I will say something in chat. Then we're again at the other problem I already mentioned: Some people never seem to read it.

It really sometimes feels like going on a field trip with young children: Has everyone eaten? Does everyone wear appropriate clothing for the activity? Has everyone been to the toilet? Some people might not mind that, but especially considering I don't have that much time to play, I rather progress more efficiently. I don't even mind struggling with a boss fight a bit and taking longer because of that, since obviously everyone tries their best at least, but things like people running off to who knows where or aggroing random mobs during a boss fight despite being told they shouldn't?

As soon as I have the rewards I want, I'm out and back to soloing.